Spurs looking to acquire another 1st?

[scott]

Thinking about Orlando, their current depth chart probably looks something like this:

Fultz/Anthony
Harris/Suggs
F Wagner/Houstan
Bancher/M Wagner
Carter Jr/Goga/Bol Bol

The players in bold are the obvious upgrade points. You'd assume they'd probably still hold out hope that Suggs can become their starting PG.

Walker fits in very nicely as an upgrade to M Wagner, and Dick would be a major upgrade over Houstan.

[DPG21920]

Thinking about Orlando, their current depth chart probably looks something like this:

Fultz/Anthony
Harris/Suggs
F Wagner/Houstan
Bancher/M Wagner
Carter Jr/Goga/Bol Bol

The players in bold are the obvious upgrade points. You'd assume they'd probably still hold out hope that Suggs can become their starting PG.

Walker fits in very nicely as an upgrade to M Wagner, and Dick would be a major upgrade over Houstan.

All true - but you have to ask; are there vets via FA or Trade they would value over adding more youth given how close they were to play in? Maybe, maybe not. Hard to tell. But if they think TOR+CHI picks come in more handy in landing a legit vet to fill that upgrade could see a path no?

[scott]

All true - but you have to ask; are there vets via FA or Trade they would value over adding more youth given how close they were to play in? Maybe, maybe not. Hard to tell. But if they think TOR+CHI picks come in more handy in landing a legit vet to fill that upgrade could see a path no?

It would seem to me based on their team and the improvement they showed last year, largely based on Paolo showing he is really legit (IMO), I would be looking to make a big leap if I were them. Maybe doing 11 for two more FRPs to use to acquire a good vet would be the way to go... who knows with that franchise though?

[rankingtear]

Detroit desperately needs wings. I think they probably try to trade up to get Brandon Miller, and if not they'll pick up Cam Whitmore, which is the right move IMO. The only way we could have a chance could be something like, say, Keldon + unprotected Spurs '24. and that's a MAYBE. I wouldn't do that for Anthony Black though, I really like him but it's too much.

I think this is on point in terms of value for the next couple of picks after top 3.

[Ariel]

The first rounders from Toronto ('24, protected 6-6-6), Chicago ('25, protected 10-8-8) and Atlanta ('25 and '27, unrestricted) have great chances of conveying and may very well do so in the lottery given the uncertain status of those teams. I'd be VERY wary of moving those picks, especially 2 of them for a single one right now, unless it's for a very highly rated prospect. One of those + #33 / #44 + bunch of future 2nds + taking bad salary + sending expiring contract (McDermott, Graham) should be the starting offer. I think that's a pretty fair package for a late lottery pick (Detroit landed #13 -Duren- for Denver's '23 first -clearly in the 20s all along- + 4 second rounders).

[Extra Stout]

I think this is on point in terms of value for the next couple of picks after top 3.
How many games do you figure other teams think the Spurs will win next year? 35? 40? So where would that have them picking, late lottery probably?

So you’re trading a pick somewhere around 11, plus Keldon Johnson, for a pick around 6. While I’m not as high as some on KJ’s value because of his bad defense, I’m inclined to agree with you.

[KingKev]

Thinking about Orlando, their current depth chart probably looks something like this:

Fultz/Anthony
Harris/Suggs
F Wagner/Houstan
Bancher/M Wagner
Carter Jr/Goga/Bol Bol

The players in bold are the obvious upgrade points. You'd assume they'd probably still hold out hope that Suggs can become their starting PG.

Walker fits in very nicely as an upgrade to M Wagner, and Dick would be a major upgrade over Houstan.

Jonathan Issac IF healthy is a big piece also

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/1662470668766593024

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/1662470668766593024

Dude is tailor made for today’s basketball. I’m sad because I know there’s such a small chance we’ll be able to get him. But I know wherever he goes he’ll be fun to watch.

[mo7888]

Haha - I would even do CHI + TOR, but ya, it’s not set in stone. Just a general framework :lol

I'd do cha + CHI, but I wouldn't include Toronto as part of a package with any other first unless I was moving into the top 8.

[mo7888]

All true - but you have to ask; are there vets via FA or Trade they would value over adding more youth given how close they were to play in? Maybe, maybe not. Hard to tell. But if they think TOR+CHI picks come in more handy in landing a legit vet to fill that upgrade could see a path no?

That's a good point. I don't think Orlando really wants to add to rookies to this squad. One at most and then vets..

[TD 21]

Thinking about Orlando, their current depth chart probably looks something like this:

Fultz/Anthony
Harris/Suggs
F Wagner/Houstan
Bancher/M Wagner
Carter Jr/Goga/Bol Bol

The players in bold are the obvious upgrade points. You'd assume they'd probably still hold out hope that Suggs can become their starting PG.

Walker fits in very nicely as an upgrade to M Wagner, and Dick would be a major upgrade over Houstan.

When healthy, Isaac-Bol-M. Wagner (UFA) were the primary 3-5 backups.

Suggs was never going to be a PG in the NBA. If he can become a decent enough catch and shoot 3-point threat, he'll be their starting SG.

They'll probably target Van Vleet (Fultz, Isaac and Harris, all have relatively little to no guaranteed money, so they could sign him outright) in free agency.

[scott]

When healthy, Isaac-Bol-M. Wagner (UFA) were the primary 3-5 backups.

Suggs was never going to be a PG in the NBA. If he can become a decent enough catch and shoot 3-point threat, he'll be their starting SG.

They'll probably target Van Vleet (Fultz, Isaac and Harris, all have relatively little to no guaranteed money, so they could sign him outright) in free agency.

Did mean SG on Suggs, good catch.

I think all the rest that you describe are still the big upgrade points (meaning you aren't going to avoid prospects because you're covered) and Any combo of Cam/Walker/Hendrix + Dick/Hawkins would fit their team nicely.

[Mugen]

A third FRP for #11? There’s a pretty good chance that Toronto’s pick is even, or better, so that the CHA pick would just be a sweetener. I hated the OKC trade last year where they gave up three FRPs for #11. Ain’t nobody I want at #11 at the cost of three FRPs

Don't blame me, I didn't set the market :lol

I didn't love the OKC trade last year but....they had the assets, had a guy they targeted fall and pulled the trigger to get it done. I can respect that tbh.

Spurs could find themselves in a similar spot and I trust this FO with drafting more than anything else they do. They're loaded with firsts for the next several years that they can't all use tbh, I wouldn't fault them for dipping into the warchest and taking a chance if they think it's worth it.

[CGD]

Don't blame me, I didn't set the market :lol

I didn't love the OKC trade last year but....they had the assets, had a guy they targeted fall and pulled the trigger to get it done. I can respect that tbh.

Spurs could find themselves in a similar spot and I trust this FO with drafting more than anything else they do. They're loaded with firsts for the next several years that they can't all use tbh, I wouldn't fault them for dipping into the warchest and taking a chance if they think it's worth it.

Go back and look at those picks. They were shitty given all the protections. Like even shittier than the Spurs’s CHA pick.

Let’s not act like they were lotto picks or anything. The CHI, TOR, and ATL picks are far superior.

