Spurs Shopping Aldridge and DeRozan

[GAustex]

Lol hitching your wagon to DDR. We’ve seen how that ends.
Sure he has been playing good and I am happy for that cause I root for the jersey.
Spurs ain’t getting better with him. And they may get worse w/o him.
It’s time to move on
He ain’t worth what he makes

[Sugus]

I think people are confusing things. Yes, DD is playing well for us, but he isn’t a changed player. He still the guy people wanted off the team THIS recent summer. What’s different? Dejounte has made a leap, Keldon is solid, Yak is doing great and the TEAM is doing better. DD is a part of that, obviously. And I have changed my mind about him. But I won’t panic if he leaves. He’s still a complicated and at times frustrating player.

I share your view. On the one hand, DeRozan has inarguably upped his game this season, he's playing by far the best and most consistent ball of his career, being an excellent floor general, and just a main cog for this Spurs team. Having been on the Trade DeRozan At All Costs bandwagon, I can safely say now that the Spurs will get worse if they lose him, and that given the internal growth and chemistry the team exhibits now, trading him away for anything other than a king's ransom is not something I'd look forward right now.

It's not the end of the world if he leaves in FA, and the Spurs have seen a lot of their young players take a step forward to the point that his production could be replaced, maybe not entirely, but close enough, in a year or two. But also, vet leadership on the hand of a player who's as consistent as DeMar, who is a real distributor and doesn't ball-hog, instead letting the young players grow, isn't easy to come by - and especially hard for a small-market team like the Spurs. I'd go as far as to say that, between getting Collins in FA and losing DD, and retaining DD but not getting Collins at a Max price tag.... I'd rather keep DeMar at this point. Maybe some recency bias after Collins' awful play in that Hawks game :lol but it's still true.

So overall, I'm pretty neutral on the issue. Which, ironically, speaks volumes about how much better DeRozan has gotten on the Spurs, since I leant pretty heavily to one side before this season/the Bubble.

[cjw]

I don't think Luka is ready to start at the 4, so I'd imagine most of their focus is finding another 4 in FA i.e. Collins or Markkanen. If they strike out then they could shift Johnson up to the four and play Vassell along with Poeltl, White, and Murray.

Technically, that lineup is about the same size as the normal SL this season but White replacing Walker and KJ replacing DDR.

They might re-sign Mills, bring back Lyles for depth, otherwise they might not use much cap unless they agree to take back bad salary in exchange for picks.

This is where I am. It’s a really good place to be - a young core that’s a borderline top 20 team without being supplemented at all (that’s a good thing), and the flexibility to use that space in a bunch of different ways that either improve the ceiling or invest even more in the future. And no future draft picks going out the door.

Issue is others will have ample cap space too this offseason and there aren’t a lot of difference-makers to go around. I don’t want to bring in anyone that’s just going to be a logjam for the young core.

Assuming they’re done with Aldridge after this year, which is probably the case unless he comes back for 2 years and $25mm-ish, 4/5 will be the biggest hole by far. Ideally you’d get someone who can play 5 in a pinch. I also don’t think Luka is ready to start at the 4, but needs minutes next year.

[Sugus]

Lol hitching your wagon to DDR. We’ve seen how that ends.
Sure he has been playing good and I am happy for that cause I root for the jersey.
Spurs ain’t getting better with him. And they may get worse w/o him.
It’s time to move on
He ain’t worth what he makes

Well, your prerogative is wrong, since the Spurs are getting visibly better with DeRozan at the helm. Much as you might dislike his game, most Spurs fans (me included, tbh) came into the season with that mindset, bracing for a losing, tanking even, season, yet we're 5th in the West right now and would be fighting for a good playoff seed if COVID didn't fuck the team over. The young players stepping up is a big part of it, but they wouldn't get nearly the same shot opportunities without DeMar distributing the ball like he does; and while I personally don't think he can ever be "the guy" on a true championship contender, it doesn't mean that he can't foster a good and growing group of young players for a couple years, and be a mentor for them, until they're ready to take the next step. Personally, except for Murray and maybe White, I don't see other young players on the Spurs ready to be "thrown into the fire".

Now, contract length/amount is a different discussion entirely, and I agree I wouldn't want him back if it meant a deal like Hayward got. But he's certainly worth his game for a price, and it's a higher price than most posters in SpursTalk (all stuck in pre-2016 contracts and cap numbers, apparently) think of.

[KobesAchilles]

I mean we are a game and a half from the 8th seed and Dallas and Memphis are playing well again. I like our chances though and if LMA does come off the bench that solves a lot of problems. It means that Lonnie can just focus on jacking up shots, and both Murray and KJ get to eat as well. Also White and LMA have really good chemistry together so that will play a big role too. Gay, Vasell, White, Mills, and LMA is a very fearsome bench unit

[GAustex]

It will be interesting to see how it plays out. He may not even want to hang in Central Texas. I would prefer to see the young ones go for it as they defer to DDR for the short term gain but maybe the long term detriment/lack of development.

And we will see if my “prerogative” is right or not as the story is still playing out. I do admit DDR has been a pleasant surprise this year with his play.

[BillMc]

LMA goes from potentially washed up starter to one of the best backup bigs in the leage, one who can explode on offense when his knees are feeling good. If he'll accept the role, keep him. We're not going to get much for him, anyway

[The Truth #6]

I share your view. On the one hand, DeRozan has inarguably upped his game this season, he's playing by far the best and most consistent ball of his career, being an excellent floor general, and just a main cog for this Spurs team. Having been on the Trade DeRozan At All Costs bandwagon, I can safely say now that the Spurs will get worse if they lose him, and that given the internal growth and chemistry the team exhibits now, trading him away for anything other than a king's ransom is not something I'd look forward right now.

It's not the end of the world if he leaves in FA, and the Spurs have seen a lot of their young players take a step forward to the point that his production could be replaced, maybe not entirely, but close enough, in a year or two. But also, vet leadership on the hand of a player who's as consistent as DeMar, who is a real distributor and doesn't ball-hog, instead letting the young players grow, isn't easy to come by - and especially hard for a small-market team like the Spurs. I'd go as far as to say that, between getting Collins in FA and losing DD, and retaining DD but not getting Collins at a Max price tag.... I'd rather keep DeMar at this point. Maybe some recency bias after Collins' awful play in that Hawks game :lol but it's still true.

So overall, I'm pretty neutral on the issue. Which, ironically, speaks volumes about how much better DeRozan has gotten on the Spurs, since I leant pretty heavily to one side before this season/the Bubble.

Totally. 100%.

[The Truth #6]

LMA goes from potentially washed up starter to one of the best backup bigs in the leage, one who can explode on offense when his knees are feeling good. If he'll accept the role, keep him. We're not going to get much for him, anyway

I’m hesitant to disagree with you about anything ever because I appreciate the photographs you post, but has LMA shown he is great off the bench? I’m being literal. He played well recently in that one game but is there a larger trend of that?

[Leetonidas]

I’m hesitant to disagree with you about anything ever because I appreciate the photographs you post, but has LMA shown he is great off the bench? I’m being literal. He played well recently in that one game but is there a larger trend of that?

LMA hadn't come off the bench since his rookie season, so no. I have a hard time believing he will accept that role going forward though

[BillMc]

I’m hesitant to disagree with you about anything ever because I appreciate the photographs you post, but has LMA shown he is great off the bench? I’m being literal. He played well recently in that one game but is there a larger trend of that?

I can't argue that it's a larger trend, only that I'm hopeful it is. He's getting on by NBA standards and maybe he's accepting it.

Glad you like the sig. :bobo

[Dejounte]

The primary reason I ever wanted DeMar to leave was to make way for Keldon to develop. Now that Keldon is getting all the minutes in the world, I don't mind DeMar as much. Sure, Keldon is probably playing out of position but maybe the Spurs address that by getting a starting PF this offseason and Keldon comes off the bench for DeMar. That may be shocking to hear coming from a HUGE Keldon fan, but after seeing Poeltl deservingly supplant LMA as the starting C, I think I'm open to letting Keldon earn DeMar's spot by becoming CLEARLY better than him(shooting, passing, dribbling, everything). This is all on the condition that Keldon plays the same amount of minutes he's getting now coming off the bench.

Now if Keldon still plays the 4 next season, I wouldn't mind that either. Playing time is playing time and I don't think playing the 4 stunts his growth at all.

[TD 21]

Maybe a package including Iggy, Olynyk, Achiuwa and a 1st* for DDR and Eubanks.

(* could be 1-5 and 16-30 protected in 2023, 2024, and 2025 otherwise it becomes 2 future seconds)

Why would the Heat do that when they're a prime free agent destination, with the cap space to conceivably sign DeRozan outright in the off season? Oladipo, said to be interested in signing with them, is a better fit with Butler and Adebayo because of his three-point shooting.

[Dejounte]

The primary reason I ever wanted DeMar to leave was to make way for Keldon to develop. Now that Keldon is getting all the minutes in the world, I don't mind DeMar as much. Sure, Keldon is probably playing out of position but maybe the Spurs address that by getting a starting PF this offseason and Keldon comes off the bench for DeMar. That may be shocking to hear coming from a HUGE Keldon fan, but after seeing Poeltl deservingly supplant LMA as the starting C, I think I'm open to letting Keldon earn DeMar's spot by becoming CLEARLY better than him(shooting, passing, dribbling, everything). This is all on the condition that Keldon plays the same amount of minutes he's getting now coming off the bench.

Now if Keldon still plays the 4 next season, I wouldn't mind that either. Playing time is playing time and I don't think playing the 4 stunts his growth at all.

Forgot to add:

The other reason was what people have already mentioned here-- his style of play. In years past, the offense would be ALL ABOUT DeMar and I hated it for player development. This year, it's been much less of that and it may be due to the fact that he has seen his teammates' growth and he (or Pop) has willingly given the green light for other guys to share the playmaking/shot-creating duties. I heavily disagree that he's been like this the whole season... Kobe-mode DeMar shows up every now and then and anyone with a pair of eyes has seen that, no matter what statistics you throw out on here. BUT, selfless-DeMar has shown up way more than selfish-DeMar this season. That's just a fact.

[Leetonidas]

I have a good memory...when murray got stripped twice from pat Bev, ppl completely gave up on him and wanted forbes to be our starting of...saying stuff like he is similar to curry

You talking about a random comment in a game thread from the beginning of last year? :lol come on son, you and I both know thats BS. No one on this forum ever said Forbes was better than White/Murray. If you can find one i'll gladly eat crow but i can almost guarantee that phrase has only been typed in this thread :lol

[Leetonidas]

also i dont know whats more ridiculous - people on ST saying Forbes is better than White/Murray or claiming people on here were comparing him to Steph Curry .... :lmao i have seen plenty of posters comment on the fact that Forbes THINKS he is Steph Curry, which is not even close to the same thing

[KingKev]

The primary reason I ever wanted DeMar to leave was to make way for Keldon to develop. Now that Keldon is getting all the minutes in the world, I don't mind DeMar as much. Sure, Keldon is probably playing out of position but maybe the Spurs address that by getting a starting PF this offseason and Keldon comes off the bench for DeMar. That may be shocking to hear coming from a HUGE Keldon fan, but after seeing Poeltl deservingly supplant LMA as the starting C, I think I'm open to letting Keldon earn DeMar's spot by becoming CLEARLY better than him(shooting, passing, dribbling, everything). This is all on the condition that Keldon plays the same amount of minutes he's getting now coming off the bench.

Now if Keldon still plays the 4 next season, I wouldn't mind that either. Playing time is playing time and I don't think playing the 4 stunts his growth at all.


I’d like to see DDR back at the 2 with Keldon at the 3 if we were able to get a legit PF

[Dejounte]

also i dont know whats more ridiculous - people on ST saying Forbes is better than White/Murray or claiming people on here were comparing him to Steph Curry .... :lmao i have seen plenty of posters comment on the fact that Forbes THINKS he is Steph Curry, which is not even close to the same thing

It was Pop who went on record to compare Forbes to Curry, then people here used that quote by Pop as a running joke to make fun of Pop... somehow, duncan2k5 twisted THAT into thinking people here actually thought Forbes was comparable to Stephen Curry...

The direct quote:

https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/938563132628365313

P.S. I'm pretty sure Pop was being facetious when he made that remark.

[Mal]

What's the offers ? Spurs are playoff team right now...

[Leetonidas]

It was Pop who went on record to compare Forbes to Curry, then people here used that quote by Pop as a running joke to make fun of Pop... somehow, duncan2k5 twisted THAT into thinking people here actually thought Forbes was comparable to Stephen Curry...

The direct quote:

https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/938563132628365313

P.S. I'm pretty sure Pop was being facetious when he made that remark.

:lol definitely sounds like he's been sarcastic which makes ducan2k5 confusing this for STers loving Forbes even funnier

[BackHome]

I am not getting to vested in Derozz or LMA because even if we want them they still might bolt so I will just enjoy this season and will see what happens. I guess the same can be said for Rudy and Mills and Lyles it is going to be an interesting off season for the Spurs on figuring out who they want to offer new contracts to.

Either way in draft I am still down taking the best player available when ever we pick

[cd021]

Why would the Heat do that when they're a prime free agent destination, with the cap space to conceivably sign DeRozan outright in the off season? Oladipo, said to be interested in signing with them, is a better fit with Butler and Adebayo because of his three-point shooting.

They could just sign him outright, though they're looking at missing the playoffs, a play-in scenario, or a very low seed this season after making the Finals last season. The pressure is on for them to try and improve. Not only that, but having him on the team ahead of FA gives them a leg-up on re-signing him.

As for why DeMar, they've been linked to him for a while now. His fit is a bit sketchy with Butler, considering neither really take 3's and neither does Bam but if their interest is real then they must have an idea for how to incorporate him.

If there is a deal to be made between the Spurs and the Heat then altering the protections on a first that they already owe is a way to entice the Spurs into dealing DDR, as well as keeping them from giving up another young player like Robinson in a deal. Its still unlikely, but if true, then they might have enough assets, after all, to be make a deal.

[MultiTroll]

Make it end already.
This is making my head hurt.

Trade LMA. Get on with the future.

[cd021]

They’re not going to give us that lottery pick to rent DeRozan for a few months.


Exactly,
The market for either is not there. I don't see a single contender, or team who thought they were a contender entering the season who would give up assets for a few months rental.

Calling it a rental seems a bit misleading. Miami could gauge whether DeRozan is amenable to re-signing long-term. I'm sure he would be considering--it's Miami, both the city and the team and the Heat have rep for paying their players. If he doesn't seem interested, then no dice, of course.

[duncan2k5]

Lol hitching your wagon to DDR. We’ve seen how that ends.
Sure he has been playing good and I am happy for that cause I root for the jersey.
Spurs ain’t getting better with him. And they may get worse w/o him.
It’s time to move on
He ain’t worth what he makes

Seriously...it's crazy how his good games vs bad teams in the regular season make ppl want to keep him...he won't make us win...not will we be able to build upon an identity because he needs the ball in his hands to be effective...he strung toronto fans along for a decade by having great regular season games vs bad and mediocre teams, but laid an egg in playoffs and big games...now he is older in a tougher conference...can't shoot threes, can't play off ball, can't defend, and we wanna build around him? Lol

[duncan2k5]

Well, your prerogative is wrong, since the Spurs are getting visibly better with DeRozan at the helm. Much as you might dislike his game, most Spurs fans (me included, tbh) came into the season with that mindset, bracing for a losing, tanking even, season, yet we're 5th in the West right now and would be fighting for a good playoff seed if COVID didn't fuck the team over. The young players stepping up is a big part of it, but they wouldn't get nearly the same shot opportunities without DeMar distributing the ball like he does; and while I personally don't think he can ever be "the guy" on a true championship contender, it doesn't mean that he can't foster a good and growing group of young players for a couple years, and be a mentor for them, until they're ready to take the next step. Personally, except for Murray and maybe White, I don't see other young players on the Spurs ready to be "thrown into the fire".

Now, contract length/amount is a different discussion entirely, and I agree I wouldn't want him back if it meant a deal like Hayward got. But he's certainly worth his game for a price, and it's a higher price than most posters in SpursTalk (all stuck in pre-2016 contracts and cap numbers, apparently) think of.

Ur in for a world of heartbreak this season...this has been Demars story every season...he has mad much better seasons than this...legit all star seasons...it always ends in an epic flameout...it's not like he goes down beasting...many times he IS the reason his team loses

[Teamduncan21]

Ur in for a world of heartbreak this season...this has been Demars story every season...he has mad much better seasons than this...legit all star seasons...it always ends in an epic flameout...it's not like he goes down beasting...many times he IS the reason his team loses

its about will we even make the playoff without derozan. And what is the alternative. Spurs is obviously considering trading him. But the trade is supposed to make the team better. Not trading for the sake of it. So the idea is how we can transition to the future (murray keldon someone from free agent etc) without needing to tank.

its obvious we are not building around him. In fact spurs dont have a strong identity as of now. Not really a superstar to build around. Its about having someone to keep us afloat until we can find someone to build around.

I dont think spurs wants to tank.

