Is Rasho Really A Presence on Defense?

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I know that Rasho has good play on the defensive end has been said so many times it has become relative fact on these boards, but I really question it. Look, when I see Rasho in game situations I do notice the occasional good play, but overall I really dont see what you guys see. Rasho still gives up easy shots in the paint, and he has no lateral movement, I mean come on that's one of the biggest knocks on Rasho--he is so slow. When Rasho leaves the paint to do zone rotations he is such a liability on defense, and I generally feel that he isn't much better in the paint. I suppose my biggest qualm with Rasho is that he has no intensity, how can you be 7 feet tall and get outrebounded by Tashuan Prince? It's not because Prince is just somehow an amazing rebounder, it's because he has hustle.

Why Rasho seems to have no motivation is beyond me, and for that reason above all others I fail to see his contribution on defense. Perhaps it's not qunatifiable, maybe blocks and rebounds just arent a stat that reflects his overall production on the defensive end, but isnt that the staple of a defensive center? Perhaps it is nit picking to expect every player on the spurs to play at an elite level, but frankly I wonder if Chris Mihm wouldnt be a better fit in our system. You Rasho supporters will probably say that he (Mihm) truly sucks at defensem, but i think the beauty of Pop's system is that it doesn't rely on great individual talent, just the quickness and smarts a guys needs to follow make good rotations and challenge every shot. If a guy with some real intensity was here and went through a spurs training camp im sure he would be a much better defender than Rasho.

Alright fire away (sorry angel)

[GO SPurs Go]

Ok........., first of all Pop isn't gonna make ANY roster changes before the playoffs unless the deal is unbelievably good. Second, Prince gets more rebounds because A. he plays about an average of ten more minutes than Rasho and second, his legendary long arms. I wouldn't be surprised if he nearly matched Rasho's vertical jump.

[Dre_7]

Ok........., first of all Pop isn't gonna make ANY roster changes before the playoffs unless the deal is unbelievably good. Second, Prince gets more rebounds because A. he plays about an average of ten more minutes than Rasho and second, his legendary long arms. I wouldn't be surprised if he nearly matched Rasho's vertical jump.

There will be no deals because the trade deadline has passed.

[T Park]

Can't argue with any of it.

Too late to make a deal now though.

I don't think hes movable though. He was on the market, no one bit.

Barry as well.

Stuck, is the nickname for Rahsho.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I didnt say anything about a Roster change, I was all for waiving Rasho last summer with the Allen Houston rule because I doubt he could bring back any player. I just dont think Rasho is a good defender. As far as Tayshaun's arms, this is just another excuse to me for Rasho's play, did Dennis Rodman have long arms? Its about hustle.

[Kori Ellis]

I still think Rasho is much better defender than Nazr. Rasho doesn't miss his rotations often and knows what to do on D and does it. It always appears teams score a lot less in the paint with Rasho in than Nazr. I always advocated starting Rasho because Nazr was always in the wrong place on D and gave up a lot more points/rebounds than he produced. But now that Nazr is picking it up on the offensive end, his D is easier to live with and he deserves to be the starter.

In the end, they need them both to be successful because it lets the Spurs be versatile and use a variety of lineups.

And I'm glad they didn't trade Rasho because Nazr might walk this summer and then the Spurs would be left with Oberto.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I think a hungry athletic kid straight from college would be a better player than Rasho. Just my opinion, I always thought it was the other was around--that teams scored more in the paint with Rasho on the floor.

[Dre_7]

As far as the Center situation goes. Niether Rasho nor Nazr are that great. I personally think Nazr is a little bit better suited for the starting spot on this team.

I still think DRob could come out of retirement and be a great backup (heck maybe even starting) Center for the Spurs. :D

[Kori Ellis]

I think a hungry athletic kid straight from college would be a better player than Rasho. Just my opinion, I always thought it was the other was around--that teams scored more in the paint with Rasho on the floor.

I don't know the stats on it, but I think the Spurs get destroyed in the paint normally when Nazr sees a lot of time.

Even last night the Suns had 56 in the paint with Nazr logging major minutes. (I realize it doesn't matter because he came up big on O though).

[Dre_7]

Is it true that when SA signed Rasho, Brad Miller was also available?

[timvp]

I think Rasho's D is a little overrated on these boards because even though he's a good defender, he's a horrible defensive rebounder so that negates most of his effectiveness.

[5ToolMan]

When Rasho was in the lineup in as a starter in 2004, 2005 and 2006 the Spurs always had among the best FG% defenses in the league. The Spurs FG% defense was pretty consistant with Rasho playing beside a healthy Tim, beside a hobbled Tim and for a few games without Tim.

In the last 7 games with Nazr starting the biggest concern beyond Tim's health is the skyrocketing FG% of the Spurs opponents. I will acknowledge that Nazr may need more time to adjust to playing defense more with the starters, and that his offensive and rebounding production are a plus. But it is a given that the Spurs play better defense with Rasho on the floor.

[Kori Ellis]

Is it true that when SA signed Rasho, Brad Miller was also available?

Yes but if they signed Miller then I think they would have had trouble making room for Manu/Tony's new contracts.

[Slinkyman]

some spurs fans think Rasho is a good defender but no nba analysts nor nba gms or coaches think so. Even in this era of bad nba centers Rasho's name has never ever come up for all nba defense and he's never received a single vote from a coach for the all defensive team. He's an average defender at best playing on a great defensive team.

[Kori Ellis]

some spurs fans think Rasho is a good defender but no nba analysts nor nba gms or coaches think so. Even in this era of bad nba centers Rasho's name has never ever come up for all nba defense and he's never received a single vote from a coach for the all defensive team. He's an average defender at best playing on a great defensive team.

I don't think anyone here thinks that he's All-Defensive Team quality. Just that he's a much better system defender than Nazr has been.

[angel_luv]

Rasho doesn't miss his rotations often and knows what to do on D and does it.

I agree.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I suppose that is a valid point, there has been a jump in opposin field goal percentage of late, not sure if that is just playing the suns twice lately or what but its worhty of note

[Dre_7]

I think Nazr is better offensively than Rasho.

Rasho is a better defender, but I dont think that he's a "much better" defender. If Rasho could rebound he would be much better. But he cant. And a 7 footer that cant rebound really bugs me.

[Dre_7]

I suppose that is a valid point, there has been a jump in opposin field goal percentage of late, not sure if that is just playing the suns twice lately or what but its worhty of note

Or maybe its Duncans foot. I think if Rasho had remained starter, opp. fg% would still have gone up.

[angel_luv]

It seems like Timmy takes a lot of rebounds when he is on the floor.

Does anyone know how many rebounds Rasho and Nazr averagae when they play with Tim?

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

It basically comes down to a choice between rebounding or defense. I say bench Manu and play a starting line up of Parker, Bowen, Duncan, Nazr and Rasho. :spin

[Slinkyman]

I don't think anyone here thinks that he's All-Defensive Team quality. Just that he's a much better system defender than Nazr has been.

some people here think Rasho's D>Timmy's D. If i wasn't so lazy i'd go find the thread but a while back someone asked to rate each players' D 1-10 and alot of people were giving Rasho a 9s and 10s :lol Sad thing is they were giving Tim 6s and 7s!

[angel_luv]

It basically comes down to a choice between rebounding or defense. I say bench Manu and play a starting line up of Parker, Bowen, Duncan, Nazr and Rasho. :spin


That's too many big guys.

As long as Rasho gets and makes good use of his minutes (as he normally does), it is immaterial to me whether he starts or not.

I felt the same way when Gino got benched- although naturally I was disappointed for both him and Sho.

And I am very pleased that Nazr is coming into his own. That makes our team all the better.

[Bruno]

It seems like Timmy takes a lot of rebounds when he is on the floor.

Does anyone know how many rebounds Rasho and Nazr averagae when they play with Tim?