[Mr. Body]

The OKC trades are somewhat contextual.

The Denver pick was going to be late first, as it now is. The two other picks are going to be in the vaguely 10-16 range, and I think they will eventually convey. This, of course, is the range where they acquired the pick. Crucially, we need to account for the player grabbed. In this case, it's Ousmane Dieng.

It seems Presti splurged to grab two players in a row he liked, Dieng and Jalen Williams, a pick he nailed. Dieng hasn't looked terrific yet, but was a longterm project from the start. Also, if Presti couldn't decide and getting a new pick for Dieng allowed him to then pick Williams, it's a win. But ultimately it's either an incomplete or a 'C.' It feels like Dieng is a Pokusevski kind of swing of the bat. New York will be happy with the picks.

Now... if the Spurs see a player at #11 who should have been picked higher, I'd say trading three picks (theoretically) is a good deal. Depends on the picks, depends on the player. Like, if a player I think is top 5 in this draft is there, then it's a good trade (if it has to be three). If it's a big swing on a Dieng, it's not.

[Ariel]

Don't blame me, I didn't set the market :lol

I didn't love the OKC trade last year but....they had the assets, had a guy they targeted fall and pulled the trigger to get it done. I can respect that tbh.

Spurs could find themselves in a similar spot and I trust this FO with drafting more than anything else they do. They're loaded with firsts for the next several years that they can't all use tbh, I wouldn't fault them for dipping into the warchest and taking a chance if they think it's worth it.
That move didn't set the market any more than Charlotte selling #13 for Denver's '23 first (low 20s, eventually #27) and 4 2nd rounders did. It's just one team with many more low quality first rounders than they can use, being infatuated with some guy. Doesn't mean anyone else needs to follow, and doesn't seem likely to repeat itself.

[scott]

Go back and look at those picks. They were shitty given all the protections. Like even shittier than the Spurs’s CHA pick.

Let’s not act like they were lotto picks or anything. The CHI, TOR, and ATL picks are far superior.

Hard disagree if you look at how the protections slide back and they have an extended time horizon to convey. If anything, I'd argue the DET and WAS picks are about equal to the CHA pick. The TOR pick is certainly more valuable though.

Can a team add protections to further trade a protected pick? Is that allowed? Ex: Could the Spurs trade the TOR pick, protected 7-14?

[JPB]

That move didn't set the market any more than Charlotte selling #13 for Denver's '23 first (low 20s, eventually #27) and 4 2nd rounders did. It's just one team with many more low quality first rounders than they can use, being infatuated with some guy. Doesn't mean anyone else needs to follow, and doesn't seem likely to repeat itself.

Yeah, retrospectively, that was a really bad trade for CHA. No idea what went through their mind. Oh wait, MJ...

[Mr. Body]

Yeah, retrospectively, that was a really bad trade for CHA. No idea what went through their mind. Oh wait, MJ...

Is this the trade involving Duren? There was some cap-saving measures for both CHA and NYK. It's really confusing and unclear. I think the Knicks got enough space to later sign Brunson. I think Charlotte might have cleared enough to resign Bridges?

[buttsR4rebounding]

For some reason I have a strong feeling the Spurs may be targeting Ausar Thompson with the 2nd first rounder. TimVP’s info on them being real high on the twins. He could be an elite 3 a couple of years from now. A front court of Wemby, Sochan, and Ausar would be an absolute defensive nightmare for opponents.

[Ariel]

Is this the trade involving Duren? There was some cap-saving measures for both CHA and NYK. It's really confusing and unclear. I think the Knicks got enough space to later sign Brunson. I think Charlotte might have cleared enough to resign Bridges?
yeah, it was a weird 3-way deal (or 2 2-ways?): https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/06/hornets-trading-no-13-pick-jalen-duren-to-pistons.html
Basically:
Charlotte sends #13 (Duren) to NY for Denver's '23 1st rounder + 4 second rounders
NY then sends #13 (Duren) to Detroit for Milwaukee's '25 1st rounder + Kemba Walker's contract
The important part of the deal (what sets the price of the pick) is what Charlotte got for #13, the rest is NY's messy dealings to make room for Brunson. Awful deal, but goes to show that you can't use a single deal as a universal measure of value, it depends on what teams need (and how badly), and that's different in every case. As a rule of thumb, I wouldn't expect most teams to take a projected late first + 4 2nds for a lottery pick, just like I wouldn't expect most teams to part with 3 1sts... somewhere in between (2 picks, pick + salary dump, pick + rotation player, etc) sounds more representative IMO.

[CGD]

Is this the trade involving Duren? There was some cap-saving measures for both CHA and NYK. It's really confusing and unclear. I think the Knicks got enough space to later sign Brunson. I think Charlotte might have cleared enough to resign Bridges?

It’s that one. Still a head scratcher from the CHA perspective. If it was Bridges, they had his rights so not sure why they needed the space for

[exstatic]

Go back and look at those picks. They were shitty given all the protections. Like even shittier than the Spurs’s CHA pick.

Let’s not act like they were lotto picks or anything. The CHI, TOR, and ATL picks are far superior.

Our CHA pick can never convey better than #15. The protections on the Detroit pick drop to 1-9 by 2027. The Washington pick protections drop to 1-8 by 2026. Those will both likely convey, although it will take a while.

[CGD]

Our CHA pick can never convey better than #15. The protections on the Detroit pick drop to 1-9 by 2027. The Washington pick protections drop to 1-8 by 2026. Those will both likely convey, although it will take a while.

DET pick is also top 13 protected in 2025, which could be about the time Cade and crew should be popping.

WAS just loves being in that 8-11 seed range, so if they are play-in team next year the pick could convey (top 12 protected).

DAL pick is top 10 next year and they are highly highly motivated to be good next year.

Bottom line there is a chance all of these fall outside the lotto (Dallas most likely).

[Mr. Body]

yeah, it was a weird 3-way deal (or 2 2-ways?): https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2022/06/hornets-trading-no-13-pick-jalen-duren-to-pistons.html
Basically:
Charlotte sends #13 (Duren) to NY for Denver's '23 1st rounder + 4 second rounders
NY then sends #13 (Duren) to Detroit for Milwaukee's '25 1st rounder + Kemba Walker's contract
The important part of the deal (what sets the price of the pick) is what Charlotte got for #13, the rest is NY's messy dealings to make room for Brunson. Awful deal, but goes to show that you can't use a single deal as a universal measure of value, it depends on what teams need (and how badly), and that's different in every case. As a rule of thumb, I wouldn't expect most teams to take a projected late first + 4 2nds for a lottery pick, just like I wouldn't expect most teams to part with 3 1sts... somewhere in between (2 picks, pick + salary dump, pick + rotation player, etc) sounds more representative IMO.

It's kudos to Detroit for jumping on that one.

[Mr. Body]

One thing about getting another lottery pick. If they don't acquire it in advance, it's unlikely they'll be able to work anybody out at those spots. They'd need a strong idea of who the players are already.

[exstatic]

One thing about getting another lottery pick. If they don't acquire it in advance, it's unlikely they'll be able to work anybody out at those spots. They'd need a strong idea of who the players are already.

