The Rented Airport Radisson Ballroom of Devin Vassell

[ace3g]

CIvtdYqMc21

[illusioNtEk]

The kid already wears protective knee pads and plays a style that will preserve his body for a long NBA Journey. I see good things for him.

A team like NY or LA might be willing to sign a huge contract for reliable young players. Hope we can afford him.

[exstatic]

The kid already wears protective knee pads and plays a style that will preserve his body for a long NBA Journey. I see good things for him.

A team like NY or LA might be willing to sign a huge contract for reliable young players. Hope we can afford him.

The only player on this roster I’d pay before him is Keldon, and that’s because his payday comes up one year earlier. We can afford him.

KJ
Devin
White

[MI21]

:pop: "He will be great for Austin"

[exstatic]

:pop: "He will be great for Austin"

Nah. He’s not a late first rounder, was picked higher than Kawhi was, and outside of maybe a rehab stint or three, I don’t think Mute Cancer spent a day there.

[BackHome]

Yeah have to rethink G League with lock down and restrictions I don’t know if Spurs want to let players go practice and then play some G League games and then come back to main team they may not want to risk possible exposure to COVID.

Though I would really like for him to play a few if possible cause I really want to see him being the offensive first option for a whole game just to see what he has. He needs to be told “Look 7 out of 10” we want you to either shoot from the outside or take it to the rim but your the man.

[Dejounte]

Yeah have to rethink G League with lock down and restrictions I don’t know if Spurs want to let players go practice and then play some G League games and then come back to main team they may not want to risk possible exposure to COVID.

Though I would really like for him to play a few if possible cause I really want to see him being the offensive first option for a whole game just to see what he has. He needs to be told “Look 7 out of 10” we want you to either shoot from the outside or take it to the rim but your the man.

Taking it to the rim is not his game. He needs to be an ace shooter from mid range to the 3 point line.

[cjw]

These are my thoughts, too. This is a pretty great hit rate, with these players still showing more potential (obvs. for Vassell). Dejounte Murray was a hit, too; I just don't think this is the team for him. Samanic looks like Livio or Milutinov.

I'll add Tre Jones, who I think people are sleeping on in a big way.

I almost mentioned Milutinov, but think he just found more value staying over in Europe. And there was good reason to drafting him - being able to keep cap space to sign LMA as he wasn’t coming over. Though they could have traded the pick for a future first too. It’s not like they totally missed out on anyone else at that pick, though you could mention a Harrell or Josh Richardson.

Tre Jones ... yes on him too. He’s exactly what you want to grab in the second round. He’s on a great contract, and he’s either a cheap backup PG for three years (fourth year he’s a RFA), and if he blossoms you might be able to move him for a pick or in a broader package down the road.

[TimDunkem]

^lol Milutinov was a throwaway pick. He even said the Spurs have never showed any serious interest in bringing him over.

But, yeah, the Spurs have NEVER EVER missed on a draft pick. *sniff sniff*

[Chinook]

I almost mentioned Milutinov, but think he just found more value staying over in Europe. And there was good reason to drafting him - being able to keep cap space to sign LMA as he wasn’t coming over.

Sorry, reading about drafting Milutinov makes blood vessels in my eyes burst. There was never a good reason to draft him unless the team really thought he was a good player. They paid Boban more than the pick's hold (and yes, the contract for Marjanovic was signed with cap space and not an exception). There were some very good big prospects in the draft the could've taken at 26. Had they gotten a decent one, that might've changed the complexion of the Leonard trade. I doubt it would've prevented the Gasol signing though, since none of those bigs were great as rookies.

There hasn't been a thing the team has ever done that peeves me more than that pick, and that includes not waiting until the off-season to move on from Carroll. It was just the dumbest use of an asset I've seen since I started closely following the team 10 years ago.

[Atl Spur]

^lol Milutinov was a throwaway pick. He even said the Spurs have never showed any serious interest in bringing him over.

But, yeah, the Spurs have NEVER EVER missed on a draft pick. *sniff sniff*

Of course the spurs have missed; they are still light years ahead of their colleagues!! Don’t take my word for it; let history guide you������

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1338583960981557248

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1282834702928359426/54njLVVi_normal.jpg
Paul Garcia pAulGarciaNBA
(https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA) 2m (https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1339777172102365184)
Vassell in 3 preseason games: 9 steals 2 blocks 7 personal fouls



Paul Garcia pAulGarciaNBA
(https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA)

41 preseason points so far for Vassell. 15 points from three 12 points in the paint 8 points from mid-range 6 points from the FT line

[ginobilized]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1282834702928359426/54njLVVi_normal.jpg
Paul Garcia pAulGarciaNBA
(https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA) 2m (https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1339777172102365184)
Vassell in 3 preseason games: 9 steals 2 blocks 7 personal fouls



Paul Garcia pAulGarciaNBA
(https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA)

41 preseason points so far for Vassell. 15 points from three 12 points in the paint 8 points from mid-range 6 points from the FT line

Low turnover rate really stands out, too. Solid player already.

[Blackhaus]

He’s looked real good. He plays at such a good pace, never seems to be in a hurry and his defense looks solid. Would like to see a future with him and Keldon starting together.

[Dverde]

Looks like a solid NBA player. Based on all the down beat draft hype, Spurs seem to gotten great value at 11. I just don’t hope people expect him to be a franchise changer. We still need a #1 option.

[John B]

Okay I will say it, Vassell has as much chance to get the ROY than anybody in this class, IF Pop would let him loose. Already he is guarding the best player in Harden. He has silky shots and not afraid to let them fly. He has the demeanor of a leader out there. I feel he can’t wait for Pop to call his number every time, and he’s not afraid to show it. Mamba mentality to guard the best player and just let it fly, at this very early stage, from his very first game. He will be a very special player. I think the fans would love for Pop to just let him loose.

[Atl Spur]

Let him live.....we haven’t seen anything yet!!! Pop knows he has some toys to play with.....patience please.

[Dejounte]

My critiques for him are largely the same in game 3:

-Still looks soft when driving to the rim. Reminds me of DJ & Lonnie in that he avoids contact albeit he seems more accurate with his finishes than both
-So say he'll never gain the strength to properly take the bumps down low-- if he can learn to slither around defenses and make acrobatic finishes, he'll be fine. Learning the Euro Step is a priority for young Devin.
-Ball handling has ways to go. Couple times the defense closed out on him on the perimeter and he was stuck and didn't know what to do with the ball.

[Atl Spur]

He has IT......

[TDomination]

If the 20 minutes he got last night is an indication of how much he'll play this year, i'll put him as top 3 candidate for Rookie of the Year. I hope Pop plays him man.
Him and Johnson together is going to be fun to watch.

[BackHome]

One thing I like about him and it’s probably one of the most important things to have to be a great baller is having mental toughness. You can tell that he knows he belongs and that it’s going to be up to Him on how great he can be not a coach and not another player. Every year since High School he has shown doubters wrong and gotten better and I am 100% sure next season he will be a much better player then he was this season.

We now have a good building block with Vassell and Keldon now after this season hopefully we can nab a top 5 lottery pick that will be a great fit with these two.

[stnick2261]

Reminds me of the quote around the time of the draft: "Devin Vassell has more career made 3s, assists, steals and blocks than turnovers. Not combined. He has more of each one of those than he has turnovers."
Through the 3 pre-season games he has 41pts (including five 3-pointers made), 16reb, 6ast, 9stl, 1blk.... and only 1 turnover.

[XDT76]

My critiques for him are largely the same in game 3:

-Still looks soft when driving to the rim. Reminds me of DJ & Lonnie in that he avoids contact albeit he seems more accurate with his finishes than both
-So say he'll never gain the strength to properly take the bumps down low-- if he can learn to slither around defenses and make acrobatic finishes, he'll be fine. Learning the Euro Step is a priority for young Devin.
-Ball handling has ways to go. Couple times the defense closed out on him on the perimeter and he was stuck and didn't know what to do with the ball.

Those 2 weakness that you stated had me worried it seems finishing at the rim and handling is what Spurs is not good at developing. White, Murray and Lonnie did not seems to improve much on their handles and finishing at the rim remain very much a weakness of their game.

[daslicer]

He's showing me that at worst he's going to be a good role player which is still a win for the Spurs.

[daslicer]

One thing I like about him and it’s probably one of the most important things to have to be a great baller is having mental toughness. You can tell that he knows he belongs and that it’s going to be up to Him on how great he can be not a coach and not another player. Every year since High School he has shown doubters wrong and gotten better and I am 100% sure next season he will be a much better player then he was this season.