For Rasho :
- with Tim : 8.2 reb/40min
- without Tim : 7.3 reb/40min

For Nazr :
- with Tim : 11.8 reb/40min
- without Tim : 13.6 reb/40min

For Duncan :
- with Rasho : 13.5 reb/40min
- with Nazr : 12.7 reb/40min

[angel_luv]

Thanks for the stats Bruno. :)

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

The point behind that lineup was that if people want defense and rebounding you're gonna have to play both of them. The Spurs have won all season with both of them starting, so it seems to me that they're strengths and weaknesses balance out. Rasho doesn't hit the boards, but he hits his spots on defense. Nazr chases down the rebounds but can't guard the paint. If they can put one's brain in the other's body we'd be good to go.

[Dre_7]

The point behind that lineup was that if people want defense and rebounding you're gonna have to play both of them. The Spurs have won all season with both of them starting, so it seems to me that they're strengths and weaknesses balance out. Rasho doesn't hit the boards, but he hits his spots on defense. Nazr chases down the rebounds but can't guard the paint. If they can put one's brain in the other's body we'd be good to go.

Nasho Mohammovic

[ChumpDumper]

There is no question that Rasho understands the Spurs' defensive system better than Nazr. There is still a measureable difference in allowed FG% between the two and actually a negligible difference in defensive rebounding (maybe a slight surprise, but positioning and tipping may have something to do with it).

That said, the difference is much less than it was last season. Part of it could well be Nazr's getting used to the system and players and vice versa. Another factor would be that Duncan's reduced mobility exacerbates Rasho's sloth and lack of athleticism. It's very difficult to run two slow frontcourt players in this league, especially when one of those players doesn't bring much else to the table outside of good picks.

Anyway Duncan's injury affects him on both sides of the floor, and Nazr helps tremendously on the offensive side with his offensive boarding and agressiveness going to the basket.

I agree with Kori in that I liked having Rasho start because it established alot of stability. Defensive rotations were generally more solid and frustrating to our opponents and the offense seemed to find a rhythm more quickly with Rasho setting pick after pick for Tony. I understand why Nazr is starting and I hope he continues to improve.

Rasho is getting to the point where his minutes do not justify his contract (see Malik Rose) and I wouldn't be surprised to see him on the block again this summer. I hope we can find someone else who can at least stay in a game againt Yao or Shaq, though. Yao in particular is only 25 and only getting better.

[1Parker1]

If it weren't for Angel's constant reminders, I would have forgotten Rasho was on the team :angel

[Bruno]

I think too that some factor made Rasho lack of spee more problematic :
- Duncan : Sometimes Duncan guard the opposite C, Rasho had to guard the opposite PF who is too quick for Rasho. In Minny with KG, I think he always guard the opposite C.
- NBA has changed : When Spurs signed Rasho our main opponent was Lakers with Shaq. Now it's Phoenix and Dallas : Phoenix plays without center and Dallas centers aren't offensive weapon. Rasho hasn't good matchup in the west outside of Yao. Maybe it's the end of the big centers in nba and Rasho is one of the last dinosaur.

Rasho will maybe be a better player int the east where they are way more true center (Big Z, Shaq, Curry, Brezec, Haywood...)

[T Park]

There is no question that Rasho understands the Spurs' defensive system better than Nazr. There is still a measureable difference in allowed FG% between the two and actually a negligible difference in defensive rebounding (maybe a slight surprise, but positioning and tipping may have something to do with it).

That said, the difference is much less than it was last season. Part of it could well be Nazr's getting used to the system and players and vice versa. Another factor would be that Duncan's reduced mobility exacerbates Rasho's sloth and lack of athleticism. It's very difficult to run two slow frontcourt players in this league, especially when one of those players doesn't bring much else to the table outside of good picks.

Anyway Duncan's injury affects him on both sides of the floor, and Nazr helps tremendously on the offensive side with his offensive boarding and agressiveness going to the basket.

I agree with Kori in that I liked having Rasho start because it established alot of stability. Defensive rotations were generally more solid and frustrating to our opponents and the offense seemed to find a rhythm more quickly with Rasho setting pick after pick for Tony. I understand why Nazr is starting and I hope he continues to improve.

Rasho is getting to the point where his minutes do not justify his contract (see Malik Rose) and I wouldn't be surprised to see him on the block again this summer. I hope we can find someone else who can at least stay in a game againt Yao or Shaq, though. Yao in particular is only 25 and only getting better.

Fantastic post from Chump, as usual.

[ajh18]

According to 82games:

Unit Min Off Def +/- W L Win%
Parker-Ginobili-Bowen-Duncan-Nesterovic 350 718 612 +106 22 17 56.4
Parker-Ginobili-Bowen-Duncan-Mohammed 208 456 363 +93 23 9 71.8

W = number of games a unit outscored its opponents while on the court.
L = number of games a unit was outscored by its opponents while on the court.
Win% = the winning percentage for the unit based on Wins versus Losses.

We seem to outscore our opponent on a more regular basis with Nazr as a starter than with Rasho, according to the win %. We give up 1.745 points per minute with Nazr with the starting lineup, and 1.749 with Rasho in with that same lineup. With Nazr playing with the starters we score 2.192 points pere minute with Nazr playing with the starting lineup, and with Rasho playing with the starting lineup, we score 2.051 points per minute. So we give up 0.004 points more per minute with Nazr in the game, but score 0.141 more points per minute. Based on these facts, we have been a better team this year with Nazr in with the starting lineup than with Rasho. I tend to agree with the sentiments regarding Rasho being a better position defender, Nazr a better rebounder, but I thought I'd look at the numbers. I might be wrong on those calculations, I'm not a huge fan of math, but I thought it would be interesting to look into

[Slo spurs fan]

Nahhh he sucks. Yao made clinic on Rasho in the first half tonight :rolleyes

[leemajors]

yao has been doing that to everyone lately. i think nazr gives up 50 lbs to yao.

[Slo spurs fan]

yao has been doing that to everyone lately. i think nazr gives up 50 lbs to yao.
See that rolling eyes smiley???
Like this one----------> :rolleyes

[Solid D]

Rasho was good tonight. Very good.

[T Park]

Had 1 more rebound than a dead guy.

Hell, put me out there, my fat ass could get ONE.

[Slo spurs fan]

And a couple of tips to teammates.

[Slo spurs fan]

Had 1 more rebound than a dead guy.

Hell, put me out there, my fat ass could get ONE.
There is not enough space on the court for your fat ass.

[SAGambler]

Look how Rasho played Yao tonight vs how Nazr played him.

It depends on the opponent on which should get the most minutes on the floor.

[T Park]

There is not enough space on the court for your fat ass.

Oh my.....

[Slo spurs fan]

Look how Rasho played Yao tonight vs how Nazr played him.

It depends on the opponent on which should get the most minutes on the floor.
That makes too much sense for some mo-fos on this boards.

[T Park]

Obviously you can't critisize the Slovenians....

[Slo spurs fan]

Obviously you can't critisize the Slovenians....
Of course not.

[T Park]

:rolleyes

[kskonn]

I agree I thought Rasho played pretty well tonight, and so did Nazr when he got in the game. However I do remember the announcers talking about how Rasho was wearing Yao down in the second half, I would agree Yao was dogging it when I turned the game on in the third. Everytime he had the ball rasho was all over him, leaning on him, swiping, really getting to him.

[Obstructed_View]

Obviously you can't critisize the Slovenians....
When have you ever stopped?

[T Park]

I guess we should stop?

Ok.

Lets all be hunky dory and not do it...

[kskonn]

I guess we should stop?

Ok.

Lets all be hunky dory and not do it...


Does that include Rasho?? or just the Posters?

I want to be ready in case one of them insults me

[Obstructed_View]

I guess we should stop?

Ok.

Lets all be hunky dory and not do it...
Yeah. I'll be holding my breath...

[Dario]

I definately agree that nazr atm is much better for this team than rasho, he always had much more potencial and he is finaly starting to use it.
As for the boards, rasho almost always boxes people out, so others can grab an easy D rebound and he normaly tips O rebounds to parker or ginobili, so again its not realy fair to look at his stats and talk crap. And like it or not, he is big factor for parkers and ginobilis layups on offense.
What i still dont like about rasho is his inconsistancy and his attitude. I remember a couple of huge dunks when he played in italy and how he played for our national team, he just isn't showing that anymore...

[mavsfan1000]

Too bad you can't combine Rasho's defense and Mohammad's offense and rebounding.

[zeleni]

Too bad you can't combine Rasho's defense and Mohammad's offense and rebounding.

We allready did. Just not in the same person. :fro

[angel_luv]

Rasho was good tonight. Very good.


That he was. :)

[Rynospursfan]

Basketball is a game of match-ups. Against the Suns Radoslav is useless. Now with teams that play at a slower pace like Houston its a different story. We should all feel fortunate to have both players. Especially since likely next year we wont have that luxury.

http://spurs.fc2web.com/img/radoslav_nesterovic.jpg

[Berkmandlc]

my opinion is that you americans are all in to stats. But basketball isn't statistic, this is one of the many reasons why US "dream team" is losing against european teams. Every player in US team is trying to improve his stats, but not his game.

see you in japan... :eyebrows

[Jimcs50]

If you remember, after Yao started the game with a great deal of success, Pop put Rasho on him, and Yao could not get the ball because Rasho is so good at denying the ball to the post with his fronting, and Yao's effectiveness was almost gone.

[5ToolMan]

my opinion is that you americans are all in to stats. But basketball isn't statistic, this is one of the many reasons why US "dream team" is losing against european teams. Every player in US team is trying to improve his stats, but not his game.

see you in japan... :eyebrows


Great! A clueless Euro talking trash after a single olympic title to the American's consistant thrashings for years. You do have a small point about team hoops, but are clueless or simply ignore much of the reason why.

Most teams of the World play with their best players TOGETHER as TEAMS for years. The Americans throw together one or two of thier top players with a few average stars and train for about three weeks. In the past this has been more than enough to bitch slap the rest of the World. This year the Americans have set up a system where they will train for a couple more weeks. That will be more than enough to take care of the lightweights and the small level of improvement they have shown. :smokin

[FromWayDowntown]

Without getting into the politics of international basketball, there is a point in saying that basketball effectiveness cannot be measured entirely by statistics.

Rasho didn't rebound the ball well last night (or ever, really, for that matter), but if you watched the game as it was played, you had to see that Rasho was fantastic as a defender on Yao. Yao managed only 14 shots -- which itself is an amazing number, given the identities of the other men occupying Rockets uniforms at the moment -- but that was because he was denied the ball on many possessions, by Rasho.

I think it's curious that when someone says "Rasho plays good defense," those who dispute that turn to statistics (like rebounds) but if someone were to say "Bowen is an overrated defender because he doesn't have numbers," the same chorus lambasting Rasho would come back with arguments about statistics being irrelevant. Rasho should rebound more for a guy of his size; but the fact that he doesn't rebound as much as he should doesn't mean he isn't a good pre-shot defender in the Spurs defensive scheme.

With all of that said, I suspect that Rasho will be a non-factor come playoff time, largely because the Spurs likely playoff matchups either don't create a need for what Rasho does well or make Rasho a huge liability. Particularly, with matchups against Dallas and (if everything goes well for the Spurs) perhaps Phoenix, Rasho has no place in those sorts of games. Against Dampier and Diop, the Spurs don't really need a positional defender, because neither will get the ball on the block to initiate the offense. Against Phoenix, Nazr's relative athleticism and his ability to grab offensive rebounds is a much greater asset than anything that Rasho brings. And, I think we saw on Christmas Day that should a matchup with Detroit occur, Rasho is completely outclassed by the Pistons' bigs.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Well put, some my question being--if Rasho is useless come playoff time what is he? A regular season rent a player?

[FromWayDowntown]

Well put, some my question being--if Rasho is useless come playoff time what is he? A regular season rent a player?

He's a guy who is probably an above-average backup center. But he's also a guy who is quite useful against teams that have centers who can score.

If the Spurs were to somehow play the Rockets in the playoffs, Rasho would be crucial. In the last game the Spurs played against Miami, Rasho finally found some juevos and went toe-to-toe with Shaq. In situations like those, Rasho is immensely helpful, I think.