My guess is that it’s A player, not a group of players. They never worked out Kawhi, so that’s not a huge deal. They were probably at one of the recent pro days to see groups of players work out, and someone caught their eye, hence the recent chatter. They’ll workout a trade framework, or maybe a couple of prospective trades, and if their player is there, they’ll pull the trigger

[exstatic]

One thing about getting another lottery pick. If they don't acquire it in advance, it's unlikely they'll be able to work anybody out at those spots. They'd need a strong idea of who the players are already.

My guess is that it’s A player, not a group of players. They never worked out Kawhi, so that’s not a huge deal. They were probably at one of the recent pro days to see groups of players work out, and someone caught their eye, hence the recent chatter. They’ll workout a trade framework, or maybe a couple of prospective trades, and if their player is there, they’ll pull the trigger

[Mr. Body]

My guess is that it’s A player, not a group of players. They never worked out Kawhi, so that’s not a huge deal. They were probably at one of the recent pro days to see groups of players work out, and someone caught their eye, hence the recent chatter. They’ll workout a trade framework, or maybe a couple of prospective trades, and if their player is there, they’ll pull the trigger

I feel like they knew who they liked and were going for. They were probably starting to put them into tiers. Then they managed to pull Wemby.

Most of those players are guys they can get in other drafts, or find lesser versions elsewhere.

If they're really going after a lottery pick, it's likely someone with a skillset they really like and that player may be undervalued. Possibly their target pre-Wemby.

[rascal]

I feel like they knew who they liked and were going for. They were probably starting to put them into tiers. Then they managed to pull Wemby.

Most of those players are guys they can get in other drafts, or find lesser versions elsewhere.

If they're really going after a lottery pick, it's likely someone with a skillset they really like and that player may be undervalued. Possibly their target pre-Wemby.

Yes, the spurs had players they liked and where going to target pre Wemby so those players will be the ones they will be considering in trades into the first round.

[Mr. Body]

Yes, the spurs had players they liked and where going to target pre Wemby so those players will be the ones they will be considering in trades into the first round.

Eh... You understood maybe 25% of what I said.

[CGD]

I feel like they knew who they liked and were going for. They were probably starting to put them into tiers. Then they managed to pull Wemby.

Most of those players are guys they can get in other drafts, or find lesser versions elsewhere.

If they're really going after a lottery pick, it's likely someone with a skillset they really like and that player may be undervalued. Possibly their target pre-Wemby.

Makes sense.

I could see them falling in love with Asur Thompson for example, and, pre-Wemby, really grappling with taking him at say 3 if that’s where they had landed. If Asur starts slipping to like Orlando or Wizards range, maybe they make an offer. But not just for shits and giggles.

[Mr. Body]

Makes sense.

I could see them falling in love with Asur Thompson for example, and, pre-Wemby, really grappling with taking him at say 3 if that’s where they had landed. If Asur starts slipping to like Orlando or Wizards range, maybe they make an offer. But not just for shits and giggles.

I risk repeating myself over and over, lol, but there's another 6'7" player who can actually play defense (instead of just "has the potential"), can actually playmake and pass the ball, and whose iffy shooting nevertheless looks like Stephen Curry next to Ausar. Oh, and he's a year younger and played against much better competition.

[CGD]

I risk repeating myself over and over, lol, but there's another 6'7" player who can actually play defense (instead of just "has the potential"), can actually playmake and pass the ball, and whose iffy shooting nevertheless looks like Stephen Curry next to Ausar. Oh, and he's a year younger and played against much better competition.

I read your point to be that pre-Wemby the Spurs may have already identified someone specific they liked (not necessarily that YOU had someone in mind you liked), and that under the right circumstances they would move into the lottery to get him. But not just to move into the draft for shits and giggles.

And my conjecture of Asur was going off the TMVP blogpost below about “whispers” the spurs where high on him.

https://www.spurstalk.com/ausar-thompson-spurs-scouting-report/

[Obstructed_View]

I made this point in another thread, and I think it's relevant here: the Spurs have five young prospects entering their second year with Wemby coming in. Maybe more 19 year olds isn't what they need. I'd guess that the Spurs need some screen-setters and maybe one vet shooter. Dougie might fit in as a sharpshooter with this core, and maybe Graham if he can develop some consistency. As it sits, the Spurs are gonna have to make some roster decisions even if Victor is the only guy they draft.

[Obstructed_View]

I risk repeating myself over and over, lol, but there's another 6'7" player who can actually play defense (instead of just "has the potential"), can actually playmake and pass the ball, and whose iffy shooting nevertheless looks like Stephen Curry next to Ausar. Oh, and he's a year younger and played against much better competition.
Sorry I'm late; you referring to Jeremy Black?

[Mr. Body]

I read your point to be that pre-Wemby the Spurs may have already identified someone specific they liked (not necessarily that YOU had someone in mind you liked), and that under the right circumstances they would move into the lottery to get him. But not just to move into the draft for shits and giggles.

And my conjecture of Asur was going off the TMVP blogpost below about “whispers” the spurs where high on him.

https://www.spurstalk.com/ausar-thompson-spurs-scouting-report/

Oh, I don't believe those rumors for a second.

[Mr. Body]

Sorry I'm late; you referring to Jeremy Black?

Frank Black, lead singer of the Pixies.

[exstatic]

Sorry I'm late; you referring to Jeremy Black?

Anthony, but I’d guess that’s correct.

[exstatic]

I read your point to be that pre-Wemby the Spurs may have already identified someone specific they liked (not necessarily that YOU had someone in mind you liked), and that under the right circumstances they would move into the lottery to get him. But not just to move into the draft for shits and giggles.

And my conjecture of Asur was going off the TMVP blogpost below about “whispers” the spurs where high on him.

https://www.spurstalk.com/ausar-thompson-spurs-scouting-report/

That was supposedly some EC exec’s opinion of what the Spurs were interested in.

[Obstructed_View]

Anthony, but I’d guess that’s correct.
Oh shit. I didn't realize I did that. Lol

[Bruno]

Spurs aren't in the same situation than one month ago, they have now Wemby.

A month ago, they might have viewed Amen and/or Ausar Thompson as great prospect. They might see them now as relatively poor fit to play alongside Wemby. It would be logical that outside shooting is now a bigger priority when evaluating prospects.

On the other hand, they might be way higher on a player like Cason Wallace who went from a prospect with a limited upside to the perfect fit to be Spurs' future starting PG.

[Dejounte]

Spurs aren't in the same situation than one month ago, they have now Wemby.

A month ago, they might have viewed Amen and/or Ausar Thompson as great prospect. They might see them now as relatively poor fit to play alongside Wemby. It would be logical that outside shooting is now a bigger priority when evaluating prospects.

On the other hand, they might be way higher on a player like Cason Wallace who went from a prospect with a limited upside to the perfect fit to be Spurs' future starting PG.

They shouldn’t be concerned about finding what fits around Wemby, but rather finding star talent. If they see Cason as a #2 guy, fine. But right now, in order to expedite the process and not waste any years like Cleveland did with LeBron starting off or what Dallas has done so far with Luka… they need to keep aiming for the moon with their picks and free agency.