We now have a good building block with Vassell and Keldon now after this season hopefully we can nab a top 5 lottery pick that will be a great fit with these two.

This upcoming draft is suppose to be 15 deep talent wise. The Spurs have a good chance of getting a good player in the lottery.

[Atl Spur]

His handles & body will get better hopefully; he has a bright future!

[Mr. Body]

He's showing me that at worst he's going to be a good role player which is still a win for the Spurs.

I thought he'd be a good role player this season and I'm thinking I was wrong.

[poopbox]

He's showing me that at worst he's going to be a good role player which is still a win for the Spurs.

Yeah I feel like he maxes out as a very high level role player...which is great value for the 11th pick...

One of those guys where the spurs win by 12 and the other team feels like they played well and they look at the game log and Devin had 15 points with 3 steals and a block and nobody really even remembers him scoring

[exstatic]

Yeah I feel like he maxes out as a very high level role player...which is great value for the 11th pick...

One of those guys where the spurs win by 12 and the other team feels like they played well and they look at the game log and Devin had 15 points with 3 steals and a block and nobody really even remembers him scoring

You seem to be agreeing with him, but you’re not. He said that Devins’s FLOOR is solid role player, and you’re saying that’s his best outcome. If Lonnie had between his ears what Devin does, he’d be an All Star. His mentality is damn near that of a PG. He not only knows where he should be, he knows where everyone else should be on a given play. The bonus is that he has that same floor awareness on defense.

[B1gduff]

Call me crazy what i see a bit of Khris Middleton in Vassel. Middleton isn't the quickest or most athtic guy, but he's gotten an high IQ, with a bility to shoot the 3 and the mid range. Something that I've seen from Vassel. There both great defenders. I would say that Vassel's ceiling could be that of Middleton.


Also Vassel has some long arms.

[Dejounte]

Call me crazy what i see a bit of Khris Middleton in Vassel. Middleton isn't the quickest or most athtic guy, but he's gotten an high IQ, with a bility to shoot the 3 and the mid range. Something that I've seen from Vassel. There both great defenders. I would say that Vassel's ceiling could be that of Middleton.


Also Vassel has some long arms.

You're not crazy. Read post #97 in page 4 of this thread.

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/chicagobullsbot/status/1340269772815003648

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I liked this kid from the jump when the draft info started coming in. I felt him, Williams, or Jalen Smith were best suited for our needs who might be available at 11.

I’m honestly not too surprised with the little bit we’ve seen from him and I think he (barring injuries) can get better

[Mr. Body]

Too bad there was no tournament last season; FSU was going to have a nice run.

[Gibbz]

Too bad there was no tournament last season; FSU was going to have a nice run.

He might not have been here at 11 had FSU had a big postseason run.

[pad300]

https://twitter.com/chicagobullsbot/status/1340269772815003648

As a minor point of interest, positions 3-5 all scored 34 pts in 3 games. Poku scored 33 in 3 games (14 (& 8 reb) against us, then 7 (& 7 reb) and 12 (& 13 reb). This as a skinny as hell 18 year old. I suspect that Poku is going to be a player...

[John B]

https://twitter.com/chicagobullsbot/status/1340269772815003648
The injuries could’ve forced Pop to give Vassell more playing time than what Pop would’ve probably played him. And based from Vassell’s performance so far, I’m hoping that Pop will not reel his minutes back. The kid could play a major role and very well be starting sooner than later, hopefully. Arguably the best 2way in the draft, Devin imo has a good chance on the ROY race. And that’s what Spurs fans could be rooting for if anything. Come on Pop.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I think Pop should start Devin and have Lonnie come of the bench. Lonnie would then have the ball in his hands more and hopefully wouldn’t play as passive as he does when other scorers are on the court with him.

Devin seems to play well with whoever he is playing with (from the little bit we have seen) not too mention he is a better defender than Lonnie and lord knows the starters need defenders

[XDT76]

I think Pop should start Devin and have Lonnie come of the bench. Lonnie would then have the ball in his hands more and hopefully wouldn’t play as passive as he does when other scorers are on the court with him.

Devin seems to play well with whoever he is playing with (from the little bit we have seen) not too mention he is a better defender than Lonnie and lord knows the starters need defenders

It will depends who is on the 2nd team if both Mills and Gay are on it, they will reduce Lonnie's time on the ball like what happened to White last year.

[venitian navigator]

Imho for the first 2 months, hoping in the meantime everybody is healing, they will try to see if the team is easily play off bound or is gonna struggle... In this second case, then they will go for the tanking...
Considering actual injuries, white and Johnson can't be counted in the starting lineup, at least for the first part of the season. And probably for all the season except the very last games of things go on the down side.
In any case its quite obvious Imho that Vassell, because of his team defense skills, is the best solution in the SL with Murray and DDR... I see the SL like
Djm Vassell DDR Lyles LMA

Then the second five
White (Tre Jones till he's healed) Walker Johnson (Samanic or KBD till he's healed) Gay Poeltl

[Dejounte]

Since some people still ask how tall Vassell is:

https://i.ibb.co/6m4bnvC/IMG-20201227-215915.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/qJn82BV/IMG-20201227-215937.jpg

[John B]

Since some people still ask how tall Vassell is:

https://i.ibb.co/6m4bnvC/IMG-20201227-215915.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/qJn82BV/IMG-20201227-215937.jpg

I think he will be taller than Demar in a year or two, and should be able to guard 1-4. He's a natural, and I hope he gets more playing time. He's just going to get better and can really help a lot in defense.

[Dejounte]

I think he will be taller than Demar in a year or two, and should be able to guard 1-4. He's a natural, and I hope he gets more playing time. He's just going to get better and can really help a lot in defense.

Sure hope he grows. It's rare though. We got lucky with Keldon growing.

[cd98]

I know Pop has a history of not playing good, young players, be it by placing them in the G-League or by keeping them on the bench. But don't you think Devin Vassell would benefit from getting a bunch of G-League minutes, at least for a couple of months, especially when SA should be tanking, but won't if DeRozan and Alderidge are still on the team.

[200 miles]

Sure hope he grows. It's rare though. We got lucky with Keldon growing.

How tall is Keldon now?

[Dejounte]

How tall is Keldon now?

I can't snap a good photo but from the looks of it he looks about an inch taller than DeMar. I could be wrong and he could be shorter. Just waiting for the perfect snapshot, since we'll never get accurate measurements.

This Vassell one above was a perfect one because he picked DeMar up from behind and the angle of the camera is good.

[rankingtear]

Some tidbit on Devin when the Vecenie interviewed College coaches, among him and Patrick Williams , Pat was widely considered the for now prospect and Devin is considered the down the road. Devin may have more potential than we taught.

[Fireball]

he looked confident the last game ... I wish he would take away minutes from Rudy but that would need a lot of consistency to convince Pop when White comes back

[exstatic]

he looked confident the last game ... I wish he would take away minutes from Rudy but that would need a lot of consistency to convince Pop when White comes back

There are defensive, physical matches that he can’t handle now that Rudy can, Kawhi for instance.

Devin always looks confident, calm and cool out there. He’s 20, and already a bonafide professional.

[ginobilized]

Devin’s countenance reminds me of an old-school type player. Not a superstar, maybe not an All-Star, but a very good pro for 10+ yrs, barring injury. He’s focused, looks relaxed, confident, plays within the system, and seems like his IQ is very high. It’s quite a sight to see a rookie who know where he needs to be on the floor to this degree. He is attuned to so many of the details of the game and Spurs sets. To me, fitting in and finding ways to adjust and contribute to the NBA game is job #1.
He’s doing a fantastic job, couldn’t ask for much more at this point.

[210baller]

Too bad there was no tournament last season; FSU was going to have a nice run.

that was a good thing. he wouldnt have made it to the spurs.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Devin’s countenance reminds me of an old-school type player. Not a superstar, maybe not an All-Star, but a very good pro for 10+ yrs, barring injury. He’s focused, looks relaxed, confident, plays within the system, and seems like his IQ is very high. It’s quite a sight to see a rookie who know where he needs to be on the floor to this degree. He is attuned to so many of the details of the game and Spurs sets. To me, fitting in and finding ways to adjust and contribute to the NBA game is job #1.
He’s doing a fantastic job, couldn’t ask for much more at this point.

Funny, he reminded me a little of Eddie Johnson (the one who played for the Kings and PHX), only with better defensive skills, when I first saw him play.

I like what he brings. He, Keldon and White (if he can get healthy) would give us a nice young core. If Walker and Murray can also reach their potential (not as sure on those two) that's a good young group of players.