[duncan2k5]

its about will we even make the playoff without derozan. And what is the alternative. Spurs is obviously considering trading him. But the trade is supposed to make the team better. Not trading for the sake of it. So the idea is how we can transition to the future (murray keldon someone from free agent etc) without needing to tank.

its obvious we are not building around him. In fact spurs dont have a strong identity as of now. Not really a superstar to build around. Its about having someone to keep us afloat until we can find someone to build around.

I dont think spurs wants to tank.

It's not about tanking...it's about moving in the right direction quicker...I think getting rid of him for assets will cause us to target players that can fit better with an identity we want to cultivate...I think having him here slows that down... for example if the warriors didn't get rid of David Lee (perceived as the CLEARLY better player at the time) Draymond Green would have still been a non-factor, and the warriors would have never won that ring...Steph would not have won mvp... sometimes u have to move on from a player you KNOW won't make u better in the long run, even if it means a few more short term losses

[duncan2k5]

You talking about a random comment in a game thread from the beginning of last year? :lol come on son, you and I both know thats BS. No one on this forum ever said Forbes was better than White/Murray. If you can find one i'll gladly eat crow but i can almost guarantee that phrase has only been typed in this thread :lol

"forbes ceiling is either steph curry or the shitter curry"
U said u would eat crow if I find one... but I bet u will just dismiss it...I keep telling y'all I have been right with many things I said...y'all just don't like me so u will never admit when I'm right...

[tonight...you]

"forbes ceiling is either steph curry or the shitter curry"
U said u would eat crow if I find one... but I bet u will just dismiss it...I keep telling y'all I have been right with many things I said...y'all just don't like me so u will never admit when I'm right...
Just find one. I'm now curious.


Edit: And you've been cool in my book.

[Teamduncan21]

It's not about tanking...it's about moving in the right direction quicker...I think getting rid of him for assets will cause us to target players that can fit better with an identity we want to cultivate...I think having him here slows that down... for example if the warriors didn't get rid of David Lee (perceived as the CLEARLY better player at the time) Draymond Green would have still been a non-factor, and the warriors would have never won that ring...Steph would not have won mvp... sometimes u have to move on from a player you KNOW won't make u better in the long run, even if it means a few more short term losses

it a gamble. Curry so happened to work out. Of course if we see potential curry in our young guys. Why not. But it can be like sixers trading igoudala for bynum and ended up with a 4 year tanking plan. Spurs is small market. We cant lose for 4 years like lakers and magically get lebron.
so its balancing trading derozan and getting the right assets. Trading derozan for a worse asset risks the team losing for multiple years.

so my take is derozan trade will happen if spurs can get a good asset out of it. If not then it will depends how much will other teams pay derozan. I doubt spurs want to overpay him on a very long deal

[Leetonidas]

"forbes ceiling is either steph curry or the shitter curry"
U said u would eat crow if I find one... but I bet u will just dismiss it...I keep telling y'all I have been right with many things I said...y'all just don't like me so u will never admit when I'm right...

Where's the link?

[Dejounte]

Where's the link?

Even if the post is real, there's a lot of stupid people on this board who post a lot of stupid shit. Anyone who posted that back then was likely ridiculed back then and for duncan2k5 to take it seriously and hold onto it like a grudge 3-4 years later is fucking idiotic.

[Joseph Kony]

i found the post, it's actually from TDMVPDPOY :lmao


forbes ceiling is either steph curry or the shitter curry

[Leetonidas]

:lol I mean I guess that counts but you really had to search for that shit didn't you

That post is also from the beginning of the 2018 season before anyone realized how terrible he really was

[Joseph Kony]

some of the other posts in that thread are pretty funny also :lol. here's a good one


I’m sold with DD/Forbes/Dante/Gay/LA lineup, and staggering DD/Gay/LA with the 2nd unit. Please no Forbes/Mills/Belli/Bertans/Gasol lineup. I mean really?

:lmao

[John B]

some of the other posts in that thread are pretty funny also :lol. here's a good one



:lmao

Fuck you stalker!! :lol:lol:lol

[Sugus]

i found the post, it's actually from TDMVPDPOY :lmao

That retard's been crazy quiet ever since Dejounte's ascension... Or was it some other player he had a random hate boner against...? :lol

[Sugus]

Ur in for a world of heartbreak this season...this has been Demars story every season...he has mad much better seasons than this...legit all star seasons...it always ends in an epic flameout...it's not like he goes down beasting...many times he IS the reason his team loses


Eh, I'm not emotionally invested in DeMar at all so it's not hearbreak that I might feel. I don't doubt that DD has had better statistical seasons, but right now, you're witnessing the absolute pinnacle of his game: he's managed to balance his masterful scoring arsenal, with a pass-first mentality that helps him set the rest of the team up, and take it slow until it's time for the show. You can love or hate it, but I at least appreciate that we're getting the very best year out of a very good player. He might never take us to a ring or whatever, but I never had that expectation in the first place... I'm just coming along for the ride.

And for the record, I still dislike DD going hero-ball in late, close games. One of the "conditions" I'd have for him coming back, would be for him to increasingly give the ball to the youngings in those kinds of situations - they'll probably lose more games than DeMar would in their place, but it's much-needed experience, and they have to fail at it before they excel.

[Ice009]

Seriously...it's crazy how his good games vs bad teams in the regular season make ppl want to keep him...he won't make us win...not will we be able to build upon an identity because he needs the ball in his hands to be effective...he strung toronto fans along for a decade by having great regular season games vs bad and mediocre teams, but laid an egg in playoffs and big games...now he is older in a tougher conference...can't shoot threes, can't play off ball, can't defend, and we wanna build around him? Lol

I know you guys trash Duncan2k5 a lot, but there is a lot of truth to what he's saying. This game against a team that is likely to make the finals shows Demar's flaws and weaknesses quite clearly. He seems to play great against shit teams and that makes people think he's a really good to great player, but in the end, without a three point shot, he's just too limited when going up against the upper echelon teams. He ends up playing like this all the time against the best teams and usually in the playoffs when the big games come around, this is the Demar you get. That's exactly why the Raptors had no problem trading him for Kawhi. Kawhi wasn't the most clutch playoff player in 2015 and 2016 (I think he choked those two years, but even then, I'd still take him over Demar any day of the week). Kawhi showed a lot more in the 2017 playoffs than Demar ever has, and I think that was enough for the Raptors to move on from him and take Kawhi without even thinking twice about it.

I will give Demar some credit, though, as it does seem like he's a great player to help build up a young team in the early stages, but if/when that team starts to mature and is looking like it can start contending, then that's the time you gotta let Demar go. He can take you to the point of contention, but then will bring you back down due to his limitations. He really needed to work on a three point shot, and Aldridge really needed to lose weight and be more mobile. Both have go no-one to blame but themselves if they have to leave and sign for a lot less money than they expected. It's all on them.

[Dejounte]

I know you guys trash Duncan2k5 a lot, but there is a lot of truth to what he's saying. This game against a team that is likely to make the finals shows Demar's flaws and weaknesses quite clearly. He seems to play great against shit teams and that makes people think he's a really good to great player, but in the end, without a three point shot, he's just too limited when going up against the upper echelon teams. He ends up playing like this all the time against the best teams and usually in the playoffs when the big games come around, this is the Demar you get. That's exactly why the Raptors had no problem trading him for Kawhi. Kawhi wasn't the most clutch playoff player in 2015 and 2016 (I think he choked those two years, but even then, I'd still take him over Demar any day of the week). Kawhi showed a lot more in the 2017 playoffs than Demar ever has, and I think that was enough for the Raptors to move on from him and take Kawhi without even thinking twice about it.

I will give Demar some credit, though, as it does seem like he's a great player to help build up a young team in the early stages, but if/when that team starts to mature and is looking like it can start contending, then that's the time you gotta let Demar go. He can take you to the point of contention, but then will bring you back down due to his limitations. He really needed to work on a three point shot, and Aldridge really needed to lose weight and be more mobile. Both have go no-one to blame but themselves if they have to leave and sign for a lot less money than they expected. It's all on them.

People don't shit on duncan2k5 because he's"right" or he's "wrong". They shit on him because he's loud and obnoxious.

Also, majority of people recognize DeMar's flaws and I don't know anyone who actually wants to build a team around him. Again, keeping him doesn't mean building around him. To duncan2k5, everything is black and white and nothing else. Literally no one is saying DeMar will lead us to championships, but that's how it is in his twisted mind.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

A Duncan2k5 post is a painful, yet highly predictable read.

[jehawk81]

A Duncan2k5 post is a painful, yet highly predictable read.

Yup.. funny thing is that D2k5 is pretty much the DeMar Derozan of SpursTalk.. the dude's probably a cool fella but his takes can be very annoying & frustrating

[R. DeMurre]

I think people are confusing things. Yes, DD is playing well for us, but he isn’t a changed player. He still the guy people wanted off the team THIS recent summer. What’s different? Dejounte has made a leap, Keldon is solid, Yak is doing great and the TEAM is doing better. DD is a part of that, obviously. And I have changed my mind about him. But I won’t panic if he leaves. He’s still a complicated and at times frustrating player.




It's not the end of the world if he leaves in FA, and the Spurs have seen a lot of their young players take a step forward to the point that his production could be replaced, maybe not entirely, but close enough, in a year or two. But also, vet leadership on the hand of a player who's as consistent as DeMar, who is a real distributor and doesn't ball-hog, instead letting the young players grow, isn't easy to come by - and especially hard for a small-market team like the Spurs. I'd go as far as to say that, between getting Collins in FA and losing DD, and retaining DD but not getting Collins at a Max price tag.... I'd rather keep DeMar at this point. Maybe some recency bias after Collins' awful play in that Hawks game :lol but it's still true.

So overall, I'm pretty neutral on the issue. Which, ironically, speaks volumes about how much better DeRozan has gotten on the Spurs, since I leant pretty heavily to one side before this season/the Bubble.


The primary reason I ever wanted DeMar to leave was to make way for Keldon to develop. Now that Keldon is getting all the minutes in the world, I don't mind DeMar as much. Sure, Keldon is probably playing out of position but maybe the Spurs address that by getting a starting PF this offseason and Keldon comes off the bench for DeMar. That may be shocking to hear coming from a HUGE Keldon fan, but after seeing Poeltl deservingly supplant LMA as the starting C, I think I'm open to letting Keldon earn DeMar's spot by becoming CLEARLY better than him(shooting, passing, dribbling, everything). This is all on the condition that Keldon plays the same amount of minutes he's getting now coming off the bench.


I can't help noticing that even the guys who are (sort of) standing up for DeRozan are still awfully lukewarm on him. I'd think a true positive force for this team would be much more enthusiastically embraced. I get the takes some have on him, and I'd impressed by his improvement with regards to distribution & assist numbers, but I still think the Spurs move towards being contenders faster without him than with him.

[ezau]

I can't help noticing that even the guys who are (sort of) standing up for DeRozan are still awfully lukewarm on him. I'd think a true positive force for this team would be much more enthusiastically embraced. I get the takes some have on him, and I'd impressed by his improvement with regards to distribution & assist numbers, but I still think the Spurs move towards being contenders faster without him than with him.

Kawhi isn't walking through that door again, son. Move on.

[rankingtear]

Duncan2k5 posts like a bot. Are we sure he isn't one?

[daslicer]

I know you guys trash Duncan2k5 a lot, but there is a lot of truth to what he's saying. This game against a team that is likely to make the finals shows Demar's flaws and weaknesses quite clearly. He seems to play great against shit teams and that makes people think he's a really good to great player, but in the end, without a three point shot, he's just too limited when going up against the upper echelon teams. He ends up playing like this all the time against the best teams and usually in the playoffs when the big games come around, this is the Demar you get. That's exactly why the Raptors had no problem trading him for Kawhi. Kawhi wasn't the most clutch playoff player in 2015 and 2016 (I think he choked those two years, but even then, I'd still take him over Demar any day of the week). Kawhi showed a lot more in the 2017 playoffs than Demar ever has, and I think that was enough for the Raptors to move on from him and take Kawhi without even thinking twice about it.

I will give Demar some credit, though, as it does seem like he's a great player to help build up a young team in the early stages, but if/when that team starts to mature and is looking like it can start contending, then that's the time you gotta let Demar go. He can take you to the point of contention, but then will bring you back down due to his limitations. He really needed to work on a three point shot, and Aldridge really needed to lose weight and be more mobile. Both have go no-one to blame but themselves if they have to leave and sign for a lot less money than they expected. It's all on them.

That's pretty much how I view Demar. He's not a guy to build a championship team around but he's the guy who will help you to develop your young players. Once your players are developed that's when you dump him.

[R. DeMurre]

Kawhi isn't walking through that door again, son. Move on.

Has nothing to do with Kawhi whatsoever. Not sure where you got that.

[Ice009]

People don't shit on duncan2k5 because he's"right" or he's "wrong". They shit on him because he's loud and obnoxious.

Also, majority of people recognize DeMar's flaws and I don't know anyone who actually wants to build a team around him. Again, keeping him doesn't mean building around him. To duncan2k5, everything is black and white and nothing else. Literally no one is saying DeMar will lead us to championships, but that's how it is in his twisted mind.

I haven't been around much the past season or so, as it took me a while to get over the Kawhi fiasco (I watched most of the games the first season after he left, but sort of had a hangover last season and didn't want to watch many of the games), however, I made a concerted effort to try and watch every single Spurs game this season because I really did like the potential of some of the young guys. I guess it started with Derrick White and Dejounte in the first season Kawhi left/was traded, and I've liked the draft picks since then too, so I wanted to start watching every single game again. It was also the first time in my life since I became a Spurs fan in '93/'94 where I didn't follow every single game (I couldn't start watching games until 2004 in my country, but before then I followed every game online in some form or another - 90% of the time live). Maybe I also needed a break from Basketball as I was so into it during the D-Rob/TD era and what I thought was going to be the Kawhi era (I also think it's a good thing that I've been able to step back and realize there is other more important stuff. I still love basketball, though, especially when it's played the right way like the Spurs try to).

Anyway, I digress, so back to the topic at hand. I just haven't been around much the past season/season and a half prior to this one to follow Duncan2K5s posts, so I'll take your word on it for the reasons everyone keeps crapping on him. I just thought his points in that post were really accurate and that is what I've thought the past year or two about DeMar now that I've had a good enough look/handle on his game and mental makeup/temperament in tight/big games.


That's pretty much how I view Demar. He's not a guy to build a championship team around but he's the guy who will help you to develop your young players. Once your players are developed that's when you dump him.

I didn't think this before, but seeing how some of these young players are playing now, I looked back at the Raptors and where they were when he left. I really do think DeMar had a pretty big hand in helping some of these young guys get better and become better players, but I think that is the endpoint with him as a leader/player to build your team around. If you want to go any further, he's not the guy to take you there as a number one option. I'm not even sure if he's best suited as a 2nd or 3rd option on a Championship level team. I am leaning towards 3rd option. His lack of three point shot is a killer and really holds him back. These past few years in SA, he really should have made a huge effort to add one to his game. It's all on him for not doing so.

[daslicer]

I haven't been around much the past season or so, as it took me a while to get over the Kawhi fiasco (I watched most of the games the first season after he left, but sort of had a hangover last season and didn't want to watch many of the games), however, I made a concerted effort to try and watch every single Spurs game this season because I really did like the potential of some of the young guys. I guess it started with Derrick White and Dejounte in the first season Kawhi left/was traded, and I've liked the draft picks since then too, so I wanted to start watching every single game again. It was also the first time in my life since I became a Spurs fan in '93/'94 where I didn't follow every single game (I couldn't start watching games until 2004 in my country, but before then I followed every game online in some form or another - 90% of the time live). Maybe I also needed a break from Basketball as I was so into it during the D-Rob/TD era and what I thought was going to be the Kawhi era (I also think it's a good thing that I've been able to step back and realize there is other more important stuff. I still love basketball, though, especially when it's played the right way like the Spurs try to).

Anyway, I digress, so back to the topic at hand. I just haven't been around much the past season/season and a half prior to this one to follow Duncan2K5s posts, so I'll take your word on it for the reasons everyone keeps crapping on him. I just thought his points in that post were really accurate and that is what I've thought the past year or two about DeMar now that I've had a good enough look/handle on his game and mental makeup/temperament in tight/big games.



I didn't think this before, but seeing how some of these young players are playing now, I looked back at the Raptors and where they were when he left. I really do think DeMar had a pretty big hand in helping some of these young guys get better and become better players, but I think that is the endpoint with him as a leader/player to build your team around. If you want to go any further, he's not the guy to take you there as a number one option. I'm not even sure if he's best suited as a 2nd or 3rd option on a Championship level team. I am leaning towards 3rd option. His lack of three point shot is a killer and really holds him back. These past few years in SA, he really should have made a huge effort to add one to his game. It's all on him for not doing so.

I have talked to Raptor fans on other message boards but they have said he was huge in the development of Vanvleet,Siakam, and the other young guys on their team. Vanvleet mentioned the other day in an interview when he scored over 50 plus points that Demar would always pushed him to be better and encourage him. He has an effect on younger guys. He genuinely wants to see them do well. You can see that with the way Dejounte,Keldon talk about him. Especially how Dejounte always defends him online. He's a good guy to have around young players. He's good at being mentor towards young guys and also creates an environment for them to succeed. Those things are very underrated in the league. I don't hold it against him for not being a good 3 point shooter. I do believe he has tried to get better at it. Not everybody can get better at it like Kawhi did. It took Jason Kidd until his mid 30's to get good at 3 point shooting and Kidd had a great work ethic. Commend Demar on becoming a great playmaker with the Spurs. His assist turnover ratio has been amazing this year.

