Woj: Dejounte Murray Traded to Pelicans for Larry Nance Jr, Dyson Daniels and Picks

[timvp]

Worthy of its own thread.

1806822140978639024



:wow Those Hawks picks just went way up in value.

[cjw]

Nothing beats playing 4D chess against these terrible GMs

[Mugen]

I'm not 100% sure they're that much worse tbh. I guess if Trae goes down with a season ending injury next year, they're screwed...

[Mr. Body]

Please no Trae. Please no

[DAF86]

I'm not 100% sure they're that much worse tbh. I guess if Trae goes down with a season ending injury next year, they're screwed...

This, they will still be as mid as ever. Maybe even improve a little.

[Dejounte]

They’re getting their picks back tbh

that’s the only logical explanation for ATL doing this

[mystargtr34]

Breaking up the Murray-Trae combo is addition by subtraction. So I don’t think Hawks get much worse. But it’s still a win for the Spurs because I thought the Hawks would get a positive impact player back for Murray, like an Ingram (even though he’s overrated too).

In summary, Hawks lose a significant asset without really improving the team.

[SpursDynasty85]

I wonder how much Risacher will help. I assume Trae/Bogey/Johnson/Hunter/Capel with Risacher off the bench for now.

[mystargtr34]

I think Risacher starts in place of Hunter unless he really struggles in training camp and pre season.

[baseline bum]

They’re getting their picks back tbh

that’s the only logical explanation for ATL doing this

This is the organization that just took Euro Harrison Barnes instead of Sarr #1 because he wouldn't work out for them. Don't give them too much credit.

[Mugen]

Risacher is starting. He's the #1 pick :lol

[scott]

Please no Trae. Please no

I have a hard time believing PAFTO would be interested in Trae.

I'm thinking maybe we see a multi-team deal where ATL gets their picks back, Trae goes somewhere, and we get picks in the time of Paul Atreides. Lisan Al Gaib is good enough to unretire #21 for.

[Mr. Body]

Breaking up the Murray-Trae combo is addition by subtraction. So I don’t think Hawks get much worse. But it’s still a win for the Spurs because I thought the Hawks would get a positive impact player back for Murray, like an Ingram (even though he’s overrated too).

In summary, Hawks lose a significant asset without really improving the team.

Theoretically they improve their team defense and become even more Trae-centric. Daniels will help where DJM had checked out on d.

[LeBowen]

Trae Young
Dyson Daniels
Jalen Johnson
Zaccharie Risacher
?

Bogdan Bogdanovic
Kobe Bufkin
Deandre Hunter
Larry Nance Jr
Onyeka Okongwu

Capela should be gone, they'll try to get a new starting center.
Ayton to the Hawks kind of makes sense.
Blazers just got Clingan and there's no reason for them to keep Ayton.
Capela's contract is expiring and Blazers would take it for a compensation.

I'm not sure they want to keep Hunter, he kind of stagnated.
Maybe the Blazers would take two of them for Ayton and one of the Blazers many guards.

Kind of still a 7-10th seed roster, regardless.

They can't tank unless we give them their picks back.
Noone here wants Trae and there aren't any suitable three team partners except maybe the Rockets.
But we'd have no reason to help them do that trade unless they give us Jabari and some of those Phoenix picks, which they won't do.

Hawks are in such a shitty spot, tbh.

[DAF86]

They’re getting their picks back tbh

that’s the only logical explanation for ATL doing this

Spurs get Trae Young, Atlanta gets all their pick backs and the Wolves 30 and 31. Just imagine. :lol

It would make the draft moves more understandable. Still fucking horrible, but at least understandable in a "I can't believe you are this stupid, but at least you followed a plan" kind of way. :lol

[Mr. Body]

I have a hard time believing PAFTO would be interested in Trae.

I'm thinking maybe we see a multi-team deal where ATL gets their picks back, Trae goes somewhere, and we get picks in the time of Paul Atreides. Lisan Al Gaib is good enough to unretire #21 for.

"We are studying Cooper Flagg's sperm count and are estimating his prime porking years."

[Mr. Body]

Prioritizing defense and players who can do multiple things on offense.

Then trading for Trae Young.

[Dejounte]

I think we trade the 2025 pick back, keep the 2027 one, include the Boston 2028 and Twolves 2031 picks for Trae.

[baseline bum]

I gotta go hit up the Hawks reddit for the meltdowns

[timvp]

But it’s still a win for the Spurs because I thought the Hawks would get a positive impact player back for Murray

Yeah I thought they could get a better win-now piece than Australian Thybulle.

[DPG21920]

Worthy of its own thread.

1806822140978639024



:wow Those Hawks picks just went way up in value.

Really, how? It’s a decent return for ATL. Daniels + Nance can be flipped for more picks probably if they want and/or they can now trade those 2 25 firsts they have (Kings top 12 protected and Lakers unprotected) for a player to help win now and they added Risacher etc..

I dont know that it helps the value of the picks all that much considering they were play-in with Murray no? What am I missing?

Now, if they move Trae? Then absolutely but this move may signal the opposite no?

[Dejounte]

I gotta go hit up the Hawks reddit for the meltdowns

way ahead of you. It’s bad over there

[timvp]

If the Spurs trade for Trae Young after drafting Stephon Castle and skipping Dilly, I'm out :lol

[DPG21920]

Breaking up the Murray-Trae combo is addition by subtraction. So I don’t think Hawks get much worse. But it’s still a win for the Spurs because I thought the Hawks would get a positive impact player back for Murray, like an Ingram (even though he’s overrated too).

In summary, Hawks lose a significant asset without really improving the team.

The picks they got are of decent value and can be used to land an impact player im guessing.

[Leetonidas]

Almost feel bad for the Hawks :lol reading Hawksquawk is sad. I've never seen such a depressing fan base after winning the #1 pick the draft

[Mr. Body]

Hawks subreddit seems to like it:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AtlantaHawks/comments/1dqwql4/the_hawks_are_ending_the_murraytrae_young/

[Leetonidas]

If the Spurs trade for Trae Young after drafting Stephon Castle and skipping Dilly, I'm out :lol

Dont lie. It's only a matter of time before you post "12 reasons why Trae and Wemby could be the best duo in the NBA" :lol

[timvp]

I dont know that it helps the value of the picks all that much considering they were play-in with Murray no? What am I missing?

Breaking up Trae/DJ without getting a win-now piece back is good news for the value of those picks.

[mudyez]

I think we trade the 2025 pick, keep the 2027 one, include the Boston 2028 and Twolves 2031 picks for Traore.

Fify

[timvp]

Dont lie. It's only a matter of time before you post "12 reasons why Trae and Wemby could be the best duo in the NBA" :lol

:lol

[scott]

I think we trade the 2025 pick back, keep the 2027 one, include the Boston 2028 and Twolves 2031 picks for Trae.

2028 isn't a pick from BOS, it's just a swap, and I don't think we can trade those.

[Mugen]

The picks they got are of decent value and can be used to land an impact player im guessing.

No they're not. Both picks are gonna be in the 20s tbh.

[baseline bum]

If the Spurs trade for Trae Young after drafting Stephon Castle and skipping Dilly, I'm out :lol

Would be bad, but the only thing that really ever had me questioning my Spurs fandom was when they were about to sign Warm Karl back in 03.

[objective]

ATL picks are overrated, I think they will make the playoffs.

The absolute best the Hawks ever played was with shooters surrounding Trae, and now Murray's touches are going to an offball shooter in Risacher.

Trade those picks before they lose value, end up as pick 16, and B.Wrong ruins another draft

[Dejounte]

The Hawks had a chance to be competitive if they drafted Clingan, not Risacher.

either:

they believe they will be competitive with the players they attained in this trade and will fail miserably because Nance, Daniels, Risacher are all garbage

or

they’re getting their pick back from us

it has to be the latter, tbh. If it’s the former then that ATL pick is going to be gold.

but… they don’t do this trade if they don’t have a trade with the Spurs lined up already. Welcome home, Trae!

[DPG21920]

No F*CKING WAY spurs are that dumb to trade for Trae. Theres just no way IMO. Everything they’ve done from their patience mindset alongside the archetype of player says “no to Trae”

Im honestly not worried about that. Could see a BKY/HOU type deal though were SA gets equivalent picks + sweetener to give ATL picks back though.

[Degoat]

My thoughts… this is a win win for the spurs. ATL got worse with this trade, highly doubtful they’ll be a playoff team, those picks will be great!

if the hawks do trade Trae Young to SA then we just got a star guard next to wemby! Saying we traded away Dilly then went and traded for young, DO NOT put them in the same convo.

[LeBowen]

Welcome home, Trae!

If we actually do it, there won't be enough hamsters in the world to keep this forum running. :rollin

Imagine trading for Trae with Dillingham becoming a legit 20ppg scorer, we'd be done as a franchise, tbh.

[Dejounte]

If we actually do it, there won't be enough hamsters in the world to keep this forum running. :rollin

Imagine trading for Trae with Dillingham becoming a legit 20ppg scorer, we'd be done as a franchise, tbh.

I don’t know why people keep thinking Dillingham is going to reach half of Trae’s level. It won’t be close, tbh.

[DPG21920]

No they're not. Both picks are gonna be in the 20s tbh.

The lakers can easily miss the playoffs in the west tbh..

[SpursFan86]

Am I the only one fine with getting Trae? I mean it obviously depends on what we have to give up, but seems like the consensus here is that he’s a bad player or doesn’t make the team considerably better. There are certainly deals that could make sense and would totally transform this team.

People overstate the whole “short guards don’t win titles” thing. We’re not asking him to be the best player on the team. We already have our #1 and he has the potential to be one of the most dominant players of all time…that changes things. Not trying to argue that defense doesn’t matter but I just don’t think Trae is automatically incapable of winning just because he’s a bad defender and hasn’t won as the first option.

[scott]

ATL picks are overrated, I think they will make the playoffs.

The absolute best the Hawks ever played was with shooters surrounding Trae, and now Murray's touches are going to an offball shooter in Risacher.

Trade those picks before they lose value, end up as pick 16, and B.Wrong ruins another draft

You make a good point here. The only thing worse than not having picks is having picks but also having Brian Wright as your GM.

[Dejounte]

Am I the only one fine with getting Trae? I mean it obviously depends on what we have to give up, but seems like the consensus here is that he’s a bad player or doesn’t make the team considerably better. There are certainly deals that could make sense and would totally transform this team.

People overstate the whole “short guards don’t win titles” thing. We’re not asking him to be the best player on the team. We already have our #1 and he has the potential to be one of the most dominant players of all time…that changes things. Not trying to argue that defense doesn’t matter but I just don’t think Trae is automatically incapable of winning just because he’s a bad defender and hasn’t won as the first option.

We suddenly have all these defensive bulldogs to hide Trae, tbh. Castle, Sochan, Wesley, Cissoko, whoever else they can get.

[baseline bum]

My thoughts… this is a win win for the spurs. ATL got worse with this trade, highly doubtful they’ll be a playoff team, those picks will be great!

if the hawks do trade Trae Young to SA then we just got a star guard next to wemby! Saying we traded away Dilly then went and traded for young, DO NOT put them in the same convo.

I don't think too much of Wright but him drafting Castle just to trade for Trae? Seems far-fetched.

[DPG21920]

ATL, if they simply keep Trae, is GUARANTEED to make play-in at worst. Depending on what happens in CLE (Mitchell does not extend?) and PHI (can they build a team because all they have are Embiid + Maxey on their roster) ATL can make playoffs pretty straightforward

But worst case is 9th seed since literally every single other team that was not a playoff team in the East is tanking hard for this draft and got worse. Theres zero competition for 9th seed and play-in for ATL even with no Murray.

