Bundy ranch situation in Nevada

[boutons_deux]

I don't think they're terrorists, but they're certainly morons.

This scenario so far lacks any violent/deadly conduct that might justify calling the protesters terrorists, IMHO.

terrorism is violence or threat of violence (as in armed to the teeth with high capacity guns) for political purposes.

Repugs ridicule PC? Well, then fuck 'em, the Burns Buttholes are ARMED INSURRECTIONIST TERRORISTS.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Was anyone from the Bundy standoff ever charged with anything?

[boutons_deux]

Was anyone from the Bundy standoff ever charged with anything?

I hope they all get arrest and charged with trespassing, maybe destruction of property, at very minimum.

BLM backing down against the Bundy ranch terrorists and letting slide Bundy's $1M unpaid fees was a big mistake. That mofo lied about the history of ownership of the property. Other ranchers paid, and pay up. But this Moroni Mormon/sovereign asshole needs get his fat butt kicked, and his property forecosed, seized and sold at auction to recover the $1M fees, just like any foreclosed homeowner.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I hope they all get arrest and charged with trespassing, maybe destruction of property, at very minimum.

BLM backing down against the Bundy ranch terrorists and letting slide Bundy's $1M unpaid fees was a big mistake. That mofo lied about the history of ownership of the property. Other ranchers paid, and pay up. But this Moroni Mormon/sovereign asshole needs get his fat butt kicked, and his property forecosed, seized and sold at auction to recover the $1M fees, just like any foreclosed homeowner.

Did you hope the same for the occupy wall street and black lives matter protesters that broke the same laws?

[boutons_deux]

Did you hope the same for the occupy wall street and black lives matter protesters that broke the same laws?

OWS and BLM had and have legit grievances. These Bundy Burns Buttholes got no grieveances. Were OWS and BLM armed to the teeth?

[boutons_deux]

These Two Photos Are Worth a Million Words in Explaining Oregon Militia Leader Blain Cooper


http://www.alternet.org/files/styles/large/public/oregon_0.png

In the first picture, freedom-loving Blain Cooper is in his full "militia" garb, ready for an armed struggle with authorities . In the second, he rubs bacon on a Koran before burning it.

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/these-two-photos-are-worth-million-words-explaining-oregon-militia-leader-blain?akid=13851.187590.747oU8&rd=1&src=newsletter1048451&t=10

[CosmicCowboy]

That claim that they set the fire to cover up killing a deer/s is ludicrous.

[TheSanityAnnex]

OWS and BLM had and have legit grievances. These Bundy Burns Buttholes got no grieveances. Were OWS and BLM armed to the teeth?

So you are okay with laws being broken as long as you agree with the grievances?

[boutons_deux]

“So that they can claim their on rights so that they can begin using them, and then they can stand strong enough to defend them themselves. And then we will go home,” he explained. “It is our goal

to get the logger back to logging,

to get the rancher back to ranching,

to get the miner back to mining,

the farmer back to farming.”

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/ammon-bundy-justifies-federal-land-takeover-with-same-argument-bush-made-for-invading-iraq/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

So butthole Bundy speaks the truth, it's all about BigCorp raping public lands

[boutons_deux]

Wow, Megyn Kelly just reduced Ammon Bundy to a silly, blathering fool

http://media.salon.com/2016/01/Kelly-620x412.png

Kelly File host Megyn Kelly last night shut down a slack-jawed Ammon Bundy caught starting a rhetorical game he would no doubt lose.

“How is what you are doing not lawlessness?” Kelly began.

“I think we have to go to the supreme law of the land to answer that question,” Bundy rebutted. “The Federal Government does not have the authority to come down into the states and to control its land and resources.” :lol

Kelly reminded Bundy that Dwight and Steven Hammond, the father and son ranchers whose arrests sparked the protests, “had their day in court, and they were found guilty and it went all the way up to the U.S. Supreme Court, which denied their appeal.”

“Let me ask you,” Bundy said. “Who was the plaintiff?”

Following a pause, Kelly told Bundy to “keep going.”

“No, I’m asking,” Bundy tried again. “Who was the plaintiff against the Hammonds?”

“I’m waiting for you to make your point. Generally I don’t answer the questions on my show; I ask them.”

Bundy fumbled a bit before spitting up an answer to his own question: “The plaintiff is the Federal Government. The prosecutors is [sic.] the federal government.”

http://www.salon.com/2016/01/05/wow_megyn_kelly_just_reduced_ammon_bundy_to_a_sill y_blathering_fool/

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't think they're terrorists, but they're certainly morons.

This scenario so far lacks any violent/deadly conduct that might justify calling the protesters terrorists, IMHO.

I take threat by force of arms to be a form of violence but I can see the wisdom in judging by actions and not intent. Threat of force is key in the whole terror thing though. The comparison to actual terrorists is completely valid.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That claim that they set the fire to cover up killing a deer/s is ludicrous.

You sure convinced me.

[CosmicCowboy]

You sure convinced me.

Don't need convincing if you just use your brain. If you had just poached a deer the last thing you would do is start a fire which would immediately attract attention to the location as people rushed to put it out.

[CosmicCowboy]

You can easily cover the evidence of shooting a deer with a few shovels of dirt.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You can easily cover the evidence of shooting a deer with a few shovels of dirt.

Cause investigators don't look for disturbed ground. Thanks, thuglife.

[CosmicCowboy]

Cause investigators don't look for disturbed ground. Thanks, thuglife.

:lmao

This isn't CSI National Forest dufus....

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lmao

This isn't CSI National Forest dufus....

The PWS rangers were actively looking for poachers no?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Do you have any information regarding the campsite or anything else they allegedly were trying to hide? You are the one saying its stupid. Well regale us with your knowledge. You sound like partschanger right now.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Do you have any information regarding the campsite or anything else they allegedly were trying to hide? You are the one saying its stupid. Well regale us with your knowledge. You sound like partschanger right now.

Accuser Dusty Hammond

(o) Federal attorneys, Frank Papagni, hunted down a witness who was not mentally capable to be credible. Dusty Hammond (grandson and nephew) testified that Steven told him to start a fire. He was 13-years-old at the time, and 24-years-old when he testified (11 years later). At 24 Dusty had been suffering with mental problems for many years. He had estranged his family including his mother. Judge Hogan noted that Dusty’s memories as a 13-year-old boy were not clear or credible. However, Judge Hogan allowed the prosecution to continually use Dusty’s testimony.

[Koolaid_Man]

They should've shot the first Bundy guy for having Snipers trained on ATF agents and we wouldn't be having to deal with this bullshit from these fucking Taliban wannabes

[ChumpDumper]

Accuser Dusty Hammond

(o) Federal attorneys, Frank Papagni, hunted down a witness who was not mentally capable to be credible. Dusty Hammond (grandson and nephew) testified that Steven told him to start a fire. He was 13-years-old at the time, and 24-years-old when he testified (11 years later). At 24 Dusty had been suffering with mental problems for many years. He had estranged his family including his mother. Judge Hogan noted that Dusty’s memories as a 13-year-old boy were not clear or credible. However, Judge Hogan allowed the prosecution to continually use Dusty’s testimony.What mental problems?

Made up ones?

[boutons_deux]

In Oregon, Myth Mixes With Anger

The implication was clear: If they got rid of the federal government, they’d have control over their land and lives again.

This version of history bears little resemblance to the actual past. Before the federal agencies came to eastern Oregon, large ranching operations from California had monopolized hundreds of thousands of acres of rangeland. Irrigation developers controlled water, cattle barons controlled the grass, and settlers were essentially locked out. Tensions were high.

When mythic histories supplant the complexities of the past, the results can be lethal. Equitable futures for Western public lands won’t be achieved when ideologues swagger in, brandishing guns and taking over federal buildings.

Rather, they develop from the hard work of collaboration, like the 2013 effort that brought together the local community, tribes, conservation groups and the state and federal governments to develop a new management plan for Malheur. These are the efforts that best respect the region’s history while pointing the way to a sustainable future.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/06/opinion/in-oregon-myth-mixes-with-anger.html

iow, the Moroni Mormon fuckoffs are your typical, ignorant, religious rurals INVADING an area that has been contentious for 100+ years, and mainly destroyed long ago by outsider BigBeef, not by BigGov.

[boutons_deux]

A White Man Just Can’t Catch A Break

He brought his rifle up at the sound of footsteps crunching the Oregon snow. “Who goes there? Stop and be recognized.”

A weary voice answered out of the darkness. “It’s me, Sam. It’s Bud.”

“Give me the password.”

“Come on, Sam. Stop foolin’ around.”

“The password,” Sam insisted.

Bud sighed. “‘Patriots act.’ Are you happy now?”

Sam lowered the weapon as Bud stepped out of the trees into the meager circle of moonlight. “Can’t be too careful,” he said. He cupped his hands and blew into them. It was cold out here. “So where you been?” he asked.

“Down to the front gate.”

Sam grinned. “Bet you it’s a zoo, bunch of satellite trucks and media elites standing around. Who all’s down there? CNN? NBC? CBS? Sure hope Fox sends that Megyn Kelly. That babe can interview me anytime.”

Bud shook his head. “Ain’t much media down there at all.”

“Oh. Cops are keepin’ em back, huh?”

“Hardly any cops, neither.”

Sam had been stamping his feet trying to bring back circulation. Now he paused, looking over at Bud in shock. “No cops?”

“Not so’s you’d notice.”

“Do they know we took over a federal facility?”

“Yup.”

“I mean, it’s only a wildlife refuge in the boonies, but it’s still federal property, ain’t it?”

“Yup.”

“So that’s treason or somethin’, right?”

“You’d think.”

“Do they know Cliven Bundy’s sons are out here with us? Do they know we’re supporting local ranchers against federal tyranny?”

“They know.”

“Do they know we’re armed? Do they know we’re ready to shoot it out? Do they know we’re ready to die — and to take some of them with us?”

“Yup, yup and yup.”

“And they’re still ignoring us?”

“Appears that way.”

“Hell,” said Sam. Cold smoke drifted from his mouth. He couldn’t feel his fingers. “Hell,” he said again. “That ain’t fair.”

“How do you mean?” Bud stood hunched over, his hands pinned in his armpits.

“You think if a bunch of damn Muslims had took this place over, the cops and the media would be diddling around like this? You wouldn’t be able to think for the helicopters buzzing overhead. You’d be blinded by the TV lights. They’d send Anderson Cooper, Wolf Blitzer, Lester Holt. Hell, even if we was just black, they’d at least send Geraldo Rivera. But a bunch of white men? Nothin’.”

“I’m not so sure,” said Bud thoughtfully, “I mean, the media did turn out when ol’ Clive made his stand a couple years ago. He had plenty attention.”

“He did, but did you notice how they treated him? They acted like he was just an old kook like your crazy uncle Bubba. He’s out there with a bunch of armed men refusing to recognize federal authority, but they acted like he was … harmless.”

Bud nodded. “I see your point,” he said.

“I’m tired of bein’ treated like I’m harmless just ’cause I’m white. White men ain’t harmless. Did you hear about that biker gang shootout in Waco last May? Nine people dead, twice that many wounded, almost 180 arrests. That sound harmless to you?”

Bud shook his head. “I must have missed that,” he said.

“See, that’s my point. If 180 Mexican illegals had shot it out, you think you wouldn’t know about it? Hell, it would have been the top news story of the year! The blacks, the Muslims, the Mexicans, they get all the attention they want even when they’re not doin’ nothin’, but guys who look like you and me, we get bupkes. What do we need, bikini girls? For criminy sake, we’re committing armed insurrection against the federal government! Ain’t that enough?”

Sam went back to stamping his feet. He found himself wondering idly about the symptoms of hypothermia. “A white man just can’t catch a break,” he muttered.

http://www.nationalmemo.com/a-white-man-just-cant-catch-a-break/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Morning%20Memo%20-%202016-01-06&utm_term=MM_frequency_six

:lol

[boutons_deux]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktr9MYFdadc

[boutons_deux]

http://www.truthdig.com/images/made/images/cartoonuploads/and0106j_590_444.jpg

[boutons_deux]

...

[boutons_deux]

some Hammond history

Showdown in the Malheur Marshes: the Origins of Rancher Terrorism in Burns, Oregon (http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/01/05/showdown-in-the-malheur-marshes-the-origins-of-the-armed-occupation-in-burns-oregon/)

In an affidavit, Earl M. Kisler, a Fish and Wildlife Service enforcement officer, said that rancher Dwight Hammond had repeatedly threatened refuge officials with violence over an eight year period. On one occasion Hammond told the manager of the federal refuge that “he was going to tear his head off and shit down his neck.”

According to the affidavit, Hammond threated to kill refuge manager Forrest Cameron and assistant manager Dan Walsworth and claimed he was ready to die over a fence line that the refuge wanted to construct to keep his cows out of a marsh and wetland.

The tensions between the Hammond family and the government started when the refuge, which was established as a haven for migrating birds, refused to renew a grazing permit for Hammond’s cattle operation. Then came the incident over the wetland, which Hammond had been using as a water hole for his cows.

On August 3, 1994, a Fish and Wildlife Service crew turned up to complete the task of fencing off the marsh. They found the fence destroyed and a monkey-wrenched earthmover parked in the middle of the marsh. While the feds were waiting on a towing service to remove the Cat, Hammond’s son Steve showed up and began calling the government men “worthless cocksuckers” and “assholes.” Hammond then arrived at the scene, according to the government’s documents, and tried to disrupt the removal of the equipment. The rancher was arrested.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/01/05/showdown-in-the-malheur-marshes-the-origins-of-the-armed-occupation-in-burns-oregon/

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lmao

This isn't CSI National Forest dufus....


The PWS rangers were actively looking for poachers no?


Do you have any information regarding the campsite or anything else they allegedly were trying to hide? You are the one saying its stupid. Well regale us with your knowledge. You sound like partschanger right now.

:lol what a pussy.

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lol what a pussy.

:lol says the faggot with half the forum on ignore

Not a single thing said by witness Dusty Hammond about covering up illegal poaching.

http://www.opb.org/news/article/hammond_witness_describes_setting_fire_in_2001/

Nearly 11 years after the fact, Dusty Hammond recalled for a jury Wednesday in a U.S. District Court how he stumbled through juniper and sagebrush to escape a fire bearing down on him, a fire he helped set.

Hammond, 24, softspoken and clean cut, explained how his first-ever deer hunt near Frenchglen turned to arson after his uncle Steve Hammond passed out boxes of strike-anywhere matches to the four-man hunting party.
“Light the whole countryside on fire,” Dusty said his uncle told him. “I started lighting matches.”

Afterwards, he said, over lunch his grandfather and uncle instructed him to “keep my mouth shut; nobody needed to know anything about the fire.”
Steve Hammond and his father, Dwight L. Hammond Jr., are on trial in Pendleton on nine counts, including conspiracy and setting fire to public grazing lands in Harney County between 2001 and 2006. A superseding indictment May 16 alleges the father and son ranchers illegally burned public rangelands, a practice used to reduce juniper growth and improve grazing areas. The indictment also alleges a fire the pair started in 2006 threatened to trap four BLM firefighters, one of whom confronted Dwight Hammond at the fire scene.

The trial, in front of U.S. District Judge Michael Hogan of Eugene, may last three weeks.
Wednesday, Dusty Hammond, facing his grandfather and uncle in court, delivered short answers in a flat tone to describe the Sept. 30, 2001, hunt with his father, Rusty Hammond, uncle, grandfather and Jacon Taylor. Four times lawyers asked that he speak louder or adjust the microphone so jurors might hear his testimony.
The hunting party walked to a fence line dividing Hammond Ranch from a BLM section and stopped at a cattle guard, Dusty said under questioning by U.S. Attorney Frank Papagni Jr. There, he said, Steve Hammond handed each a box of Diamond Strike Anywhere wooden stick matches. He was instructed to walk the fenceline by his uncle and “start lighting until you run out.”
He said he lit one match after another as he walked, but each one sputtered out before hitting the ground. His father showed him how to light a handful of matches at once, and soon the brush burned at his feet, he said. He walked until finding himself alone, with fire coming up behind him, towering 8-10 feet above his head, he said.
He never actually saw his uncle set fire that day, only smoke rising up from his direction, he said. He remembered the day clearly despite the intervening years because of his close scrape with fire. He said he scrambled into a rocky area that day and waited until the fire passed by.
Later, he said, Dwight, his grandfather, flew his Super Cub over the scene to gauge the effect the fire had on juniper there.
Dusty Hammond said he never spoke of the day out of fear of his uncle and grandfather, a fear he’s since shed. He lived on the ranch until about age 15 but distanced himself from his Hammond relatives.
But he failed to testify, as Papagni said he would during his opening statement to jurors Tuesday, that his uncle and grandfather talked about using fire to scare away hunters who came too close to Hammond Ranch property. A Utah man and his son, Dennis and Dusty Nelson, testifying before Hammond, described meeting a hunting party, presumably the Hammond party, on the BLM tract that morning.
Both men described a clear day marred by smoke that grew heavier as the morning wore on.
Papagni asked Hammond three times whether he’d ever heard his uncle and grandfather discuss what to do about hunters “on the mountain.” But Hammond each time said no.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Oregon house rep Greg Walden addresses the government overreach
bx4ocLdWE90
well worth watching the 25 minutes

[boutons_deux]

First of all, when did it become OK for cowboys to cry in public?

The coolest thing about the Gary Cooper-Clint Eastwood-James Coburn-Yul Brynner-style cowboys is that they never said a damned thing. They walked slow, asses sore from all that riding, and kept things to a syllable or two if they could manage it: "Whiskey." "Bath." "Draw."


How the Oregon Militants' Revolutionary Plan Went Sideways » (http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/armed-pathetic-and-hungry-how-the-oregon-militants-revolutionary-plan-went-sideways-20160105)Contrast that with Ammon Bundy, the man who recently led a small group of gun-wielding outpatients to occupy the Malheur federal wildlife preserve in Oregon.

Before the occupation, Bundy stood up at a town hall meeting (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JF2c6UYRdE0&app=desktop) in Harney County, Oregon, and fell to pieces as he described to the audience the revelation he had from God about the need to take action against the federal government.

He was most put out about the five-year sentence for arson (http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2015/12/ranchers_fight_with_feds_spark.html#incart_story_p ackage) that the feds slapped on a father and son duo of ranchers named Dwight and Steven Hammond for setting fires on federal land.

Bundy, his beard always carefully groomed, his unblemished broad-billed rancher hat always on straight, stood up at the town hall and weepingly explained that God had spoken to him about the Hammonds.

"The Lord was not pleased with what was happening with the Hammonds," he croaked out. "OK?" He then wiped his eyes and — in an absolutely flawless homage to the Mike Myers I'm a little verklempt (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDXEgBh0TF0) routine — held a palm out as if to say, "Hang on while I compose myself."

"And I apologize for being emotional," he went on. "I hope you guys can get past that!" (He wiped his eyes again.)

