Battle Blog -- Is Tony Parker Overrated?

[timvp]

Sense: In his first couple years in the league, Tony Parker was often touted as one of the up-and-coming talents in the league. This perception, however, has seemingly changed recently. During the Spurs’ championship run, whispers around the league were that Parker is overrated.

A big reason for that talk is Parker’s struggles with his free throws and his low three point percentages. Based on those statistics, fans seem to have lost faith in the Spurs’ starting point guard. Without a basic jump shot, they say, it’s impossible for Parker to be a true point guard.

I do not argue this – Tony Parker is not a true point guard. Parker is, however, an overachiever. Despite his lack of size, he changes the game with his speed. Personally, I'll take a point guard who creates fouls and opportunities around the basket over a point guard who'd rather hang around on the perimeter and launch threes.

Parker is and should be considered a top three NBA point guard. Why? Because even though he doesn’t have the world’s best jumper, he's unselfish and does what needs to be done to win. He pushes the ball when need be. He sets up the halfcourt offense when need be. He defers to his teammates when need be. He takes the ball into his own hands and scores when need be.

Unlike every other point so-called “elite” point guard in the league, Parker has two championship rings to prove that his style of play works. Since he’s only 23-years-old, he will only improve as years go by.

Even though Parker isn’t receiving the glitz and glamour associated with Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili, the way he runs the team cannot be ignored. The two trophies in San Antonio will assure that never happens.



Guru of Nothing: If I have to choose a side, yes, Tony Parker is overrated. By your own argument, he's overrated. Yes, he has two rings, but Avery Johnson and Speedy Claxton have rings too. So does Jud Buechler, that doesn’t mean I'd necessarily want him on my team.

That said, I still think he's a top ten point guard, and if he develops as a reliable outside threat, he will approach top three status. Until that happens, we Spurs fans will continue to be frustrated watching opposing defenses cheat off of him. (Some things never change for a Spurs fan.)

So long as he remains a half-time favorite for quickie Cheryl Miller interviews, while Spurs fans such as myself daydream about his teammates playing a game unfettered by his outside shot (or lack thereof) - YES, he's overrated.



Sense: I did not base it on the fact that he has two rings. Although I believe he still has work to do in mastering the basics, I think he has all the necessary point guard fundamentals.

I've noticed that in most of our losses in the post season, when he goes out and tries to dominate the action, Manu and Tim often struggle. I believe when Tony Parker tries to do too much, it takes away from the rest of the team. So as long as he concentrates on running the team and staying within his capabilities, the team can win and Parker can go down as one of the best point guards in the league. He does what it takes to win. Period.

The fact that he's already been a starter on two championship teams should clue the rest of the league that he’s a top five point guard. He’s obviously done something right, and he’s young enough to continue to improve. I just don’t see how one could say he’s overrated.



Guru of Nothing: I think you are proving my point for me. To say that Tony still needs to work on his basics, and yet also say that he is a top five point guard leads me to conclude he is overrated.

Jason Kidd, Stephon Marbury, Allen Iverson, Mike Bibby, Chauncey Billups, Steve Nash and Baron Davis (when healthy) are all considered better point guards than Parker. Parker is in a tier below, along with the likes Andre Miller and Kirk Hinrich.

That said, there are only two or three point guards I would trade straight up for Parker, for reasons ranging from salary, to age and health, to team chemistry. Tony Parker is one of the top five point guards best suited to run the Spurs, which is what I think you really meant to say, but didn't.




















**********************************

The judges have given the victory to Guru of Nothing. Thanks goes out to the bloggers and the judges.

[Banks91]

wat is this stupidness, its the other way around

tony parker is underrated , if anything

[Banks91]

the whole reason spurs are so good is they can adapt, and parker helps them

against teams like suns, where u need transition. Its funny how the media and fans

try to take apart and analyze every player on the spurs, regardless of wat they

do

[MI21]

That's outrageous.

Regardless of opinion, Senses' argument was much better.

[timvp]

Keep in mind that these are the edited version. Pre-edit, this one was much easier to judge.