On a title team he would be the third option. He's good for the Spurs right now until Dejounte,Keldon,White can take the next step to becoming all-star caliber players.

[mo7888]

I think DDR is a role player but he plays an important role. I don't think he can lead a team to a championship but, I do think he can be part of a championship team as a the 3rd best player on a team. As for the Spurs, ddr has done a good job bringing our young guys along and that should be commended. Going forward I'm fine with keeping him and I'm fine with letting him go or trading him, it just depends on what we want to do as an organization. Do we strictly want to develop these kids and hope for one to develop into a high level star or do we want to cash in two or three and trade for a star? If we go development then we won't need ddr after this year but, we should realize that the only guys on the roster with true 'star' talent are Lonnie, Luka, and possibly Keldon (with a ton of work on his shot) and all of them have a ways to go to become that. The trading route would include packaging White, Lonnie, or Keldon with picks for a top end talent to pair with ddr (think Beal or someone similar).

In either case, the young guys have developed so well that we need to make a decision on a direction by the draft. We've got enough cap space and contracts large enough (white $17M/year or Murray $16M/year) to attach with picks to make a strong offer for any top player that becomes tradeable.

[KingKev]

I think DDR is a role player but he plays an important role. I don't think he can lead a team to a championship but, I do think he can be part of a championship team as a the 3rd best player on a team. As for the Spurs, ddr has done a good job bringing our young guys along and that should be commended. Going forward I'm fine with keeping him and I'm fine with letting him go or trading him, it just depends on what we want to do as an organization. Do we strictly want to develop these kids and hope for one to develop into a high level star or do we want to cash in two or three and trade for a star? If we go development then we won't need ddr after this year but, we should realize that the only guys on the roster with true 'star' talent are Lonnie, Luka, and possibly Keldon (with a ton of work on his shot) and all of them have a ways to go to become that. The trading route would include packaging White, Lonnie, or Keldon with picks for a top end talent to pair with ddr (think Beal or someone similar).

In either case, the young guys have developed so well that we need to make a decision on a direction by the draft. We've got enough cap space and contracts large enough (white $17M/year or Murray $16M/year) to attach with picks to make a strong offer for any top player that becomes tradeable.

I’m pretty confident Walker IV and Luka will never be stars. I agree with alot of what yiu say above at some point developing all these mid to late first round picks becomes excessive. Only so many minutes to go around. Now is a good time to explore moving a young player or two and some picks for the next disgruntled star, I’d just prefer to keep DJ, Keldon and Vassel if I had to choose.

[Ice009]

I’m pretty confident Walker IV and Luka will never be stars. I agree with alot of what yiu say above at some point developing all these mid to late first round picks becomes excessive. Only so many minutes to go around. Now is a good time to explore moving a young player or two and some picks for the next disgruntled star, I’d just prefer to keep DJ, Keldon and Vassel if I had to choose.

Would you rate Bradley Beal as a star? He's one player I am very interested in getting. What do you guys think of Beal? Would he be worth it, and/or would the price be too steep? I think the Clippers tried to get him before getting Paul George, and I think they would have been a better team if they were able to trade for him instead. I mean, on paper Paul George is the more logical choice when the best players in the NBA right now are SF/PF hybrids, but I still think Beal is a better player than PG. I don't know, PG could prove me wrong these playoffs, but I've never been impressed with him come playoff time (despite his playoff failures, I was still a fan of PG until these previous playoffs, as I like his overall game and keep thinking he'll turn a corner, but last year's playoffs have made me to start doubting he'll reach his full potential. I guess we will see this time around).

[jjktkk]

Where's the link?Its a secret.:lol

[mo7888]

I’m pretty confident Walker IV and Luka will never be stars. I agree with alot of what yiu say above at some point developing all these mid to late first round picks becomes excessive. Only so many minutes to go around. Now is a good time to explore moving a young player or two and some picks for the next disgruntled star, I’d just prefer to keep DJ, Keldon and Vassel if I had to choose.

One thing for clarity... I'm not predicting Lonnie or Luka will be stars... I'm just saying they are the only ones we have with the physical traits to reach that level.... to actually do it requires a mentality and work ethic that we haven't seen(and may never see)

[The Truth #6]

DDR can’t be the only alpha on the team. I’m ok with Dejounte taking some of that responsibility, especially when DDR goes cold and gets frustrated.

[mo7888]

Would you rate Bradley Beal as a star? He's one player I am very interested in getting. What do you guys think of Beal? Would he be worth it, and/or would the price be too steep? I think the Clippers tried to get him before getting Paul George, and I think they would have been a better team if they were able to trade for him instead. I mean, on paper Paul George is the more logical choice when the best players in the NBA right now are SF/PF hybrids, but I still think Beal is a better player than PG. I don't know, PG could prove me wrong these playoffs, but I've never been impressed with him come playoff time (despite his playoff failures, I was still a fan of PG until these previous playoffs, as I like his overall game and keep thinking he'll turn a corner, but last year's playoffs have made me to start doubting he'll reach his full potential. I guess we will see this time around).

Beal would be a prime candidate to go after. The cost would depend on two things 1) how bad would he want out and 2) what other teams that were after him would offer. Most top teams can't make competitive offers (Philly is the exception). I think in the West Nola would be strong competition because they have draft capital and he fits. I think a strong starting offer for us would be something like White + Lonnie + our 1st.

[rankingtear]

Beal would be a prime candidate to go after. The cost would depend on two things 1) how bad would he want out and 2) what other teams that were after him would offer. Most top teams can't make competitive offers (Philly is the exception). I think in the West Nola would be strong competition because they have draft capital and he fits. I think a strong starting offer for us would be something like White + Lonnie + our 1st.

Closer to the Harden haul than what you are proposing.

[KingKev]

Beal would be a prime candidate to go after. The cost would depend on two things 1) how bad would he want out and 2) what other teams that were after him would offer. Most top teams can't make competitive offers (Philly is the exception). I think in the West Nola would be strong competition because they have draft capital and he fits. I think a strong starting offer for us would be something like White + Lonnie + our 1st.

Two firsts min seems to be the precedence. I’d consider trades around some combo of Walker, White, Sammy an expiring vet not named DDR and two firsts for the likes of Beal, Lavine, KAT.

[exstatic]

Two firsts min seems to be the precedence. I’d consider trades around some combo of Walker, White, Sammy an expiring vet not named DDR and two firsts for the likes of Beal, Lavine, KAT.

Not Lavine. He’s not in that group. Beal and KAT are head and shoulders above him.

[PrimeMinister]

Two first rounders, 2 rotation players, and a prospect with high potential for an assortment of players that have shown they are capable of being the best players on bottom dwelling teams

You really think mortgaging our entire future for a player of Lavine or Towns caliber leaves us in any better position than the wolves or bulls are in now?

did we think these trade scenarios through at all or do we just want the instant gratification of something “new” so badly that we’re willing to just sell a kidney for it

[venitian navigator]

what is the actual market value of our next to be free agents?

Let's try some numbers...in the wiew of our player's value for other teams

DDR..............difficult to say, in a dry market having no 3 point shot for a guard/wing is a big minus.....I don't see a team offering max but I'd say anything from 15 to 30 a year depending on the team

LMA.............bad season till now but worth consideration for his offensive ability and his past................No way near his last contract but I'd say anything from min. to mid level depending on the team

Gay............good season till now but too old............................................... .................................................. ...................................I'd say the same things said for LMA

Lyles..........no playing time till now, but good behavior and at least decent production for the minutes played........................................I'd say from minimum to max 6/7 millions

Mills..........decent/good season till now for his capabilities, but because of his defense he's an obvious liability.......................................I' d say anything from 5/6 millions to the mid level

different thoughts?

[MultiTroll]

I have not been smoking crack. I really want this LMA speculation to go away, move forward with the young core and stop this silly Grandpa and Aldridge growth hinderance.
Lonzo Ball.

Since the rest of the NBA is fully aware of how Aldridge has been in decline since 2016 and is now in full decline thus the PATFO are not going to buffalo anyone, just keeping the expectation level real:

"Since the start of February, he has been throwing flames: 45.9 percent from 3 on 8.1 attempts per game. That is the highest percentage in the league at that volume over that span. If you lower the attempts baseline to 6.5 per game, the list of guys over 45 percent expands to Jamal Murray, George, LaVine and Joe Harris. These are some of the best shooters in the world. Ball hasn't just improved his 3-point shooting; he's become an actual marksman."

To which you will respond we already have Walker, DJ etc.
Could we then flip Ball for a team that needs him?

[mo7888]

Closer to the Harden haul than what you are proposing.

I proposed a starting point...not an ending point...

[mo7888]

Two firsts min seems to be the precedence. I’d consider trades around some combo of Walker, White, Sammy an expiring vet not named DDR and two firsts for the likes of Beal, Lavine, KAT.

I would exclude Lavine.... but agree on the rest

[exstatic]

I have not been smoking crack. I really want this LMA speculation to go away, move forward with the young core and stop this silly Grandpa and Aldridge growth hinderance.
Lonzo Ball.

Since the rest of the NBA is fully aware of how Aldridge has been in decline since 2016 and is now in full decline thus the PATFO are not going to buffalo anyone, just keeping the expectation level real:

"Since the start of February, he has been throwing flames: 45.9 percent from 3 on 8.1 attempts per game. That is the highest percentage in the league at that volume over that span. If you lower the attempts baseline to 6.5 per game, the list of guys over 45 percent expands to Jamal Murray, George, LaVine and Joe Harris. These are some of the best shooters in the world. Ball hasn't just improved his 3-point shooting; he's become an actual marksman."

To which you will respond we already have Walker, DJ etc.
Could we then flip Ball for a team that needs him?




Why? Why get a guy, just to flip him? The market is what it is. You’re not going to get him cheap, and sell him for lots of assets. It just makes no sense, AND we are both divisional and conference rivals with NO.

[MultiTroll]

Why? Why get a guy, just to flip him? The market is what it is. You’re not going to get him cheap, and sell him for lots of assets. It just makes no sense, AND we are both divisional and conference rivals with NO.
Before he caught fire he was no doubt available for far less. I did not foresee the drastic improvement in treys and apparently no other teams did either. (Unless NO is committed to him.)
However, same status of LMA in that he is on the last 1/2 year of his contract, so they need to either move him or pony up. They may have to take less then he is worth so as to get some return.

If not flipped, then what Spurs would you want to move if Lonzo joined?

I mean what other ideas do you have? The NBA knows the Spurs are fucked with Aldridge. Drafting ability? Whoever is doing the scouting for the Spurs continues to kick ass top tier with another absolute beauty in KJ. Trading wise? They know Gramps has lost it with the Forbes fiasco, Patty 50 etc.

[LeBowen]

It obviously won't happen, but if there was ever a time for Spurs to make a blockbuster trade, it's now (or this summer).

If we talk about current roster, assets available and cap space, Spurs are unmatched. Other teams with cap space are bottom of the league and no legit playoff team has as much cap space.

I love watching all of the young guys, but it's going to get really crowded very soon and it's only a matter of time before someone's unhappy.
DJ, Derrick, Lonnie, Devin, Keldon are all already or soon to be legit NBA starters. Some of them will surely make all-star selections in the future.
Tre also looks like he's going to be a good rotation piece.

6 players for 3 positions. Keldon can play the 4, but he'd be way better as a permanent SF.
Then you add Patty who'll inevitably retire as a Spur :rolleyes into the equation and there's just not enough minutes for everyone unless we keep playing those 4 guard lineups.

There's also Demar. He's been nothing short of amazing this season, but even though he has the size, he can't be a PF. Makeshift forward.

We don't have a single 6'7-6'10 player who's a great defender. (Unless Luka becomes the next AK47 because his lateral movements last night were really impressive.)
In today's West, that won't work against top teams.

Jakob can become a defensive juggernaut, but on offense, he's one of the biggest liabilities in the league.
Until Lonnie and Devin become more consistent, we have one legit 3pt shooting threat in Patty. And he's horrible at everything else. Spacing is awful at times.

Right now it's a pipe dream, but if the opportunity presents itself, Spurs simply have to try and get KAT. Assets are there and he would be a perfect fit.
DJ, Keldon and Devin should be the only untouchables.

I love Derrick, he's probably our second best player when fully healthy, but his issues seem to be chronic. Would be a tough decision, but I'd rather have DJ.
Lonnie...can become a superstar, but is always missing something.
Don't get me wrong, if we can't get KAT or someone like Beal, I'd never trade them, but as I said, if someone like KAT is available, you simply have to go for it.

As far as more realistic trades go, just try and get something for Rudy and LMA. I'd love to get rid of Patty, but he'll never leave.
Obviously, I think current roster will be a legit playoff team maybe even the next season, but if we want to contend again, a true superstar level player is needed. KAT just makes too much sense for me. He can become an MVP level player with proper coaching instead of that dumpster fire in Minny.

[rankingtear]

Two first rounders, 2 rotation players, and a prospect with high potential for an assortment of players that have shown they are capable of being the best players on bottom dwelling teams

You really think mortgaging our entire future for a player of Lavine or Towns caliber leaves us in any better position than the wolves or bulls are in now?

did we think these trade scenarios through at all or do we just want the instant gratification of something “new” so badly that we’re willing to just sell a kidney for it

Yeah this is a last piece to a championship move. We can't do this.

[exstatic]

Before he caught fire he was no doubt available for far less. I did not foresee the drastic improvement in treys and apparently no other teams did either. (Unless NO is committed to him.)
However, same status of LMA in that he is on the last 1/2 year of his contract, so they need to either move him or pony up. They may have to take less then he is worth so as to get some return.

If not flipped, then what Spurs would you want to move if Lonzo joined?

I mean what other ideas do you have? The NBA knows the Spurs are fucked with Aldridge. Drafting ability? Whoever is doing the scouting for the Spurs continues to kick ass top tier with another absolute beauty in KJ. Trading wise? They know Gramps has lost it with the Forbes fiasco, Patty 50 etc.

Maybe you do nothing, and let most or all of the expirings expire. I mean, it’s not like Ball fills a position of need. I’m not even sure his shooting improvement or blip makes him better than DJ.

You don’t just do something just to do something, at least the Spurs don’t. Consequently, a team that kills it in the draft still has all of their picks.

[KobesAchilles]

I mean when both Jimmy Butler and Thibs call you lazy then I kinda want no part of Towns. The dude is super talented, but the effort level is just beyond questionable. Like how is he such a bad defender? Though to be fair I haven't checked him out this year, but for his career he has been subpar. He has all the tools to be a monster on that end. The wolves tried to have KG mentor him bc they saw this as a problem, but apparently that didn't work. Would he listen to Tim? Idk.

[MultiTroll]

Maybe you do nothing, and let most or all of the expirings expire. I mean, it’s not like Ball fills a position of need. I’m not even sure his shooting improvement or blip makes him better than DJ.

You don’t just do something just to do something, at least the Spurs don’t. Consequently, a team that kills it in the draft still has all of their picks.
Spurs may have no choice but to let him expire.
Doing something for something, even if it's minimal is better then nothing for nothing. Letting good food go to waste is, waste.
LMA is not going to help in this years playoffs. Never has, never will.
Well I'll back off never and say he could be an excellent spot benchie depending on the opponent. But that would take Gramps to have some BBIQ moving fwd.

Never. :lmao

[The Truth #6]

I like the young players. I know we probably won’t win a championship with them. But I want to see them develop and see where it goes, and avoid moonshots that could throw it all away. I just want to rid the team of expensive vets that underperform and aren’t on the same page. I could see Mills getting resigned as well as DD, *assuming they accept their role within the team.

[rjv]

i can't see how LMA has any value other than an expiring contract.

[John B]

I’m pretty confident Walker IV and Luka will never be stars. I agree with alot of what yiu say above at some point developing all these mid to late first round picks becomes excessive. Only so many minutes to go around. Now is a good time to explore moving a young player or two and some picks for the next disgruntled star, I’d just prefer to keep DJ, Keldon and Vassel if I had to choose.

Do you think DJ is a Star? He's 29th pick

[CGD]

i can't see how LMA has any value other than an expiring contract.

Tend to agree, and there simply are fewer and fewer long-term bad contracts these days where a team will throw sink to get off it. It will have to be a desperation move by a would be contender like MIA or BOS

[spurs1990]

He seems to play great against shit teams and that makes people think he's a really good to great player, but in the end, without a three point shot, he's just too limited when going up against the upper echelon teams.

He can take you to the point of contention, but then will bring you back down due to his limitations. He really needed to work on a three point shot, and Aldridge really needed to lose weight and be more mobile. Both have go no-one to blame but themselves if they have to leave and sign for a lot less money than they expected. It's all on them.

First I don't blame you for skipping out on 2019-2020 season. Easily the most unwatchable the team has had and not just for the lack of playoffs. It was the Forbes/Belinelli show before Corona, Lonnie Walker getting a raw deal from his coach, and the games 3 months after shutdown were purely exhibition.

Now to your points on DeRozan and his 3's. It's the one issue I have with him which has made me agnostic on him returning altogether, and certainly not at a max contract.