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/the-dumb-and-the-restless-20160107?utm_source=newsletter&utm_content=daily&utm_campaign=010716_16&utm_medium=email

Another fuckwad Religionist with his brain scrambled by Religion

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lol says the faggot with half the forum on ignore

Not a single thing said by witness Dusty Hammond about covering up illegal poaching.

http://www.opb.org/news/article/hammond_witness_describes_setting_fire_in_2001/

Nearly 11 years after the fact, Dusty Hammond recalled for a jury Wednesday in a U.S. District Court how he stumbled through juniper and sagebrush to escape a fire bearing down on him, a fire he helped set.

Hammond, 24, softspoken and clean cut, explained how his first-ever deer hunt near Frenchglen turned to arson after his uncle Steve Hammond passed out boxes of strike-anywhere matches to the four-man hunting party.
“Light the whole countryside on fire,” Dusty said his uncle told him. “I started lighting matches.”

Afterwards, he said, over lunch his grandfather and uncle instructed him to “keep my mouth shut; nobody needed to know anything about the fire.”
Steve Hammond and his father, Dwight L. Hammond Jr., are on trial in Pendleton on nine counts, including conspiracy and setting fire to public grazing lands in Harney County between 2001 and 2006. A superseding indictment May 16 alleges the father and son ranchers illegally burned public rangelands, a practice used to reduce juniper growth and improve grazing areas. The indictment also alleges a fire the pair started in 2006 threatened to trap four BLM firefighters, one of whom confronted Dwight Hammond at the fire scene.

The trial, in front of U.S. District Judge Michael Hogan of Eugene, may last three weeks.
Wednesday, Dusty Hammond, facing his grandfather and uncle in court, delivered short answers in a flat tone to describe the Sept. 30, 2001, hunt with his father, Rusty Hammond, uncle, grandfather and Jacon Taylor. Four times lawyers asked that he speak louder or adjust the microphone so jurors might hear his testimony.
The hunting party walked to a fence line dividing Hammond Ranch from a BLM section and stopped at a cattle guard, Dusty said under questioning by U.S. Attorney Frank Papagni Jr. There, he said, Steve Hammond handed each a box of Diamond Strike Anywhere wooden stick matches. He was instructed to walk the fenceline by his uncle and “start lighting until you run out.”
He said he lit one match after another as he walked, but each one sputtered out before hitting the ground. His father showed him how to light a handful of matches at once, and soon the brush burned at his feet, he said. He walked until finding himself alone, with fire coming up behind him, towering 8-10 feet above his head, he said.
He never actually saw his uncle set fire that day, only smoke rising up from his direction, he said. He remembered the day clearly despite the intervening years because of his close scrape with fire. He said he scrambled into a rocky area that day and waited until the fire passed by.
Later, he said, Dwight, his grandfather, flew his Super Cub over the scene to gauge the effect the fire had on juniper there.
Dusty Hammond said he never spoke of the day out of fear of his uncle and grandfather, a fear he’s since shed. He lived on the ranch until about age 15 but distanced himself from his Hammond relatives.
But he failed to testify, as Papagni said he would during his opening statement to jurors Tuesday, that his uncle and grandfather talked about using fire to scare away hunters who came too close to Hammond Ranch property. A Utah man and his son, Dennis and Dusty Nelson, testifying before Hammond, described meeting a hunting party, presumably the Hammond party, on the BLM tract that morning.
Both men described a clear day marred by smoke that grew heavier as the morning wore on.
Papagni asked Hammond three times whether he’d ever heard his uncle and grandfather discuss what to do about hunters “on the mountain.” But Hammond each time said no.

I'll answer your posts much after the fact. You're weird, fixate, and try to get arguments to go in circles. I guess you're lonely. We've talked of this before.

Can you tell me what your argument is? That narrative says they were only playing with matches.

PS if you want me to actually talk to you then don't act like an asshat and try to actually argue on merit. i'll just ignore it and we can move on.

[boutons_deux]

Cliven Bundy still owes the U.S. $1 million. What are the feds doing to collect it?

Federal officials seem to have shied away from confrontation to avoid recreating the bloody standoffs in Waco, Texas, and Ruby Ridge, Idaho, in the 1990s, which galvanized anti-government radicals like 1995 Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh.

“The two [Bundy standoffs], I think, are indicative of a problem, and that is: When you have people who are publicly proclaiming their defiance of the law and doing it in a potentially violent way, how do you deal with it?” said Patrick Shea, former director of the BLM from 1997 to 1999, who was the first to sue Cliven Bundy for illegal grazing.

“After 20 years and multiple court orders to remove the trespass cattle, Mr. Bundy owes the American taxpayers in excess of $1 million,” Kornze said. “The BLM will continue to work to resolve the matter administratively and judicially.”

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-cliven-bundy-fines-20160107-story.html

[Winehole23]

compare and contrast:

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/10/31/us/range-war-in-nevada-pits-us-against-2-shoshone-sisters.html

[FuzzyLumpkins]

compare and contrast:

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/10/31/us/range-war-in-nevada-pits-us-against-2-shoshone-sisters.html

If they actually had a tribe behind them I might have more sympathy for them. I can even give credence to the argument that indigenous peeps didn't get a fair shake in their reparations. Other than that though they are still squatters on legally established federal land. The comparison with groups of whitey? Don't see it.

I just love how GOP types ignore the tragedy of the commons on this topic but welfare? Logical consistency is not strong or less than based on ego.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I'll answer your posts much after the fact. You're weird, fixate, and try to get arguments to go in circles. I guess you're lonely. We've talked of this before.

Can you tell me what your argument is? That narrative says they were only playing with matches.

PS if you want me to actually talk to you then don't act like an asshat and try to actually argue on merit. i'll just ignore it and we can move on.

Before we continue what do you know about Dusty Hammond and his relationship with Dwight and Steve?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Before we continue what do you know about Dusty Hammond and his relationship with Dwight and Steve?

I want your argument. I am an open book.

[boutons_deux]

Broke, unemployed and on disability: Here’s how the Oregon militants can afford to play ‘patriot’ games

As the militia stand-off in Oregon comes up on one week, speculation turns to the financial resources that allow men to up and leave their jobs — reportedly for however long it takes — to take an uninvited stand for freedom in an empty bird sanctuary.According to experts who study right-wing movements, militia members barely get by, with some living on government disability checks and the earnings of their neglected wives.

In an interview with The Oregonian (http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2016/01/with_little_outside_support_mi.html), Mark Pitcavage, who has studied far-right movements for 22 years, said most militia members live hand to mouth.

“These guys are broke,” he said. “Right-wing extremists, generally speaking, have very little money.”

While some members have brought their wives and children with them — leading todissension within the ranks (http://%22these%20guys%20are%20broke%2C%22/) — others may have to cut out early before leader Ammon Bundy declares victory and heads home to Nevada.

“It’s quite possible that a lot of them will get tired and feel the pressure to go back and care for their families,” Pitcavage explained.

The extended stay at the national bird refuge in the dead of winter has already cost one militia member his job.

Jason Patrick, of Georgia, claims he lost his $80,000-a-year roofing job — with benefits and a company truck — because he took off without notice and had already used up his vacation days attending other Patriot-inspired events.

“I didn’t get to give appropriate notice,” he said when describing the voicemail message he left for his bosses. “The Constitution is more important.”

According to Daryl Johnson, a former domestic terrorism analyst for the Department of Homeland Security, militia members have unique priorities when it comes to choosing between their beliefs and their families.

“They’ll think nothing about taking half their paycheck and using half of it to buy ammunition and guns,” Johnson told The Oregonian.

Despite the occupation of federal property, militia members in Oregon have been free to come and go as they please as authorities have backed off, allowing one occupier to put in a few hours of paying work.

Occupier Duane Ehmer of Oregon wrote on his Facebook page that he left the refuge to put in some hours.

“I just got back home from the bundy/ Hammond stand off I have to work a few days before I go back,” Duane Ehmer wrote on his Facebook page, adding later, “bringing more guns.”

Jon Ritzheimer, who has been orchestrating anti-Muslim rallies from his Arizona home (http://www.rawstory.com/2015/11/fbi-searching-for-armed-anti-muslim-activist-after-facebook-threat-to-muslim-community-in-new-york/), says he gets by on his veterans’ disability pay, and that he’s “lucky to have a wife who works.”

Occupier spokesperson Maureen Peltier is currently in the Washington National Guard, but will be retiring soon due to a disability (http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/patriot-militias-appeal-to-some-frustrated-vets/) — giving her more time to join protests against the government.

According to Pitcavage, self-described militia group may be rich in organizational skills, but they have empty wallets and must rely small donations from like-minded people.
“There’s no large organization to give them money,” he stated. “The right-wing extremist movement is broke.”

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/broke-unemployed-and-on-disability-heres-how-the-oregon-militants-can-afford-to-play-patriot-games/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

:lol LOSERS! :lol

Vote Repug, they'll make all y'all rich, Spurstalkers say.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I want your argument. I am an open book.

Learn about Dusty's relationship with Dwight and Steve, read Dusty's testimony, and you'll see why there was no poaching cover up.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Learn about Dusty's relationship with Dwight and Steve, read Dusty's testimony, and you'll see why there was no poaching cover up.

So you cannot make your own argument. Figures. I'm done responding to you.

[ChumpDumper]

So you cannot make your own argument. Figures. I'm done responding to you.I dunno. Dude says he was hunting. TSA accepts hearsay saying he's mentally disturbed or something. He believes every right wing source out there without question.

[boutons_deux]

Ryan, Cruz, Trump and Tarp Man: The New Conservative Truth


http://www.truth-out.org/images/images_2016_01/2016_0108tarp.jpg
LaVoy Finicum, a rancher from Arizona, speaks to reporters at the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge near Burns, Oregon, January 5, 2016. Finicum would later cover himself in a blue tarp with a gun in preparation for an "altercation."

There you have it, ladies and gentlemen. Dispense with the elephant. I hereby nominate Mr. Finicum as the new avatar of the modern conservative movement: An angry white guy armed to the teeth with a bag over his head.

http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/34335-ryan-cruz-trump-and-tarp-man-the-new-conservative-truth

[CosmicCowboy]

when did hunting become poaching?

[ChumpDumper]

when did hunting become poaching?If it's out of season or done without permit, for example. I don't know the details of the season there.

[CosmicCowboy]

If it's out of season, for example. I don't know the details of the season there.

Funny, all the court records I have seen (admit to not reading them cover to cover) don't mention any evidence of "poaching".

[boutons_deux]

LaVoy's hat is really nice. I wonder if he bought it to look good on teevee?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I dunno. Dude says he was hunting. TSA accepts hearsay saying he's mentally disturbed or something. He believes every right wing source out there without question.

Oh I know. And it knows I will paint them as a dumbass the order of boutox when they link that shit.

There is no reasoning with people like that so I don't even bother trying. Prima facia their positions are shit and I can discuss better simply by ignoring it. I give accounts that behave like that no legitimacy whatsoever.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Funny, all the court records I have seen (admit to not reading them cover to cover) don't mention any evidence of "poaching".

Such thoroughness, fattie. Good job!

[CosmicCowboy]

Such thoroughness, fattie. Good job!

Feel free to point out the poaching evidence, bitch.

:lmao @ your misplaced fixation on my weight. You are a real keyboard ninja aren't you?

[CosmicCowboy]

Kind of sick having another man fantasizing about my body.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Feel free to point out the poaching evidence, bitch.

I'm not the one forming a position on such half assed measures. I don't know and I am okay with that. I do know the legal standings in regards to state's rights and federal lands and their central position of ceding lands to the state has zero basis.


Constitutional huffing and puffing aside, residents in states like Oregon and Utah have zero legal rights to the land they are trying to claim. The act declaring Utah’s statehood, for example—just like legislation granting statehood to other territories in the 19th and 20th centuries—stipulates that its Legislature “forever disclaim all right and title to the unappropriated public lands.” In fact, the land that these ranchers call their own belongs to the entire country—to school teachers in New York and shipbuilders in Virginia as much as to ranchers in Oregon.
What’s more, the West has historically been a beneficiary of the U.S. government, not a victim. You won’t hear any of this from Bundy or from elected officials who mimic his argument, if not his lawlessness.
The real story is one of a niche interest group (ranchers and their allies) that feels entitled to a federal handout—potentially one of the largest in American history—at the expense of residents of East Coast, Midwest and Southeast states. Like the first Sagebrush Rebellion of 40 years ago, this revolt represents a classic case of fictional privilege, grounded in a shoddy understanding of United States history.


Read more: http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/01/bundhy-protest-ranchers-actually-government-moochers-213510#ixzz3wgpRnbiA

See I am not some dumbass that tries fumbling halfassed through someone else's paralegal investigative work trying to draw an exhaustive conclusion. As has been pointed out the investigation is ongoing. I don't think coming to a conclusion right now is very wise, fattie.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Kind of sick having another man fantasizing about my body.

It's not sexual, fattie. I just know that it bothers you because of the personality type you display.

This particular whine does nothing to dissuade me, gordo. If some people want to think I'm gay and hold it against me because I think your fat after having a knee replacement and when you respond in this fashion then so be it.

[TheSanityAnnex]

So you cannot make your own argument. Figures. I'm done responding to you.

You are just lazy. Here is some reading material for you.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3385554/Ranchers-inspired-militiamen-Oregon-standoff-scraped-16-year-old-relative-s-skin-raw-forced-eat-tobacco-teach-respect-set-fire-government-property.html

Now see if you can figure out why there was no poaching cover up.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

youre back to a couple of words when I look at the quote in my profile.

I might look at it if someone else thinks its interesting but I sincerely doubt that.

[TheSanityAnnex]

youre back to a couple of words when I look at the quote in my profile.

I might look at it if someone else thinks its interesting but I sincerely doubt that.

And you wonder why call you bitch, wonder why they call you bitch. No one believes you don't read every single post of mine in real time. But continue on with your pseudo ignore function.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lol here comes the angry spam. it's so much better filtered this way. Anyway I'm going to go eat a sandwich.

[boutons_deux]

My dear Patriots.

I understand your feelings have been bruised by the many mentions of your groups as "terrorists." Understandably so. Nothing is so loathesome to civilized minds as one who would inflict violence and fear on the innocent to further their political beliefs. I'm also told you prefer to be known as members of a militia. Certainly a nobler appellation, but one which poses some complications.

As you are known to be scholars of the Constitution, let us begin there. Please get out your ubiquitous pocket copies and follow along.

Article I, Section 8 of our founding document states, ""The Congress shall have the power ... To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the Union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions ... To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress."

The rather vague description (Congress defines, states appoint officers) was clarified somewhat by the First Militia Act of 1792, which specified " "whenever the United States shall be invaded, or be in imminent danger of invasion from any foreign nation or Indian tribe" and, further, authorized the nationalization of state militias "whenever the laws of the United States shall be opposed or the execution thereof obstructed, in any state," specifically when the lawbreaking was too big for civil authorities to handle.

The same year, Congress fulfilled its constitutional duty by outlining exactly how state militias were to be organized in the Second Militia Act. In 1795, Congress made clear that the militias could be called into service by the president of the United States.

These laws, along with state laws regarding militias, appear to have sufficed for the needs of such organizations, standing largely unchanged for over a century. However, jurisdictional feuds and other SNAFUs which developed in the Spanish-American War led to the scrapping of the 1792 statutes and their replacement in 1903, when command structures and specific requirements for federalization were codified in a new Militia Act, which defined two varieties of militia, Reserve and state National Guard units.

Got all that? Great. Now let's jump back to that booklet you love so dearly and the passage quoted above: "To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States, reserving to the states respectively, the appointment of officers, and the authority of training the militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress."

So, it appears that our Founders were quite specific in the matter of what a militia is and who controls it, to wit, the Congress and president of the United States and, in the matter of staffing, the executives of individual states. This authority was further clarified by the 1827 court case of Martin v. Mott, in which the Supreme Court ruled emphatically that the president has sole authority over whether militias could be called out for military operations.

Never has there been a single court case or law allowing citizens themselves to make such a determination. I cannot find any evidence of a "DIY Militia Act" of any year.

So it's clear that under no legal or constitutional definition can your group be called a "militia." While you may not like the label "terrorists," your actions bring you squarely under that definition, as Merriam-Webster marks it. At best, you could be called "thugs" or a "violent street gang" (admittedly with a marked lack of streets at present).


But if, by bending law and language to the breaking point, you could, in any interpretation, be considered a militia, you know who your boss would be?

This guy.



http://images.dailykos.com/images/192973/large/obama.jpg?1452099658

Have a nice day. Pick up your trash before you leave our bird refuge, please.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/01/08/1467169/-Dear-Militiamen-Meet-the-New-Boss-Same-as-the-Old-Boss?detail=email

[ChumpDumper]

Funny, all the court records I have seen (admit to not reading them cover to cover) don't mention any evidence of "poaching".Funny, I don't know what any of that has to do with setting an illegal fire.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Funny, I don't know what any of that has to do with setting an illegal fire.

You'll have to ask FuzzyLumpkins after he is done eating his sandwich. I'm going to go buy some dog food and maybe clip my fingernails so I'll respond to you at my own leisure.

[ChumpDumper]

You'll have to ask FuzzyLumpkins after he is done eating his sandwich. I'm going to go buy some dog food and maybe clip my fingernails so I'll respond to you at my own leisure.What a pathetic bitch you have become, Breitbart.

[Winehole23]

http://grist.org/food/this-rancher-says-the-bundys-are-idiots-but-he-too-is-worried-about-losing-access-to-public-land/

[TheSanityAnnex]

Funny, I don't know what any of that has to do with setting an illegal fire.
That's what was being talked about, you idiot.

Are you really so stupid you can't follow a simple conversation.

Well you already answered.

[ChumpDumper]

That's what was being talked about, you idiot.

Are you really so stupid you can't follow a simple conversation.

Well you already answered.I followed it quite easily, Breitbart. I asked what it has to do with the legality of the fire.

[boutons_deux]

Controversial Federal Grazing Fees Not A Great Deal For Anyone

Because at face value that’s exactly what it looks like. Grazing fees are calculated in a weird unit called an Animal Unit Month – A-U-M – essentially how much it would cost to feed one cow and a calf for one month. So on Bureau of Land Management and Forest Service land, that price is currently $1.69.

Now if you compare that to the going rate for private land, which averages about $20 per animal per month, it looks like ranchers are getting a huge discount to use public lands.

It isn’t. Because those two numbers include very different things.“If you just look at the grazing fee itself, and you see the small amount on public land and then a 10-fold increase on private land grazing fees, it looks like — people call it a subsidy,” said John Tanaka, a rangeland economist at the University of Wyoming. “But when you consider all the costs involved in grazing, they’re roughly equal. Or in some cases, public land grazing can cost the rancher more.”

Joe Villagrana, a ranch manager from Lake County, in Southeast Oregon, says permits on public land carry their own costs.
“What people don’t realize is, by holding the permit, you are responsible for maintaining the fences, maintaining water, for example like water troughs,” Villagrana said. “And that costs money. So you add up time, labor, fuel, material and all that, it actually gets to be very expensive. So yeah, that sounds pretty cheap, but with everything that’s put on us to keep that permit, it costs us a lot of money.”