[Dejounte]

For as much as people claim Scoot has a “me-first” type mentality that would be damaging to Wemby, Irving is pretty much that and LeBron has overlooked/ had overlooked all that because Irving was one of the players that helped him win despite all of it. Winning matters most, not opinions from armchair psychologists on this board nitpicking quotes from players they don’t like.

[Dejounte]

And I DON’T believe the Spurs don’t have those star-upside players on the team right now. One of them very well could be. What I’m saying is that they should keep building their deck until one of them rises to the top. Eventually one guy will.

[Mr. Body]

Why are you obsessed with Scoot Henderson?

[Dejounte]

Why are you obsessed with Scoot Henderson?

If we summed up the total number of posts you’ve brought up Scoot vs how many times I have, boy it would be a landslide. Post less. Nobody wants your fucking opinion on everything.

[Mr. Body]

If we summed up the total number of posts you’ve brought up Scoot vs how many times I have, boy it would be a landslide. Post less. Nobody wants your fucking opinion on everything.

But seriously, why do you want Scoot?

[Dejounte]

But seriously, why do you want Scoot?

For the same reason there are groups of over 10 salaried professionals, each likely paid six figures, employed by multiple teams who rate him highly that somehow you have reduced to as simple as iF hE wAsNt nAmEd ScOot, He WoUldNt bE rATed hIgHly. Good job, you spit in the face of people who actually do their homework and don’t dumb things down to simplistic views.

[Mr. Body]

For the same reason there are groups of over 10 salaried professionals, each likely paid six figures, employed by multiple teams who rate him highly that somehow you have reduced to as simple as iF hE wAsNt nAmEd ScOot, He WoUldNt bE rATed hIgHly. Good job, you spit in the face of people who actually do their homework and don’t dumb things down to simplistic views.

Those aren't reasons. You're saying 1) because other people value this asset, and 2) you are upset that other people don't want him.

The first is more or less fine, in my view, but you still need to evaluate your situation and needs, otherwise this sounds more ike "I want the head cheerleader because everyone else wants the head cheerleader."

And then you seem to get really upset when people say that he's not a good fit and suggest reasons why -- he's not a good fit, he's undersized, not a good shooter, ball-dominant, his personality may clash with Wembanyama, he's actually not that good, he would cost way too much to acquire.

I don't mean to get on your case. It just sounds like rascal and Shaeden Sharpe.

And if you want to get back at me, you should ask why I'm obsessed with a certain player. I have reasons. Maybe they're not the greatest reasons, but I have reasons.

[Dejounte]

Those aren't reasons. You're saying 1) because other people value this asset, and 2) you are upset that other people don't want him.

The first is more or less fine, in my view, but you still need to evaluate your situation and needs, otherwise this sounds more ike "I want the head cheerleader because everyone else wants the head cheerleader."

And then you seem to get really upset when people say that he's not a good fit and suggest reasons why -- he's not a good fit, he's undersized, not a good shooter, ball-dominant, his personality may clash with Wembanyama, he's actually not that good, he would cost way too much to acquire.

I don't mean to get on your case. It just sounds like rascal and Shaeden Sharpe.

And if you want to get back at me, you should ask why I'm obsessed with a certain player. I have reasons. Maybe they're not the greatest reasons, but I have reasons.

I’ve stated my views on Scoot ad nauseam, to the point where it would be ridiculous to say I’m just following someone’s lead on this. I’ve said before that I do hours and hours of research before I form an opinion on players. I have countless videos favorited on prospects, as well as articles, stats, etc. It isn’t anywhere close to rascal and his infatuation with athletic players. It doesn’t upset me when people don’t want Scoot, it’s the unfounded claims about a player’s character that irks me most, as well as the fortune telling that people love to do here when it comes to player futures.

For example, there is probably very few or none that have reviewed this like I have:

https://i.ibb.co/SRQxj3p/C9-CE265-C-33-C6-4-E06-AC95-9540-CEFCA688.png

[kobyz]

Anthony Black who is Jason Kidd type PG could be a perfect match for us at PG position, someone who set the tone defensively and will know how to set up Wembanyama on offense

[R. DeMurre]

Post less. Nobody wants your fucking opinion on everything.


I’ve stated my views on Scoot ad nauseam, to the point where it would be ridiculous...




Oh, the irony of the exasperated and thin-skinned I'm-better-than-everybody expert.

[rascal]

Anthony Black who is Jason Kidd type PG could be a perfect match for us at PG position, someone who set the tone defensively and will know how to set up Wembanyama on offense

Black is not like Jason Kidd. Black is way overrated at Spurstalk. Because two or three guys are pounding on the Black drum at Spurstalk he's now as good as Jason Kidd.

He may not even be good enough to be a starter in the NBA.

[Dejounte]

Oh, the irony of the exasperated and thin-skinned I'm-better-than-everybody expert.

The only reason you think that’s irony is because you think I post about everything, which is factually incorrect as I barely spend time giving my opinion on here. So the only conclusion here is that you give my posts extra attention than you do others and you can’t help yourself to give a snarky reply like you did here. If I bother you so much, I’ll repeat the same thing I have to you many times before that you simply can’t do: put me on Ignore.

[DAF86]

Anthony Black who is Jason Kidd type PG could be a perfect match for us at PG position, someone who set the tone defensively and will know how to set up Wembanyama on offense

I don't think that type of PG is what the Spurs are needing, imho. To me the Spurs are lacking a dynamic playmaker, a Murray to Wemby's Jokic. If everything pans out, we will have our franchise bigman (Wemby), our 3 and D guy (Vassell), our do it all glue guy that can defend 5 positions (Sochan), a secondary scoring wing with good 3pt shooting (Keldon) (although I do think Keldon might be the odd man out), we are lacking that explosive point of attack guard that can take over games.

[EricB]

For the same reason there are groups of over 10 salaried professionals, each likely paid six figures, employed by multiple teams who rate him highly that somehow you have reduced to as simple as iF hE wAsNt nAmEd ScOot, He WoUldNt bE rATed hIgHly. Good job, you spit in the face of people who actually do their homework and don’t dumb things down to simplistic views.


MRO be fair these people once rated Darko above Carmelo Anthony.

drafting is a tough not exact science. These guys just cause they make big money aren’t always right.

[Dejounte]

MRO be fair these people once rated Darko above Carmelo Anthony.

drafting is a tough not exact science. These guys just cause they make big money aren’t always right.

And I didn’t say they always get it right. But I’ll trust the judgment of those who spend 40 hours a week for one year or more reviewing film and analytics over a simple, dumbed down analysis that some make on here. I don’t go blindly believing that teams make the right pick because they did their homework— but it makes me more comfortable to believe they have just cause for ranking guys higher than other guys because of all the time they put in. Shit happens and prospects don’t work out. That’s life.

[CGD]

Anthony Black who is Jason Kidd type PG could be a perfect match for us at PG position, someone who set the tone defensively and will know how to set up Wembanyama on offense

Well he can’t shoot, so that’s something he has in common with early days Kidd.