Per B-Ball Reference, He's ranked (https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2021_per_game.html) 190th in the league in 3pt-attempt per game.
Surprisingly his 1.9 attempts per game are the third highest of his career, so he has improved his effort based solely on his own track record.

DeRozan 3-pt attempt per Game for his career
https://i.ibb.co/1zL8xK7/Derozan-3.png


To see how 1.9 per game stacks up, here's the 3pt Attempt-per-Game for the 2 best players of teams ahead of San Antonio record-wise so far.

3-pt Attempt per Game for 2020-2021.
https://i.ibb.co/qChLwZf/Derozan-table.png

There's a lot of comments on why Patty Mills (6.7 per gm, 27th rank in attempts) stays on the court routinely.
...It wouldn't be unfair to say that DeRozan's lack of attempts is a factor in Mills' necessity, whether for spreading the floor or just hitting the damn shot.

[KingKev]

what is the actual market value of our next to be free agents?

Let's try some numbers...in the wiew of our player's value for other teams

DDR..............difficult to say, in a dry market having no 3 point shot for a guard/wing is a big minus.....I don't see a team offering max but I'd say anything from 15 to 30 a year depending on the team

LMA.............bad season till now but worth consideration for his offensive ability and his past................No way near his last contract but I'd say anything from min. to mid level depending on the team

Gay............good season till now but too old............................................... .................................................. ...................................I'd say the same things said for LMA

Lyles..........no playing time till now, but good behavior and at least decent production for the minutes played........................................I'd say from minimum to max 6/7 millions

Mills..........decent/good season till now for his capabilities, but because of his defense he's an obvious liability.......................................I' d say anything from 5/6 millions to the mid level

different thoughts?

How can anyone disagree when you barbell their market value like that. 15-30mm is huge, vet min to MLE? This league has more liquidity, even during COVID.

[KingKev]

Not Lavine. He’s not in that group. Beal and KAT are head and shoulders above him.

you also get Lavine for 20mm first year. This season he is not far off of Beal and KAT. I’m not in love with these scenarios just anxious to move on from the status quo while giving our young bulls a complimentary scorer not named DDR; ideally who can shoot 40% from deep on volume.

[Dejounte]

I haven't been around much the past season or so, as it took me a while to get over the Kawhi fiasco (I watched most of the games the first season after he left, but sort of had a hangover last season and didn't want to watch many of the games), however, I made a concerted effort to try and watch every single Spurs game this season because I really did like the potential of some of the young guys. I guess it started with Derrick White and Dejounte in the first season Kawhi left/was traded, and I've liked the draft picks since then too, so I wanted to start watching every single game again. It was also the first time in my life since I became a Spurs fan in '93/'94 where I didn't follow every single game (I couldn't start watching games until 2004 in my country, but before then I followed every game online in some form or another - 90% of the time live). Maybe I also needed a break from Basketball as I was so into it during the D-Rob/TD era and what I thought was going to be the Kawhi era (I also think it's a good thing that I've been able to step back and realize there is other more important stuff. I still love basketball, though, especially when it's played the right way like the Spurs try to).

Anyway, I digress, so back to the topic at hand. I just haven't been around much the past season/season and a half prior to this one to follow Duncan2K5s posts, so I'll take your word on it for the reasons everyone keeps crapping on him. I just thought his points in that post were really accurate and that is what I've thought the past year or two about DeMar now that I've had a good enough look/handle on his game and mental makeup/temperament in tight/big games.



I didn't think this before, but seeing how some of these young players are playing now, I looked back at the Raptors and where they were when he left. I really do think DeMar had a pretty big hand in helping some of these young guys get better and become better players, but I think that is the endpoint with him as a leader/player to build your team around. If you want to go any further, he's not the guy to take you there as a number one option. I'm not even sure if he's best suited as a 2nd or 3rd option on a Championship level team. I am leaning towards 3rd option. His lack of three point shot is a killer and really holds him back. These past few years in SA, he really should have made a huge effort to add one to his game. It's all on him for not doing so.

Yeah, even duncan2k5 (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=237) himself has posted that he and I share a lot of views on things even though we argue a lot. The problem is his approach to replying to people who show the least bit of openness to the possibility of DeMar and LMA returning to the team. He feels compelled to argue his ass off every single time a word is said about either of these two, as if he wants to force his own opinion onto others and have us become a sort of cult-- one where everybody hates on both DeMar and LMA. He can't accept other people's opinions and will write paragraphs of re-hashed topics every. single. damn. time.

I'm not even to attached to DeMar or LaMarcus and he always acts like I do or anyone for that matter. *I don't care* if they are gone after this season.

duncak2k5, you need to fucking let go of your demons and stop having a Trump-like attitude to people having other opinions. Not everyone has to have the same opinion as you.

[poopbox]

Would you rate Bradley Beal as a star? He's one player I am very interested in getting. What do you guys think of Beal? Would he be worth it, and/or would the price be too steep? I think the Clippers tried to get him before getting Paul George, and I think they would have been a better team if they were able to trade for him instead. I mean, on paper Paul George is the more logical choice when the best players in the NBA right now are SF/PF hybrids, but I still think Beal is a better player than PG. I don't know, PG could prove me wrong these playoffs, but I've never been impressed with him come playoff time (despite his playoff failures, I was still a fan of PG until these previous playoffs, as I like his overall game and keep thinking he'll turn a corner, but last year's playoffs have made me to start doubting he'll reach his full potential. I guess we will see this time around).

Absolutely NO to Beal. I don't understand people infatuation with this guy. All he does is put up stats on a bad team because somebody has to. The price for him is going to be ultra steep as well. You need 28 mil worth of salary so off the top you looking at trading Dejounte, White, plus whatever is left to make salaries work plus a 1st round pick if not multiple first round picks. So you get rid of the strength of your team, your perimeter guards, and the strength of your front office, hitting on 1st round picks, so you can get a guy who isn't good enough to keep his team from being one of the 6 worst teams in the nba every year ? Hard no.

You not a fan of PG cause he chokes in the playoffs, then how could you be a fan of Beal who can't even get to the playoffs, IN THE EAST :rollin

[Leetonidas]

Absolutely NO to Beal. I don't understand people infatuation with this guy. All he does is put up stats on a bad team because somebody has to. The price for him is going to be ultra steep as well. You need 28 mil worth of salary so off the top you looking at trading Dejounte, White, plus whatever is left to make salaries work plus a 1st round pick if not multiple first round picks. So you get rid of the strength of your team, your perimeter guards, and the strength of your front office, hitting on 1st round picks, so you can get a guy who isn't good enough to keep his team from being one of the 6 worst teams in the nba every year ? Hard no.

You not a fan of PG cause he chokes in the playoffs, then how could you be a fan of Beal who can't even get to the playoffs, IN THE EAST :rollin

He's leading the entire league in scoring by a good margin, it's not like he's putting up 20ppg. His team is also a complete trainwreck (seriously, look at their roster, it's complete trash). Beal is 10x better than anyone we have on our roster and it's unlikely any player we have will ever end up being a 32ppg scorer. if you can get him, you do it. I love D. White and Lonnie as much as the next guy but you don't hold onto role players out of sentiment if there a real impact player on the table

[cjw]

He's leading the entire league in scoring by a good margin, it's not like he's putting up 20ppg. His team is also a complete trainwreck (seriously, look at their roster, it's complete trash). Beal is 10x better than anyone we have on our roster and it's unlikely any player we have will ever end up being a 32ppg scorer. if you can get him, you do it. I love D. White and Lonnie as much as the next guy but you don't hold onto role players out of sentiment if there a real impact player on the table

Trading White is very hard because of salary rules. His incoming basically accounts for his higher post-extension salary but outgoing only his current contract.

But framework is right. If you’re getting Beal, trading one of Murray/White plus Walker is something you do yesterday assuming price isn’t crazy beyond that. But it’ll be another first at the very least.

[poopbox]

He's leading the entire league in scoring by a good margin, it's not like he's putting up 20ppg. His team is also a complete trainwreck (seriously, look at their roster, it's complete trash). Beal is 10x better than anyone we have on our roster and it's unlikely any player we have will ever end up being a 32ppg scorer. if you can get him, you do it. I love D. White and Lonnie as much as the next guy but you don't hold onto role players out of sentiment if there a real impact player on the table

Who cares about his 32ppg when he couldn't cover a corpse with a white sheet. Roster isn't great but they have nba level talent on it. Russel Westbrook is a former mvp who once took okc to the playoffs surrounded by the worst shooting in the league. Riu and Deni are top 10 lottery picks. Bertans was a top tier 3 point shooter last year and got paid like it. If I told you a team had a former mvp, a current all star, two top 10 lottery picks, and a top tier 3 point shooter, I do not think you would say that is one of the worst teams in the league.

Beal hasn't done anything but play on lottery teams since Wall got hurt. I think one of the reasons why is because all he offers is scoring a bunch of points on a lot of volume shooting. Thanks but no thanks, that isn't what we need. Also there is no way you are getting Beal without giving up Dejounte, who is playing all nba level defense and flashing all star level offense occasionally. He is the number one guy the wizards are going to ask for.

:lmao At thinking the wizards would be like "hey san antonio you know that guard you got that keeps getting all these weird foot injuries and missing the first 20 games of the season, yeah that is the guy we want to trade for bradley beal"

[TD 21]

They could just sign him outright, though they're looking at missing the playoffs, a play-in scenario, or a very low seed this season after making the Finals last season. The pressure is on for them to try and improve. Not only that, but having him on the team ahead of FA gives them a leg-up on re-signing him.

As for why DeMar, they've been linked to him for a while now. His fit is a bit sketchy with Butler, considering neither really take 3's and neither does Bam but if their interest is real then they must have an idea for how to incorporate him.

If there is a deal to be made between the Spurs and the Heat then altering the protections on a first that they already owe is a way to entice the Spurs into dealing DDR, as well as keeping them from giving up another young player like Robinson in a deal. Its still unlikely, but if true, then they might have enough assets, after all, to be make a deal.

They've got a good chance to finish top 6 (Knicks will probably drop out) and the likely top 2 (Nets and Bucks) would leave a likely 3-6 of 76ers, Celtics, Raptors and them, which is a virtual coin flip. I suspect they'd be fine with that and I don't think a surprising run to the Finals last season has created pressure or is going to lead them to do something foolish.

I know, but I'm skeptical of the veracity.

[Sugus]

I can't help noticing that even the guys who are (sort of) standing up for DeRozan are still awfully lukewarm on him. I'd think a true positive force for this team would be much more enthusiastically embraced. I get the takes some have on him, and I'd impressed by his improvement with regards to distribution & assist numbers, but I still think the Spurs move towards being contenders faster without him than with him.

Lol, you hit it on the head, lukewarm is a good word.

At its core, I just don't see DeMar as a player that will help you win (contend, more like) on his own, BUT as evidenced by the team's chemistry, growth and play, he can play a role as a developmental figure, and "hold the fort" until our young guys are ready to blossom. In a way, I see him like CP3, who had a great stint in OKC mentoring SGA, and now is really helping a young Suns squad and Booker specifically to reach their potential. Those kinds of players aren't easy to come by, so there's value to me in keeping DeMar for at least a couple more seasons (though I'd want no part of a deal extending beyond 2 years, maybe 3 at the most if the last season is partially guaranteed); but at the same time, as he won't really help the team contend (at least while he's the #1 option like he is on this Spurs squad), I wouldn't be very sad if he left. I think his on-court production can be replaced with a step forward by some of our youngings, but his true value lies elsewhere, and that's something that I'd worry we'll have trouble replacing.

I think posters who are anti-resigning DD at all costs, are looking at it from a perspective that DeMar is exclusively a win-now player, which is inaccurate and doesn't represent the entirety of the value he brings to the Spurs right now. At the same time, I also understand that keeping DeMar for any amount of time, will surely prevent the Spurs from bottoming out and playing the lottery game to get a top-level prospect: in my opinion, the Spurs have an amount of intriguing, upside-heavy prospects to the point that they might as well try to see how far they can make it, instead of shipping DD out and going full-tank, which would be counter-productive to the "identity" that the Spurs have right now. The FO also certainly doesn't want to tank right now, so it's easy to see the direction the team is heading towards, and see how it makes sense keeping DeRozan in the short term.

[pad300]

I agree with Poopbox. I wouldn't be looking to trade for Beal. IMO, to seriously compete, we need a ring-worthy #1 option. Derozan ain't that guy. If Beal was that guy, the Wizards would make the playoffs a lot more often during Beal's career... I don't think Beal is better than Derozan (from a wins generated PoV), and he's going to be a lot more expensive. KAT is pretty much in the same boat. We need to be looking for a Kawhi trade or a Durant S&T, not burning talent on guys who aren't worth a max, but will want to get paid it.

[mo7888]

Absolutely NO to Beal. I don't understand people infatuation with this guy. All he does is put up stats on a bad team because somebody has to. The price for him is going to be ultra steep as well. You need 28 mil worth of salary so off the top you looking at trading Dejounte, White, plus whatever is left to make salaries work plus a 1st round pick if not multiple first round picks. So you get rid of the strength of your team, your perimeter guards, and the strength of your front office, hitting on 1st round picks, so you can get a guy who isn't good enough to keep his team from being one of the 6 worst teams in the nba every year ? Hard no.

You not a fan of PG cause he chokes in the playoffs, then how could you be a fan of Beal who can't even get to the playoffs, IN THE EAST :rollin

You don't need to send out equal salary if you have the cap space to absorb a portion of his contract, so there's no need to combine white and Murray.

[BackHome]

We have won ZERO Championship by acquiring a Super Star type of player the only way we will ever win is getting lucky with draft Like we did in getting David and Timmy.

[Leetonidas]

Who cares about his 32ppg when he couldn't cover a corpse with a white sheet. Roster isn't great but they have nba level talent on it. Russel Westbrook is a former mvp who once took okc to the playoffs surrounded by the worst shooting in the league. Riu and Deni are top 10 lottery picks. Bertans was a top tier 3 point shooter last year and got paid like it. If I told you a team had a former mvp, a current all star, two top 10 lottery picks, and a top tier 3 point shooter, I do not think you would say that is one of the worst teams in the league.

Beal hasn't done anything but play on lottery teams since Wall got hurt. I think one of the reasons why is because all he offers is scoring a bunch of points on a lot of volume shooting. Thanks but no thanks, that isn't what we need. Also there is no way you are getting Beal without giving up Dejounte, who is playing all nba level defense and flashing all star level offense occasionally. He is the number one guy the wizards are going to ask for.

:lmao At thinking the wizards would be like "hey san antonio you know that guard you got that keeps getting all these weird foot injuries and missing the first 20 games of the season, yeah that is the guy we want to trade for bradley beal"

"Who cares about 32ppg" :lmao stopped reading right there.

[poopbox]

"Who cares about 32ppg" :lmao stopped reading right there.

With a take dumb as this I'm shot you were even able to start reading tbh :lmao

Actually you and I both know your legal guardian read it for you :lmao

[Leetonidas]

Lol cringe response

[poopbox]

That was a bullshit travel call...

[Dejounte]

We have won ZERO Championship by acquiring a Super Star type of player the only way we will ever win is getting lucky with draft Like we did in getting David and Timmy.

We have a Luka

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/a-Ve9OaLXiEJxyMdeBw38Dof2fy6Mb8SgtbzJ216qCYZZwV23Tkh eKUzxXvFxs4V_T0IKqjy75LTP290kUIlWNHTQD24r9Z3hCSrqn 8TnNThC3qbwCd2HlfyxS7sO1_SofQQS8r06dctNhjk0G5_BHaG Fv9WmeiHOyE

[John B]

We have won ZERO Championship by acquiring a Super Star type of player the only way we will ever win is getting lucky with draft Like we did in getting David and Timmy.
Granted Spurs were lucky with Timmy and DRob, but Spurs have won 5 and that’s not lucky. And you can’t call the beautiful game “lucky.” Having 1st round picks don’t guarantee championship(s) either. Go ask Philly. My point is there is more than luck, it’s great management, and Spurs has shown that. I think Spurs have the key players and only missing a 20/10 PF/C to replace Aldridge to become a contender. It could be Luka or it could be from FA. I trust the PATFO will get that player however, but for sure not from “luck.”

[Mr. Body]

Absolutely NO to Beal. I don't understand people infatuation with this guy. All he does is put up stats on a bad team because somebody has to. The price for him is going to be ultra steep as well. You need 28 mil worth of salary so off the top you looking at trading Dejounte, White, plus whatever is left to make salaries work plus a 1st round pick if not multiple first round picks. So you get rid of the strength of your team, your perimeter guards, and the strength of your front office, hitting on 1st round picks, so you can get a guy who isn't good enough to keep his team from being one of the 6 worst teams in the nba every year ? Hard no.

You not a fan of PG cause he chokes in the playoffs, then how could you be a fan of Beal who can't even get to the playoffs, IN THE EAST :rollin

Doesn't Beal have a massive usage rate? Seems an awful idea to take the ball out of the hands of the youth brigade. Just having them stand around and watch. DeRozan is so effective because he circulates the ball. His assists are high and TOs extremely low.

[exstatic]

"Who cares about 32ppg" :lmao stopped reading right there.