On private lands, a lot of this infrastructure is already included in that up-front price.

Probably the biggest challenge is changing the formula the feds use, or even throwing it out completely. Rimbey said bidding on permits, like they do in Idaho, would get closer to reflecting what the actual market value of the grazing is. But that would require a change to a law that has essentially been the same since 1966.

http://www.opb.org/news/series/burns-oregon-standoff-bundy-militia-news-updates/federal-grazing-fees/

Do the Feds police the ranchers on public to see if they really do the required maintenance?

what do the ranchers want? pay the $1.69 but have the Feds to all the maintenance?

fucking free-loading, whiny moochers wanting "free stuff".

btw, a graph on the above link shows that the Fed fee hasn't increased in 35+ years, so $1.69 was a lot more expensive in 1980, so why no Bundy bullshit back then?

[boutons_deux]

Armed Oregon occupation: Is it really about white poverty in the West?

If you thought the armed occupation of a federal bird refuge in Oregon was simply a battle over land rights, think again.
(http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2016/0109/Armed-Oregon-occupation-Is-it-really-about-white-poverty-in-the-West#)
This week, Ammon Bundy, the leader of the group, complained that Westerners are helpless against a federal foe that is “literally putting [people] into poverty.”

To be sure, since their take-over of Malheur National Wildlife Refuge last weekend, Mr. Bundy and his group have struggled to elicit sympathy and support. But by reframing the issue, Bundy may find a wider audience. And he's right: Poverty in the American West is rising even as it has fallen in the Deep South.

By raising the plight of poor, mostly white Americans languishing under the thumb of federal land managers provides a poignant insight into recent economic trends as well as a centuries-old fight over land use in the west, one which could, some say, provide these Western range riders common cause with other groups of marginalized Americans (http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2015/1105/America-s-red-state-crisis).

Bundy’s comments are “really the first time [since the Great Depression] where rural people are talking about their fear of poverty and their experience of poverty,”

“White people don’t want to talk about being poor or a small town in Kansas being a white ghetto – nobody’s going to use those terms.

What’s remarkable is that these guys are actually saying ‘impoverishment’ and blaming it on government, as opposed to broader structures in society.”

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2016/0109/Armed-Oregon-occupation-Is-it-really-about-white-poverty-in-the-West

These low-wage, low-info. we-want-free-stuff rurals have bought the Repug/VRWC LIES that govt is root of ALL problems.

"If we could just kill govt, all problems would disappear."

[boutons_deux]

Tribe Member: 'We Would Have Been Dead By Now' If We Acted Like Oregon Militants

BURNS, Ore. -- The armed protesters who seized remote federal property in Oregon should leave, the Burns Paiute Tribal Council urged Wednesday. The occupiers claim the federal land rightfully belongs to the mostly white population of eastern Oregon, but Harney County was largely Paiute territory (http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-bundys-occupy-oregon) prior to white settlement.

On a foggy Wednesday morning, some of the tribe's nearly 420 members gathered at the top of a snow-packed hill on the Paiute reservation to discuss their concerns about the outsiders. The doors of the meeting center were plastered with signs warning people not to bring firearms inside.

"As a Native, if we were to go out there and fight back like they are, we would have been dead by now," said Carla Teeman, a social services assistant at the tribe.

"They are desecrating one of our sacred traditional cultural properties," said Charlotte Rodrique, the tribal chair. "They are endangering our children and the safety of our community."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/tribe-member-american-indians-would-have-been-dead-by-now-if-they-protested-like-oregon-militants_568d8bc8e4b0c8beacf58547?utm_hp_ref=must-reads%3Fncid%3Dnewsltushpmg00000003

[Winehole23]

Ammon Bundy's mother sends out a call for supplies, FBI arrives:


Saturday, members of the FBI began arriving at Burns Municipal Airport about 30 miles from the U.S. bird refuge where militants have occupied a federal building for the past week.http://www.news3lv.com/content/news/story/FBI-arrival-call-for-donations-hint-at-possible/7cRghyVNA0Gak3tmaE_4MA.cspx

[boutons_deux]

Western Voters Don’t Agree With The Demands Of Armed Militia In Oregon

The poll (https://www.coloradocollege.edu/stateoftherockies/conservationinthewest/), released Monday by Colorado College, surveyed voters in seven western states (Arizona, Colorado, Nevada, New Mexico, Montana, Utah, and Wyoming) on their views regarding public lands and energy. It found that most western voters — 58 percent — don’t want states to take over management of public lands. That’s one of the main desires of Ammon Bundy and the rest of the group that’s occupying the Malheur Wildlife Refuge — to turn federally protected lands over to private and state ownership, which the group thinks would help open up these lands to more drilling, mining, and grazing.

“These findings show us that the Bundy family…are far out of touch with most folks living in the West,” Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar said on a press call Monday. “Anyone who tells us to hand public lands over to private owners and the state are telling us a story that won’t stand the test of time.”


http://cdn.thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/11142404/coloradocollege-816x352.jpg

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2016/01/11/3738043/western-voters-poll-public-lands/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+climateprogress%2FlCrX+%28Cli mate+Progress%29

I remember other ranchers disagreeing with Cloven, that he should pay his subsidized grazing fees like everybody else.

[RandomGuy]

http://i.imgur.com/D2HkQi2.jpg

[RandomGuy]

http://image.oregonlive.com/home/olive-media/pgmain/img/geek/photo/2016/01/04/screen-shot-2016-01-04-at-111300-ampng-7680af3f2358a323.png

[TheSanityAnnex]

The militia is an easy target and useful tool to distract from the real problem of the out of control BLM and the tactics they are using to force people off of their land.

[Quetzal-X]

The Honkey Invisibility Cloak outchea in Full MuthaFuckin' Effizzzekt!

[TheSanityAnnex]

The Honkey Invisibility Cloak outchea in Full MuthaFuckin' Effizzzekt!

You need a new schtick, this one is completely ignored by all.

[Quetzal-X]

You need a new schtick, this one is completely ignored by all.
except for yourself?

[Quetzal-X]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daYXkvDNj0UKang Barreh needs to light these welfare porkskinned squatters up with some fuckin drones n shit.

:lolStraighten out that 1 inbreds face tbh :lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daYXkvDNj0U

[TheSanityAnnex]

except for yourself?
In this instance yes I acknowledged you. Pay attention from here on out and see how often others do the same, and then realize you need a new schtick.

[Quetzal-X]

In this instance yes I acknowledged you. Pay attention from here on out and see how often others do the same, and then realize you need a new schtick.


:lol we r gonna ignore you!

lol fucking honkeys

[Quetzal-X]

Do you need some extra tampons like your inbreds bundy brothers bitch?

[TSA]

Do you need some extra tampons like your inbreds bundy brothers bitch?

:lmao fucking honkey inbred squatters

[boutons_deux]

Oregon standoff: Bundy, militants destroy fence at federal refuge

Militants presiding over an armed occupation of a federal bird sanctuary destroyed a portion of a fence Monday afternoon that they said was installed by the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service – using the agency's own equipment.

The stunt was perhaps the militants' boldest yet since overtaking the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge earlier this month. Arizona businessman Ammon Bundy and his band of protesters traveled about five miles south of refuge headquarters to a property where they said a local ranching family grazes cattle.

Bundy, son of Nevada rancher Cliven Bundy, said the Fish and Wildlife Service used a $100,000 grant to install the fence last year, preventing the family's 600 cattle from grazing on nearby public land.

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/oregon_standoff_bundy_militant.html

[boutons_deux]

meanwhile, Repugs screwing N-As for profit.

iow, what Bundy buttholes and other Westerners really want is Ms of acres of "free stuff" that belongs to The American People.

==================


In a secret, backroom deal, Congress snuck language into a must-pass defense bill to transfer sacred Native American lands in Arizona to a multinational copper mining company.
For years, Republican lawmakers in Arizona have tried to give away the national forest in and around the Apache holy land of Oak Flat to the foreign-owned Resolution Copper, a company with “dismal human rights and environmental records.”1

Since Oak Flat sits on large copper reserves, Resolution Copper’s highly destructive plan to mine the area will create a crater two miles wide and 1,000 feet deep.2
If this giveaway stands, these sacred lands will be permanently destroyed. However, new legislation introduced by progressive champion Sen. Bernie Sanders will repeal this deplorable land grab and protect this holy land for good.

http://act.credoaction.com/sign/sanders_oak_flat?t=1&akid=16498.2603534.qcDN7W

[Winehole23]

the main economic problem cattle ranchers face is the consolidation of meat packers:


As the University of Missouri rural sociologist Mary Hendrickson points out (https://www.fca.gov/Download/Symposium14/hendrickson19feb2014.pdf), after a decade of mergers and acquisitions (https://www.aae.wisc.edu/fsrg/publications/Archived/wp-92.pdf), just four companies slaughtered and packed 69 percent of US-grown cows in 1990. By 2011—after another spasm of mergers (http://grist.org/article/meat-wagon-beef-behemoth/)—the four-company market share had risen to 82 percent, Hendrickson reports.

Such consolidation at the top of the value chain gives farmers less leverage to get a decent price for their cows. A market dominated by a few buyers is a buyer's market. The Kansas rancher and rural advocate Mike Callicrate (http://www.mikecallicrate.com/) has been making this point tirelessly for years. Callicrate thinks the BLM has been overly burdensome for ranchers in the West, he tells me, but there's a bigger problem that is "rarely mentioned" either by the gun-toting ranchers or the media covering them: "the historically low, below break-even, market prices for livestock."

http://www.motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2016/01/malheur-militants-are-picking-wrong-beef-feds

[Winehole23]

Rather than demanding unfettered access to public land, the Malheur rebels could be agitating for federal antitrust authorities to take on the beef giants. As the New America Foundation's Barry C. Lynn has shown (http://www.demos.org/sites/default/files/publications/Lynn.pdf) repeatedly, since the age of Reagan, US antitrust regulators have focused almost exclusively on whether large companies use their market power to harm consumers by unfairly raising retail prices. Those regulators have looked the other way when companies deploy their girth to harm their suppliers by squeezing them on price. So antitrust authorities okayed merger after merger, even when deals left just a few giant companies towering over particular markets. As a result, writes Lynn, "In sector after sector, control is now more tightly concentrated than at any time in a century." The meat industry is a classic example (http://grist.org/article/2009-09-22-meat-wagon-jbs-pilgrims/).

[boutons_deux]

rurals are getting fucked by BigCorp just like everybody else, but they watch Fox to get dumbed down, listen to their asshole Repug Congresscritters, and are suckered into believing the ONLY problem is the govt.

[pgardn]

Bundyfication
Bundify
Bundiferous

Feel free to use the above For any situation in which Big______ uses government to screw rural folks.

Sincerely,
Boots

[boutons_deux]

Ammon Bundy really does think his armed occupation is like Rosa Parks — and women’s liberation


Ammon Bundy @Ammon_Bundy (https://twitter.com/Ammon_Bundy)

We are doing the same thing as Rosa Parks did. We are standing up against bad laws which dehumanize us and destroy our freedom.
12:12 AM - 6 Jan 2016 (https://twitter.com/Ammon_Bundy/status/684618461100818432)





(https://twitter.com/intent/tweet?in_reply_to=684618461100818432)

397397 Retweets (https://twitter.com/intent/retweet?tweet_id=684618461100818432)

466466 likes (https://twitter.com/intent/like?tweet_id=684618461100818432)



he told host David Hodges that he and other militants seized the federal building because they had exhausted every other legal process in their effort to transfer federally owned land to the control of an extralegal group he had set up in Harney County,

“There has been a complete exhaustion of prudent methods, including through the courts, including through elected representatives,” said Bundy, who arrived in the county about a month ahead of the takeover and tried to win supporters.

He established a six-member Committee of Safety and a “common law grand jury,” which are based on extralegal “sovereign citizen” concepts that mimic tactics used by American colonists ahead of the Revolutionary War.

“Just as our founders taught, this is the right way to do it,”

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/ammon-bundy-really-does-think-his-armed-occupation-is-like-rosa-parks-and-womens-liberation/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

goddam, you rightwingnuts are stupid, ignorant bunch of assholes. Throw in made-up-shit Mormonism, and you got REAL stupidity, ignorance.

:lol

[boutons_deux]

ISIS supporter joins Ammon Bundy’s armed occupation as resident computer expert
http://www.rawstory.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/fry2-800x430.jpg

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/isis-supporter-joins-ammon-bundys-armed-occupation-as-resident-computer-expert/

This bundy shit attracts the flies and maggots

[boutons_deux]

The Daily Cost Of The Bundy Occupation


http://cdn.thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/12220812/AP_291627039992-1024x702.jpg

Cost to the County: $70,000 Per Day

Harney County Judge Steve Grasty told outraged community members that he’d send the Bundys a bill for what they’d cost the county — which he estimates to be “$60,000 to $70,000 a day” for the closed schools and government offices and the drastic ramp-up in security.

Despite Judge Grasty’s threats, he doesn’t seem optimistic about actually recouping their losses. He reiterated the threat (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/oregon-county-judge-militia-pay-fine-occupation-article-1.2493839) to the New York Daily News, but clarified that he doesn’t expect Mr. Bundy to pony up: “Will he pay it? No.”
These estimates for security don’t include the additional cost of the FBI presence and support, just the cost to the rural community around the reserve — which is bearing the brunt of the economic fallout.

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2016/01/12/3738570/the-true-victim-of-the-bundy-occupation-is-taxpayers/

Wasting taxpayers money is what Bundy and assholes learned from the Founding Fathers

[boutons_deux]

Militiaman Loses His Cool Over Getting Sex Toys In Care Packages (VIDEO)

The self-styled militiamen occupying an Oregon wildlife refuge got your mail – and they’re not amused.

In a video posted online Tuesday, Jon Ritzheimer, one of the ringleaders of the occupation, shared the fruits of a recent mail run after the armed anti-government militants put out a call (http://www.buzzfeed.com/salvadorhernandez/oregon-militia-wants-hay-menthol-100s-and-french-vanilla-cre#.uxpgXWKzb7)for food, clothing, and hygiene products.

Ritzheimer bemoaned the “abundance of hate mail” while digging through dozens of packages spread across a table.

“It was really mind blowing that people would...spend and waste their money of all this hateful stuff to send out here to us,” he said in the video. “Rather than going out and
doing good, they spend all their money on hate, and hate, and hate, and hate.”

While he doesn’t highlight many of the unsolicited gifts, Ritzheimer makes it clear that the men have been gifted numerous sex toys.

“This one is really funny...a bag of dicks,” he said, holding up what appears to be a bag of novelty candy modeled on male genitalia.

Ritzheimer then registers his frustration by shoving all the packages off the table in one sweeping motion.

“We’re not going to be deterred, we’re not going to let your junk and hate mail sidetrack us,” Ritzheimer said.

He concluded the video with another call to action for “the rest of you patriots out there” to come join the cause and be “part of history in the making.” :lol

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/jon-ritzheimer-militia-care-package--4?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+tpm-news+%28TPMNews%29

[boutons_deux]

Replacing "Bundy white boys" in CNN report

Since the black militants/Muslim terrorists occupying the Malheur Wildlife Refuge came to town, there has been an increase in the number of "vandalism, harassment and intimidation reports," Harney County Sheriff Dave Ward said.

"There are continual reports of law enforcement officers and community members being followed home; of people sitting in cars outside their homes, observing their movements and those of their families; and of people following them and their families as they move around the community," Ward said on Monday.

"While not direct physical threats, these activities are clearly designed to try to intimidate," he said.

Some of the black militants/Muslim terrorists have been able to leave and return from the refuge center during the occupation.

"Let me be clear: The law enforcement agencies -- those that are local as well as the sheriff's deputies from around the state, the Oregon State Police troopers and the FBI agents -- will not be intimidated from doing their jobs.

"Everyone on the law enforcement side is working together to bring a peaceful resolution to this situation, and the behavior of the black militants/Muslim terrorists from outside of our community only serves to escalate the situation unnecessarily."

Ammon Bundy, the son of the black militant/Muslim terrorist Cliven Bundy, and others have been hunkered down in the wildlife refuge since early January. The militant/terrorist occupation started out as a call against the conviction of Dwight Hammond and his son Steven -- two militants/terrorists who were found guilty in 2012 of committing arson on federal lands in Oregon -- but soon morphed into a bigger movement, rallying against the role of the federal government when it comes to land rights.

Ward says that both law enforcement and employees for the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, which runs the refuge, have been harassed recently by the black militants/Muslim terrorists.

He says Fish and Wildlife workers have seen vehicles driving slowly or idling in front of their homes.

"Self-identified black militant/Muslim terrorist militia members" will approach them in public, according to Ward, trying engage in a debate about the federal government.

"The black militants/Muslim terrorists on the refuge -- and those who they have called to our community -- obviously have no consideration for the wishes or needs of the people of Harney County," he said. "If they did, they, too, would work to bring this situation to a peaceful close."

Ward said after a recently issued "call to action," more armed black militants/Muslim terrorists and "outside militia members" have begun to show up...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/01/12/1468688/-White-Privilege-101-The-Bundy-Brigands-are-Now-Openly-Threatening-and-Harassing-People-in-Oregon?detail=email

[boutons_deux]

http://images.dailykos.com/images/193756/story_image/TMW2016-01-13color.png?1452287749

[angrydude]

That cartoon isn't clever or funny. I'm not surprised you thought it was relevant to post.

[boutons_deux]

Bundy Bodyguard 'Fluffy Unicorn' Arrested in Arizona

Ammon Bundy's bodyguard from the early days of the Malheur Wildlife Refuge standoff has been arrested for an outstanding warrant in Maricopa County, Arizona

local officials would not release details of the Monday arrest, but did confirm that Cavalier was not arrested on federal charges.

Cavalier had been masquerading at the compound as a former marine, but a Daily Mail story (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3387117/Stolen-valor-Militiaman-bodyguard-ranchers-Cliven-Ammon-Bundy-posing-retired-Marine-served-Afghanistan-Iraq-boost-combat-credentials.html)set that record straight. Instead of serving in Iraq and Afghanistan, Cavalier was a tattoo artist with a few DUIs on the record.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/bundy-bodyguard-arrested?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+tpm-news+%28TPMNews%29

:lol

[boutons_deux]

Oregon militia will get 55 gallons of lube for all those dildos

The Oregon militia will soon get a 55-gallon drum of personal lubricant to go along with all those dildos they've received (http://www.sfgate.com/local/article/Oregon-occupiers-Quit-sending-us-dildos-6756019.php), courtesy of Cards Against Humanity co-founder Max Temkin.

Temkin tweeted that he purchased the lube on Amazon (They really do have everything, don't they?), and even sprung for expedited shipping.

You're welcome, Oregon militia.

This is what happens when you start an armed protest at a bird sanctuary (http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Protesters-occupy-federal-building-at-Oregon-6733719.php), forget food and let the world know that y'all need snacks.

Temkin later tweeted: "I hope nobody shoots me with a gun."

