Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, 2022 First Round Pick and 2028 First Round Pick Swap for Derrick White

[R. DeMurre]

Will Brown and Taytum even pass him the ball? That’s the real question

Brown & Tatum average significantly more assists per game than KJ & McDermott, so I doubt that'll be an issue.

[wildbill2u]

The only thing that worries me about this trade is that it opens up some cap space to give Keldon a White-like extension that he doesn't deserve. KJ's terrible defense and his inability to improve on that end means he's going to be a money sink if the Spurs give him starter level money.

Find a new home for Keldon before he gets an extension.

[objective]

The only thing that worries me about this trade is that it opens up some cap space to give Keldon a White-like extension that he doesn't deserve. KJ's terrible defense and his inability to improve on that end means he's going to be a money sink if the Spurs give him starter level money.

I agree. Even with Dejounte, White and Poeltl the defense would suffer for keldon and McDermott.

I don't want to see keldon get a 4/70 or 4/80, or worse when he's not even the equal of White.

[RC_Drunkford]

I could honestly see the Spurs trade Murray next season. There doesn’t seem a way to build a competitive team around him anytime soon, so they might just sell high for a 2023 pick

[duncan2150]

More I think about it the less I like it. I've said back through the summer and I think since he signed the deal, that they could have moved him for a first round pick whenever they wanted. Easy.

Did they really improve on that? I read the swap was #1 protected. And probably 2022 is a pick in the 20s ... But they're down a good player now.

White is a good NBA player. And he will leave a hole in their roster, because Romeo doesn't look like an NBA player and Richardson is an average player only under contract for another year who has been passed around like a groupie.

And I don't buy this 'timeline' stuff. If the Spurs cared about timelines, they wouldn't have signed a 30 year old McDermott to a 3 year deal.

White is good. They don't even make the playoffs against Denver without White. He will be great in Boston alongside better talent.

Yes, White gone helps a tank. But it just highlights the terrible decision to not tank when Kawhi was hiding. It made sense to compete with no chance if it helped Pop keep some dignity, but now they're tanking anyway with Pop all the same. What a giant waste of time. They should have told Kawhi to get bent, and moved off the vets they never moved and been back in business by now and not junking good players. Great, it makes time for Primo ... How about keeping him with Primo and getting rid of guys who aren't legit good like Lonnie?

Disappointed.

I'm totally on the opposite side

Imo you can't have a better trade for a role player like White who's 27 now. A Pick , a swap, some flexibility ( you don't talk about this part), a guy like Richardson who's not that bad and a kind of project with Langford.

One thing i don't agree is that it's not a choice between Lonnie and Derrick, both could have been traded. Spurs choose Primo and Vasell over White and i think it's a good idea.

My last point is to analyze this trade now, not with the past of the franchise. They could have done a better job before, everybody agree but it still a good trade imo.

Still i understand your point of view objective.

[wildbill2u]

White was a good defender, but never had the ability to be a shooting guard. After all, isn't a SG supposed to be aggressive in shooting and have a decent 3pt shot. White was a career 34% 3 pt shooter and didn't show signs of improving. (Ref: Keldon Johnson improvement). In fact, there seemed to be a lot of games where he was back to being shy about taking the 3pt shot when he was open and could have. Once DJM won the PG spot, White became expendable because he never developed as an adequate SG. So thanks, Derrick, for what you gave us and I hope Boston is the right spot for ya.

That SG spot is now officially open for one of the other guards to take over. The competition between Primo and Vassell should be a highlight going down the rest of the schedule. I wonder if Vassell has enough aggressiveness to be the SG. And TBH his 3pt shooting percentage isn't any better than White for this year.

I actually think Primo is a better passer than Vassell at this point. If he loses that rookie shyness and starts to look for his shot more, we'll see if he really is the sharpshooter we drafted. His shooting percentages aren't very good TBH, but then he IS a rookie and hasn't had the ball put into his hands to win the SG spot. He could blossom with more time on court and the dose of confidence he could get from playing for the job this year.

[objective]

I'm totally on the opposite side

Imo you can't have a better trade for a role player like White who's 27 now. A Pick , a swap, some flexibility ( you don't talk about this part), a guy like Richardson who's not that bad and a kind of project with Langford.

One thing i don't agree is that it's not a choice between Lonnie and Derrick, both could have been traded. Spurs choose Primo and Vasell over White and i think it's a good idea.

My last point is to analyze this trade now, not with the past of the franchise. They could have done a better job before, everybody agree but it still a good trade imo.

Still i understand your point of view objective.

Maybe they could not have gotten any better pick wise, fair enough.

But I think about player quality. If they had traded White and a first for John Collins, I would have been annoyed that they didn't try to sign the tender and have both, but at least it would have been arguably a better player who was definitely at a position of need.

I think White is good enough to be a starter on a title team, or at least a 6th man, and pull his own weight. And that's hard to get.

Richardson ain't it. Romeo ain't it. And the pick could be, but could also fall short of White's level like Walker, keldon, Samanic, Anderson, and now Romeo when we're talking picks 14-30. Even Vassell isn't there yet. The odds are not in the Spurs favor.

Add in that he wasn't terribly overpaid, he wasn't an underwater contract, and he was a low maintenance player, on a locked in for years. Not having to wonder if he wanted out for a bigger market or hotter club scene, he was fine where he was.

He was a good piece on a fair deal and I just think it's hard to step back from players like that, they don't grow on trees, look at Lonnie and Luka.

[jermaine]

WOULD YOU SAY HE WAS THA JUICE OF A DUMPSTA?

Very much so. Soggy trash with fecal matter on it...

[jermaine]

I dont get all this White love from people. Only consistent things he ever did is take charges, run around in the paint an pick up his dribble under the basket, and run into the paint and flop into the defense an lose his footing looking like he traveled. His decision making was certified booty crumbs, an you damn sure couldn't count on his 3 ball. Set the B.S. guys. He looked like a special needs kid with that big ass head, then had the nerve to never do nuttin with that Whigga hair of his. Braid that shit nicca!!

[cjw]

Generally it's almost impossible to move up from a spot like #6 to #2 or #3 without a major investment. Teams get very tightfisted. The picks we may get in the teens might be put together to move up a few spots but that's generally it.

Thats what I meant. I should have clarified - trading the picks isn’t going to be enough. But the Spurs have enough other assets (and probably without Murray) to move up if they REALLY wanted to.

[KingKev]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfmPOecrBJw

I wouldn't mind having him play PF off the bench

He is 6’5. He can defend bigger wings and some 4’s but I don’t see him getting much burn at the 4 if he becomes a full time rotation player.

[ceperez]

Memphis is a testament that you need to draft an all-star player to get a chance to even get into the playoffs in the West.

DJM is an all-star, but he's a borderline guy that is more like a role player with good stats than a dominant player.

I thought KJ would get to the next level this year but it hasn't happened other that having a higher % 3 point shot.

What the Spurs have are very good role players but not anyone who can take over games. It's just not good enough to win against Western teams that all have legitimate go to players.

So Spurs have no choice but to gamble on picks and players who can jump out of the gym.

[ceperez]

He is 6’5. He can defend bigger wings and some 4’s but I don’t see him getting much burn at the 4 if he becomes a full time rotation player.

A player like Danny Green thrived in the Spurs with a lot less basketball skills than this guy. I think he could be yet another decent role player for the Spurs.

[DJR210]

White's peak was the dunk in the Utah series.. great trade.

[J_Paco]

White's peak was the dunk in the Utah series.. great trade.

Correction, Denver series.......

[Dex]

White's peak was the dunk in the Utah series.. great trade.


Correction, Denver series.......

This. That series made everyone believe White had his coming out party...but then injuries, passive play, and crazy rotations seemed to derail him.

If we had the Derrick White from that series, I'd say he is definitely a keeper and one to build around. Unfortunately, that White only seemed to show up from time to time.

[exstatic]

I wonder how Derrick will play post-trade. He clearly had no interest in even trying to be more than a glue guy, so theoretically he is in the type of situation he wants to be in now. But he's very neurotic. His confidence might fall off a cliff at being traded and in a whole new world.

I always remember the Spurs story video on him, where his HS coach said that it took him awhile but eventually the team was better when they put the ball in Derricks hands, and that every coach along the way figured it out. All except one, that is. Boston has been needing a true PG for a while, and Derrick will do well there.

[lefty]

1491844825078972419
:lol He gone

[DesignatedT]

This was a solid trade for White. Spurs needed to move on. Nobody was going to give up a top 10 pick for the guy. I understand people liked Derrick as did I... probably the most likable guy on the team the past few years so I get why some people are acting upset, but the Spurs had been fielding calls on him for sometime now. They knew what his value was throughout the league.

[Ocotillo]

I wonder if the HEB commercials will be running tonight?

[rjv]

I dont get all this White love from people. Only consistent things he ever did is take charges, run around in the paint an pick up his dribble under the basket, and run into the paint and flop into the defense an lose his footing looking like he traveled. His decision making was certified booty crumbs, an you damn sure couldn't count on his 3 ball. Set the B.S. guys. He looked like a special needs kid with that big ass head, then had the nerve to never do nuttin with that Whigga hair of his. Braid that shit nicca!!

white had become very sloppy with the ball as of late, often even dribbling the ball of his own feet, or just taking the ball right into the heart of the defense and having the ball swiped clean from him. he was also getting pretty sloppy with some of his passes.

[RC_Drunkford]

He is 6’5. He can defend bigger wings and some 4’s but I don’t see him getting much burn at the 4 if he becomes a full time rotation player.

all we do is play 4 guard line ups, the only PF is KBD. We played Vassell at Center once, so Romeo at the 3 or 4 can happen

[GreekSpursfan]

Good luck White, solid trade anyway you see it

[R. DeMurre]

White was a good defender, but never had the ability to be a shooting guard. After all, isn't a SG supposed to be aggressive in shooting and have a decent 3pt shot. White was a career 34% 3 pt shooter and didn't show signs of improving. (Ref: Keldon Johnson improvement). In fact, there seemed to be a lot of games where he was back to being shy about taking the 3pt shot when he was open and could have. Once DJM won the PG spot, White became expendable because he never developed as an adequate SG. So thanks, Derrick, for what you gave us and I hope Boston is the right spot for ya.



If anything, it's Keldon who has shown signs of being shy about taking threes. White lead the team with 5.3 3pt attempts per game in 30.3 minutes while Keldon has averaged 4.4 Attempts in 31.1 minutes. I get the reason for trading White, but if anything, Keldon is more frustrating to watch for me because he so frequently passes up threes, despite having the best possible success percentage-wise this year. Watching the Spurs this year, I've become convinced that there should be a new statistical category called "Passed Up Threes." I have a feeling this year's Spurs would be among the league leaders.

[The Truth #6]

I’m curious to see how they look at Josh and Romeo. I mean, similar 3/D players, no? Going to be hard to fit them all in. Given that, Lonnie’s agent is probably trying to get him off the team, so to speak.

[KobesAchilles]

Brown & Tatum average significantly more assists per game than KJ & McDermott, so I doubt that'll be an issue.
Talk to Marcus Smart about that

[emanueldavidginobili]

Celtics radio play by play announcer

1492026567639375902

[exstatic]

I’m curious to see how they look at Josh and Romeo. I mean, similar 3/D players, no? Going to be hard to fit them all in. Given that, Lonnie’s agent is probably trying to get him off the team, so to speak.

Romeo is 22. Josh is 28. It’s nothing more than a math problem.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1492020939206316032

[R. DeMurre]

Talk to Marcus Smart about that


He's the least talented offensively of all of their starters. If I was Ime Udoka, I'd probably be suggesting they pass more frequently to each other or the uber efficient Robert Williams too.

[The Truth #6]

Romeo is 22. Josh is 28. It’s nothing more than a math problem.

Neither of them look to have star potential, so I see it more of a potential talent/fit issue. But it sounds like you’re suggesting they see the younger player as the priority?

[KobesAchilles]

He's the least talented offensively of all of their starters. If I was Ime Udoka, I'd probably be suggesting they pass more frequently to each other or the uber efficient Robert Williams too.
I agree. But the offense is super Tatum and Brown reliant. Might be good for White to be a catch and shoot player. Idk. White has no drive to really take over and initiate his own offense for some reason.

[duncan2k5]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfmPOecrBJw

I wouldn't mind having him play PF off the bench

Cut the midget ball shit...the best teams play big

[rankingtear]

Cut the midget ball shit...the best teams play big

Not really.

[exstatic]

Neither of them look to have star potential, so I see it more of a potential talent/fit issue. But it sounds like you’re suggesting they see the younger player as the priority?

Absolutely. With White gone, or oldest core player is Poodle at 26. Younger players are more teachable. With a 22 YO, you could spiff up his shooting, and have a rotation 3 and D guy for a decade.

[RC_Drunkford]

Cut the midget ball shit...the best teams play big

we don't have any bigs besides our 3 Centers. We've been playing midget ball for over 3 years

[tim_duncan_fan]

I always remember the Spurs story video on him, where his HS coach said that it took him awhile but eventually the team was better when they put the ball in Derricks hands, and that every coach along the way figured it out. All except one, that is. Boston has been needing a true PG for a while, and Derrick will do well there.
You think Pop held Derrick back? I felt like we all, all of Spursdom, Pop included, were begging Derrick to show out constantly.

[exstatic]

You think Pop held Derrick back? I felt like we all, all of Spursdom, Pop included, were begging Derrick to show out constantly.

Derrick plays better on the ball than off. I think you’ll see that in Boston. Pop made the decisions he made, and I don’t think there was anything malevolent about it, just wasn’t the best use of Derrick’s talent. He came into the league already able to run the PnR at a high level.

[TrueSpursFan]

If anything, it's Keldon who has shown signs of being shy about taking threes. White lead the team with 5.3 3pt attempts per game in 30.3 minutes while Keldon has averaged 4.4 Attempts in 31.1 minutes. I get the reason for trading White, but if anything, Keldon is more frustrating to watch for me because he so frequently passes up threes, despite having the best possible success percentage-wise this year. Watching the Spurs this year, I've become convinced that there should be a new statistical category called "Passed Up Threes." I have a feeling this year's Spurs would be among the league leaders.

Not sure I agree with that. I watch every spurs game and I see keldon taking threes even though he might be tightly guarded. I never feel like he should have taken a three where he would drive instead. I don’t get that frustration feeling like I get when White attempts a 3 and I know it’s not going in.