[DPG21920]

My thoughts… this is a win win for the spurs. ATL got worse with this trade, highly doubtful they’ll be a playoff team, those picks will be great!

if the hawks do trade Trae Young to SA then we just got a star guard next to wemby! Saying we traded away Dilly then went and traded for young, DO NOT put them in the same convo.

Lmao - Traes sh*t defense and need to be on ball and contract and fact he will cost 3-4 firsts negates anything else.

[Leetonidas]

Am I the only one fine with getting Trae? I mean it obviously depends on what we have to give up, but seems like the consensus here is that he’s a bad player or doesn’t make the team considerably better. There are certainly deals that could make sense and would totally transform this team.

People overstate the whole “short guards don’t win titles” thing. We’re not asking him to be the best player on the team. We already have our #1 and he has the potential to be one of the most dominant players of all time…that changes things. Not trying to argue that defense doesn’t matter but I just don’t think Trae is automatically incapable of winning just because he’s a bad defender and hasn’t won as the first option.

I'm fine with getting him also. Not necessarily my preference but I don't think it's going to ruin the franchise and any chance Victor has to compete if it doesn't work out. There are many ways to get to the same place imo

[LeBowen]

Am I the only one fine with getting Trae? I mean it obviously depends on what we have to give up, but seems like the consensus here is that he’s a bad player or doesn’t make the team considerably better. There are certainly deals that could make sense and would totally transform this team.

People overstate the whole “short guards don’t win titles” thing. We’re not asking him to be the best player on the team. We already have our #1 and he has the potential to be one of the most dominant players of all time…that changes things. Not trying to argue that defense doesn’t matter but I just don’t think Trae is automatically incapable of winning just because he’s a bad defender and hasn’t won as the first option.

I'd be fine if the price is right (ATL picks and dumping all of our useless players) and Trae agrees to not ask for a full max extension in $60M a year range, but to stay at around ~$45M he's currently making.
If you draft a player who's that useless on one side of the floor, he has to realize we'd need more cap space in order to surround him with a functional team.

And if we're drafting Trae, then might aswell go all in and also trade for a legit forward.

[baseline bum]

Am I the only one fine with getting Trae? I mean it obviously depends on what we have to give up, but seems like the consensus here is that he’s a bad player or doesn’t make the team considerably better. There are certainly deals that could make sense and would totally transform this team.

People overstate the whole “short guards don’t win titles” thing. We’re not asking him to be the best player on the team. We already have our #1 and he has the potential to be one of the most dominant players of all time…that changes things. Not trying to argue that defense doesn’t matter but I just don’t think Trae is automatically incapable of winning just because he’s a bad defender and hasn’t won as the first option.

Drafting Castle was moronic if they were going to make this trade.

[CGD]

Well ATL got a 25 and 27 FRP back for Murray.

If they’re moving players, I’m highly interested in taking Hunter off their hands.

[BackHome]

It's funny people wanting Murray saying he would help us are now saying Atlanta is going to be better without him?

[SpursBills]

I don't think Dyson Daniels was that much worse than Dejounte Murray last season - he actually graded out as a more impactful player. People are underestimating just how terrible Dejounte was last season. Larry Nance has consistently graded out as a positive player. Now they take Murray's wasted possessions where he chucks a mid-range jumper and shunt them to Trae who's a way better playmaker; I think that Hawks team fits better on paper now with how their role players work around Trae. They're not going very far in the post-season, but it's a tall order to expect them to be a bottom tier team.

[Rosewood]

I don’t know why people keep thinking Dillingham is going to reach half of Trae’s level. It won’t be close, tbh.
This is perplexing and I only see it on this board. A proven top NBA scorer and PnR guy being valued the same as a rookie who hasn’t played a game. I’d rather go for Markannen or try the dice in the Flagg sweepstakes but :lol at this insane narrative that is popping up about Trae.

[Dejounte]

ATL, if they simply keep Trae, is GUARANTEED to make play-in at worst. Depending on what happens in CLE (Mitchell does not extend?) and PHI (can they build a team because all they have are Embiid + Maxey on their roster) ATL can make playoffs pretty straightforward

But worst case is 9th seed since literally every single other team that was not a playoff team in the East is tanking hard for this draft and got worse. Theres zero competition for 9th seed and play-in for ATL even with no Murray.

PHI “all they have are Embiid and Maxey” ??? :lmao

Worst case is play in?

horrible takes

[Degoat]

Spurs moved back Devonte grahams Guarantee date which I assume could be used in a trade for a team to save money…

[DPG21920]

DET: Still terrible
WAS: Still terrible and traded away Deni
CHA: Still terrible and may lose Bridges and drafted the most non-nba ready player at 6
TOR: has not improved at all
BKY: traded Bridges for picks
CHI: Traded their most net + player in Caruso, likely letting DeRozan go and will trade Lavine.

Not a single one of the bad teams in the East will be a threat to try and leap ATL - maybe CHA if they keep Bridges, LaMelo stays healthy and Miller can leap?

[Dejounte]

I don't think Dyson Daniels was that much worse than Dejounte Murray last season - he actually graded out as a more impactful player. People are underestimating just how terrible Dejounte was last season. Larry Nance has consistently graded out as a positive player. Now they take Murray's wasted possessions where he chucks a mid-range jumper and shunt them to Trae who's a way better playmaker; I think that Hawks team fits better on paper now with how their role players work around Trae. They're not going very far in the post-season, but it's a tall order to expect them to be a bottom tier team.

They tried this model before, and it was a much better team then vs what they could hope to build with the assets they have in this offseason. This is a much worse team than that pre-Dejounte team.

[mystargtr34]

I can’t see the Hawks jumping any of the playoff teams this year.

Celtics
Knicks
Bucks
Sixers
Pacers
Cleveland
Orlando
Miami

Those 8 are a lock to be better than the Hawks. Miami won’t trade Butler imo.

Atlanta will be fighting with Toronto and Charlotte for 9-10 imo. The rest of the teams in the East are in tank mode (Brooklyn, Chicago, Washington, Detroit).

[LeBowen]

PHI “all they have are Embiid and Maxey” ??? :lmao

Worst case is play in?

horrible takes

Tbh, Pistons, Wizards, Nets, Hornets, Raptors, Bulls are all almost guaranteed to be under 30 wins, imo.
Can't see healthy Hawks with Trae dropping below 9th seed, East is just horrible right now.

[DPG21920]

PHI “all they have are Embiid and Maxey” ??? :lmao

Worst case is play in?

horrible takes

My friend, you realize that PHI literally only has 4 players under contract. I wasn’t saying it as a jab its a literal damn FACT that PHI only has those two guys :lol

And yes, ATL with Trae is worst case a play-in team. Not a single non-playoff team in the east got better and almost all of them got worse and are still tanking hard. How is this a horrible take? Please elaborate with your thesis here.

[DPG21920]

Drafting Castle was moronic if they were going to make this trade.

Why? I think Castle fits well next to a Trae type honestly. I dont want Trae for a lot of reasons, but Castle actually fits next to him IMO

[Mr. Body]

Why? I think Castle fits well next to a Trae type honestly. I dont want Trae for a lot of reasons, but Castle actually fits next to him IMO

It's not good for Castle, it's good for Trae.

Trae gets to stand around on defense disengaged and watching Castle try to cover two players by himself.

Castle gets to watch Trae pound the ball and launch threes whenever he "feels it."

Pretty sure those are exactly the things Castle didn't want to happen.

[SpursBills]

They tried this model before, and it was a much better team then vs what they could hope to build with the assets they have in this offseason. This is a much worse team than that pre-Dejounte team.

Yes, they tried this model before and were a borderline playoff team. A worse version of that is probably a borderline play-in with a pick ranging from 8-12, so I don't necessarily disagree with you. But let's not act like this trade all of a sudden makes Atlanta a bottom 4 team or something, the difference between next year's Hawk's team vs this year's Hawks team (10th worst) probably isn't that big.

[BackHome]

Man we better not get that scrub Trae that would be such a huge mistake for this franchise

[scott]

Yeah, I don't think it's Trae... just trying to figure out what team out there would want Trae and send us Galaxy-era picks for it.

[mystargtr34]

I think Dejounte is going to be passed around like a blunt at a college party for the rest of his career almost like Westbrook after he turned 30.

Game sounds good on paper then you get him and realise he can’t be effective in a complementary role and needs to the ball on his hands to be effective, but he’s not good enough with the ball in his hands to move the needle and generate real impact/wins.

[Dejounte]

Yes, they tried this model before and were a borderline playoff team. A worse version of that is probably a borderline play-in with a pick ranging from 8-12, so I don't necessarily disagree with you. But let's not act like this trade all of a sudden makes Atlanta a bottom 4 team or something, the difference between next year's Hawk's team vs this year's Hawks team (10th worst) probably isn't that big.

I think you’re underrating a few aspects:

-that team was built over time to reach those peaks. this upcoming Hawks team will have no seasons of experience together.
-Trae’s mindset. He specifically wanted to play with a star, that’s why they got Dejounte. Now they’re doing the same model again and his effort levels are supposed to stay the same? What motivation does he have for this organization now that it’s clear they’re putting players around him that have not won anything in this league?

[TheChillFactor]

i'm just glad he isn't coming back here. i don't want trae young either.

[vy65]

ATL, if they simply keep Trae, is GUARANTEED to make play-in at worst. Depending on what happens in CLE (Mitchell does not extend?) and PHI (can they build a team because all they have are Embiid + Maxey on their roster) ATL can make playoffs pretty straightforward

But worst case is 9th seed since literally every single other team that was not a playoff team in the East is tanking hard for this draft and got worse. Theres zero competition for 9th seed and play-in for ATL even with no Murray.

But why tho?

Better teams:

Boston
NYK
Philly
Indy
MIL
Cleveland
Orlando
Miami
Charlotte
Toronto

Worse
Brooklyn
Washington
Detroit
Chicago (TBD)

Assuming Chicago tanks, that would put Atlanta at #11.

[Mr. Body]

Dejounte has to be happy. The play-in game this year, after the whole game of Trae just lazily walking around on defense and barely being viable on offense, this one play where Trae chucks this deep three against the run of offense early in the shot clock. The look of disgust on Murray's face.

[DPG21920]

But why tho?

Better teams:

Boston
NYK
Philly
Indy
MIL
Cleveland
Orlando
Miami
Charlotte
Toronto

Worse
Brooklyn
Washington
Detroit
Chicago (TBD)

Assuming Chicago tanks, that would put Atlanta at #11.

TOR and CHA are not better than ATL IMHO

[DesignatedT]

Hawks lose some leverage in a trade with the Spurs now.

[thOOdee]

If the Spurs trade for Trae Young after drafting Stephon Castle and skipping Dilly, I'm out :lol


oh god no!!!

[TrainOfThought5]

I don’t know why people keep thinking Dillingham is going to reach half of Trae’s level. It won’t be close, tbh.

he will 100% reach half of traes level. He’s already a better 3 Point shooter.

[superbigtime]

Spurs could've given more than NO surely. Would've loved him in silver and black again.

[thOOdee]

he will 100% reach half of traes level. He’s already a better 3 Point shooter.


crazy hows this forum switched from dilly being an absolute no brainer of a pick, to now not even a fraction of a point guard who forever keeps his team in mediocrity. Again, unless buzelis or cody williams becomes the next kawhii, b wright made the right move. UNLESS HE F@CKS IT UP BY TRADING FOR TREY!!

[TDMVPDPOY]

why would u want igballer back...

move on fellas, at leasts its not 1of the 2 pos on that hawks...

there are better players out there worth trying to trade for

[Mr. Body]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1yVVeoUkXI

Look at these plays.