If nothing else, this should add a few more chapters to the homoerotic fan fiction Twitter hashtag #BundyEroticFanFic (http://blog.sfgate.com/hottopics/2016/01/07/oregon-militia-homoerotic-fan-fiction-sweeps-twitter-thanks-to-hashtag/).

http://m.sfgate.com/nation/article/Oregon-militia-will-get-55-gallons-of-lube-for-6762936.php

:lol

you rightwingnuts and gun fellators are laughable fools. :lol

[spankadelphia]

Holy shit, 29 pages on these knuckleheads?:lmao

[boutons_deux]

Oregon occupier arrested: Are Feds ready to get tough?
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2016/0116/Oregon-occupier-arrested-Are-Feds-ready-to-get-tough-video

[Winehole23]

from the link ^^^


This is not the first time (http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/protester_arrested_in_burns_dr.html) Medenbach has been arrested. In 1995, Medenbach was convicted for illegally creating an unauthorized, heavily fortified campsite in the Gifford Pinchot National Forest in Washington state.


According to the court that sentenced him two decades ago, there was "evidence that Medenbach had attempted to protect his forest campsite with fifty to a hundred pounds of the explosive ammonium sulfate, a pellet gun, and what appeared to be a hand grenade with trip wires."

[boutons_deux]

we'll see if the local authorities really manage to stick these ignorant bubbas with many $10Ks of the costs of covering their futile, sterile, ridiculous stunt

[Nbadan]

Public service announcement...

http://i1068.photobucket.com/albums/u453/Snarkoleptic/nodildos_zpsuavaapat.jpg

[Nbadan]

Genius I tell you....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvCAxGmDq9k

[boutons_deux]

Genius I tell you....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvCAxGmDq9k

... disturbing federal property, their crimes add up.

[boutons_deux]

Rural Oregon’s Lost Prosperity Gives Standoff a Distressed Backdrop

Times were once very good out here on the high desert of east-central Oregon, and a place like Burns — remote and obscure until a group of armed protesters took over a nearby federal wildlife sanctuary early this month — was full of civic pride and bustle. In their heyday, Harney County and its largest town, Burns, were economically important in a way that now seems unthinkable in the rural West.

These days, cities like Portland, Salt Lake City and Boise, Idaho, are gobbling up more of the jobs than ever, especially the good ones. Half the jobs in Oregon, for example, are now clustered in just three counties in and around Portland, according to a study (http://headwaterseconomics.org/economic-development/trends-performance/urban-areas-drive-economic-growth-in-the-west) by Headwaters Economics, a nonprofit research group in Bozeman, Mont. Almost two-thirds of Utah’s jobs are along the Wasatch Front, which runs from Salt Lake City to Provo.

And isolated, rural counties like Harney — with 7,126 people in an area larger than Massachusetts — are too far away from those urban centers to catch the economic uplift, the study said. So the population grows ever older, poorer and less educated, and opportunities continue to dry up: The county has 10 percent fewer jobs (http://oregoneconomicanalysis.com/2016/01/06/harney-county-a-brief-historical-perspective/) than it did in 1979, according to state figures.

The pattern of poverty has shifted nationally as well. In the four decades since the late 1960s, poverty rates fell or remained stable across the Northeast, South and Midwest — but rose significantly across the West, a Pew Research Center study said in 2014.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/19/us/rural-oregons-lost-prosperity-gives-standoff-a-distressed-backdrop.html?_r=0

Not the Fed's fault America is still urbanizing/de-ruralizing. Repugs LIE to the rurals that EVERYTHING is the Fed's fault.

[boutons_deux]

same, maybe worse, in Maine and elsewhere

In Maine, Local Control Is a Luxury Fewer Towns Can Afford

CARY PLANTATION, Me. — Up here, near the end of Interstate 95, a single main road ridged with stately conifers runs past the odd house that at night casts an orange glow over the snow. There is no school. No police department. Not even a stoplight.

But there are property taxes. And some residents say the taxes’ growth has pushed this community of about 200 to the brink. To save Cary Plantation, they say, they want to dismantle it.

“What do you do, what does the town do, when they can’t pay their bills? Do we go bankrupt? Do we lose our homes?” asked Diane Cassidy, a former nursing assistant. “There was no answer, other than deorganization.”

Ms. Cassidy is leading an effort to dissolve the local government and join the Unorganized Territory, a vast swath of forest and townships in north, central and eastern Maine run by a partnership between the state and the counties. Last month, residents here voted, 64 to 0, to continue the process.

At a time of rising municipal costs, local governments around the country are looking for ways to rein in tax bills, pursuing privatization, the consolidation of services, mergers and even bankruptcy.

But in northern Maine, as operating costs have increased, the economy has stagnated and the population has aged and dwindled, a handful of struggling towns have pursued the unusual process of eliminating local government entirely.

In the West, citizens are protesting to constrain government power. And over all, Americans tend to resist ceding their local authority. But these communities are handing their governing power over to the state and the county.

“Knowing how dependent towns are in Maine on the property tax, they may have just reached a point where they’ve decided, ‘We’d be better off just not existing as a town,’ ”

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/17/us/in-maine-local-control-is-a-luxury-fewer-towns-can-afford.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgqVCJpRqWQ

[pgardn]

Using a metal ladder next to a transforming station is not a good idea.
Putting a big bag of saltwater (human body) up in the air connected to a nice ground around high potential differences is a horrible idea.

These guys are going to kill themselves.
That was seriously stupid for these high tech freedom fighters.

Thanfully no one was hurt.

[pgardn]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xspo3Xxb8No

This happens even when there are no cameras present.
Notice how far it is arcing thru the AIR at the end. Put a body up there. Attached to the ground via metal


If those guys are going around fiddling with this stuff the power company is obliged to shut the station down cutting off electricity to various parts of Oregon. Let's see how that goes over with the population these stations serve.

[boutons_deux]

Using a metal ladder next to a transforming station is not a good idea.


electricity is way too high tech for these rural inbreds

[RandomGuy]

Holy shit, 29 pages on these knuckleheads?:lmao

These guys are a gift to satire writers everywhere. :lol

[RandomGuy]

Using a metal ladder next to a transforming station is not a good idea.
Putting a big bag of saltwater (human body) up in the air connected to a nice ground around high potential differences is a horrible idea.

These guys are going to kill themselves.
That was seriously stupid for these high tech freedom fighters.

Thanfully no one was hurt.

http://www.darwinawards.com/

I would not wish harm on anyone, but neither would I be overly sad. Some people, just make the kinds of decisions that weed themselves out of reality.

[RandomGuy]

The militia is an easy target and useful tool to distract from the real problem of the out of control BLM and the tactics they are using to force people off of their land.

ribe Member: 'We Would Have Been Dead By Now' If We Acted Like Oregon Militants


BURNS, Ore. -- The armed protesters who seized remote federal property in Oregon should leave, the Burns Paiute Tribal Council urged Wednesday. The occupiers claim the federal land rightfully belongs to the mostly white population of eastern Oregon, but Harney County was largely Paiute territory prior to white settlement.

On a foggy Wednesday morning, some of the tribe's nearly 420 members gathered at the top of a snow-packed hill on the Paiute reservation to discuss their concerns about the outsiders. The doors of the meeting center were plastered with signs warning people not to bring firearms inside.

"As a Native, if we were to go out there and fight back like they are, we would have been dead by now," said Carla Teeman, a social services assistant at the tribe.

"They are desecrating one of our sacred traditional cultural properties," said Charlotte Rodrique, the tribal chair. "They are endangering our children and the safety of our community."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...ushpmg00000003

Force which people off which land?

[pgardn]

http://www.darwinawards.com/

I would not wish harm on anyone, but neither would I be overly sad. Some people, just make the kinds of decisions that weed themselves out of reality.

The cameras at the transforming station appeared to be in the middle of nowhere... A good place to have a transforming station. The only reason I can see for putting cameras up is possibly security of power systems. Will they assault a sewage treatment plant next?

[baseline bum]

Thanfully no one was hurt.

???

It would be funny as shit to see one of those assholes die there and then they blame the feds for it.

[CavsSuperFan]

Maybe this was posted already but I just heard about it Sunday…Bundy protesters sent sex toys for supplies request…:lmao

http://cw33.com/2016/01/13/sex-toys-sent-to-oregon-protesters-bring-new-meaning-to-junk-mail/

[boutons_deux]

Maybe this was posted already but I just heard about it Sunday…Bundy protesters sent sex toys for supplies request…:lmao

http://cw33.com/2016/01/13/sex-toys-sent-to-oregon-protesters-bring-new-meaning-to-junk-mail/

already posted, and somebody else sent a 55 gallon drum of lube. see above

[baseline bum]

I think I'm going to send them a copy of Obama's book.

[boutons_deux]

Get the Government's Hands Off My Foster Kid Subsidies


http://a3.img.talkingpointsmemo.com/image/upload/c_fill,fl_keep_iptc,g_faces,h_365,w_652/yh0vwvkl0lwvbvytlodk.jpg

Here's a disturbing update from the Oregon militant standoff. Robert “LaVoy” Finicum, one of the most colorful militants (http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/lavoy-finicum-is-a-militiaman-and-a-novelist), says that Arizona child protective services has removed four foster children (http://www.opb.org/news/series/burns-oregon-standoff-bundy-militia-news-updates/militant-says-foster-children-were-pulled-from-his-home-lavoy-finicum-burns-oregon/), apparently all boys, from his care because of his involvement in the standoff.

There's no direct evidence offered to show that the removals are tied to the standoff, though the timing - all coinciding with the standoff - makes it a reasonable surmise. And there's zero evidence to back up Finicum's claim that the federal government pressured state authorities to remove the children. Indeed, he doesn't claim to have any evidence, just his suspicion, which for him seems to equal evidence.

Two points got my attention about this story.

First, having one parent away from the home for a significant period of time committing a number of high profile federal crimes would seem like at least a plausible reason to remove the children. This doesn't seem to occur to Finicum.

The second point comes further down in the article. From a mix of tabulations by Oregon Public Broadcasting and Finicum's own account, Finicum and his wife apparently get almost all or all of their income from being foster parents. His ranch in Chino Valley, Arizona is break even at best and appears to generate no income.

Now, foster parents, especially those who care for troubled children, are truly doing God's work. And they are entitled to compensation, both for the work involved in being a parent and for the substantial out of pocket expenses involved in raising children. But it seems at least ironic and perhaps more than ironic that this paragon of getting the government off our backs and radical, near-absolute individualism supports himself and his wife off state subsidies. I've also always thought that there are at least possible adverse incentives created when foster parents get all their income from being foster parents. (That said, placing foster children is, I know, incredibly challenging work. And not knowing enough about the practice, I certainly don't begrudge state authorities placing children with parents who seem, after careful scrutiny, able to provide a caring home environment - even if it's their sole or near sole source of income.)

It's certainly possible that Finicum and his wife provide a great experience and place of emotional support for these boys. That's what he says and maybe he's right. But participation in anti-government extremist activity and various federal crimes seems to merit at least a close look at whether this is a healthy environment for these children, especially if they are taking in as many as 8 or 10 at a time and it's their only source of income.

Regardless, Finicum's claim that this is another example of the government persecution of him - removing foster children, who come with

state subsidies which are his only source of income,

because he has abandoned them to go commit crimes against the federal government in another state -

just illustrates painfully and comically what a nonsense bubble these jokers live in.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/get-the-government-s-hands-off-my-foster-kid-subsidies

hmm, state subsidies are his only source of income? aka, a moocher, a taker, an anti-John Galt.

tough on the kids getting shuttled around.

[Splits]

I think I'm going to send them a copy of Obama's book.

Better make that an audio book...

[TheSanityAnnex]

Maybe this was posted already but I just heard about it Sunday…Bundy protesters sent sex toys for supplies request…:lmao

http://cw33.com/2016/01/13/sex-toys-sent-to-oregon-protesters-bring-new-meaning-to-junk-mail/

:lol it's a couple posters over at AR15.com sending the dildos

[boutons_deux]

Oregon militants use traditional Jewish horns as Christian ‘battle trumpets’ in insanely weird performance



http://www.rawstory.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Oregon-militant-horns-800x430.jpg


Oregon militants posted footage of themselves online blowing what appear to be traditional Jewish “spiritual warfare” horns in a short video asking for support,Gawker reported. (http://gawker.com/powerful-oregon-militiamen-upload-video-of-themselves-1753840048)

The video was attributed to Blaine Cooper, the alias used by Stanley Blaine Hicks, with a description reading,

“THE BATTLE TRUMPET HAS BEEN SOUNDED TIME TO RISE! CALL TO ACTION SEND IN THE TROOPS TO STAND WITH US IN BURNS OREGON!”

The footage shows two men blowing on instruments resembling the shofar, a traditional Jewish horn made out of a ram horn, typically used to announce the end of the fasting period in Yom Kippur. Several Biblical passages also make reference to the horn being used to mark the start of a war.

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/oregon-militants-use-traditional-jewish-horns-as-christian-battle-trumpets-in-insanely-weird-performance/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

:lol

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lol more lube and a couple of sex fists shipped out last night. These guys are sending hundreds of dollars of sex toys. Also some of those Amazon gummy bears that make you shit your pants :lol

[baseline bum]

:lol more lube and a couple of sex fists shipped out last night. These guys are sending hundreds of dollars of sex toys. Also some of those Amazon gummy bears that make you shit your pants :lol

:rollin :rollin :rollin


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sMjgaa5j_LE

[boutons_deux]

GOP chair of Natural Resources Committee seeks public lands giveaway disguised as environmental bill (http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/1/21/1472933/-Natural-Resources-Committee-chairman-seeks-public-lands-giveaway-disguised-as-environmental-bill)

Two Republican Utah congressmen have introduced a deceptive public lands initiative designed to open a million acres of public land to private interests while pretending to protect other lands under a bogus “wilderness” designation where weakened environmental regulations would make that label a very unfunny joke.

For 40 years, extremists have been eager to take over federal lands. It started with the Sagebrush Rebellion of the 1970s, which was reincarnated in the 1980s and ‘90s as the so-called Wise Use movement, which was and is a network of right-wing grassroots and corporate front groups focused on attacking environmentalists and promoting free-for-all resource exploitation.

Among its exemplars have been James G. Watt, the corrupt secretary of Interior appointed by Ronald Reagan, and funders like the cult fascist Rev. Sun Myung Moon, founder of the Washington Times.

The movement’s anti-government, anti-environmentalist rhetoric has sparked its own cohort of stormtroopers whose latest action is on display in the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge, where ever more militants are showing up every day to join the armed takeover and demand that the land be given back to its original owners.

They mean themselves, of course, not the Northern Paiutes whose presence there dates back several thousand years. That land has been in federal hands since it was pried from the Paiutes nearly 140 years ago.

The Wise Use movement has sought to open all but a small portion of federal lands to unfettered clear-cutting, mining, grazing, and the driving of off-road recreational vehicles. The rhetoric of today’s movement, polished in The Wise Use Agenda (http://www.amazon.com/Agenda-Citizens-Policy-Environmental-Resource/dp/B001EPISVS/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1453401491&sr=8-2&keywords=the+wise+use+agenda), a 1989 book edited by Alan Gottlieb, talks a good game to the uninitiated. But it dismisses environmental concerns.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/01/21/1472933/-Natural-Resources-Committee-chairman-seeks-public-lands-giveaway-disguised-as-environmental-bill?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+dailykos%2Findex+%28Daily+Kos %29

[boutons_deux]

Ammon Bundy and Members of Oregon Protest Arrested After Confrontation With FBI


One person is dead and several others, including Oregon occupation leader Ammon Bundy, were arrested during a confrontation with the FBI and state police on Tuesday night, according to reports.

Bundy and a few of his followers were stopped en route to a community meeting in John Day, located around 70 miles away, KATU-TV reported (http://katu.com/news/local/leader-of-oregon-occupation-ammon-bundy-three-others-arrested).

Shots were fired when the law enforcement officials made the stop, the station said. Ammon Bundy, Ryan Bundy, Brian Cavalier, Shawna Cox, and Ryan W. Payne were then arrested.

One person died, and it is unclear who fired first, according to KATU.

Their arrests came on the 25th day of their occupation. Bundy and about three dozen other people occupied a wildlife refuge starting earlier this month after two local ranchers were sent to prison for setting fires on federal land.

Oregon’s governor last week said she’s tired of the protest in the southeastern corner of the state.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1951200-ammon-bundy-and-members-of-oregon-protest-arrested-after-confrontation-with-fbi-reports/

[baseline bum]

:lmao :lmao :lmao

[baseline bum]

Get the Government's Hands Off My Foster Kid Subsidies


http://a3.img.talkingpointsmemo.com/image/upload/c_fill,fl_keep_iptc,g_faces,h_365,w_652/yh0vwvkl0lwvbvytlodk.jpg

Here's a disturbing update from the Oregon militant standoff. Robert “LaVoy” Finicum, one of the most colorful militants (http://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/lavoy-finicum-is-a-militiaman-and-a-novelist), says that Arizona child protective services has removed four foster children (http://www.opb.org/news/series/burns-oregon-standoff-bundy-militia-news-updates/militant-says-foster-children-were-pulled-from-his-home-lavoy-finicum-burns-oregon/), apparently all boys, from his care because of his involvement in the standoff.

There's no direct evidence offered to show that the removals are tied to the standoff, though the timing - all coinciding with the standoff - makes it a reasonable surmise. And there's zero evidence to back up Finicum's claim that the federal government pressured state authorities to remove the children. Indeed, he doesn't claim to have any evidence, just his suspicion, which for him seems to equal evidence.

Two points got my attention about this story.

First, having one parent away from the home for a significant period of time committing a number of high profile federal crimes would seem like at least a plausible reason to remove the children. This doesn't seem to occur to Finicum.

The second point comes further down in the article. From a mix of tabulations by Oregon Public Broadcasting and Finicum's own account, Finicum and his wife apparently get almost all or all of their income from being foster parents. His ranch in Chino Valley, Arizona is break even at best and appears to generate no income.

Now, foster parents, especially those who care for troubled children, are truly doing God's work. And they are entitled to compensation, both for the work involved in being a parent and for the substantial out of pocket expenses involved in raising children. But it seems at least ironic and perhaps more than ironic that this paragon of getting the government off our backs and radical, near-absolute individualism supports himself and his wife off state subsidies. I've also always thought that there are at least possible adverse incentives created when foster parents get all their income from being foster parents. (That said, placing foster children is, I know, incredibly challenging work. And not knowing enough about the practice, I certainly don't begrudge state authorities placing children with parents who seem, after careful scrutiny, able to provide a caring home environment - even if it's their sole or near sole source of income.)

It's certainly possible that Finicum and his wife provide a great experience and place of emotional support for these boys. That's what he says and maybe he's right. But participation in anti-government extremist activity and various federal crimes seems to merit at least a close look at whether this is a healthy environment for these children, especially if they are taking in as many as 8 or 10 at a time and it's their only source of income.