[ceperez]

Cut the midget ball shit...the best teams play big

So true. Spurs have an undersized team. White, Walker and even Murray are undersized players.

[BatManu20]

1492159304060841985

[Chinook]

I'm glad Derrick got a more thoughtful tribute than Young and Eubanks. Dude really put his time in with the organization.

[Robz4000]

1492159304060841985


Gonna miss White tbh. Prolly my favorite Spur since LDN and Bobo left.

[slick'81]

Maybe white will come back at 31 when his contract expires

[timtonymanu]

I'll never forget how huge he was for the Spurs in 2019. I don't care if he never reached that level again, he was fun to watch and I'll miss him.

[Thomas82]

I could honestly see the Spurs trade Murray next season. There doesn’t seem a way to build a competitive team around him anytime soon, so they might just sell high for a 2023 pick

That doesn't sound too far-fetched to me either.

[KingKev]

So crazy that we traded the future Manu Ginobilli 2.0! He was supposed to be our up and coming 6th man for at least 3 NBA titles. SMH.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Derrick going off at the Boston Garden right now. Boston fans are loving this guy. They're already calling him the best passer on the team lmao which is probably true.

[Dejounte]

How the fk is 8 points “going off”

hes going off so hard that they’re still losing by 9 pts

[CGD]

Derrick going off at the Boston Garden right now. Boston fans are loving this guy. They're already calling him the best passer on the team lmao which is probably true.

That’s because Smart is utter trash

[daslicer]

How the fk is 8 points “going off”

hes going off so hard that they’re still losing by 9 pts

That Jokic guy is pretty good and a huge reason why they are down by 9.

[mystargtr34]

I think White will thrive in the 6th man playmaking/scoring role ala Ginobili. Like many here thought he should have played with the Spurs.

He'll do well in Boston imo. He can run the second unit and I think he'll close a lot of games with the R.Williams(or Horford)/Tatum/Brown/White/Smart lineup. Boston already had a top 5 defense in the L.

[KingKev]

Derrick going off at the Boston Garden right now. Boston fans are loving this guy. They're already calling him the best passer on the team lmao which is probably true.

I haven’t been to Boston is 7-8 years but Boston Garden is gone.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I haven’t been to Boston is 7-8 years but Boston Garden is gone.
I was born and raised in Boston and will always call it that lol something similar to Lakers fans not calling the Staples Center the Crypto.com Arena or whatever its called lmao

[KingKev]

I was born and raised in Boston and will always call it that lol something similar to Lakers fans not calling the Staples Center the Crypto.com Arena or whatever its called lmao

Those are naming rights though. Staples was never referred to as the Forum.

[RC_Drunkford]

Edit: wrong thread :lol

[exstatic]

I could honestly see the Spurs trade Murray next season. There doesn’t seem a way to build a competitive team around him anytime soon, so they might just sell high for a 2023 pick

If they burn it all the way down, be prepared for an OKC/ Philly length rebuild

[RC_Drunkford]

If they burn it all the way down, be prepared for an OKC/ Philly length rebuild

really depends on the draft tbh. The team didn't get worse, but needs to find a running mate in this draft for DJ. Banchero would probably be the guy who could produce immediately, but I'm good with any of the top 4

[kht]

Are Langford (#14 overall pick) and Richardson gonna even get any type of run with us?

[8FOR!3]

Derrick White is the best PG on the Celtics. Marcus Smart is a great defender and Payton Prichard can score but Derrick White is better and more of a PG than both of them.

[ceperez]

Looks like the Celtics got a good deal acquiring White. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5BjzjfM_s

I just realized that because he was in USA basketball that he's familiar with Tatum and Brown.

[RC_Drunkford]

Looks like the Celtics got a good deal acquiring White. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO5BjzjfM_s

I just realized that because he was in USA basketball that he's familiar with Tatum and Brown.

his father is also a Celtics fan and his head coach is Ime. He will like playing there

[ceperez]

his father is also a Celtics fan and his head coach is Ime. He will like playing there

Looks like Spurs always place their players in idea situations (see: DeRozan).

[ceperez]

his father is also a Celtics fan and his head coach is Ime. He will like playing there

Looks like Spurs always place their players in idea situations (see: DeRozan).

He's going to do well there with a lot more talent around him.

[Mr. Body]

I'm feeling less happy about the trade. It's hard to give up talent and I don't think a ton about Richardson or Langford. The FRP will be... okay. The swap coule be excellent, or not.

The fact is that the trade was because White's age and salary, and I get it. I just am not terribly happy about it.

[DJR210]

Correction, Denver series.......

Yep, Denver. Was so long ago that he was a difference maker I forgot 😂

[buttsR4rebounding]

The Derrick White trade is a disaster
Sorry, folks. Brad Stevens made his first major mistake as GM.
By Neil Iyer Feb 11, 2022, 12:59pm
Photos by Logan Riely/NBAE via Getty Images
Back when newspapers were more important institutions, they had general sports columnists who’d write scathing one-sided columns, devoid of any acknowledgement to the opposing argument. In that spirit, while I’m not a fan of the Derrick White trade, my actual opinions are more nuanced. I understand that it’s absurd to judge a trade less than 24 hours after it’s made. Regardless, I enjoyed writing this hit piece from the perspective of a blowhard writer (which, at times, I can be).


Just a few hours before the NBA trade deadline, the Spurs traded Derrick White to the Celtics for Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, a 2022 first-round pick, and a 2028 first-round pick swap. This was a senseless and shortsighted trade from Brad Stevens, a man who was once considered a basketball genius.

The Twitter reaction from the toxically optimistic Celtic fans was predictable. There was a lot of “nobody’s gonna score on a Derrick White / Marcus Smart backcourt,” and “I was glad to see Romeo gone,” and “Josh Richardson wasn’t that good anyway.”

Here are the facts. Josh Richardson is a better shooter than Derrick White, and aside from Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, he was the best shooter on this team. Richardson is 6’5” with a 7-foot wingspan, White is 6’4” with a 6’8” wingspan. White was never asked to defend wings in San Antonio. Richardson did that regularly, and now there’s no wing depth with Langford gone, too. Richardson makes $11.6 million this year and $12.3 million next year, while White is on the first year of a four-year, $73 million contract.

When I saw the first tweet from Shams Charania, I assumed it was Richardson for White straight up, and even then, I wasn’t happy. They’re roughly the same level of defender, Richardson is a better shooter, and White is a better ballhandler. Additionally, Richardson is on an outstanding contract while White is overpaid.

Later, we learned Boston included Romeo Langford and their 2022 first round pick in the deal. I couldn’t believe it. Romeo was turning into a plus defender who effectively played his role on offense. He shot 36 percent from three when he played over 18 minutes. He became a steady rotation player after injury-plagued rookie and sophomore seasons.

For whatever reason, the Celtics no longer care about their first round picks. As recently as January 14th, the Celtics were 11th in the Eastern Conference standings. As of today, they’re positioned for the 18th pick, but it’s certainly possible they fall within the 10 to 14 range. They really couldn’t get it lottery protected, or even top-10 protected?

Then the nail in the coffin — the Celtics inexplicably included a 2028 pick swap, lightly protected for the first pick. I couldn’t believe it. Yes, 2028 is six years away, but moving a future asset like that is irresponsible from a team building standpoint.

Josh Richardson was a valuable player for this Celtic team. He defended well, shot 40 percent from three, was a good locker room presence, and was on a great contract. If you think White is a significantly upgrade, congratulations, you’ve successfully been brainwashed by Celtics Twitter propaganda.

I can say this without hesitation: Derrick White is the most unspectacular player in the NBA. He’s not fast, can’t jump, doesn’t have the handle or passing to be considered a pure point guard, and lacks the bucket-getting instincts of a modern scoring guard. He’s shooting 31 percent from three on 5.3 attempts. Richardson, and even Langford, were more reliable outside shooters. The Celtics currently rank 22nd in three-point percentage and unfathomably traded their best catch-and-shoot player.

Admittedly, Derrick White plays hard on both ends of the floor. Coaches love him because he extracts the most out of his physical ability and always makes the right play. He’s got some quickness, he gets to the rim, and he’s a solid off-ball cutter. However – and I cannot emphasize this enough – there’s no dynamic quality to his game.

He’s also got an injury history. Last season he only played 36 games battling ankle and toe injuries. He’s had everything from heel injuries, glute contusions, fractured wrists, and plantar fascia tears.

The Spurs had no issue trading him during the first year of his four-year $73 million contract. Why would they draft Josh Primo – a guard projected as a late first-rounder to early second rounder – with the 12th pick if they already had Derrick White? Gregg Popovich didn’t care about cutting bait to make way for Primo and Lonnie Walker.

I don’t want to hear that this year’s pick doesn’t matter. It’s negligent trading away your first-round pick in back-to-back years. Teams need to have young talent coming up the pipeline. They can’t solely rely on free agent signings. Especially this team that’s barely above mediocre.

People are saying “2028 is so far away, who cares about a pick swap.” Trading an unprotected pick several years into the future is inherently dangerous. The Kings got killed for trading their 2017 pick swap to Philly in 2015. In 1997, the Grizzlies traded their 2003 top-one protected pick swap, and it turned into the 2nd pick of the draft (which was Darko Milicic, but could have been Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh, or Dwyane Wade). The Nets didn’t care about throwing in a 2017 pick swap to the Pierce/Garnett trade, and it turned into Jayson Tatum.

I keep seeing tweets about how this defense will be elite. It already was elite! The Celtics have the 3rd best defensive rating and the best over the last month-and-a-half. If there’s one thing they didn’t need, it’s more defense. Why trade your best spot-up shooter for a slightly better (but less versatile) defender?

This will rank among the worst trades in Celtic history. It will be remembered in the same category as Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson in 1998, the 8th pick in 1999 (Andre Miller) for Vitaly Potapenko, three first-round picks for Bob McAdoo in 1979, and Joe Johnson for Tony Delk and Rodney Rogers in 2002. Apparently, Brad Stevens has been possessed by the ghost of Rick Pitino.

Yesterday, the Suns acquired Aaron Holiday from the Wizards for cash. Where were the Celtics? If they needed a point guard to replace Schroder, they could have targeted Tomas Satoransky or Ish Smith. They could have acquired Montrezl Harrell, Serge Ibaka, or Donte DiVincenzo as relatively low-cost options that would immediately improve the roster.

Brad Stevens was opposed to giving Evan Fournier a four-year, $78 million contract last summer, but he has no problem trading a high-level bench player, a young rotation player, a first round pick, and a future swap for a worse offensive player on a four-year, $73 million deal? The Knicks are certainly regretting that Fournier contract, but he’s shooting 40 percent from three on seven attempts. The Celtics could use that.

Don’t get me wrong. Derrick White is a solid two-way player who’ll play big minutes on this team. He’s a good defender, but certainly not the disruptive force some of you on Twitter think he is. He’ll never be a top-15 point guard. He’ll never be as impactful a player as Marcus Smart, and we’ll be lucky if he ever has a season shooting 40 percent from three.

Here’s how everything will play out from yesterday’s mistep.

The Celtics will come back to earth after their recent stretch of success. They’ll continue to blow fourth quarter leads as everyone will recognize that beating Orlando, Detroit, and New Orleans shouldn’t be celebrated. Jayson and Jaylen will have no space attack the hoop. Get ready for a gluttony of contested 18-foot jumpers. More importantly, get ready for the play-in tournament.

Brad Stevens won’t be the GM for long. Either next season or the year after, Rick Carlisle will get fired from Indiana. Wyc Grousbeck will allow Brad to interview for the job, which he’ll eventually accept.

Jaylen Brown will leave Boston when he hits free agency in 2024. The Celtics won’t trade Tatum, thinking the supermax will entice him to stay, but he too will leave Boston during his 2025 free agency. The Celtics will be a bad team for the years to come, and in 2028, we’ll have to relinquish our top-5 pick to the Spurs. It won’t fall in the top-1 protected range because we’ll be punished by the basketball gods. It’s Tim Duncan all over again.

I know I’m right about this trade. I’ll be right two games from now, two months from now, and two years from now. I don’t care that we ducked the tax. I don’t care that we collected some trade exceptions. I do care that our current roster is worse, and our future outlook is bleak.

This was a disaster.

[Chinook]

:lol What a dunce.

[Robz4000]

The Derrick White trade is a disaster
Sorry, folks. Brad Stevens made his first major mistake as GM.
By Neil Iyer Feb 11, 2022, 12:59pm
Photos by Logan Riely/NBAE via Getty Images
Back when newspapers were more important institutions, they had general sports columnists who’d write scathing one-sided columns, devoid of any acknowledgement to the opposing argument. In that spirit, while I’m not a fan of the Derrick White trade, my actual opinions are more nuanced. I understand that it’s absurd to judge a trade less than 24 hours after it’s made. Regardless, I enjoyed writing this hit piece from the perspective of a blowhard writer (which, at times, I can be).


Just a few hours before the NBA trade deadline, the Spurs traded Derrick White to the Celtics for Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, a 2022 first-round pick, and a 2028 first-round pick swap. This was a senseless and shortsighted trade from Brad Stevens, a man who was once considered a basketball genius.

The Twitter reaction from the toxically optimistic Celtic fans was predictable. There was a lot of “nobody’s gonna score on a Derrick White / Marcus Smart backcourt,” and “I was glad to see Romeo gone,” and “Josh Richardson wasn’t that good anyway.”

Here are the facts. Josh Richardson is a better shooter than Derrick White, and aside from Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, he was the best shooter on this team. Richardson is 6’5” with a 7-foot wingspan, White is 6’4” with a 6’8” wingspan. White was never asked to defend wings in San Antonio. Richardson did that regularly, and now there’s no wing depth with Langford gone, too. Richardson makes $11.6 million this year and $12.3 million next year, while White is on the first year of a four-year, $73 million contract.

When I saw the first tweet from Shams Charania, I assumed it was Richardson for White straight up, and even then, I wasn’t happy. They’re roughly the same level of defender, Richardson is a better shooter, and White is a better ballhandler. Additionally, Richardson is on an outstanding contract while White is overpaid.

Later, we learned Boston included Romeo Langford and their 2022 first round pick in the deal. I couldn’t believe it. Romeo was turning into a plus defender who effectively played his role on offense. He shot 36 percent from three when he played over 18 minutes. He became a steady rotation player after injury-plagued rookie and sophomore seasons.

