Duncan vs Kareem

[Buddy Mignon]

You niggas feeling froggy tonight? You talking all that shit about Jim being so great, huh? Well I'm sitting trump tight over here, you nerds!!! Let's compare Jim to other great big men... preferably Lakers bigs. When you look at this comparison you will see why the Spurs have hung on to that mantra of Duncan being the best PF of all time, because they know they better not dare compare him to true legends that roamed the paint.

Feast your eyes on how Kareem makes Jim's career look like shit. And he did it against great big men late in his career... no these soft ass pastry chefs like Bosh and Ibaka.



http://www.landofbasketball.com/player_comparison/a/kareem_abdul_jabbar_vs_tim_duncan.htm

[Buddy Mignon]

Noooooooobody wants none of this. That's right!!!

[ChumpDumper]

http://www.incgamers.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/narutocostumes-1024x558.jpg

[Buddy Mignon]

Yeah niggga... keep spamming. I got my foot in your funny looking ass.:lmao

[Buddy Mignon]

Mid won't even tough this thread.

[ChumpDumper]

http://media.tumblr.com/2be47393e5abba6e9d1cdb6d7f589956/tumblr_inline_mls7jz2vYr1qz4rgp.gif

[ezau]

As long as Duncan>Kobe. To be fair though, Jabbar is above Duncan in the all-time list but not much. There's no shame being one-upped by the greatest big man ever. Kobe, on the other hand, :lol

[Buddy Mignon]

As long as Duncan>Kobe


I'm good for tonight, ezau. J.T., gave up the goods. You sleep well, my friend.:toast

[midnightpulp]

Mid won't even tough this thread.

Kareem is my personal GOAT since I value bigs over wings. I don't care if Duncan falls short of that comparison.

But Duncan hangs with him pretty good:

http://oi59.tinypic.com/2efun4i.jpg

What's also admirable about Kareem is that he was a team first player in the later years of his career, just like Duncan.

The 2 smartest bigs ever.

Wilt was a statpadding ape in the weakest big man era in NBA history, so I don't know why you're on his jock.

[ambchang]

Kareem used to be my personal GOAT, but then when you really look at Kareem, his legacy really was overrated.

During his absolute prime, he needed another top 10 player of all time in Oscar Robertson to win the championship. He also missed the playoffs twice during the weakest era of NBA basketball in the 70s. Some of that was due to the wonky playoff format, but still, the GOAT shouldn't miss the playoffs, period.

He won most of his rings (5 of 6) during the 80s, again, teaming up with another top 10 player, this time Magic. While he was clearly the best player in the 80 and 82 runs, him missing the last game of the season in 80 didn't stop the Lakers from winning it all, because Magic took over. He got his ass romped by the Celtics in 84, was totally dominated by Malone in 81, was embarrassed by Sampson and Kareem in 86. GOATS do not do that, especially when they were in their semi-prime state. Then 87 and 88 were Magic rings.

Not to mention, Kareem was suspect defensively later in his career.

You put it all together, Duncan has a good argument over Kareem. I am still picking, all time, Kareem over Duncan, but the difference is not as big as people want to believe.

Also, great seeing OP comparing Duncan against the greatest players of all time, and has all but given up comparing Duncan to Kobe. I can see OP comparing Duncan to Naruto if he manages to win one more ring.

[scanry]

As long as Duncan>Kobe

That's all that matters in this day and age.

[scanry]

Kareem is arguably the greatest basketball player of all time if you consider high school, college and pro accomplishments.

[Buddy Mignon]

Kareem is my personal GOAT since I value bigs over wings. I don't care if Duncan falls short of that comparison.

But Duncan hangs with him pretty good:

http://oi59.tinypic.com/2efun4i.jpg

What's also admirable about Kareem is that he was a team first player in the later years of his career, just like Duncan.

The 2 smartest bigs ever.

Wilt was a statpadding ape in the weakest big man era in NBA history, so I don't know why you're on his jock.


Wilt would dominate this era where you guys consider scrubs like Hibert, Noah, Howard, and the Gasol's good big men. And no, Jim doesnt measure up with Kareem. I noticed you skipped over the regualar season.

[Buddy Mignon]

Kareem used to be my personal GOAT, but then when you really look at Kareem, his legacy really was overrated.

During his absolute prime, he needed another top 10 player of all time in Oscar Robertson to win the championship. He also missed the playoffs twice during the weakest era of NBA basketball in the 70s. Some of that was due to the wonky playoff format, but still, the GOAT shouldn't miss the playoffs, period.

He won most of his rings (5 of 6) during the 80s, again, teaming up with another top 10 player, this time Magic. While he was clearly the best player in the 80 and 82 runs, him missing the last game of the season in 80 didn't stop the Lakers from winning it all, because Magic took over. He got his ass romped by the Celtics in 84, was totally dominated by Malone in 81, was embarrassed by Sampson and Kareem in 86. GOATS do not do that, especially when they were in their semi-prime state. Then 87 and 88 were Magic rings.

Not to mention, Kareem was suspect defensively later in his career.

You put it all together, Duncan has a good argument over Kareem. I am still picking, all time, Kareem over Duncan, but the difference is not as big as people want to believe.

Also, great seeing OP comparing Duncan against the greatest players of all time, and has all but given up comparing Duncan to Kobe. I can see OP comparing Duncan to Naruto if he manages to win one more ring.


This is the worst basketball take I've ever seen. Kareem has three NCAA titles and would have four if they didn't red shit freshman's. Jim played four years and has none. Kareem has 6 MVP's... Jim 2. Kareem played in the era of great big men... Hakeem, Moses, Parish, Ewing, Sampson, Gilmore, Russell, Walton, Reed, Unseld, Thurman, Haywood, Lanier, Hayes, Cowins. Kareem was a giant amongst all of those great bigs. Duncan's only rival in the paint was Shaq and KG, and he couldn't stop Shaq. Oscar was a shell of himself when he joined Kareem to win a title. And he's far from a top 10 player. His game was extremely weak compared to todays standards. Kareem led the league in blocks, scoring and rebounding. Duncan has never led the league in anything. You make it seem like winning the majority of his rings during the second half of his career is a slight. If anything its a testament to his longevity and dominance. Stat for stat... Kareem kicks Jim's ass. And he was a better team player.

[ambchang]

This is the worst basketball take I've ever seen. Kareem has three NCAA titles and would have four if they didn't red shit freshman's. Jim played four years and has none.

Read your own post title, it says NBA: Duncan vs. Kareem. Not sure why you are putting in NCAA titles.


Kareem has 6 MVP's... Jim 2.

Because players like Dr. J, Artis Gilmore, and a dude who romps his ass in Moses Malone was playing in the NBA. 70s basketball was easily the weakest basketball era in basketball due to diluted talent and drugs.


Kareem played in the era of great big men... Hakeem, Moses, Parish, Ewing, Sampson, Gilmore, Russell, Walton, Reed, Unseld, Thurman, Haywood, Lanier, Hayes, Cowins. Kareem was a giant amongst all of those great bigs. Duncan's only rival in the paint was Shaq and KG, and he couldn't stop Shaq.

Shaq > all of those except Hakeem and Moses, and Kareem was routinely bullied by Hakeem (well in the older years) and Moses.

And Duncan held Shaq to 22.5 ppg in the playoffs, and was 3-2 h2h against him, so not sure how you would say Duncan couldn't stop Shaq.


Oscar was a shell of himself when he joined Kareem to win a title. And he's far from a top 10 player. His game was extremely weak compared to todays standards.

Too bad for you Oscar only had to play against standards of the 60s/70s.


Kareem led the league in blocks, scoring and rebounding. Duncan has never led the league in anything.

I guess you just answered your own question, eh?


His game was extremely weak compared to todays standards.

A player who's game was, in your words, extremely weak, compared to today's standards was dominating the league back in the day. Yet Kareem led the league in all those great things in the same era was a point for Kareem. Contradiction much?

BTW, that shell of his former self Oscar still led the league in playoff assists the year he rang, and averaged 18 a game and got 5 rebounds. In the regular season, he got 19/8.2/5.7.


You make it seem like winning the majority of his rings during the second half of his career is a slight. If anything its a testament to his longevity and dominance. Stat for stat... Kareem kicks Jim's ass. And he was a better team player.

Kareem was known to be aloof, and generally a rotten person and leader. Didn't get along with anyone, and most definitely NOT a better team player. And Stat of stat? Kareem played in an era of much faster pace. Per 100 possessions, Kareem averaged 29.9points, 3.4 blks, 13.1 rebounds and 4.5 assists. Duncan averages 30.4 points, 3.4 blocks, 17 rebounds and 4.7 assists. Tim tops Kareem in 3 out of the 4 big man stats, and ties him for the 4th.

[Axegrinder]

:lol at Lakerfans in panicky overcompensation mode.

[Buddy Mignon]

Read your own post title, it says NBA: Duncan vs. Kareem. Not sure why you are putting in NCAA titles.



Because players like Dr. J, Artis Gilmore, and a dude who romps his ass in Moses Malone was playing in the NBA. 70s basketball was easily the weakest basketball era in basketball due to diluted talent and drugs.



Shaq > all of those except Hakeem and Moses, and Kareem was routinely bullied by Hakeem (well in the older years) and Moses.

And Duncan held Shaq to 22.5 ppg in the playoffs, and was 3-2 h2h against him, so not sure how you would say Duncan couldn't stop Shaq.



Too bad for you Oscar only had to play against standards of the 60s/70s.



I guess you just answered your own question, eh?



A player who's game was, in your words, extremely weak, compared to today's standards was dominating the league back in the day. Yet Kareem led the league in all those great things in the same era was a point for Kareem. Contradiction much?

BTW, that shell of his former self Oscar still led the league in playoff assists the year he rang, and averaged 18 a game and got 5 rebounds. In the regular season, he got 19/8.2/5.7.



Kareem was known to be aloof, and generally a rotten person and leader. Didn't get along with anyone, and most definitely NOT a better team player. And Stat of stat? Kareem played in an era of much faster pace. Per 100 possessions, Kareem averaged 29.9points, 3.4 blks, 13.1 rebounds and 4.5 assists. Duncan averages 30.4 points, 3.4 blocks, 17 rebounds and 4.7 assists. Tim tops Kareem in 3 out of the 4 big man stats, and ties him for the 4th.


If you had bothered to look you'll notice that Kareem's first 4 season are not included in his PER. Kareem dwarfs Jim in every single category. Like I've said before... Jim has never been dominant in any one category... prove me wrong? Even in win shares... you'll find Kareem at the very top looking way down the list at Jim. There is no comparison here. Also, I find it hilarious you calling Kareem aloof while comparing him to Theodore... lol.

[ambchang]

If you had bothered to look you'll notice that Kareem's first 4 season are not included in his PER. Kareem dwarfs Jim in every single category. Like I've said before... Jim has never been dominant in any one category... prove me wrong? Even in win shares... you'll find Kareem at the very top looking way down the list at Jim. There is no comparison here. Also, I find it hilarious you calling Kareem aloof while comparing him to Theodore... lol.

Tim led the league in FGM, FTM, and D rebounds and total rebounds in 02, he led the league in DWS 5 times, D rating 4 times, OWS once, and total WS twice. Sure, Kareem did it more times, but like you said, it was an "extremely weak" era.

And since when was Tim aloof, he's quiet, he's always respectful, I have yet to hear stories of Duncan ignoring little kids' requests for autographs, when it was basically the norm for Kareem. He's such a questionable individual that he couldn't get a coaching gig even though he has been begging for one for years.

[Buddy Mignon]

Tim led the league in FGM, FTM, and D rebounds and total rebounds in 02, he led the league in DWS 5 times, D rating 4 times, OWS once, and total WS twice. Sure, Kareem did it more times, but like you said, it was an "extremely weak" era.

And since when was Tim aloof, he's quiet, he's always respectful, I have yet to hear stories of Duncan ignoring little kids' requests for autographs, when it was basically the norm for Kareem. He's such a questionable individual that he couldn't get a coaching gig even though he has been begging for one for years.

Karriem is from the era where signing autographs was embarrassing. Russell refused to do it as well, until they started getting paid to do so. Jim is extremely aloof and smug.

:lmao

[ambchang]

Karriem is from the era where signing autographs was embarrassing. Russell refused to do it as well, until they started getting paid to do so. Jim is extremely aloof and smug.

:lmao

No it wasn't, signing autographs was never embarrassing, you are now just making stuff up per par. And Russell was also well known to be aloof, Kareem was just more so. And nice to know that Kareem played in an extremely weak era where aloofness is the norm.

What exactly did Duncan do? Did he rape unattractive hotel employees? Called out his teammates in taped videos? Refuse to take the blame for failures? What did he do?

[Johnny RIngo]

Kareem's great. Amazing longevity but he's far from the perfect big man. Great offensive player but he never anchored any great defensive teams. Also not an impressive rebounder(especially in the 80s). Played his best ball in the weakest era in NBA history(70s) and only came away with one title.

[Johnny RIngo]

Karriem is from the era where signing autographs was embarrassing. Russell refused to do it as well, until they started getting paid to do so. Jim is extremely aloof and smug.

:lmao

I'm not sure you want to play "Who's the better human being" game betweem KAJ and TD. Kareem refused to pay child support for his bastard son and practically ignored him. The kid hates him now. Shit all over him on reddit a while ago.

[hitmantb]

Honestly you can't really count pre-NBA/ABA merger (1976) at full face value, the games were nowhere near as competitive as they are today and there were very few teams. The value of rings/awards should be halved until it was a full league.

Using that as the basis and the simple ring + FMVP + MVP formula (tie breaker I give to MVP then FMVP as they are the more individualistic metrics):

Jordan: 6 + 6 + 6 = 18
Kareem: 5 + 1/2 + 1 + 1/2 + 2 + 4/2 + = 11
Magic: 5 + 3 + 3 = 11
Duncan: 5 + 3 + 2 = 10
Russell: (11 + 5) / 2 = 8
LeBron: 2 + 2 + 4 = 8
Shaq: 4 + 3 + 1 = 8
Kobe: 5 + 2 + 1 = 8

In that order.

Honestly of the top 4, Duncan had the weakest supporting cast, if he didn't have to play 42.5 minutes a game in 2003 and took out two of the top 8 players on same team, his peak would have lasted longer. 2003 Duncan accomplished more than Jordan did in any single year IMO.

I mean, Kareem missed the finals and Lakers still won a title. This is a far cry from what Duncan has to work with.

[dbestpro]

Wilt would dominate this era where you guys consider scrubs like Hibert, Noah, Howard, and the Gasol's good big men. And no, Jim doesnt measure up with Kareem. I noticed you skipped over the regualar season.

We really will never know how good Wilt would be. So, imagine a big who was so athletic he could jump from a standstill position, from the foul line, and dunk the ball, while being a top of the line track athlete. This all without any of the modern day training methods. He would be a bad man regardless of the generation.

[ezau]

Not bad comparing Duncan against the greatest basketball player to walk on Earth.

[Richie]

He will never pass him because Kareem was so unstoppable offensively, butif Spurs repeat Duncan has a shout for #3 all time behind Kareem and Jordan.

[dg7md]

If Duncan wins 6 he will be deemed the greatest bigman of NBA history tbqh. Kareem was a beast, but it's about time people recognize that greatness in tougher eras surpass the older years where elite teams weren't really there and the competition level was nowhere near as high.

It's unfair to judge Kareem, Wilt, etc. based on these merits, but I bet Tiago Splitter would be the GOAT in the 1960s era of the NBA...

[spurraider21]

Jabbar and Duncan are respective GOAT's at their positions

[Jacob1983]

I'd say Kareem but that's just me. Got to give props to Kareem. If he hadn't have played his butt off in 1971, the Bucks would not be in Milwaukee right now. 32 and 18 per game in the Finals is fantastic. I think the thing that puts Kareem over Duncan is the scoring. Kareem was more of a dominant scorer than Duncan.

[Arcadian]

Unless we can build a time machine and send 03 Duncan to face 71 Kareem, we'll never know. But they are excellent parallels of each other. Duncan is the contemporary Kareem. Both are in the top 5 all time and two of my personal favorites.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Kareem > Duncan > Kobe. That's it and that's all.

[SpursDynasty]

Kareem played in a much easier NBA than Duncan.