[Mr. Body]

I don't think you can say Bibby is better than Parker anymore. We'll see how he does after his crap-out in the playoffs. He's called to do more now that Webber is gone and Peja sucks, but how effective is he?

Baron Davis and Stephon Marbury aren't winners. Gaudy stats, but what do those mean? Where's the success? I see Davis in general as either underperforming to his talents or simply overrated and I think in the end Marbury saps wins from his team.

Allen Iverson is as much of a point guard as Tracy McGrady. Sure, they may handle the ball the majority of the time, but that doesn't make them PGs.

I think there are absolutely only three players ahead of Parker - Kidd, Nash, Billups - with the rest debateable. Parker is definitely top 10 and as a prospect, so much better than the Marburys and Baron Davises.

The problem with this whole battle blog is 'exactly how is Parker rated'? I say budding star and future All-Star is about right. Maybe this is his year for the ASG.

[Sense]

Keep in mind that these are the edited version. Pre-edit, this one was much easier to judge.


Hmm... so battleblogs are based on spelling, and the word use?

I understand it's not about facts, it's about the argument, and I think I did a good job doing that. I hope the fact that he said "you're proving my point" didn't affect it, or the fact that he's a mod...


:angel

anyways...

Good argument GoN...apparently you are closer to getting the money.

[MI21]

Keep in mind that these are the edited version. Pre-edit, this one was much easier to judge.

:lol

Understood.

[Kori Ellis]

GuruofNothing isn't a mod. He was just given some power temporarily during the playoffs to help us out. There's no permanent mods.

And yes, grammar, spelling, diction, and how you make your argument all weigh on the judges' decisions.

[Sense]

GuruofNothing isn't a mod. He was just given some power temporarily during the playoffs to help us out. There's no permanent mods.

And yes, grammar, spelling, diction, and how you make your argument all weigh on the judges' decisions.


either way I was just kidding...


And I thought the battleblogs were more about arguing topics rather than using what you learned in language arts. So then again that was my mistake..

[timvp]

Alright sense, since you want to be like that, we'll let people see the pre-edit version and then they can say who should have won.

:)






Sense: Over the years it has seemed that Tony Parker has never been doubted as a point guard in the NBA. This, however, has changed since he's been getting attention being in championship teams, and championship caliber teams with the Spurs. The lack of good free throw and three point percentages seem make people criticize him. Judging either of those statistics, have fans convinced that he's no true point guard.I do not argue this however, Tony Parker is no true point guard...at least by most NBA standards. Tony Parker is an overachiever, he does what most point guards can't do, and at his weight and height, he should be commended. Personally, I'd take a pointguard who creates fouls, easier passes under the hoop, and who'd rather go for a layup than a three pointer over any other superstar point guard in the league. He is and should be considered a top 3 NBA pointguard. Why? Because even though he doesn't put up stats, he's unselfish and does what needs to be done to win. Unlike most point guards considered to be top 5 in the league, he does have 2 rings at such a young age, and he will only improve as years go by. Tony Parker is too good at things that take a career to learn, and considering his assists and percentages for judging is good for his career. In my opinion, reasons he is not a superstar in this league must include the fact that he is with the Spurs, Manu Ginobili, and Tim Duncan.



Guru: If I have to choose a side, yes, Tony Parker is overrated. By your own argument, he's overrated - he "has two rings" .... Avery Johnson and Speedy Claxton have rings too. So does Jeb Buecheler; does not mean I'd necessarily want him on my team.

That said, I still think he's a top-10 point guard, and if he develops as a reliable outside threat, he will approach top-3. Until that happens, we Spurs fans will continue to be frustrated watching opposing defenses cheat off of him. .... Some things never change for a Spurs fan.

So long as he remains a half-time favorite for quickie Cheryl Miller interviews, while Spurs fans such as myself daydream about his teammates playing a game unfettered by his outside shot (or lack thereof) - YES, he's overrated.



Sense: I did not base it on the fact that he has two rings, I do believe he has point guard fundamentals, however he still needs to work on his basics. I've noticed that in most of our losses in the post season, when he gets his, Manu or Tim Duncan aren't playing their A game. I believe when Tony Parker shows up, the rest of the team doesn't... so I'd rather have him get fouls and taking care of the inside men, rather than starting a shooting competition against any other point guard in the league. This is why I think Pop is being leninent on him.