Grandpa stats. How many shots does he take to get that?

[Mr. Body]

Beal takes 23 shots a game. He makes $28 million and the next two years $34 and $37 million. I'd rather those shots and that money go to our developing players.

He's also a pretty terrible defender. (DDR is actually slightly positive this year.)

[Dverde]

Beal takes 23 shots a game. He makes $28 million and the next two years $34 and $37 million. I'd rather those shots and that money go to our developing players.

He's also a pretty terrible defender. (DDR is actually slightly positive this year.)

This is like saying wouldn’t smash a certain model, when everyone knows if the model came up to you...you’d cream your pants and beg to carry her purse. Beal isn’t coming here :lol

[PrimeMinister]

Beal takes 23 shots a game. He makes $28 million and the next two years $34 and $37 million. I'd rather those shots and that money go to our developing players.

He's also a pretty terrible defender. (DDR is actually slightly positive this year.)

honestly amazing to me it’s 20 MFing 21 and we are still doing “trade our young cornerstones and picks for Beal” discourse on ST

We trade White, Samanic, etc... for Beal and now have a team led by Demar and Beal! Great, now what?

[DAF86]

I wonder if Luka and Lyles' play increases' PATFO interest on moving Gay.

[J_Paco]

I wonder if Luka and Lyles' play increases' PATFO interest on moving Gay.

I really hope so, but I'm afraid Pop values the experience of a veteran and trying to make the playoffs too much to part with Rudy.

If the Bucks actually had a 1st round pick to send our way then he would be a near perfect fit there.

[RC_Drunkford]

Definitely looks like Aldridge and Gay should be the odd men out. I‘m also not sure if it‘s that easy to replace DeRozan since he’s the HOTS of this team. He got double teamed all night and dished out assists for the young guys. I don’t see anybody else on this team taking over that role as of now

[FkLA]

Definitely looks like Aldridge and Gay should be the odd men out. I‘m also not sure if it‘s that easy to replace DeRozan since he’s the HOTS of this team. He got double teamed all night and dished out assists for the young guys. I don’t see anybody else on this team taking over that role as of now

Agree. DeMar has never been expendable. I've never liked it when people lump him in with the other vets. He's the youngest of the vets and actually fits in with the youth movement pretty seamlessly. I'd like to at least see LMA and Rudy go. We all know Patty isn't going anywhere. Rudy seems pretty beloved in the locker room and is kind of DeRozans BFF though, so I also wouldn't be opposed to simply just phasing him out.

[spurraider21]

demar is expendable only to the extent that we are confident that White can regularly play 33+ mpg. otherwise, our offense basically needs him to function. ideally, White could step up (or we get a FA like Collins who can help the offense), because Derozan does also limit the team due to his lack of defense and outside shooting

[Dejounte]

DJ's little spout with Pop makes me think DeMar is needed around the team. Don't think DJ would respect anyone else to hold him back like DeMar did during that incident. DJ may still have some maturing to do.

[slick'81]

Spurs should of dealt lma before this season but it is what it is. Curious if the spurs move their newly minted backup center and get anything of value in return

[exstatic]

I really hope so, but I'm afraid Pop values the experience of a veteran and trying to make the playoffs too much to part with Rudy.

If the Bucks actually had a 1st round pick to send our way then he would be a near perfect fit there.

At this point, the veterans, other than DDR are contra-indicative of making the playoffs. Rudy and LMA aren’t going to help you get there.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

DeRozan's more valuable than anything we'd get in exchange. Sadly he may be playing himself into a really large contract for next season.


LMA and Rudy? LMA still might have some appeal to a veteran team vying for the championship. I still like Rudy on the Spurs, though.

[KingKev]

DJ's little spout with Pop makes me think DeMar is needed around the team. Don't think DJ would respect anyone else to hold him back like DeMar did during that incident. DJ may still have some maturing to do.

Or maybe Pop needs someone to actually tell him whatsup. TD is probably the only player to do so. Everyone else who had an opinion was left in the dust during the golden era. These days Pop’s resume is mixed at best. I’m all good with DJ voicing his opinion and not being the status quo Spurs culture sheep.

[KingKev]

Spurs should of dealt lma before this season but it is what it is. Curious if the spurs move their newly minted backup center and get anything of value in return

Wasteful curiosity; LMA has far more value to us off the bench. His value away from us will return a 2nd and an expiring AT MOST

[Dejounte]

Or maybe Pop needs someone to actually tell him whatsup. TD is probably the only player to do so. Everyone else who had an opinion was left in the dust during the golden era. These days Pop’s resume is mixed at best. I’m all good with DJ voicing his opinion and not being the status quo Spurs culture sheep.

There's telling Pop what's up and then there's "I'm gonna beat yo ass, Pop". That incident looked like the latter. DJ looked enraged and it was borderline unprofessional. That's how it looked to me, anyway. I could be wrong.

[exstatic]

There's telling Pop what's up and then there's "I'm gonna beat yo ass, Pop". That incident looked like the latter. DJ looked enraged and it was borderline unprofessional. That's how it looked to me, anyway. I could be wrong.

When was this?

[Dejounte]

When was this?

During the Nets game in overtime. I'll make a gif when I have a chance...

[KingKev]

There's telling Pop what's up and then there's "I'm gonna beat yo ass, Pop". That incident looked like the latter. DJ looked enraged and it was borderline unprofessional. That's how it looked to me, anyway. I could be wrong.

DJ has a heart of gold. Nothing that can’t be talked about behind closed doors. Can’t ask DJ to be the spiritual leader but also not get heated. The best Spurs teams always had that one guy who didn’t conform completely. 99’ Mario Elie, 03’ Stephen Jackson, arguably 05’ Robert Horry. I mean DDR probably has more ill advised temper tantrum T’s than Tim, Tiny and Manu combined. My point is I wouldn't even second guessing Pop/DJs rapport. Pop knows this team has half a soul sans Murray.

[Dejounte]

DJ has a heart of gold. Nothing that can’t be talked about behind closed doors. Can’t ask DJ to be the spiritual leader but also not get heated. The best Spurs teams always had that one guy who didn’t conform completely. 99’ Mario Elie, 03’ Stephen Jackson, arguably 05’ Robert Horry. I mean DDR probably has more ill advised temper tantrum T’s than Tim, Tiny and Manu combined. My point is I wouldn't even second guessing Pop/DJs rapport. Pop knows this team has half a soul sans Murray.

Trust me, I hope so. His erratic behavior on his social media makes me think otherwise. The dude seems impulsive sometimes and I just hope it never leads to the point where he wants to burn bridges. He had a rough childhood, and I hope he'll always be thankful for his situation now. Loyalty seems big for him. I hope nothing fucks that up, including a little misunderstanding during the heat of the moment.

[Joseph Kony]

There's telling Pop what's up and then there's "I'm gonna beat yo ass, Pop". That incident looked like the latter. DJ looked enraged and it was borderline unprofessional. That's how it looked to me, anyway. I could be wrong.
interested in seeing this, because i really find it hard to envision since Murray speaks so glowingly of Pop and has said more than once he looks at him like a father figure. really hope you're just looking too much into it because if you aint, definitely not what you wanna see from him at this point whether he had a legit gripe or not

[TD 21]

DeRozan's more valuable than anything we'd get in exchange. Sadly he may be playing himself into a really large contract for next season.


LMA and Rudy? LMA still might have some appeal to a veteran team vying for the championship. I still like Rudy on the Spurs, though.

Nah. His decline should kick in early-mid contract, the team is too small/lacking in three-point shooting and you don't pay Murray/White starter money (and let's face it, eventually Johnson) to be babysat forever.

I'm fine keeping this team together until the off season, but at that point, I hope the Raptors aren't interested in a reunion (cap space to sign him outright) and they can sign and trade him somewhere.

[Blackhaus]

Pop and Murray were joking with each other towards the end of the knicks game. Chalk that spat in the Nets game to just competitive deference’s I think.

[gospursgojas]

When was this?


interested in seeing this, because i really find it hard to envision since Murray speaks so glowingly of Pop and has said more than once he looks at him like a father figure. really hope you're just looking too much into it because if you aint, definitely not what you wanna see from him at this point whether he had a legit gripe or not

It’s a whole bunch of nothing. Just 2 guys talking it over. Everyone is just so used to everyone being scared of Pop. Pop loves Dj because of it. Dj loves Pop because of it. I don’t have the know how to make a gif but if you still have game recorded it’s in OT during the clear path foul review.

Pop was right to get on Dj. He left Kylie wide open for a 3, then on next play dribbled into traffic and turned ball over (thus the reason for the potential clear path foul).

I recognized Pop and Dj’s relationship was special way back when Lamarcus and Ibalka fought and Dj held LA back and physically pushed Pop away like “I got him” and Pop just smirked like that’s my boy.

[Dejounte]

"San Antonio Spurs

The Spurs are receiving calls on their veteran players who are pending free agents — LaMarcus Aldridge, DeMar DeRozan, Rudy Gay, Trey Lyles and Patty Mills — and are listening to inquiries, sources said. San Antonio is the sixth seed in the Western Conference at 18-13, blending its veterans and talented young core of Keldon Johnson, Dejounte Murray, Derrick White and Lonnie Walker IV.

DeRozan, a four-time All-Star, is having an All-Star-caliber season — averaging 20 points and a career-high 7.3 assists per game and helping lead the roster.

Murray (15.8), Johnson (14.3), White (11.8) and Walker (11.3) are all averaging double figures in points. This marks the first time the Spurs have had four players under 30 years old averaging double figures since the 2003 championship team (Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, Stephen Jackson, Malik Rose)."

https://theathletic.com/2425373/2021/03/04/nba-trade-news-rumors-blake-griffin-p-j-tucker-andre-drummond-shams?source=user-shared-article

Today's article

[Dejounte]

Minnesota Timberwolves

Minnesota has shown interest in power forwards around the league, including Atlanta’s John Collins and Orlando’s Aaron Gordon, sources said. Both players have significant asking prices in the marketplace. The Timberwolves had substantive conversations with the Magic on Gordon prior to his severe ankle sprain last month, sources said, and those talks are expected to resume as he nears his return to the floor.

[stephen jackson]

I doubt the Spurs make any moves especially how we been playing . Idk if I’d want too maybe only Aldridge

[couchman]

I doubt we can get anything more than a 2nd rounder for LMA and we'd also have to take back salary. Gay is probably a better trade asset.

[buttsR4rebounding]

I doubt the Spurs make any moves especially how we been playing . Idk if I’d want too maybe only Aldridge

To me Gay is the most likely to be traded. Aldridge actually fills a needed role as back up center. I think that Lyles, Samanic, and KJ can handle the PF slot just fine moving forward. Gay's contract is much easier to trade for at 16 million and he fills the need many contenders have. He also has one of the best net ratings in the league when on the floor. It would allow for Samanic's continued development and depending on it's trajectory COULD actually move the needle for the Spurs. This is the most likely (still not real likely) path for the Spurs to actually fight for a conference finals berth.

[Mr. Body]

I doubt the Spurs make any moves especially how we been playing . Idk if I’d want too maybe only Aldridge

I see the Spurs only making trades if those players ask for them. No other situation.

[Dex]

I see the Spurs only making trades if those players ask for them. No other situation.

And I wouldn't be surprised to see Aldridge in that camp. Something tells me he is not thrilled about coming off the bench since he has historically been keen on getting "his touches".

Granted...with the 2nd unit he can wheel and deal and probably would get more of a chance to play naturally since he's not sharing the floor with DeMar as much, but time will tell if he sees it the same way. He could actually be an asset if he accepts that Manu role.

[Dejounte]

And I wouldn't be surprised to see Aldridge in that camp. Something tells me he is not thrilled about coming off the bench since he has historically been keen on getting "his touches".

Granted...with the 2nd unit he can wheel and deal and probably would get more of a chance to play naturally since he's not sharing the floor with DeMar as much, but time will tell if he sees it the same way. He could actually be an asset if he accepts that Manu role.

Any rift between Aldridge and the Spurs wouldn't be good for the John Collins sweepstakes. Aldridge and JC share the same agent. Not saying there IS a rift, for all we know it could be that Aldridge is just truly washed.

[exstatic]

Any rift between Aldridge and the Spurs wouldn't be good for the John Collins sweepstakes. Aldridge and JC share the same agent. Not saying there IS a rift, for all we know it could be that Aldridge is just truly washed.

He IS washed. I see it every game.

[Dejounte]

He IS washed. I see it every game.

I think I used the wrong wording. I wasn't speaking of Aldridge's performance. Moreso on his consistent injury status (which people are speculating is actually a rift between LMA and the Spurs). What I meant to say was more like, "perhaps Aldridge is just too damn old for the NBA that his body is failing him."

[tbdog]

To me Gay is the most likely to be traded. Aldridge actually fills a needed role as back up center. I think that Lyles, Samanic, and KJ can handle the PF slot just fine moving forward. Gay's contract is much easier to trade for at 16 million and he fills the need many contenders have. He also has one of the best net ratings in the league when on the floor. It would allow for Samanic's continued development and depending on it's trajectory COULD actually move the needle for the Spurs. This is the most likely (still not real likely) path for the Spurs to actually fight for a conference finals berth.

Any trade targets would be one for one. Our position of need is a 4. It's not like the Spurs would trade Gay for a guard or center.

[exstatic]

I think I used the wrong wording. I wasn't speaking of Aldridge's performance. Moreso on his consistent injury status (which people are speculating is actually a rift between LMA and the Spurs). What I meant to say was more like, "perhaps Aldridge is just too damn old for the NBA that his body is failing him."

I don’t think it’s a matter of old. Tim was 4 years older when his right knee finally gave way, but played a lot of high level ball between 35-39. This goes back to LMAs first year here, when he and Tim were working out, and he just basically walked off the floor when Tim told him this was what it took to play into your late 30s in the NBA.

[Dejounte]

I don’t think it’s a matter of old. Tim was 4 years older when his right knee finally gave way, but played a lot of high level ball between 35-39. This goes back to LMAs first year here, when he and Tim were working out, and he just basically walked off the floor when Tim told him this was what it took to play into your late 30s in the NBA.

Tim was also 40 lbs lighter, wasn't he?

[duncan2k5]

Just find one. I'm now curious.


Edit: And you've been cool in my book.

Thanks bro

[duncan2k5]

it a gamble. Curry so happened to work out. Of course if we see potential curry in our young guys. Why not. But it can be like sixers trading igoudala for bynum and ended up with a 4 year tanking plan. Spurs is small market. We cant lose for 4 years like lakers and magically get lebron.
so its balancing trading derozan and getting the right assets. Trading derozan for a worse asset risks the team losing for multiple years.

so my take is derozan trade will happen if spurs can get a good asset out of it. If not then it will depends how much will other teams pay derozan. I doubt spurs want to overpay him on a very long deal

We are already losing

[duncan2k5]

:lol I mean I guess that counts but you really had to search for that shit didn't you

That post is also from the beginning of the 2018 season before anyone realized how terrible he really was
But ur making my point...I notice things before they become common knowledge...and when I point it out,I get bashed...

1. Been said Murray would be a really good PG and needs to be a starter...got bashed

2. Said White is a good player that needs to play over Forbes...this was when white wasn't playing well before murray went down and a LOT of ppl had given up on him

3. Said we would regret not trading LMA, and said if we keep him, we wont get any better as a team, and he will end up old and nearly untradeable with a bad contract...got bashed because ppl loved the fact that he was our only star at the time

4. Said we would miss the playoffs last year, so it makes no sense to keep trying with LMA and DDR...got bashed because ppl said DDR had a year under the system and we made it the year before, so we would only get better...we missed it...

5. Said Jacob is better as a starter because our defense really picks up with him on the floor...got bashed as ppl said he was a stiff...now our defense is a top ranking defense and he is in one of the best ranking defensive lineups in the league...

There's a lot more things I point out that I get bashed for, then when they happen, ppl act like it was an obvious thing and that everyone on the board always used to think that way

[duncan2k5]

People don't shit on duncan2k5 because he's"right" or he's "wrong". They shit on him because he's loud and obnoxious.

Also, majority of people recognize DeMar's flaws and I don't know anyone who actually wants to build a team around him. Again, keeping him doesn't mean building around him. To duncan2k5, everything is black and white and nothing else. Literally no one is saying DeMar will lead us to championships, but that's how it is in his twisted mind.

Are u serious? Numerous ppl on here say we are one piece away from being a contender...if u understand basketball, u would see that that's a ludicrous thing to say

[duncan2k5]

Yup.. funny thing is that D2k5 is pretty much the DeMar Derozan of SpursTalk.. the dude's probably a cool fella but his takes can be very annoying & frustrating
Lol...this is pretty funny...not gonna lie

[exstatic]

Tim was also 40 lbs lighter, wasn't he?

Perhaps LMA could learn from that. Tim wasn’t always that light. He dropped the weight to prolong his career after 2010.

[Dejounte]

But ur making my point...I notice things before they become common knowledge...and when I point it out,I get bashed...

