Whos Starting 5 Is Better?

[Hassdabballman]

Let me ask u guys this, and please be honest. WHos starting 5 do u guys think is better, Pistons or Spurs? I think the pistons starting 5 is wayy better then the spurs. You could have made an argument that each player on our starting 5 could have been an allstar.

My opinion

Billups < Parker
Rip < Manu, this one was a close one
Tay < Bowen
Sheed > Duncan
Ben << Mohamed

FYI which ever way the arrow is pointing is the better play. You guys might think different but thats what i think.

[Horry For 3!]

Rasheed isn't better than Timmy :lol

[ALVAREZ6]

Well for 1, you need to learn how to use greater than and less than signs.






or if it isn't a mistake, then Nazr is way greater than Ben in your opinion.

[LilMissSPURfect]

and detroit >>>>>> SPURS!

[slayermin]

Manu > Rip
Bowen = Prince

[Vingianx]

Let me ask u guys this, and please be honest. WHos starting 5 do u guys think is better, Pistons or Spurs? I think the pistons starting 5 is wayy better then the spurs. You could have made an argument that each player on our starting 5 could have been an allstar.

My opinion

Billups < Parker
Rip < Manu, this one was a close one
Tay < Bowen
Sheed > Duncan
Ben << Mohamed

FYI which ever way the arrow is pointing is the better play. You guys might think different but thats what i think.

Finals scenario
billups will be able to score against Tony until they move bowen on him
Rip ....well bowen will move into his private space and lock him down
Tay ...hope he's good in the finals
Sheed...plays whenever he wants to and i think he cancels out with Duncan "if" he's up to the task of playing and making his shots
Ben .. will rebound and duke it out for every ball against mohammed

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

You think Nazr is twice as good as Big Ben?

Anyways, I would give the edge to the Pistons. Billups is probably the best all around point guard in the league, so there's no shame in giving him an edge over Tony, although I think the gap between the two is much smaller than last year.

I'd say Ginobili vs. Hamilton is a very slight edge towards Rip, because he's stepped up his game this year and he's a lot more durable. Before the Manu Mafia comes after me let me say that I'm making this on the basis that Manu's health is a great big question mark right now. If you can promise me that he'll be healthy by the finals I'll change my vote.

Bowen is better than Prince. Overall Bowen plays a smaller role on that team than Prince, but he does everything that is asked of him perfectly. Play D, hit open threes in the corner and he does it. Prince kind of disapeared in the finals last year, too.

Duncan, even gimped up is better than Rasheed, and most of the edge I give him is entirely mental. Rasheed has calmed down alot in Detroit but he still gets too emotional, and in a situation like the finals where momentum swings are so important they can cost you a game. And in a seven game series one game can be too many.

Ben is better than Nazr. He's a better rebounder and light years ahead as a one on one defender.

So it's close, but I give the Pistons five a slight advantage. With that said I think the depth and versatility of the bench of the Spurs more than balances it.

[bdubya]

Finals scenario
billups will be able to score against Tony until they move bowen on him
Rip ....well bowen will move into his private space and lock him down
Tay ...hope he's good in the finals
Sheed...plays whenever he wants to and i think he cancels out with Duncan "if" he's up to the task of playing and making his shots
Ben .. will rebound and duke it out for every ball against mohammed

Tay's definitely got to step it up; looks like you've got Bowen covering Billups AND Rip, so I assume Tayshaun will be doubled by Parker & Ginobili. Tay better start taking lessons from Sheed on that high, high release he's got; if he gets that down he can just shoot over the double all series long.

[yavozerb]

Pistons have a better starting 5 for sure!!But the depth of the spurs is what will win us the title..And yes, I think he did misitakenly reverse all of his ><

[Vingianx]

Tay's definitely got to step it up; looks like you've got Bowen covering Billups AND Rip, so I assume Tayshaun will be doubled by Parker & Ginobili. Tay better start taking lessons from Sheed on that high, high release he's got; if he gets that down he can just shoot over the double all series long.
yeah, remember in the finals when they switched bowen on billups he shut him down and blocked his final shot

[yavozerb]

I think this line up works better against the pistons:
Manu-1
Finley-2
Bowen-3
TD-4
Nazr-5
- Tony just has nobody to cover against the starting 5 of detroit...Tony should only play spotted minutes

[JamStone]

Rip is better than Manu THIS YEAR only because Manu has not been 100% most of the season. I think Manu is the better all around player, but if we are evaluating only on this season, I would give the edge to Rip as well. A healthy Manu Ginobili is one of the best shooting guards in the league, right behind Kobe, Dwyane Wade, and Vince Carter.

Tim Duncan definitely has the edge over Rasheed, but Rasheed seems to get up against Timmy and usually plays him well. It's one of the better match-ups both ways to watch as a basketball fan. Tim has the edge. When Rasheed outplays Tim, the Pistons have a great chance to win the game.

The match-up between Bruce Bowen and Tayshaun Prince is a toss-up. It depends how you view the two players. The better overall talent might be Prince. The smarter, tougher player is Bowen. On any given night, the match-up could go either way.


As a collective unit, I would say the Detroit Pistons have the better starting five. If we were to take into account the benches, I think the Spurs have a more balanced and complete team.

I actually think Denver and Sacramento have really great starting fives as well, especially with the additions of Ruben Patterson and Ron Artest to their respective teams. In fact, I think Denver's starting five is just as good as Detroit's except for outside shooting.

[spursfaninla]

Tony last year was not as good as chauncy, but this year I think its pretty close. Tony has become the teams leading scorer.

I would say

tony = chauncy (tony's better fg%, chauncey clutch, assists and 3pt)
manu (healthy) = rip (manu better d and slashing, rip shooter)
bowen = prince (bowen better d and 3's, prince scorer)
duncan (healthy) ~> Sheed (sheed can neutralize tim at times, though)
nazr << ben (ouch)

sa bench >> det bench (horry, barry, beno, finley, nve, rasho vs dice and a defensive pg?!)

Pretty even, very close. Prince does not deserve to be an All Star, and Manu healthy would have been an All-Star possibly.

Alot depends on how the Pistons try to stop Tony. If they focus the D on stopping his penetration, our outside shooters will have a field day, Tony included.

I think this year our offense is much better than before. Bottom line; if Tony and Manu can get to the hoop, we win.

If Detroit stops Tony and Manu's penetration, but we make open outside shots, we still win.

Detroit is going to have to stop the penetration and we are going to have to clang some shots.

I will admit that Detroit won games last year by generating turnovers, so If we turn a bunch over, or (like this year playing against them ) we allow a bunch of offensive rebounds, then Detroit will win.

[Despot]

Our center position is our weak link(considering TD is technically a forward), although it is still stronger than most teams. Given that, Detroit wins hands down when it comes to starting 5.

I guess you could argue that TD > Sheed + Ben , and Nazr is just gravy.

[spursfaninla]

I think this line up works better against the pistons:
Manu-1
Finley-2
Bowen-3
TD-4
Nazr-5
- Tony just has nobody to cover against the starting 5 of detroit...Tony should only play spotted minutes

Dude, you want to spot Detroit our leading scorer? I recognize that Billups can muscle his way to the rim against tony, but tony is flying past him (and other pg's) so easly this year that I think it is a wash at best for detroit, assuming their d can stop Tony.

If not, I'll take Tony's 55% shooting against Billups 42% any day...

[ChumpDumper]

Really Pistonfans, this is beneath you.

Leave this kind of ish to the Mavfans.

[Hassdabballman]

does this help for u dumasses

billups better then tony
rip better then Manu
Tay better then bowen
Duncan better then sheed
ben way better then mohamed.

[yavozerb]

Do you really think that Detroit will allow TP to rim like the lakers did last night??They much to good defensivle and that is where the majority of tony's points are made. I haven't had the cahnce to look up tp's stats from the last 2 games between det. and SA but I bet he didn't shoot very well? But then again I might be wrong, when you lose by 15 everytime its usually not 1 players fault!!

[cheguevara]

Our bench is way better than Piston's bench.

Pop owns Flippy

[FreshPrince22]

Individual breakdowns don't mean shit. This is a team game.

Look at the '04 finals. Everyone said...
Payton > Billups
Kobe > Rip
George = Prince
Malone > Sheed
Shaq > Ben

How'd that work out?

Whichever team gets on a roll at the time will win. Simple as that. These teams are too even.

[Rynospursfan]

Fortunatly teams have more than just 5 player on them. There is little doubt the Spurs wouldn't have won the series with the Pistons last year had it not been for the Bench play of Brent Barry and the heroics of Remarkable Shot Rob.

[PM5K]

Give me a fucking break, figure out how to use the signs right before you start talking shit and making yourself look like a fucking retard....

[1Parker1]

Do you really think that Detroit will allow TP to rim like the lakers did last night??They much to good defensivle and that is where the majority of tony's points are made. I haven't had the cahnce to look up tp's stats from the last 2 games between det. and SA but I bet he didn't shoot very well? But then again I might be wrong, when you lose by 15 everytime its usually not 1 players fault!!

Tony Parker

Dec 25 @ Detroit: 7-17, 5-6 FT's, 4 Assists, 3 Steals, 19 points

Jan 12 vs SA: 7-14, 2-5 FT's, 17 points

I'd say he did fine against the Pistons...he still managed to score around his season average. But if some Spurs fans still think he deserves "Spot" minutes and doesn't match up well against anyone agains the Pistons well....the numbers speak for themselves.

[ALVAREZ6]

does this help for u dumasses

billups better then tony
rip better then Manu
Tay better then bowen
Duncan better then sheed
ben way better then mohamed.
I think that you have shown in this thread that you are the dumbass.

Also in the other thread called: Why Will The Spurs Win It?

let's take a look...

Some of you guys prolly know me and know that im a pistons fan. I dont post here too much, but i post from time to time. Im here to ask you guys why do you think the spurs will win it this year? Looking at the pistons and spurs from an outside view, everything points to the pistons winning it. Now no trash talking, just say why u think the spurs will win it. Remember the pistons are up 2-0 in the season series and won both games pretty easily.

As for me i think the pistons will win it because we beat u guys twice, we got an offensive minded coach, we can turn the defense on any time we want to, and the way the pistons have been playing all year.
I'm not surprised that you don't post here too much, maybe it's because you don't watch basketball too much.

OK, the Pistons beat us in the regular season, but that doesn't mean shit.


Oh yeah, this one is classic: "the way the pistons have been playing all year."

Referring back to the fact that you don't watch basketball too much, have you noticed that the Pistons have been sucking lately? What does the 1st half of the season mean???

Nothing.



oh yeah, learn how to use greater than and less than signs.


:tu Have a nice day

[SenorSpur]

You think Nazr is twice as good as Big Ben?

Anyways, I would give the edge to the Pistons. Billups is probably the best all around point guard in the league, so there's no shame in giving him an edge over Tony, although I think the gap between the two is much smaller than last year.

I'd say Ginobili vs. Hamilton is a very slight edge towards Rip, because he's stepped up his game this year and he's a lot more durable. Before the Manu Mafia comes after me let me say that I'm making this on the basis that Manu's health is a great big question mark right now. If you can promise me that he'll be healthy by the finals I'll change my vote.

Bowen is better than Prince. Overall Bowen plays a smaller role on that team than Prince, but he does everything that is asked of him perfectly. Play D, hit open threes in the corner and he does it. Prince kind of disapeared in the finals last year, too.

Duncan, even gimped up is better than Rasheed, and most of the edge I give him is entirely mental. Rasheed has calmed down alot in Detroit but he still gets too emotional, and in a situation like the finals where momentum swings are so important they can cost you a game. And in a seven game series one game can be too many.

Ben is better than Nazr. He's a better rebounder and light years ahead as a one on one defender.

So it's close, but I give the Pistons five a slight advantage. With that said I think the depth and versatility of the bench of the Spurs more than balances it.

Well said

[ALVAREZ6]

Tim Duncan definitely has the edge over Rasheed, but Rasheed seems to get up against Timmy and usually plays him well. It's one of the better match-ups both ways to watch as a basketball fan. Tim has the edge. When Rasheed outplays Tim, the Pistons have a great chance to win the game.

I think that if the Spurs face the Pistons again in the finals, this match-up will decide who gets the rings.

Rasheed simply knows what Tim does, plays him defensively so well, and shoots right over him in the post.

IF Sheed continues to play Tim like he has been reccently, then I think the Spurs are fucked.

[ALVAREZ6]

Fortunatly teams have more than just 5 player on them. There is little doubt the Spurs wouldn't have won the series with the Pistons last year had it not been for the Bench play of Brent Barry and the heroics of Remarkable Shot Rob.
:tu



You took the "Remarkable Shot Rob" part from Steve Kerr didn't you?

:lol

[SPURS21]

does this help for u dumasses

billups better then tony
rip better then Manu
Tay better then bowen
Duncan better then sheed
ben way better then mohamed.

haha you spelt "dumbass" wrong you dipshit

[Rummpd]

Uh last year in finals Tim practically out rebounded both Wallaces. Lets not get ahead of ourselves.

Duncan is far better than Rasheed period, Rasheed has his moments.
Manu better than Hamilton - Hamilton great shooter but no way he drives the lane like Manu and wake me when he has earned the credentials of Manu.
Billups slight edge over Parker but not as much as some say period
Bowen is better than Prince by a fair margin and can defend anyone under 6 8
Wallace gets edge over Nazr agreed but Wallace has also been at times inconsistent and recently Nazr closing gap.

Lot closer than people give credit for. A motivated and nearly healthy Spurs starting five can give the Pistons all they can handle.

Dont forget the coach - FlipFlop not on same plane with Pop end of story.

[aaronstampler]

It's really hard to compare matchups because the starting fives will NEVER guard their opposing player. