Parker's Free Throws [Archive] - SpursTalk.com Forums

dbreiden83080

09-25-2005, 12:06 AM

I was really annoyed watching his play in the international games this past week. I mean he had some good games using his quickness and playmaking ability but his damn free throws are still awful. I really thought he would put in the time this summer and come back a 75% foul shooter this year, clearly that is not going to happen. I mean there is just no excuse for a 6-1, 6-2 pg to shoot around 65% for the season none at all. We can forgive Timmy for having a bad night from the line and shooting that % because he is dominant at everything else, he makes up for it. Tony still has a long way to go be an all star in the NBA a long way.

Kori Ellis

09-25-2005, 12:38 AM

timvp

09-25-2005, 01:20 AM

You do realize that he's been only working with the shooting coach for a couple months and they're restructuring his form completely. It will be several months before you see the results of the coaching/practice.

Actually, I wouldn't expect results that soon. If Parker is going to re-do his mechanics, he'll get worse before he gets better. My thinking is that if it works out, Parker's shot could be "fixed" in a couple years.

T Park

09-25-2005, 03:10 AM

i honestly didnt see any change in his form watching today.

Im sure, if you showed film side by side, there would be HUGE differences. WHo knows.

My thinking is that if it works out, Parker's shot could be "fixed" in a couple years.

Brewski will say thats an excuse and that you need to trade the young frenchie IMMEDIATELY!!

MI21

09-25-2005, 10:27 AM

Most players don't develop a good jump shot in a matter of 2 months, it usually takes something closer to 12 months if they only need slight changes and often a lot more than that for someone who wants to get a whole new J. The amount of practice needed is phenominal.

Parker has already had his long range jumpshot changed in his NBA career, and it obviously hasn't worked out great. It would be very hard to change the way you like to shoot after shooting the same way for 7-8 years of professional basketball. Give dude some time.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 10:36 AM

Just curious. What NBA player can you think of that's totally reworked their shot and gone from a bad/mediocre shooter to a good shooter? Are shooters born or made?

ALVAREZ6

09-25-2005, 10:38 AM

Are shooters born or made?
Born.

If a coach has to change your shot, it normally doesn't work out right. It's your job as a player to adjust your shot by yourself. If he's going to change his mechanics after all these years, I don't think it will work out right.

MI21

09-25-2005, 10:43 AM

Just curious. What NBA player can you think of that's totally reworked their shot and gone from a bad/mediocre shooter to a good shooter? Are shooters born or made?

Grant Hill and Tracy McGrady spring to mind.

You'd probably find most players that have gone from being bad to good shooters haven't exactly remodeled there shot, but just fine tuned it and made simple adjustments that may not be that easy to spot just by looking at them shoot. Doesn't mean they haven't made big, important change though.

MI21

09-25-2005, 10:46 AM

Born.

If a coach has to change your shot, it normally doesn't work out right. It's your job as a player to adjust your shot by yourself. If he's going to change his mechanics after all these years, I don't think it will work out right.

Bullshit.

Jordan was a very average shooter and then he turned into one of the best midrange shooters ever.

boutons

09-25-2005, 10:55 AM

"Grant Hill and Tracy McGrady"

... natural, graceful, well coordinated athletes, a hugely advantageous platform.

Tony isn't, he'll have a harder row to hoe in changing his mechanics, but he's gotta try. In the meantime, I'd like to see him shooting jumpers less, and concentrating on running the offense with 10 APG, driving like a madman, and keeping up his growth as a defender.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 11:00 AM

SequSpur

09-25-2005, 11:02 AM

Prior to gametime, I've seen Parker make one handed shots from sitting in a chair courtside without any problem.

Most NBA players are excellent shooters.

The problem with most of them is between the ears.

Some guys just can't ever get it.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 11:06 AM

Maybe he needs to shoot form sitting in a chair.

SequSpur

09-25-2005, 11:16 AM

:lol

It's hilarious. I've seen the dude do some things that are out of this world. He has the inside game of a hall of famer 7 footer, he has the dribbling skills of I. Thomas, but his free throws look like T. Wakefield. (Knuckleballer) But prior to gametime, he is usually automatic from anywhere on the court.

Same thing goes for Robert Horry.

But when the game is on, the difference is between the ears.

Late.

1Parker1

09-25-2005, 11:17 AM

picnroll

09-25-2005, 11:18 AM

The guy that was unreal pre-game was Kerr. Swish, swish, swish, swish .....

MI21

09-25-2005, 11:29 AM

Grant Hill 94-95 to 04-05
FG% - .477; .462; .496; .452; .479; .489; .442*; .426*; .492; .509
3 FG% - .148; .192; .303; .143; .000; .347; 1.00*; .000*; .250; .231

* 4 games and 14 games

Tracy McGrady 97-98 to 04-05
FG% - .450; .436; .451; .457; .451; .417; .431
3 FG% - .341; .229; .277; .355; .364; .386; .339; .326

FG% is misleading at times, McGrady wouldn't take a perimeter jumpshot early on I doubt he even took 1 3PA per game, now he is a good 3PT shooter and would attempt close to 6/7 a game, but the FG% says he has got worse. Tracy McGrady is a far superior shooter now than in his first 3 seasons, even if the stats don't show it. If anyone should know that it is Spurs fans, after what happened last season.

Grant Hill's FG% has risen according to those stats, but even then they don't show the extent of the improvement on his jumpshot alone. He went from being very good offensively to being unstoppable thanks to his improved jumpshot opening up more driving lanes for him because defenders could no longer sag.