1. Been said Murray would be a really good PG and needs to be a starter...got bashed

2. Said White is a good player that needs to play over Forbes...this was when white wasn't playing well before murray went down and a LOT of ppl had given up on him

3. Said we would regret not trading LMA, and said if we keep him, we wont get any better as a team, and he will end up old and nearly untradeable with a bad contract...got bashed because ppl loved the fact that he was our only star at the time

4. Said we would miss the playoffs last year, so it makes no sense to keep trying with LMA and DDR...got bashed because ppl said DDR had a year under the system and we made it the year before, so we would only get better...we missed it...

5. Said Jacob is better as a starter because our defense really picks up with him on the floor...got bashed as ppl said he was a stiff...now our defense is a top ranking defense and he is in one of the best ranking defensive lineups in the league...

There's a lot more things I point out that I get bashed for, then when they happen, ppl act like it was an obvious thing and that everyone on the board always used to think that way

The world doesn't revolve around you, bro. A lot of people here have had the same opinions as you. They just don't hang onto it like it's their life's purpose to tell other people "I told you so!".

[Dejounte]

Are u serious? Numerous ppl on here say we are one piece away from being a contender...if u understand basketball, u would see that that's a ludicrous thing to say

So? A lot of people here say dumb shit. You don't get paid to lecture everybody on how you think the team should build its team. It's a waste of your energy to constantly respond to everybody you disagree with.

[duncan2k5]

I haven't been around much the past season or so, as it took me a while to get over the Kawhi fiasco (I watched most of the games the first season after he left, but sort of had a hangover last season and didn't want to watch many of the games), however, I made a concerted effort to try and watch every single Spurs game this season because I really did like the potential of some of the young guys. I guess it started with Derrick White and Dejounte in the first season Kawhi left/was traded, and I've liked the draft picks since then too, so I wanted to start watching every single game again. It was also the first time in my life since I became a Spurs fan in '93/'94 where I didn't follow every single game (I couldn't start watching games until 2004 in my country, but before then I followed every game online in some form or another - 90% of the time live). Maybe I also needed a break from Basketball as I was so into it during the D-Rob/TD era and what I thought was going to be the Kawhi era (I also think it's a good thing that I've been able to step back and realize there is other more important stuff. I still love basketball, though, especially when it's played the right way like the Spurs try to).

Anyway, I digress, so back to the topic at hand. I just haven't been around much the past season/season and a half prior to this one to follow Duncan2K5s posts, so I'll take your word on it for the reasons everyone keeps crapping on him. I just thought his points in that post were really accurate and that is what I've thought the past year or two about DeMar now that I've had a good enough look/handle on his game and mental makeup/temperament in tight/big games.



I didn't think this before, but seeing how some of these young players are playing now, I looked back at the Raptors and where they were when he left. I really do think DeMar had a pretty big hand in helping some of these young guys get better and become better players, but I think that is the endpoint with him as a leader/player to build your team around. If you want to go any further, he's not the guy to take you there as a number one option. I'm not even sure if he's best suited as a 2nd or 3rd option on a Championship level team. I am leaning towards 3rd option. His lack of three point shot is a killer and really holds him back. These past few years in SA, he really should have made a huge effort to add one to his game. It's all on him for not doing so.

I don't even think he is good at making young players better... everyone on his team got better with Kawhi...Lowry shed his choker label...Pascal became a star...Van Vleet became a known name around the NBA and got a big contract... because Kawhi is similar to Duncan... because they can be great without NEEDING the ball in their hands, it allows other players to build up their games...so Kawhi can go off for 30 or 40 without it meaning he is stifling the growth of other players because he can play off ball...

Typically players like DeMar who always need to hold the ball may get good assist numbers, but it also makes other players on the team one dimensional...it turns them into spot up shooter a as opposed to being dynamic players...so Kawhi could play off ball while Pascal learned his game and drives to the rim or posts up... because he knows he would be given the space to do so since Kawhi is a three point threat and also unselfish

[duncan2k5]

Yeah, even duncan2k5 (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=237) himself has posted that he and I share a lot of views on things even though we argue a lot. The problem is his approach to replying to people who show the least bit of openness to the possibility of DeMar and LMA returning to the team. He feels compelled to argue his ass off every single time a word is said about either of these two, as if he wants to force his own opinion onto others and have us become a sort of cult-- one where everybody hates on both DeMar and LMA. He can't accept other people's opinions and will write paragraphs of re-hashed topics every. single. damn. time.

I'm not even to attached to DeMar or LaMarcus and he always acts like I do or anyone for that matter. *I don't care* if they are gone after this season.

duncak2k5, you need to fucking let go of your demons and stop having a Trump-like attitude to people having other opinions. Not everyone has to have the same opinion as you.

I get it...but I'm a PASSIONATE Spurs fan...and I don't mind losing...but I can't stand complacency... And I think DDR and LMA are good enough to make the playoffs, but their games and temperament will never allow them to win a ring if they're the focal point or playing major roles... So to see ppl comfortable with just making the playoffs even tho we don't have a bright future reminds me of Magic fans... Who have been stagnant for a decade... We have no identity with those two, and no bright future with them in it... And it's frustrating that I feel like I'm one of the few on here who realizes the urgency of the situation... Trade while they have value, or we end up like other teams that keep their bad stars too long until they get untradeable due to their diminished skills and high paid contract

[Teamduncan21]

We are already losing
So far we are playoffs. It's no guarantee. But definitely not bottom team.

Not all teams cut their loser player and gets a curry. Think like magic losing howard and just bottom team for many years. Same with sixers.

So while spurs are getting a suitable trade partner. Trading for the sake of trading is not necessary good. There is no guarantee we will just end up with a curry.

[Teamduncan21]

And I wouldn't be surprised to see Aldridge in that camp. Something tells me he is not thrilled about coming off the bench since he has historically been keen on getting "his touches".

Granted...with the 2nd unit he can wheel and deal and probably would get more of a chance to play naturally since he's not sharing the floor with DeMar as much, but time will tell if he sees it the same way. He could actually be an asset if he accepts that Manu role.


There's a difference between the time he wants touches and now. Basically he legit is bad now. While he is at his prime before.

He might not be happy. But not like he will get his touches anywhere else if he plays like that.

[spurs1990]

duncan2k5 - is there a contract the Spurs could offer DeRozan that you could live with? I was on the get-rid-of-him boat since 2019-2020 season, but a lot of posters have pointed out his value in bonding the team. He was the guy holding back Murray from going at Gregg the other night. And what I like best about his play is his passing. He's actively finding the right guy that leads to an open shot.

If I had to choose I'd still say move on, simply because it allows these recent draft picks (Walker, Samanic, Johnson, Vassell) to inherit the swingman minutes... BUT, I won't have a problem if they extend him. The ceiling isn't a title anyway so 3 more years of DeRozan won't be John Wall/Oladipo level dead-end.

[cd021]

They've got a good chance to finish top 6 (Knicks will probably drop out) and the likely top 2 (Nets and Bucks) would leave a likely 3-6 of 76ers, Celtics, Raptors and them, which is a virtual coin flip. I suspect they'd be fine with that and I don't think a surprising run to the Finals last season has created pressure or is going to lead them to do something foolish.

I know, but I'm skeptical of the veracity.
They've definitely played a lot better recently, and with the close standins have a chance at a home court in the first round. Still, I don't think they'd be content with a first or second round playoff appearance after the Finals even if it probably was partly due to crazy circumstances.

Plus Riley has a tendency of doing something splashy to shake-up the team. Whether its trading for DeMar is still a question but if they can move a first then they have enough assets to at least get the Spurs consider it.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I have no doubt the Spurs would be at least 22-13 had they not missed out on 4 winnable games due to Covid protocol. And I'm thinking the Net game goes in their favor too, which would make them 23-12 and percentage points ahead of the Lakers and Clippers for the 3 seed.

Not bad for a team that's "rebuilding".

[Dejounte]

When was this?


interested in seeing this, because i really find it hard to envision since Murray speaks so glowingly of Pop and has said more than once he looks at him like a father figure. really hope you're just looking too much into it because if you aint, definitely not what you wanna see from him at this point whether he had a legit gripe or not


It’s a whole bunch of nothing. Just 2 guys talking it over. Everyone is just so used to everyone being scared of Pop. Pop loves Dj because of it. Dj loves Pop because of it. I don’t have the know how to make a gif but if you still have game recorded it’s in OT during the clear path foul review.

Pop was right to get on Dj. He left Kylie wide open for a 3, then on next play dribbled into traffic and turned ball over (thus the reason for the potential clear path foul).

I recognized Pop and Dj’s relationship was special way back when Lamarcus and Ibalka fought and Dj held LA back and physically pushed Pop away like “I got him” and Pop just smirked like that’s my boy.




https://i.ibb.co/0M49zhs/VID-20210304-114824.gif

https://i.ibb.co/Cbgh3xV/VID-20210304-114904.gif

Here it is.

I wish I could read lips.

Notice DJ's veins pop out in his neck in the second gif.

I don't dismiss the fact that they may have made up in the games after this. Could be much ado over nothing.

We'll see.

[GAustex]

https://i.ibb.co/0M49zhs/VID-20210304-114824.gif

https://i.ibb.co/Cbgh3xV/VID-20210304-114904.gif

Here it is.

I wish I could read lips.

Notice DJ's veins pop out in his neck in the second gif.

I don't dismiss the fact that they may have made up in the games after this. Could be much ado over nothing.

We'll see.
This here is some mighty fine ST contributions

[Dejounte]

When was this?


interested in seeing this, because i really find it hard to envision since Murray speaks so glowingly of Pop and has said more than once he looks at him like a father figure. really hope you're just looking too much into it because if you aint, definitely not what you wanna see from him at this point whether he had a legit gripe or not


It’s a whole bunch of nothing. Just 2 guys talking it over. Everyone is just so used to everyone being scared of Pop. Pop loves Dj because of it. Dj loves Pop because of it. I don’t have the know how to make a gif but if you still have game recorded it’s in OT during the clear path foul review.

Pop was right to get on Dj. He left Kylie wide open for a 3, then on next play dribbled into traffic and turned ball over (thus the reason for the potential clear path foul).

I recognized Pop and Dj’s relationship was special way back when Lamarcus and Ibalka fought and Dj held LA back and physically pushed Pop away like “I got him” and Pop just smirked like that’s my boy.


https://i.ibb.co/0M49zhs/VID-20210304-114824.gif

https://i.ibb.co/Cbgh3xV/VID-20210304-114904.gif

Here it is.

I wish I could read lips.

Notice DJ's veins pop out in his neck in the second gif.

I don't dismiss the fact that they may have made up in the games after this. Could be much ado over nothing.

We'll see.

The concerning part about this incident is DJ talking back at Pop when Pop is already walking away. I believe in the first gif, DJ is yelling "PULL ME!" in response to Pop probably threatening to do after seeing what happened on the court.

In the second gif, I think it's DJ repeating the same thing and screaming "PULL ME THEN!". Again, the concerning part here is just the act of continuing the spat when it's already over. This is a very unprofessional moment by DJ and it's clear he is enraged.

[rah88sa]

When was this?

I'm not the most technically literate, but here you go

https://www.reddit.com/r/NBASpurs/comments/lvwjbr/clip_of_dejounte_and_pop_arguing/

[Dejounte]

I'm not the most technically literate, but here you go

https://www.reddit.com/r/NBASpurs/comments/lvwjbr/clip_of_dejounte_and_pop_arguing/

Dude, that's better quality than mine. What app did you use to do this? Also, you missed the second part of the spat (my second gif).

[duncan2k5]

duncan2k5 - is there a contract the Spurs could offer DeRozan that you could live with? I was on the get-rid-of-him boat since 2019-2020 season, but a lot of posters have pointed out his value in bonding the team. He was the guy holding back Murray from going at Gregg the other night. And what I like best about his play is his passing. He's actively finding the right guy that leads to an open shot.

If I had to choose I'd still say move on, simply because it allows these recent draft picks (Walker, Samanic, Johnson, Vassell) to inherit the swingman minutes... BUT, I won't have a problem if they extend him. The ceiling isn't a title anyway so 3 more years of DeRozan won't be John Wall/Oladipo level dead-end.

Keeping him isn't just about the money...I think he has a ceiling on how good the team can be...and by time he gets to the end of an extension, he will be untradeable...get assets/picks for him... We can then build a team of young players and vets that fit into a winning style... DeMar ball isn't it... We missed the playoffs last year and may miss it again this year

[Joseph Kony]

I'm not the most technically literate, but here you go

https://www.reddit.com/r/NBASpurs/comments/lvwjbr/clip_of_dejounte_and_pop_arguing/

the whole exchange looks pretty benign tbh, looks more like a heated discussion rather that an argument / Murray screaming. idk, think Dejounte may be looking too much into this tbh

[John B]

Dude, that's better quality than mine. What app did you use to do this? Also, you missed the second part of the spat (my second gif).
they were already okay on the Knicks game, Pop joking with DJ in the final steal. But yup that was very unprofessional of DJ. If he wants to be a leader of the group, he needs to show that he could be led. That was disappointing to see.

[John B]

The concerning part about this incident is DJ talking back at Pop when Pop is already walking away. I believe in the first gif, DJ is yelling "PULL ME!" in response to Pop probably threatening to do after seeing what happened on the court.

In the second gif, I think it's DJ repeating the same thing and screaming "PULL ME THEN!". Again, the concerning part here is just the act of continuing the spat when it's already over. This is a very unprofessional moment by DJ and it's clear he is enraged.

Samanic seeing DJ talking back to his coach is not good. DJ should lead by example. That's bad.

[JuneJive]

I bet they don't even remember it.

Seemed like usual talk during a competitive game.

[Sugus]

Samanic seeing DJ talking back to his coach is not good. DJ should lead by example. That's bad.

Damn, when you put it like that... Yeah, not a good look at all. Hope this doesn't become a trend with DJ - though, considering the growth in his game, both physical and mental, I'd say he's maturing just fine. He's got a long ways to go still.

[BacktoBasics]

A whole lot of overreacting in this thread. This shit happens all the time.

[MultiTroll]

Aldridge, Mills, DD and Pop for

Bam, Iggy and Pat Riley.

[PrimeMinister]

When you don’t know what was said- reading into the body language doesn’t really matter. DJ is a fierce competitor and he hates losing, we know this. He had just made 2 plays that essentially shot down our chances in OT. His frustration in whatever they were talking about will reflect that. I don’t doubt Pop could have been asking him what he wanted on his pizza after the game and Dejounte would have answered in the same fashion.

Pop- “you’re tired, DJ, need to pull you for tomorrow”

DJ- “I’m not, I’m not, I’m not, pull me then”

Pop obliges by leaving DJ in the game- Derozan immediately turns the ball over and the subs come in. That was my read then, and that’s what I tried explaining to the nerds on Reddit the night it happened but the narrative was already going there. I see we haven’t gone into “omg he liked a tweet about the clippers” discourse yet. That was the real kicker over there that set them off.

[MultiTroll]

Samanic seeing DJ talking back to his coach is not good. DJ should lead by example. That's bad.
Psssh the tolerating of Patty n Forbes etc by not only players but yes men assistant coaches is LONG overdue to have been called out.

Bravo for DJ having some passion and TRUTH.
Oh, what do you say the Spurs are 10X better this year then the last 4 years of Poppycock.

Excellent example set by DJ.

[RC_Drunkford]

People in here overreacting, reading too much into a 5 second argument and twitter posts. I find this hilarious. DJ said Pop was on his ass this season to push him to greatness. Ain’t nothing wrong with that. Things got heated with Pop all the time back in the day. He curses people out in film sessions to the point where Kyle Anderson got pissed and Tim had to talk to him. That’s regular Spurs culture. Pop told Danny Green to stfu in a game. This happens. A player talking back to the coach when he gets chewed out is not out of the norm

[paperboy77]

Samanic seeing DJ talking back to his coach is not good. DJ should lead by example. That's bad.


Kind of agree but if DJ feels he's right then what's wrong with that? Pop's been fucking up lately considering he's considered an all timer. Every-now and then you gotta speak your mind.

[John B]

Kind of agree but if DJ feels he's right then what's wrong with that? Pop's been fucking up lately considering he's considered an all timer. Every-now and then you gotta speak your mind.

Nah I like DJ. I like the dog in him not backing down on anybody (see pushing Harden :lol). But I think that was bad. I'm sure he learned from it and everybody moved on. They looked okay in the Knicks game.

I'm sure after the game, Pop talks to them about everything else. But during game, anybody failing their assignment, Pop should call them out. Spurs didn't have that last year, in Forbes/Beli, not making them accountable.

This year, I like Pop calling them out and get better. And it sends message to the rest. So take it and carry on.

[BillMc]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJt7V6nnIiY

[TD 21]

They've definitely played a lot better recently, and with the close standins have a chance at a home court in the first round. Still, I don't think they'd be content with a first or second round playoff appearance after the Finals even if it probably was partly due to crazy circumstances.

Plus Riley has a tendency of doing something splashy to shake-up the team. Whether its trading for DeMar is still a question but if they can move a first then they have enough assets to at least get the Spurs consider it.

Maybe not content, but I don't think they'd make an illogical desperation move either.

If/when they make a move, I suspect it'll be for a big wing/four to replace Crowder. Then they'll probably sign Oladipo in the off season.