2:24 Trae floats this shitty pass into traffic for some fucking reason, plays terrible transition defense then sort of... leaves?
2:46 Trae wants to jack a contested deep three because he's "feeling it," decides to just pass it to a defender instead, plays awful fucking defense on the break
(Subsequent span of time, Atlanta claws back when, ahem, Trae has been benched, because he sucks.)
5:21 What the fuck was this? Feeble swipe at the ball leading to a wide-open j. I would hate to play with this guy.
6:08 Just... decides not to do help defense.
6:21 Not a terrible pass, but it's Dejounte who saves the play. Trae once again ballwatching whenever he doesn't have it.
6:55 Tries to draw a foul a league away from the three-point line in embarrassing fashion. Turns to whine to the ref while Chicago strolls down for a layup.
7:17 Piece of shit defense, just fucking awful
8:26 Maybe the worst one yet. Coby White is killing them. Trae sees him making the lane again and... just doesn't bother coming over.

Trae Young fucking sucks.

[Ditty]

If they trade Trae Young they are a bottom five team. No way they are a decent team with Jalen Johnson being your best player as they probably trade Hunter also at some point.

[spurraider21]

Trae may lower your ceiling but he is also undeniably a floor raiser.

[Degoat]

Probably not likely but I wonder if there’s a possible 3 team trade in the works… Donovan Mitchell still hasn’t signed a contract extension (won’t sign unless they get Trae) and Trae young is currently at his camp. Maybe there’s a 3 team trade between the spurs, Hawks, and Cavs, where the Cavs end up with Trae young and the spurs Garland.

[Seventyniner]

Probably not likely but I wonder if there’s a possible 3 team trade in the works… Donovan Mitchell still hasn’t signed a contract extension and Trae young is currently at his camp. Maybe there’s a 3 team trade between the spurs, Hawks, and Cavs, where the Cavs end up with Trae young and the spurs Garland.

Would have to be at least 4 way imo. If Mitchell doesn't want to share the ball with Garland there's no way he would want Young as a teammate.

[timvp]

But why tho?

Better teams:

Boston
NYK
Philly
Indy
MIL
Cleveland
Orlando
Miami
Charlotte
Toronto

Worse
Brooklyn
Washington
Detroit
Chicago (TBD)

Assuming Chicago tanks, that would put Atlanta at #11.

Brooklyn, Washington and Detroit are tanking. Doesn't look like Chicago is tanking yet. Toronto unlikely to tank to begin the season. Hornets will probably try to win until Ball gets injured.

Hard to see ATL rising into the top 8, especially after not getting a big-time win-now piece for either DJ or Trae.

[Obstructed_View]

The pick...is in play. There's a 2034 second round pick with our name on it!

[objective]

Doubt Atlanta trades Trae to the only other rumored team, the Lakers

Now that they own the Lakers 25 pick, it's not in their interest to help the Lakers.

[spurraider21]

in concept... this is pretty fascinating. returning the hawks picks to them but with protections :lol

1806865485402980453

[Robz4000]

As long as ATL finishes in the top 10 there's a legit chance they move into the top 4 tbh.

[Notorious H.O.P.]

Like a lot of people here, my first thought was that ATL was somehow getting their picks back. Combined with them not taking extra salary by dumping Dilly and passing on Furphy, it seemed like they were hoping to be a player in free agency but hopefully it's not to onboard a huge salary like Trae's.

[Spurs Homer]

Hilarious reading all the experts here shit all over trae young -
when our team has - wesley,branham,zollins and others....

trae young singlehandedly increases the spurs wins over everyone else not named wemby on the spurs roster...

but post after post of drama queen "if the spurs get trae i will blah blah..."

[Mr. Body]

Hilarious reading all the experts here shit all over trae young -
when our team has - wesley,branham,zollins and others....

trae young singlehandedly increases the spurs wins over everyone else not named wemby on the spurs roster...

but post after post of drama queen "if the spurs get trae i will blah blah..."

I don't know how many times I have to tell you and show you how bad he is for us.

[Spurs Homer]

I don't know how many times I have to tell you and show you how bad he is for us.

Im thinking you have some kind of a personal hate for him - judging by your endless rants about him...

sure is better than anyone not named wemby on this spurs team if you can be objective - but i doubt you can

[benefactor]

Trae may lower your ceiling but he is also undeniably a floor raiser.
Probably the best take about him yet.

[benefactor]

Im thinking you have some kind of a personal hate for him - judging by your endless rants about him...

sure is better than anyone not named wemby on this spurs team if you can be objective - but i doubt you can
Don't listen to him. He wanted to trade down if he was forced to take Reed Sheppard

[timtonymanu]

I hope we get Trae Young just so it lowers the ceiling of Mr. Body remaining a Spurs fan.

[WaywardTexan]

Sorry I may be in the wrong thread but can someone tell me where i can find some website hosting updates?

[Spurs Homer]

Don't listen to him. He wanted to trade down if he was forced to take Reed Sheppard

Reed sheppard would have been fucking awesome on this brick squad...

[SpursDynasty85]

I don't know how many times I have to tell you and show you how bad he is for us.

Bruh. Trae Yoong had just come back from injury just to play that game. I’m not a big Trae Young fan but clearly that game was not indicative of his play.

[CitizenDwayne]

I am…skeptical…but a Trae/Castle backcourt wouldn’t be the worst thing we’ve seen. I feel like I’m saying the same shit people predicted about Trae/Murray but ideally they would mask each other’s deficiencies. Trae wouldn’t be the #1 guy and his comments make it sound like he understands that and would embrace the role of facilitating Vic. Never liked the guy but he would immediately be by far the best passer Wemby has played with. Js, a big issue with the team this year was teammates failing to help maximize Wemby on the offensive end

[benefactor]

Reed sheppard would have been fucking awesome on this brick squad...
Mr. Butt Buddy and his long, detailed paragraphs of horseshit beg to differ my friend....

[SpursDynasty85]

I can’t see the Hawks jumping any of the playoff teams this year.

Celtics
Knicks
Bucks
Sixers
Pacers
Cleveland
Orlando
Miami

Those 8 are a lock to be better than the Hawks. Miami won’t trade Butler imo.

Atlanta will be fighting with Toronto and Charlotte for 9-10 imo. The rest of the teams in the East are in tank mode (Brooklyn, Chicago, Washington, Detroit).

Orlando needs a couple pieces. Cleveland has to resign Mitchell or Trade Garland. I think Hawks can compete in the 6-10 range. Jalen Johnson looking like a stud and let’s see how Risacher does.

[Mr. Body]

Bruh. Trae Yoong had just come back from injury just to play that game. I’m not a big Trae Young fan but clearly that game was not indicative of his play.

Guessing you never watched him play.

[scott]

If Trae comes, I'll root like hell for him to succeed... I just think there are better avenues we can go.

But.... I also thought we should use the #8 pick. Your mileage may vary.

[Mr. Body]

"He was just injured bro he was just injured he doesn't turn over the ball shoot wild inefficient shots play no defense and just stand around watching all the time bro he was injured bro."

[Obstructed_View]

My concern isn't that Trae is bad, but that I have no faith in this coaching staff to properly channel him. There is no denying that there are things he does at an elite level. The question is if the other things are a result of bad habits or no accountability.

[z0sa]

I'd take Trae Young, in a heartbeat. Doesn't mean he isn't flawed, and possibly he does even lower your ceiling. The main sticking point for me is his contract. Would he take less money to keep the Show running?

At the least, it'd show the FO has balls and are willing to make a move to earn Wemby's loyalty and that future stadium. If it's a rental for sure because Trae wants max money in a year or so, that wouldn't be the right move, though. Still, a selfish part of me is dying for even just one season of Wemby+Trae just to show how it should be done when we do get "the guy", at least on offense. Just wouldn't do that for a bunch of first round picks (unless we're planning on doing some more punting...).

[Obstructed_View]

Doubt Atlanta trades Trae to the only other rumored team, the Lakers

Now that they own the Lakers 25 pick, it's not in their interest to help the Lakers.
Aren't the Lakers out of assets?

[scott]

Aren't the Lakers out of assets?

The Lakers have available to trade:

2026 Swap
2028 Swap
2029 FRP
2030 Swap (or FRP if they don't trade 29 or 30)
2031 FRP (though I believe the Spurs are closely eyeing this one)

[Spurs Homer]

"He was just injured bro he was just injured he doesn't turn over the ball shoot wild inefficient shots play no defense and just stand around watching all the time bro he was injured bro."

I watched that game you keep ranting about -
c'mon man - he had recently come back from injury -you could see his body was not cooperating and he got frustrated and pressed and then he got worse -

it can happen and i am not some trae fan - and it is not about excuses - but i have also seen him carrying his team in the playoffs and willing them to upset some teams and being a surprise -

regardless...i think your harsh critiques of trae might even be understandable if the spurs were stocked with studs and all stars and adding trae would be adding a bad piece and having the team regress...

but literally no one outside of wemby is even near traes talent and here you are acting like some entitled armchair GM talent expert -

just bizarre

[BackHome]

Signing him is a huge cap hit -
2024 - 43 million
2025 - 46 million
2026 - 49 million

And we still will have to pay for a starting SF and deep bench at minimum

[CitizenDwayne]

"He was just injured bro he was just injured he doesn't turn over the ball shoot wild inefficient shots play no defense and just stand around watching all the time bro he was injured bro."
You like Garland any better?

[Chinook]

The Lakers have available to trade:

2026 Swap
2028 Swap
2029 FRP
2030 Swap (or FRP if they don't trade 29 or 30)
2031 FRP (though I believe the Spurs are closely eyeing this one)

I'd still consider Knecht's rights liquid too. How funny would it be if the Spurs traded Bronny's rights away after all that pageantry with them drafting him?

[Darkwaters]

Just say no to Trae

[benefactor]

Signing him is a huge cap hit -
2024 - 43 million
2025 - 46 million
2026 - 49 million

And we still will have to pay for a starting SF and deep bench at minimum
Could have just drafted Dilly.

2031 though!

[CitizenDwayne]

Signing him is a huge cap hit -
2024 - 43 million
2025 - 46 million
2026 - 49 million

And we still will have to pay for a starting SF and deep bench at minimum

Trae
Castle
Devin
Sochan
Wemby

Maybe?

[Mr. Body]

My concern isn't that Trae is bad, but that I have no faith in this coaching staff to properly channel him. There is no denying that there are things he does at an elite level. The question is if the other things are a result of bad habits or no accountability.

Why don't we trade back their picks and pay him 40 to 60 a year to find out?

Fact of the matter is, Trae doesn't work with ANY star player. He has to dominate the ball. You can give him another star and it won't work. Put him with Wemby and they'll have to take turns.

You know why he never gets invited to the Olympics?

Anyway clearly I hurt feelings from the EA Sports crowd for pointing out how challenged he is. Just don't get the constant love affairs for the John Collins DeAndre Ayton Trae Young players in the league. Someone will have to explain that to me someday, why this forum keeps falling in love with the worst most expensive non stars in the league. Tobias Harris. Forgot him. At some point I'd think you'd rethink your thought processes.

[Chinook]

Signing him is a huge cap hit -
2024 - 43 million
2025 - 46 million
2026 - 49 million

And we still will have to pay for a starting SF and deep bench at minimum

It's why drafting a guy you hope can eventually do what Young can do while spending that money on a vet forward made the most sense. But I'm a broken record.

One of the things overlooked in a Young trade is that the Spurs have the cap space to absorb Hunter while still being able to provide matching salary for Young. So they could acquire their starting SF in the same transaction as they acquired Young. But yes, it's not a great move.