[RC_Drunkford]

Depending on what you have to give up you take Scoot without a doubt. The guy is saying he wants to build that fanbase in San Antonio and I‘m pretty sure he views the Spurs as the best landing spot for himself in the top 5. You don’t even have to worry about him and Wemby clashing he‘s just competitive and confident in himself.

I don’t like Anthony Black. He‘s not fast enough. Like DAF said we need a Jamal Murray type of PG. Somebody who can get to the rim and draw the defense to him to create open looks and driving lanes. And also somebody who‘s able to move off the ball for catch and shoot 3s. Defense is secondary here if you ask me

[Degoat]

Kinda interesting, not that it means anything but hoopshype has an update on the spurs page that shows Jeremy Sochan reached out to Brandin Podziemski about playing on the Polish national team together. Could see the Spurs targeting him in the draft

[Frenchfred]

I don't think that type of PG is what the Spurs are needing, imho. To me the Spurs are lacking a dynamic playmaker, a Murray to Wemby's Jokic. If everything pans out, we will have our franchise bigman (Wemby), our 3 and D guy (Vassell), our do it all glue guy that can defend 5 positions (Sochan), a secondary scoring wing with good 3pt shooting (Keldon) (although I do think Keldon might be the odd man out), we are lacking that explosive point of attack guard that can take over games.

Irving?

[Ariel]

I don't think that type of PG is what the Spurs are needing, imho. To me the Spurs are lacking a dynamic playmaker, a Murray to Wemby's Jokic. If everything pans out, we will have our franchise bigman (Wemby), our 3 and D guy (Vassell), our do it all glue guy that can defend 5 positions (Sochan), a secondary scoring wing with good 3pt shooting (Keldon) (although I do think Keldon might be the odd man out), we are lacking that explosive point of attack guard that can take over games.

I don’t like Anthony Black. He‘s not fast enough. Like DAF said we need a Jamal Murray type of PG. Somebody who can get to the rim and draw the defense to him to create open looks and driving lanes. And also somebody who‘s able to move off the ball for catch and shoot 3s. Defense is secondary here if you ask me
Actually there's a player that could be a Jamal Murray sort of player, and it's Keyonte George from Baylor. He's not very efficient as of now, but he's actually pretty skilled all around, can score from all levels, create and pass. Probably my favorite target in the late lottery/mid teens. Not my target for full time PG, but a very interesting prospect.

[Mr. Body]

Depending on what you have to give up you take Scoot without a doubt. The guy is saying he wants to build that fanbase in San Antonio and I‘m pretty sure he views the Spurs as the best landing spot for himself in the top 5. You don’t even have to worry about him and Wemby clashing he‘s just competitive and confident in himself.

I don’t like Anthony Black. He‘s not fast enough. Like DAF said we need a Jamal Murray type of PG. Somebody who can get to the rim and draw the defense to him to create open looks and driving lanes. And also somebody who‘s able to move off the ball for catch and shoot 3s. Defense is secondary here if you ask me

I want to leave alone the Scoot stuff. Bottom line is, I don't want a tiny shoot-first combo guard taking all of Wembanyama's shots. As for Black, there are certainly concerns about his shooting, especially since he and Sochan may see a lot of the floor at the same time.

But Black was always in the lane. Even given his shooting wasn't a total threat, he was always getting in there. Partly because of his handles, partly because he's actually pretty swift and strong. His team had zero shooters and still he managed to get into the paint time and again. He drew enough fouls to shoot five free throws a game. One of his biggest attributes is that he's a lob maniac. He was getting past defenses and throwing lobs to his teammates every chance he could. That's what you want with Wembanyama.

[rascal]

I want to leave alone the Scoot stuff. Bottom line is, I don't want a tiny shoot-first combo guard taking all of Wembanyama's shots. As for Black, there are certainly concerns about his shooting, especially since he and Sochan may see a lot of the floor at the same time.

But Black was always in the lane. Even given his shooting wasn't a total threat, he was always getting in there. Partly because of his handles, partly because he's actually pretty swift and strong. His team had zero shooters and still he managed to get into the paint time and again. He drew enough fouls to shoot five free throws a game. One of his biggest attributes is that he's a lob maniac. He was getting past defenses and throwing lobs to his teammates every chance he could. That's what you want with Wembanyama.

But Black shoots a poor ft% for a pg.

[BacktoBasics]

But Black shoots a poor ft% for a pg.

That’s not a long term concern of mine. Black will likely develop into a serviceable shooter. I would be even less worried if we drafted him.

[rascal]

That’s not a long term concern of mine. Black will likely develop into a serviceable shooter. I would be even less worried if we drafted him.

Spurs will have a team full of players needing to work on their shot.

[Mr. Body]

Spurs will have a team full of players needing to work on their shot.

Black has a lot in common with Sochan. He processes the game very quickly, he's a pest on defense with very quick hands and quick reactions, he can use his size and speed very well, he can be relentless in his activity, and can make big plays on both sides of the court. Most importantly, it's easy to tell who they are by way of their hair.

But yes, they both may cap out their offensive threats from range. We'll see. Maybe you can deal with only having one of those players on your team, but they are both so smart, so dynamic, such game-changers in how they see and interact with the floor, it's more than worth the shot.

[Mr. Body]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_ydCMfBGyw

Here is an extensive clip of Black in the pick n roll this year. He needs to improve his execution - he gets too many turnovers because he doesn't place the ball quite right sometimes - but he'll be a high level threat in these actions pretty quickly. He's making snap reads, so many correct passes.

[DAF86]

Irving?

Nah, someone that isn't batshit crazy.

[BackHome]

If we really want a PG I am cool with taking Wallace who I think would be a good fit with this team - He plays defense is not a drama queen who can grow in his role with Wemby together.

[Mr. Body]

Here's my hot take: Is Cason Wallace that much better than Tre Jones?

Yes, Jones was a year older coming out, but he was better at a lot of categories (and adv. categories). Wallace is like an inch or so taller.

Here's their shooting from 3 pters in college: 1.5-4.4 vs. 1.4-3.8

First is Wallace, second is Jones.

Not a huge difference. (Jones was better.)

Would we be trying to get a guy at 8-12 who isn't actually that much better than the guy we got at 41?

[Degoat]

Here's my hot take: Is Cason Wallace that much better than Tre Jones?

Yes, Jones was a year older coming out, but he was better at a lot of categories (and adv. categories). Wallace is like an inch or so taller.

Here's their shooting from 3 pters in college: 1.5-4.4 vs. 1.4-3.8

First is Wallace, second is Jones.

Not a huge difference. (Jones was better.)

Would we be trying to get a guy at 8-12 who isn't actually that much better than the guy we got at 41?

Thats what’s brutal about going for a PG in this draft, nobody other than Scoot or Anthony Black nobody is that much better than what we have in Tre Jones, and I think Blake Wesley is a better prospect than Wallace and several of the other PGs in this draft too.