[FromWayDowntown]

For what it's worth, the Spurs were +17 with Rasho on the floor last night and -11 with Nazr on the floor.

[wildbill2u]

I know that Rasho has good play on the defensive end has been said so many times it has become relative fact on these boards, but I really question it. Look, when I see Rasho in game situations I do notice the occasional good play, but overall I really dont see what you guys see.

Why can't you accept what Duncan and Pop and all his teammates see when they defend him? They're professionals and see things a little clearer than even informed amateurs.

Is he the greatest defensive center ever? NO. The best defensive center the Spurs have ever had? NO.

Does the team have confidence in him? YES Have we won with him as the starting center? YES. Can we also accomodate the somewhat streaky play of NAZR? YES

[Slinkyman]

For what it's worth, the Spurs were +17 with Rasho on the floor last night and -11 with Nazr on the floor.

i don't put much stock in those stats, a week ago against houston it was nazr +6 rasho 0. A much more telling stat is that in that game nazr played 26 minutes and did well against Yao while Rasho played just 14 and got 4 fouls in that time. the Slovenians were no where to be found after that game...

needless to say houston will not make the playoffs and unless miami beats detroit rasho well be planted on the bench come playoff time.

[ChumpDumper]

I love how haters can never prop a guy for even one obviously good night.

[T Park]

Haha...:lol

[zeleni]

i don't put much stock in those stats, a week ago against houston it was nazr +6 rasho 0. A much more telling stat is that in that game nazr played 26 minutes and did well against Yao while Rasho played just 14 and got 4 fouls in that time. the Slovenians were no where to be found after that game...

needless to say houston will not make the playoffs and unless miami beats detroit rasho well be planted on the bench come playoff time.

We were found if you looked for us. ;)

Coach Pop has a system and player can come and go without seriously damaging the system. Nesterovic was not needed that game with Nazr getting used of starting against a defensive big Yao's team. Rasho did indeed just the rotation.

I do not know who will be the starting center come playoffs. But now they are both capable of starting within the system. We just know Oberto will not be in the starting.

[FromWayDowntown]

I do not know who will be the starting center come playoffs. But now they are both capable of starting within the system. We just know Oberto will not be in the starting.

Barring an injury, I think we're pretty certain about who the starting center will be come playoff time -- the same guy who started 23 playoff games last year, and his name is not Rasho.

The point, though, is that there are times and matchups where Rasho's ability to defend, which is greater than might be evidenced by just his numbers, can be handy and might make a difference in terms of who the Spurs end up playing in Round 1.

[ploto]

I find the timing of this thread interesting when in the past 5 games, Pop has had the quick hook on Nazr's poor defense and benched him early and often for Rasho 4 of those games.

Lakers- Mihm was scoring at will- Pop sent Rasho in early in the first quarter to shut him down. Nazr lasted less than 2 minutes into the third quarter before he was on the bench again and Rasho was back in.

Houston- Yao went off with 9 early points and Rasho was in there early.

New Orleans/OKC- Marc JAckson started 4-4 and Rasho was already sitting at the scorer's table 4 minutes into this game. Nazr lasted 20 seconds of the third quarter before Rasho was back in.

Last night- Rasho came in to stop Yao again and Rasho even started the second half.

So- it isn't just about Yao and Shaq. If the Spurs end up the #1 seed- they could play the Lakers, Sacramento, or Houston in the first round. People forget that Rasho was big in Games 3 and 4 in Denver last year in the first round. Even if the Spurs are #4 and draw the Clippers, Nazr struggled big time trying to guard Kaman. Truth is- Nazr is fine if the other center really isn't much of an offensive threat, but if the center is a vital part of their offensive scheme, Nazr can't really defend them very well.

I thought I would add some quotes from Pop and Tim last night, in the interest of educating some of you:

Pop: "Yao's been the best center in the league for whatever period of time, and he had to work for everything he got tonight, mostly because of Rasho fronting him."

Tim: "It was huge for Rasho and for us."

[SAGambler]

Why can't you accept what Duncan and Pop and all his teammates see when they defend him? They're professionals and see things a little clearer than even informed amateurs.

Is he the greatest defensive center ever? NO. The best defensive center the Spurs have ever had? NO.

Does the team have confidence in him? YES Have we won with him as the starting center? YES. Can we also accomodate the somewhat streaky play of NAZR? YES
Yeah, I think I will accept what Pop and his teammates think of him, over what some rank amateur thinks. It's pretty obvious that a lot of people tend to only look at points scored and rebounds gotten. People that don't understand the entire basketball concept will never appreciate a Rasho.

The rest of your post is right on also. I think we are indeed fortunate to have both to use in different situations. While neither will ever go to the HOF, they can certainly help us keep bringing those trophies home.

[timvp]

I think it's curious that when someone says "Rasho plays good defense," those who dispute that turn to statistics (like rebounds) but if someone were to say "Bowen is an overrated defender because he doesn't have numbers," the same chorus lambasting Rasho would come back with arguments about statistics being irrelevant. Rasho should rebound more for a guy of his size; but the fact that he doesn't rebound as much as he should doesn't mean he isn't a good pre-shot defender in the Spurs defensive scheme.

As a center, Rasho has to get rebounds. It's what he's getting paid to do. Play solid post defense and turn around and rebound the ball. Bowen, on the other hand, isn't supposed to really do anything that appears in the boxscore. Getting steals and blocks aren't what his defense is about.

Bowen has a long list of responsibilities defensively, as does Rasho. However, one of Rasho's main areas is rebounding, which he is not doing.

[timvp]

I do agree that Rasho played well against Houston. In the playoffs, there might be a series where he would be useful. If the Pistons get Flipped out of the playoffs, Rasho will be very nice to have against Shaq.

Basically, he's a modern day Will Perdue ... except not as good.

[FromWayDowntown]

I do agree that Rasho played well against Houston. In the playoffs, there might be a series where he would be useful. If the Pistons get Flipped out of the playoffs, Rasho will be very nice to have against Shaq.

Basically, he's a modern day Will Perdue ... except not as good.

Perdue would rebound.

[timvp]

Perdue would rebound.

Exactly.

:smokin

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Rasho's arms are too short
His wingspan is 6 foot 9

i dunno
just tryin to bs more excuses as to why he doesnt rebound hhaha

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Another factor would be that Duncan's reduced mobility exacerbates Rasho's sloth and lack of athleticism.


Funniest CD quote EVER!!

[SpursWillOwn]

rasho likes nachos. rasho is a reasonably gd center as compared to the rest of the league's center. we should stop criticizing rasho and him our support and hope tt he will help spurs into another championship

[Slomo]

i don't put much stock in those stats, a week ago against houston it was nazr +6 rasho 0. A much more telling stat is that in that game nazr played 26 minutes and did well against Yao while Rasho played just 14 and got 4 fouls in that time. the Slovenians were no where to be found after that game...

needless to say houston will not make the playoffs and unless miami beats detroit rasho well be planted on the bench come playoff time.We were probably busy giving props to Nazr, something you're obvioulsy uncapable of.

Since you miss us so much let me comfort you by saying that there is always a good number of us present on the board. Of course you have to take into consideration the fact that there is a time difference between our two countries. You see all the place on earth do not have the same time, it's called time zones - something you'll cover next year in 5th grade.

[Slo spurs fan]

We were probably busy giving props to Nazr, something you're obvioulsy uncapable of.

Since you miss us so much let me comfort you by saying that there is always a good number of us present on the board. Of course you have to take into consideration the fact that there is a time difference between our two countries. You see all the place on earth do not have the same time, it's called time zones - something you'll cover next year in 5th grade.
:tu

To inform you Slinkyman, I woke up at 2:30 am (CET) in friday and saturday´s game to warch Spurs game and went to sleep at 5:30 am (CET). So right after the game there is reason why there is less Slovenians on the board, but when you fell to sleep, we own this board (15 - 30 Slovenian posters at the same time on Spurstalk).

[CharlieMac]

A 7 foot tall human being not being a presence on defense? Hogwash.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

There are def. things Rasho does well against Yao, there is no denying it because Yao never has a good game against him (i dont know what they are...but oh well) But on the average night, watching the games it seems like he is a liability. Maybe Im wrong, but there was no compelling argument to convince me otherwise.