[Spurs Homer]

Why don't we trade back their picks and pay him 40 to 60 a year to find out?

Fact of the matter is, Trae doesn't work with ANY star player. He has to dominate the ball. You can give him another star and it won't work. Put him with Wemby and they'll have to take turns.

You know why he never gets invited to the Olympics?

Anyway clearly I hurt feelings from the EA Sports crowd for pointing out how challenged he is. Just don't get the constant love affairs for the John Collins DeAndre Ayton Trae Young players in the league. Someone will have to explain that to me someday, why this forum keeps falling in love with the worst most expensive non stars in the league. Tobias Harris. Forgot him. At some point I'd think you'd rethink your thought processes.

yeah - ^ that sure doesn't sound dickish in any way mr expert

thanks for setting us all straight with your wisdom

[Kevin]

If Trae comes, I'll root like hell for him to succeed... I just think there are better avenues we can go.

But.... I also thought we should use the #8 pick. Your mileage may vary.

That’s just leftover Luka/Giannis fantasies talking. Other realistic targets were Garland DJM and Lauri.

I’d love to still make a run at Lauri if we get Young.

[scott]

That’s just leftover Luka/Giannis fantasies talking. Other realistic targets were Garland DJM and Lauri.

I’d love to still make a run at Lauri if we get Young.

I've never been a delusional Luka/Giannis dreamer. The better avenues I'm talking about don't even involve superstar trades... but this FO seems like they have it all figured out..........

[exstatic]

I'm not 100% sure they're that much worse tbh. I guess if Trae goes down with a season ending injury next year, they're screwed...

They were marginally better when Trae went out last year, and DJ ran the show.

[KobesAchilles]

yeah - ^ that sure doesn't sound dickish in any way mr expert

thanks for setting us all straight with your wisdom
Dude wasn’t even willing to trade for Luka last year saying the same shit. Basically according to the “wise” people on Spurstalk the only two players who are worth trading for and paying money to are Giannis and Jokic.

[CitizenDwayne]

That’s just leftover Luka/Giannis fantasies talking. Other realistic targets were Garland DJM and Lauri.

I’d love to still make a run at Lauri if we get Young.

Ngl I'd like to see that

[exstatic]

They’re getting their picks back tbh

that’s the only logical explanation for ATL doing this

Or, they realized they never would, and have moved on to get returns on what they can. The consensus was that DJ held more value in a trade than Trae, and they only got two FRPs and some salary.

[Obstructed_View]

Why don't we trade back their picks and pay him 40 to 60 a year to find out?

Fact of the matter is, Trae doesn't work with ANY star player. He has to dominate the ball. You can give him another star and it won't work. Put him with Wemby and they'll have to take turns.

You know why he never gets invited to the Olympics?

Anyway clearly I hurt feelings from the EA Sports crowd for pointing out how challenged he is. Just don't get the constant love affairs for the John Collins DeAndre Ayton Trae Young players in the league. Someone will have to explain that to me someday, why this forum keeps falling in love with the worst most expensive non stars in the league. Tobias Harris. Forgot him. At some point I'd think you'd rethink your thought processes.
My evaluations and opinions of Young are from watching him play. I assure you that they aren't at all influenced by someone I had to remove from my ignore list to reply to. You're entitled to your opinions. I'm not obligated to agree.

I'd have preferred to draft someone Victor's age to develop with him, someone that has more upside than Julian Champagne, but here we are. The nice thing about the Trae Youngs of this world are that if he turns out to be empty stats, someone will give you value for him.

If he doesn't get invited to the Olympics for a reason, then Popovich is the author of that reason, and you don't have to worry about the Spurs trading for him.

[exstatic]

The picks they got are of decent value and can be used to land an impact player im guessing.

The Laker one could be anything from mid to very nice, but the other one is hot garbage, worst of NO and Milwaukee.

[baseline bum]

Or, they realized they never would, and have moved on to get returns on what they can. The consensus was that DJ held more value in a trade than Trae, and they only got two FRPs and some salary.

No way Dejounte holds more trade value than Trae, I don't believe that for a second. Hawks could have easily pried Reaves and a first from the Lakers last year for Young.

[exstatic]

No way Dejounte holds more trade value than Trae, I don't believe that for a second. Hawks could have easily pried Reaves and a first from the Lakers last year for Young.

Not that DJ is a better player. That and value are two different things. He makes half the money, and is under team control twice as long. He’s better than 50% of the player that Trae is, probably 80-85%, so there’s the value disparity.

[Kevin]

I’d offer the Bulls pick, the most favorable pick in 2027 and 2030 and the 2031 T-Wolves pick for Lauri right now.

[objective]

Any word on if Dejounte waived his trade kicker?

Or because the trade might happen during the 23-24 league year does it not kick in until July 1?

[scott]

Listening to some annoying ass Twitter Live, and Tynan says he doesn't think the Spurs are in the Young conversation.

Side note, whoever is hosting this Twitter Spaces (or whatever the fuck its called) is the most annoying "host" I've ever had the displeasure of listening to. K-Dot the Chemist. If you read this message board, you are horrible and need to learn how to shut the fuck up while your "guests" are talking.

[SpursDynasty85]

Guessing you never watched him play.

Trae Young is good and a net positive with the right team around him. Offensively not too much to argue about. Defensively, well.. there’s the problem.

[Obstructed_View]

Trae Young is good and a net positive with the right team around him. Offensively not too much to argue about. Defensively, well.. there’s the problem.
No guards on the Spurs play defense, either. Might as well have someone who can score points while they're busy not defending.

[drpill]

Nobody probably wanted Dillingham on this team more than I did, so reading this thread I've had to ask myself if I am still opposed to trading for Trae Young... The answer is yes. The situations are barely equivalent, despite whatever parallels you want to draw between them as players. Personally I think the similarities don't extend much further than their size and defensive impact, but it's not really the point. The most obvious and glaring difference is the cost -- getting Trae is putting a huge portion of your eggs in the shrimpy guard basket, with a much more challenging path to building a real team once he'd be here. And besides, I mostly agree with Mr. Body and others who say Trae sucks. He is painful to watch sometimes. Of the two, I would rather have Garland, but if the Spurs rejected Dillingham I hope it's due to a general move towards putting size and defensive skill at every position and that they aren't looking to compromise that.

My faith in the Spurs' ability to build through the draft has wavered a bit, but they aren't going to punt every year and they are bound to stumble upon a few more ideal pieces with all the picks they have coming up, or to find a better player in trade. Stay the course, build a true juggernaut.

[Jordan Jackson]

yeah - ^ that sure doesn't sound dickish in any way mr expert

thanks for setting us all straight with your wisdom

Pay him no mind. Just know, if you’re on the opposite side of one of his takes - you’re probably on the right side of that debate.

[heyheymymy]

please no Trae Young

[heyheymymy]

DJM posted those eyeball emojis on his media a few days ago just like when SA traded him. In fact on the same date of that Spurs trade.

Turns out he had good info again.

[024]

Wonder what the Hawks' next moves are. Hoping to see them trade more rotation players out for picks. They get worse here but there's a large drop off between 9/10 and the rest of the teams in the East. Can't see this improving the owed pick to the Spurs by much especially with the Nets leaning into the tank and Bulls ready to blow it up.

Want to see them embrace a rebuild around Trae or even trade him... as long as it's not to the Spurs. Not sure if I oppose a Trae/Wemby pairing as I think the offense is there to outweigh Trae's defensive liabilities but it would be far better for the Hawks to trade Trae and the Spurs retain their pick.

[rankingtear]

Trae is the new Derozan with the era of mismatch hunting in the playoffs and crack down on foul baiting.

[99 Problems]

If the Spurs trade for Trae Young after drafting Stephon Castle and skipping Dilly, I'm out :lol

Albeit 5 million Trae posts on here is there any solid intel on how the PATFO value Trae? 25yoa, essentially a 25&10 career guy? Could we absorb him on D in a workable system?

[Knoxxx]

Castle is our PG so why fantasize about Trae still? Overall good news, ATL does not improve and seems more oriented towards a rebuild approach.

[SpursGenius]

I’d offer the Bulls pick, the most favorable pick in 2027 and 2030 and the 2031 T-Wolves pick for Lauri right now.
thank god you aint the gm LM is trash

[baseline bum]

I’d offer the Bulls pick, the most favorable pick in 2027 and 2030 and the 2031 T-Wolves pick for Lauri right now.

Would have to know he'd be willing to re-sign first, so Spurs would have to commit to a 5 year $270 million max contract offer. I think that's pretty rich for him even factoring in the 10% annual cap increases from the TV/streaming deal, but that's what he would cost.

[offset formation]

Would have to know he'd be willing to re-sign first, so Spurs would have to commit to a 5 year $270 million max contract offer. I think that's pretty rich for him even factoring in the 10% annual cap increases from the TV/streaming deal, but that's what he would cost.

No way Spurs ownership pay that -- the final year of LM's contract would include the pay hike Wemby is going to get and Castle's second contract. We'd have no cap space available for anyone else like Vassell, Sochan, etc.

[heyheymymy]

Yeah I'm cooling on Lauri

loved his effort on Finland national team, won me over

But his premium makes him kinda cost prohibitive

[mystargtr34]

Lauri has become slightly overrated the last year or two.

[The Truth #6]

Trade for Trae? "Yeah, I don't know about all that!" Laughs nervously.

[tbdog]

I was on team trade for Trae. But a combination of being convinced here and seeing how the team is being built, I am against the trading for Trae.

[z0sa]

Lauri has become slightly overrated the last year or two.

He's only hit 68 games once in his career, but last season he was close to a 50/40/90 guy (on 8 3PA and 5FTA a game, mind you). 23PPG, 8REB, about half of his FGA were 3's. If his cost was more reasonable, he'd be literally the perfect fit next to Wemby - a guy who can rebound, defend, make strong moves off the ball and actually nail the fuck out of 3s. I heard rumblings here that Utah tanked and put him away early, but at face his games played per season seems low and inconsistent. He'd be perfect here, but only if he wants to be second banana and take a big paycut. I don't see it happening at all.

[Bruno]

It isn't a great return for Murray which is good news for Spurs.

Young has publicly put some pressure on Hawks FO. If Hawks don't get better, he might ask to be traded. With that in mind, Hawks have mostly two options:
- Use these picks to do another trade to improve their team.
- Trade Young and rebuild around Jalen Johnson and Risacher. They can't do that without their picks back, Spurs will have to be involved directly or indirectly in a Young trade.

After having draft Castle, I don't see Spurs going after Trae young. Question is what team is interested in Young and what they might offer to Spurs to give Hawks their picks back?

[kobyz]

Hawks not done yet, they gonna use those assets to bring a win now player who is better fit next to Young than DJM

[kobyz]

I think Risacher starts in place of Hunter unless he really struggles in training camp and pre season.

Risacher starts at the two next to Hunter

[heyheymymy]

Just hope ATL doesn't swing Trae Young for some real difference makers next

But if that's the weak haul for DJ not sure if anything Trae can pull is going to level the Hawks up significantly. They really needed to get big returns from both and stack up.

Pretty tense times here because moving DJ shows the willingness and then Trae brings back a lot of value + opens up a massive 40MM or so opportunity in the salary. You could potentially really shake it up. Which ATL needs to do since they have no control of their picks future.

[kobyz]

It isn't a great return for Murray which is good news for Spurs.

Young has publicly put some pressure on Hawks FO. If Hawks don't get better, he might ask to be traded. With that in mind, Hawks have mostly two options:
- Use these picks to do another trade to improve their team.
- Trade Young and rebuild around Jalen Johnson and Risacher. They can't do that without their picks back, Spurs will have to be involved directly or indirectly in a Young trade.

After having draft Castle, I don't see Spurs going after Trae young. Question is what team is interested in Young and what they might offer to Spurs to give Hawks their picks back?

The only logical trade destination for Young is Orlando, so how a 3 teams trade would look in that scenario?

[heyheymymy]

As long as ATL doesn't pivot too well with Young next I like where they stand in regards to the 2025-2027 FRPs value

Perfect situation so far where the Hawks panic knowing they have no presence in the next few drafts and unloads corporate knowledge and continuity fwiw to make a big recourse to go all-in but ultimately falls short and lands in mediocrity with hamstrung flexibility.

Cmon baby just give me three seasons of misfires and disorganization from ATLFO and then you're free

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Weird that Dejounte fetched that little value, especially on his new contract (didn’t he have a trade kicker though?). Atlanta didn’t even wait longer, so perhaps the Lakers, supposedly Spurs and others interest in him hasn’t been that great.

I wouldn’t hate going after CJ McCollum, think he’d fit well on the Spurs and his expensive contract will expire before having to pay Wemby.

[Raven]

amazing trade for the pels tbh, it actually makes them one of the better teams in the league suddenly. If they trade ingram, of course, that changes everything, but regardless that was amazing value. Atlanta with nance and risacher clearly becomes a team with sense, where the TO machine becomes a 35% usage rate player if not more.

[T Park]

Don’t like the fit for the pelicans.

Hawks did ok with 2 firsts and one of the better on ball defenders.


The hawk’s however are one injury away from bottoming out

[RC_Drunkford]

It isn't a great return for Murray which is good news for Spurs.

Young has publicly put some pressure on Hawks FO. If Hawks don't get better, he might ask to be traded. With that in mind, Hawks have mostly two options:
- Use these picks to do another trade to improve their team.
- Trade Young and rebuild around Jalen Johnson and Risacher. They can't do that without their picks back, Spurs will have to be involved directly or indirectly in a Young trade.

After having draft Castle, I don't see Spurs going after Trae young. Question is what team is interested in Young and what they might offer to Spurs to give Hawks their picks back?

there's no reason in that 2nd scenario for the Spurs to trade the Hawks picks tbh. If they blow it up these are potential top 5 picks 3 years in a row. There's nobody worth trading those for.

[Raven]

Don’t like the fit for the pelicans.

Hawks did ok with 2 firsts and one of the better on ball defenders.


The hawk’s however are one injury away from bottoming out

why though?

[John B]

Not interested. Wake me up if it’s Markkanen’s turn to be traded.

[Bruno]

there's no reason in that 2nd scenario for the Spurs to trade the Hawks picks tbh. If they blow it up these are potential top 5 picks 3 years in a row. There's nobody worth trading those for.

This scenario isn't on the table. They will blow it up only if they get their picks back.

It is similar to what happen few days ago with Nets. They blew it up by trading Bridges only because they made a side trade with Rockets to get their picks back.

[Dejounte]

https://x.com/king_hawk38/status/1806776221113765952?s=46

Welcome home Trae!

[LeBowen]

Which team would even want Trae and has enough assets?

Magic - best fit and they've got picks and some pieces Hawks would want.
Heat - they don't have enough assets, but it's Riley, so who knows.
Clippers - I guess in some ridiculous three team scenario where a third team gets PG13 and gives up assets, but PG13's market isn't great right now.
Lakers - they don't have the assets.
Rockets - don't see it happening after they drafted Sheppard.
Jazz - doesn't seem like an Ainge player, but they certainly have the best package out of all these teams.
Spurs - ugh...

I'd say there's absolutely no chance any other team is interested.

[Dejounte]

Which team would even want Trae and has enough assets?

Magic - best fit and they've got picks and some pieces Hawks would want.
Heat - they don't have enough assets, but it's Riley, so who knows.
Clippers - I guess in some ridiculous three team scenario where a third team gets PG13 and gives up assets, but PG13's market isn't great right now.
Lakers - they don't have the assets.
Rockets - don't see it happening after they drafted Sheppard.
Jazz - doesn't seem like an Ainge player, but they certainly have the best package out of all these teams.
Spurs - ugh...

I'd say there's absolutely no chance any other team is interested.

It’s win now players from other teams or picks back from the Spurs. No in between.

[Dejounte]

Now that I’m thinking about it… why wouldn’t a Garland-Trae swap work?

[LeBowen]

It’s win now players from other teams or picks back from the Spurs. No in between.

The only two players I can think of that would be good for us are Markkenen and Jabari Smith Jr. But it's not happening.
I like Franz Wagner, but he's a bad shooter, doesn't fit.


Now that I’m thinking about it… why wouldn’t a Garland-Trae swap work?

Why would Cavs do that? The reason why they're moving off Garland is because Mitchell wants to be the primary ball-handler.
Trae is even worse off the ball than Garland.

[Dejounte]

The only two players I can think of that would be good for us are Markkenen and Jabari Smith Jr. But it's not happening.
I like Franz Wagner, but he's a bad shooter, doesn't fit.



Why would Cavs do that? The reason why they're moving off Garland is because Mitchell wants to be the primary ball-handler.
Trae is even worse off the ball than Garland.

I was talking about for the Hawks.

They’re either taking win now players for Trae (so that their picks we have won’t be high) or they’re giving us Trae back for their picks so they can properly control their destiny

[exstatic]

Wonder what the Hawks' next moves are. Hoping to see them trade more rotation players out for picks. They get worse here but there's a large drop off between 9/10 and the rest of the teams in the East. Can't see this improving the owed pick to the Spurs by much especially with the Nets leaning into the tank and Bulls ready to blow it up.

Want to see them embrace a rebuild around Trae or even trade him... as long as it's not to the Spurs. Not sure if I oppose a Trae/Wemby pairing as I think the offense is there to outweigh Trae's defensive liabilities but it would be far better for the Hawks to trade Trae and the Spurs retain their pick.

I’m not sure the Bulls are. They’ve never shown an appetite for that, not even for Wemby. We’ll have to wait and see, but they’re not in my “tank” column just yet.

[LeBowen]

I was talking about for the Hawks.

They’re either taking win now players for Trae (so that their picks we have won’t be high) or they’re giving us Trae back for their picks so they can properly control their destiny

Win-now players kind of don't make sense with Jalen and Risacher being the best players left on the roster.
I don't think Magic wants to give up Wagner or Banchero.
Heat doesn't have anything valuable except Bam.
Clippers are old.
Lakers don't have shit except AD.
Rockets are the only team that would make sense, but they drafted Sheppard.
Jazz aren't giving up Markkanen to get Trae and their other players are nothing special.
No other team is even going to entertain the idea of Trae.

The only way I can see it happening is if Hawks get their picks back, which Spurs hopefully won't do.

[CGD]

The only logical trade destination for Young is Orlando, so how a 3 teams trade would look in that scenario?

Right, it’s Orlando or maybe Lakers.

[CGD]

https://x.com/king_hawk38/status/1806776221113765952?s=46

Welcome home Trae!

Nooooooo!!!

[exstatic]

It isn't a great return for Murray which is good news for Spurs.

Young has publicly put some pressure on Hawks FO. If Hawks don't get better, he might ask to be traded. With that in mind, Hawks have mostly two options:
- Use these picks to do another trade to improve their team.
- Trade Young and rebuild around Jalen Johnson and Risacher. They can't do that without their picks back, Spurs will have to be involved directly or indirectly in a Young trade.

After having draft Castle, I don't see Spurs going after Trae young. Question is what team is interested in Young and what they might offer to Spurs to give Hawks their picks back?

They’re going to have to trade Trae within the calendar year, or he becomes a rental and loses even more value. His value is already low, so it makes no sense to become involved in a Trae trade as a 3rd party. Any 3rd party return will be mid at best, and probably crap, and not worth surrendering those picks.

[exstatic]

Hawks not done yet, they gonna use those assets to bring a win now player who is better fit next to Young than DJM

Young is already pressuring the FO, and becomes a rental next summer by virtue of his 2026 opt out. They have to move him within a calendar year. Makes no sense to bring in win now pieces, when the most likely ATL outcome is a Trae trade within 12 months.

[Raven]

They’re going to have to trade Trae within the calendar year, or he becomes a rental and loses even more value. His value is already low, so it makes no sense to become involved in a Trae trade as a 3rd party. Any 3rd party return will be mid at best, and probably crap, and not worth surrendering those picks.

i think that with this trade, they are committed to the TO machine for at least the next 5 years.

[exstatic]

This scenario isn't on the table. They will blow it up only if they get their picks back.

It is similar to what happen few days ago with Nets. They blew it up by trading Bridges only because they made a side trade with Rockets to get their picks back.

ATLANTA CAN’T MAKE SUCH A SIDE DEAL, BECAUSE THEY ARE PICK BARE. THEY ARE STUCK LIKE CHUCK.

There is a one year clock ticking on Trae becoming a rental, and losing even more value.

[exstatic]

i think that with this trade, they are committed to the TO machine for at least the next 5 years.

Trae is opting out in 2026 if they don’t trade him.

[baseline bum]

This scenario isn't on the table. They will blow it up only if they get their picks back.

It is similar to what happen few days ago with Nets. They blew it up by trading Bridges only because they made a side trade with Rockets to get their picks back.

Only worked because the Nets had the Suns picks and now the Rockets got them to hold Phoenix hostage and force a trade of Durant or Booker when they get sick of first round exits with a league leading payroll and mountains of luxury tax. Atlanta has nothing of the sort to make that kind of deal.

[LeBowen]

Trae can opt out, but what then?

He either accepts he has to take a paycut to actually compete or he goes to another treadmill team that is willing to offer him a full max.
Noone is competing with Trae on ~$60M a year.

[exstatic]

Only worked because the Nets had the Suns picks and now the Rockets got them to hold Phoenix hostage and force a trade of Durant or Booker when they get sick of first round exits with a league leading payroll and mountains of luxury tax. Atlanta has nothing of the sort to make that kind of deal.

THIS.

[Raven]

Trae can opt out, but what then?

He either accepts he has to take a paycut to actually compete or he goes to another treadmill team that is willing to offer him a full max.
Noone is competing with Trae on ~$60M a year.

yeah, no way he's going anywhere. He is not a respected player.

[baseline bum]

Trae can opt out, but what then?

He either accepts he has to take a paycut to actually compete or he goes to another treadmill team that is willing to offer him a full max.
Noone is competing with Trae on ~$60M a year.

Young will have no trouble finding someone to pay him the base salary of $48 million he'd be opting out of for 26-27 when the salary cap will keep rising 10% every year thanks to the 3x richer TV/streaming deal the league just negotiated starting in 25-26. Hawks are in a pretty bad place.

[baseline bum]

yeah, no way he's going anywhere. He is not a respected player.

His base salary he'll opt out of is $48 million in a year where the cap will be around $171 million. That's only a marginally higher percentage of the cap than the deal Anunoby just signed. He'll find that base salary bare minimum and get a 4 year deal.

[Raven]

His base salary he'll opt out of is $48 million in a year where the cap will be around $171 million. That's only a marginally higher percentage of the cap than the deal Anunoby just signed. He'll find that base salary bare minimum and get a 4 year deal.

sure but nobody considers him a franchise player or a plug in player. It's atlanta or nothing.

[baseline bum]

sure but nobody considers him a franchise player or a plug in player. It's atlanta or nothing.

Is Anunoby a franchise player? There is no way there won't be a market to pay Young at least what he opts out of.

