Ron Holland - 2024 NBA Draft Prospect

[timvp]

https://www.spurstalk.com/ron-holland-spurs-2024-nba-draft/

[Mr. Body]

Ron Holland is like a Stephon Castle who doesn't know how to play basketball.

[DAF86]

Hard pass on this guy, tbh. Typical athlete without a hint of skill, feel or BBIQ.

[heyheymymy]

Not interested in Holland at all

[BatManu20]

Would be shocked if the Spurs took Holland at this point tbh. Between his completely broken shot and character concerns, I just don’t see it happening. Especially if Cody Williams is still on the board and the Spurs were looking for a wing at 8.

Too bad too cause Holland is an elite athlete and lethal in the open floor. He has size and talent you can’t teach, and he plays hard defensively. He’s just a negative offensive player right now who needs a lot of work/refinement/development.

[spurraider21]

i know im in the minority here, but i like him quite a bit. he's not in my top tier (risacher/sheppard/dillingham) but he's one of the guys i'd be content with taking at 4. however, there appears to be virtually no link between the spurs and holland (and theres apparently some off court stuff we are not privy to), so i understand it aint happening. i dont see the spurs taking him over Castle, Williams, or even (barf) Salaun... but same people who are cutting buzelis a lot of slack for the situation at ignite dont seem to give holland that same benefit of the doubt

i understand if the spurs want somebody closer to the final product than Holland (which is why Salaun particularly baffles me)

to me, his floor/starting point is a 6'8 blake wesley, while his ceiling kinda feels like derozan + very good defense. he doesnt have the footwork, midrange game yet, but the north/south attacking ability, drawing fouls without being harden/trae, and the gimples of playmaking are there. derozan didnt come into the NBA as a playmaker either, took him a long time to develop that part of his game.

ive been advocating for shooting shooting shooting (why my top tier above has 3 high end shooters), but have also consistently felt that IF they want to take a non-shooter, he better be exceptional elsehwere, and i do think holland fits the bill with his defense/explosiveness. if you asked me to predict which player from this year's draft is most likely to have a finals mvp on their resume in the next 10 years, holland is at or near the top of that list imo

[mo7888]

The only part of the article I disagree with is in regard to his shot. I think it's a complete teardown.

[SpursFan86]

Yeah give me Holland over Salaun every day of the week tbh.

If we got someone like Sheppard at #4 I think Holland at 8 is a great gamble. But if we went Castle or Buzelis I’d much prefer Dillingham or Carter at #8.

[exstatic]

Deer. Hard pass.

[Uriel]

He’s clearly in the same tier as anyone in this draft outside of maybe three or four players.
Who are those three or four players?

[BatManu20]

i know im in the minority here, but i like him quite a bit. he's not in my top tier (risacher/sheppard/dillingham) but he's one of the guys i'd be content with taking at 4. however, there appears to be virtually no link between the spurs and holland (and theres apparently some off court stuff we are not privy to), so i understand it aint happening. i dont see the spurs taking him over Castle, Williams, or even (barf) Salaun... but same people who are cutting buzelis a lot of slack for the situation at ignite dont seem to give holland that same benefit of the doubt

i understand if the spurs want somebody closer to the final product than Holland (which is why Salaun particularly baffles me)

to me, his floor/starting point is a 6'8 blake wesley, while his ceiling kinda feels like derozan + very good defense. he doesnt have the footwork, midrange game yet, but the north/south attacking ability, drawing fouls without being harden/trae, and the gimples of playmaking are there. derozan didnt come into the NBA as a playmaker either, took him a long time to develop that part of his game.

ive been advocating for shooting shooting shooting (why my top tier above has 3 high end shooters), but have also consistently felt that IF they want to take a non-shooter, he better be exceptional elsehwere, and i do think holland fits the bill with his defense/explosiveness. if you asked me to predict which player from this year's draft is most likely to have a finals mvp on their resume in the next 10 years, holland is at or near the top of that list imo

I agree that due to his freakish athletic ability in the open court and hard-nosed defense, if he ever figures out that jump shot, we could look back in 10 years and wonder how everyone passed on him. He could also be a knucklehead who never figures out his jumper and we’ll mock whoever drafted him in the lottery. Polarizing prospect for sure. Just don’t see the Spurs being the team to take a swing on him.

[spurraider21]

I agree that due to his freakish athletic ability in the open court and hard-nosed defense, if he ever figures out that jump shot, we could look back in 10 years and wonder how everyone passed on him. He could also be a knucklehead who never figures out his jumper and we’ll mock whoever drafted him in the lottery. Polarizing prospect for sure. Just don’t see the Spurs being the team to take a swing on him.
he's this drafts version of ausar thompson, albeit more confident in his jumper (for better or worse, tbh :lol). not quite the athlete of the thompson twins, but not too far off

[AFBlue]

I think the competitive edge and aggression he plays with are plusses that overcome the lack of skill or feel. There are better options at 4, but I like the swing at 8 if he's there.

[scottspurs]

I could be dead wrong but I’m all the way out on Holland. He didn’t do all that great in the athletic testing for a player that is labeled as super athletic. I see low Basketball IQ player here. I’m not going to question his character but strictly basketball I think he could just be a bigger less athletic Lonnie Walker

[Chinook]

Holland is raw but I don’t think more time in the G League would do him any good. Giving him minutes early and often is likely the best way to help him learn the game and evolve as a player. He’s probably not a starter as a rookie but he should be in the rotation early on.

This is sort of what I was talking to Deeps about yesterday. Small-forward prospects who need to develop but can do some things well have a natural role on the team as the backup PF both Holland and Buzelis can play there to get up to NBA speed while they work on their shot. The team needs legit dynamism and defense in a second unit that has Johnson, Branham and Collins on it. Unless the Spurs believe Holland is much closer to fixing things that many others do, then he would be a hard sell at 4. But at 8, even a player with his limitations can play a valuable role. Putting the guys they draft into positions to succeed with the big club rather than sending them down to Austin to learn how to be a point-guard should be the only play for the first-rounder of this draft. For some players it makes more sense than others.

[baseline bum]

Wouldn't have wanted him at say 7 if the Toronto pick didn't convey and the Spurs fell but with a second lottery pick can't say I'm against taking a home run swing on Holland unless they take a home run swing on Buzelis at 4 instead of a high floor guy like Risacher, Castle, or Sheppard there. Topic would have been my first choice HR swing at 8 before we found out about his T-rex arms, now feels like kind of a coin flip between Holland or Williams for high risk high reward pick at 8.

[Mugen]

Maybe I missed this but what character concerns with Holland? I don't remember him having that stigma.

I don't love him at #8 but he'd be a pretty damn good pick for somebody in the 10-15 range if he fell that far tbh.

[z0sa]

Bruce Bowen type on D and if he manages to develop an outside shot, he could be a key part of a playoff or even title team.

He seems like someone you round the roster out with, though, not draft high and have big expectations on both ends for. Don't think he's what we need right now.

[spurraider21]

Maybe I missed this but what character concerns with Holland? I don't remember him having that stigma.

I don't love him at #8 but he'd be a pretty damn good pick for somebody in the 10-15 range if he fell that far tbh.
nothing specific has come out, but i think a couple reporters made some vague reference to "non basketball reasons" for why he might fall. saw this like a week or two back

[CGD]

This thread will go to page 2 within 48 hours. Pass

[Knoxxx]

Let’s draft Castle and Holland and play them with Sochan.

[lefty20]

Eww, no.

[DPG21920]

Im in on Holland. Jaylen Brown arc…….I think he can be a higher ceiling Keldon replacement. It’s not like Keldon is an elite shooter or passer either even now, but Holland has shown some playmaking chops, hustles so hard on defense and has all the tools to score just as effectively over time as Keldon does now while adding in better playmaking and defense.


Reed + Holland is my favorite combo to walk away from this draft with personally

[rankingtear]

He is described as being the worst player without the ball in this draft. Draft Twitter loves this guy though but they are evaluating guys in a vacuum.

[JR3]

Hard pass. He sounds like a taller Blake Wesley. I’ll keep Blake. But we need mor BB IQ and shooting on this team.

[Splits]

I'd take him at 35, otherwise fuck no. Do we want to repeat last season being one of the worst 3pt shooting teams in the league? Jfc

[jesterbobman]

The whole of the Ignite season was a disaster.

With Ron, I think the upside is that he started awful, being given entirely too much on ball responsibility for a guy who played PF in High school and needed to transition to a wing style role in the NBA. He still ended up with a negative A:TO ratio, but it was basically neutral over the last few weeks before he injured himself, and he racked up insane steal numbers. Signs of actual growth over the course of a few months.

I think he wouldn't fit in the starting lineup alongside Sochan as the wing shooting would be so negative, but the defense (including event generation) is a real positive. I'd be fine at 8 given the upside (potential role as a good defender who can be a star slasher (like a Maggette on offense alongside the Roberson defence).

[Mr. Peabody]

He’s more aggressive than Walker and is a much better defender than Walker ever was.