[BacktoBasics]

Black has a lot in common with Sochan. He processes the game very quickly, he's a pest on defense with very quick hands and quick reactions, he can use his size and speed very well, he can be relentless in his activity, and can make big plays on both sides of the court. Most importantly, it's easy to tell who they are by way of their hair.

But yes, they both may cap out their offensive threats from range. We'll see. Maybe you can deal with only having one of those players on your team, but they are both so smart, so dynamic, such game-changers in how they see and interact with the floor, it's more than worth the shot.
I think Black is the kinda guy who already makes players around him better. Much like Sochan. He’s not the hero we’d ever ask for but he’s the kinda guy who’d easily be the hero we need.

[BacktoBasics]

Thats what’s brutal about going for a PG in this draft, nobody other than Scoot or Anthony Black nobody is that much better than what we have in Tre Jones, and I think Blake Wesley is a better prospect than Wallace and several of the other PGs in this draft too.

The thing I’ve always liked about drafting Black is that it instantaneously makes Tre the perfect change of pace backup. Between those two you can do a lot to dictate the flow of the game and both could play together if needed.

[scott]

With Scoot and Black pretty much out of range, at this point I’m more intrigued by some shooters in the middle of the round (Hawkins and Dick) than PGs.

[Dejounte]

With Scoot and Black pretty much out of range, at this point I’m more intrigued by some shooters in the middle of the round (Hawkins and Dick) than PGs.

If Hawkins gets picked by the Spurs, then there’s your second star next to Wemby tbh

[BacktoBasics]

If Hawkins gets picked by the Spurs, then there’s your second star next to Wemby tbh

There is something there with Hawkins. Like Mathurin vibes.

[rascal]

If Hawkins gets picked by the Spurs, then there’s your second star next to Wemby tbh



Spurs should target him at 16 with that Utah pick.

[Ariel]

With Scoot and Black pretty much out of range, at this point I’m more intrigued by some shooters in the middle of the round (Hawkins and Dick) than PGs.
There's plenty of very good shooters in this draft class: Jordan Hawkins, Gradey Dick, Dariq Whitehead, Jett Howard, Brice Sensabaugh, Julian Strawther, Marcus Sasser and a couple others. The best shooter of the bunch I think is Hawkins, his ability to move without the ball, shoot on the move, his quick release and efficiency on high volume puts him at the top.
There are so many teams needing shooters from 11 onwards that I think a lot of them will go very high:
11) Orlando
12) OKC
13) Toronto (mediocre as it is and might lose both Van Vleet and Gary Trent Jr)
14) NOLA
15) Atlanta
16) Utah
17) Lakers
18) Miami
20) Houston
I'd say chances are high Orlando and OKC take both Hawkins and Dick at 11 and 12, and I have a feeling Jett Howard will go 20 at worst. Whitehead should go there as well, but the injuries might cause him to slip a bit, and this is a guy I'd really like to pick up if he lips. Sensabaugh I'm not in love with, seems like an overweight chucker, but Strawther and Sasser might fall to #33 and they're two of my targets there along with Jaquez.

[Ariel]

There is something there with Hawkins. Like Mathurin vibes.
You mean it in a good way? as a shooter, they're not really comparable. Hawkins is leaps and bounds above Mathurin, and is a better defender. Mathurin is a bit of a chucker, actually. Very confident, not so efficient.

Spurs should target him at 16 with that Utah pick.
Hawkins will likely be gone way before that, lots of teams need shooting in the bottom half of the lottery, starting with Orlando and OKC. I wouldn't be shocked in fact if Orlando took BOTH Dick (at 6) and Hawkins (at 11).

[Mr. Body]

It seems like Gradey Dick and Derek Lively are on the rise, at least judging by team message boards and general mocks. It's not unbelievable they both could wind up top 10, making things interesting.

Take Dean on Draft with a grain of salt. He does highly analytic comparisons, but they are a good tactic. He cautions against over-enthusiasm for Hawkins. His major points being, 1) Hawkins does nothing other than shoot, which is different than other top shooters we've seen come out (Ray Allen, Klay Thompson), and 2) shooting is highly variable. Shooting goes up and down every year. He mentions players like Duncan Robinson and Strus. If that player does nothing else, then overpaying for shooting can be problematic. https://deanondraft.substack.com/p/is-jordan-hawkins-the-next-elite

[RC_Drunkford]

I want to leave alone the Scoot stuff. Bottom line is, I don't want a tiny shoot-first combo guard taking all of Wembanyama's shots. As for Black, there are certainly concerns about his shooting, especially since he and Sochan may see a lot of the floor at the same time.

But Black was always in the lane. Even given his shooting wasn't a total threat, he was always getting in there. Partly because of his handles, partly because he's actually pretty swift and strong. His team had zero shooters and still he managed to get into the paint time and again. He drew enough fouls to shoot five free throws a game. One of his biggest attributes is that he's a lob maniac. He was getting past defenses and throwing lobs to his teammates every chance he could. That's what you want with Wembanyama.

everybody can throw lobs to a 7'5'' guy. What you want is somebody who can drive past defenders and get to the rim to get Wembanyama and the shooters open and develop an elite pick & roll and pick & pop combination between the 2. And you definitely want that person to be an elite 3-point shooter. who can move off the ball when Sochan has it. Hawkins would be great on this team, but he's more of a 2 guard than a PG. Cason Wallace might fit since he's being compared to Jrue Holiday, but there are also some question marks with him

[RC_Drunkford]

Actually there's a player that could be a Jamal Murray sort of player, and it's Keyonte George from Baylor. He's not very efficient as of now, but he's actually pretty skilled all around, can score from all levels, create and pass. Probably my favorite target in the late lottery/mid teens. Not my target for full time PG, but a very interesting prospect.

he looks good. Has some things to work on, but I think coaching and better team mates would help him improve in those areas

[Mr. Body]

everybody can throw lobs to a 7'5'' guy. What you want is somebody who can drive past defenders and get to the rim to get Wembanyama and the shooters open and develop an elite pick & roll and pick & pop combination between the 2. And you definitely want that person to be an elite 3-point shooter. who can move off the ball when Sochan has it. Hawkins would be great on this team, but he's more of a 2 guard than a PG. Cason Wallace might fit since he's being compared to Jrue Holiday, but there are also some question marks with him

I don't know what you missed from what I said, but Black can drive past defenders. And, no, not everyone throws good lobs. Not everyone at nineteen runs a PnR with expertise.

Regardless, shooting is fine. Going too high to get a guy who can only shoot isn't a good idea. And Cason Wallace is also being compared to Tre Jones.

If the Spurs are going for shooting, it would probably be Gradey Dick rather than Hawkins.

[TD 21]

everybody can throw lobs to a 7'5'' guy. What you want is somebody who can drive past defenders and get to the rim to get Wembanyama and the shooters open and develop an elite pick & roll and pick & pop combination between the 2. And you definitely want that person to be an elite 3-point shooter. who can move off the ball when Sochan has it. Hawkins would be great on this team, but he's more of a 2 guard than a PG. Cason Wallace might fit since he's being compared to Jrue Holiday, but there are also some question marks with him

Yeah. As much as malleable combo guards with size like Wallace are a valuable archetype, he wouldn't solve the lack of a dynamic advantage creator issue.