For whatever reason, the Celtics no longer care about their first round picks. As recently as January 14th, the Celtics were 11th in the Eastern Conference standings. As of today, they’re positioned for the 18th pick, but it’s certainly possible they fall within the 10 to 14 range. They really couldn’t get it lottery protected, or even top-10 protected?

Then the nail in the coffin — the Celtics inexplicably included a 2028 pick swap, lightly protected for the first pick. I couldn’t believe it. Yes, 2028 is six years away, but moving a future asset like that is irresponsible from a team building standpoint.

Josh Richardson was a valuable player for this Celtic team. He defended well, shot 40 percent from three, was a good locker room presence, and was on a great contract. If you think White is a significantly upgrade, congratulations, you’ve successfully been brainwashed by Celtics Twitter propaganda.

I can say this without hesitation: Derrick White is the most unspectacular player in the NBA. He’s not fast, can’t jump, doesn’t have the handle or passing to be considered a pure point guard, and lacks the bucket-getting instincts of a modern scoring guard. He’s shooting 31 percent from three on 5.3 attempts. Richardson, and even Langford, were more reliable outside shooters. The Celtics currently rank 22nd in three-point percentage and unfathomably traded their best catch-and-shoot player.

Admittedly, Derrick White plays hard on both ends of the floor. Coaches love him because he extracts the most out of his physical ability and always makes the right play. He’s got some quickness, he gets to the rim, and he’s a solid off-ball cutter. However – and I cannot emphasize this enough – there’s no dynamic quality to his game.

He’s also got an injury history. Last season he only played 36 games battling ankle and toe injuries. He’s had everything from heel injuries, glute contusions, fractured wrists, and plantar fascia tears.

The Spurs had no issue trading him during the first year of his four-year $73 million contract. Why would they draft Josh Primo – a guard projected as a late first-rounder to early second rounder – with the 12th pick if they already had Derrick White? Gregg Popovich didn’t care about cutting bait to make way for Primo and Lonnie Walker.

I don’t want to hear that this year’s pick doesn’t matter. It’s negligent trading away your first-round pick in back-to-back years. Teams need to have young talent coming up the pipeline. They can’t solely rely on free agent signings. Especially this team that’s barely above mediocre.

People are saying “2028 is so far away, who cares about a pick swap.” Trading an unprotected pick several years into the future is inherently dangerous. The Kings got killed for trading their 2017 pick swap to Philly in 2015. In 1997, the Grizzlies traded their 2003 top-one protected pick swap, and it turned into the 2nd pick of the draft (which was Darko Milicic, but could have been Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh, or Dwyane Wade). The Nets didn’t care about throwing in a 2017 pick swap to the Pierce/Garnett trade, and it turned into Jayson Tatum.

I keep seeing tweets about how this defense will be elite. It already was elite! The Celtics have the 3rd best defensive rating and the best over the last month-and-a-half. If there’s one thing they didn’t need, it’s more defense. Why trade your best spot-up shooter for a slightly better (but less versatile) defender?

This will rank among the worst trades in Celtic history. It will be remembered in the same category as Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson in 1998, the 8th pick in 1999 (Andre Miller) for Vitaly Potapenko, three first-round picks for Bob McAdoo in 1979, and Joe Johnson for Tony Delk and Rodney Rogers in 2002. Apparently, Brad Stevens has been possessed by the ghost of Rick Pitino.

Yesterday, the Suns acquired Aaron Holiday from the Wizards for cash. Where were the Celtics? If they needed a point guard to replace Schroder, they could have targeted Tomas Satoransky or Ish Smith. They could have acquired Montrezl Harrell, Serge Ibaka, or Donte DiVincenzo as relatively low-cost options that would immediately improve the roster.

Brad Stevens was opposed to giving Evan Fournier a four-year, $78 million contract last summer, but he has no problem trading a high-level bench player, a young rotation player, a first round pick, and a future swap for a worse offensive player on a four-year, $73 million deal? The Knicks are certainly regretting that Fournier contract, but he’s shooting 40 percent from three on seven attempts. The Celtics could use that.

Don’t get me wrong. Derrick White is a solid two-way player who’ll play big minutes on this team. He’s a good defender, but certainly not the disruptive force some of you on Twitter think he is. He’ll never be a top-15 point guard. He’ll never be as impactful a player as Marcus Smart, and we’ll be lucky if he ever has a season shooting 40 percent from three.

Here’s how everything will play out from yesterday’s mistep.

The Celtics will come back to earth after their recent stretch of success. They’ll continue to blow fourth quarter leads as everyone will recognize that beating Orlando, Detroit, and New Orleans shouldn’t be celebrated. Jayson and Jaylen will have no space attack the hoop. Get ready for a gluttony of contested 18-foot jumpers. More importantly, get ready for the play-in tournament.

Brad Stevens won’t be the GM for long. Either next season or the year after, Rick Carlisle will get fired from Indiana. Wyc Grousbeck will allow Brad to interview for the job, which he’ll eventually accept.

Jaylen Brown will leave Boston when he hits free agency in 2024. The Celtics won’t trade Tatum, thinking the supermax will entice him to stay, but he too will leave Boston during his 2025 free agency. The Celtics will be a bad team for the years to come, and in 2028, we’ll have to relinquish our top-5 pick to the Spurs. It won’t fall in the top-1 protected range because we’ll be punished by the basketball gods. It’s Tim Duncan all over again.

I know I’m right about this trade. I’ll be right two games from now, two months from now, and two years from now. I don’t care that we ducked the tax. I don’t care that we collected some trade exceptions. I do care that our current roster is worse, and our future outlook is bleak.

This was a disaster.

:lol tell me you don't watch basketball without telling me you don't watch basketball

:lmao Josh fucking Richardson being a better player than White

[JeffDuncan]

The Derrick White trade is a disaster
Sorry, folks. Brad Stevens made his first major mistake as GM.
…

This was a disaster.


A wonderful article, great reading. It makes me feel warm all over. Lmao!

[BatManu20]

Tatum seems to be pretty happy about it.


1492347249254453251

[John B]

The Derrick White trade is a disaster
Sorry, folks. Brad Stevens made his first major mistake as GM.
By Neil Iyer Feb 11, 2022, 12:59pm
Photos by Logan Riely/NBAE via Getty Images

Just a few hours before the NBA trade deadline, the Spurs traded Derrick White to the Celtics for Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, a 2022 first-round pick, and a 2028 first-round pick swap. This was a senseless and shortsighted trade from Brad Stevens, a man who was once considered a basketball genius.

The Twitter reaction from the toxically optimistic Celtic fans was predictable. There was a lot of “nobody’s gonna score on a Derrick White / Marcus Smart backcourt,” and “I was glad to see Romeo gone,” and “Josh Richardson wasn’t that good anyway.”

Here are the facts. Josh Richardson is a better shooter than Derrick White, and aside from Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, he was the best shooter on this team. Richardson is 6’5” with a 7-foot wingspan, White is 6’4” with a 6’8” wingspan. White was never asked to defend wings in San Antonio. Richardson did that regularly, and now there’s no wing depth with Langford gone, too. Richardson makes $11.6 million this year and $12.3 million next year, while White is on the first year of a four-year, $73 million contract.

When I saw the first tweet from Shams Charania, I assumed it was Richardson for White straight up, and even then, I wasn’t happy. They’re roughly the same level of defender, Richardson is a better shooter, and White is a better ballhandler. Additionally, Richardson is on an outstanding contract while White is overpaid.

Later, we learned Boston included Romeo Langford and their 2022 first round pick in the deal. I couldn’t believe it. The Celtics will be a bad team for the years to come, and in 2028, we’ll have to relinquish our top-5 pick to the Spurs. It won’t fall in the top-1 protected range because we’ll be punished by the basketball gods. It’s Tim Duncan all over again.

This was a disaster.

This makes me smile. :lol Thank you Brad Stevens.

[Rocalcio]

Romeo is 22. Josh is 28. It’s nothing more than a math problem.
I think the Josh he’s talking about is Primo.

[John B]

really depends on the draft tbh. The team didn't get worse, but needs to find a running mate in this draft for DJ. Banchero would probably be the guy who could produce immediately, but I'm good with any of the top 4

I’ve said it before, Vassell is that running mate. Devin is a natural scorer, has the silkiest shot, high release and seems to float on air. Vassell will be scoring 20+ with higher usage and green light. I’m hoping Devin puts in another 10lbs of muscle on that NBA body, to finish strong with contact and get more trips to the FT line, and ultimately become a go-to scorer. I think Pop realizes this and let go of White to thrive as a natural PG elsewhere, and to finally give the minutes to Vassell. Primo is still very on his handles but would get that Lonnie minutes as the 6th man, not shying to score.

But this also mean drafting high or trade to get another caliber scorer, hopefully a PF to help protect the rim and score in the paint.

[tbdog]

I’ve said it before, Vassell is that running mate. Devin is a natural scorer, has the silkiest shot, high release and seems to float on air. Vassell will be scoring 20+ with higher usage and green light. I’m hoping Devin puts in another 10lbs of muscle on that NBA body, to finish strong with contact and get more trips to the FT line, and ultimately become a go-to scorer. I think Pop realizes this and let go of White to thrive as a natural PG elsewhere, and to finally give the minutes to Vassell. Primo is still very on his handles but would get that Lonnie minutes as the 6th man, not shying to score.

But this also mean drafting high or trade to get another caliber scorer, hopefully a PF to help protect the rim and score in the paint.

I've always said devin could be a Paul George. I'm expecting pacers Paul George.

[exstatic]

I think the Josh he’s talking about is Primo.

If so, we’ll all need to start referring to them by last name. Landales given name isn’t Jock, it’s Josh, so there’s three of them now.

[CGD]

^ what a trash take by that BOS blogger.

But his take about wingspans sounds like something I’d read in this forum tbqh

[Maddog]

Nah, this was not a disaster for Boston
I think this is one of the few trades where everyone did ok.
I really like DW, but this is a good move for him. I think he'll flourish being a third option and on a team whose time is now as opposed to 2 to 3 years down the road. Spurs get a good pick. Will they get someone better than White with that pick?, Statistically speaking probably not. But the Spurs need Stars, not more good players , and more picks increases the odds

[mo7888]

The Derrick White trade is a disaster
Sorry, folks. Brad Stevens made his first major mistake as GM.
By Neil Iyer Feb 11, 2022, 12:59pm
Photos by Logan Riely/NBAE via Getty Images
Back when newspapers were more important institutions, they had general sports columnists who’d write scathing one-sided columns, devoid of any acknowledgement to the opposing argument. In that spirit, while I’m not a fan of the Derrick White trade, my actual opinions are more nuanced. I understand that it’s absurd to judge a trade less than 24 hours after it’s made. Regardless, I enjoyed writing this hit piece from the perspective of a blowhard writer (which, at times, I can be).


Just a few hours before the NBA trade deadline, the Spurs traded Derrick White to the Celtics for Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford, a 2022 first-round pick, and a 2028 first-round pick swap. This was a senseless and shortsighted trade from Brad Stevens, a man who was once considered a basketball genius.

The Twitter reaction from the toxically optimistic Celtic fans was predictable. There was a lot of “nobody’s gonna score on a Derrick White / Marcus Smart backcourt,” and “I was glad to see Romeo gone,” and “Josh Richardson wasn’t that good anyway.”

Here are the facts. Josh Richardson is a better shooter than Derrick White, and aside from Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, he was the best shooter on this team. Richardson is 6’5” with a 7-foot wingspan, White is 6’4” with a 6’8” wingspan. White was never asked to defend wings in San Antonio. Richardson did that regularly, and now there’s no wing depth with Langford gone, too. Richardson makes $11.6 million this year and $12.3 million next year, while White is on the first year of a four-year, $73 million contract.

When I saw the first tweet from Shams Charania, I assumed it was Richardson for White straight up, and even then, I wasn’t happy. They’re roughly the same level of defender, Richardson is a better shooter, and White is a better ballhandler. Additionally, Richardson is on an outstanding contract while White is overpaid.

Later, we learned Boston included Romeo Langford and their 2022 first round pick in the deal. I couldn’t believe it. Romeo was turning into a plus defender who effectively played his role on offense. He shot 36 percent from three when he played over 18 minutes. He became a steady rotation player after injury-plagued rookie and sophomore seasons.

For whatever reason, the Celtics no longer care about their first round picks. As recently as January 14th, the Celtics were 11th in the Eastern Conference standings. As of today, they’re positioned for the 18th pick, but it’s certainly possible they fall within the 10 to 14 range. They really couldn’t get it lottery protected, or even top-10 protected?

Then the nail in the coffin — the Celtics inexplicably included a 2028 pick swap, lightly protected for the first pick. I couldn’t believe it. Yes, 2028 is six years away, but moving a future asset like that is irresponsible from a team building standpoint.

Josh Richardson was a valuable player for this Celtic team. He defended well, shot 40 percent from three, was a good locker room presence, and was on a great contract. If you think White is a significantly upgrade, congratulations, you’ve successfully been brainwashed by Celtics Twitter propaganda.

I can say this without hesitation: Derrick White is the most unspectacular player in the NBA. He’s not fast, can’t jump, doesn’t have the handle or passing to be considered a pure point guard, and lacks the bucket-getting instincts of a modern scoring guard. He’s shooting 31 percent from three on 5.3 attempts. Richardson, and even Langford, were more reliable outside shooters. The Celtics currently rank 22nd in three-point percentage and unfathomably traded their best catch-and-shoot player.

Admittedly, Derrick White plays hard on both ends of the floor. Coaches love him because he extracts the most out of his physical ability and always makes the right play. He’s got some quickness, he gets to the rim, and he’s a solid off-ball cutter. However – and I cannot emphasize this enough – there’s no dynamic quality to his game.

He’s also got an injury history. Last season he only played 36 games battling ankle and toe injuries. He’s had everything from heel injuries, glute contusions, fractured wrists, and plantar fascia tears.

The Spurs had no issue trading him during the first year of his four-year $73 million contract. Why would they draft Josh Primo – a guard projected as a late first-rounder to early second rounder – with the 12th pick if they already had Derrick White? Gregg Popovich didn’t care about cutting bait to make way for Primo and Lonnie Walker.

I don’t want to hear that this year’s pick doesn’t matter. It’s negligent trading away your first-round pick in back-to-back years. Teams need to have young talent coming up the pipeline. They can’t solely rely on free agent signings. Especially this team that’s barely above mediocre.

People are saying “2028 is so far away, who cares about a pick swap.” Trading an unprotected pick several years into the future is inherently dangerous. The Kings got killed for trading their 2017 pick swap to Philly in 2015. In 1997, the Grizzlies traded their 2003 top-one protected pick swap, and it turned into the 2nd pick of the draft (which was Darko Milicic, but could have been Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh, or Dwyane Wade). The Nets didn’t care about throwing in a 2017 pick swap to the Pierce/Garnett trade, and it turned into Jayson Tatum.

I keep seeing tweets about how this defense will be elite. It already was elite! The Celtics have the 3rd best defensive rating and the best over the last month-and-a-half. If there’s one thing they didn’t need, it’s more defense. Why trade your best spot-up shooter for a slightly better (but less versatile) defender?

This will rank among the worst trades in Celtic history. It will be remembered in the same category as Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson in 1998, the 8th pick in 1999 (Andre Miller) for Vitaly Potapenko, three first-round picks for Bob McAdoo in 1979, and Joe Johnson for Tony Delk and Rodney Rogers in 2002. Apparently, Brad Stevens has been possessed by the ghost of Rick Pitino.

Yesterday, the Suns acquired Aaron Holiday from the Wizards for cash. Where were the Celtics? If they needed a point guard to replace Schroder, they could have targeted Tomas Satoransky or Ish Smith. They could have acquired Montrezl Harrell, Serge Ibaka, or Donte DiVincenzo as relatively low-cost options that would immediately improve the roster.

Brad Stevens was opposed to giving Evan Fournier a four-year, $78 million contract last summer, but he has no problem trading a high-level bench player, a young rotation player, a first round pick, and a future swap for a worse offensive player on a four-year, $73 million deal? The Knicks are certainly regretting that Fournier contract, but he’s shooting 40 percent from three on seven attempts. The Celtics could use that.

Don’t get me wrong. Derrick White is a solid two-way player who’ll play big minutes on this team. He’s a good defender, but certainly not the disruptive force some of you on Twitter think he is. He’ll never be a top-15 point guard. He’ll never be as impactful a player as Marcus Smart, and we’ll be lucky if he ever has a season shooting 40 percent from three.

Here’s how everything will play out from yesterday’s mistep.

The Celtics will come back to earth after their recent stretch of success. They’ll continue to blow fourth quarter leads as everyone will recognize that beating Orlando, Detroit, and New Orleans shouldn’t be celebrated. Jayson and Jaylen will have no space attack the hoop. Get ready for a gluttony of contested 18-foot jumpers. More importantly, get ready for the play-in tournament.

Brad Stevens won’t be the GM for long. Either next season or the year after, Rick Carlisle will get fired from Indiana. Wyc Grousbeck will allow Brad to interview for the job, which he’ll eventually accept.

Jaylen Brown will leave Boston when he hits free agency in 2024. The Celtics won’t trade Tatum, thinking the supermax will entice him to stay, but he too will leave Boston during his 2025 free agency. The Celtics will be a bad team for the years to come, and in 2028, we’ll have to relinquish our top-5 pick to the Spurs. It won’t fall in the top-1 protected range because we’ll be punished by the basketball gods. It’s Tim Duncan all over again.

I know I’m right about this trade. I’ll be right two games from now, two months from now, and two years from now. I don’t care that we ducked the tax. I don’t care that we collected some trade exceptions. I do care that our current roster is worse, and our future outlook is bleak.

This was a disaster.

Wow....what a true idiot...

[objective]

You think Pop held Derrick back? I felt like we all, all of Spursdom, Pop included, were begging Derrick to show out constantly.

Did Pop always put him in a spot to succeed? Of course not.

Refused to play him as a rookie when it was obvious that he was one of the 4 best guards on the team

Then after his second year where he finished the regular season great and pretty much was the reason they made the playoffs as the starter, be gets limited off the bench to 23 minutes a game because Pop refuses to give him time with Dejounte until covid

Then the next year for much of it he refused to stagger and play them apart, I guess because Mills had to get his.

Then as things this season weren't going great, and with several other guards to experiment with as starters like Vassell and Primo and Walker, Pop doesn't try White off the bench. Somehow Pop had no problem asking a hall of famer Manu to come off the bench for sandbaggers like Hero, Barry, Finley et Al but couldn't try White off the bench to get him going better and jumpstart one of the other players. The one time he came off the bench this year after missing games he was pretty good.

[Ocotillo]

From the Boston writer....


Gregg Popovich didn’t care about cutting bait to make way for Primo and Lonnie Walker.

If it helps you feel better, we'll throw in Lonnie as well. :lol

[Dex]

From the Boston writer....



If it helps you feel better, we'll throw in Lonnie as well. :lol

Yeah, he makes some decent points and it's a good sign a beat writer for the Celtics feels so strongly about assets that now belong to the Spurs.

But he apparently hasn't watched us much if he thinks Lonnie is our future

[Dejounte]

Not sure why the opinions of a Celtics blogger are being invalidated, the guy has watched more Celtics games than Spurs fans

He’s not really trashing Derrick White, he’s moreso saying Josh is better. And he’s entitled to that opinion, it might end up even being true.

his primary concern is the 2028 FRP which is a legitimate concern. It’s very stupid for the Celtics to include that for Derrick White.

[exstatic]

Nah, this was not a disaster for Boston
I think this is one of the few trades where everyone did ok.
I really like DW, but this is a good move for him. I think he'll flourish being a third option and on a team whose time is now as opposed to 2 to 3 years down the road. Spurs get a good pick. Will they get someone better than White with that pick?, Statistically speaking probably not. But the Spurs need Stars, not more good players , and more picks increases the odds

Don’t forget the 2028 FRP swap option. That might wind up being the best part of this trade.

[exstatic]

Not sure why the opinions of a Celtics blogger are being invalidated, the guy has watched more Celtics games than Spurs fans

He’s not really trashing Derrick White, he’s moreso saying Josh is better. And he’s entitled to that opinion, it might end up even being true.

his primary concern is the 2028 FRP which is a legitimate concern. It’s very stupid for the Celtics to include that for Derrick White.

If you closely read the first part, he basically says that the trade result is more nuanced, but he’s going to emulate old time print journalists with a one sided hit piece. That makes it fair game.

[Atl Spur]

We came up but I still liked Derrick regardless.

[objective]

One thing about White that has gone unappreciated is how he's one of the best pick and roll ball handlers in the league and managed that without ever playing with an above the rim big who could really go get it. Poeltl likes the ball low, and his other partners have been the likes of Pau, Aldridge, Eubanks, Joffrey, Dieng, Thaddeus, Trey Lyles and old Rudy Gay

[The Truth #6]

Re: that Boston blogger: his post was better written than most things here. Lol. Probably overemphasized some key points, probably underestimated White’s defense (he DID have to guard wings sometimes), but yeah, makes me think that like the DDR trade, our GM did about as well as one could hope for given the situation. I’m thrilled. And he’s absolutely right about the injury history. White had an atypically injury free season this year. Also, his insight gives me more hope for Richardson and Langford. I did think it was a weird, bad move by boy genius Brad Stevens. That’s great.

[exstatic]

Re: that Boston blogger: his post was better written than most things here. Lol. Probably overemphasized some key points, probably underestimated White’s defense (he DID have to guard wings sometimes), but yeah, makes me think that like the DDR trade, our GM did about as well as one could hope for given the situation. I’m thrilled. And he’s absolutely right about the injury history. White had an atypically injury free season this year. Also, his insight gives me more hope for Richardson and Langford. I did think it was a weird, bad move by boy genius Brad Stevens. That’s great.

Richardson doesn’t fit our timeline. He’s already on the market, and he hasn’t played a minute yet. He’ll be shopped during the draft, free agency, and next season. He’s a serviceable player who can shoot and defend on a decent deal. In other words, catnip to playoff teams. We should get a decent asset for him.

Langford will be given a shot to stick. He’s in the timeline, and has the toolset. There’s some chatter about his motor/ethic on Twitter, but Pop will sort that out one way or the other. As strong defender with a decent 3 pointer, he can always be flipped next year, too.

[Dejounte]

This whole timeline thing is overblown

the Wolves aren’t rushing to get rid of KAT because he’s 26 and because that team isn’t yet competitive

The Wizards can continue to surround 28 year old Beal with players and look to compete. They tried to do that this past offseason.

older players have a place on any team. Especially if that role isn’t a primary one.

A team doesn’t have to be filled with prepubescent teenagers to fit any timeline.

[exstatic]

This whole timeline thing is overblown

the Wolves aren’t rushing to get rid of KAT because he’s 26 and because that team isn’t yet competitive

The Wizards can continue to surround 28 year old Beal with players and look to compete. They tried to do that this past offseason.

older players have a place on any team. Especially if that role isn’t a primary one.

A team doesn’t have to be filled with prepubescent teenagers to fit any timeline.

Rebuilding teams need assets, and the best way to get those is to trade experienced players for youth and picks from playoff teams. I can think of two clear cases of the reverse, when playoff teams should have traded their picks. The first one should be familiar: Boston, and pick #14 in 2019, Romeo Langford. They were a deep playoff team, and didn’t have time or minutes to develop a young wing player. Second case, same as the first: Phoenix and pick #10 in 2020, Jalen Smith. He was buried 4th on their center depth chart as a rookie until Saric was injured during the playoffs.

Veteran players tend to want more money, which also interferes with paying the young players, and preserving cap room for rentals to accrue assets.

[The Truth #6]

This whole timeline thing is overblown

the Wolves aren’t rushing to get rid of KAT because he’s 26 and because that team isn’t yet competitive

The Wizards can continue to surround 28 year old Beal with players and look to compete. They tried to do that this past offseason.

older players have a place on any team. Especially if that role isn’t a primary one.

A team doesn’t have to be filled with prepubescent teenagers to fit any timeline.

Yeah, I agree with that. For me, I think it’s less about age/timeline but fit, meaning can they accept and fulfill the role Pop has in mind, which may be to complement our younger players. Maybe Richardson motivates Vassel or Primo to play harder. Really hard for me to predict at this point. But yeah, Langford/Richardson could also easily be traded. The rest of the season will be interesting.

[MannyIsGod]

Did Pop always put him in a spot to succeed? Of course not.




lmao what

This is insane. Pop bent overbackwards to enable Derrick. Derrick is good, but there's no need to completely rewrite history to one where Pop did anything but constantly support this dude and put him in places to succeed.

[R. DeMurre]

What can really be overrated is the age expectations of a great team. The '96 Bulls that went 72-10 and won a championship started five players that were 34, 32, 32, 30, & 27... and the 27 year old was the least consequential player of the bunch.

[MannyIsGod]

This whole timeline thing is overblown

the Wolves aren’t rushing to get rid of KAT because he’s 26 and because that team isn’t yet competitive

The Wizards can continue to surround 28 year old Beal with players and look to compete. They tried to do that this past offseason.

older players have a place on any team. Especially if that role isn’t a primary one.

A team doesn’t have to be filled with prepubescent teenagers to fit any timeline.

White =! Beal and KAT but also both those teams are pretty bad at rebuilding so I'm not sure you want to use them as examples.

[exstatic]

What can really be overrated is the age expectations of a great team. The '96 Bulls that went 72-10 and won a championship started five players that were 34, 32, 32, 30, & 27... and the 27 year old was the least consequential player of the bunch.

The timeline is the timeline. It isn’t always young, and in fact, with contenders, it almost never is. Our Chip squads were usually among the oldest in the league.

[R. DeMurre]

Anyone like this Boston blogger looking at Derrick White and declaring him "unathletic" is falling victim to the shortcomings of the eye test. His objective draft combine numbers were excellent.

[RC_Drunkford]

Then after his second year where he finished the regular season great and pretty much was the reason they made the playoffs as the starter, he gets limited off the bench to 23 minutes cause Pop wanted to start Bryn Forbes


FIFY

[R. DeMurre]

That 2028 pick swap is really incredible. Tatum has a player option in 2026. If he decides to leave, the Celtics could easily be in rebuild mode come 2028. Kudos to Brad Stevens for identifying White as a non-glamor player who can legitimately make the Celtics better, but that pick swap is a crazy risk to take as a GM.

[Russ]

That 2028 pick swap is really incredible. Tatum has a player option in 2026. If he decides to leave, the Celtics could easily be in rebuild mode come 2028. Kudos to Brad Stevens for identifying White as a non-glamor player who can legitimately make the Celtics better, but that pick swap is a crazy risk to take as a GM.

If the GM thinks he'll be around in 2028 . . .

[cd98]

That 2028 pick swap is really incredible. Tatum has a player option in 2026. If he decides to leave, the Celtics could easily be in rebuild mode come 2028. Kudos to Brad Stevens for identifying White as a non-glamor player who can legitimately make the Celtics better, but that pick swap is a crazy risk to take as a GM.

Yes, but he knows Tatum well and Celtics will have the financial advantage. The pick swap is interesting, but if S.A. turns it around in the next 3 years, they probably won't want to swap or if they do, it will probably be a few picks earlier situation. I could see these two teams having similar records by then. I really like White on that team, though.

[Atl Spur]

We need to keep Josh rich unless we get offered something solid

[R. DeMurre]

Yes, but he knows Tatum well and Celtics will have the financial advantage. The pick swap is interesting, but if S.A. turns it around in the next 3 years, they probably won't want to swap or if they do, it will probably be a few picks earlier situation. I could see these two teams having similar records by then. I really like White on that team, though.

True, but 6 years is a long time... how many couples, married now, won't be in 2028? Also, Tatum could sign and get injured in 2027. So many things can happen in 6 years.

Six years ago, a San Antonio team that featured Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili, Tony Parker, Kawhi Leonard, LaMarcus Aldridge, Patty Mills, and Danny Green won 67 games!

[Cabrito]

Robert Woodard released by the Kings. The guy drafted right in front of Tre Jones. The Spurs are familiar with this guy after playing with the summer team after the draft (I am pretty sure it was summer team).

[John B]

Robert Woodard released by the Kings. The guy drafted right in front of Tre Jones. The Spurs are familiar with this guy after playing with the summer team after the draft (I am pretty sure it was summer team).