[R. DeMurre]

Dalton Knecht outperformed Holland in every single test at the draft combine-- lane agility, shuttle run, 3/4 sprint, standing vertical, and max vertical leap-- but somehow Holland still retains the label of "uber athlete" while almost nobody uses that terminology for Knecht or others who've so far shown to have far greater actual basketball skills.


https://www.nba.com/stats/draft/combine-strength-agility?dir=A&sort=LANE_AGILITY_TIME

[objective]

The critiques on Holland regarding turnovers is very strange to me.

A 0.90 a/t ratio with a monster usage against pros as an 18 year old and #1 option .... Is pretty damn good

Buzelis has a near identical a/t ratio of 0.89 on about 3/4 the usage getting to play a secondary role and it's Holland that catches the heat

Holland is a risk with that poor shooting, no doubt. But he's created events on defense while having to carry the burden of #1 option. He was able to drive and get to the rim in a halfcourt setting. IF he ever learns to shoot, he's going to have a great career because he's shown so much as an 18 year old already with defense, driving and getting downhill, some playmaking. If he doesn't shoot he's bouncing around the fringes like a bigger Okogie.

[AFBlue]

Dalton Knecht outperformed Holland in every single test at the draft combine-- lane agility, shuttle run, 3/4 sprint, standing vertical, and max vertical leap-- but somehow Holland still retains the label of "uber athlete" while almost nobody uses that terminology for Knecht or others who've so far shown to have far greater actual basketball skills.


https://www.nba.com/stats/draft/combine-strength-agility?dir=A&sort=LANE_AGILITY_TIME

They're not talked about in the same way because of how they use their athleticism. It's easier to see Holland's athleticism on the court because of how he pressures the rim on offense and disrupts his opponent on D.

[Pauleta14]

Dalton Knecht outperformed Holland in every single test at the draft combine-- lane agility, shuttle run, 3/4 sprint, standing vertical, and max vertical leap-- but somehow Holland still retains the label of "uber athlete" while almost nobody uses that terminology for Knecht or others who've so far shown to have far greater actual basketball skills.


https://www.nba.com/stats/draft/combine-strength-agility?dir=A&sort=LANE_AGILITY_TIME

To be fair/add context Knetch is 4 years older than Holland, who might not even have finished growing.

[The Truth #6]

Holland is definitely the upside swing at 8. I'm not 100% I want to swing for the fences as Carter and Knecht are appealing, but Holland has creation event stats, or whatever the term is, that actually in some analytics has him highly regarded. John Holli her has him #1. Of course that could be an indictment on Hollinger, but it's another factor to consider. Like Buzelis and Collier, he was once a #1 pick candidate, and so he shouldn't be dismissed. He seems to be the hardest worker in the draft or up there with Carter. That counts for something. I agree he has dynamic functional athleticism.

TLDR: if we draft Risacher at 4 and get shooting, I would consider Holland at 8.

[Obstructed_View]

The hardest working players in the NBA are the best five guys and the worst five guys.

The NBA is full of massively talented players who could be great but their job is safe, they are rich and don't have to work super hard. The more I look at guys who rise up in their draft class, guys like SGA and Jimmy Butler and Kawhi and Anthony Edwards, the common thread becomes work ethic.

Luka Samanic was a home run swing because you hoped he would change his nature and become a gym rat instead of being lazy. His unwillingness to chase after a turnover made it pretty clear that was a bad call.

A guy who can stand out there and shoot threes without showing up early for practice is the high floor pick. It's safe, and the conventional wisdom says that's good for Victor.

A guy who plays as hard as he can during games but doesn't come to a new season with any improved skills is a crapshoot like Samanic. Again you draft the guy who already has the skill you want and hope it translates. Not really inspiring when you have two high lottery picks and a chance to build the core of your team to go with your multi generational player.

I guess I'm looking for the guy who is all about winning, who is in the gym in July. I don't see much mention of that in this year's scouting reports.

Anybody else see that mentioned for any of these guys?

[Mr. Body]

The hardest working players in the NBA are the best five guys and the worst five guys.

The NBA is full of massively talented players who could be great but their job is safe, they are rich and don't have to work super hard. The more I look at guys who rise up in their draft class, guys like SGA and Jimmy Butler and Kawhi and Anthony Edwards, the common thread becomes work ethic.

Luka Samanic was a home run swing because you hoped he would change his nature and become a gym rat instead of being lazy. His unwillingness to chase after a turnover made it pretty clear that was a bad call.

A guy who can stand out there and shoot threes without showing up early for practice is the high floor pick. It's safe, and the conventional wisdom says that's good for Victor.

A guy who plays as hard as he can during games but doesn't come to a new season with any improved skills is a crapshoot like Samanic. Again you draft the guy who already has the skill you want and hope it translates. Not really inspiring when you have two high lottery picks and a chance to build the core of your team to go with your multi generational player.

I guess I'm looking for the guy who is all about winning, who is in the gym in July. I don't see much mention of that in this year's scouting reports.

Anybody else see that mentioned for any of these guys?

A lot of these guys are hard workers, but it's Castle and Carter here. Carter's interview talking about how he learned to work off two feet was really impressive. Castle is known to be a hardass worker. It's a reason why I don't care much about the shooting concerns. He'll get it done.

[Obstructed_View]

A lot of these guys are hard workers, but it's Castle and Carter here. Carter's interview talking about how he learned to work off two feet was really impressive. Castle is known to be a hardass worker. It's a reason why I don't care much about the shooting concerns. He'll get it done.
I keep circling back to Castle for that reason as well. He checks a lot of boxes off the bat and looks committed to improving.

I was super high on Blake Wesley until he showed up in his second year not having improved in any way. He's just gonna improve with experience and maturity and make his money. That's fine for where he was drafted. I don't want more of that at 4 and 8. Damn sure not drafting for position there, and frankly I don't care about the current draft rankings. History shows they don't mean a lot.

[DPG21920]

Really fair and balanced write up on Holland with insights into his flaws, strengths & mentality from his high school coach:

1803793968049557958

[Obstructed_View]

Really fair and balanced write up on Holland with insights into his flaws, strengths & mentality from his high school coach:

1803793968049557958
He is what he is. Don't expect him to develop any new skills, just expect him to play hard.

[rjv]

good lord, the Ignite went 2-32?

[The Truth #6]

Really fair and balanced write up on Holland with insights into his flaws, strengths & mentality from his high school coach:

1803793968049557958

From the article:

"He didn’t always practice hard,” Peavy said. “But when the lights were on, when the moment came and it was time to go get it, forget it. You’re not gonna beat him for a loose ball.”

Yeah, that doesn't seem like what Pop will be down with. Lol.

[DPG21920]

From the article:

"He didn’t always practice hard,” Peavy said. “But when the lights were on, when the moment came and it was time to go get it, forget it. You’re not gonna beat him for a loose ball.”

Yeah, that doesn't seem like what Pop will be down with. Lol.

For sure - it was a pretty raw and open article which surprised me. I think that may be the *stuff* some people were alluding to with regard to “off court” stuff? But by all accounts, he seems to have grown from that and works really hard. But it was definitely an interesting article with very real insights.

[spurraider21]

I keep circling back to Castle for that reason as well. He checks a lot of boxes off the bat and looks committed to improving.

I was super high on Blake Wesley until he showed up in his second year not having improved in any way. He's just gonna improve with experience and maturity and make his money. That's fine for where he was drafted. I don't want more of that at 4 and 8. Damn sure not drafting for position there, and frankly I don't care about the current draft rankings. History shows they don't mean a lot.
woof, you lost mr. body there. as soon as you criticize wesley he will call you an idiot who doesnt know what he's looking at

[stnick2261]

good lord, the Ignite went 2-32?

They were tanking for the draft (they were a little misguided).

[objective]

https://youtu.be/qmvv42Lfnhs?si=N613lGGTAhEG1ymi

[RobinsontoDuncan]

In what world does it make sense to draft Cody Williams 4OA as TIMVP suggested, but it's too risky to draft Ron Holland 40A? The logic there is more twisted than a Gordian Knot.

[exstatic]

Russillo had Veccine on his hour long podcast today, and they both have things they like about him, but described his deficits, too, on both sides of the ball, and they were similar both ways, and they asked a question: do you think it’s just slow processing? That would be a bust certainty for a player with few fundamentals.

[objective]

Here's someone who basically did the 'glass half full' positive case for Holland that I think covers things well


https://youtu.be/cZMXkI5pHh4?si=JU0_x471xdHM6KpP

[BackHome]

For me it's Holland or Carter with the 8th pick

[objective]

Nate Duncan ranked Holland 3rd on his board and said he believed in Holland being able to shoot more than Castle

[scottspurs]

Does he also believe that Holland will develop Basketball IQ lol

[The Truth #6]

Russillo had Veccine on his hour long podcast today, and they both have things they like about him, but described his deficits, too, on both sides of the ball, and they were similar both ways, and they asked a question: do you think it’s just slow processing? That would be a bust certainty for a player with few fundamentals.

Good interview. They knocked his defense which was damning in my opinion as the assumption was that he was at least solid on that end.