[daslicer]

He already looks like a good 3-D player. Don't know how good he can become but it looks like in the worst case scenario he's going to be a very good role player.

[SpursDynasty85]

I can't snap a good photo but from the looks of it he looks about an inch taller than DeMar. I could be wrong and he could be shorter. Just waiting for the perfect snapshot, since we'll never get accurate measurements.

This Vassell one above was a perfect one because he picked DeMar up from behind and the angle of the camera is good.

Keldon is not an inch taller than Demar. he is probably slightly shorter but about the same height.

[Degoat]

I honestly think Devin has a high ceiling, he just needs to bulk up some. The fact that he has been able to contribute so much without summer league or much training with the team is incredible.

[Dejounte]

Keldon is not an inch taller than Demar. he is probably slightly shorter but about the same height.

Probably true. I said it was a possibility.

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/demar-derozan-and-keldon-johnson-of-the-san-antonio-spurs-hug-after-a-picture-id1230443212?s=2048x2048

Something about Keldon's body makes him more suitable for bigger NBA positions than DeMar. Maybe because it's wider.

[John B]

Funny, he reminded me a little of Eddie Johnson (the one who played for the Kings and PHX), only with better defensive skills, when I first saw him play.

I like what he brings. He, Keldon and White (if he can get healthy) would give us a nice young core. If Walker and Murray can also reach their potential (not as sure on those two) that's a good young group of players.

Scottie Pippen for me. Devin will be a very good 2way player. Murray/Vassell/Keldon will be the next big 3. If Luka pans out, Spurs would be elite in a very long time.

[John B]

Sure hope he grows. It's rare though. We got lucky with Keldon growing.
These are younger kids now that are getting drafted, unlike before. Drob grew almost a foot in his senior year in high school.

[timvp]

Something about Keldon's body makes him more suitable for bigger NBA positions than DeMar.

Keldon's standing reach is 8-foot-8, which is what you'd expect from someone who is ~6-foot-8. The Spurs accounted for his short neck (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=280061) when they drafted him, interestingly.

[SpursDynasty85]

Probably true. I said it was a possibility.

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/demar-derozan-and-keldon-johnson-of-the-san-antonio-spurs-hug-after-a-picture-id1230443212?s=2048x2048

Something about Keldon's body makes him more suitable for bigger NBA positions than DeMar. Maybe because it's wider.

slightly on the upper body side but I figure Demar’s legs and positioning down there are much stronger than Keldon. Demar’s problem is he just doesn’t know how to defend well. Keldon long term at the four will wear him out. He is a SG/SF.

[John B]

Vassell is amazing. I know Derrick is hurt. But the kid needs this kind of minutes even when White gets back.
He's just so natural. Defense, he just knows where to go. He's not afraid to take 3pt shots.

This kid is a stud.

[r0drig0lac]

Vassell is amazing. I know Derrick is hurt. But the kid needs this kind of minutes even when White gets back.
He's just so natural. Defense, he just knows where to go. He's not afraid to take 3pt shots.

This kid is a stud.
54% 3PT

[Mugen]

His defense was legit tonight tbh.

[John B]

His defense was legit tonight tbh.
That steal off that pass to Davis under the basket, that was just knowing where to go. And there we several. The kid just has great defensive feel for the game.

[DAF86]

Vassell is amazing. I know Derrick is hurt. But the kid needs this kind of minutes even when White gets back.
He's just so natural. Defense, he just knows where to go. He's not afraid to take 3pt shots.

This kid is a stud.

There's really no reason to leave Vassell out of the rotation when White gets back.

Murray
Walker
DeRozan
Keldon
Aldridge

White
Mills
Vassell
Gay
Poeltl

Pretty straight forward, tbh. I don't know why Pop didn't play him the couple of games Derrick played.

[John B]

There's really no reason to leave Vassell out of the rotation when White gets back.

Murray
Walker
DeRozan
Keldon
Aldridge

White
Mills
Vassell
Gay
Poeltl

Pretty straight forward, tbh. I don't know why Pop didn't play him the couple of games Derrick played.

Maybe conditioning, but Vassell should've earned his minutes by the way he's playing. Great stuff.

[tim_duncan_fan]

If Devin works on his handle over the summer, it's over.

[XDT76]

That steal off that pass to Davis under the basket, that was just knowing where to go. And there we several. The kid just has great defensive feel for the game.

Yeah that was a great play don't see many player in the NBA doing that, even the commentator said that alot of play will just give up in that play.

[Sugus]

His defense was legit tonight tbh.

[Dejounte]

Those two key rebounds in the 4th.

He's got a nose for the ball.

[Atl Spur]

Dejounte and Devin has those go go gadget arms! I would love the lineup of DJ, Dev,KJ,DD,LA, bring Lonnie & White in to time kill a second team lineup.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I love what I’m seeing from the young man so far on the court.

[Ice009]

Yep, Devin may not be scoring a lot, but I like what he is doing out there on the court. He looks like he's going to be a very good player. Love what he does on the defensive side of the ball, and for me, defense always comes first, so I'll always likely be biased. Hopefully he works hard on his offense and becomes a great two-way player.

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1348408163389861890

[ginobilized]

Devin is so on point mentally and has such a nose for the ball and ability to read the defense.
It really is shocking how dialed in he is at this point in his career and in a more complex than average NBA system.
Really impressed with him.

[John B]

Devin is so on point mentally and has such a nose for the ball and ability to read the defense.
It really is shocking how dialed in he is at this point in his career and in a more complex than average NBA system.
Really impressed with him.
Scotie Pippen

[spurraider21]

lets see him average 5 ppg on higher than 40% shooting before sucking this guy's dick and calling him pippen :lol

[Gagnrath]

slightly on the upper body side but I figure Demar’s legs and positioning down there are much stronger than Keldon. Demar’s problem is he just doesn’t know how to defend well. Keldon long term at the four will wear him out. He is a SG/SF.

I don't like him as a combo sg/sf... Can he pull some minutes at 2 in some match-ups yeah but I see him more as a combo forward with more time and more match-ups at sf. Are there some PF match-ups that are bad for him? Yeah... But not that many in today's nba... Do I also think that his lower body and endurance will get built a bit over the next couple of years... Yeah I just hope he can keep his speed where it is. He has power but I don't want him to loose speed and would like to see a bit of finesse built. All power players wear out in a few years unless their name is James or Shaq.

[SpursDynasty85]

I don't like him as a combo sg/sf... Can he pull some minutes at 2 in some match-ups yeah but I see him more as a combo forward with more time and more match-ups at sf. Are there some PF match-ups that are bad for him? Yeah... But not that many in today's nba... Do I also think that his lower body and endurance will get built a bit over the next couple of years... Yeah I just hope he can keep his speed where it is. He has power but I don't want him to loose speed and would like to see a bit of finesse built. All power players wear out in a few years unless their name is James or Shaq.

Ill agree he is a SF. Can he play SG better than a traditional PF? I think so. Can he play the PF if we play small ball, sure. The best teams in the NBA will have a well-rounded squad with size and strength. He will more than likely be severely mismatched at the PF if he plays there. Some of the NBA will be playing small ball but ultimately the contenders will have their bigs just playing more like guards and punishing the smaller players.

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350124586801704960

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350120560605487104

[bluebellmaniac]

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350124586801704960

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350120560605487104

How do you add NEGATIVE offensive points? It can't be from allowing the other team to score, that would fall under Defensive Points Saved... WTF?

[bluebellmaniac]

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350124586801704960

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1350120560605487104

The trend line seems incredibly arbitrary. I can't imagine that an actual trend line would be so steep when most data points on the left side are UNDER it and on the right side there only 2 data points and they are WAY ABOVE it. SMH. Very biased graph, not rooted in math at all.

[Dejounte]

The trend line seems incredibly arbitrary. I can't imagine that an actual trend line would be so steep when most data points on the left side are UNDER it and on the right side there only 2 data points and they are WAY ABOVE it. SMH. Very biased graph, not rooted in math at all.

The DPS and OPA is likely based on a 48 minute scale.

DPS league best is probably +12, your y axis maximum. League worst is -26.
OPA league best is +26, your x axis maximum. League worst is -12.

Slope is then connected from both (max y, min x), (max x, min y) coordinates

[John B]

The DPS and OPA is likely based on a 48 minute scale.

DPS league best is probably +12, your y axis maximum. League worst is -26.
OPA league best is +26, your x axis maximum. League worst is -12.

Slope is then connected from both (max y, min x), (max x, min y) coordinates

Say what? :lol

[bluebellmaniac]

The DPS and OPA is likely based on a 48 minute scale.