[vander]

Pels got fleeced IMO, Dejuante is fools gold

Hoping the Hawks don't fleece the Spurs as well

[Raven]

Is Anunoby a franchise player? There is no way there won't be a market to pay Young at least what he opts out of.

anunoby can be plugged into any team, trae is a ball dominant player with 0 D and an awful personality. You either have him as you franchise player, or you don't have him. Maybe i can see it with a dominant big to rebound a lot, but man, it's a tall order. Like which team needs a player like that currently.. can't think of one. Philly maybe?

[baseline bum]

anunoby can be plugged into any team, trae is a ball dominant player with 0 D and an awful personality. You either have him as you franchise player, or you don't have him. Maybe i can see it with a dominant big to rebound a lot, but man, it's a tall order. Like which team needs a player like that currently.. can't think of one. Philly maybe?

Anunoby is also a China doll and still got that money.

[Spurs Homer]

Never seen so many people so confident in brian wright and what he would do with those valuable picks!

The picks the picks - do not give atlanta those picks -

sure - b wright is the pick/crack addict you want holding those crack/picks!

when has b wright ever used those picks to actually land a good player?

[exstatic]

Never seen so many people so confident in brian wright and what he would do with those valuable picks!

The picks the picks - do not give atlanta those picks -

sure - b wright is the pick/crack addict you want holding those crack/picks!

when has b wright ever used those picks to actually land a good player?

When there’s a good draft, and not a crap one like this year? 2025 and 2026 come to mind.

Also, if you think Wright is crap,why would you trust him to make the right trade?

[ginobilized]

I still have a hard time thinking that the Spurs really want Trae Young.
If they do, we would have exactly 1 player than can dribble against pressure. Getting into the offense quicker would solve a lot of problems. We took so many crappy late in the clock shots last season. Maybe Castle compensates for the lack of D?

My gut says they are more looking to grab Garland or maybe D'Aaron Fox in a 3-4 team blockbuster. The smokescreen could be that they are targeting a true lengthy forward here, though, I feel that position will be filled over the next 2 seasons.

[The Truth #6]

I just don't see SA trading for Trae. I feel like they are locked in with Castle as PG experiment for 2-3 years now. I think the Spurs are that rigid and think that long term, or whatever you want to call it. The Spurs are not making any splashy trades. I'm happy to be wrong.

As for Atlanta they may simply be accepting that the trade value for DJM and Trae is low and they got just the best they could get. They very well could be idiots and bungled these trade options. The video of them cheering ecstatically over drafting Risacher was odd. I think the Spurs are happy to let Atlanta continue to create their own problems and sit back and take their pics.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Yeah Trae wants out, he’s not an idiot he sees he’s surrounded by a bunch of scrubs and they just traded away Dejounte he knows damn well this team isn’t going to compete and doesn’t want to rot there any longer. Not sure if he’s going to the Spurs but I will be surprised if he’s in a Hawks uniform come October.

People that wouldn’t want Trae are bugging, he’s 25 years old and never has played in a structured system, Trae and Wemby would instantly be one of the most dynamic duos in the entire league.

[Spurs Homer]

When there’s a good draft, and not a crap one like this year? 2025 and 2026 come to mind.

Also, if you think Wright is crap,why would you trust him to make the right trade?

I have eyes - and I have seen the spurs roster...
wemby needs an all star next to him and all stars NEVER want to come here - this one does - so why not take a chance?

* oh yeah - 25/26

how are you so confident wright wont bungle those drafts?

[Pauleta14]

Weird that Dejounte fetched that little value, especially on his new contract (didn’t he have a trade kicker though?). Atlanta didn’t even wait longer, so perhaps the Lakers, supposedly Spurs and others interest in him hasn’t been that great.

I wouldn’t hate going after CJ McCollum, think he’d fit well on the Spurs and his expensive contract will expire before having to pay Wemby.

DJ is a nice player but he doesn't move the needle really. It's almost how he's always described

He's a great fit at NO tho, fills a need in a small market team

I read McCollum, who I like a lot too, is part of their untouchable core ...

[Pauleta14]

Don’t like the fit for the pelicans.



Why not?

He fills a need...

[Pauleta14]

Now that I’m thinking about it… why wouldn’t a Garland-Trae swap work?

How can you imagine Trae and Mitchell coexist??? :lol

[John B]

I have eyes - and I have seen the spurs roster...
wemby needs an all star next to him and all stars NEVER want to come here - this one does - so why not take a chance?

* oh yeah - 25/26

how are you so confident wright wont bungle those drafts?


That was before Wemby. Wemby is going to get stronger and better, and All Stars will be lining up. You don’t go All-In on the flop when you have a pocket Ace. Trae is no more than an off suit Jack. You wait for the sucker bets to keep pouring before you make the call.

You don’t bailout ATL and give back 2025 deep draft for Trae. It’s a win for Spurs not to help ATL and avoid a defensive liability Trae. A better player would come plus Spurs don’t help ATL get better.

[KingKev]

Please no Trae. Please no

I’ll become a Pels fan I swear.

[SpursDynasty85]

I always thought a Lavine for Trae Young would’ve been a decent trade. Now it probably won’t happen.

[Redshadows]

ATL now have their first-round picks from 2028 to 2031 and first-round picks in 2025 (via the Los Angeles Lakers), 2025 (via the Los Angeles Sacramento Kings), 2027 (via the worst pick between the Milwaukee Bucks and Pelicans).

They can make a trade for Lauri Markkanen if they can convince him to sign a new contract.

For instance, unprotected first-round picks form ATL in 2029 and 2031, first-round picks in 2025 from LAL and SAC, first-round picks in 2027 from MIL or NO for Lauri Markkanen.

[exstatic]

ATL now have their first-round picks from 2028 to 2031 and first-round picks in 2025 (via the Los Angeles Lakers), 2025 (via the Los Angeles Sacramento Kings), 2027 (via the worst pick between the Milwaukee Bucks and Pelicans).

They can make a trade for Lauri Markkanen.

For instance, unprotected first-round picks form ATL in 2029 and 2031, first-round picks in 2025 from LAL and SAC, first-round picks in 2027 from MIL or NO for Lauri Markkanen.

Yes, let’s trade a boatload of first round picks for a guy who squeeked into one ASG, because that worked SO well last time.

[RC_Drunkford]

I don‘t understand why people think Markkanen costs a Bridges to the Knicks type of package. He‘s on an expiring and Dejounte Murray was just traded for 2 firsts while being on a team friendly deal. Ainge will have to move Lauri sooner or later

[Indianman]

Dejounte what if you're seeing it the wrong way here, buddy.
What if instead of a Garland-Young swap, there is a Mitchell- Young swap? Would fulfill many needs across the teams. Or maybe I'm just fooling around with these thoughts in my head.

[SOMA Spur]

Feels like this was a home run for the Hawks on so many levels.

-The Owner - Gets them under the tax which he's insisted on.

-The Coach - loses DJ a lousy defender, makes space for Bufkin, now Daniels, much improved POA (plus Risacher's defense will be a plus eventually).

-Their Star - Trae's better by addition plus subtraction with DJ out. (unless he's traded in the next five minutes)

-The Fans - Get to keep Trae (for now). Trae's the fan favorite, he puts butts in seats.

-THE FO - scored a 25 unprotected fist and meh 27 first. That 25 Lakers unprotected looks nice. They are not really handcuffed by us having their picks now.

-Flexibility - Could still make a splash trading Trae, or just move pieces like Hunter or Capela (if they have positive value), or they could do nothing else and their team looks much improved in the present and future.

Here's Brad Rollin's emergency pod for Locked on Hawks regarding DJ. (Just saw Trae take down the Hawks logo on the Socials, so I'm guessing we'll have another Emergency Pod for him soon?)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uh3B2vbJYHM&list=PLCnyS4smiUeDOhWtyelPu-ky9kiJJ-w_s

[spurraider21]

I don‘t understand why people think Markkanen costs a Bridges to the Knicks type of package. He‘s on an expiring and Dejounte Murray was just traded for 2 firsts while being on a team friendly deal. Ainge will have to move Lauri sooner or later
Because ainge only makes these big trades if he absolutely rips somebody off

[RC_Drunkford]

Because ainge only makes these big trades if he absolutely rips somebody off

yeah but in this case, if he can't he'll get nothing

[BackHome]

I have eyes - and I have seen the spurs roster...
wemby needs an all star next to him and all stars NEVER want to come here - this one does - so why not take a chance?

* oh yeah - 25/26

how are you so confident wright wont bungle those drafts?

I call BS on him wanting to come to SA - I think he said that for two reason 1. He wanted to piss off the Spurs players by basically saying they don't know how to play basketball as they can't even throw a pass to Wemby. 2. He is just trying to use leverage to get him the best deal with the Hawks as far as money or them bringing in talent

[z0sa]

there's no reason in that 2nd scenario for the Spurs to trade the Hawks picks tbh. If they blow it up these are potential top 5 picks 3 years in a row. There's nobody worth trading those for.

There’s a lot of truth here, but I’m personally not yet convinced banking on another team’s player being injured will earn us any karma points from the basketball gods.

Even if they do trade Young, we’re still banking on them tanking successfully for years when they probably still get value to make a playin run in a weak East with plenty of teams tanking.

[Ariel]

Dejounte (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=51342) what if you're seeing it the wrong way here, buddy.
What if instead of a Garland-Young swap, there is a Mitchell- Young swap? Would fulfill many needs across the teams. Or maybe I'm just fooling around with these thoughts in my head.
Worst trade in Cleveland's history. FO should be fired on the spot. Trae and Garland together? :lol

[scott]

Reporting is that Utah will listen to offers for Lauri, but they don't really want to trade him.

I interpret this as Utah definitely wants to trade him and Ainge is just setting things up for maximum return. Apparently teams are already lining up.

I have felt that a Siakam-like deal was what it would take... but now that I sleep on it a little more I think Kevin is correct and this will take something more like the deal Atlanta gave us for DJM, partly due to the Ainge factor.

Lauri is so perfect... but that is a lot to give up. So long as you keep at least one pick in each year going forward... I think I'd do it. Picks are overvalued when it's this FO who will eventually have to do something with them.

[exstatic]

Reporting is that Utah will listen to offers for Lauri, but they don't really want to trade him.

I interpret this as Utah definitely wants to trade him and Ainge is just setting things up for maximum return. Apparently teams are already lining up.

I have felt that a Siakam-like deal was what it would take... but now that I sleep on it a little more I think Kevin is correct and this will take something more like the deal Atlanta gave us for DJM, partly due to the Ainge factor.

Lauri is so perfect... but that is a lot to give up. So long as you keep at least one pick in each year going forward... I think I'd do it. Picks are overvalued when it's this FO who will eventually have to do something with them.

I keep coming back to…

Every team he was on got better when he left. He might just be a tall better shooting version of Dejounte, a guy who doesn’t move the needle. An All Star imposter. If you’re looking for a shooting forward, just go get Cam Johnson. He’s a better shooter, and would be much cheaper.

[RC_Drunkford]

I keep coming back to…

Every team he was on got better when he left. He might just be a tall better shooting version of Dejounte, a guy who doesn’t move the needle. An All Star imposter. If you’re looking for a shooting forward, just go get Cam Johnson. He’s a better shooter, and would be much cheaper.

Jalen Smith is a free agent!!!!

[R. DeMurre]

I actually like Dyson Daniels, but I think it's noteworthy to point out his archetype similarity to Castle. In the G league, DD was a good defender with size who could handle the ball and pass, but shot 25% from three, and people said if he ever developed an outside shot he might be a star. In the last two seasons, his 3pt% has improved, up to 31%. He's still young and improving, but he was still the 3rd string PG for New Orleans. I'm rooting for Castle, but I think people who are absolutely certain of his future success are definitely overselling him.