I give the guy props, he has some abilities, I just think he lacks any desire to use them.

[leemajors]

if a team doesn't have a real center there isn't much he can do. i don't think desire would help him be able to guard dirk or any other quicker pf or center better, he just isn't fast enough. with the right matchup he holds his own. i don't see why that's hard to understand.

[ploto]

if a team doesn't have a real center there isn't much he can do. i don't think desire would help him be able to guard dirk or any other quicker pf or center better, he just isn't fast enough. with the right matchup he holds his own. i don't see why that's hard to understand.
It should be simple to understand. The story of Rasho since he has been on the Spurs is put him up against some of the best true centers in the league and he has his best games. Play him on Shaq, Yao, Ilgauskas, Miller.. etc and you see what he can do. He has even shown some great moments at guarding some tough covers- Bosh, KG, Brand, even Rasheed... But there are teams he simply does not match up against. The same holds true for Nazr. People can see why Nazr is not such a good choice on Shaq or Ilgauskas- why is it so hard then to understand that putting Rasho on a 6'8" Boris Diaw just won't work?

[callo1]

my opinion is that you americans are all in to stats. But basketball isn't statistic, this is one of the many reasons why US "dream team" is losing against european teams. Every player in US team is trying to improve his stats, but not his game.

see you in japan... :eyebrows

Basketball isn't about statistics? How many times have you seen a team get outrebounded, out shot, out hustled, and out scored win a game?

Stats arn't always easy to interpret and sometimes they can be misleading, but they do tell the story...every time if you are looking in the right place.

Don't make too much of the last Olympics. There has been FAR to much of that "Europeans play more as a team, thats why they won". I'm not saying there is not some truth in that, but please...the US had recently had the biggest act of homeland terrorism committed against it in history, and MANY of the best we had to offer didn't participate in the Olympics due to rumors that Americans were to be targeted at the games.

Taking nothing away from Argentina, they won, and they deserve the respect, but please keep it real.

[callo1]

Rasho had a fantastic game tonight. There will be certain matchups where having Rasho will still prove to be very important.

Rasho plays good "D" in the sense that he is usually spot on with his rotations, and his mere presence in the paint deters players from getting to the rim alot.

Rasho is not a "go get the rebound guy". If it comes his direction, he is good about rebounding, but if not...ummm..well...you get the picture.

Say what you want about Rasho's defense, but he still closes out on perimeter shooters better than ANY big man the Spurs have including Tim. Rasho also moves his feet very well when he gets caught out on the perimeter due to mismatches etc.

If Rasho can bring the energy he did against the Rockets into the playoffs when he is inserted, he will raise the Spurs chances of winning another title all the more.

I actually saw Rasho sprint !!! I was thiking no way !! I had to do a double take, and then I realized it was true. Rasho moved really well:)

I like Rasho, and I like Nazr, but they are entirely two different players.

If (I doubt it) the Heat were to get by the Pistons and meet the Spurs in the Finals, the Rasho/Shaq matchup would show you just how valuable he actually is.

[Berkmandlc]

Basketball isn't about statistics? How many times have you seen a team get outrebounded, out shot, out hustled, and out scored win a game?

Stats arn't always easy to interpret and sometimes they can be misleading, but they do tell the story...every time if you are looking in the right place.

Don't make too much of the last Olympics. There has been FAR to much of that "Europeans play more as a team, thats why they won". I'm not saying there is not some truth in that, but please...the US had recently had the biggest act of homeland terrorism committed against it in history, and MANY of the best we had to offer didn't participate in the Olympics due to rumors that Americans were to be targeted at the games.

Taking nothing away from Argentina, they won, and they deserve the respect, but please keep it real.

I'm just saying that there are players in every NBA team that are only after stats and you can't ignore it. Rasho isn't like that at all (BTW whatever stats are saying, Rasho is still one of the greatest D players in spurs team). Who mentioned olympic games? God...
Whatever I'm really looking forward to next world champ. especially USA vs. Sl:spinvenia