DPS league best is probably +12, your y axis maximum. League worst is -26.
OPA league best is +26, your x axis maximum. League worst is -12.

Slope is then connected from both (max y, min x), (max x, min y) coordinates

Uh, yeah. That is exactly how you do NOT do a trend line. That isn't a trend line at all. Just some arbitrary line that they justified in drawing. Pretty meaningless. Doesn't give me much faith in the rest after knowing how they came up with the "trend" line, which is what you would assume it is.

[pad300]

The trend line seems incredibly arbitrary. I can't imagine that an actual trend line would be so steep when most data points on the left side are UNDER it and on the right side there only 2 data points and they are WAY ABOVE it. SMH. Very biased graph, not rooted in math at all.

That's not a trend line. It's there to indicate anyone above the line is a net positive player, anyone below it is a net negative...

[bluebellmaniac]

That's not a trend line. It's there to indicate anyone above the line is a net positive player, anyone below it is a net negative...

It doesn't indicate that either, mathematically it doesn't. Only using some arbitrary Maximum and Minimum values to create that line is not a valid way to determine who is a net positive player and net negative. I mean, if that is the definition you want to use, sure, that can mean that. But in reality it has no meaningful purpose in helping identify net positive and net negative players.

A waste of time to create, actually. And we are all dumber for having looked at it...

[Dejounte]

Uh, yeah. That is exactly how you do NOT do a trend line. That isn't a trend line at all. Just some arbitrary line that they justified in drawing. Pretty meaningless. Doesn't give me much faith in the rest after knowing how they came up with the "trend" line, which is what you would assume it is.

I didn't mean to say it was a trend line. I'm just saying that's how it kinda looks like.

[bluebellmaniac]

I didn't mean to say it was a trend line. I'm just saying that's how it kinda looks like.

I'm not blaming you, I'm just saying that NBA Math has nothing to do with math on that graph. And that line is misleading, for whatever purpose it serves. Unless it is meant to mislead, then it does a good job.

[pad300]

It doesn't indicate that either, mathematically it doesn't. Only using some arbitrary Maximum and Minimum values to create that line is not a valid way to determine who is a net positive player and net negative. I mean, if that is the definition you want to use, sure, that can mean that. But in reality it has no meaningful purpose in helping identify net positive and net negative players.

A waste of time to create, actually. And we are all dumber for having looked at it...

I really get the impression you don't understand the math he's doing (note, I am not endorsing this math, but this is what he's doing).

https://nbamath.com/tpa-model/

Essentially BPM (adjusted box -score plus minus) can be broken into defensive and offensive portion. It is then adjusted to make all the players compared on a per 100 possessions basis... that gives you DPS and OPA. Those added together give you TPA (which is the player's net +/- per 100 possessions on the floor) ... The diagonal line that bugs you is where TPA = 0, above that line TPA >0.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

When his shot starts going in he’ll be incredible. Very impressive.

[onechance87]

Its good hes getting this experience early

[LeBowen]

Considering that there was no SL and he got drafted just a couple of months before the season started, he's been nothing short of incredible of defense.
Amazing defensive IQ, great rotations, deflections and hustle. Also looks really good on the glass.
Definitely 1st team all-defense player in a couple of years.

His shot looks smooth, I think it's just a matter of confidence on offense. He still stops and just passes the ball away, probably scared of Pop yelling at him. :lol
Perfect SG/SF for the modern game.

Hopefully he still keeps his minutes when Derrick comes back.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Another solid game for the rookie.

he is consistently showing he is a legit NBA PLAYER.

[spurraider21]

defense comes so naturally to him, its really quite impressive for a rookie. scoring department needs some work though.

[Dejounte]

That block on Kanter was great. He showcased a Khris Middletonesque pull up J from mid-range in garbage time, too.

[spurraider21]

That block on Kanter was great. He showcased a Khris Middletonesque pull up J from mid-range in garbage time, too.
its a big ask for his offensive game to progress as well as Middleton's but that should definitely be the target

if anything he has a better shot coming out of college than middleton did

[Atl Spur]

This guy has it........a soft spoken KILLER! He is something to mold like Keldon/Kawhi

[Dejounte]

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/demar-derozan-of-the-san-antonio-spurs-looks-on-before-the-game-the-picture-id1230660905?s=2048x2048

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/the-against-the-san-antonio-spurs-look-on-before-the-game-against-the-picture-id1230660701?s=2048x2048

Hope this closes the book on who is taller between KJ and DV. Look at their shoulder height.

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/702692830741921792/G1V30-wC_normal.jpg
JeffGSpursZone JeffGSpursZone
(https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone) 1h (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1351347480995229696)
D. Vassell has now recorded 1 steal or more in 10 straight games for the Spurs. #nbahttps://abs.twimg.com/hashflags/NBALeague_2021/NBALeague_2021.png (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23nba) #gospursgo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23gospursgo)

[Dejounte]

its a big ask for his offensive game to progress as well as Middleton's but that should definitely be the target

if anything he has a better shot coming out of college than middleton did

Yup, this is the play I was talking about:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events/?GameEventID=618&GameID=0022000207&Season=2020-21&flag=1&title=MISS%20Vassell%2020%27%20Step%20Back%20Jump% 20Shot&sct=plot

Practice that shot over the offseason and we'll have a hell of a player.

[DAF86]

It doesn't indicate that either, mathematically it doesn't. Only using some arbitrary Maximum and Minimum values to create that line is not a valid way to determine who is a net positive player and net negative. I mean, if that is the definition you want to use, sure, that can mean that. But in reality it has no meaningful purpose in helping identify net positive and net negative players.

A waste of time to create, actually. And we are all dumber for having looked at it...

Dude, these formulas and graphs are created with the help of professional mathematicians. Are you one of those? If not, you should STFO, tbh. :lol

[BillMc]

Devin is the best looking Rookie since Kawhi.

[bluebellmaniac]

Dude, these formulas and graphs are created with the help of professional mathematicians. Are you one of those? If not, you should STFO, tbh. :lol

Oh good, professional mathematicians. Who are some of those who contributed?

Can't say? Then STFU, tbh ... LOL!

[John B]

Devin is the best looking Rookie since Kawhi.
Tbh if Vassell were getting the same minutes as rookie Kawhi, he will have better numbers. Rookie Kawhi while very good defensively, likewise Devin is, he was very timid in scoring, which is not the case for Vassell. Vassell is not shy to let them fly with hands in his face.

[exstatic]

Sean always talks about the development curve for a player when the game slows down for him. The game has been slow for Devin since game one. That’s what makes him unique. That is not the norm for a rookie.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Devin is the best looking Rookie since Kawhi.

Speaking of best looking, those are some nice additions to the signature, Bill. :tu

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351597612592472064

[Darius Bieber]

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351597612592472064

Rudy Gay being #2 is.... surprising

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351592049292812290

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351592050253299719

[Seventyniner]

tbh the Spurs' defense makes me want to pull my hair out sometimes, but the Spurs sit at 10th in (team) DRtg right now and if they finish the season there I would be quite pleased, especially considering last year's team was 25th in that metric.

I think some of the frustration comes from the fact that the league as a whole is more efficient on offense than in years past, so good defense relative to current league average can still look bad compared to past seasons. Last season was a record for overall ORtg (110.8), several points above the mid-100s from most of the 2010s.

[DAF86]

Oh good, professional mathematicians. Who are some of those who contributed?

Can't say? Then STFU, tbh ... LOL!

:lmao

Dude, stop bitching just to bitch. There's a reason these formulas are used and seen all around the globe and your opinion isn't, tbh. :lol

[DAF86]

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351597612592472064

The Marfan DemiGod up in this biatch!! :lol

[Chinook]

:lmao

Dude, stop bitching just to bitch. There's a reason these formulas are used and seen all around the globe and your opinion isn't, tbh. :lol

You're appealing to authority pretty hardcore. There are a lot of basketball stats, and some of them are definitely better than others. Like most folks basically ignore PER now, and it too was once a mathematical formula made by folks who are arguably way smarter than we are. Advanced stats often boil down to being mathematical opinions trying to quantify what the creators think are the most important aspects to playing the game. They can be disagreed with or ignored if they end up not being useful.

As far as why they are repeated, the folks who make (and more importantly, sell) stats market them just like any product. You can argue that the best plus-minus stat out there is old RAPM that's been around forever now, but that's cranked out by a stathead on like a Google sheet a few times a season. Stats like RPM, BPM and TPA often use RAPM as their standard to verify their calculations, but they are still way more easily circulated than their original because of how quickly they update and, more importantly, because they are owned by companies that have a vested interest in hyping their product through tweets and broadcast plug-ins.