[Kevin]

Reporting is that Utah will listen to offers for Lauri, but they don't really want to trade him.

I interpret this as Utah definitely wants to trade him and Ainge is just setting things up for maximum return. Apparently teams are already lining up.

I have felt that a Siakam-like deal was what it would take... but now that I sleep on it a little more I think Kevin (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=52570) is correct and this will take something more like the deal Atlanta gave us for DJM, partly due to the Ainge factor.

Lauri is so perfect... but that is a lot to give up. So long as you keep at least one pick in each year going forward... I think I'd do it. Picks are overvalued when it's this FO who will eventually have to do something with them.

After the Dilly deal the Spurs are more loaded with picks than ever. Go get Trae and Lauri! Hawks picks for Trae. Best pick of 2027 and 2030 plus the 2031 Wolves pick and the Spurs own 2031 pick unprotected. Heck I’ll throw in the Bulls pick since it’s looking like they might blow it up and tank anyway.

[exstatic]

I actually like Dyson Daniels, but I think it's noteworthy to point out his archetype similarity to Castle. In the G league, DD was a good defender with size who could handle the ball and pass, but shot 25% from three, and people said if he ever developed an outside shot he might be a star. In the last two seasons, his 3pt% has improved, up to 31%. He's still young and improving, but he was still the 3rd string PG for New Orleans. I'm rooting for Castle, but I think people who are absolutely certain of his future success are definitely overselling him.

Please never compare the gleague to an elite NCAA program.

One of Daniels problems was that he couldn’t get time. That won’t be an issue with Castle.

[baseline bum]

I don‘t understand why people think Markkanen costs a Bridges to the Knicks type of package. He‘s on an expiring and Dejounte Murray was just traded for 2 firsts while being on a team friendly deal. Ainge will have to move Lauri sooner or later

Does he not want to re-sign there? Is Ainge not offering that fifth year?

[scott]

After the Dilly deal the Spurs are more loaded with picks than ever. Go get Trae and Lauri! Hawks picks for Trae. Best pick of 2027 and 2030 plus the 2031 Wolves pick and the Spurs own 2031 pick unprotected. Heck I’ll throw in the Bulls pick since it’s looking like they might blow it up and tank anyway.

I believe there is a way to add two stars now, but from a cap perspective one of them needs to be an older Vet on his last big deal, something like a 3-year max for PG13. That way the Vet's max is rolling off when you need to start paying Wemby his max in addition to potentially Vassell's next deal.

Trae and Lauri doesn't work (IMO, completely ignoring on-the-court fit and just looking at salary) because if it works (and why would you do it if it doesn't work?) then you'll be forced to break it up in order to resign Wemby. At least with a PG13-like deal, you know it's short term.

But rather than a second Max with Lauri, I'd rather us trade for him and then go for a Khris Middleton-like player. Old, more short-term, but not a max player. I don't like Klay AT ALL, but even someone like him would be a better fit.

Castle
Vassell
Middleton or Klay
Lauri
Wemby

Now you have a starting lineup with better spacing and you're not pairing Castle with another poor shooter in Sochan.

[scott]

Does he not want to re-sign there? Is Ainge not offering that fifth year?

The story has been that Lauri isn't interested in being part of a tank, and by loading up on even more rookies (they just took 3 who I would all expect to get serious playing time this year, in addition to their two second year guys) and having their upcoming draft picks... hard to see the Jazz doing anything but continuing to tank.

[scott]

For anyone concerned about paying Lauri... he's going to sign a max deal next year, he's a max-level player in this NBA. If you don't want him because you don't think he's good enough, then that's fine. But if you want him, you're going to have to pay the max, because that's what he is. This is going to be true of any "second star". We have to get used to this idea and not be afraid of a massive deal.

IMO, Lauri is definitely worth the max he'll command and is THE perfect fit based on on-the-court fit AND availability. There might be other max players who you think would be better to add, but are any of them actually able to be acquired? Luka, SGA, Giannis, Maxey, Halli, etc, etc, etc. are NOT getting traded. Lauri, on the other hand, you can get. Trae Young is the other most-available player, and we all generally agree we don't want him.

[Dejounte]

Tbh I don’t get this notion of “we all generally don’t want Trae”. There was a Trae thread during the season where at least half of the posters in it were OK with getting Trae. Not sure why that would change now.

[heyheymymy]

Kinda felt like Utah even tried to replace Lauri's type to some degree with Williams and Flip

Probably reading too much into it but feels like preparations

[scott]

Tbh I don’t get this notion of “we all generally don’t want Trae”. There was a Trae thread during the season where at least half of the posters in it were OK with getting Trae. Not sure why that would change now.

Fire up the poll machine!

Maybe it's just selective bias, but it seems like the majority of the board are against.

[Kevin]

I believe there is a way to add two stars now, but from a cap perspective one of them needs to be an older Vet on his last big deal, something like a 3-year max for PG13. That way the Vet's max is rolling off when you need to start paying Wemby his max in addition to potentially Vassell's next deal.

Trae and Lauri doesn't work (IMO, completely ignoring on-the-court fit and just looking at salary) because if it works (and why would you do it if it doesn't work?) then you'll be forced to break it up in order to resign Wemby. At least with a PG13-like deal, you know it's short term.

But rather than a second Max with Lauri, I'd rather us trade for him and then go for a Khris Middleton-like player. Old, more short-term, but not a max player. I don't like Klay AT ALL, but even someone like him would be a better fit.

Castle
Vassell
Middleton or Klay
Lauri
Wemby

Now you have a starting lineup with better spacing and you're not pairing Castle with another poor shooter in Sochan.

If the Spurs have to make room for Trae/Wemby/Lauri Dev goes to create space. Wemby being on his rookie makes this big three affordable for the next three years.

[scott]

Kinda felt like Utah even tried to replace Lauri's type to some degree with Williams and Flip

Probably reading too much into it but feels like preparations

I think Lauri would fit well with Cody and with Taylor Hendricks... but not really with both. I assume Utah will eventually want Cody/Hendrix/Kessler as their starting front court.

Flip is a nice bench prospect, but he doesn't really figure into this.

I think you can see Utah's young tank core forming...

Collier
George
Cody
Hendricks
Kessler

All first, second and third year guys with potential. Clarkson off the bench for vet leadership, let them scrap it out to see who is a keeper. Those who don't rate, you move to the bench or two another team and replace with more incoming draft picks.

This is what the Spurs would be doing if we didn't land Wemby, and it is the right approach to rebuilding until you find your star, IMO. Spurs are just lucky that we got Wemby and are past that stage.

[scott]

If the Spurs have to make room for Trae/Wemby/Lauri Dev goes to create space. Wemby being on his rookie makes this big three affordable for the next three years.

Yes... they'll be affordable for the next three years, but not after that. That's my point. You'll be paying a premium for Trae and Lauri's youth, but not able to take advantage of it because you'll have to break them up when Wemby's extension kicks in.

[z0sa]

I believe there is a way to add two stars now, but from a cap perspective one of them needs to be an older Vet on his last big deal, something like a 3-year max for PG13. That way the Vet's max is rolling off when you need to start paying Wemby his max in addition to potentially Vassell's next deal.

Trae and Lauri doesn't work (IMO, completely ignoring on-the-court fit and just looking at salary) because if it works (and why would you do it if it doesn't work?) then you'll be forced to break it up in order to resign Wemby. At least with a PG13-like deal, you know it's short term.

But rather than a second Max with Lauri, I'd rather us trade for him and then go for a Khris Middleton-like player. Old, more short-term, but not a max player. I don't like Klay AT ALL, but even someone like him would be a better fit.

Castle
Vassell
Middleton or Klay
Lauri
Wemby

Now you have a starting lineup with better spacing and you're not pairing Castle with another poor shooter in Sochan.

One can only dream. That team, even in its first season together would be legit 2nd rounder fodder :lol

Only thing that scares me about Lauri is his lack of GP. He's had as many seasons with games played in the 50s as the 60s. If he could do 65+ every year, I'd say it's a no brainer even at max and let the rest of the pieces fall where they may.

[Redshadows]

ATL now have their first-round picks from 2028 to 2031 and first-round picks in 2025 (via the Los Angeles Lakers), 2025 (via the Los Angeles Sacramento Kings), 2027 (via the worst pick between the Milwaukee Bucks and Pelicans).

They can make a trade for Lauri Markkanen if they can convince him to sign a new contract.

For instance, unprotected first-round picks form ATL in 2029 and 2031, first-round picks in 2025 from LAL and SAC, first-round picks in 2027 from MIL or NO for Lauri Markkanen.

I assume if ATL could not get their picks back from the Spurs while Trae Young threaten ATL that he want to be traded if the team don't become better enough.

ATL can't tank without those picks from the Spurs, so they might have to become more aggressive to get a star level player even if the trade cost more than usual.

[SpursFan86]

I keep coming back to…

Every team he was on got better when he left. He might just be a tall better shooting version of Dejounte, a guy who doesn’t move the needle. An All Star imposter. If you’re looking for a shooting forward, just go get Cam Johnson. He’s a better shooter, and would be much cheaper.

What am I missing here? Markannen didn’t really break out until the 2022-2023 season. Since then, pretty much every metric points to him being a considerably high impact player and the Jazz are far better with him on the court (+10 net rating over the past 2 seasons vs. when he’s not playing).

I also don’t know if Cam Johnson is a better shooter at this point. Over the past 2 seasons they’ve shot pretty much identically from 3 but Lauri has done it on more volume. Lauri has a better mid-range game too although neither of them take many attempts there. Lauri gets to the FT line at a better rate and has more of a game outside of 3 point shooting.

If you want to argue that Markannen isn’t worth giving up X, or that player Y is a better target at cost, then that’s fine. But acting like Markannen is some scrub who puts up empty stats or that he wouldn’t make this team considerably better is a little ridiculous. He’s pretty much the picture perfect PF to pair alongside Wemby.

[R. DeMurre]

Please never compare the gleague to an elite NCAA program.

One of Daniels problems was that he couldn’t get time. That won’t be an issue with Castle.

Scouting involves comparisons, and you can only compare what's available. there's no avoiding it. Using your logic, I couldn't compare Kentucky player Kevin Knox in 2018 to the G-league showing of Derrick White.

[Kevin]

Yes... they'll be affordable for the next three years, but not after that. That's my point. You'll be paying a premium for Trae and Lauri's youth, but not able to take advantage of it because you'll have to break them up when Wemby's extension kicks in.

Front load Lauri’s deal as much as possible. Back load Wemby’s deal as much as possible. Off load Dev for picks after the three year window is complete. I think they can keep it together for 5-7 years.

I know people want some unquestionable 20 year title window but no such thing exists.

[RC_Drunkford]

Paying Lauri makes only sense if you front load his deal. That way you have more cap room when Wemby gets extended and Markkanen‘s contract becomes a decent one.

As of Trae Young, it depends on the price. He could make sense, but do not give away the 25 ATL or Spurs picks. No way. And if you extend him frontload that deal too.

[baseline bum]

For anyone concerned about paying Lauri... he's going to sign a max deal next year, he's a max-level player in this NBA. If you don't want him because you don't think he's good enough, then that's fine. But if you want him, you're going to have to pay the max, because that's what he is. This is going to be true of any "second star". We have to get used to this idea and not be afraid of a massive deal.

IMO, Lauri is definitely worth the max he'll command and is THE perfect fit based on on-the-court fit AND availability. There might be other max players who you think would be better to add, but are any of them actually able to be acquired? Luka, SGA, Giannis, Maxey, Halli, etc, etc, etc. are NOT getting traded. Lauri, on the other hand, you can get. Trae Young is the other most-available player, and we all generally agree we don't want him.