[mo7888]

It seems like Gradey Dick and Derek Lively are on the rise, at least judging by team message boards and general mocks. It's not unbelievable they both could wind up top 10, making things interesting.

Take Dean on Draft with a grain of salt. He does highly analytic comparisons, but they are a good tactic. He cautions against over-enthusiasm for Hawkins. His major points being, 1) Hawkins does nothing other than shoot, which is different than other top shooters we've seen come out (Ray Allen, Klay Thompson), and 2) shooting is highly variable. Shooting goes up and down every year. He mentions players like Duncan Robinson and Strus. If that player does nothing else, then overpaying for shooting can be problematic. https://deanondraft.substack.com/p/is-jordan-hawkins-the-next-elite

I've had Gradey Dick in my top 10 for a couple months now because he offers more potential than just shooting and I've had Hawkins lower because I don't see much more there than just shooting.

[Mr. Body]

I've had Gradey Dick in my top 10 for a couple months now because he offers more potential than just shooting and I've had Hawkins lower because I don't see much more there than just shooting.

Agree completely. Also, Hawkins is wonderful because of all these runarounds he does, like Curry, but I don't think he'll get these actions devoted to him in the NBA. He'll be more of a spot up shooter (maybe a very good one).

IMO, if the Spurs try to go into the deep top first round, like 5-10, they are after Black or Dick.

Dick is a potential flamethrower who slots in more comfortably at a SF position of need and contributes elsewhere more.

IMO, if the Spurs are trying to get into the mid to later first round, they are after guys like Bufkin or Hawkins.

I think the team would love to have Hawkins, but I don't think they would spend too much to get there.

Added: If they are going for the late first, round, they're looking for someone like Podziemski.

[BackHome]

So just curious what would it take to get Black - Keldon Johnson, and our next years first, and Charlottes pick?

[kobyz]

I don't think that type of PG is what the Spurs are needing, imho. To me the Spurs are lacking a dynamic playmaker, a Murray to Wemby's Jokic. If everything pans out, we will have our franchise bigman (Wemby), our 3 and D guy (Vassell), our do it all glue guy that can defend 5 positions (Sochan), a secondary scoring wing with good 3pt shooting (Keldon) (although I do think Keldon might be the odd man out), we are lacking that explosive point of attack guard that can take over games.

Wemby is different than Jokic, he's not gonna be a PG in Center body like Jokic

[kobyz]

So just curious what would it take to get Black - Keldon Johnson, and our next years first, and Charlottes pick?
A protected top 5 pick next year should be enough...

[rankingtear]

KJ and TOR 2024 could get you 5 this was proposed by their athletic writer and got split reviews so the offer seems to be solid. I think they only do that for Amen, not Black.

[DAF86]

Wemby is different than Jokic, he's not gonna be a PG in Center body like Jokic

A Harden (minus the chokig) to Wemby's Embiid then. The point is, we need an explosive point of attack PG that can put points on the board and isn't jumpshooting challenged.

[Mr. Body]

So just curious what would it take to get Black - Keldon Johnson, and our next years first, and Charlottes pick?

It might require trading Keldon, which I don't think the team wants to do. Also definitely don't see them sending Johnson to a bad team like Detroit.

There is thought that they can entice with the right kinds of draft assets and maybe use cap room to take bad salaries. Ultimately it depends on what the other team needs. It's probably impossible to keep him away from the Washington or Utah picks at 8 and 9. Dallas's pick seems to be on the market, but they want help now rather than later, etc...

[rascal]

I've had Gradey Dick in my top 10 for a couple months now because he offers more potential than just shooting and I've had Hawkins lower because I don't see much more there than just shooting.

Hawkins is better defensively than Dick.

[mo7888]

Hawkins is better defensively than Dick.

No he's not...

[Mr. Body]

They're both not totally terrible at defense, but also not great. It's just that Gradey is a tall white guy, so it automatically goes into his description.

[rascal]

No he's not...

Yeah he is.

Plenty of film of guys blowing right by Dick. He's too slow to keep up with quicker players.

He's so bad teams game planned to attack him on 1 on 1 isolation.

Also struggles in self creation on offense struggles to gain separation off the dribble. Hawkins is better shooting off the dribble and quicker to get himself open with movement.

Dick is the best catch and shoot shooter in this draft.

[GAustex]

White boy from Kanas is over rated
Easy to guard and can’t guard

[RC_Drunkford]

Yeah he is.

Plenty of film of guys blowing right by Dick. He's too slow to keep up with quicker players.

He's so bad teams game planned to attack him on 1 on 1 isolation.

Also struggles in self creation on offense struggles to gain separation off the dribble. Hawkins is better shooting off the dribble and quicker to get himself open with movement.

Dick is the best catch and shoot shooter in this draft.

Ayo pause

[kobyz]

A Harden (minus the chokig) to Wemby's Embiid then. The point is, we need an explosive point of attack PG that can put points on the board and isn't jumpshooting challenged.

With our PG first of all we need someone who could set Wemby in the p&r and help make him a 30+ppg guy, and set the tone defensively... and of course you go after Black only if you believe in him developing a reliable 3 point shot to kepp the defense honest

[DAF86]

With our PG first of all we need someone who could set Wemby in the p&r and help make him a 30+ppg guy, and set the tone defensively... and of course you go after Black only if you believe in him developing a reliable 3 point shot to kepp the defense honest

And who's gonna be the dynamic perimeter scorer/playmaker? Keldon and Vassell aren't that, at least for now.

[kobyz]

And who's gonna be the dynamic perimeter scorer/playmaker? Keldon and Vassell aren't that, at least for now.
You'll have time and cap space to find one

[ambchang]

I don’t see the obsession to get a high caliber PG at this stage. First, the spurs are clearly building a position less team, even before wemby was for ours to take. Players like sochan, Jones, Vassell, collins, Manu, can all read and pass relatively well, especially for their positions. Would it be great to have a star PG? Of course! But it’s not a dire necessity.

Secondly, even if we were to get a star PG, we don’t necessarily get that this draft. To think a star point would drop to a mid first is mostly wishful thinking. I’m sure it could be done but it’s not likely to happen.

Also, wemby is such a unique offensive talent that we can’t really rely on a traditional team build. As much as his size gives him an advantage on the court, he also requires a lot of room to roam. I’m not sure how the offensive sets would be constructed but it could become congested with players getting into each others ways if spacing is not pristine. Outside shooting is a must (which I get why people wants to replace Jones) but basketball iq to get to the right spots and when to shoot vs when to pass is of more importance.

Overall, spurs have many ways to fill the PG need with all the future picks and cap room, which allows them use it straight up or involved in a trade. Moving up in this draft is only one of many ways.

[Dverde]

I would think Utah would be up for swapping 28 for Spurs 33 in the second round. They already have two higher first round picks. Spurs probably toss in another future second rounder to make it happen. Just not sure if there is a player worth moving up in that range on draft day.

[dbestpro]

Sleeper with speed and can score. Little bit of a head case and may fall to a 1st that Spurs can get........ Nick Smith Jr.