Think PFF and SNF NFL games for an example.

[Chinook]

I'm not saying that to throw shade on Vassell, who I think is playing really well and would probably thrive as a starter rather than a bit player.

[DAF86]

You're appealing to authority pretty hardcore. There are a lot of basketball stats, and some of them are definitely better than others. Like most folks basically ignore PER now, and it too was once a mathematical formula made by folks who are arguably way smarter than we are. Advanced stats often boil down to being mathematical opinions trying to quantify what the creators think are the most important aspects to playing the game. They can be disagreed with or ignored if they end up not being useful.

As far as why they are repeated, the folks who make (and more importantly, sell) stats market them just like any product. You can argue that the best plus-minus stat out there is old RAPM that's been around forever now, but that's cranked out by a stathead on like a Google sheet a few times a season. Stats like RPM, BPM and TPA often use RAPM as their standard to verify their calculations, but they are still way more easily circulated than their original because of how quickly they update and, more importantly, because they are owned by companies that have a vested interest in hyping their product through tweets and broadcast plug-ins.

Think PFF and SNF NFL games for an example.

Did you read how the argument began? The dude is saying that the Cartesian axes used in those graphs are being just randomly put there. :lol

You can question the criteria used to come up with certain formulas all you want, but you can't question something as straighforward as Cartesian axes, tbh. :lol

[BillMc]

Speaking of best looking, those are some nice additions to the signature, Bill. :tu

Glad you approve my friend!:bobo

[Chinook]

Did you read how the argument began? The dude is saying that the Cartesian axes used in those graphs are being just randomly put there. :lol

You can question the criteria used to come up with certain formulas all you want, but you can't question something as straighforward as Cartesian axes, tbh. :lol

My bad. I went back and read it. BBM seems so invested in disagreeing with the implications of the graph that he's purposefully misunderstanding it.

[bluebellmaniac]

My bad. I went back and read it. BBM seems so invested in disagreeing with the implications of the graph that he's purposefully misunderstanding it.

No, I finally understood how it worked. Few people did because it wasn't explained simply. My comments to him are just based on him being rude and typical ST smacker. Still not sure I like it. It's simple, and has that going for it.

[John B]

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351592049292812290

https://twitter.com/N_Magaro/status/1351592050253299719
Whose Spurs record is Vassell about to break? Nephew?

[Fireball]

Rudy Gay at #2 ? :lol

[XDT76]

Whose Spurs record is Vassell about to break? Nephew?

Since they only start tracking in 16-17, it probably is DJM, since he is our only rookie with significant time.

[BackHome]

As soon as I saw Rudy on that list I was like OK meaningless stat lol

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/spurs/status/1352099820505333761

[spurraider21]

he's going to have to stop being a liability on offense though

[Degoat]

Pshhh liability on offense lol who on the team isn’t a liability

[John B]

This kid should start. The kid doesn't play like a rookie.

[BillMc]

Once Devin's jumper starts falling, starting should be a done deal.

[Atl Spur]

Year 1 no training camp........he will get the offense down!

[poopbox]

His offense will come in time...most guys who are good at defense right off the bat are terrible at offense...

Have you seen Thybulle in philly ? Great defender but offensively...yikes

[look_at_g_shred]

Bump

[look_at_g_shred]

Starting lineup should be
La
Ddr
Devin
KJ
Murray

Lonnie should be the go to scorer on the 2nd unit

[John B]

I'm a big fan of this kid. It's him I pretty much watch when he's out there. His defense if just solid, doesn't really gamble, but just stays in front of his guy. Great help defender.

[RC_Drunkford]

Starting lineup should be
La
Ddr
Devin
KJ
Murray

Lonnie should be the go to scorer on the 2nd unit

you forgot Derrick White. Other than that I pretty much agree with you

[timvp]

Can't wait to see Murray, White and Vassell defensive lineups :hungry:

[Spursfanfromafar]

Vassell is the only rookie to have a positive impact on both defense and offense in terms of RAPTOR rating (other than the Celtics' Peyton Prichard). And he leads all rookies in WAR and overall RAPTOR. Only Vassell, Gay and Murray (marginally) [Patty is also inching closer there] have net positive RAPTOR on both offense & defense among the Spurs. This kid is a gem.

Give the ratings a trawl to check that out - https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/nba-player-ratings/

[spurraider21]

Can't wait to see Murray, White and Vassell defensive lineups :hungry:
Then i have good news. The 2021-2022 season is just around the corner!

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/johnhollinger/status/1353680884034056193

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1353765830446616577

Anthony Edwards is so bad wow

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1353759789994528768

https://twitter.com/NBA_Math/status/1353759538789416960

[tdominate21]

Looks like The Natural is catching on quick. I think Pop see's it too. Pop is increasing his minutes, kind of like he did with Nephew his rookie year, as he starts to trust the player.

Vassell's first 9 games: 15mpg
Vassell's last 7 games: 23mpg

Vassell is looking like he has gained the trust of our coaches with no summer league and only playing in 16 games.

[John B]

Looks like The Natural is catching on quick. I think Pop see's it too. Pop is increasing his minutes, kind of like he did with Nephew his rookie year, as he starts to trust the player.

Vassell's first 9 games: 15mpg
Vassell's last 7 games: 23mpg

Vassell is looking like he has gained the trust of our coaches with no summer league and only playing in 16 games.

Whose minutes is he taking, can you see?

[PrimeMinister]

fun fact: When Devin Vassell wins DPOY in 2023 he will be the youngest to ever win the award, beating Alvin Robertson, Dwight Howard, and Michael Jordan. Good company.

[ace3g]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0x5AWx_3AM

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/AirlessJordan/status/1354564296022306817?s=19

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/1354583410136772609?s=19

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/tom_orsborn/status/1354585110570541057?s=19

[Obi Juan Kenobi]

Hopefully Devin's play has cemented him with the big league club and won't get sent down to the G-League now...

[exstatic]

Hopefully Devin's play has cemented him with the big league club and won't get sent down to the G-League now...

With white coming back, where will his minutes come from? Fifteen games in Orlando over 25 days won’t kill him or us, and could do him good, from an offensive development standpoint. If the baby Spurs miss the playoffs, he’d be back for pretty much the entire second half of the schedule.

[Obi Juan Kenobi]

With white coming back, where will his minutes come from? Fifteen games in Orlando over 25 days won’t kill him or us, and could do him good, from an offensive development standpoint. If the baby Spurs miss the playoffs, he’d be back for pretty much the entire second half of the schedule.

Yeah that sounds like a good plan...just don't want him buried there as has been the case with rookies past but like you said he should have plenty of time with the big league club later on this season...

[Dejounte]

If Devin continues to get more reps doing these:

https://www.nba.com/stats/events/?GameEventID=403&GameID=0022000296&Season=2020-21&flag=1&title=Vassell%2015%27%20Pullup%20Jump%20Shot%20(7% 20PTS)%20(DeRozan%207%20AST)&sct=plot

https://www.nba.com/stats/events/?GameEventID=583&GameID=0022000296&Season=2020-21&flag=1&title=Vassell%208%27%20Pullup%20Jump%20Shot%20(9%2 0PTS)%20(Mills%201%20AST)&sct=plot

Then we have our next Rip Hamilton/ Khris Middleton.

[JuneJive]

https://twitter.com/robeltussin/status/1355999518089687040?s=19

[cd021]

Starting lineup should be
La
Ddr
Devin
KJ
Murray

Lonnie should be the go to scorer on the 2nd unit
Probably tbh, though that would mean less Mills, Walker, and Gay with White eating up at least 25 mpg once he's fully healthy and Vassell getting decent minutes.

Murray, Vassell, KJ, DDR, LMA
Mills, White, Walker, Gay, Poeltl

Murray ~ 32 mpg
Mills ~ 20 mpg
Vassell ~ 20 mpg
White ~ 28 mpg
Johnson ~ 30 mpg
Walker ~ 18 mpg
DDR ~ 30 mpg
Gay ~ 18 mpg
LMA ~ 25 mpg
Poeltl ~ 23 mpg

[rankingtear]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5l8Jz-t8Fs

[Slippy]

This guy is going to be special on both ends . That shooting action with high release point is unstoppable. Doesnt matter if you get a hand in face. Hell get his shot.

Got benched for Lyles who gave nothing. Pop better remember that mistake.. hopefully the assistants remind him next game.

[Ice009]

This guy is going to be special on both ends . That shooting action with high release point is unstoppable. Doesnt matter if you get a hand in face. Hell get his shot.