I'm kind of lukewarm on him, especially for what he'll cost in both draft capital and in dollars. Booker would be my favorite target but it'll require Phoenix dumping Durant to Houston first.

[baseline bum]

Paying Lauri makes only sense if you front load his deal. That way you have more cap room when Wemby gets extended and Markkanen‘s contract becomes a decent one.

As of Trae Young, it depends on the price. He could make sense, but do not give away the 25 ATL or Spurs picks. No way. And if you extend him frontload that deal too.

Nah he's going to demand 5 year max and he'll have all the leverage to get it since the Spurs would have traded a ton to get him.

[Ice009]

I'm not a big on Lauri Markkanen. I don't think anyone one ever thought he was anything like a top 3 player on a Championship team a few years ago. I know he's improved a lot since then, but still, don't know I'd want to pay him the type of money he'll likely ask for and get. I could be wrong, but I'd say no if it were my choice.

[exstatic]

What am I missing here? Markannen didn’t really break out until the 2022-2023 season. Since then, pretty much every metric points to him being a considerably high impact player and the Jazz are far better with him on the court (+10 net rating over the past 2 seasons vs. when he’s not playing).

I also don’t know if Cam Johnson is a better shooter at this point. Over the past 2 seasons they’ve shot pretty much identically from 3 but Lauri has done it on more volume. Lauri has a better mid-range game too although neither of them take many attempts there. Lauri gets to the FT line at a better rate and has more of a game outside of 3 point shooting.

If you want to argue that Markannen isn’t worth giving up X, or that player Y is a better target at cost, then that’s fine. But acting like Markannen is some scrub who puts up empty stats or that he wouldn’t make this team considerably better is a little ridiculous. He’s pretty much the picture perfect PF to pair alongside Wemby.


I kinda was doing that. Markannen isn’t a scrub, but Cam is under team control for three more years at like $21M. I don’t think Lauri is twice as good, but he’ll cost twice as much, plus more picks to get.

[spurraider21]

What am I missing here? Markannen didn’t really break out until the 2022-2023 season. Since then, pretty much every metric points to him being a considerably high impact player and the Jazz are far better with him on the court (+10 net rating over the past 2 seasons vs. when he’s not playing).

I also don’t know if Cam Johnson is a better shooter at this point. Over the past 2 seasons they’ve shot pretty much identically from 3 but Lauri has done it on more volume. Lauri has a better mid-range game too although neither of them take many attempts there. Lauri gets to the FT line at a better rate and has more of a game outside of 3 point shooting.

If you want to argue that Markannen isn’t worth giving up X, or that player Y is a better target at cost, then that’s fine. But acting like Markannen is some scrub who puts up empty stats or that he wouldn’t make this team considerably better is a little ridiculous. He’s pretty much the picture perfect PF to pair alongside Wemby.
Lauri gets to the line a lot because he's also excelling at punishing closeouts and is a very aggressive dunker when driving down the lane

[scott]

I'm kind of lukewarm on him, especially for what he'll cost in both draft capital and in dollars. Booker would be my favorite target but it'll require Phoenix dumping Durant to Houston first.

I'd personally put Booker in my list of players who aren't available and probably won't come available, at least not for San Antonio. If he gets traded, it will probably be because he demands a trade to a big market. I could be wrong, but that's my feeling on booker.

[scott]

Lauri is significantly better than someone like Cam Johnson - like, the difference between a max player and a $21MM year player (which will clearly play out, next off season). This is easily borne out in the advanced stats in addition to the counting stats. Cam Johnson is a good choice if you truly feel like Vassell is a second star and you want to fill the team with role players. At that point you're basically going the Solo Superstar Model around Wemby. Maybe that's the right build... Wemby is definitely special enough.

I will say Cam Johnson's $21MM/yr is a much better deal than Zach Collins' $17MM/year.

[TrainOfThought5]

Front load Lauri’s deal as much as possible. Back load Wemby’s deal as much as possible. Off load Dev for picks after the three year window is complete. I think they can keep it together for 5-7 years.

I know people want some unquestionable 20 year title window but no such thing exists.

Let me tell you about a guy named Tim Duncan.

[spurraider21]

Tbh I don’t get this notion of “we all generally don’t want Trae”. There was a Trae thread during the season where at least half of the posters in it were OK with getting Trae. Not sure why that would change now.
makes less sense with castle. Trae is a small harden. needs spacing/shooting around him.

[BackHome]

Lauri gets to the line a lot because he's also excelling at punishing closeouts and is a very aggressive dunker when driving down the lane

Lauris is a good player my only issue with him is his injury history which is why I didn't want him when Chicago was shopping him around.

[Spurs Homer]

I call BS on him wanting to come to SA - I think he said that for two reason 1. He wanted to piss off the Spurs players by basically saying they don't know how to play basketball as they can't even throw a pass to Wemby. 2. He is just trying to use leverage to get him the best deal with the Hawks as far as money or them bringing in talent

He wasnt wrong - he played against the spurs and sochan,vassell, tre jones, et al - missed lob after lob after pass after pass after lob -

even in that 1 game against the hawks...

he also tried to befriend wemby at the all star game and has been pretty open about his admiration of wemby - even going so far as to explain how he is not just a one dimensional player and would do whatever a team needed - whether it was just facilitating or as a scorer -

not really a mystery

[R. DeMurre]

What am I missing here? Markannen didn’t really break out until the 2022-2023 season. Since then, pretty much every metric points to him being a considerably high impact player and the Jazz are far better with him on the court (+10 net rating over the past 2 seasons vs. when he’s not playing).

I also don’t know if Cam Johnson is a better shooter at this point. Over the past 2 seasons they’ve shot pretty much identically from 3 but Lauri has done it on more volume. Lauri has a better mid-range game too although neither of them take many attempts there. Lauri gets to the FT line at a better rate and has more of a game outside of 3 point shooting.

If you want to argue that Markannen isn’t worth giving up X, or that player Y is a better target at cost, then that’s fine. But acting like Markannen is some scrub who puts up empty stats or that he wouldn’t make this team considerably better is a little ridiculous. He’s pretty much the picture perfect PF to pair alongside Wemby.


Agreed. I think it's clear he's easily a top 30 player in the league, and at the very least rates at a level with Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordon, Tyrese Maxey, Kyrie Irving, or whoever you consider the #2 guys on Minnesota, Indiana, or most other playoff teams... The Spurs have their #1 guy in Wemby, so if Lauri and someone else are 2a & 2b, they're in the conversation for going beyond the 2nd round of the playoffs. Anyone who thinks he's one dimensional hasn't been watching him the last two seasons and is letting vague impressions of his years from ages 20-23 cloud their perception. He's the only guy in NBA history to have 200 3 pointers and 100 dunks in one season, his midrange percentages are excellent, and his offensive win shares last year were higher than Tatum and Curry. His pairing with Victor would be a match made in heaven.

[Chomag]

I wouldn’t hate going after CJ McCollum, think he’d fit well on the Spurs and his expensive contract will expire before having to pay Wemby.
This, I have no idea why CJ never seems to get any buzz here. I feel like he would be a great fit on this roster.

[TD 21]

I thought the Hawks would get more, but it's not as bad as it's being made out to be either.


I don't think Dyson Daniels was that much worse than Dejounte Murray last season - he actually graded out as a more impactful player. People are underestimating just how terrible Dejounte was last season. Larry Nance has consistently graded out as a positive player. Now they take Murray's wasted possessions where he chucks a mid-range jumper and shunt them to Trae who's a way better playmaker; I think that Hawks team fits better on paper now with how their role players work around Trae. They're not going very far in the post-season, but it's a tall order to expect them to be a bottom tier team.

Agreed, though the roster isn't settled. Hunter, Capela and Nance Jr. are all trade candidates.


I actually like Dyson Daniels, but I think it's noteworthy to point out his archetype similarity to Castle. In the G league, DD was a good defender with size who could handle the ball and pass, but shot 25% from three, and people said if he ever developed an outside shot he might be a star. In the last two seasons, his 3pt% has improved, up to 31%. He's still young and improving, but he was still the 3rd string PG for New Orleans. I'm rooting for Castle, but I think people who are absolutely certain of his future success are definitely overselling him.

I utilized him, among many others, to illustrate the relatively low ceiling (in relation to where they're often selected) / high bust rate archetype of this style of player, but most were too busy guzzling the Spurs mystique Kool-Aid to adhere to it.

Daniels is also taller, longer, more athletic and provides "event creation" defensively and is still a non starter, who'd have a tough time playing more than spot minutes in the playoffs if he were on a championship contender.

[Mr. Body]

I like the ATL trade in a vacuum, wiping away memory of what they spent to take Dejounte. Dyson will be a nice fit, not demanding the ball and giving near-elite defense alongside Trae's shortcomings. Nance is a nice impactful player. Those two picks will defray the loss of their own picks.

And the team returns to being Trae centric. He'll love that.

For our purposes, it just takes another Trae injury to get a great pick, as they don't have a secondary playmaker to pick up the slack.

[baseline bum]

I'd personally put Booker in my list of players who aren't available and probably won't come available, at least not for San Antonio. If he gets traded, it will probably be because he demands a trade to a big market. I could be wrong, but that's my feeling on booker.

I don't think he'll be available this year, but Phoenix is going to eventually blow it up and probably after another disappointing season this year. Their payroll is just insane and 5-seed in the west is probably their ceiling. I expect them to trade Durant to Houston, try to stubbornly hold onto Booker, realize they're not going anywhere without a total rebuild, and then finally move him in a Bridges like deal.

[baseline bum]

Agreed. I think it's clear he's easily a top 30 player in the league, and at the very least rates at a level with Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordon, Tyrese Maxey, Kyrie Irving, or whoever you consider the #2 guys on Minnesota, Indiana, or most other playoff teams... The Spurs have their #1 guy in Wemby, so if Lauri and someone else are 2a & 2b, they're in the conversation for going beyond the 2nd round of the playoffs. Anyone who thinks he's one dimensional hasn't been watching him the last two seasons and is letting vague impressions of his years from ages 20-23 cloud their perception. He's the only guy in NBA history to have 200 3 pointers and 100 dunks in one season, his midrange percentages are excellent, and his offensive win shares last year were higher than Tatum and Curry. His pairing with Victor would be a match made in heaven.

What would you be willing to give up to land him? Let's say Ainge has rebuffed every offer and you can make him one final offer. Let's assume Lauri says he'll sign a 5 year max contract before July 1st 2025 and thus never hits free agency.

[Seventyniner]

If the Hawks can get a bunch of picks from another team for Young, could they offer the Spurs enough non-Hawks draft capital to get the Spurs to take it in return for the Hawks regaining control over their next three drafts? It would be in the same vein as the Rockets/Nets deal.

There has to be a point at which the Spurs say yes, though it might not be possible for the Hawks to get there. The picks the Hawks got in the Dejounte trade help towards this end, though, and it's possible that's exactly why they traded Dejounte.

[Mr. Body]

If the Hawks can get a bunch of picks from another team for Young, could they offer the Spurs enough non-Hawks draft capital to get the Spurs to take it in return for the Hawks regaining control over their next three drafts? It would be in the same vein as the Rockets/Nets deal.

There has to be a point at which the Spurs say yes, though it might not be possible for the Hawks to get there. The picks the Hawks got in the Dejounte trade help towards this end, though, and it's possible that's exactly why they traded Dejounte.

Theoretically, yes, but I don't think contenders have enough picks to tip the balance like that.