The fact that he's already a starter on a championship team should get him in the top 5 at the least. He had to had done something right in order to have the team in such a contention, and the fact that he will do nothing but improve makes him better.



Guru: I think you are proving my point for me. To say that Tony "still needs to work on his basics," and yet also say that he is a top five point guard leads me to conclude he is overrated.

Jason Kidd, Stephon Marbury, Allen Iverson, Mike Bibby, Chauncey Billups, Steve Nash, and Baron Davis (when healthy) are all considered better point guards than Parker. Parker is in a tier below, along with the likes Andre Miller and Kirk Hinrich.

That said, I there are only two or three point guards I would trade straight up for Parker, for reasons ranging from salary, to age and health, to team chemistry. Tony Parker is one of the top five point guards best suited to run the Spurs, which is what I think you really meant to say, but didn't.

[Sense]

Alright sense, since you want to be like that, we'll let people see the pre-edit version and then they can say who should have won.

:)






Sense: Over the years it has seemed that Tony Parker has never been doubted as a point guard in the NBA. This, however, has changed since he's been getting attention being in championship teams, and championship caliber teams with the Spurs. The lack of good free throw and three point percentages seem make people criticize him. Judging either of those statistics, have fans convinced that he's no true point guard.I do not argue this however, Tony Parker is no true point guard...at least by most NBA standards. Tony Parker is an overachiever, he does what most point guards can't do, and at his weight and height, he should be commended. Personally, I'd take a pointguard who creates fouls, easier passes under the hoop, and who'd rather go for a layup than a three pointer over any other superstar point guard in the league. He is and should be considered a top 3 NBA pointguard. Why? Because even though he doesn't put up stats, he's unselfish and does what needs to be done to win. Unlike most point guards considered to be top 5 in the league, he does have 2 rings at such a young age, and he will only improve as years go by. Tony Parker is too good at things that take a career to learn, and considering his assists and percentages for judging is good for his career. In my opinion, reasons he is not a superstar in this league must include the fact that he is with the Spurs, Manu Ginobili, and Tim Duncan.



Guru: If I have to choose a side, yes, Tony Parker is overrated. By your own argument, he's overrated - he "has two rings" .... Avery Johnson and Speedy Claxton have rings too. So does Jeb Buecheler; does not mean I'd necessarily want him on my team.

That said, I still think he's a top-10 point guard, and if he develops as a reliable outside threat, he will approach top-3. Until that happens, we Spurs fans will continue to be frustrated watching opposing defenses cheat off of him. .... Some things never change for a Spurs fan.

So long as he remains a half-time favorite for quickie Cheryl Miller interviews, while Spurs fans such as myself daydream about his teammates playing a game unfettered by his outside shot (or lack thereof) - YES, he's overrated.



Sense: I did not base it on the fact that he has two rings, I do believe he has point guard fundamentals, however he still needs to work on his basics. I've noticed that in most of our losses in the post season, when he gets his, Manu or Tim Duncan aren't playing their A game. I believe when Tony Parker shows up, the rest of the team doesn't... so I'd rather have him get fouls and taking care of the inside men, rather than starting a shooting competition against any other point guard in the league. This is why I think Pop is being leninent on him.

The fact that he's already a starter on a championship team should get him in the top 5 at the least. He had to had done something right in order to have the team in such a contention, and the fact that he will do nothing but improve makes him better.



Guru: I think you are proving my point for me. To say that Tony "still needs to work on his basics," and yet also say that he is a top five point guard leads me to conclude he is overrated.

Jason Kidd, Stephon Marbury, Allen Iverson, Mike Bibby, Chauncey Billups, Steve Nash, and Baron Davis (when healthy) are all considered better point guards than Parker. Parker is in a tier below, along with the likes Andre Miller and Kirk Hinrich.

That said, I there are only two or three point guards I would trade straight up for Parker, for reasons ranging from salary, to age and health, to team chemistry. Tony Parker is one of the top five point guards best suited to run the Spurs, which is what I think you really meant to say, but didn't.


I'm not saying I won, I just wanted to know why....