[duncan2150]

People in here overreacting, reading too much into a 5 second argument and twitter posts. I find this hilarious. DJ said Pop was on his ass this season to push him to greatness. Ain’t nothing wrong with that. Things got heated with Pop all the time back in the day. He curses people out in film sessions to the point where Kyle Anderson got pissed and Tim had to talk to him. That’s regular Spurs culture. Pop told Danny Green to stfu in a game. This happens. A player talking back to the coach when he gets chewed out is not out of the norm

+1

[Degoat]

I want to believe it so bad but I can’t see the spurs trading any of the vets

[DAF86]

demar is expendable only to the extent that we are confident that White can regularly play 33+ mpg. otherwise, our offense basically needs him to function. ideally, White could step up (or we get a FA like Collins who can help the offense), because Derozan does also limit the team due to his lack of defense and outside shooting

This. The idea is that with DeRozan gone, Murray and White (and maybe Keldon) can pick up the playmaking slack. I don't think is far stretched to suggest these guys can average around 20 ppg and 5/7 apg each. In that case, having a 3 and D guy (Vassell) in the lineup, instead of DeRozan, makes a whole lot more sense.

[spurraider21]

lol that clip is nothing

[poopbox]

:lol at that clip of DJ and Pop "arguing"

The clip of Becky and Pop arguing was 10 times worse than this...guess she going to be shipped out to :cry

[spurraider21]

This. The idea is that with DeRozan gone, Murray and White (and maybe Keldon) can pick up the playmaking slack. I don't think is far stretched to suggest these guys can average around 20 ppg and 5/7 apg each. In that case, having a 3 and D guy (Vassell) in the lineup, instead of DeRozan, makes a whole lot more sense.
basically, yeah. but its a tough question if its worth moving derozan now. team definitely gets worse for the rest of this year (unless white plays bubble levels and stays healthy)

[Ice009]

duncan2k5 - is there a contract the Spurs could offer DeRozan that you could live with? I was on the get-rid-of-him boat since 2019-2020 season, but a lot of posters have pointed out his value in bonding the team. He was the guy holding back Murray from going at Gregg the other night. And what I like best about his play is his passing. He's actively finding the right guy that leads to an open shot.

If I had to choose I'd still say move on, simply because it allows these recent draft picks (Walker, Samanic, Johnson, Vassell) to inherit the swingman minutes... BUT, I won't have a problem if they extend him. The ceiling isn't a title anyway so 3 more years of DeRozan won't be John Wall/Oladipo level dead-end.

Yeah, I was also all for getting rid of him last season for sure, but now I'm sort of indifferent. Like you said, I still won't have a problem moving on, but it's a little harder now. I'm not sure they can get anyone in the next three years to put us in the actual title contender status. The only way that would happen is if we got a really good young player in return and that guy, or 1 or 2 of our current young guys turn into an all-star or superstar level players, but the likelihood of that happening is pretty small. I don't think the Spurs are going to sign an all-star level or superstar level player in free agency, so yeah, not sure what to do.

The other options are, do you guys think if the Spurs let all the vets go that they could hold that cap space for next year and try for a big free agent signing the following off-season? Not sure what the following year's free agency class is like?

And the second, and my least preferred option is, let all the vets go, and finish in the lottery to try and get a top 5 draft pick to get the all-star level player that way. Having said that, as we all know, a top 5 (or even top 3) draft pick is still no guarantee that you'll get an all-star/superstar level player, and this team might all be too good to finish low enough to get one of those type of picks anyway.


I don't even think he is good at making young players better... everyone on his team got better with Kawhi...Lowry shed his choker label...Pascal became a star...Van Vleet became a known name around the NBA and got a big contract... because Kawhi is similar to Duncan... because they can be great without NEEDING the ball in their hands, it allows other players to build up their games...so Kawhi can go off for 30 or 40 without it meaning he is stifling the growth of other players because he can play off ball...

Typically players like DeMar who always need to hold the ball may get good assist numbers, but it also makes other players on the team one dimensional...it turns them into spot up shooter a as opposed to being dynamic players...so Kawhi could play off ball while Pascal learned his game and drives to the rim or posts up... because he knows he would be given the space to do so since Kawhi is a three point threat and also unselfish

You've got some more really good points that I didn't think about. The other aspect of TD and Kawhi is they both impacted the game on defense in a huge, huge way, so they really did so much more without the ball in their hands, and yeah, the point about him not having a three point shot, again, shows that it also limits the way he can be effective on offense. He can't spot up like Kawhi and wait for a pass to take an open three. He can however drive, but that is only one option, whereas Kawhi could either shoot an open three or drive if it's a hard closeout on him. No one is going to be closing out hard at DeMar open at the three point line when they know he doesn't want to shoot the three.


People in here overreacting, reading too much into a 5 second argument and twitter posts. I find this hilarious. DJ said Pop was on his ass this season to push him to greatness. Ain’t nothing wrong with that. Things got heated with Pop all the time back in the day. He curses people out in film sessions to the point where Kyle Anderson got pissed and Tim had to talk to him. That’s regular Spurs culture. Pop told Danny Green to stfu in a game. This happens. A player talking back to the coach when he gets chewed out is not out of the norm

What is the tweet thing? Also, someone mentioned reddit. Is it worth reading any Spurs related posts/discussion over there?

[RC_Drunkford]

What is the tweet thing? Also, someone mentioned reddit. Is it worth reading any Spurs related posts/discussion over there?

DJ liked a tweet where somebody said he'd be great on the Clippers and now everybody is freaking out thinking he might leave :lol

[BackHome]

Only way I see them moving Derozz is if him and his agent have let San Antonio know that they will not be signing back with them. He could have told the Spurs I like you and everything is cool but I want back to East or West Cost so money is not the issue but I am leaving so if you want to trade me that's cool.

[RC_Drunkford]

This. The idea is that with DeRozan gone, Murray and White (and maybe Keldon) can pick up the playmaking slack. I don't think is far stretched to suggest these guys can average around 20 ppg and 5/7 apg each. In that case, having a 3 and D guy (Vassell) in the lineup, instead of DeRozan, makes a whole lot more sense.

it's not about assist numbers, it's about bending the defense and drawing double teams. There been many times where this team couldn't get a bucket and DeMar had to go to work. You need to have a go-to-guy and nobody on this roster has these type of iso skills yet

[spurraider21]

it's not about assist numbers, it's about bending the defense and drawing double teams. There been many times where this team couldn't get a bucket and DeMar had to go to work. You need to have a go-to-guy and nobody on this roster has these type of iso skills yet
derrick white has had flashes of it

[MoSpur02]

it's not about assist numbers, it's about bending the defense and drawing double teams. There been many times where this team couldn't get a bucket and DeMar had to go to work. You need to have a go-to-guy and nobody on this roster has these type of iso skills yet

This. DeRozan isn’t easily replaceable. He can create his own shot, draw fouls, pull up, and draw a double team, which can lead to an open shot for someone else on the team. Unfortunately no one else on this team can do that. Sure White May show flashes of that and Murray has shown hints of some of that with his elbow jumper, but they aren’t there yet. If you trade DeRozan theN the Spurs are waving the white flag unless you get someone else who can do the same, which I don’t see happening.

[MoSpur02]

Trade Aldridge and Mills to Orlando for Gordon and Ross.

[MoSpur02]

Trade Aldridge to Sacramento for Barnes

[mo7888]

Trade Aldridge and Mills to Orlando for Gordon and Ross.

I think they'd rather include Fournier (even though he's the better player) than Ross because of their cap situation and not being able to resign him this summer. Either way, we'd have to include a 1st (which I'm good with).

[MoSpur02]

I think they'd rather include Fournier (even though he's the better player) than Ross because of their cap situation and not being able to resign him this summer. Either way, we'd have to include a 1st (which I'm good with).

True. Fournier is good, but another guard? I wouldn’t hate it, but I a myself would like Ross coming over more than Fournier.

Honestly Aldridge to me has checked out. He sees the writing on the wall and has checked out. He isn’t gonna return so the Spurs need to trade him and I think they will.

[rodchizz]

DDR for Beal?...does that work straight up?

[rah88sa]

Dude, that's better quality than mine. What app did you use to do this? Also, you missed the second part of the spat (my second gif).

I'm just linking someone's Reddit post. I didn't make the vid.

[offset formation]

DDR for Beal?...does that work straight up?


Spurs would never do DeRozan that way. Dump him on a perennial loser. Pop has way too much respect for him to do that, unless DD said it was OK and both sides knew he wasn'tresigning there. That's not the way they function. But then why would Washington do the trade?

[offset formation]

True. Fournier is good, but another guard? I wouldn’t hate it, but I a myself would like Ross coming over more than Fournier.

Honestly Aldridge to me has checked out. He sees the writing on the wall and has checked out. He isn’t gonna return so the Spurs need to trade him and I think they will.

Dude he's like 113 points away from 20,000. The only way I see him being traded is back to Portland at this point. He's not going to want to score such momentous career (and personal) points in a meaningless place where nobody truly appreciates his accomplishment. Also disagree on him checking out. I just think he's getting older and his body is starting to have old person issues.

But we'll see soon enough. If he's getting traded it'll happen before they start the second half.

[exstatic]

Dude he's like 113 points away from 20,000. The only way I see him being traded is back to Portland at this point. He's not going to want to score such momentous career (and personal) points in a meaningless place where nobody truly appreciates his accomplishment. Also disagree on him checking out. I just think he's getting older and his body is starting to have old person issues.

But we'll see soon enough. If he's getting traded it'll happen before they start the second half.

Why do you say that? 95% of in season trades happen ON deadline day. Especially in a season like this, you want the most information possible before you pull the trigger. A borderline playoff team may go from buyers to sellers if half their roster goes into health and safety protocols for a couple of weeks.

[MultiTroll]

Honestly Aldridge to me has checked out. He sees the writing on the wall and has checked out. He isn’t gonna return so the Spurs need to trade him and I think they will.
Or if Grandpa sits on a trade (just as likely) and LMAs still a Spur we get to see more average / below average effort from Muh Touches.
A complete lose/lose scenario.

:cry So classy. :cry

[PrimeMinister]

I’ve been trying to find a trade for aldridge that makes sense for the receiving team while also not giving us 5 players or bad salary and.... it’s pretty much impossible. You can work a deal to Portland if you add Nurkic and 3 rookie contracts but that just doesn’t make any sense for anyone. Boston can’t use their entire TPE without offloading close to 10 million, Nets have nothing.

The most realistic trade scenario for Aldridge honestly is sending him to Cleveland for Love under the assumption Cleveland immediately waives him making him free to sign anywhere, Spurs receive heavy draft compensation for taking the rest of Love’s deal that conveniently expires before 2023 free agency. I hate that deal just as much as you do, so I’m saying Aldridge gets bought out a couple of days before the playoff eligibility cutoff.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

It feels like LMA is getting lined up for a trade. How many players miss this much time with a stomach bug?

[offset formation]

Why do you say that? 95% of in season trades happen ON deadline day. Especially in a season like this, you want the most information possible before you pull the trigger. A borderline playoff team may go from buyers to sellers if half their roster goes into health and safety protocols for a couple of weeks.

I just think Pop gave LMA a promise that he'd be his coach his entire contract. So I don't think they'll trade him.

And if they do, and the poster I was replying to is correct that he's dogging it, then they'll do the Spurs thing and try to get him out of here as quickly as possible.

Again, I don't think he's going anywhere.

[offset formation]

It feels like LMA is getting lined up for a trade. How many players miss this much time with a stomach bug?

2?

[John B]

Detroit just bought out Griffin. Is he ringchasing with the Lakers? Nets? Does Spurs have a chance to land him? Is it worth it?

[PrimeMinister]

Detroit just bought out Griffin. Is he ringchasing with the Lakers? Nets? Does Spurs have a chance to land him? Is it worth it?

He’s going to push for the Lakers I’m certain. Guy would love to win a ring in LA as a f you to ballmer. Nets are a possibility but need him less especially now with the emergence of Claxton. Lakers are hurting a little bit and need to address their roster.

we aren’t even a factor.

[R. DeMurre]

I wonder what the final dollar number was for the Blake Griffin buy out. Man, did Detroit misplay that situation.

[poopbox]

Detroit just bought out Griffin. Is he ringchasing with the Lakers? Nets? Does Spurs have a chance to land him? Is it worth it?


He is being bought out cause he is washed up and trash ? We already have a guy who fits that mold on the spurs in LMA. Why would we want another one ?

Have you SEEN blake griffin play this year :lol

[spurraider21]

griffin can still handle the ball and pass well, but he has absolutely no juice left. he mostly just chucks 3's these days and not at a good clip

literally. more than half of his FGA this season have been 3PA and he's hitting 31% of them :lol

[exstatic]

It feels like LMA is getting lined up for a trade. How many players miss this much time with a stomach bug?

It’s only been two games, but that hip pointer went on a bit too long. I think they are keeping him off the court, but trying not to embarrass him with DNP CDs.

[rodchizz]

It unloads Beal contract and in return WAS receives an expiring contract in DDR

[RC_Drunkford]

Other teams looking for a back up big besides Boston, Brooklyn and Portland are Toronto, Phoenix and Dallas. Do I see a trade for Aldridge that works? No. Maybe a 3-team deal?

[DAF86]

it's not about assist numbers, it's about bending the defense and drawing double teams. There been many times where this team couldn't get a bucket and DeMar had to go to work. You need to have a go-to-guy and nobody on this roster has these type of iso skills yet

Again, the idea is that with DeRozan gone, these youngeter speed up the development of those skills. I have little doubt that guys like Murray and White would be able to become primary options with more opportunities.

[KingKev]

Again, the idea is that with DeRozan gone, these youngeter speed up the development of those skills. I have little doubt that guys like Murray and White would be able to become primary options with more opportunities.

I am indifferent regarding DDR 25mm a year or less. He is definitely in the Spurs potential plans though. If we landed another piece via trade or FA best believe DDR is back. As much as PATFO frustrates me recently these are conversations that are going on. I’m confident they are having fluid talks with all 4 of our vets to optimize our future with their needs also. Frustrating because other teams treat business like business. For better or worse I suspect PATFO operates in a whole other world than any other team.

[Kurgan]

IIRC, Spurs offered Demar an extension and he wasn't satisfied with the amount offered. I don't think the front office is gonna change their mind on what he's worth. When Spurs really like someone, they make sure to lock them up in a new contract. The fact that they haven't done so with Demar says they're not that eager to keep him. Either that or Demar has a ridiculous amount in mind as to what he thinks he's worth.

[exstatic]

IIRC, Spurs offered Demar an extension and he wasn't satisfied with the amount offered. I don't think the front office is gonna change their mind on what he's worth. When Spurs really like someone, they make sure to lock them up in a new contract. The fact that they haven't done so with Demar says they're not that eager to keep him. Either that or Demar has a ridiculous amount in mind as to what he thinks he's worth.

It could have been the amount, or it could have been the years. Maybe they offered two, and he wanted three or four.

[tbdog]

It could have been the amount, or it could have been the years. Maybe they offered two, and he wanted three or four.

Spurs could offer 3 and argue he got 4. Lets say they offer 3/80m, Spurs could argue it was actually 4/107 because he opt in.

[exstatic]

Spurs could offer 3 and argue he got 4. Lets say they offer 3/80m, Spurs could argue it was actually 4/107 because he opt in.

Yeah, that’s kind of a weak argument since the option was always his. They didn’t do anything for him to get paid this year.

[lmbebo]

It could have been the amount, or it could have been the years. Maybe they offered two, and he wanted three or four.

It could be that, or that they want to maintain cap flexibility ...

[MoSpur02]

According to Kevin O’Connor of the Ringer, the Spurs are one team showing interest in Vucevic.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/8/22319031/nba-power-rankings-midseason-brooklyn-nets

[MultiTroll]

Oladipo of Rockets also probably available.
Very similar stats.

Does this help or hurt moving Derozian?

[MoSpur02]

Oladipo of Rockets also probably available.
Very similar stats.

Does this help or hurt moving Derozian?

He is a FA after this season. Don’t see how that would improve the Spurs. DeRozan is a better fit right now with the Spurs so not sure why they would trade for Oladipo.

[MultiTroll]

He is a FA after this season. Don’t see how that would improve the Spurs. DeRozan is a better fit right now with the Spurs so not sure why they would trade for Oladipo.
Not talking about Spurs acquiring.

Talking about light years behind PATFO waiting on offers for DD, meanwhile perhaps Houston is willing to move Oladipo for far less?
Thus potential trade partners saying we could get Oladipo for much less then DD.

[mo7888]

Not talking about Spurs acquiring.

Talking about light years behind PATFO waiting on offers for DD, meanwhile perhaps Houston is willing to move Oladipo for far less?
Thus potential trade partners saying we could get Oladipo for much less then DD.

Oladipo can be gotten for much less than DDR because he's not nearly as good as DDR

[MultiTroll]

Oladipo can be gotten for much less than DDR because he's not nearly as good as DDR
:lol

Let me know when an NBA team thinks so. My guess is very little being offered for DD.
Unless Poppycock is holding out.

[MoSpur02]

Not talking about Spurs acquiring.

Talking about light years behind PATFO waiting on offers for DD, meanwhile perhaps Houston is willing to move Oladipo for far less?
Thus potential trade partners saying we could get Oladipo for much less then DD.

Ah. My bad.