Bottom line is there is no stat to measure the improvement of the jumpshot by itself, only the FG% stat, but anyone who has watched those players at the start of there careers and then now, knows how it is.

1Parker1

09-25-2005, 11:30 AM

I agree with Sequ that half of Tony's problem is in his head. Some games you see him right from tip-off and he has this focused look about him. He knows exactly when to drive and penetrate, when to dish out to the open man, when to push the ball up the court, how to get defenses to collapse on him, etc. Then, after he misses a shot or 2 or he gets a turnover or 2, you can just tell that he's lost some of that focus and confidence. Then he tries to force the game to come back to him and overthinks it all and tries way too hard.

I think Focus is the biggest problem with his game. That goes for his crappy FT's, his poor jumpshots, and even his TO's. How else can you explain how a guy can go from looking like a flawless, experienced basketball player one game scoring 20 and 7, and then go for 8 and 3 the next?

MI21

09-25-2005, 11:37 AM

Grant Hill and Tracy McGrady"

... natural, graceful, well coordinated athletes, a hugely advantageous platform.

Tony isn't, he'll have a harder row to hoe in changing his mechanics, but he's gotta try. In the meantime, I'd like to see him shooting jumpers less, and concentrating on running the offense with 10 APG, driving like a madman, and keeping up his growth as a defender.

Whoa. Tony Parker isn't a graceful, natural athlete on the basketball court? Whatever.

10 APG, how many NBA players have averaged that once in the last 10 years. I'll hazard a guess and say maybe 4/5. Nash, Kidd, Stockton, perhaps Rod Strickland and maybe someone out there I'm forgetting. Nash did it with the Suns, the fastest and most effective offensive team in Basketball. Stockton was Stockton, a once in a lifetime type player. Kidd has played for 3 fast paced, fast breaking, offensively orientated teams in that time period. Parker plays in a deliberate, post centered offense for a team that is generally middle of the pack offensively. No chance of 10apg.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 11:44 AM

The first three years McGrady was .2 of .6, .2 of .7 and .2 of .8 for his percentages on three point shooting. You could make a stronger case for statistical vagaries of a small sample and not getting enough shots to get a rhythm those first three years than that he improved his three point shooting. After that he's pretty much flatlined about where he was year one.

Personally on shooting I think for the most part numbers are numbers. Maybe he was played tighter, got more attention as he established himself but to make your case you have to go to second lines of defense. If true as Parker improved he would face the same obstacles.

Personally I think somebody can help with consistency of stroke, correct gross flaws but the majority of it is just inate hand eye coordination, visual perception stuff.

On a side note McGrady with a big man had his worse three point shooting year in ages. Where have we seen that before?

ShoogarBear

09-25-2005, 11:44 AM

Just curious. What NBA player can you think of that's totally reworked their shot and gone from a bad/mediocre shooter to a good shooter? Are shooters born or made?

Most obvious example is Michael Redd, although he didn't exactly "rework" his shot so much.

Magic (and Jordan, as previously mentioned) also was a mediocre shooter who became a deadly clutch shooter.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 11:57 AM

Kori Ellis

09-25-2005, 12:05 PM

How else can you explain how a guy can go from looking like a flawless, experienced basketball player one game scoring 20 and 7, and then go for 8 and 3 the next?

Nearly every player in the league is like that. Look at the other point guards from game to game and they are just as inconsistent. Tony was a lot more consistent this past season than people give him credit for.

Tony's mechanics on his shot suck. Everything from thumb position to the angle of his elbow. Sure, sometimes he concentrates a little harder or is just lucky and he shoots better. But it's mainly a mechanics thing.

ambchang

09-25-2005, 12:07 PM

Jeff Hornacek had a funny spin to his shot early on in his career because his thumb on his shooting hand gave the ball a sideway spin. He worked a whole summer shooting jumpers with his thumb taped to his palm, and he became one of the best pure shooters in the league.

MI21

09-25-2005, 12:08 PM

Kori is correct.

When we start seeing some backspin on Tony's shots, that's when you will know something has changed.

picnroll

09-25-2005, 12:13 PM

Nobody wants Parker to develop a consistent shot more than me. At the other end of the spectrum would be IceColdBrewski who's life would lose all meaning if he had to praise Parker. That said, it gets a little discouraging when you look through player's stats and see how few are able to significantly and consistently, year to year, improve their shooting percentage, particularly after a year or two in the league.

Here's hoping though. :drunk

ShoogarBear

09-25-2005, 02:42 PM

Redd's three point shooting has gone from .444 to .438 to .350 to .355.

Best candidates I can find so far are LeBron who's gone from .290 to .350 and Johnson who was a career .350 or so to last year .478. Those could be one year phenomenas though, there are lots of those. If so Johnson picked a great year to do it.

"shooter" != "three-point shooter"

Likewise percentage != great shooter.

When Redd came into the league, no one expected him to be much of a scorer. He became that through lots of hard work on his shot.

Emperor

09-25-2005, 08:32 PM

i once made 75 free throws in a row at HoopsCity when the NCAA Final Four was in town in 04. Sign me up Buford!

Rescueone

09-26-2005, 08:49 AM

i once made 75 free throws in a row at HoopsCity when the NCAA Final Four was in town in 04. Sign me up Buford!

Did you do any wind spints between shots? Run up and down the court ten times without stopping in a set time limit, then see if you can hit 10 in a row. If you can do that, I'd give you a shot! :tu