I am a first timer apparently, so I just want to know what to do for the next one.

[timvp]

You did good. The more you do it, the easier it becomes.

:smokin

[Sense]

You did good. The more you do it, the easier it becomes.

:smokin

I'll keep that in mind, aswell as the prize...

:hat

[Guru of Nothing]

I'm a Tony Parker fan, and for those of you counting, I was many words short of my allotted 250 trying to argue that TP is overrated - and I don't necessarily agree with what I said - except that TP is definitely one of the top 5 most capable PGs to lead the Spurs.

Good job Sense.

[Guru of Nothing]

I don't think you can say Bibby is better than Parker anymore. We'll see how he does after his crap-out in the playoffs. He's called to do more now that Webber is gone and Peja sucks, but how effective is he?

Baron Davis and Stephon Marbury aren't winners. Gaudy stats, but what do those mean? Where's the success? I see Davis in general as either underperforming to his talents or simply overrated and I think in the end Marbury saps wins from his team.

Allen Iverson is as much of a point guard as Tracy McGrady. Sure, they may handle the ball the majority of the time, but that doesn't make them PGs.

I think there are absolutely only three players ahead of Parker - Kidd, Nash, Billups - with the rest debateable. Parker is definitely top 10 and as a prospect, so much better than the Marburys and Baron Davises.

The problem with this whole battle blog is 'exactly how is Parker rated'? I say budding star and future All-Star is about right. Maybe this is his year for the ASG.

Well, I was careful not to include Steve Francis on my list.

[Nbadan]

So does Jeb Buecheler; does not mean I'd necessarily want him on my team.


Look at GURU playing the Jeb Buecheler card. As if Buecheler and Tony's contributions were at all related. What's next? Comparing Mark Madsen to Manu?

:hat

[1Parker1]

You did good. The more you do it, the easier it becomes.

:smokin

:lol Says the guy who's 0-1........

[1Parker1]

I don't think I understand. Is this supposed to be Tony Parker is over-rated by Spurs fans or the general NBA fans?

[1Parker1]

Brewski Time in 3.........2...............1

[xcoriate]

Well thats 2 seperate Blogs 1Parker1 :)

Good job bloggers :)

[spurster]

Saying TP as a top 3 or top 5 PG is overrating him. Top 10 sounds about right to me.

However, I would say TP is often underestimated. All the top PGs took until their late 20's or early 30's to excel. TP is there at age 23. He is going to be a good PG for a long time.

I can't tell though whether TP is overpaid or underpaid. Maybe Atlanta or some other team would have made a max offer to TP this summer.

[1Parker1]

Houston, Cavs, Lakers, TWolves----all would have offered Parker a lot of money to be their PG.

[MannyIsGod]

Guru takes the lead!

Bastard.

[1Parker1]

Hey, I want to try out this Battle Blog thing...anyone wanna go against me? :) I'm open to whatever topic you may want to debate.

Hey MavsFan...how about we do an official Kobe vs T-Mac one? :)

[Guru of Nothing]

Guru takes the lead!

Bastard.

http://www.boomspeed.com/mateo/whistling.gif

[1Parker1]

Damn, you haven't lost a battle blog yet? Hmm...I'd like to go against you next time :) I bet I can make that 3-1 :)

[RobinsontoDuncan]

How come no one mentions that Tony Parker averaged 17.1 PPG in the post season, or that he was better than Manu and Duncan in detroit, higher shooting percentage than both, and more PPG than Manu, why not that his clutch shooting stole us a game in denver with duncan fouled out, or how his overall play helped lift us past Phoenix?

Did anyone see how reliable his 15-18 foot jumper was in detroit?

[1Parker1]

How come no one mentions that Tony Parker averaged 17.1 PPG in the post season, or that he was better than Manu and Duncan in detroit, higher shooting percentage than both, and more PPG than Manu, why not that his clutch shooting stole us a game in denver with duncan fouled out, or how his overall play helped lift us past Phoenix?