Regardless, Finicum's claim that this is another example of the government persecution of him - removing foster children, who come with

state subsidies which are his only source of income,

because he has abandoned them to go commit crimes against the federal government in another state -

just illustrates painfully and comically what a nonsense bubble these jokers live in.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/get-the-government-s-hands-off-my-foster-kid-subsidies

hmm, state subsidies are his only source of income? aka, a moocher, a taker, an anti-John Galt.

tough on the kids getting shuttled around.



:lmao that's the faggot who got killed

[SpursforSix]

Wtf...they just hopped in a car to go to a meeting? What kind of occupiers are they?

[TheSanityAnnex]

Three separate shootings per live feed. 3%'rs dug in. Shits poppin off.
https://youtu.be/pXbuP19AWDM

[TheSanityAnnex]

And away we go. Hands up don't shoot Mike Brown claim.

[baseline bum]

And away we go. Hands up don't shoot Mike Brown claim.

Did more of those faggots get killed?

[Splits]

:lmao

[TheSanityAnnex]

Did more of those faggots get killed?
Only heard one so far. You seen "tarp man" yet? :lol

[Splits]

So can I go look at the birds now?

:lmao these faggots have their martyr

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

[Splits]

And of course this bitch is stooging for them:

672911378491961348

:lmao this is too funny

[TeyshaBlue]

So can I go look at the birds now?

:lmao these faggots have their martyr

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Yeah. Someone died. Fucking hilarious.

[Splits]

Yeah. Someone died. Fucking hilarious.

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

[Splits]

:lmao :cry R.I.P. :cry :lmao

http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/2016/media/223227/_original/1452201822/1035x690-h_14747281.jpg

Faggot thought he could take on the FBI with his toy guns :lmao

[baseline bum]

Yeah. Someone died. Fucking hilarious.

His statements before made it sound like he was ready to play suicide by cop. Good riddance.

[boutons_deux]

Yeah. Someone died. Fucking hilarious.

:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:l ol:lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgtQj8O92eI

[baseline bum]

:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:l ol:lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgtQj8O92eI

:rollin

[boutons_deux]

Dispute Over Cattle Grazing Blocks Patrols Of Federal Land

Ever since a tense, armed standoff near Cliven Bundy's Nevada ranch in 2014, a vast and sensitive piece of federal public land adjacent to the Grand Canyon has gone unmanaged and uncontrolled.

It's safe to travel into the area called Gold Butte so long as you're not in a federal vehicle, according to Jaina Moan of Friends of Gold Butte, which wants to see the area federally protected.

The last time there was any known federal presence was last summer, when scientists under contract with the Bureau of Land Management were camped here, gathering field research.

"Unfortunately that also was canceled after shots were fired at one of the contract crews," Moan says.

Gold Butte, roughly the size of Los Angeles County, is basically lawless right now. Trash is dumped here and there. Some of the BLM's route markers are torn down. Illegal off-road tracks from ATVs lead into the desert. Some pioneer grave sites were even dug up, bones scattered everywhere.

http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2016/01/26/img_7221_wide-884ec0fcfb869f3fc67d93515aa7d7ddff4c48d8-s800-c85.jpgGold Butte's red rock cliffs and slot canyons are home to many ancient petroglyphs. Some, like this one, have been shot at and damaged since federal land managers left the area due to safety concerns.

If no one is patrolling it, who's going to deter vandals? That's a question Moan and William Anderson, the former chairman of the local Moapa Band of Paiutes, who consider this desert sacred, are asking more and more as the dispute between Bundy and the government drags on.

The occupation of a federal wildlife refuge in Oregon has renewed attention to the federal government's case against Bundy in Nevada. The government's inaction against him is often cited as emboldening his sons (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/26/464510016/bundy-other-militants-arrested-one-killed-near-oregon-refuge) to storm the refuge this month.

In southern Nevada, meanwhile, scores of the family's cattle continue to graze illegally in and around Gold Butte.

http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2016/01/26/img_7215_wide-dad7008a53862f007ff5b7a1021ee6c68ae98a8f-s800-c85.jpgCattle have been grazing in the vast Gold Butte area since an armed standoff between the government and self-styled militia in 2014.

William Anderson looks on frustrated, as a mangy looking group of them cross a four-wheel-drive road in the heart of Gold Butte. He considers the cattle a threat to desert grasses and plants that his people have gathered and used out here for generations.

"[The cattle are] out here just roaming the area and they are stepping on areas that are culturally sensitive to our people," he says.

No one knows for sure how many cows are roaming here since federal agencies pulled out of the area shortly after the standoff.

The Nevada state director of the BLM, John Ruhs, defends the agency's decision to keep field staff away. He says there are still threats and intimidation tactics directed toward his employees there.

"When it comes to having employees on the ground doing things like monitoring or restoration work, it's just not getting done because of the safety concerns we have for our employees," Ruhs told NPR.

Ruhs would not discuss the government's case against Bundy, and neither would the Department of Justice. But Ruhs did say that he now requires his staff doing field work elsewhere in Nevada to go out in teams, never alone. It's a frustrating climate, he says. The BLM's mission is to manage public lands for all sorts of uses by everyone, not just cattle ranchers.

"We don't do anything on our own as personal individuals," Ruhs says. "We do things that are mandated from Congress, and we follow the laws that are given to us, and we try to enforce them appropriately."

Nevada has a long and troubled history with these sorts of domestic insurgencies. In the 1990s, bombs were placed on U.S. Forest Service property and the BLM's state headquarters in Reno. The case against Bundy and his unpaid grazing fees goes back some 20 years too.

Land managers in the late 1990s also planned to roundup some of his cows that crossed into the Lake Mead National Recreation Area. Alan O'Neill, who was superintendent there at the time and is now retired, recalls that at the last minute, the federal prosecutor stopped it, worrying of a Waco-type situation.

"When people break the law and there's no penalty, it just emboldens them to continue to do that," O'Neill says.

Bundy and his supporters have told NPR in recent interviews that their fight is about a lot more than cows. Like a lot of the mountain west, rural Nevada's economy has struggled and Bundy is one of the last ranchers in this corner of the state. Many were forced out or bought out over the years as Las Vegas expanded and federal environmental laws got tougher.

Still, the current movement to take back federal land that the Bundys and others have led is infuriating to people like William Anderson of the local tribe.

"They can get in line — we're saying the same thing about our people too," Anderson says.

Back in Gold Butte, Anderson points out a petroglyph panel on a red rock slope. Two of the ancient drawings have bullet holes that were recently pocked through them.

"It's really hard to even believe that somebody would come in and try to destroy it, or remove it," he says. "It's something that's been here forever."

Anderson says Gold Butte should be protected forever, and managed by the local tribes.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/27/464490320/dispute-over-cattle-grazing-blocks-patrols-of-federal-land (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/27/464490320/dispute-over-cattle-grazing-blocks-patrols-of-federal-land)

[mrsmaalox]

The first day that shit all started they showed that old guy under that tarp I seriously thought "dummy is gonna go outta there under a tarp too!" I didn't realize he was the same one who complained about the state taking back the free labor, er, I mean "foster children" he cared for.

[boutons_deux]

The first day that shit all started they showed that old guy under that tarp I seriously thought "dummy is gonna go outta there under a tarp too!" I didn't realize he was the same one who complained about the state taking back the free labor, er, I mean "foster children" he cared for.

yeah, those little tarps are a lot cheaper than an official govt body bag.

red, slave states and counties want to charge prisoners for the expenses of jailing them, parole expenses.

Feds must "take names" and tote up the taxpayer cost of this fiasco and bill every one of ignorant fucks, bills not dischargeable in bankruptcy.

As with Cliven being 20 years behing, lack of govt enforcement and penalties encourages other assholes.

Cliven should try defaulting on $1M to BigBank FOR ONE YEAR and see if he can keep his ranch from foreclosure.

[Th'Pusher]

Dispute Over Cattle Grazing Blocks Patrols Of Federal Land

Ever since a tense, armed standoff near Cliven Bundy's Nevada ranch in 2014, a vast and sensitive piece of federal public land adjacent to the Grand Canyon has gone unmanaged and uncontrolled.

It's safe to travel into the area called Gold Butte so long as you're not in a federal vehicle, according to Jaina Moan of Friends of Gold Butte, which wants to see the area federally protected.

The last time there was any known federal presence was last summer, when scientists under contract with the Bureau of Land Management were camped here, gathering field research.

"Unfortunately that also was canceled after shots were fired at one of the contract crews," Moan says.

Gold Butte, roughly the size of Los Angeles County, is basically lawless right now. Trash is dumped here and there. Some of the BLM's route markers are torn down. Illegal off-road tracks from ATVs lead into the desert. Some pioneer grave sites were even dug up, bones scattered everywhere.

http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2016/01/26/img_7221_wide-884ec0fcfb869f3fc67d93515aa7d7ddff4c48d8-s800-c85.jpgGold Butte's red rock cliffs and slot canyons are home to many ancient petroglyphs. Some, like this one, have been shot at and damaged since federal land managers left the area due to safety concerns.

If no one is patrolling it, who's going to deter vandals? That's a question Moan and William Anderson, the former chairman of the local Moapa Band of Paiutes, who consider this desert sacred, are asking more and more as the dispute between Bundy and the government drags on.

The occupation of a federal wildlife refuge in Oregon has renewed attention to the federal government's case against Bundy in Nevada. The government's inaction against him is often cited as emboldening his sons (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/26/464510016/bundy-other-militants-arrested-one-killed-near-oregon-refuge) to storm the refuge this month.

In southern Nevada, meanwhile, scores of the family's cattle continue to graze illegally in and around Gold Butte.

http://media.npr.org/assets/img/2016/01/26/img_7215_wide-dad7008a53862f007ff5b7a1021ee6c68ae98a8f-s800-c85.jpgCattle have been grazing in the vast Gold Butte area since an armed standoff between the government and self-styled militia in 2014.

William Anderson looks on frustrated, as a mangy looking group of them cross a four-wheel-drive road in the heart of Gold Butte. He considers the cattle a threat to desert grasses and plants that his people have gathered and used out here for generations.

"[The cattle are] out here just roaming the area and they are stepping on areas that are culturally sensitive to our people," he says.

No one knows for sure how many cows are roaming here since federal agencies pulled out of the area shortly after the standoff.

The Nevada state director of the BLM, John Ruhs, defends the agency's decision to keep field staff away. He says there are still threats and intimidation tactics directed toward his employees there.

"When it comes to having employees on the ground doing things like monitoring or restoration work, it's just not getting done because of the safety concerns we have for our employees," Ruhs told NPR.

Ruhs would not discuss the government's case against Bundy, and neither would the Department of Justice. But Ruhs did say that he now requires his staff doing field work elsewhere in Nevada to go out in teams, never alone. It's a frustrating climate, he says. The BLM's mission is to manage public lands for all sorts of uses by everyone, not just cattle ranchers.

"We don't do anything on our own as personal individuals," Ruhs says. "We do things that are mandated from Congress, and we follow the laws that are given to us, and we try to enforce them appropriately."

Nevada has a long and troubled history with these sorts of domestic insurgencies. In the 1990s, bombs were placed on U.S. Forest Service property and the BLM's state headquarters in Reno. The case against Bundy and his unpaid grazing fees goes back some 20 years too.

Land managers in the late 1990s also planned to roundup some of his cows that crossed into the Lake Mead National Recreation Area. Alan O'Neill, who was superintendent there at the time and is now retired, recalls that at the last minute, the federal prosecutor stopped it, worrying of a Waco-type situation.

"When people break the law and there's no penalty, it just emboldens them to continue to do that," O'Neill says.

Bundy and his supporters have told NPR in recent interviews that their fight is about a lot more than cows. Like a lot of the mountain west, rural Nevada's economy has struggled and Bundy is one of the last ranchers in this corner of the state. Many were forced out or bought out over the years as Las Vegas expanded and federal environmental laws got tougher.

Still, the current movement to take back federal land that the Bundys and others have led is infuriating to people like William Anderson of the local tribe.

"They can get in line — we're saying the same thing about our people too," Anderson says.

Back in Gold Butte, Anderson points out a petroglyph panel on a red rock slope. Two of the ancient drawings have bullet holes that were recently pocked through them.

"It's really hard to even believe that somebody would come in and try to destroy it, or remove it," he says. "It's something that's been here forever."

Anderson says Gold Butte should be protected forever, and managed by the local tribes.

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/27/464490320/dispute-over-cattle-grazing-blocks-patrols-of-federal-land (http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/01/27/464490320/dispute-over-cattle-grazing-blocks-patrols-of-federal-land)
But, but, but the BLM is a big bad federal agency that bullies patriots out of their land :cry

[Sportcamper]

The first day that sht all started they showed that old guy under that tarp.

OMG...I remember that crazy old guy under the tarp on the comedy channels...
Oath Keepers, Protestor Armed Militia LaVoy Finicum, at the Masher Refuge Center…


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3vPttCwCZw

[boutons_deux]

:lol

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/1951627-oregon-militia-member-promises-a-bloodbath-as-fbi-moves-in-this-is-a-free-for-all/

[baseline bum]

Good, more suicide by cop martyrs.

[CosmicCowboy]

Stupid is as stupid does. Black or white you don't wave guns and give cops shit or you can expect to get dead.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Some very interesting claims here being made by a current militia member about Ryan Payne during the Bundy standoff and Burns.

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-testimony-of-christian-yingling-in.html