Oladipo is pretty good, but DeRozan is better and actually a good fit here. You’re right though Oladipo will probably demand less than DeRozan, however, didn’t he just reject an offer from Houston for like $45 million for two years?

[mo7888]

:lol

Let me know when an NBA team thinks so. My guess is very little being offered for DD.
Unless Poppycock is holding out.

You can look to their past contracts as evidence...and this summer you can look at their new contracts as evidence.... as to Pop holding out, I'm sure they are...there's no need to trade ddr unless it brings something very significant.

[Mugen]

I'd much rather have Derozan than Dipo tbh. And I don't even like Derozan that much :lol

[MultiTroll]

Whatever, i agree DD is slightly better then Dipo and with Dipos knee injury perhaps I'll bump that up.

But if the Spurs sit on LMA and DD's expiring and both walk in FA, that will be further retardation.

[itzsoweezee]

According to Kevin O’Connor of the Ringer, the Spurs are one team showing interest in Vucevic.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2021/3/8/22319031/nba-power-rankings-midseason-brooklyn-nets

I’m guessing Aldridge plus one of the young guards.

[MoSpur02]

No doubt Spurs gotta move one of them and perhaps both, but depending on what/who they get in return. Moving Aldridge should be priority #1. He doesn’t fit, defense sucks, and has checked out (IMO). The sad thing is that his value currently sucks. The Spurs could only hope that a team wanting to shred salary next offseason will take Aldridge, but that usually means they want a young up and coming player in return. The other option would be a contending team desperately wanting a big that they feel can push them deep into the playoffs. Not sure there is a team out that sees Aldridge as that player. Maybe Boston? Portland? The return from those teams is weak though. A team like Orlando might trade Vucevic, but would they want Aldridge? Only if they are that desperate to rid themselves of his contract, which isn’t bad at all. They would want someone like Walker in return though.

[Dejounte]

There's no "need" for him to go. He's only on the hook for a few more months. Holding onto him a little longer and letting him go should be enough. Tell him thank you for all the years and the things you've taught our young kids. There's no urgency here. If there was a good trade to be had, by all means go for it. But Aldridge isn't a hot potato you need to get rid of because he's hurting anything on the team. He's not doing that because he's not playing much anymore.

[MoSpur02]

There's no "need" for him to go. He's only on the hook for a few more months. Holding onto him a little longer and letting him go should be enough. Tell him thank you for all the years and the things you've taught our young kids. There's no urgency here. If there was a good trade to be had, by all means go for it. But Aldridge isn't a hot potato you need to get rid of because he's hurting anything on the team. He's not doing that because he's not playing much anymore.

I’m gonna disagree. Only because everyone pretty much knows he’s not gonna return so you might as well get something for him.

[Dejounte]

I’m gonna disagree. Only because everyone pretty much knows he’s not gonna return so you might as well get something for him.

I see it the same way as Marco Belinelli. The Spurs let him walk because he literally had no value.

If the guy has no value, then what's the point? You said so yourself.

I think we're getting too caught up in getting value for everything when the guy already gave value in an intangible way. For some reason, people need to see the exchange in numbers, figures, or something that flat out spells the value out in front of their eyes.

[Seventyniner]

There's no "need" for him to go. He's only on the hook for a few more months. Holding onto him a little longer and letting him go should be enough. Tell him thank you for all the years and the things you've taught our young kids. There's no urgency here. If there was a good trade to be had, by all means go for it. But Aldridge isn't a hot potato you need to get rid of because he's hurting anything on the team. He's not doing that because he's not playing much anymore.

I agree. If things really go south with his attitude and/or game, the Spurs can just buy him out.

[MoSpur02]

I see it the same way as Marco Belinelli. The Spurs let him walk because he literally had no value.

If the guy has no value, then what's the point? You said so yourself.

I think we're getting too caught up in getting value for everything when the guy already gave value in an intangible way. For some reason, people need to see the exchange in numbers, figures, or something that flat out spells the value out in front of their eyes.

His value is low, but there could be a team willing to take him to shed salary this offseason. The Cavs have been wanting to get rid of Love. Now Vucevic’s name is being brought up. Who knows? I’m not a big fan of Love, but his 3pt shot and rebounding could be an asset to this team.

[MultiTroll]

I see it the same way as Marco Belinelli. The Spurs let him walk because he literally had no value.

If the guy has no value, then what's the point? You said so yourself.

I think we're getting too caught up in getting value for everything when the guy already gave value in an intangible way. For some reason, people need to see the exchange in numbers, figures, or something that flat out spells the value out in front of their eyes.
If Aldridge has "no value" tf is he doing on the team eating up minutes and 24 million this season? :pop:

[exstatic]

His value is low, but there could be a team willing to take him to shed salary this offseason. The Cavs have been wanting to get rid of Love. Now Vucevic’s name is being brought up. Who knows? I’m not a big fan of Love, but his 3pt shot and rebounding could be an asset to this team.

Capspace or several mid level FAs >>>> Kevin Love.

[exstatic]

If Aldridge has "no value" tf is he doing on the team eating up minutes and 24 million this season? :pop:

Have you noticed that he’s not eating minutes much recently?

[MultiTroll]

Have you noticed that he’s not eating minutes much recently?
:clap
With damage done and behind us, now a half season to go HOF coach has woken up?
Probably some teams could have been snookered after one his 56 point outbursts of moons ago.

This pattern of overpaying and hanging onto washed vets is soo beyond old.
The bubble Spurs never happened by design. CIA Popped was absolutely going to play Forbes and his other pets before injuries forced the Young Core bubble.

Oh well, glad it happened. IMO someone got involved in the offseason and told Popped the bubble line ups needed to continue.
Thankfully he partially complied and for the most part has stayed out of the way of Young Core development this season.

Moving fwd, if some team offers an 18th round pick for LMA why not take it? Spurs drafting has remained top notch thru out.

[exstatic]

:clap
With damage done and behind us, now a half season to go HOF coach has woken up?
Probably some teams could have been snookered after one his 56 point outbursts of moons ago.

This pattern of overpaying and hanging onto washed vets is soo beyond old.
The bubble Spurs never happened by design. CIA Popped was absolutely going to play Forbes and his other pets before injuries forced the Young Core bubble.

Oh well, glad it happened. IMO someone got involved in the offseason and told Popped the bubble line ups needed to continue.
Thankfully he partially complied and for the most part has stayed out of the way of Young Core development this season.

Moving fwd, if some team offers an 18th round pick for LMA why not take it? Spurs drafting has remained top notch thru out.
To be fair to Pop, LMA has dropped off a cliff that I don’t think anyone saw coming this quickly. They gave him time to work it out, 21 games, and then, other than covering COVID shortages for 3 games, he hasn’t played at all.

[mo7888]

Capspace or several mid level FAs >>>> Kevin Love.

But is that really the question? Are we discussing trading them straight up or are we talking about a 1st or two coming our way?

[tbdog]

Yeah, that’s kind of a weak argument since the option was always his. They didn’t do anything for him to get paid this year.

Not if Spurs were offering him a 4 year contract last off season.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

I think folks who keep saying trade Aldridge are forgetting that we have to take back a contract or contracts that are similar to his unless the team we are trading him to can absorb his deal. It isn’t many teams that can absorb that much money.

trading for Kevin Love and another year (expires at the end of 2022-23 season) of his bad contract isn’t a smart move in my opinion. He is worse on defense than Aldridge and more injury prone also. He is a better rebounder, passer, and 3 point shooter but I’m sure we all can agree we would rather have a big guy who can defend.

[Dex]

I think folks who keep saying trade Aldridge are forgetting that we have to take back a contract or contracts that are similar to his unless the team we are trading him to can absorb his deal. It isn’t many teams that can absorb that much money.

trading for Kevin Love and another year (expires at the end of 2022-23 season) of his bad contract isn’t a smart move in my opinion. He is worse on defense than Aldridge and more injury prone also. He is a better rebounder, passer, and 3 point shooter but I’m sure we all can agree we would rather have a big guy who can defend.

Agreed, Kevin Love is a lateral move at best but more likely a downgrade with a worse contract. Hard pass

[KobesAchilles]

If Aldridge has "no value" tf is he doing on the team eating up minutes and 24 million this season? :pop:
You can thank Brian Wrong for that. Picking up his option was always a bad move.

[exstatic]

You can thank Brian Wrong for that. Picking up his option was always a bad move.

He wasn’t awful last year, when the FO guaranteed his deal. It’s always a good idea to wait, though.

[Thomas82]

I think folks who keep saying trade Aldridge are forgetting that we have to take back a contract or contracts that are similar to his unless the team we are trading him to can absorb his deal. It isn’t many teams that can absorb that much money.

trading for Kevin Love and another year (expires at the end of 2022-23 season) of his bad contract isn’t a smart move in my opinion. He is worse on defense than Aldridge and more injury prone also. He is a better rebounder, passer, and 3 point shooter but I’m sure we all can agree we would rather have a big guy who can defend.

If we could get Cleveland's lottery pick I actually wouldn't mind doing that deal.

[mo7888]

If we could get Cleveland's lottery pick I actually wouldn't mind doing that deal.

That's my view as well...the earlier talk about Vuc (giving up way to much) to play behind Poeltl (as some suggested) is similar to this imo. Love is fine as a backup C and is similar to Vuc in some respects. Yes, he's way overpaid but an unprotected 1st would mitigate that...

[Dejounte]

rankingtear (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=44897)

From your boy, NBASupes, the Atlanta Hawks insider:

The biggest players that should be moved is DeRozan and Oladipo. I was told that both have high value cost but teams feel the price is reasonable. DeRozan to Charlotte just seems like it can be a thing. Pop likes Rozier too. A lot of these borderline teams are looking for that player to get them over the edge.

https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/432056-lets-talk-trade-ideas/page/52/?tab=comments#comment-1070388

Do us a solid, James Borrego.

[Dejounte]

More from that guy:

I actually just spoke with him on the Hawks.

Snell, Bruno, Dunn, Rondo are available at the right price. Snell though due to injuries is highly valued for where he was in JAN. Dunn is not available but he is if they can get the right type of player as mentioned below. Gallo or Bogi is not available. None of the core kids are either. JC is available but not really. Atlanta wants a top 5-10 pick for him or an equal young player. A lot of teams have interest in JC but the asking price is extremely high for most. JC is a fall back plan for most teams. There is still this thought that he could end up back in Atlanta. It's all about the market. Teams feel JC is worth exactly what Atlanta offered and while some are willing to go over 90 million, it's not that much over is what he's hearing.

Knicks are interested in a 3 way deal with Atlanta where Randle goes to Atlanta, JC, Mitch Rob, and Snell to MIN, and KAT goes to NY while a lot of picks goes to MIN but MIN and ATL have shown no interest so far. Knicks are trying to get a superstar as quiet as it's kept. KAT is their primary target. Next is Booker who loves PHX right now.
Hawks aren't buyers or salers yet but have had interest in Eric Bledsoe I've heard. The thing about Bledsoe is Atlanta could get him without trading a 1st or Snell either. Dunn/Rondo can land them Bledsoe.

Atlanta has also talked to New Orleans about Redick.

To @TheNorthCydeRises (https://www.hawksquawk.net/profile/3641-thenorthcyderises/) happiness or sadness, Bruno has been added to the available list. He's mainly a salary filler at this stage if moved.
Hawks do believe that they have a shot to not only make the playoffs but get homecourt and they are fighting to be a top 4 seed.

Nothing big outside of the Knicks snooping around is happening right now.

Oladipo, Gordon, and Forniner are getting a lot of buzz but I was told the price is really high for them. Oladipo seems to be getting the most buzz. Memphis has been linked to him the most he said. Houston wants a top 10 protected 1st for VO.

Expect JC interest to pick up soon, although he's likely to NOT be traded. Once again, teams around the league DON'T feel he's worth this type of money and many think Atlanta offer was excellent. His value is his RFA status which is why Atlanta wants SO MUCH for him.

He didn't mention anything about us targeting a center right now.

Lonzo Ball is another player teams like but like JC, the price is massive. Orlando has spoke on potentially bringing Ball to ORL.

Note: Orlando wants to make a push for the playoffs. They are NOT in sell mode. They are only in asset mode and if they can land one or trade their players for some, they are fine with that. The cost for their players is HIGH.

Houston is selling but outside of Tucker, I was told, not for cheap. Tucker is expected to be traded.

Blake Griffin is getting some calls to return back to LAC if brought out. With Batum success and the lack of PF depth, LAC is interested in the return of the greatest Clipper of all time.

The biggest players that should be moved is DeRozan and Oladipo. I was told that both have high value cost but teams feel the price is reasonable. DeRozan to Charlotte just seems like it can be a thing. Pop likes Rozier too. A lot of these borderline teams are looking for that player to get them over the edge.

Oh, almost forgot, Lowry also is available and for cheap but I was told, he's unlikely to be moved as he wants to go to a contender. This is not new news. This is just confirmed. His contract and demands makes things hard.

Shams has pretty much nailed things. Boston wants Grant but he's gonna cost Boston their life assets wise, LMAO!

[mo7888]

rankingtear (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=44897)

From your boy, NBASupes, the Atlanta Hawks insider:

The biggest players that should be moved is DeRozan and Oladipo. I was told that both have high value cost but teams feel the price is reasonable. DeRozan to Charlotte just seems like it can be a thing. Pop likes Rozier too. A lot of these borderline teams are looking for that player to get them over the edge.

https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/432056-lets-talk-trade-ideas/page/52/?tab=comments#comment-1070388

Do us a solid, James Borrego.

What would a potential Charlotte trade look like for Demar? I don't follow them that closely.

[Maddog]

rankingtear (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=44897)

From your boy, NBASupes, the Atlanta Hawks insider:

The biggest players that should be moved is DeRozan and Oladipo. I was told that both have high value cost but teams feel the price is reasonable. DeRozan to Charlotte just seems like it can be a thing. Pop likes Rozier too. A lot of these borderline teams are looking for that player to get them over the edge.

https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/432056-lets-talk-trade-ideas/page/52/?tab=comments#comment-1070388

Do us a solid, James Borrego.

Rozier
Yeah just what is needed another combo guard. Also why would charlotte want DDR?
I see very little that makes sense for both the Spurs and and any purported trading partner

[Dejounte]

Rozier
Yeah just what is needed another combo guard. Also why would charlotte want DDR?
I see very little that makes sense for both the Spurs and and any purported trading partner

Rozier is who we want Lonnie to become.

He destroyed us the last time we played them.

[Seventyniner]

Rozier is who we want Lonnie to become.

He destroyed us the last time we played them.

I am frankly shocked at how efficient Rozier has become. There was some buzz that the Spurs were considering trading Number Two to Boston with Rozier being part of the return package. At the time I wanted no part of him: a 6'1" SG who only shot 40% from the floor sounded like a less efficient version of Bryn Forbes.

Now Rozier is taking 7.7 threes per game and hitting an eye-popping 43.9% of them. His TS% is 62.6, which would lead the Spurs by a good margin (DeRozan is at 59.4, a career high for him). Rozier would be like a super-Mills on the Spurs, and would of course start rather than coming off the bench. He's on a reasonable contract too ($17.9M next season, then a free agent). While DeRozan is the engine of the offense right now, Rozier would help the Spurs build a Utah style of offense if that's what they want. Rozier/White/Samanic as volume three-point shooters surrounding Murray (who hopefully can at least improve to league-average from three) and Poeltl likely wouldn't set the world on fire like Utah is, but can be a reasonable facsimile.

I don't know if Rozier is any good on defense, but given his negative DBPM numbers and short stature I would guess he isn't.

[rjv]

i don't think the spurs consider moving demar unless they know he's not returning and i don't think LMA is going anywhere because i can't see any team offering anything of value for him. or a deal that would work out salary-cap wise. i mean, if we can get an expiring contact that matched LMA's and a draft pick, that'd be great. it'd also be a miracle.

[exstatic]

rankingtear (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=44897)

From your boy, NBASupes, the Atlanta Hawks insider:

The biggest players that should be moved is DeRozan and Oladipo. I was told that both have high value cost but teams feel the price is reasonable. DeRozan to Charlotte just seems like it can be a thing. Pop likes Rozier too. A lot of these borderline teams are looking for that player to get them over the edge.

https://www.hawksquawk.net/topic/432056-lets-talk-trade-ideas/page/52/?tab=comments#comment-1070388

Do us a solid, James Borrego.

Rozier and PJ Washington works.

[buttsR4rebounding]

DDR to Charlotte isn't happening. They almost have to include Rozier for salary. Even then assuming the Spurs won't go over the lux tax threshold then they would have to include at least 2 other players. They could use Cody Zeller if the play is to get their draft pick, but beyond that why would the Spurs add another guard to the rotation?

[Degoat]

Charlotte is trying to make the playoffs and a Lamelo, Demar, Hayward trio should get them there. I really like PJ Washington if he was included in the trade, one of Keldons teammates from kentucky

[exstatic]

DDR to Charlotte isn't happening. They almost have to include Rozier for salary. Even then assuming the Spurs won't go over the lux tax threshold then they would have to include at least 2 other players. They could use Cody Zeller if the play is to get their draft pick, but beyond that why would the Spurs add another guard to the rotation?

Repeating myself, but Rozier and PJ Washington works. Obviously, Charlotte would have to reach an agreement with DD and his representation that he would stay.