Did anyone see how reliable his 15-18 foot jumper was in detroit?


ummm....I think that's partially why Sense lost the battle :lol

[waly.mg]

The new contract is overrated, but the first for years, Tp won 4 millins and 66 for the next 6, it´s 70 millions - 10 years contract, isn´t too much

[waly.mg]

How come no one mentions that Tony Parker averaged 17.1 PPG in the post season, or that he was better than Manu and Duncan in detroit, higher shooting percentage than both, and more PPG than Manu, why not that his clutch shooting stole us a game in denver with duncan fouled out, or how his overall play helped lift us past Phoenix?

Did anyone see how reliable his 15-18 foot jumper was in detroit?

The 17,2 PPG is nothing if he take 16 shots x game and 4 FTA, thats´s around 1,1 PPS when Manu is around 1,7 PPS

In the Playoffs Tony takes 80 more shots than Manu and scores 83 less points

[bigbendbruisebrother]

Look at GURU playing the Jeb Buecheler card. As if Buecheler and Tony's contributions were at all related. What's next? Comparing Mark Madsen to Manu?

:hat

Reread the post. He didn't compare them. He said that having a ring is not necessarily an indicator of where the guys is in terms of playing to his potential or in terms of comparing said player to others at his position.

[ALVAREZ6]

Parker a top 3 PG??????


:wtf?

[Sense]

Parker a top 3 PG??????


:wtf?

He has no jumpshot, three pointer, nor ft.......


And he's averaging what?

With 2 championships?

Wait till this guy gets the basics.

[ALVAREZ6]

He has no jumpshot, three pointer, nor ft.......
...




With 2 championships?
With Duncan.


Wait till this guy gets the basics.
Well he's played pro ball in France...and he's going into his 5th year in the NBA...

I'm still waiting.



No disrespect to Parker, I like Parker, he fits well with the team, but he's not a top 3.

[Spursdaone]

Parker's energy level and athleticism brings alot to the game. He isn't a top 3 point guard but I would put him at 4 or 5.

[Sense]

...




With Duncan.


Well he's played pro ball in France...and he's going into his 5th year in the NBA...

I'm still waiting.



No disrespect to Parker, I like Parker, he fits well with the team, but he's not a top 3.

Duncan wouldn't have won either of the two championships if it weren't for TP.

Yeah, he's played pro ball in France, how pro is this? Compared to the NBA.

Yeah, you're still waiting, but you forget he is still young..he has alot of time to improve.

[duncan_21]

First off, a debate on someone overrated or underrated has a seemingly obvious problem. By my logic in order for someone to be overrated or underrated someone has to be rated.

How was tp rated? And by who? Was that the consensus? How anyone could win or lose this debate is beyond me. You might as well argue who's more real the Easter Bunny or Santa Claus.

The topic should have been; tony parker is at least the third best pg in the nba, true or false?

My answer to that question is no, but he is a top 7 or 8 pg.

[Sense]

First off, a debate on someone overrated or underrated has a seemingly obvious problem. By my logic in order for someone to be overrated or underrated someone has to be rated.

How was tp rated? And by who? Was that the consensus? How anyone could win or lose this debate is beyond me. You might as well argue who's more real the Easter Bunny or Santa Claus.

The topic should have been; tony parker is at least the third best pg in the nba, true or false?

My answer to that question is no, but he is a top 7 or 8 pg.

It's a battleblog, who gives a shit.

[Guru of Nothing]

You might as well argue who's more real the Easter Bunny or Santa Claus.

Santa Claus is 100x more real than the Easter Bunny!

Bunnies do not distribute hard-boiled eggs.

[duncan_21]

It's a battleblog, who gives a shit.

Sorry, stating that players are over/underrated is one of my pet peeves. It's like when someone scratches the chalkboard with their finger nails.

[1Parker1]

I would love to argue that Kobe is the best guard in basketball. Kobe>TMac....Mavsfan1000, me or the Philly girl are up for it!


:lol. It's on...or Ginobili is god...you and I could argue something else :) If you think of a topic PM me. Mavsfan is prolly too much of a wuss to take either of us on :smokin

[1Parker1]

Yeah, you're still waiting, but you forget he is still young..he has alot of time to improve.

Alvarez is 15....when he's 23, he'll realize himself how young he still is and that he can still improve and change :smokin