OK ... Everybody... please gather around and listen to what I am about to say.. Then either shut your mouth, or share this far and wide. If you have ANY faith in me as a leader you will heed what I am about to say. If not..I want nothing to do with you. simple as that.
The key to victory in any battle is the ability to remain calm in any given situation. What we are seeing right now is a whole bunch of people acting based solely on raw emotion. This is very bad and I'm about to explain exactly why. I am not letting my emotions make my decisions for me, but instead, looking at this from a calm, level headed, common sense approach.
What you are all witnessing right now right now in Oregon has the makings of a full on false flag event. And I will prove that to you to the absolute best of my ability. Should you choose to look at this from a logical perspective you will see I am 100% correct. Some of what I will tell you is speculation based on my own experience and experiences of others I have talked to throughout this ordeal, but most of what I am going to tell you is documented verifiable fact.
Back during the Bundy situation, Ryan Payne declared himself the unofficial "leader" of the militias present at the Bundy ranch. Nothing could have been further from the truth. In fact, none of the militias listened to him at all. The ONLY ones who listened to him were the Bundy's, Blaine Cooper, who Payne claimed was a "professional security consultant', who turned out to be nothing more than an ex con, and buddah bear (nice name) who he also claimed was a "professional security consultant", but was later discovered to be nothing more than a tattoo artist thug. The militias ignoring these three, is precisely why that situation didn't turn into a blood bath. (Strangely enough all three are present at the refuge.)
I and Scott Woods were asked on one occasion, by Payne to go and destroy BLM equipment in the middle of the night. We refused, stating that that's not why we were there. We were there solely to defend the family. That very same night he rushed off in a car with a loaded AR to START a violent altercation with LEOs who supposedly had pulled over members of the Armenian Militia off exit 10 near the ranch. This report was never vetted nor was it looked into before he rushed off. It is also well documented that Payne had tried to incite other militia members to start violent altercations with the authorities who were present there. all of which were refused by militia members..all for the same reason...we were NOT there to start a fight...but to DEFEND the family. When people refused, Payne, Cooper, and Buddah ostracized them and ran them off the ranch. This is why most militias left the ranch when they did. One other point worth mentioning was there were militia members present with long range 50 cal sniper rifles... but instead of positioning them on the hilltops surrounding the ranch, Payne had them stationed down in a valley where they were effectively useless...does that sound like the makings of a solid leader to you? And also Payne was always sure to make certain that there was ONE completely UNDEFENDED access point to the ranch.. I brought this up to him asking why he would leave our back door completely open and undefended... and he completely blew me off... What he was doing in fact, was leaving an access point open for authorities to bum rush the ranch if that's what they felt needed to be done. And I have the witnesses to prove it.
Now throughout the situation Payne made repeated threats to law enforcement on NATIONAL media. There's VIDEO of him doing this..its not hard to find. Yet oddly enough with all that evidence he was never charged with anything during or after the standoff. Does that seem ODD to anyone but me? (not if you're a paid provocateur) Now in this situation at the refuge, he has publicly stated to a reporter that he has snipers set up to kill any federal official who approaches the refuge. Yet still.. no charges are being filed against him. making threats like that, you'd think they'd swoop in and scoop him up... but noooo.. because they're giving patriots time to get there... Don't think for one second that with a couple of phone calls to the proper alphabet agencies, those shmucks wont be SORELY outnumbered. Tell you what... if you think LEO's don't take threats against them seriously... go find the nearest cop and walk up to him and tell him you plan to kill police officers and see what happens to you.. See how long it takes for you to end up in prison.. yet Payne roams free..as does Cooper. Better yet go ask Schuyler Barbeau what happens when you threaten a public official... oh wait...you can't... he's in prison... because of a Facebook post. Funny how that works huh? Also... has anyone else noticed that until this situation popped up Payne was damned near SILENT on social media? Wonder why that is... Hell, Most of you don't even know who he is... He also claimed to be an Army Ranger, But when we had someone at the Ranger School check their records... they said NO Ryan Payne had EVER attended that school... who-da thunk it?
Myself and Scott begged the Bundys, after we left (via phone) to stop listening to Payne..that he was a plant. But they refused to listen. Payne wouldn't let ANYONE talk to the Bundy's with out him being present..or close by. The Bundy's are good God fearing Christians but they are TERRIBLY naive. They truly believe Payne is one of the good guys. Which is why they are at the refuge now. Do you honestly think for one second it was AMMON's idea to take that building? If you do... you're a fool. They're not that type of people. Ammon has been suckered into this standoff by Payne and Cooper. He truly went up there with the intention of helping the Hammonds, and when they were refused, The Bundy's were made to believe that taking a stand against the BLM was the answer.
Nothing could be further from the truth. Now Cliven is on his way there.. and the govt is finally going to get their revenge on the Bundy's and in doing so gain the access they need to their land. All the major players in the operation of that Ranch will soon be together at the wildlife refuge... that's no coincidence. I assure you. Payne, Cooper, Pete Santili... All well trained provocateurs who are doing everything in their power to lure patriots to the ranch.. Case in point...Santili just released a video try to say that the FBI was TRYING to shut him down.. Dont you think if that were the case...with ALL of the resources the FBI has, they would just go ahead and do it...do you really think this shmuck is smart enough to outsmart the ENTIRE FBI? Think about it...
Let us continue on.. why the wild life refuge? how in the blue hell did they even know it existed if this wasn't PRE-PLANNED? And why were their trailers staged up there THURSDAY night if this was all "unplanned"? And if they wanted support so bad...why not let the Oregon 3%ers and militia in on this? I'll tell you why.. because they would have had no part in it and vehemently refused if they had known.... as was demonstrated by their response once they found out. SO..that being said.. why pick a place so remote.. I'll tell you why.. the same reason the Bundy ranch was picked.. it's remote... no civilian casualties. And if everyone out there is killed there's no witnesses allowing the govt to write the narrative of what happened afterwards..You can bet any reporters out there will be silenced should they actually get close enough to catch anything worth documenting unless of course they're willing to report what they're told to... the reason it failed at the Bundy ranch was because the community got so involved... NOT the case at the refuge.
Next.. why has a detachment of Delta Force been deployed to the area? (does anyone remember that Delta was ALSO at WACO?) 19 sets of orders were cut for operators to be at Waco. Why in the Blue hell would they send Delta to squash a bunch of unorganized mostly unarmed protesters? I'll tell you why.. one of the things Delta specializes in is hostage rescue.. I.E. blow open a door rush in and shoot the bad guys but save the good guys.. I.E. embedded reporters from the national media who can later report the protesters fired first.
This is happening EXACTLY the same way WACO did... you know who else claimed, "We won't fire first but if attacked we'll fire back.."? David Koresh. Again well documented fact. This situation is going to turn out the exact same way. If these guys don't stand down now, while the sheriff is giving them an opportunity to, I promise you.. its going to turn out the exact same way. I'll bet my life on it.
Now let's look at poor John Ritzheimer. This guy is exhibiting all the classic signs of PTSD. It is my belief that he is not in on this plan but like the Bundy's... has been suckered into believing what he is doing is right. This poor bastard is still fighting the war in his head and Assholes like Payne and Cooper are feeding into his delusions that dying for this cause is what he needs to do. They are taking advantage of his big heart and his undying love for the country he fought for and twisting him into a suicidal maniac. Im sorry if that stings.. but I assure you its the cold hard truth. How could ANYONE in their right mind think that dying trying to fight the BLM of all things is going to "change the govt"? How ignorant do you have to be to think that fighting and dying out there is going to somehow make the BLM fold up shop and stop what they are doing.
Sorry kids... the ONLY people who can stop the BLM are in DC.. and I assure you, as long as People like Harry Reid and the like are around... the BLM is not going anywhere.. no matter how much we fight them and run them off. We ran them off at the Bundy ranch...and how much did that slow them down..? we ran them off at the sugar pine mine... how much did that slow them down...? What makes anyone think this will be any different? Mind boggling I tell you.
Now to those of you who are buying into this whole "this will galvanize the movement line of crap".. What this is REALLY going to do is crush the patriot movement. They are going to hit these people with such force with such blinding speed and a level of violence of action that most patriots are going to turn and look at their own children and go there's no way in HELL I want that to happen to MY family... thus the reason there are women and Children being taken to the refuge. The govt has already shown at WACO and Ruby Ridge just how willing they are to kill American Children. Don't think for a second they wont do it here as well. All the classic signs of a psyop. They plan to frighten the people into not even daring to ever take a stand against them again.
So what then of the militias? We'll still be here but will be forced into hiding.. those who aren't will be scooped up and charged as Domestic Terrorists. Do you for even ONE second really believe that this happening at the same time as Obama prepares to announce a whole new slew of gun restrictions is really a coincidence? Its not.. Not at all. What this is going to be used for is an EXCUSE to show why we need to disarm the American people for their own safety.. or put into place such SEVERE restrictions on owning firearms that we will NEVER be able to properly defend ourselves against a tyrannical govt. Hitler did it... Stalin did it... Mao did it... now Obama's doing it. History is repeating itself in front of our own eyes and we're too blinded by raw emotion to recognize it.
If everyone picked up and left that refuge tomorrow, what do you think Payne and Cooper would do? They're so die hard...think they'd stay and fight? I mean that's what they're saying... they're not leaving right? Prepared to die for the cause....right?.... My ASS ! Nope... they'll slink back into the shadows and wait for the next opportunity to bamboozle good patriots into signing their own death warrants. And of course... once again.. neither will be charged with anything. And good peoples lives will be risked for nothing.
We're being goaded into a fight here people...you NEED to see that. And every ONE of you who is advocating for this...Know this... if these people die... it will be YOUR fault. Not mine, nor will it be the fault of ANYONE in ANY unit I command. I simply wont allow it. THIS is the reason my troops follow me.. because I take the time to think these things through...to look at them from ALL directions... not based on sheer emotion as so many of you are doing now.
It was stated, dare I say, TAUGHT to me today by a close friend who is an ex-special forces operator, that wars are not won by people taking rash actions such as the ones that have been taken here. Wars are won with proper planning. That shit hit me like a brick.. And I Will NEVER forget those words as that is the smartest thing I have heard throughout this entire ordeal.
1. Plan
2. Equip
3. Rehearse
4. Execute
THAT'S how you win a battle. THAT'S how you minimize casualties.. THAT'S how you win a war. None of that was done here. Therefore, these guys are all as good as dead.. Why do you think the local sheriff there just said these guys need to leave WHILE THEY STILL CAN... Because he KNOWS whats going to happen to them! He's OFFERING them a way out and DAMNIT THEY NEED TO TAKE IT!
The first thing I teach my guys is when they make unexpected contact with the enemy is, the proper response is to fall back, reset and take back the initiative. That's what we need to do here. Will it look like a loss in the eyes of the people? Absolutely. But hey, you all had better get used to the fact that we are not going to win every battle.. BUT... in the eyes of those who put this whole bullshit plan together... this will be a CRUSHING defeat...Even though it will never be made public knowledge. We have let the enemy pick the time and place of our fight...and that is about to prove to be a fatal mistake. Mark my words..
But we can still snatch victory out of this whole screwed up mess...if ONLY you will listen to me.
How do we win then? Well I'll tell you...
We get those people out of there!!!!!
Anyone and everyone who has contact with the people there needs to PLEAD with them to get the hell out of there... Then, we regroup, and WE pick the time and place of our fight...not the enemy. WE make THEM react.. WE pick ground that is most sensible for a proper defense, not a building in the middle of a field that has absolutely NO defensible positions as in the case of the refuge. Then we properly equip, plan, rehearse, and execute. If you want to win a war...that's how you have to do it. Most importantly.. we expose frauds like Cooper and Payne for who they truly are. and drum them out of the movement before they really get someone killed.
So that my take on this mess... listen to me if you want, ignore me at your own peril... either way it is of no consequence to me. I will not debate this issue, and NO ONE will change my mind about this... I have done too much research into this situation to allow ANY armchair commando to dictate my actions for me. This is the war you all wanted so badly... now either lead follow or get the fuck out of the way. End of story.

[TheSanityAnnex]

But, but, but the BLM is a big bad federal agency that bullies patriots out of their land :cry

In the case of the Hammonds and the 20 years of documented harassment you don't think that was bullying to get them off their land? And the other ranchers in the next town who were flooded out of their property purposely weren't bullied either?

[ElNono]

:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:l ol:lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgtQj8O92eI

:lmao

[pgardn]

Some very interesting claims here being made by a current militia member about Ryan Payne during the Bundy standoff and Burns.

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-testimony-of-christian-yingling-in.html

OK ... Everybody... please gather around and listen to what I am about to say.. Then either shut your mouth, or share this far and wide. If you have ANY faith in me as a leader you will heed what I am about to say. If not..I want nothing to do with you. simple as that.

The key to victory in any battle is the ability to remain calm in any given situation. What we are seeing right now is a whole bunch of people acting based solely on raw emotion. This is very bad and I'm about to explain exactly why. I am not letting my emotions make my decisions for me, but instead, looking at this from a calm, level headed, common sense approach.

What you are all witnessing right now right now in Oregon has the makings of a full on false flag event. And I will prove that to you to the absolute best of my ability. Should you choose to look at this from a logical perspective you will see I am 100% correct. Some of what I will tell you is speculation based on my own experience and experiences of others I have talked to throughout this ordeal, but most of what I am going to tell you is documented verifiable fact.

Back during the Bundy situation, Ryan Payne declared himself the unofficial "leader" of the militias present at the Bundy ranch. Nothing could have been further from the truth. In fact, none of the militias listened to him at all. The ONLY ones who listened to him were the Bundy's, Blaine Cooper, who Payne claimed was a "professional security consultant', who turned out to be nothing more than an ex con, and buddah bear (nice name) who he also claimed was a "professional security consultant", but was later discovered to be nothing more than a tattoo artist thug. The militias ignoring these three, is precisely why that situation didn't turn into a blood bath. (Strangely enough all three are present at the refuge.)

I and Scott Woods were asked on one occasion, by Payne to go and destroy BLM equipment in the middle of the night. We refused, stating that that's not why we were there. We were there solely to defend the family. That very same night he rushed off in a car with a loaded AR to START a violent altercation with LEOs who supposedly had pulled over members of the Armenian Militia off exit 10 near the ranch. This report was never vetted nor was it looked into before he rushed off. It is also well documented that Payne had tried to incite other militia members to start violent altercations with the authorities who were present there. all of which were refused by militia members..all for the same reason...we were NOT there to start a fight...but to DEFEND the family. When people refused, Payne, Cooper, and Buddah ostracized them and ran them off the ranch. This is why most militias left the ranch when they did. One other point worth mentioning was there were militia members present with long range 50 cal sniper rifles... but instead of positioning them on the hilltops surrounding the ranch, Payne had them stationed down in a valley where they were effectively useless...does that sound like the makings of a solid leader to you? And also Payne was always sure to make certain that there was ONE completely UNDEFENDED access point to the ranch.. I brought this up to him asking why he would leave our back door completely open and undefended... and he completely blew me off... What he was doing in fact, was leaving an access point open for authorities to bum rush the ranch if that's what they felt needed to be done. And I have the witnesses to prove it.

Now throughout the situation Payne made repeated threats to law enforcement on NATIONAL media. There's VIDEO of him doing this..its not hard to find. Yet oddly enough with all that evidence he was never charged with anything during or after the standoff. Does that seem ODD to anyone but me? (not if you're a paid provocateur) Now in this situation at the refuge, he has publicly stated to a reporter that he has snipers set up to kill any federal official who approaches the refuge. Yet still.. no charges are being filed against him. making threats like that, you'd think they'd swoop in and scoop him up... but noooo.. because they're giving patriots time to get there... Don't think for one second that with a couple of phone calls to the proper alphabet agencies, those shmucks wont be SORELY outnumbered. Tell you what... if you think LEO's don't take threats against them seriously... go find the nearest cop and walk up to him and tell him you plan to kill police officers and see what happens to you.. See how long it takes for you to end up in prison.. yet Payne roams free..as does Cooper. Better yet go ask Schuyler Barbeau what happens when you threaten a public official... oh wait...you can't... he's in prison... because of a Facebook post. Funny how that works huh? Also... has anyone else noticed that until this situation popped up Payne was damned near SILENT on social media? Wonder why that is... Hell, Most of you don't even know who he is... He also claimed to be an Army Ranger, But when we had someone at the Ranger School check their records... they said NO Ryan Payne had EVER attended that school... who-da thunk it?

Myself and Scott begged the Bundys, after we left (via phone) to stop listening to Payne..that he was a plant. But they refused to listen. Payne wouldn't let ANYONE talk to the Bundy's with out him being present..or close by. The Bundy's are good God fearing Christians but they are TERRIBLY naive. They truly believe Payne is one of the good guys. Which is why they are at the refuge now. Do you honestly think for one second it was AMMON's idea to take that building? If you do... you're a fool. They're not that type of people. Ammon has been suckered into this standoff by Payne and Cooper. He truly went up there with the intention of helping the Hammonds, and when they were refused, The Bundy's were made to believe that taking a stand against the BLM was the answer.

Nothing could be further from the truth. Now Cliven is on his way there.. and the govt is finally going to get their revenge on the Bundy's and in doing so gain the access they need to their land. All the major players in the operation of that Ranch will soon be together at the wildlife refuge... that's no coincidence. I assure you. Payne, Cooper, Pete Santili... All well trained provocateurs who are doing everything in their power to lure patriots to the ranch.. Case in point...Santili just released a video try to say that the FBI was TRYING to shut him down.. Dont you think if that were the case...with ALL of the resources the FBI has, they would just go ahead and do it...do you really think this shmuck is smart enough to outsmart the ENTIRE FBI? Think about it...

Let us continue on.. why the wild life refuge? how in the blue hell did they even know it existed if this wasn't PRE-PLANNED? And why were their trailers staged up there THURSDAY night if this was all "unplanned"? And if they wanted support so bad...why not let the Oregon 3%ers and militia in on this? I'll tell you why.. because they would have had no part in it and vehemently refused if they had known.... as was demonstrated by their response once they found out. SO..that being said.. why pick a place so remote.. I'll tell you why.. the same reason the Bundy ranch was picked.. it's remote... no civilian casualties. And if everyone out there is killed there's no witnesses allowing the govt to write the narrative of what happened afterwards..You can bet any reporters out there will be silenced should they actually get close enough to catch anything worth documenting unless of course they're willing to report what they're told to... the reason it failed at the Bundy ranch was because the community got so involved... NOT the case at the refuge.

Next.. why has a detachment of Delta Force been deployed to the area? (does anyone remember that Delta was ALSO at WACO?) 19 sets of orders were cut for operators to be at Waco. Why in the Blue hell would they send Delta to squash a bunch of unorganized mostly unarmed protesters? I'll tell you why.. one of the things Delta specializes in is hostage rescue.. I.E. blow open a door rush in and shoot the bad guys but save the good guys.. I.E. embedded reporters from the national media who can later report the protesters fired first.

This is happening EXACTLY the same way WACO did... you know who else claimed, "We won't fire first but if attacked we'll fire back.."? David Koresh. Again well documented fact. This situation is going to turn out the exact same way. If these guys don't stand down now, while the sheriff is giving them an opportunity to, I promise you.. its going to turn out the exact same way. I'll bet my life on it.

Now let's look at poor John Ritzheimer. This guy is exhibiting all the classic signs of PTSD. It is my belief that he is not in on this plan but like the Bundy's... has been suckered into believing what he is doing is right. This poor bastard is still fighting the war in his head and Assholes like Payne and Cooper are feeding into his delusions that dying for this cause is what he needs to do. They are taking advantage of his big heart and his undying love for the country he fought for and twisting him into a suicidal maniac. Im sorry if that stings.. but I assure you its the cold hard truth. How could ANYONE in their right mind think that dying trying to fight the BLM of all things is going to "change the govt"? How ignorant do you have to be to think that fighting and dying out there is going to somehow make the BLM fold up shop and stop what they are doing.

Sorry kids... the ONLY people who can stop the BLM are in DC.. and I assure you, as long as People like Harry Reid and the like are around... the BLM is not going anywhere.. no matter how much we fight them and run them off. We ran them off at the Bundy ranch...and how much did that slow them down..? we ran them off at the sugar pine mine... how much did that slow them down...? What makes anyone think this will be any different? Mind boggling I tell you.

Now to those of you who are buying into this whole "this will galvanize the movement line of crap".. What this is REALLY going to do is crush the patriot movement. They are going to hit these people with such force with such blinding speed and a level of violence of action that most patriots are going to turn and look at their own children and go there's no way in HELL I want that to happen to MY family... thus the reason there are women and Children being taken to the refuge. The govt has already shown at WACO and Ruby Ridge just how willing they are to kill American Children. Don't think for a second they wont do it here as well. All the classic signs of a psyop. They plan to frighten the people into not even daring to ever take a stand against them again.

So what then of the militias? We'll still be here but will be forced into hiding.. those who aren't will be scooped up and charged as Domestic Terrorists. Do you for even ONE second really believe that this happening at the same time as Obama prepares to announce a whole new slew of gun restrictions is really a coincidence? Its not.. Not at all. What this is going to be used for is an EXCUSE to show why we need to disarm the American people for their own safety.. or put into place such SEVERE restrictions on owning firearms that we will NEVER be able to properly defend ourselves against a tyrannical govt. Hitler did it... Stalin did it... Mao did it... now Obama's doing it. History is repeating itself in front of our own eyes and we're too blinded by raw emotion to recognize it.

If everyone picked up and left that refuge tomorrow, what do you think Payne and Cooper would do? They're so die hard...think they'd stay and fight? I mean that's what they're saying... they're not leaving right? Prepared to die for the cause....right?.... My ASS ! Nope... they'll slink back into the shadows and wait for the next opportunity to bamboozle good patriots into signing their own death warrants. And of course... once again.. neither will be charged with anything. And good peoples lives will be risked for nothing.

We're being goaded into a fight here people...you NEED to see that. And every ONE of you who is advocating for this...Know this... if these people die... it will be YOUR fault. Not mine, nor will it be the fault of ANYONE in ANY unit I command. I simply wont allow it. THIS is the reason my troops follow me.. because I take the time to think these things through...to look at them from ALL directions... not based on sheer emotion as so many of you are doing now.

It was stated, dare I say, TAUGHT to me today by a close friend who is an ex-special forces operator, that wars are not won by people taking rash actions such as the ones that have been taken here. Wars are won with proper planning. That shit hit me like a brick.. And I Will NEVER forget those words as that is the smartest thing I have heard throughout this entire ordeal.

1. Plan

2. Equip

3. Rehearse

4. Execute

THAT'S how you win a battle. THAT'S how you minimize casualties.. THAT'S how you win a war. None of that was done here. Therefore, these guys are all as good as dead.. Why do you think the local sheriff there just said these guys need to leave WHILE THEY STILL CAN... Because he KNOWS whats going to happen to them! He's OFFERING them a way out and DAMNIT THEY NEED TO TAKE IT!

The first thing I teach my guys is when they make unexpected contact with the enemy is, the proper response is to fall back, reset and take back the initiative. That's what we need to do here. Will it look like a loss in the eyes of the people? Absolutely. But hey, you all had better get used to the fact that we are not going to win every battle.. BUT... in the eyes of those who put this whole bullshit plan together... this will be a CRUSHING defeat...Even though it will never be made public knowledge. We have let the enemy pick the time and place of our fight...and that is about to prove to be a fatal mistake. Mark my words..

But we can still snatch victory out of this whole screwed up mess...if ONLY you will listen to me.

How do we win then? Well I'll tell you...

We get those people out of there!!!!!

Anyone and everyone who has contact with the people there needs to PLEAD with them to get the hell out of there... Then, we regroup, and WE pick the time and place of our fight...not the enemy. WE make THEM react.. WE pick ground that is most sensible for a proper defense, not a building in the middle of a field that has absolutely NO defensible positions as in the case of the refuge. Then we properly equip, plan, rehearse, and execute. If you want to win a war...that's how you have to do it. Most importantly.. we expose frauds like Cooper and Payne for who they truly are. and drum them out of the movement before they really get someone killed.

So that my take on this mess... listen to me if you want, ignore me at your own peril... either way it is of no consequence to me. I will not debate this issue, and NO ONE will change my mind about this... I have done too much research into this situation to allow ANY armchair commando to dictate my actions for me. This is the war you all wanted so badly... now either lead follow or get the fuck out of the way. End of story.



I wrote all of this down to make sure I am totally committed to establishing a check point in my neighborhood drainage ditch. Who is with me...

[boutons_deux]

the bubbas, cosplay patriots, rednecks, assholes, gun fellators have lost their bullshit protest, they've all gone totally flaccid (if they had dicks at all).

court documents say the childish assholes had explosives.