Yup double-double guy. But then again we already have Cacock and 2 inches taller at 6’8”

[RC_Drunkford]

it's pretty clear the Spurs were looking for a more pure SG who can shoot the ball better, since the rumor came out that they were also in talks with ATL about Bogdanovic. I think it makes sense for the Spurs to play J-Rich as a 6th man and keep him around next season. If you give him more shots he can easily average 13-14 PPG and he'll be on an expiring next season. Contenders will cough up a first round draft pick for a 3-and-D player of his caliber

[exstatic]

Yup double-double guy. But then again we already have Cacock and 2 inches taller at 6’8”

Cacok is a PF/C. Woodard is a SF.

This is the kind of pickup I was talking about with our 15th slot. I’m just wondering why Sacto didn’t give him more gleague time this year, only 6 games.

[Dejounte]

Woodard is more promising than Langford, IMO

[mo7888]

Robert Woodard released by the Kings. The guy drafted right in front of Tre Jones. The Spurs are familiar with this guy after playing with the summer team after the draft (I am pretty sure it was summer team).

I'd love to see us waive somebody and pick him up to give him a look..

[exstatic]

Robert Woodard released by the Kings. The guy drafted right in front of Tre Jones. The Spurs are familiar with this guy after playing with the summer team after the draft (I am pretty sure it was summer team).

Nope. He actually played for the Austin Spurs in the Gubble. Only 15 organizations fielded teams. He got a lot of burn once the Spurs had to call up Tre and Sammich to cover covid shortfalls.

[exstatic]

I'd love to see us waive somebody and pick him up to give him a look..

We’ll have a spot when Dragic gets bought out.

[pad300]

We’ll have a spot when Dragic gets bought out.

And possibly a second if they do a buyout with Satoransky.

[John B]

We’ll have a spot when Dragic gets bought out.

Stupid question, but I count 17 players including Dragic:

Murray/Tre/Satoransky/Dragic
Vassell/Primo/Lonnie/Weiskamp
McDermont/Josh/Romeo
Keldon/KBD/Cacock
Poeltl/Zollins/Landale

I’m not familiar with the 2way contract players if that’s what it is

Edited: got it, Joe and Cacock on two-way on addition to the 15

[XDT76]

Stupid question, but I count 17 players including Dragic:

Murray/Tre/Satoransky/Dragic
Vassell/Primo/Lonnie/Weiskamp
McDermont/Josh/Romeo
Keldon/KBD/Cacock
Poeltl/Zollins/Landale

I’m not familiar with the 2way contract players if that’s what it is

Each team can have 15 players plus 2 2-way players. So if Dragic is waived/bought out, we will have an open slot.

[John B]

Each team can have 15 players plus 2 2-way players. So if Dragic is waived/bought out, we will have an open slot.

So they convert either Joe or Cacock to regular first, before picking up Woodard on two-way?

[KingKev]

And possibly a second if they do a buyout with Satoransky.

Doubt Satoransky gets bought out. Henisn’t taking money off the table and I doubt other teams care much for him.

[JeffDuncan]

Stupid question, but I count 17 players including Dragic:

Murray/Tre/Satoransky/Dragic
Vassell/Primo/Lonnie/Weiskamp
McDermont/Josh/Romeo
Keldon/KBD/Cacock
Poeltl/Zollins/Landale

I’m not familiar with the 2way contract players if that’s what it is


You can probably go ahead and remove Satoransky and Dragic. Neither is likely to join the team.

Dragic is essentially retired. He’ll be 36 in May.

I don’t think the Spurs had any real interest in Satoransky. As part of getting a 2nd round pick for Hernangomez, they had to help move Satoransky, is what it looks like.

[XDT76]

So they convert either Joe or Cacock to regular first, before picking up Woodard on two-way?

No need, they can keep the 2 way players as is and sign a regular player if they desired.

[Russ]

You can probably go ahead and remove Satoransky and Dragic. Neither is likely to join the team.

Dragic is essentially retired. He’ll be 36 in May.

Pounding the Rock seems to think Dragic may sign with a contender.

[Degoat]

The spurs welcomed Josh Rich, Langford, and Tomas on Instagram yesterday but not Dragic. I think they keep Tomas and buyout dragic unfortunately

[John B]

No need, they can keep the 2 way players as is and sign a regular player if they desired.

I liked Woddard at the Gubble averaging double-doubles, and with Samanic and Tre dominating until both Tre and Samanic got called up. Not sure about his defense though. But I rather they get a project big who can be a better on-man defender than what we have at the C position.

[rankingtear]

Woodard is more promising than Langford, IMO

Don't know about that. His showcase numbers are bad , summer league is bad. He only played 3 games in the regular season and had 1 good game inflating his numbers. Doubt someone picks up a forward with his shooting splits.

[R. DeMurre]

Richardson, with his ~$12mil salary, could be important to make trades work in the off season.

[mo7888]

Don't know about that. His showcase numbers are bad , summer league is bad. He only played 3 games in the regular season and had 1 good game inflating his numbers. Doubt someone picks up a forward with his shooting splits.

He was a 6'7" defensive minded player in college that shot 40% from 3 in his last year if I remember correctly... there's something to explore there..

[JeffDuncan]

The spurs welcomed Josh Rich, Langford, and Tomas on Instagram yesterday but not Dragic. I think they keep Tomas and buyout dragic unfortunately


Very good, but it’ll be a challenge to find everybody minutes.

Vassell is the starting SG now, and Richardson, Langford, and Satoransky are all listed as SGs.

That’s why I was dismissive of Satoransky above. Where are the minutes coming from? Also, he’s 30. However, Satoransky has played some PG, so some backup minutes there could be possible.

It’ll be fascinating to watch how the Spurs sort all this out, for the rest of this season.

[Thomas82]

Pounding the Rock seems to think Dragic may sign with a contender.

From what I've been reading, it looks like he might be heading to Dallas.

[Chomag]

As I have said before , I have always wanted Dragic here but that ship has sailed and I don't mind him being bought out. There is really nothing he can give this team at this stage of his career and even if he still has a little left in his tank it's not like that will give this team anymore wins.

[MarCowMar]

This whole timeline thing is overblown

the Wolves aren’t rushing to get rid of KAT because he’s 26 and because that team isn’t yet competitive

The Wizards can continue to surround 28 year old Beal with players and look to compete. They tried to do that this past offseason.

older players have a place on any team. Especially if that role isn’t a primary one.

A team doesn’t have to be filled with prepubescent teenagers to fit any timeline.

From a player age and development perspective he did have some overlap with our timeline. The conflict was that there were other players that we needed more existing in the same timeline. So by timeline theory, someone had to be moved, and White made the most sense because his development appeared to have peaked and this was a great trade in terms of value.

If White had a similar skill level and played PF he likely would not have been moved.

[koriwhat]

Sucks we got rid of White. We don't have a product worth a damn on the floor atm so it's a good opportunity for him on a team actually competing for a title. Glad he got traded to a team whose aspirations are a title because he def deserves that but we'll def be missing his skillset soon enough.

[KingKev]

Very good, but it’ll be a challenge to find everybody minutes.

Vassell is the starting SG now, and Richardson, Langford, and Satoransky are all listed as SGs.

That’s why I was dismissive of Satoransky above. Where are the minutes coming from? Also, he’s 30. However, Satoransky has played some PG, so some backup minutes there could be possible.

It’ll be fascinating to watch how the Spurs sort all this out, for the rest of this season.

It’s not rocket science. Dragic will never join the team and this was known ahead of time. Sato wil become a free agent this offseason as he isn’t a buyout target since no one wants him and he has no reason to bet on himself currently other than getting paid and hitting free agency.

[talkspurs]

I will throw this out here in this thread since this is the one where we got the 2028 pick swap. I have seen a few people mention us drafting Manus kids. Well they will be 18 in 2028 and would be draft eligible. This of course would only get us one but does give us 2 shots at getting one.

[Gagnrath]

It’s a move that had to be done but definitely gonna miss that big forehead. Dude was a class act and a good player on the Spurs. DJ is just better and the white/Murray combo wasn’t going to get the spurs anywhere.

By itself no, you had a solid starter in White and a complementary star level player in Murray though which is what a team needs, they just needed a primary starter level player somewhere in the front court, it just wasn looking like they were finding the guy on that front without making moves. Since we have a couple if other decent prospects at the guard spots moving the quality starter level player for pick's and prospects isn't a bad move especially if he doesn't really fit super well timeline wise.

[Fusternino]

I remember when the 76ers tried to salvage the Jimmy Butler situation by trading him for Richardson. Maybe he could be kind of good?

Still worrying that after the Spurs stopped with the small background nonsense, they decided to pick up playing undersized at the 4 instead. Not sure if an upgrade over those TP9/Mills/Forbes back courts, tbh.

[ceperez]

Spurs loss to the GSW scrubs is all one needed to see to explain why White needed to be traded for draft picks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Q5UG0Ga_MY

[rankingtear]

Richardson is a good bench piece, used to be a first option on a fairly decent Heat team, i have always liked primary scorers who turn into role players super valuable off the bench ala Rudy/Gallo. He is young enough to be part of the bench unit even after the a 2 year rebuild. But more likely a flip next year for a bad contract and draft compensation.

Langford is more of a salary dump in BOS point of view. More likely cut next training camp, good defender but not a spurs type player, motor and character concerns since the draft.

26 is when Tatum might leave BOS - ideally it is 2026 pick swap but BOS protected themselves from disaster and made it 2028. 2028 they are maybe 2 years into a rebuild if Tatum left. It is a lottery ticket.

BOS still has a high chance of being in the lottery, they are on a winning streak but some of it is because of a cakewalk schedule.

[Atl Spur]

Richardson is a good bench piece, used to be a first option on a fairly decent Heat team, i have always liked primary scorers who turn into role players super valuable off the bench ala Rudy/Gallo. He is young enough to be part of the bench unit even after the a 2 year rebuild. But more likely a flip next year for a bad contract and draft compensation.

Langford is more of a salary dump in BOS point of view. More likely cut next training camp, good defender but not a spurs type player, motor and character concerns since the draft.

26 is when Tatum might leave BOS - ideally it is 2026 pick swap but BOS protected themselves from disaster and made it 2028. 2028 they are maybe 2 years into a rebuild if Tatum left. It is a lottery ticket.

BOS still has a high chance of being in the lottery, they are on a winning streak but some of it is because of a cakewalk schedule.

Romeo plays D and has playmaking skills, we will teach him how to shoot! He was just traded to a team full of guards ( same height and size ) that can barely dribble or playmake outside of primo / Murray . This kid has a legitimate chance to be just as valuable as the draft pick.

[exstatic]

Richardson is a good bench piece, used to be a first option on a fairly decent Heat team, i have always liked primary scorers who turn into role players super valuable off the bench ala Rudy/Gallo. He is young enough to be part of the bench unit even after the a 2 year rebuild. But more likely a flip next year for a bad contract and draft compensation.

Langford is more of a salary dump in BOS point of view. More likely cut next training camp, good defender but not a spurs type player, motor and character concerns since the draft.

26 is when Tatum might leave BOS - ideally it is 2026 pick swap but BOS protected themselves from disaster and made it 2028. 2028 they are maybe 2 years into a rebuild if Tatum left. It is a lottery ticket.

BOS still has a high chance of being in the lottery, they are on a winning streak but some of it is because of a cakewalk schedule.

Langford’s year 4 option has already been picked up before this year, so unless he’s somehow toxic or disruptive in a KPJ way, he absolutely won’t be cut during training camp. Either of them could be moved for the right assets.

[CGD]

Langford’s year 4 option has already been picked up before this year, so unless he’s somehow toxic or disruptive in a KPJ way, he absolutely won’t be cut during training camp. Either of them could be moved for the right assets.

I do think moving Langford in something they can argue is value, is partially face saving for BOS after much was made of Danny hoarding picks (It’s probably why they haven’t moved on from Smart tbh). They really didn’t get much for all those middling picks they had, and Romeo was one on the “better” ones.

[exstatic]

I do think moving Langford in something they can argue is value, is partially face saving for BOS after much was made of Danny hoarding picks (It’s probably why they haven’t moved on from Smart tbh). They really didn’t get much for all those middling picks they had, and Romeo was one on the “better” ones.

I won’t argue with this. The post I responded to said that he would probably get cut in training camp next fall, and I WILL argue that. They’re not going to eat $5M for a 22YO that could become a bench piece or a future asset in a trade.

I had another post where I posited that playoff teams shouldn’t keep middling lottery picks, they should trade them. Boston drafted Romeo onto a team that was making deep playoff runs, and already had Tatum, Brown, and Smart. How was he ever going to develop? Phoenix drafted Jalen Smith, and he was 4th on their center depth chart until Saric was injured in the playoffs. Why keep that pick? Kick it down the road for an asset and future pick.

[Ocotillo]

Anyone thing Ainge would have made that trade if he was still the guy? I don't.

[Dejounte]

I won’t argue with this. The post I responded to said that he would probably get cut in training camp next fall, and I WILL argue that. They’re not going to eat $5M for a 22YO that could become a bench piece or a future asset in a trade.

I had another post where I posited that playoff teams shouldn’t keep middling lottery picks, they should trade them. Boston drafted Romeo onto a team that was making deep playoff runs, and already had Tatum, Brown, and Smart. How was he ever going to develop? Phoenix drafted Jalen Smith, and he was 4th on their center depth chart until Saric was injured in the playoffs. Why keep that pick? Kick it down the road for an asset and future pick.

They will eat the $5M if it’s blocking them from a roster spot for one of their three 2022 FRP’s (or SRP, if it’s not a two-way) or if they need that spot for a free agent.

[KingKev]

They will eat the $5M if it’s blocking them from a roster spot for one of their three 2022 FRP’s (or SRP, if it’s not a two-way) or if they need that spot for a free agent.

We are likely going into next training with far too many bodies once again. This is why useless signings like KBD and Landale frustrate me. Putting 5 end of the bench guys in comp never made sense to me. Those 3FRPs are nice but they better move guys ahead of training camp if they plan to keep all 3.

[Atl Spur]

They will eat the $5M if it’s blocking them from a roster spot for one of their three 2022 FRP’s (or SRP, if it’s not a two-way) or if they need that spot for a free agent.

I think we all would agree it’s situational but in this instance I’d agree with Exstatic. I would almost bet the farm Romeo was specifically requested for a reason greater than a projected salary dump.

[Biggems]

I won’t argue with this. The post I responded to said that he would probably get cut in training camp next fall, and I WILL argue that. They’re not going to eat $5M for a 22YO that could become a bench piece or a future asset in a trade.