[exstatic]

Sleeper with speed and can score. Little bit of a head case and may fall to a 1st that Spurs can get........ Nick Smith Jr.

Nah, he’s just bad. Of the top 100 RSCI every year, half of them bust out, even some of the really high ones like NSJ.

[mo7888]

Yeah he is.

Plenty of film of guys blowing right by Dick. He's too slow to keep up with quicker players.

He's so bad teams game planned to attack him on 1 on 1 isolation.

Also struggles in self creation on offense struggles to gain separation off the dribble. Hawkins is better shooting off the dribble and quicker to get himself open with movement.

Dick is the best catch and shoot shooter in this draft.

You're just wrong, by a wide margin, but you do you ..

[mo7888]

Sleeper with speed and can score. Little bit of a head case and may fall to a 1st that Spurs can get........ Nick Smith Jr.

I agree... I see him as a PG at this level. Boom or bust prospect with a very small sample size and almost no sample size playing in his future position....

[duncan2150]

About the gradey debate i was not impressed by his tournament but i still think he could be a really good role player. I see him as a good end of the lottery pick or mid first round.

[mo7888]

About the gradey debate i was not impressed by his tournament but i still think he could be a really good role player. I see him as a good end of the lottery pick or mid first round.

I think he's going top 10...pretty confident of that...however, I see him as a high end role player too. ...pair him with two other 'star' types and he'll be very valuable.

[scott]

I think he's going top 10...pretty confident of that...however, I see him as a high end role player too. ...pair him with two other 'star' types and he'll be very valuable.

Dick seems to me to have one of the highest floors of any player outside of the Top 3 (who also have high ceilings - and I do think Scoot and Miller have pretty high floors). He could be a pretty valuable piece on a team like Dallas or even Indianapolis.

[DAF86]

You'll have time and cap space to find one

Then why make a move to draft Anthony Black? If you are willing to give up assets to move up in the draft it is because you think Black will be their starting PG of the future. That seems like the opposite of allowing yourself the time and cap space to figure out the PG position.

[Dejounte]

Then why make a move to draft Anthony Black? If you are willing to give up assets to move up in the draft it is because you think Black will be their starting PG of the future. That seems like the opposite of allowing yourself the time and cap space to figure out the PG position.

Not even just the starting PG, but one hopes that they think he will be a future star. There’s always next year to get their point guard of the future tbh (and I believe that’s the position the second or third star has to come from)

[RC_Drunkford]

James Ham: Continue to hear rumors that the San Antonio Spurs and Charlotte Hornets are being added to the California Classic in Sacramento in early July. (https://hoopshype.com/social/) Nothing confirmed yet, but could get interesting with Spurs and Hornets owning picks No. 1 and No. 2.
22 mins ago (https://hoopshype.com/rumor/2093314/) – via Twitter James_HamNBA (https://twitter.com/James_HamNBA)

[Mr. Body]

I don’t see the obsession to get a high caliber PG at this stage. First, the spurs are clearly building a position less team, even before wemby was for ours to take. Players like sochan, Jones, Vassell, collins, Manu, can all read and pass relatively well, especially for their positions. Would it be great to have a star PG? Of course! But it’s not a dire necessity.

Secondly, even if we were to get a star PG, we don’t necessarily get that this draft. To think a star point would drop to a mid first is mostly wishful thinking. I’m sure it could be done but it’s not likely to happen.

Also, wemby is such a unique offensive talent that we can’t really rely on a traditional team build. As much as his size gives him an advantage on the court, he also requires a lot of room to roam. I’m not sure how the offensive sets would be constructed but it could become congested with players getting into each others ways if spacing is not pristine. Outside shooting is a must (which I get why people wants to replace Jones) but basketball iq to get to the right spots and when to shoot vs when to pass is of more importance.

Overall, spurs have many ways to fill the PG need with all the future picks and cap room, which allows them use it straight up or involved in a trade. Moving up in this draft is only one of many ways.

To me it's because there could be a special talent there. If the Spurs are aiming for another pick in the 6-12 range, I think it's because they see a particular talent who is either a PG or a shooter, and that player is either Black or Dick. Otherwise, there are players who the team does not really need (lots of PFs) or PGs who I think you can sort of find most drafts. Not to say those PGs might pop or not, just their profiles aren't that uncommon.

I do think the team can go with Tre Jones as the PG, with Graham and Wesley as backups, and other players filling in. I don't think ideas of Sochan running point are founded. You don't want him defending quicker perimeter players fulltime.

What appeals to me about Anthony Black is that he's the center of a Venn diagram with high-level defense, high-level playmaking, and high-level BB IQ. He might be the best perimter defender in the class, he's among the best playmakers, and he might be among the smartest players. He also happens to be 6'7". Does he have flaws? Absolutely. We may be looking at a future lineup of Black-Vassell-Sochan-Wembanyama-Collins where two of those players are iffy from deep. He also needs to clean up and improve execution, etc., but he's only nineteen.

However, my big vision here is defense. We get destroyed by good perimeter players going off. We get wrecked on bad rotations. With the above lineup we suddenly have a defense that can be really pesky, effective, both defend the rim and turn the ball over without gambling. Tbh, a defense based on Sohan-Black-Wemby could be murder on teams. We also have a team that's dangerous attacking from a lot of different spots and angles. I think Black is the third best player in the draft.

Anyway.

The other player that consistently appeals is Bufkin. He's more of a combo guard, but he's available later and if the opportunity arises, I'd pounce. I like his toughness and his interviews show a maturity and understanding of basketball that's pretty impressive. I think he's a bit of a mini-Haliburton. But he doesn't seem as completely unique as Black is.

Not to say Black is a can't-miss. I can see him drafted to the wrong team and be completely wasted.

[Ariel]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/271725/Pacers-Looking-To-Package-Picks-To-Move-Up-In-Draft

The Indiana Pacers, who hold three picks in the first round of the draft, are reportedly looking at trading up. Indiana is looking into packaging the #7, #26 and #29 picks together to move up in the first round.
Not enough to move up, but maybe if they add something else... I'd say they'd do that if they're trying to leapfrog Detroit for Cam Whitmore.

I agree... I see him as a PG at this level. Boom or bust prospect with a very small sample size and almost no sample size playing in his future position....
Nick Smith Jr's "boom or bust": 1% boom 99% bust

[mo7888]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/271725/Pacers-Looking-To-Package-Picks-To-Move-Up-In-Draft

Not enough to move up, but maybe if they add something else... I'd say they'd do that if they're trying to leapfrog Detroit for Cam Whitmore.

Nick Smith Jr's "boom or bust": 1% boom 99% bust

Not a fan huh? Lol

[kobyz]

Player that i like in the late first round is Amary Bailey, and if the experiment of making Sochan a PG would work, Bailey could be the perfect combo guard to play longside him

[TD 21]

To Magic: 24th pick (Kings), Raptors '24 1st, Bassey or Wesley

To Kings: Okeke

To Spurs: 11th pick (Magic), Holmes

I don't know that I'd do this, but if they're enamored enough with at least one of the combo guards projected to be available in the late lottery, this might work.