They are domestic terrorists (not the kind suckered, enticed by the FBI)

[boutons_deux]

Where was the FBI during the armed standoff in Oregon? Out of sight, but listening and watching

Behind the quiet facade, however, the FBI (http://www.chicagotribune.com/topic/crime-law-justice/fbi-ORGOV000008-topic.html) was running surveillance on the occupation and recording the activists’ public statements, mostly drawn from media reports and the activists' use of social media, while FBI agents encouraged locals to report their experiences with the new strangers in town.

According to the allegations in an indictment and supporting affidavit, the FBI was collecting information that confirmed the occupiers were armed, angry and willing to die.

http://www.trbimg.com/img-56a930d4/turbine/la-na-oregon-refuge-roadblocks-20160127/400/400x225 (http://www.chicagotribune.com/la-na-oregon-refuge-roadblocks-20160127-story.html)

The court documents detail how a source told a Harney County sheriff’s officer that the protesters “had explosives, night vision goggles, and weapons and that if they didn't get the fight they wanted out there they would bring the fight to town.” The documents show that authorities grew concerned as the occupiers used increasingly heated rhetoric when discussing their plans and the occupation.

The court documents detail how a source told a Harney County sheriff’s officer that the protesters “had explosives, night vision goggles, and weapons and that if they didn't get the fight they wanted out there they would bring the fight to town.” The documents show that authorities grew concerned as the occupiers used increasingly heated rhetoric when discussing their plans and the occupation.

On Wednesday afternoon, U.S. Magistrate Judge Stacie F. Beckerman unsealed the government’s criminal complaint against two brothers, Ammon and Ryan Bundy, and Jon Ritzheimer, as well as five others arrested in connection with the occupation.

All stand accused of conspiring to use threats, intimidation or force to stop federal officers from doing their duty, a charge also used against tax protesters Edward and Elaine Brown, a New Hampshire couple who holed up in their home in 2007 and engaged in an armed standoff with federal agents for months. It eventually ended peacefully with their arrest.

A significant amount of the FBI’s information used to charge Ammon Bundy came from an activist named Pete Santilli, who was living inside the refuge and broadcasting live his conversations with fellow activists.

To demonstrate a conspiracy, the government has a lower burden than it would with similar charges, such as aiding and abetting, or solicitation. A conspiracy charge in federal court does not require the underlying offense to have taken place, so prosecutors can charge the defendants based on their statements, without proving they actually committed a crime.

That is where Santilli’s broadcasts proved so useful to the FBI.

“We’re continuing the stand at the Malheur National Wildlife Reserve,” Ammon Bundy told Santilli in a conversation on Jan. 2, the day the occupation began. “Let everybody know that.”

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/daywatch/la-na-ff-oregon-refuge-fbi-20160127-story.html?track=ct-email-Daywatch

excellent lesson, example to next event by such assholes of how NOT to run a terrorist occupation

[boutons_deux]

Republicans React to News of Oregon Standoff With Wild Conspiracy Theories and Bizarre Comparisons to Jesus


LaVoy Finicum, the armed militiaman shot in FBI standoff, mourned by one GOP lawmaker with comparison to Jesus.

Other supporters have taken to wild conspiracy theories in reaction to news of Finicum’s death:


Murky Accounts, Hearsay Swirl Around FBI’s Shooting Of Oregon Militiaman https://t.co/bg44tioYuu pic.twitter.com/g0IM061wO3 (https://t.co/g0IM061wO3)
— The Daily Caller (@DailyCaller) January 27, 2016 (https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/692410516719980545)


The Feds Just Shot An Oregon Protester. Here's The Big Lesson. | Daily Wire https://t.co/zn4XJ2WaoU pic.twitter.com/Qk1g9Jawj5 (https://t.co/Qk1g9Jawj5)
— Ben Shapiro (@benshapiro) January 27, 2016 (https://twitter.com/benshapiro/status/692397200538759168)


http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/republicans-react-news-oregon-standoff-wild-conspiracy-theories-and-bizarre?akid=13921.187590.jqAprz&rd=1&src=newsletter1049697&t=6

[boutons_deux]

Eyewitnesses Knock Down Conspiracy Theories About LaVoy Finicum Dying With His Hands Up

McConnell — who was taken into custody, questioned and released — recorded a second video early Wednesday morning, saying that Payne told him that he and Finicum got into an argument in the pickup after the rancher fled the police stop.

He said Cox told him that Finicum crashed into the snowbank, jumped out of the manual transmission diesel pickup with the rear wheels still spinning and charged toward law enforcement officers.

The bodyguard said Cox and Payne each told him that Finicum charged toward officers before he was shot, and he explicitly denied that the rancher had surrendered or complied with law enforcement.

“He was not on his knees, none of that,” McConnell said. “He was none of that nonsense. You know, that was a miscommunication on somebody else’s part. But he went after them. He charged them. You know, LaVoy was very passionate about what he was doing up here.”

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/eyewitnesses-knock-down-conspiracy-theories-about-lavoy-finicum-dying-his-hands?akid=13921.187590.jqAprz&rd=1&src=newsletter1049697&t=20

[Warlord23]

TSA is a true connoisseur of the batshit conspiracy section of the Internet. Hope this is for a research project, if not you better hope your meds / therapy becomes cheaper when single payer finally arrives

[Sportcamper]

In the case of the Hammonds and the 20 years of documented harassment you don't think that was bullying to get them off their land? And the other ranchers in the next town who were flooded out of their property purposely weren't bullied either?

Most people agree with you. The Hammonds were not treated fairly & we cannot understand why the political establishment of Oregon did not come to their defense. The occupation of an unoccupied bird sanctuary is a different matter.

1- This is NOT the fight of a self imposed militia from Nevada & Arizona. The locals as well as the Hammonds have asked Bundy & his followers to respect State Law & go home.

2- The occupiers have endangered the lives of police officers & have inflicted financial harm on the local populace.

3- The comedy is that this anti-government militia are all sucking on the Government teat in one form or another. 50 foster children? Government aide for all those kids? Unemployment insurance? Welfare & food stamps?

4- Whether it is Ferguson or Black lives matter movement in LA who block our freeways & businesses or the crazy white people in Nevada, the question is “why are these people not at work”? Where I work if one is out 5 days they need a letter from a doctor for re instatement. Out 20 days you are out of the system. No parking pass, no access to the facility, no access to company email. Who is gainfully employed & can go picket or occupy for a month or two? These armed occupiers are total losers! The same people I encountered in the 60’s & 70’s who dodged the draft, hid in Canada & chanted “give peace a chance”

PS I was sad to learn that the Crazy old man underneath the Blue Tarp was killed...He made me laugh...

[TheSanityAnnex]

TSA is a true connoisseur of the batshit conspiracy section of the Internet. Hope this is for a research project, if not you better hope your meds / therapy becomes cheaper when single payer finally arrives

You don't think the feds have plants in the militias? LOL

[TheSanityAnnex]

Most people agree with you. The Hammonds were not treated fairly & we cannot understand why the political establishment of Oregon did not come to their defense. The occupation of an unoccupied bird sanctuary is a different matter.

1- This is NOT the fight of a self imposed militia from Nevada & Arizona. The locals as well as the Hammonds have asked Bundy & his followers to respect State Law & go home.

2- The occupiers have endangered the lives of police officers & have inflicted financial harm on the local populace.

3- The comedy is that this anti-government militia are all sucking on the Government teat in one form or another. 50 foster children? Government aide for all those kids? Unemployment insurance? Welfare & food stamps?

4- Whether it is Ferguson or Black lives matter movement in LA who block our freeways & businesses or the crazy white people in Nevada, the question is “why are these people not at work”? Where I work if one is out 5 days they need a letter from a doctor for re instatement. Out 20 days you are out of the system. No parking pass, no access to the facility, no access to company email. Who is gainfully employed & can go picket or occupy for a month or two? These armed occupiers are total losers! The same people I encountered in the 60’s & 70’s who dodged the draft, hid in Canada & chanted “give peace a chance”

PS I was sad to learn that the Crazy old man underneath the Blue Tarp was killed...He made me laugh...

The Militia guys are just as stupid as the occupy tards, but both brought issues to the National media that needed attention.

[boutons_deux]

OWS was not, is not stupid. BigFinance is sucking the wealth out of Americans.

bubbas and their invasive species need to Get Smart (they won't)

[TheSanityAnnex]

OWS was not, is not stupid. BigFinance is sucking the wealth out of Americans.

bubbas and their invasive species need to Get Smart (they won't)

The occupiers were stupid, just like the militia. Both issues they stand for are important though.

[boutons_deux]

The occupiers were stupid, just like the militia. Both issues they stand for are important though.

false equivalence. but FALSE is all You People have

[TheSanityAnnex]

false equivalence. but FALSE is all You People have

Did both groups not bring National attention to issues that needed it?

[Splits]

Did both groups not bring National attention to issues that needed it?

:lol this is what you're going with? A couple dozen gun fellators threatening the feds with violence in order to teach the nation that BLM doesn't only stand for black lives matter is equivalent to a movement of tens of thousands who have brought corporate greed and income inequality to the forefront of the political establishment?

:lmao yeah, run with that bro. Solid comparison.

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lol this is what you're going with? A couple dozen gun fellators threatening the feds with violence in order to teach the nation that BLM doesn't only stand for black lives matter is equivalent to a movement of tens of thousands who have brought corporate greed and income inequality to the forefront of the political establishment?

:lmao yeah, run with that bro. Solid comparison.Did both groups not bring National attention to issues that needed it?

[Splits]

Did both groups not bring National attention to issues that needed it?

No.

Do you know how to read?

[TheSanityAnnex]

No.

Do you know how to read?You are okay with what our government did to the Hammonds for 20 years or you don't think it is an issue that needed National attention?

[Splits]

You are okay with what our government did to the Hammonds for 20 years or you don't think it is an issue that needed National attention?

:lol who?

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lol who?

The family that has been talked about the last 17 pages of the thread you are in.

So, you are okay with what our government did to the Hammonds for 20 years or you don't think it is an issue that needed National attention?

[CosmicCowboy]

Splits pretends to be black. He can only support black issues and give credit to black dissidents. It's his shtick.

[pgardn]

You don't think the feds have plants in the militias? LOL

You mean they have plants amongst the other potted plants?
How do we know who's whom?

Im gonna have to nix the plan of hiding under a tarp, it's not safe. Allegedly...

[TheSanityAnnex]

You mean they have plants amongst the other potted plants?
How do we know who's whom?

Im gonna have to nix the plan of hiding under a tarp, it's not safe. Allegedly...
The quality of your posts take a dive when you attempt humor, stick to what you're good at.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Eyewitnesses Knock Down Conspiracy Theories About LaVoy Finicum Dying With His Hands Up

McConnell — who was taken into custody, questioned and released — recorded a second video early Wednesday morning, saying that Payne told him that he and Finicum got into an argument in the pickup after the rancher fled the police stop.

He said Cox told him that Finicum crashed into the snowbank, jumped out of the manual transmission diesel pickup with the rear wheels still spinning and charged toward law enforcement officers.

The bodyguard said Cox and Payne each told him that Finicum charged toward officers before he was shot, and he explicitly denied that the rancher had surrendered or complied with law enforcement.

“He was not on his knees, none of that,” McConnell said. “He was none of that nonsense. You know, that was a miscommunication on somebody else’s part. But he went after them. He charged them. You know, LaVoy was very passionate about what he was doing up here.”

http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/eyewitnesses-knock-down-conspiracy-theories-about-lavoy-finicum-dying-his-hands?akid=13921.187590.jqAprz&rd=1&src=newsletter1049697&t=20


he definitely did not charge anyone, can't tell which guy shot him but if its the guy on the left it looks like he shot him from behind. Haven't heard whether or not Lavoy was armed but this video is not what boutons was hoping for.

1sR1hGpZQ5U

[TheSanityAnnex]

I'm sure the resident Mike Brown crowd will be here shortly to call this shoot unjustified :lol

[TheSanityAnnex]

And that McConnell witness was full of shit.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Need to see the dash cam video with audio to determine whether this was a good shoot or not. From this video with no audio it looks like he could have been reaching for a gun. He was shot three times. The dash cam and audio will show if he was reaching towards his body for a gun and was then shot or if he was shot with his hands up and then reached for his wounds before being hit with the finishing shot.

If the dash cam and audio are not released I'm leaning towards the latter.

[CosmicCowboy]

I would have shot him. Had his hands up, then clearly went for something at his waist.

He got deaded.

Stupid is as stupid does.

[CosmicCowboy]

FBI wouldn't have released the video so quick if they knew the audio didn't match their story line.

you can claim they doctored the audio but then you sound like cosmored.

[baseline bum]

he definitely did not charge anyone, can't tell which guy shot him but if its the guy on the left it looks like he shot him from behind. Haven't heard whether or not Lavoy was armed but this video is not what boutons was hoping for.

1sR1hGpZQ5U

What an asshole. Almost runs down an FBI agent and then reaches like he's going for a weapon. Fuck him, he got what he deserved, and probably what he wanted too. Win-Win situation.

[TheSanityAnnex]

FBI wouldn't have released the video so quick if they knew the audio didn't match their story line.

you can claim they doctored the audio but then you sound like cosmored.
Audio will be key. He was either reaching and got shot or had his hands up, got shot, reached where he was shot, and got shot again.

I've always said play stupid games win stupid prizes. He won his stupid prize.

[TheSanityAnnex]

What an asshole. Almost runs down an FBI agent and then reaches like he's going for a weapon. Fuck him, he got what he deserved, and probably what he wanted too. Win-Win situation.
That dude is lucky to be alive. Who the fuck jumps in front of an Excursion on an icy road :lol

[TheSanityAnnex]

FBI wouldn't have released the video so quick if they knew the audio didn't match their story line.

you can claim they doctored the audio but then you sound like cosmored.
And if they don't release the dash cam and audio?

[baseline bum]

That dude is lucky to be alive. Who the fuck jumps in front of an Excursion on an icy road :lol

I imagine he thought they were going to try to plow through the barricade and not go around it.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I'd like to see the witness who said he charged them respond to this video.

[pgardn]

The quality of your posts take a dive when you attempt humor, stick to what you're good at.

When you judge my humor as bad, I'm all good.

[TheSanityAnnex]

When you judge my humor as bad, I'm all good.
It's not just me, notice you never garner a single lol from anyone on the board? I like you as a poster, you are just not funny. No big deal.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I imagine he thought they were going to try to plow through the barricade and not go around it.
In the unedited video you can see its set up behind a blind curve. Pretty stupid place for a roadblock unless they were trying to get rammed.

[TheSanityAnnex]

And :lol at them posing and what appears to be taking pictures with the dead body. Cold blooded.

[pgardn]

It's not just me, notice you never garner a single lol from anyone on the board? I like you as a poster, you are just not funny. No big deal.

Not keeping track.
But I'm happy you are.

Dont really care what posters like or dislike.
Onward thru the fog.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Not keeping track.
But I'm happy you are.

Dont really care what posters like or dislike.
Onward thru the fog.

Sounds good.

[TheSanityAnnex]

So far two separate witness accounts have come out. The guy who said Lavoy charged and got shot and the girl in the truck who said Lavoy was shot with hands up. One proven wrong and one unproven.

[Splits]

The family that has been talked about the last 17 pages of the thread you are in.

So, you are okay with what our government did to the Hammonds for 20 years or you don't think it is an issue that needed National attention?

Yes, I'm fine with two no-named arsonists getting re-sentenced under statute. There was no "national attention" needed or granted to the arsonists. You're a fucking dumbass.

Are you okay being the stupidest person on this board?

[Splits]

http://i.imgur.com/jmF5wSd.png

:lmao

[Splits]

http://i.imgur.com/Bv59IqR.png

[Splits]

http://i.imgur.com/nnkySKx.png

[TheSanityAnnex]

Yes, I'm fine with two no-named arsonists getting re-sentenced under statute. There was no "national attention" needed or granted to the arsonists. You're a fucking dumbass.

Are you okay being the stupidest person on this board?
Glad you at least know who we are taking about now, but I'm not talking about their being fucked over and sentenced again. I asked you if the constant harassment they received from the government for 20 years to get them off their land needed National attention.

Now that you know who the Hammonds are I expect you'll do some research into their harassment and answer my previous question honestly.

[Splits]

http://i.imgur.com/QwJfXSG.png (https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/clo/5423869615.html)

[baseline bum]

https://scontent-dfw1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpl1/t31.0-8/s720x720/12604733_951182274958581_1524600045597902493_o.jpg

:cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry

[boutons_deux]

Ransacked Oregon refuge shows disdain toward America’s rangers

“As I understand it, some of the employees in Oregon, on the refuge, had to abandon their homes, [while] occupiers were reportedly in the homes, rifling through personal papers – I mean, holy cow!” says David Hayes, who served as deputy secretary of the Interior under President Obama.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2016/0130/Ransacked-Oregon-refuge-shows-disdain-toward-America-s-rangers-What-s-the-fix

[TheSanityAnnex]

Ransacked Oregon refuge shows disdain toward America’s rangers

“As I understand it, some of the employees in Oregon, on the refuge, had to abandon their homes, [while] occupiers were reportedly in the homes, rifling through personal papers – I mean, holy cow!” says David Hayes, who served as deputy secretary of the Interior under President Obama.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2016/0130/Ransacked-Oregon-refuge-shows-disdain-toward-America-s-rangers-What-s-the-fix


Before I click the link can you verify it's true? The witness testimony you posted earlier turned out to be a lie.

[boutons_deux]

Before I click the link can you verify it's true? The witness testimony you posted earlier turned out to be a lie.

you'll have to ask David Hayes.

I expect after the last assholes are out, there will be plenty of photographic evidence for the trials.

[baseline bum]

So far two separate witness accounts have come out. The guy who said Lavoy charged and got shot and the girl in the truck who said Lavoy was shot with hands up. One proven wrong and one unproven.

Second one too.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The FBI released the tape.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAGxDWKrjPQ

You can see him get out put his hands up briefly and then brig his hands into his torso. Starts at around 9m.

[baseline bum]

LOL faggot gets caught reaching for his gun and the militiatards acting like he was murdered.

#TeaTard Lives Matter :cry

[ElNono]

That gotta be a drone recording, IMO... would've been cool to see a couple of hellfires coming out and hitting the white truck

[baseline bum]

That gotta be a drone recording, IMO... would've been cool to see a couple of hellfires coming out and hitting the white truck

It's more personal seeing him gunned down while reaching for his pistol.

[CosmicCowboy]

stupid is as stupid does. He absolutely asked to be shot.

[TheSanityAnnex]

stupid is as stupid does. He absolutely asked to be shot.

He literally did ask to be shot :lol

And from the eyewitness account it sounds like they started shooting before he was even out of the car. Very possible he was shot with his hands up, don't think they'll ever release the dash cam with audio.

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/shawna_cox_refuge_occupier_des.html

"We kind of slid through the snow," she said. "Then bullets started flying."
Finicum jumped out but Cox didn't see what happened because she was on the floor. She said she thought he was wearing a bulletproof vest.
"He was yelling, 'Just shoot me, just shoot me, just shoot me,' That's all he said. And then they did."