I had another post where I posited that playoff teams shouldn’t keep middling lottery picks, they should trade them. Boston drafted Romeo onto a team that was making deep playoff runs, and already had Tatum, Brown, and Smart. How was he ever going to develop? Phoenix drafted Jalen Smith, and he was 4th on their center depth chart until Saric was injured in the playoffs. Why keep that pick? Kick it down the road for an asset and future pick.

so what you are saying is this. I am a championship contender, but missing one or two pieces.....trade those draft picks now, go get that piece and also future compensation. I agree. Unless, you are getting an absolutely out of this world prospect like Duncan, Kobe, Lebron, or Dirk.....no need in cluttering your bench with youth that will never see the light of day.

[Biggems]

I would be overly joyed if we got Tomas, Josh, and Romeo simply to accrue future assets.

[Dejounte]

We are likely going into next training with far too many bodies once again. This is why useless signings like KBD and Landale frustrate me. Putting 5 end of the bench guys in comp never made sense to me. Those 3FRPs are nice but they better move guys ahead of training camp if they plan to keep all 3.

What’s the issue with having too many bodies in training camp? That makes no sense. It’s in training camp where you see the actual talent level or progress a player has made. Pitting KBD against Luka and Luka probably showing he wasn’t much better was what probably kicked Luka off the team. You need various degrees of talent to see where you are. This is a non-issue.

[KingKev]

What’s the issue with having too many bodies in training camp? That makes no sense. It’s in training camp where you see the actual talent level or progress a player has made. Pitting KBD against Luka and Luka probably showing he wasn’t much better was what probably kicked Luka off the team. You need various degrees of talent to see where you are. This is a non-issue.

The issue is needless guarantees and useless contracts. If we don’t consolidate this summer we are going to be forced to make premature and hard decisions around Tre, Langford other guys who are developing and probably have something to offer.

3FRPs and 35mm in cap space and a an already full roster doesn't make much sense.

[RC_Drunkford]

I actually like that the Spurs keep some competition on the team. Everybody is young and can get playing time, they just gotta be better than the other guys. That puts some pressure on the young guys to develop further, cause their roster spot ain't safe. Players like KBD, Wieskamp and Walker are under pressure if they want to stay on the team next season.

[XDT76]

Why would we have too many body Tomas contract is up, we are buying out Dragic else his contract is up, Josh Rich has a unguaranteed contract next year. LW4 is a RFA next year. KBD and Landale is not guaranteed next year. We have a lot of flexibility.

[RC_Drunkford]

The issue is needless guarantees and useless contracts. If we don’t consolidate this summer we are going to be forced to make premature and hard decisions around Tre, Langford other guys who are developing and probably have something to offer.

3FRPs and 35mm in cap space and a an already full roster doesn't make much sense.


that ain't an issue. Satoransky and Dragic will be gone, that opens up 2 roster spots. KBD could be gone, the same with Walker. Spurs could package 1 or 2 picks to move up and only draft 1 or 2 players which is likely. 2nd round pick gets a 2-way contract. Richardson could be waived or traded on draft night. And the free agent class is garbage, I assume the Spurs will only sign 1 or 2 new players.

[Atl Spur]

White being traded should put everyone on notice……competition is here to stay!

[KingKev]

that ain't an issue. Satoransky and Dragic will be gone, that opens up 2 roster spots. KBD could be gone, the same with Walker. Spurs could package 1 or 2 picks to move up and only draft 1 or 2 players which is likely. 2nd round pick gets a 2-way contract. Richardson could be waived or traded on draft night. And the free agent class is garbage, I assume the Spurs will only sign 1 or 2 new players.

4 incoming draft picks and 35 mm in cap should equate to at least 6 players if we don’t consolidate. It’s going to be an issue again.

Drago and Sato are absolutely gone and hopefully guys like Walker, KBD replaced but this is going to be a potential issue.

[FutureMan]

4 incoming draft picks and 35 mm in cap should equate to at least 6 players if we don’t consolidate. It’s going to be an issue again.

Drago and Sato are absolutely gone and hopefully guys like Walker, KBD replaced but this is going to be a potential issue.

I don’t see it as an issue. Especially since we don’t need to sign anyone unless it’s a big free agent. If so, it can be a sign and trade.

[RC_Drunkford]

4 incoming draft picks and 35 mm in cap should equate to at least 6 players if we don’t consolidate. It’s going to be an issue again.

Drago and Sato are absolutely gone and hopefully guys like Walker, KBD replaced but this is going to be a potential issue.


it's gon be 2 draft picks not 4. I don't know what's so hard to understand there

[KingKev]

it's gon be 2 draft picks not 4. I don't know what's so hard to understand there

Brian Wright called you and said they were going to consolidate picks?

[KingKev]

I don’t see it as an issue. Especially since we don’t need to sign anyone unless it’s a big free agent. If so, it can be a sign and trade.

I think there is a chance it will be an issue. I love what we did at the trade deadline but I hope they have a plan for all this moderate talent we are going to have. It’ll be a shame to have to cut guys like Langford, Weiskamp, Tre Jones simply because we don’t have the roster space. Great that they went up against competition but also silly that we are having such competition for the bottom half of our roster.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

The Boston writer made a lot of good point I agree with concerning the trade. He did understate how well Derrick plays though.

[exstatic]

I would be overly joyed if we got Tomas, Josh, and Romeo simply to accrue future assets.

Tomas will be gone mid April. No assets for him. No one wants him on a buyout, so we can’t even save money.

[exstatic]

it's gon be 2 draft picks not 4. I don't know what's so hard to understand there

Minimum of 3 draft picks: our first, the LAL second, and Boston’s first. No one here thinks we can get a top 4, so no one should think Boston can, either, so we’ll get their pick. The odds on Torontos pick are like 85%, so almost certainly 3 picks and probably 4 picks, assuming no consolidation.

[Chinook]

it's gon be 2 draft picks not 4. I don't know what's so hard to understand there

How many trade-ups do you remember seeing with multiple firsts in the same draft? Why would another team value the multiple Spurs picks over their own higher pick, especially considering that the in the case the Spurs themselves wouldn't?

[rankingtear]

I think we all would agree it’s situational but in this instance I’d agree with Exstatic. I would almost bet the farm Romeo was specifically requested for a reason greater than a projected salary dump.

Well for BOS he is salary dump it was either him , Schroeder or Neismith that has to go out in order for them to get under the tax at the time of the trade. No chance BOS wants to go into the luxury tax this season.

[RC_Drunkford]

Minimum of 3 draft picks: our first, the LAL second, and Boston’s first. No one here thinks we can get a top 4, so no one should think Boston can, either, so we’ll get their pick. The odds on Torontos pick are like 85%, so almost certainly 3 picks and probably 4 picks, assuming no consolidation.

whoever gets signed with the Lakers 2nd will get a 2-way contract, so he won't count against the 15-man roster


How many trade-ups do you remember seeing with multiple firsts in the same draft? Why would another team value the multiple Spurs picks over their own higher pick, especially considering that the in the case the Spurs themselves wouldn't?

they could just package both the Toronto and Boston pick to trade up. Given that the picks outside of the top 4 are pretty even, that's a realistic scenario. I also don't think there's a high chance for the Spurs to get into the top 4 if their own pick is outside of that range, but they most certainly won't draft 3 players in the first round. Even if they do, the 2nd rounder still gets a 2-way

[bluebellmaniac]

International not an option? Though not a fan favorite, it could be they go international and let them mature for a couple years.

[Atl Spur]

International not an option? Though not a fan favorite, it could be they go international and let them mature for a couple years.

I could be on board with that👍🏾

[Chinook]

The issue is needless guarantees and useless contracts. If we don’t consolidate this summer we are going to be forced to make premature and hard decisions around Tre, Langford other guys who are developing and probably have something to offer.

3FRPs and 35mm in cap space and a an already full roster doesn't make much sense.

Neither KBD or Landale have any future guarantees (Landale is an RFA that Deeks for some reason added a year onto). If you blame this year's KBD contract on why Samanic was cut, then you're going to be disappointed for a few years. A lot of players are going to get cut or otherwise dumped. They don't have the spots to hold or develop all of the contracts they're going to be responsible for. They're going to have to make choices and cut players who end up sticking in the league somewhere else. That's one of the main ways teams end up with cast-off steals like Green and Covington. It's going to be part of doing business. Hopefully, though, they'll be able to get rid of almost all of the chaff along with the bits of wheat they miss out on. Guys like Samanic SHOULDN'T stick on a team that has a ton of prospects who've already shown they can play at an acceptable level. There are too many other prospects waiting in the wings to worry about them.

Also, I think it's disrespectful to lament KBD and Landale interfering with "prospects", when both of them are still within the prospect range. Jock is adjusting to the league still. Physically, he's fine, so once his catches up, I expect him to stick. Bates-Diop is in this fourth year in the league. He was drafted the season before Samanic. He was drafted the season AFTER Zach Collins, who for some reason can also still be considered a prospect worth keeping. I understand the belief that KBD is much closer to his ceiling than are the other guys. But the mistake that often comes from that thought is that that means Collins/Samanic will probably grow into being better players. I'm doubtful, because right now, they're nowhere near as good as him. Even if they improve quite a bit, for what KBD is supposed to contribute to a winning team, he just needs to hone one skill. I like the odds of KBD becoming a strong shooter over those than the other players hit all of their targets.

Finally, the team is going to need to keep role-players on their team to continue to give their rotations structure. If Richardson does have a partial guarantee on his contract, he probably shouldn't but cut unless the team needs cap space for a big move. While he does compete with some young players for minutes, he does so by being a passable veteran who's an actual target for young players to reach rather than a guy like Forbes who was already worse than them but continued to get minutes over them anyway. KBD is similar. Do I think if the Spurs draft someone like Eason in the lottery that he should play over KBD (and other players)? Yes. Would I lament some forward picked at 45 being in Austin instead of taking KBD's spot? No. We don't know where the Spurs' trajectory is going to take them next year, but I wouldn't be surprised if Pop isn't content for the team to have another hard rebuilding year. If so, then the team will need floor-establishing players in addition to their prospects.

[Drewlius]

Lol @ trolls complaining we have too many draft picks now because of a bunch of expirings and non guaranteed roster spots. Get a grip, we are by far in the best position we have been in since the Uncle Dennis era.

[rankingtear]

International not an option? Though not a fan favorite, it could be they go international and let them mature for a couple years.

I think Hollinger mentioned this is the worst international class in 2 decades so probably not. Best guess they trade 1 or 2 for future picks.

[Chinook]

whoever gets signed with the Lakers 2nd will get a 2-way contract, so he won't count against the 15-man roster



they could just package both the Toronto and Boston pick to trade up. Given that the picks outside of the top 4 are pretty even, that's a realistic scenario. I also don't think there's a high chance for the Spurs to get into the top 4 if their own pick is outside of that range, but they most certainly won't draft 3 players in the first round. Even if they do, the 2nd rounder still gets a 2-way

We don't know if Cacock or Wieskamp will get those two-ways or even get regular roster spots. I wouldn't rely on using the two-way slots to solve the roster issue.

I understand why you could say the Spurs could just trade up. It's intuitive, but the data we've seen for multiple drafts suggests that teams with multiple first-rounders don't get to package them to move up in the same draft very often.

In the last five years, I've seen two examples:

2019 -- ATL traded 8, 17, 35 and a future first to NOP for 4
2017 -- POR traded 15 and 20 to SAC for the rights to 10

I was going to stop there, but seeing SAC in a trade reminded me of the trade the year before:

2016 -- PHX traded 13, 28, future second and Bodganovic's rights to SAC for 8

The Collins trade in 2017 is probably your best comp, given that it was the only straight trade-up that didn't involve future picks. Maybe it could be worth it, but this trade, and indeed all of these trades combined -- aren't the usual results. You should look up those drafts on Wikipedia to see what teams with multiple firsts usually did. Most of them either took all the players and dealt with the roster glut we've been talking about, or they just took salvage value for the picks. It's not the worst thing if that happens and they get a good deal, but I would at least assume they'll make the picks.

[Chinook]

Also, RGM just dropped the full details on the trade. It's actually more complicated (and better for the Spurs) than we thought:


2022 first round draft pick from Boston
Boston's 1st round pick to San Antonio protected for selections 1-4 in 2022 and 1-4 in 2023; if Boston has not conveyed a 1st round pick to San Antonio by 2023, then Boston will instead convey (i) Portland's 2023 2nd round pick and (ii) Houston's 2023 2nd round pick, Dallas' 2023 2nd round pick or Miami's 2023 2nd round pick (see Boston Incoming) to San Antonio [Boston-San Antonio, 2/10/2022]

2028 first round draft pick from Boston
San Antonio has the right to swap its 2028 1st round pick for Boston's 2028 1st round pick protected for selection 1; if this pick falls on its protected selection and is therefore not conveyable, then Boston will instead convey its 2028 2nd round pick to San Antonio protected for selections 46-60 (if this pick falls within its protected range and is therefore not conveyed, then Boston's obligation to San Antonio will be extinguished) [Boston-San Antonio, 2/10/2022]

And then the details on that 2023 second --


2023 second round draft pick from Houston, Dallas or MiamiOklahoma City will receive the more favorable of Dallas' 2023 2nd round pick and Miami's 2023 2nd round pick (Oklahoma City may convey this pick to New York (see Oklahoma City Outgoing)); Boston will receive the more favorable of (i) Houston's 2023 2nd round pick protected for selections 31-32 and (ii) the less favorable of the Dallas pick and the Miami pick and Indiana will receive the least favorable of the three (via Miami to Dallas; via Memphis' right to swap Dallas or Miami for Houston); if the Houston pick falls within its protected range, then Houston's obligation to Boston will be extinguished and Boston will instead receive the less favorable of the Dallas pick and the Miami pick and Indiana will instead receive the Houston pick [Dallas-Miami, 7/7/2017; Dallas-Memphis, 7/8/2019; Houston-Memphis, 2/6/2020; Boston-Memphis-Portland, 11/20/2020; Dallas-Detroit-Oklahoma City, 11/27/2020; Brooklyn-Cleveland-Houston-Indiana, 1/16/2021]; Boston may convey this pick to San Antonio (see Boston Outgoing)

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/detailed
timvp (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8), since you always seem interested in this

So even if Boston finds a way not to convey a first, they'll give the Spurs what are likely to be two high seconds, and if they somehow win the lotto in 2028 and not convey the swap, they'll give the Spurs another high second. Would three high seconds, Langford and Richardson be enough for White? No. But it's a decent floor.