Got benched for Lyles who gave nothing. Pop better remember that mistake.. hopefully the assistants remind him next game.

I still don't understand that. The Spurs needed defense and Pop played Lyles instead who did pretty much nothing out there. Why was he in over Vassell? Why was Mills also in instead of Keldon?

[The Truth #6]

I still don't understand that. The Spurs needed defense and Pop played Lyles instead who did pretty much nothing out there. Why was he in over Vassell? Why was Mills also in instead of Keldon?

I think the team was getting killed on the boards and Pop went with a big. But yeah, in general, I'd prefer Vassell instead. (I had modest hope that Lyles would have a better season, at least following up the end of his season last year with solid outside shooting, but that ship has passed.)

[exstatic]

I think the team was getting killed on the boards and Pop went with a big. But yeah, in general, I'd prefer Vassell instead. (I had modest hope that Lyles would have a better season, at least following up the end of his season last year with solid outside shooting, but that ship has passed.)

Yup. You had Poodle, Rudy, and Lyles on one unit. Definitely a move to put some size on the floor.

Not sure you can expect anything from Lyles when he’s played a grand total of 110 minutes. He goes weeks without entering a game. Something obviously radically changed from last year. He has a lot of things we need, good size, shot 39% from 3, is really good on the boards, and can switch effectively on D. He’s a better option than Rudy.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Yup. You had Poodle, Rudy, and Lyles on one unit. Definitely a move to put some size on the floor.

Not sure you can expect anything from Lyles when he’s played a grand total of 110 minutes. He goes weeks without entering a game. Something obviously radically changed from last year. He has a lot of things we need, good size, shot 39% from 3, is really good on the boards, and can switch effectively on D. He’s a better option than Rudy.

Lyles is just willing to disappear and not exert himself. Rudy's old and slow, but he's got a little bit of passion in his bones still. I'd be happy never seeing Lyles enter a game. When I saw him come off the bench against Memphis I knew we were going to lose. I basically quit watching at that point.

[John B]

Keldon, Vassell and DJ the next big 3. Wow and all 3 are elite 2way players too

[Atl Spur]

Keldon, Vassell and DJ the next big 3. Wow and all 3 are elite 2way players too

White is the manu of the group....... hopefully Lonnie gets consistent

[spurraider21]

Keldon, Vassell and DJ the next big 3. Wow and all 3 are elite 2way players too
in what universe is vassell elite on offense?

[John B]

in what universe is vassell elite on offense?
Okay will be.. man give this fan a break :lmao

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I still don't understand that. The Spurs needed defense and Pop played Lyles instead who did pretty much nothing out there. Why was he in over Vassell? Why was Mills also in instead of Keldon?

i agree he shouldn’t have given Lyles so many minutes but he put him in over Devin because we were giving up offensive rebounds and points in the paint.

he should’ve rolled with Devin though.

[exstatic]

Lyles is just willing to disappear and not exert himself. Rudy's old and slow, but he's got a little bit of passion in his bones still. I'd be happy never seeing Lyles enter a game. When I saw him come off the bench against Memphis I knew we were going to lose. I basically quit watching at that point.

If you consider chucking shots to be passion, then yeah, Rudy’s got it. I’m not sure taking shots away from our developing cadre of young players is either a good current or future strategy. He’s only mediocre with on the ball on D, and is as bad as LMA on switches, and he really only shot well from 3 his first year.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

If you consider chucking shots to be passion, then yeah, Rudy’s got it. I’m not sure taking shots away from our developing cadre of young players is either a good current or future strategy. He’s only mediocre with on the ball on D, and is as bad as LMA on switches, and he really only shot well from 3 his first year.

I'd much rather see the young guys over Rudy. But I can say the same for LMA and Mills...in spite of Mills' strong shooting. I don't put Trey Lyles in the same classification as our young core. He was a scrap heap signing who happened to work out. At the end of the day, though, I still see Lyles as highly expendable.

[exstatic]

I'd much rather see the young guys over Rudy. But I can say the same for LMA and Mills...in spite of Mills' strong shooting. I don't put Trey Lyles in the same classification as our young core. He was a scrap heap signing who happened to work out. At the end of the day, though, I still see Lyles as highly expendable.

He’s a better shooter, defender, and rebounder than Rudy, but I guess Pop feels the same way you do.

[ezau]

Perhaps it's time to start Vassell over LW. Vassell can be effective without the ball in his hands while Walker just looks lost out there.

[Ice009]

Perhaps it's time to start Vassell over LW. Vassell can be effective without the ball in his hands while Walker just looks lost out there.

I'm all for benching Lonnie. I believe Derrick White should be starting and finishing games. This is not the big three where you can bring a star like Manu off the bench when you have a Megastar Tim Duncan starting and an All-Star Tony Parker also starting. The current team needs all the talent it can get in the starting lineup. If he doesn't want to start D-White, then I'd also be happy with Vassell starting, but either way, I think Lonnie has lost that starting spot. He's done nothing to show that he should keep it. He's had two great games when Demar has been out, but apart from those two great games, he's been average to above average the rest of them IMO.

[buttsR4rebounding]

I'm all for benching Lonnie. I believe Derrick White should be starting and finishing games. This is not the big three where you can bring a star like Manu off the bench when you have a Megastar Tim Duncan starting and an All-Star Tony Parker also starting. The current team needs all the talent it can get in the starting lineup. If he doesn't want to start D-White, then I'd also be happy with Vassell starting, but either way, I think Lonnie has lost that starting spot. He's done nothing to show that he should keep it. He's had two great games when Demar has been out, but apart from those two great games, he's been average to above average the rest of them IMO.

I think Lonnie has been a net negative in most games. Heck, Mills is playing better defense than IV. His 2 games w/o DDR allowing him to tease us and then his subsequent return to background noise is all the more reason to bring him off the bench. See if more time without DDR on the floor allows him to play more aggressively. If he shines in the role for an extended period then you either trade Lonnie with his value high if you think you are going to re-sign DDR or if not, then trade DDR.

[John B]

I’m for starting White over Lonnie. 1. To fix the slow start. Spurs have been terrible in the 1st and 3rd quarters and the insertion of White as another creator and scorer could remedy that. 2. Lonnie doesn’t deserve to start, or could find his mojo back with the 2nd unit where he is expected to score more.

[look_at_g_shred]

Pop should try this SL out:
Jak
DDR
Vassell
White
Murray

Bench:
LMA
Lyles
KJ
Lonnie
Mills

[RC_Drunkford]

White has to start, he used to guard the opponents best player in 2018/19, would improve our defense a lot. Pop can just stagger him and DJ so 1 of them is always out there. They should both play 30 minutes.

[exstatic]

Pop should try this SL out:
Jak
DDR
Vassell
White
Murray

Bench:
LMA
Lyles
KJ
Lonnie
Mills

I wouldn’t hate it, but it’s even smaller than our current SL.

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1358835590519791617

[ginobilized]

And how about the windmill dunk?!?!?!

He's such a smart and talented player.

[BillMc]

I think Lonnie has been a net negative in most games. Heck, Mills is playing better defense than IV. His 2 games w/o DDR allowing him to tease us and then his subsequent return to background noise is all the more reason to bring him off the bench. See if more time without DDR on the floor allows him to play more aggressively. If he shines in the role for an extended period then you either trade Lonnie with his value high if you think you are going to re-sign DDR or if not, then trade DDR.

This. And even those two big offensive games for Lonnie (without DDR) his defense was still bad. I haven't seen anything from him this season that makes me think he should in the starting lineup.

[LurkingSpursFan]

LMA will start to maintain whatever trade value he has.

[RC_Drunkford]

I think Lonnie has been a net negative in most games. Heck, Mills is playing better defense than IV. His 2 games w/o DDR allowing him to tease us and then his subsequent return to background noise is all the more reason to bring him off the bench. See if more time without DDR on the floor allows him to play more aggressively. If he shines in the role for an extended period then you either trade Lonnie with his value high if you think you are going to re-sign DDR or if not, then trade DDR.

I laughed at the fact that he said he's a "defensive stopper". His defense is bad most of the times. I like that his 3-point shot is the most consistent out of the young guys, but White starting would improve the D a lot and Lonnie could score more coming off the bench

[spurraider21]

lonnie is easily the most frustrating player on the roster right now

[DAF86]

Pop needs to start trusting this guy more. On nights where he has it going like tonight, he needs to finish the games off. A shot maker on one end and elite defense on the other.

[spurraider21]

Pop needs to start trusting this guy more. On nights where he has it going like tonight, he needs to finish the games off. A shot maker on one end and elite defense on the other.
still wish he'd shoot more. 4 FGA in 20 minutes is too passive

[Blackhaus]

still wish he'd shoot more. 4 FGA in 20 minutes is too passive

I agree, he could easily take 4 or 5 shots away from Patty and Gay instead of deferring. Hes got great pace and plays so under control for his inexperience. Loving his in-between game too.

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/702692830741921792/G1V30-wC_normal.jpg
JeffGSpursZone JeffGSpursZone
(https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone) 1h (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1360259987906457604)
Vassell says he still hasn't explored San Antonio due to the pandemic. Says he orders steak from a place near La Cantera in San Antonio for delivery. #GoSpursGo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GoSpursGo)

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/702692830741921792/G1V30-wC_normal.jpg
JeffGSpursZone JeffGSpursZone
(https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone) 2h (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1360260207822196738)
Vassell says his parents moved to San Antonio #GoSpursGo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GoSpursGo)

[JuneJive]

He a pro.

On and off the court.

Big get for the club.

[NASpurs]

I wonder if he’s going to start tonight and Lonnie and White come off the bench.

[John B]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/702692830741921792/G1V30-wC_normal.jpg
JeffGSpursZone (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone)Jeff (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=1013)GSpursZone
1h (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1360259987906457604)
Vassell says he still hasn't explored San Antonio due to the pandemic. Says he orders steak from a place near La Cantera in San Antonio for delivery. #GoSpursGo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GoSpursGo)

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/702692830741921792/G1V30-wC_normal.jpg
JeffGSpursZone (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone)Jeff (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=1013)GSpursZone
2h (https://twitter.com/JeffGSpursZone/status/1360260207822196738)
Vassell says his parents moved to San Antonio #GoSpursGo (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GoSpursGo)

Good family guy. No uncle coming, i hope.

[rjv]

Good family guy. No uncle coming, i hope.

amen to that.

[NASpurs]

I wonder if he’s going to start tonight and Lonnie and White come off the bench.

It was fun while it lasted, maybe next year or every b2b :lol

1360365225657196545

[Dejounte]

It was fun while it lasted, maybe next year or every b2b :lol

1360365225657196545

“He did a good job,” Popovich said. “I love him in every game.”

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/spurs/article/Rookie-Devin-Vassell-receives-praise-from-Spurs-15940527.php

I don't remember ANY rookie Pop has said this about. That's ridiculous.

I wouldn't count it out that he doesn't win that starting job for good this season.

[tim_duncan_fan]

This guy needs more playing time and shots.

[Degoat]

This guy needs more playing time and shots.

DWhite is my boy, one of my favorite players on the team but a part of me wishes Devin started along Murray and Keldon

[paperboy77]

I sure hope this guy gets some run. I feel tho that his career might go the route of Corey Brewer. Brewer had some potential and for whatever reason everyone gave up on him.

[paperboy77]

DWhite is my boy, one of my favorite players on the team but a part of me wishes Devin started along Murray and Keldon


"Like"

[BackHome]

I was hoping he would get some G League burn where they would tell him they want him to take 15 to 20 shots and be very aggressive on the offensive side. I think that was one of the knocks on him on his draft profile in that he defers to much don't want him to go all Patty on us but also don't want him to be another Poodle.

Either way I really like the pick and look forward to his development he has the same characteristics that DJ and Keldon have in wanting to be the best they can be and more then willing to put in the hard work to make it happen.

[daslicer]

I was hoping he would get some G League burn where they would tell him they want him to take 15 to 20 shots and be very aggressive on the offensive side. I think that was one of the knocks on him on his draft profile in that he defers to much don't want him to go all Patty on us but also don't want him to be another Poodle.

Either way I really like the pick and look forward to his development he has the same characteristics that DJ and Keldon have in wanting to be the best they can be and more then willing to put in the hard work to make it happen.

I think the worst case scenario for him is that he will be a Trevor Ariza/Danny Green type of player. I can't project the best case scenario for him.

[Spurtacular]

Haven't seen him play. All I know is ST'ers are super excited about a guy averaging 5.6 ppg and shooting 40 FG.

[tim_duncan_fan]

He's already about as good as Danny. Lateral quickness on D may be an issue against elite players one-on-one, but it looks like he may be able to improve his dribble and put points on the board easier than Danny could. And he doesn't seem phased when the team needs a timely 3.

[Spurtacular]

Okay, just give him all of Lyles's minutes, tbh.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cxd1-iKuEsQ

[J_Paco]

Haven't seen him play. All I know is ST'ers are super excited about a guy averaging 5.6 ppg and shooting 40 FG.

Watch the actual game then cause he's been a lot better than his raw numbers indicate.. He's been about as good as a rookie can be with so many guys in front of him, no Summer League and a truncated training camp/preseason.

He's everything folks wanted in Matisse Thybulle but younger (20 compared to 24) & with more offensive upside.

[exstatic]

Watch the actual game then cause he's been a lot better than his raw numbers indicate.. He's been about as good as a rookie can be with so many guys in front of him, no Summer League and a truncated training camp/preseason.

He's everything folks wanted in Matisse Thybulle but younger (20 compared to 24) & with more offensive upside.

Pay no attention to him. Just a little attention whore trying to stir things up.

[PrimeMinister]

Okay, just give him all of Lyles's minutes, tbh.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cxd1-iKuEsQ

He goes top 5 if there’s a tournament, easily.

[Mr. Body]

FSU players are super intriguing right now. Leonard Hamilton is turning out multi-dimensional, position-less players that have a a lot of promise. Scottie Barnes is fantastic for them right now, with so many tools, would be absolutely perfect in our 4 slot. Too bad he'll go too high.

[timtonymanu]

Remember when sniffers said tanking last year wasn’t smart cause they wouldn’t find good talent anyways with a high pick. Vassell has been nice.

[NASpurs]

Remember when sniffers said tanking last year wasn’t smart cause they wouldn’t find good talent anyways with a high pick. Vassell has been nice.

Which is contradictory if sniffers believe that the PATFO have a great eye in evaluating players.

[cjw]

Remember when sniffers said tanking last year wasn’t smart cause they wouldn’t find good talent anyways with a high pick. Vassell has been nice.

After Lamelo and Wiseman, you can argue Vassell is in that next group of guys and would have gone top 5 as some have mentioned with a tournament under his belt.

The Spurs could have gotten a high lottery on a late lottery contract. It’s a meaningful difference to the Spurs’ benefit.

[exstatic]

Remember when sniffers said tanking last year wasn’t smart cause they wouldn’t find good talent anyways with a high pick. Vassell has been nice.

We didn’t tank last year. We were in the playoff hunt until game 7 of the 8 game Bubble ended, and busted ass the whole time. You just destroyed your own tanking argument by showing that we could get top talent without doing so.

[timtonymanu]

We didn’t tank last year. We were in the playoff hunt until game 7 of the 8 game Bubble ended, and busted ass the whole time. You just destroyed your own tanking argument by showing that we could get top talent without doing so.

They may not have intentionally tanked, but they played like a lottery team all of last season. And they still ended up in the lottery. What are you smoking?

Also my original point was talking about posters who said the Spurs wouldn't find talent in the lottery because it was a weak draft so getting swept by the Lakers in the first round was more ideal for some people. :lol

[exstatic]

They may not have intentionally tanked, but they played like a lottery team all of last season. And they still ended up in the lottery. What are you smoking?

Also my original point was talking about posters who said the Spurs wouldn't find talent in the lottery because it was a weak draft so getting swept by the Lakers in the first round was more ideal for some people. :lol

Tanking is intentionally losing to improve draft position. What are you smoking? Lottery=/=tanking. If DJ doesn’t make 1 stupid play at the end of the first bubble loss, we’re in the play-in game.

[Degoat]

Neither one of y’all are wrong lol should the spurs have tanked last season? Yeah, but with the roster they had with so many vets they were never going to do so... it was we either try to make the playoffs or we settle with a mid lottery pick, luckily it looks like we got a hit with Vassell

[Spurtacular]

Pay no attention to him. Just a little attention whore trying to stir things up.

GFY

[Spurtacular]

He goes top 5 if there’s a tournament, easily.

Don't know enough to support or refute this. But it does appear that people are correct in saying it's a weak draft class, so maybe.

[Spurtacular]

Remember when sniffers said tanking last year wasn’t smart cause they wouldn’t find good talent anyways with a high pick. Vassell has been nice.

They were right. And if the Spurs don't take him @ 11 he appears to go at past 15. Spurs could've got a high pick and traded DeRozan or something for a trade that includes a mid first.

[Spurtacular]

Watch the actual game then cause he's been a lot better than his raw numbers indicate.. He's been about as good as a rookie can be with so many guys in front of him, no Summer League and a truncated training camp/preseason.

He's everything folks wanted in Matisse Thybulle but younger (20 compared to 24) & with more offensive upside.

He appears to be a solid rotation player. We'll have to see if he can be more.

[Dejounte]

https://youtu.be/jrQ5QnA24Og

kid needs to link up with Keldon’s dietician/ trainer. He’s still very skinny.

great personality though

[exstatic]

https://youtu.be/jrQ5QnA24Og

kid needs to link up with Keldon’s dietician/ trainer. He’s still very skinny.

great personality though

Think closer to DeJounte. Everyone can put on some muscle and bulk up. Everyone just can’t do it to the same extent. DJ was a twig when we drafted him, and now he has enough bulk to absorb contact, and get a good shot up at the rim.

[Dejounte]

CQl6gZdsFK4

click the right arrow.

i hope he works on his shot creation and handles. His pull up J is money. He could conceivably force White to the bench. He generates points easily with how pure his shot is.

[Mr. Body]

CQl6gZdsFK4

click the right arrow.

i hope he works on his shot creation and handles. His pull up J is money. He could conceivably force White to the bench. He generates points easily with how pure his shot is.

There's no way White should go to the bench. He's the only playmaker on the team.

[ginobilized]

CQl6gZdsFK4

click the right arrow.

i hope he works on his shot creation and handles. His pull up J is money. He could conceivably force White to the bench. He generates points easily with how pure his shot is.

He had a great 1st season, all things considered. I expect big things down the road from him. Season 2 will be a major step, I predict. He's getting used to the NBA life, all the adjustments, travel and physical demands.
Devin obviously has a solid head on his shoulders and is going to put in the work. I think he can be a very effective player without adding much bulk. Later in his career or if he is matching up with SFs, then maybe sooner than later.
Still, there is a place for skilled, heady wings in the league. Being really good at basketball can negate the need for excess bulk. I see him as that type. Pippenesque.

[spurraider21]

CQl6gZdsFK4

click the right arrow.

i hope he works on his shot creation and handles. His pull up J is money. He could conceivably force White to the bench. He generates points easily with how pure his shot is.
"he generates points easily"

averaged 11.6 points per 36 on 40.6% shooting

[slick'81]

"he generates points easily"

averaged 11.6 points per 36 on 40.6% shooting

:rollin

[Dejounte]

"he generates points easily"

averaged 11.6 points per 36 on 40.6% shooting

I don’t like Vassell that much to go through why I said this lmao. If you don’t think so— oh well

[Atl Spur]

I don’t like Vassell that much to go through why I said this lmao. If you don’t think so— oh well

I to agree his skill set will allow him in the future to generate points easily.

[spurraider21]

cant believe people are saying he had a "great" rookie season :lol

im not calling him a bust but he was disappointing as a rookie, particularly on offense. and while he was solid on defense he wasn't exactly dominant on that end, at not enough to offset his poor offense

[John B]

cant believe people are saying he had a "great" rookie season :lol

im not calling him a bust but he was disappointing as a rookie, particularly on offense. and while he was solid on defense he wasn't exactly dominant on that end, at not enough to offset his poor offense

Pop doesn’t normally play rookies. That said, Devin got enough game for Pop to play him, likewise Tre. I would say “seeing the floor” as a rookie with the Spurs great :lol

I think he would be a better lockon defender than any of our guys. DJ gambles too much for a steal. And Spurs championship team always had an Elliot, a Bowen and Green and Kawhi. Vassell could be it. He’s long and takes pride on a great defense.

[koriwhat]

I was impressed with Devin considering how we've treated 1st/2nd yr players in the past. He has the skillset but needs more time on the court and I think next season he'll get that time to play.

[Degoat]

cant believe people are saying he had a "great" rookie season :lol

im not calling him a bust but he was disappointing as a rookie, particularly on offense. and while he was solid on defense he wasn't exactly dominant on that end, at not enough to offset his poor offense

Compared to the other youngins on the spurs he had a great rookie season

[KobesAchilles]

cant believe people are saying he had a "great" rookie season :lol

im not calling him a bust but he was disappointing as a rookie, particularly on offense. and while he was solid on defense he wasn't exactly dominant on that end, at not enough to offset his poor offense
Yeah the dude never recovered after Covid. You can’t really blame it on fatigue either since he got 2 weeks off. But his shooting fell off a cliff. His defense sucked to at the end of the year and he became unplayable. He has a long long way to go but he shows flashes where maybe he can be a very useful player 3 years from now.

That said, if flashes were all it took then Lonnie would be all NBA

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/spursDJLW/status/1411174346001899522

[PhantomDashCam]

Thought that was Tre Jones at first in the B/G (34 second mark), but think it’s actually Raquan Jeffries.

Summer League should be exciting with Vassell, Luka, Raquan and Tre J all hopefully committing.
Then you throw in 2 rooks, lots to like.

[Dejounte]

Thought that was Tre Jones at first in the B/G (34 second mark), but think it’s actually Raquan Jeffries.

Summer League should be exciting with Vassell, Luka, Raquan and Tre J all hopefully committing.
Then you throw in 2 rooks, lots to like.

You mean Daquan Jeffries? No, that's not him. It's not a Spurs player. He looks like a friend or a staffer.

[PhantomDashCam]

You mean Daquan Jeffries? No, that's not him. It's not a Spurs player. He looks like a friend or a staffer.

Yeah my bad. Had been watching film recently of Raiquan Gray for the draft, must of slipped the ‘R’ in there.
You’re right. Definitely not him. Maybe it is this illusive Raquan I’ve been talking about :lol

[tim_duncan_fan]

Between this guy, Lonnie, and Derrick — if Derrick's hurt ass even plays significant time — I need 18 3PA per game next season.

[Mr. Body]

He'll make a pretty good jump this year. Didn't even get camp last year.

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/SanAntonioFC/status/1413683456626790405

https://twitter.com/spurs/status/1413683352415182848

https://twitter.com/spurs/status/1413682638817316864

Special guest appearance by RC Buford...

[ace3g]

CRcCPPBsG5P

[SAGirl]

https://twitter.com/SanAntonioFC/status/1413683456626790405


https://twitter.com/spurs/status/1413683352415182848


https://twitter.com/spurs/status/1413682638817316864


Special guest appearance by RC Buford...

wow Vassell looks like an old man here. At least 10 years older than he is, maybe it’s glare making him scrunch his face, but he’s already wrinkling up. Sunscreen meet face.

[TDMVPDPOY]

this guy is still behind the pecking order on the roster, team needs to start pushing the younger players more minutes or they will find it elsewhere on another team

[GAustex]

It would be nice if he defended better
Take and make shots better
Be a secondary ball handler and play maker better

[CGD]

I really like this kid and hope he’s a Spurs for a long time.

[John B]

I’m rooting for this kid to have even more opportunities next season. I really like him to be our next 3andD ball stopper with his length. Great kid.

[mo7888]

I’m rooting for this kid to have even more opportunities next season. I really like him to be our next 3andD ball stopper with his length. Great kid.

I am too... I have pretty high expectations for Devin..

[Ditty]

I thought he started off playing really good defense especially help side wise before covid. After he came back he was nothing special defensively. That game against Phoenix gave me some confidence that he be a really good player. Hopefully he can be our Mikal Bridges.

[jbspurs]

I thought he started off playing really good defense especially help side wise before covid. After he came back he was nothing special defensively. That game against Phoenix gave me some confidence that he be a really good player. Hopefully he can be our Mikal Bridges.


It's tough for a player to be consistent without playing time. Last season, he had good games only to be benched on their next game. Pop plays too much mind games...

[Atl Spur]

It's tough for a player to be consistent without playing time. Last season, he had good games only to be benched on their next game. Pop plays too much mind games...

Mental toughness must be cultivated......it’s a skill set.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Needs to get stronger and work on his creativity with the ball.

The 3 will come.

[NASpurs]

uzIuhTeEF_A

[NASpurs]

Step backs, floaters, a dunk, 3s, etc.

3-and-D player :lol

[John B]

My favorite player of the team, while I’m rooting a lot for Lonnie and Primo. Also if Keldon expand his game, this team becomes a playoff team.

But other than that, Devin is potentially the best complete player with his length as lockdown defender, and smooth shooting, as great scorer. He could very well be our best lockdown defender. It would eventually mean putting Derek to 6th man. But right now, I’m liking what Lonnie/Devin can do leading the 2nd unit.