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You can see on the video at which point he gets shot. it's after he reaches towards his torso that he gets hit and goes down. It does happen quickly once the car goes off the road but the order of events is obvious.

[TheSanityAnnex]

You can see on the video at which point he gets shot. it's after he reaches towards his torso that he gets hit and goes down. It does happen quickly once the car goes off the road but the order of events is obvious.
I'm not defending the guy at all, it was suicide by cop, but the order of events is not obvious, it's a shitty grainy video. Payne was shot earlier putting his hands out of the window, what makes you think they didn't open fire immediately when Finicum got out of the truck? The girl in the truck said they were shooting before he even got out. Until they release the dash cam with corresponding audio this video can be seen two ways; he reached for his torso and got shot or he was shot and reached for his torso (wound)

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Low end muzzle velocities are over 100 m/s. From that distance even the slowest bullet would take a fraction of a fraction of a second. He clearly reaches towards his torso then moments later goes down. The order of events is clear despite wishcasting by the usual suspects.

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lol coming from the guy who had the order of events clear with Mike Brown and his hands up surrendering:lol

How is the order of events clear when there is no audio to establish when the gunshots take place? The eyewitness in the truck said shots were being fired before he was out of the truck.


I've said from the start the only way to truly know what happened is with synced audio.

And lol @ your constant overuse of your newly learned buzzwords, this week's being wishcasting. Try to spread them out a bit, it's to easy to tell when your class starts a new chapter

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You can tell when the impact occurs because it spins him around and he goes down. Keep on wishcasting that there were shots fired that didn't hit him from that range.

As for the Brown incident my point still remains. The police investigation had a clear conflict of interest and because of that you couldn't be sure what was valid given all the conflicting testimony.

The single Shaun King tweet I posted that you incessantly bring up showed the picture of where the cops SUV was and where the body was. Using a sense of scale and that information, it was obvious that the chiefs statements the day before were false.

This is a very similar circumstance. They were maybe 5 meters away and even the slowest bullet will cover that distance in .05 seconds. I doubt those cops used shitty rounds so likely that is much much faster.

Who gives a shit what you've said from the start. You've routinely been noted to be biased and not too bright.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

And only someone who glorifies ignorance and is insecure about their intelligence would complain about someone learning and using new words.

Seeing how you struggle with simple concepts like mutual exclusiveness and basic physics I can understand why at least. New concepts are obviously a struggle.

[ChumpDumper]

Eh, once he ran the roadblock and got the truck close to the trooper, they could all have been justifiably shot. Dude panicked. I hope McConaughey plays him in the movie.

[TheSanityAnnex]

And only someone who glorifies ignorance and is insecure about their intelligence would complain about someone learning and using new words.

Seeing how you struggle with simple concepts like mutual exclusiveness and basic physics I can understand why at least. New concepts are obviously a struggle.
What course/coffee shop did you learn wishcasting at this week?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

well dipshit has given up on the substantive argument and instead is fixating on me entirely. how droll. how creepy.

[TheSanityAnnex]

You can tell when the impact occurs because it spins him around and he goes down. Keep on wishcasting that there were shots fired that didn't hit him from that range.

As for the Brown incident my point still remains. The police investigation had a clear conflict of interest and because of that you couldn't be sure what was valid given all the conflicting testimony.

The single Shaun King tweet I posted that you incessantly bring up showed the picture of where the cops SUV was and where the body was. Using a sense of scale and that information, it was obvious that the chiefs statements the day before were false.

This is a very similar circumstance. They were maybe 5 meters away and even the slowest bullet will cover that distance in .05 seconds. I doubt those cops used shitty rounds so likely that is much much faster.

Who gives a shit what you've said from the start. You've routinely been noted to be biased and not too bright.

Were shots fired at the truck before he got out?
Could he have been hit by one of those shots prior to getting out?
Could adrenaline have masked the pain if he was shot?
Do you think the first shot dropped him?
How many times was he shot and by which size rounds?
Do you think all gun shots make someone spin on impact?
Was he shot by one or two people?

your claim that the order of events was clear is complete bullshit.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Your incredulity is not an argument. There is no evidence of any of that thus me using the term wishcasting.

:lol you saying you're not defending him yet you are presenting a conspiracy that does just that.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Your incredulity is not an argument. There is no evidence of any of that thus me using the term wishcasting.

:lol you saying you're not defending him yet you are presenting a conspiracy that does just that.
The questions you can't answer further prove my point that your claim is baseless without audio of when the shots happened. I'm not presenting any conspiracy, I'm just posing questions until more information comes out. You keep glossing over the girl in the truck who said they opened fire before he got out of the truck. Audio would prove her statement true or false.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Why do you think this has been the only video released?

[ChumpDumper]

Were shots fired at the truck before he got out?
Could he have been hit by one of those shots prior to getting out?
Could adrenaline have masked the pain if he was shot?
Do you think the first shot dropped him?
How many times was he shot and by which size rounds?
Do you think all gun shots make someone spin on impact?
Was he shot by one or two people?Ultimately , why does any of this matter?

Once he almost ran over the agent/trooper, he was fair game.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Be back tomorrow morning, headed out to grab a latte and learn a couple cool words.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The questions you can't answer further prove my point that your claim is baseless without audio of when the shots happened. I'm not presenting any conspiracy, I'm just posing questions until more information comes out. You keep glossing over the girl in the truck who said they opened fire before he got out of the truck. Audio would prove her statement true or false.

Your parroting Inforwars take and not doing it very well.

http://www.infowars.com/was-lavoy-finicum-murdered-by-the-fbi/

Here they are making your audio argument. I know you want to believe the 120 bullets story.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Why do you think this has been the only video released?

Conspiracy!

[ChumpDumper]

Why do you think this has been the only video released?Different agencies.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

A stupid man's report of what a clever man says can never be accurate, because he unconsciously translates what he hears into something he can understand.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Ultimately , why does any of this matter?

Once he almost ran over the agent/trooper, he was fair game.

That and again the action right before the death blow where he reached for his waist.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You can normally find TSA's takes are simply regurgitations of conservativetreehouse, breitbart and infowars.

He doesn't cite them because like the Darrin account he knows his sources are shit.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Ultimately , why does any of this matter?

Once he almost ran over the agent/trooper, he was fair game.
Have they said that action justified the shoot? I haven't heard that.
It's hard to tell from the angle in the air but it looks like they set the roadblock up right around a corner on an icy road. Still can't figure out why the trooper ran at the truck either.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Your parroting Inforwars take and not doing it very well.

http://www.infowars.com/was-lavoy-finicum-murdered-by-the-fbi/

Here they are making your audio argument. I know you want to believe the 120 bullets story.kind of hard to parrot a site when I posted the video here before your site discussed it. Is Alex Jones parroting TSA? Haven't heard the 120 bullets story. Wanting to hear the audio first is what any rational person would ask for before coming to conclusions. Amusing watching you run about the site shouting about the thin blue line and LEBOR and throwing all that out the window in this case.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Different agencies.
OSP on the ground FBI in the sky, makes sense then. Still want to know if they'll release video/audio from the ground, would answer a lot of questions.

[TheSanityAnnex]

You can normally find TSA's takes are simply regurgitations of conservativetreehouse, breitbart and infowars.

He doesn't cite them because like the Darrin account he knows his sources are shit.

I don't frequent any of those sites, and it appears I'm ahead of them in obtaining information.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Who said that I had made a decision? of course I want to see all the info. That doesn't mean to wishcast to fill in the blanks. given the info we have now it is what it is. If new info comes in then I will look at it similar to the Justice Dept report in Missouri.

My LEOBOR concerns indictments and investigations against police. That isn't what is going on here. Ty and keep up.

And I don't read your posts. You responded to me so I looked but that is the extant. Your take is the same as theirs and that article is from several days ago. In general you are not reliable. link your claim.

[ChumpDumper]

Have they said that action justified the shoot? I haven't heard that.It's currently under review by some county task force. I'm speculating, but in most places that constitutes assault with a deadly weapon.


It's hard to tell from the angle in the air but it looks like they set the roadblock up right around a corner on an icy road. Still can't figure out why the trooper ran at the truck either.Seems to be enough of a clearing that they could see the three trucks. Of course dash cam would help. Looks like only one official vehicle there with lights though.


OSP on the ground FBI in the sky, makes sense then. Still want to know if they'll release video/audio from the ground, would answer a lot of questions.Sure. Like I said, some other agency is reviewing the shoot, so don't expect much for a few weeks.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lol you are a gullible stupid fuck.

I knew your chart had inconsistencies having read the witness statements myself. Looks like someone actually took the time to break down what was wrong with PBS's chart.

I told you over and over to read the witness statements on your own but you were too lazy and relied on PBS to do your thinking for you. How embarrassing.

http://i1311.photobucket.com/albums/s679/thefuzzylumpkins/pbschart_zpsb43b780f.jpg (http://s1311.photobucket.com/user/thefuzzylumpkins/media/pbschart_zpsb43b780f.jpg.html)

http://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/1499/4375/original.jpg

click the link to see the chart and zoom in

Original chart 261 data fields
141 errors reported in data
Accuracy of original chart 46%

:lmao

After all of this you will still refuse to read the statements on your own. Thanks for the laugh blowhard, always enjoy watching you flail around.

Note how he doesn't cite it as from conservativetreehouse. He pulled it from this article: http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2014/12/02/the-mike-brown-pbs-lie-chart-the-false-pbs-claims-deconstructed-visually/

This account is a lying piece of shit just like the Darrin account.

[boutons_deux]

Jailed Oregon militants have extensive criminal histories — many aren’t even allowed to carry guns

The arrested militiamen of the Oregon refuge occupation have had extensive previous run-ins with the law – and a history of anti-government protests that federal officials are now using against them in court.In recent filings (https://www.scribd.com/doc/297643569/Bundy-Et-Al-Response-to-Pretrial-Release-Motions-1-29-16)in federal court in Portland, prosecutors have detailed the criminal histories of the 11 people facing felony charges for their involvement in the armed occupation of the Malheur national wildlife refuge, which began 2 January (http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/03/oregon-militia-threatens-showdown-with-us-agents-at-wildlife-refuge)and continues to drag on this week with no end in sight (http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/30/oregon-militia-standoff-malheur-wildlife-refuge-ammon-bundy-attorneys).

The men’s rap sheets include cases of domestic violence, illegal firearm possession, terrorist threats, resisting arrest and drug crimes, according to the court records.

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/02/jailed-oregon-militants-have-extensive-criminal-histories-many-arent-even-allowed-to-carry-guns/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

:lol TSA adorably supports and defends these mofos.

[TheSanityAnnex]

And I don't read your posts. You responded to me so I looked but that is the extant. Your take is the same as theirs and that article is from several days ago. In general you are not reliable. link your claim.

Post #923---5 days ago
he definitely did not charge anyone, can't tell which guy shot him but if its the guy on the left it looks like he shot him from behind. Haven't heard whether or not Lavoy was armed but this video is not what boutons was hoping for.

1sR1hGpZQ5U

Post #926---5 days ago
Need to see the dash cam video with audio to determine whether this was a good shoot or not. From this video with no audio it looks like he could have been reaching for a gun. He was shot three times. The dash cam and audio will show if he was reaching towards his body for a gun and was then shot or if he was shot with his hands up and then reached for his wounds before being hit with the finishing shot.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Jailed Oregon militants have extensive criminal histories — many aren’t even allowed to carry guns

The arrested militiamen of the Oregon refuge occupation have had extensive previous run-ins with the law – and a history of anti-government protests that federal officials are now using against them in court.In recent filings (https://www.scribd.com/doc/297643569/Bundy-Et-Al-Response-to-Pretrial-Release-Motions-1-29-16)in federal court in Portland, prosecutors have detailed the criminal histories of the 11 people facing felony charges for their involvement in the armed occupation of the Malheur national wildlife refuge, which began 2 January (http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/03/oregon-militia-threatens-showdown-with-us-agents-at-wildlife-refuge)and continues to drag on this week with no end in sight (http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jan/30/oregon-militia-standoff-malheur-wildlife-refuge-ammon-bundy-attorneys).

The men’s rap sheets include cases of domestic violence, illegal firearm possession, terrorist threats, resisting arrest and drug crimes, according to the court records.

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/02/jailed-oregon-militants-have-extensive-criminal-histories-many-arent-even-allowed-to-carry-guns/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

:lol TSA adorably supports and defends these mofos.






Said from the start the militia guys are fucking idiots. Try again.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Note how he doesn't cite it as from conservativetreehouse. He pulled it from this article: http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2014/12/02/the-mike-brown-pbs-lie-chart-the-false-pbs-claims-deconstructed-visually/ This account is a lying piece of shit just like the Darrin account.

[TheSanityAnnex]

It's currently under review by some county task force. I'm speculating, but in most places that constitutes assault with a deadly weapon.

Seems to be enough of a clearing that they could see the three trucks. Of course dash cam would help. Looks like only one official vehicle there with lights though.

Sure. Like I said, some other agency is reviewing the shoot, so don't expect much for a few weeks.

Doesn't look like he saw them in time as he doesn't appear to hit the brakes and tries to avoid hitting them. He could have just rammed them if he wanted to hurt people. But yeah it's really tough to tell from the angle we are looking at. I don't think it'd be an easy sell to a jury to justify the shoot based on the road block situation alone. Now him getting shot when he got out is an easy good shoot call.

[boutons_deux]

Bundy militants could be forced to repay $3.4 million to taxpayers over illegal stunt

An Oregon Democrat introduced legislation that would require Ammon Bundy and other out-of-state militants to repay taxpayers for the cost of their armed takeover of a wildlife sanctuary.Rep. Earl Blumenauer introduced a bill that would require the militants — and the federal government — to pay back costs associated with the occupation, which the lawmaker estimates at $100,000 a day, reported KOIN-TV (http://koin.com/2016/02/03/blumenauer-wants-militia-to-pay-for-malheur-occupation/).

The bill would require (http://registerguard.com/rg/news/local/34022768-75/malheur-occupation-costing-state-local-law-enforcement-100k-a-week-congressman-says.html.csp) the U.S. Department of Justice “to quickly reimburse state and local law enforcement agencies up front for costs associated with responding to the armed takeover.”

The U.S. Attorney General would then be allowed sue the militants to recover those costs.

“It would allow the federal government to go after the armed people who started it,” Blumenauer said. “But in the meantime, the people of Harney County shouldn’t have to suffer twice — had the disruption and then have to pay the bill.”

Blumenauer said the federal government should pay some of the costs to Oregon taxpayers, because he said authorities prolonged the standoff by waiting to arrest or confront the militants.

“The state and local government shouldn’t have to pick up the tab — it’s not their fault,” he said. “The feds need to reimburse and then go after the people who caused it.”

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/02/bundy-militants-could-be-forced-to-repay-3-4-million-to-taxpayers-over-illegal-stunt/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

still are 4 occupiers who won't come out unless they will not be arrested :lol

[TheSanityAnnex]

Bundy militants could be forced to repay $3.4 million to taxpayers over illegal stunt

An Oregon Democrat introduced legislation that would require Ammon Bundy and other out-of-state militants to repay taxpayers for the cost of their armed takeover of a wildlife sanctuary.Rep. Earl Blumenauer introduced a bill that would require the militants — and the federal government — to pay back costs associated with the occupation, which the lawmaker estimates at $100,000 a day, reported KOIN-TV (http://koin.com/2016/02/03/blumenauer-wants-militia-to-pay-for-malheur-occupation/).

The bill would require (http://registerguard.com/rg/news/local/34022768-75/malheur-occupation-costing-state-local-law-enforcement-100k-a-week-congressman-says.html.csp) the U.S. Department of Justice “to quickly reimburse state and local law enforcement agencies up front for costs associated with responding to the armed takeover.”

The U.S. Attorney General would then be allowed sue the militants to recover those costs.

“It would allow the federal government to go after the armed people who started it,” Blumenauer said. “But in the meantime, the people of Harney County shouldn’t have to suffer twice — had the disruption and then have to pay the bill.”

Blumenauer said the federal government should pay some of the costs to Oregon taxpayers, because he said authorities prolonged the standoff by waiting to arrest or confront the militants.

“The state and local government shouldn’t have to pick up the tab — it’s not their fault,” he said. “The feds need to reimburse and then go after the people who caused it.”

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/02/bundy-militants-could-be-forced-to-repay-3-4-million-to-taxpayers-over-illegal-stunt/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

still are 4 occupiers who won't come out unless they will not be arrested :lol




I don't remember you calling for the OWS protestors to pay

'Occupy' Protests Cost Nation's Cities At Least $13 Million

NEW YORK — During the first two months of the nationwide Occupy protests, the movement that is demanding more out of the wealthiest Americans cost local taxpayers at least $13 million in police overtime and other municipal services, according to a survey by The Associated Press.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/23/occupy-protests-cost_n_1109695.html

[Splits]

I don't remember you calling for the OWS protestors to pay

'Occupy' Protests Cost Nation's Cities At Least $13 Million

NEW YORK — During the first two months of the nationwide Occupy protests, the movement that is demanding more out of the wealthiest Americans cost local taxpayers at least $13 million in police overtime and other municipal services, according to a survey by The Associated Press.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/23/occupy-protests-cost_n_1109695.html

So posting an article now means that you're advocating for the contents of the article?

Good to know.

[TheSanityAnnex]

So posting an article now means that you're advocating for the contents of the article?

Good to know.

In this case yes, boutons for sure wants the militia squatters to pay. Ask him.

Since you are here again and I assume you've finally figured out what the last 17 pages have been about I'll ask the question you ran from again.

Did the constant harassment the Hammonds received from the government for 20 years in an attempt to force them off their land need National attention?

[Splits]

In this case yes, boutons for sure wants the militia squatters to pay. Ask him.

Since you are here again and I assume you've finally figured out what the last 17 pages have been about I'll ask the question you ran from again.

Did the constant harassment the Hammonds received from the government for 20 years in an attempt to force them off their land need National attention?

That's your invention. The arsonists, having lost all federal appeals, deserved to be in prison and that issue warranted no national attention.

[TheSanityAnnex]

That's your invention. The arsonists, having lost all federal appeals, deserved to be in prison and that issue warranted no national attention.
Once again, I'm not talking about the arson case. Are you purposely avoiding answering my question about the 20 years of harassment and attempted land grab or do you just have no knowledge of it?

[Splits]

:lmao Feds moving in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOlrSain0lk

[TheSanityAnnex]

:lmao Feds moving in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOlrSain0lk
Always amusing to see a guy bump a thread he last ran away from.

Are you purposely avoiding answering my question about the 20 years of harassment and attempted land grab or do you just have no knowledge of it?

[TheSanityAnnex]

Speaking of faggots who run from threads

Your take is the same as theirs and that article is from several days ago. In general you are not reliable. link your claim.


Post #923---5 days ago

Post #926---5 days ago

[Splits]

:lmao this bitch, the one I called out and TSA's hero, is going to hand the terrorists over to the feds

http://i2.wp.com/fusiondotnet.files.wordpress.com/2015/12/eb2rnle.jpg?resize=600%2C600&quality=80&strip=all