[rankingtear]

Isn't it 3 seconds for the first one. It's portlands , houstons and the least favorable of Dallas and Miami pick.

[exstatic]

Didn’t OKC flip a FRP to Houston last year that they used on Sengün?

[RC_Drunkford]

We don't know if Cacock or Wieskamp will get those two-ways or even get regular roster spots. I wouldn't rely on using the two-way slots to solve the roster issue.

I understand why you could say the Spurs could just trade up. It's intuitive, but the data we've seen for multiple drafts suggests that teams with multiple first-rounders don't get to package them to move up in the same draft very often.

In the last five years, I've seen two examples:

2019 -- ATL traded 8, 17, 35 and a future first to NOP for 4
2017 -- POR traded 15 and 20 to SAC for the rights to 10

I was going to stop there, but seeing SAC in a trade reminded me of the trade the year before:

2016 -- PHX traded 13, 28, future second and Bodganovic's rights to SAC for 8

The Collins trade in 2017 is probably your best comp, given that it was the only straight trade-up that didn't involve future picks. Maybe it could be worth it, but this trade, and indeed all of these trades combined -- aren't the usual results. You should look up those drafts on Wikipedia to see what teams with multiple firsts usually did. Most of them either took all the players and dealt with the roster glut we've been talking about, or they just took salvage value for the picks. It's not the worst thing if that happens and they get a good deal, but I would at least assume they'll make the picks.

I mean given the Spurs track record in the draft I wouldn't even be mad if they draft 3 players. Do you see a way for them to somehow sneak into the top 4-5 though? I mean the drop off in talent is huge, but then again there are a lot of stupid FO's picking at the top (Magic, Pistons, Rockets) and the Spurs also got the 2025 Bulls pick plus cap space to take on some bad contracts. I still hope they land at least in the top 7 range and then have some lottery luck, but a top 4 pick would be a game changer

[Chinook]

Isn't it 3 seconds for the first one. It's portlands , houstons and the least favorable of Dallas and Miami pick.

No. It's Portland's pick and then the pick 2023 pick in that second blurb, which is basically the more favorable of the Houston pick OR the less favorable of the Dallas and Miami's picks.

Basically, OKC will initially get the best of Dallas or Miami's pick, and then the Spurs get the best of the remaining pick and Houston's pick. In addition to that pick, they'll also get Portland's pick.

To put it a third way, Of the Houston, Dallas, and Miami picks: OKC will get one, the Spurs would get one and Boston would get one. Then completely separate from sorting all of that out, the Spurs would also get Portland's pick.

Of course, the far, far more likely scenario is Boston just conveying a first to the Spurs and not having the first-overall pick in 2028. None of those details changed the likely results, just limited the downsides.

[Chinook]

I mean given the Spurs track record in the draft I wouldn't even be mad if they draft 3 players. Do you see a way for them to somehow sneak into the top 4-5 though? I mean the drop off in talent is huge, but then again there are a lot of stupid FO's picking at the top (Magic, Pistons, Rockets) and the Spurs also got the 2025 Bulls pick plus cap space to take on some bad contracts. I still hope they land at least in the top 7 range and then have some lottery luck, but a top 4 pick would be a game changer

They still have a decent chance to get into the the top four given the newer lottery odds. I don't know that they have a good chance to trade up, given that those three teams you've mentioned have all had multiple first-rounders in recent drafts. Houston, for example, used four first-rounders last year. I would assume they'd prioritize high-end talent rather than multiple roster-filling picks. Of course, they can always read the board dramatically different than SA and trade down if the Spurs are willing to pay, but I would imagine that would be more likely if a team further down like NOP or SAC jump up into the top-four and want more win-now talent. It's possible that someone like NOP might've valued White and/or Johnson enough to drop down into the lower half of the lottery. With Derrick gone, that scenario is less likely, but the team does still have guys like Poeltl who might help.

[Chinook]

Didn’t OKC flip a FRP to Houston last year that they used on Sengün?

They did. They traded it for two heavily protected firsts -- Detroit's pick that's at least moderately protected until 2027 and Washington's pick with similar protections. I don't know if I'd consider the Spurs making a similar trade with their second first a win. OKC could end up getting two okay firsts in a great draft long after they become too good to earn those picks naturally. Or they could have traded the 16th-overall pick for two distant second-rounders. I don't mind the Spurs having even more future pick they can use on trades, but I have no interest in SA becoming another OKC where getting picks for the sake of it seems to be their strategy. I would be highly disappointed if they don't come out of the with two good prospects.

[BatManu20]

Derrick looks good again today so far. He’s gonna be a fan favorite in Boston quick.

Rooting for his success but we need Boston to lose games so hoping they go on a losing streak now lol.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Derrick looks good again today so far. He’s gonna be a fan favorite in Boston quick.
Definitely, he's already the best passer on the team. A lot of Celtic fans had no idea who DW is really, they're pleasantly surprised.

[RC_Drunkford]

Derrick looks good again today so far. He’s gonna be a fan favorite in Boston quick.

Rooting for his success but we need Boston to lose games so hoping they go on a losing streak now lol.

they do have a pretty tough schedule coming up for the next 2 months, so who knows. That winning streak definitely has to stop :lol

[exstatic]

They did. They traded it for two heavily protected firsts -- Detroit's pick that's at least moderately protected until 2027 and Washington's pick with similar protections. I don't know if I'd consider the Spurs making a similar trade with their second first a win. OKC could end up getting two okay firsts in a great draft long after they become too good to earn those picks naturally. Or they could have traded the 16th-overall pick for two distant second-rounders. I don't mind the Spurs having even more future pick they can use on trades, but I have no interest in SA becoming another OKC where getting picks for the sake of it seems to be their strategy. I would be highly disappointed if they don't come out of the with two good prospects.

I’m not proposing that we trade two picks. It’s just a good thing to be in that market, and to have two picks that could be available, diluting OKCs market, especially for that late pick. There are 8 teams with no first rounder. I think we can get a decent return on one of the two 20ish picks., and use the other two picks.

[Mr. Body]

White is a big boost for the Cs. He's automatically their best connecter on offense and he plays great defense. They still have problems on the roster. The Brown/Tatum pairing is still not perfect and their supporting cast is just okay.

[CGD]

The teams with no FRP in 2022 (best I can tell) and may be targets to buy a FRP from Spurs are:

NOP; LAL; LAC; BOS; TOR; PHI; UTH; PHX

[CGD]

I’m not proposing that we trade two picks. It’s just a good thing to be in that market, and to have two picks that could be available, diluting OKCs market, especially for that late pick. There are 8 teams with no first rounder. I think we can get a decent return on one of the two 20ish picks., and use the other two picks.

To be fair, OKC’s assets also dilutes the Spurs’ later two picks.

[BatManu20]

1492962591190265861

[RC_Drunkford]

The teams with no FRP in 2022 (best I can tell) and may be targets to buy a FRP from Spurs are:

NOP; LAL; LAC; BOS; TOR; PHI; UTH; PHX


doesn't NOLA get the Lakers pick?

[Chinook]

To be fair, OKC’s assets also dilutes the Spurs’ later two picks.

It's not just them. Memphis, Houston, Portland and Indy are also teams with multiple firsts if the season ended today.

A potential trade-up team I could the Spurs working with is Washington. They have a lot of front-court players but probably need to draft guards, and they have an okay but not great first and no other picks. I could see them having some real interest in 19, 20 and 42 for 11. The Spurs might be position to take a guard in the lottery but miss out on the first crop of forwards. By moving up to 11 they can get a chance at the second group of forwards currently slotted in the late-lottery like Eason, Murray, Baldwin or Brown and avoid having to reach or take two or even three guards (which would be a disaster) to keep with BPA.

[CGD]

doesn't NOLA get the Lakers pick?

I think it’s destined for Memphis (at least per tankathon)

And wow, maybe I haven’t noticed this in previous drafts, but 3 teams have 3 picks each in this draft (SAS, OKC, MEM). Three other teams have 2 each (IND, HOU, POR), which probably is less remarkable.

[CGD]

It's not just them. Memphis, Houston, Portland and Indy are also teams with multiple firsts if the season ended today.

A potential trade-up team I could the Spurs working with is Washington. They have a lot of front-court players but probably need to draft guards, and they have an okay but not great first and no other picks. I could see them having some real interest in 19, 20 and 42 for 11. The Spurs might be position to take a guard in the lottery but miss out on the first crop of forwards. By moving up to 11 they can get a chance at the second group of forwards currently slotted in the late-lottery like Eason, Murray, Baldwin or Brown and avoid having to reach or take two or even three guards (which would be a disaster) to keep with BPA.

I also like CHA in that range, with potential to use Jakob and lesser of BOS/TOR picks as inducement

[TD 21]

Lol @ trolls complaining we have too many draft picks now because of a bunch of expirings and non guaranteed roster spots. Get a grip, we are by far in the best position we have been in since the Uncle Dennis era.

Yeah, it's a low bar, but I don't see the point in trying to invent a solution in search of a problem.

I get that many are slow to trust after the disastrous recent past, but the biggest takeaway is they finally appeared to have joined the modern NBA in terms of team building, which is a win in and of itself.

The other one was that they presumably view Murray as their first foundational piece and are now focused on constructing a roster around him that complements him.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Derrick like oh I'm able to throw alley oops on this team:lol

1492953688540864523

[TDomination]

Miss Derrick and I’m sure Derrick was sad too but after today’s game he’s probably like Spurs who? Lol

[Cabrito]

D. White shoots 4-14 with this Spurs team usually would mean an L.

[mystargtr34]

The Celtics are actually better than their record indicates if you go by advanced stats. It has a lot to do with their starting lineup of RW-Horford-Tatum-Brown-Smart having a damn good net rating. Things use to fall apart when the bench started coming in i.e. Schroeder and Richardson didn't fit well with the others. Not to mention you had Anus Cancer getting minutes. Now they have Derrick running the second unit and you have Theis coming back. Pritchard-DW-Grant Williams-This along with one of Tatum or Brown is a lot stronger defensively than the bench prior to the trade.

I think Boston and Toronto will battle out for the 6 spot till the end of the season.

[KingKev]

Does anyone know when KBD and Landale’s contracts become guaranteed? June 30th I‘m assuming?

I’d think KBD and Walker are likely not being brought back. Jock still has an intriguing skillset so it would be a shame to have to cut him loose this soon.

I really doubt we consolidate draft picks and I hope we don’t. 3 chances at young, cost controlled talent makes much more sense than moving up in the draft given our propensity to find solid players, late in the draft, time after time.

[KingKev]

D. White shoots 4-14 with this Spurs team usually would mean an L.

2-10 3pt shooting. At some point he needs to realize he is a terrible 3 pt shooter.

He is one Spur I absolutely will not miss.

[Dejounte]

Does anyone know when KBD and Landale’s contracts become guaranteed? June 30th I‘m assuming?

I’d think KBD and Walker are likely not being brought back. Jock still has an intriguing skillset so it would be a shame to have to cut him loose this soon.

I really doubt we consolidate draft picks and I hope we don’t. 3 chances at young, cost controlled talent makes much more sense than moving up in the draft given our propensity to find solid players, late in the draft, time after time.

It’s not cost controlled when you have to pay them all at the same time when their contracts are up. That’s a disaster waiting to happen. Do you understand how rare that happens in the NBA? I’m open to us having three more rooks on the team but it’s not as simple as you make it out to be. I’d rather them trade up if they see a greater talent that they like.

[KingKev]

It’s not cost controlled when you have to pay them all at the same time when their contracts are up. That’s a disaster waiting to happen. Do you understand how rare that happens in the NBA? I’m open to us having three more rooks on the team but it’s not as simple as you make it out to be. I’d rather them trade up if they see a greater talent that they like.

We are already going to start seeing this happen with Vassell and KJ. Don’t need to pay everyone, you can move them for value before their rookie extensions kick in.

I’d prefer 3 shots at young talent is my argument. For every Leonard or Murray there is a Luka or Walker.

[Dejounte]

We are already going to start seeing this happen with Vassell and KJ. Don’t need to pay everyone, you can move them for value before their rookie extensions kick in.

I’d prefer 3 shots at young talent is my argument. For every Leonard or Murray there is a Luka or Walker.

KJ and Vassell are going to be paid in different years, which is much more manageable than doing it the same year. Imagine going into contract negotiations and potentially losing all three to other teams because they don’t like your offer. Instead of losing just one in one year and being able to retool with free agency if that occurs. I’m only talking contract-wise too, who knows what the impact is to the development team when they have to stretch their resources to 3-4 rooks instead of focusing on a couple?

[tbdog]

It’s not cost controlled when you have to pay them all at the same time when their contracts are up. That’s a disaster waiting to happen. Do you understand how rare that happens in the NBA? I’m open to us having three more rooks on the team but it’s not as simple as you make it out to be. I’d rather them trade up if they see a greater talent that they like.

2019, spurs took on three rookies. Only one still exists on the team. I get your point. But that was a bad draft by the spurs.

[Dejounte]

2019, spurs took on three rookies. Only one still exists on the team. I get your point. But that was a bad draft by the spurs.

And it may have been bad because developmentally they had to stretch their resources to three instead of two. Like I said, I’m playing devil’s advocate here. I’m open to three, I just don’t think it’s as simple.

[KingKev]

KJ and Vassell are going to be paid in different years, which is much more manageable than doing it the same year. Imagine going into contract negotiations and potentially losing all three to other teams because they don’t like your offer. Instead of losing just one in one year and being able to retool with free agency if that occurs. I’m only talking contract-wise too, who knows what the impact is to the development team when they have to stretch their resources to 3-4 rooks instead of focusing on a couple?

Cap space is unlikely to be a problem for us for years to come. Regardless these are good problems to have.

[KingKev]

KJ and Vassell are going to be paid in different years, which is much more manageable than doing it the same year. Imagine going into contract negotiations and potentially losing all three to other teams because they don’t like your offer. Instead of losing just one in one year and being able to retool with free agency if that occurs. I’m only talking contract-wise too, who knows what the impact is to the development team when they have to stretch their resources to 3-4 rooks instead of focusing on a couple?

Cap space is unlikely to be a problem for us for years to come. Regardless these are good problems to have.

[JeffDuncan]

Does anyone know when KBD and Landale’s contracts become guaranteed? …


KBD’s contract for next season becomes fully guaranteed on opening night. In other words, his money is guaranteed if he makes the team. Very sensible.

On Landale, all I can find is that his contract for next season is not guaranteed at this time.

Since the Spurs were active, and creative, in midseason trades, it implies deals could happen on draft night. Something like drafting a player for another team, in connection with a trade, might not be ruled out. If they did more wheeling and dealing it wouldn’t surprise me, is what I mean.

[Ocotillo]

It’s not cost controlled when you have to pay them all at the same time when their contracts are up. That’s a disaster waiting to happen. Do you understand how rare that happens in the NBA? I’m open to us having three more rooks on the team but it’s not as simple as you make it out to be. I’d rather them trade up if they see a greater talent that they like.

I see your point. This does presume they all three turn into keepers.

[KingKev]

KBD’s contract for next season becomes fully guaranteed on opening night. In other words, his money is guaranteed if he makes the team. Very sensible.

On Landale, all I can find is that his contract for next season is not guaranteed at this time.

Since the Spurs were active, and creative, in midseason trades, it implies deals could happen on draft night. Something like drafting a player for another team, in connection with a trade, might not be ruled out. If they did more wheeling and dealing it wouldn’t surprise me, is what I mean.

Thank you sir.

[BatManu20]

Celtics destroying the Sixers on the road right now but Derrick is struggling. He can’t hit an open 3 right now. His shooting slump continues.

[alfahdlan]

D. WHITE +41 BPM

[slick'81]

11/1/2/1 for white

[BatManu20]

Yea Boston whooped em by like 50 and Derrick did a lot of good things on both sides of the ball. He clearly makes them a better team. He just can’t hit any of his open 3’s right now. If those start falling at even an average rate, he’ll a fantastic pickup for them. He’s already a good one.

[exstatic]

It’s not cost controlled when you have to pay them all at the same time when their contracts are up. That’s a disaster waiting to happen. Do you understand how rare that happens in the NBA? I’m open to us having three more rooks on the team but it’s not as simple as you make it out to be. I’d rather them trade up if they see a greater talent that they like.

I remember one draft, maybe 1990, where Sacto drafted FOUR players with first round picks, but to see more than two is very unusual, and I agree, undesirable.

None of them panned out, btw.

[R. DeMurre]

In three games with Boston, White is +64.

[XDT76]

I remember one draft, maybe 1990, where Sacto drafted FOUR players with first round picks, but to see more than two is very unusual, and I agree, undesirable.

None of them panned out, btw.

I remember Spurs wanted to draft Jimmy Butler also, but when they got Kawhi, they decided to go with JC as they did not deem to have enough resources to develop KL and JB.

[Chinook]

I remember one draft, maybe 1990, where Sacto drafted FOUR players with first round picks, but to see more than two is very unusual, and I agree, undesirable.

None of them panned out, btw.

The Rockets just used four firsts last year (Green, Sengun, Garuba and Christopher). They and OKC both had three to start the draft.

Boston had three the year before but ended up dumping one to Memphis for two seconds. That became Bane, which is looking like a mistake.

They also had three in 2019 and end up dumping one of them on Philly ... which ended up being Thybulle, so they had a bad couple of years. Atlanta had three firsts that same year but traded two to NOP, meaning the Pelicans had three (Zion, Hayes, NAW).

In 2018, ATL had three firsts and used them with the caveat that they traded down with Dallas but still ended up using three firsts (Young, Reddish Spellman).

In 2017, POR had three firsts but moved the best two in order to trade up for Collins. That gave SAC three firsts, which they used (Fox, Jackson, Giles). In addition, the Lakers drafted went into the draft with three firsts and used three, though they moved down a bit at the end of the round (Ball, Kuzma, Hart)

In 2016, Denver had three firsts and used them. Philly also had and used three firsts that year. Phoenix had three firsts but traded their latter two to SAC part of the Chriss trade, giving SAC three firsts to use (Papagiannis, Richardson, Skal).


You basically have to go all the way back to 2015 to find a year where someone didn't end up getting three players out of the first round. This year, the Spurs, Thunder and Grizzlies are all going into the draft with three picks if the season ended today. Portland, Atlanta Indiana and Houston either can or might go into the draft with two firsts, meaning in the event of a trade down they might have three. I'd consider it pretty likely that at least one team is going to draft three first-rounders or trade for their rights on draft night. It'll probably be two or three.

[Mr. Body]

The NYK drafted Channing Frye and David Lee in 2005. I thought they drafted Nate Robinson that night but actually traded for him.

[daslicer]

2019, spurs took on three rookies. Only one still exists on the team. I get your point. But that was a bad draft by the spurs.

It was an ok draft. They could have gotten Thybulle instead of Luka but they did fine with Keldon as their other first round pick. The second-round pick of Quindary was a flop but second round picks tend to fail over 90 percent of time.

[RC_Drunkford]

Celtics destroying the Sixers on the road right now but Derrick is struggling. He can’t hit an open 3 right now. His shooting slump continues.

he‘s been in that slump his entire career

[Spursfanfromafar]

It doesn't show on the boxscore...oh wait. It does. White had a +41 in his +/- on the court as the Celtics routed the Sixers. My main man is a great fit with the green as he does everything (except 3 point shooting now) at an above average level. The Spurs didn't have enough All Star talent to make the best out of White but the Celtics do. They have two Uber talented wings (the most coveted assets in the NBA) who are very good at both ends but somehow they lacked complete chemistry and a bit of facilitation. White just comes in and makes it easy for them by smoothening up rough ends. I feel happy for White but it's bittersweet. If only we had a do it all wing to go with White and Murray. The Spurs would have been contenders. Anyways White has helped the Spurs get more draft picks and help secure our future better. So here's hope.

[alfahdlan]

Fearless forecast: Boston to vie for east championship save injury to key players

[CGD]

In three games with Boston, White is +64.

Yeah, but he was +48 in the 40 point thumping of PHI, so that is massively skewed

[CGD]

And it may have been bad because developmentally they had to stretch their resources to three instead of two. Like I said, I’m playing devil’s advocate here. I’m open to three, I just don’t think it’s as simple.

Agree with you, and that’s before the question of roster openings.

Ideal situation in my view is consolidating 8, 18, 20 into 8 and 11. Or, selling 20 to a team lacking a pick for a 2023 FRP, although, with many teams owning multiple picks the price of a first this year may be depressed.

Also, it wouldnt be terrible if the Raptors pick was pushed to 2023 by virtue of them missing the playoffs, but of course it means one less chance of it turning into a FRP.

[John B]

I’m not opposed to using all FRP if for top 5, Kessler and Jovic, while trading and stashing the SRP’s. It’s ideal to stagger, but IF they see the players they like, go for it. I have high hopes that PATFO will be creative on using Spurs picks and cap space this coming off season. Spurs could very well contend immediately IF successful. I certainly don’t want another tanking season.

[R. DeMurre]

Yeah, but he was +48 in the 40 point thumping of PHI, so that is massively skewed

His three games were +11, +12, and +41... he's also had the best +/- on the team in two games , and the second best in the third. Yes, a small sample size, but pretty impressive nonetheless.

[Drom John]

I remember one draft, maybe 1990, where Sacto drafted FOUR players with first round picks, but to see more than two is very unusual, and I agree, undesirable.

None of them panned out, btw.

But their second rounder did.

Pick#/Career WS order

7/18 Lionel Simmons
14/34 Travis Mays
18/20 Duane Causwell
23/22 Anthony Bonner
40/13 Bimbo Coles

24/40 Dwayne Schintzius
43/21 Tony Massenburg
54/44 Sean Higgins

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

His three games were +11, +12, and +41... he's also had the best +/- on the team in two games , and the second best in the third. Yes, a small sample size, but pretty impressive nonetheless.

He's helping them I think. Long-term, though, this was a good move for the Spurs.

[Sugus]

It doesn't show on the boxscore...oh wait. It does. White had a +41 in his +/- on the court as the Celtics routed the Sixers. My main man is a great fit with the green as he does everything (except 3 point shooting now) at an above average level. The Spurs didn't have enough All Star talent to make the best out of White but the Celtics do. They have two Uber talented wings (the most coveted assets in the NBA) who are very good at both ends but somehow they lacked complete chemistry and a bit of facilitation. White just comes in and makes it easy for them by smoothening up rough ends. I feel happy for White but it's bittersweet. If only we had a do it all wing to go with White and Murray. The Spurs would have been contenders. Anyways White has helped the Spurs get more draft picks and help secure our future better. So here's hope.

Same exact thing is gonna happen with Jakob once he's inevitably off this team. Can't wait for dolts and national media alike to make a sudden 180º and start wondering why would the Spurs let such a great player go and all that shit, as if we couldn't tell already. Not every player has to be a superstar (rather the opposite if you want the team to work out well), White is a great example of that and I'm missing him already.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Smart out Derrick making his first career start with the Celtics.

[Maddog]

It doesn't show on the boxscore...oh wait. It does. White had a +41 in his +/- on the court as the Celtics routed the Sixers. My main man is a great fit with the green as he does everything (except 3 point shooting now) at an above average level. The Spurs didn't have enough All Star talent to make the best out of White but the Celtics do. They have two Uber talented wings (the most coveted assets in the NBA) who are very good at both ends but somehow they lacked complete chemistry and a bit of facilitation. White just comes in and makes it easy for them by smoothening up rough ends. I feel happy for White but it's bittersweet. If only we had a do it all wing to go with White and Murray. The Spurs would have been contenders. Anyways White has helped the Spurs get more draft picks and help secure our future better. So here's hope.

The Celtic's are just a perfect fit for him. I'm rooting for him.

[FutureMan]

The real fear for me is White’s ineffective offense is a core reason why we had such a bad record. At the trade deadline we had the 6th worst record in the league. Let’s see how it goes.

It goes without saying but I’ll say it anyway, if the Spurs finish with the 10th pick or worse it’ll be another wasted season waiting on a franchise player.

[Dejounte]

Richardson looks like a rotation player, at least. People go on and on about asset management, but if he’s a culture fit and it makes sense to keep him, then keep him.

[slick'81]

Richardson looks like a rotation player, at least. People go on and on about asset management, but if he’s a culture fit and it makes sense to keep him, then keep him.

could def see sa resigning him. Why not?

[John B]

How did Josh look out there? How’s his defense?

[ismael-robert]

Spurs searching dark web bringing in everyone's who ever said something positive about them

[tbdog]

could def see sa resigning him. Why not?

Depends what's happening with walker and the draft.

Iff vassell and Primo are guaranteed your sgs, then it makes keeping him. But then there's walker and 3 1st round picks. I'm going to assume one pick is a guard. And all those players are not point guards

[RC_Drunkford]

Richardson looks like a rotation player, at least. People go on and on about asset management, but if he’s a culture fit and it makes sense to keep him, then keep him.

Like I said the Spurs didn't even get worse through the trade and contenders will definitely cough up a first for his expiring deal at the deadline

[exstatic]

could def see sa resigning him. Why not?

Because he’ll be almost 30 when his deal is up in 2023, and he’ll be occupying a roster spot that we’ll likely need going forward for our draft picks.

[exstatic]

Like I said the Spurs didn't even get worse through the trade and contenders will definitely cough up a first for his expiring deal at the deadline

He makes sense for a strong playoff team. He will be just shy of 29, shoots and defends, and is on a reasonable deal. Contender catnip.

[John B]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CZlFMChlyQD/?utm_medium=copy_link

[Dverde]

I think Spurs should integrate Richardson immediately. Play him good minutes until next trade deadline than trade him. Team still needs a couple vets to play with the kids. I could see him playing well with Tre and Primo

[slick'81]

Because he’ll be almost 30 when his deal is up in 2023, and he’ll be occupying a roster spot that we’ll likely need going forward for our draft picks.

oh i dont like the player. Hes a blackhole on offense,and as inconsistent as lonnie

[exstatic]

I think Spurs should integrate Richardson immediately. Play him good minutes until next trade deadline than trade him. Team still needs a couple vets to play with the kids. I could see him playing well with Tre and Primo
The next trade window is during the draft.

[scott]

The next trade window is during the draft.

Is his deal a TO or non-guaranteed? I thought I recall us not being tied to JRich after this season? I assume we’d have declined the TO by the draft?

[KingKev]

Is his deal a TO or non-guaranteed? I thought I recall us not being tied to JRich after this season? I assume we’d have declined the TO by the draft?

22-23 is guaranteed for JRich. Langford is a team option.

[Chinook]

22-23 is guaranteed for JRich. Langford is a team option.

Langford WAS a TO. Now it's just a guaranteed year.

[scott]

This shows him in the last year of his deal. Are we off the hook for him after this season or no? I thought that was one of the benefits I’d the deal?

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/san-antonio-spurs/josh-richardson-17868/

[KingKev]

Langford WAS a TO. Now it's just a guaranteed year.

oh yeah you are correct, forgot those roomie team options are the November before.

Will be interesting to see if JRich and Langford get time these next few months.

[CGD]

This shows him in the last year of his deal. Are we off the hook for him after this season or no? I thought that was one of the benefits I’d the deal?

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/san-antonio-spurs/josh-richardson-17868/

If you scroll further down you’ll see he’s owed $12,196,094 next year.

[scott]

Never mind, I see the Celtics gave him an extension so he has that extra year

[John B]

I didn’t see the game last night, friends birthday/poker party. How did Richardson play? Stats show 10/4/4 in 26 mins. It seems a good vet production from the bench.

[slick'81]

I didn’t see the game last night, friends birthday/poker party. How did Richardson play? Stats show 10/4/4 in 26 mins. It seems a good vet production from the bench.

That's pretty much the best you can hope for. Enjoy

[Dex]

I didn’t see the game last night, friends birthday/poker party. How did Richardson play? Stats show 10/4/4 in 26 mins. It seems a good vet production from the bench.

He was alright. He got extra minutes because DJ/KJ/Jak were out...had some good plays and bad, but overall a decent outing for a guy who has only been with the team 2 weeks and was basically playing with our GLeague squad. Most of his time on the floor was spent with the likes of Primo, Landale, KBD, Wieskamp, and others and he was still able to be mostly effective.

[exstatic]

I didn’t see the game last night, friends birthday/poker party. How did Richardson play? Stats show 10/4/4 in 26 mins. It seems a good vet production from the bench.

Exactly what I hope some contender is looking for this summer or next season.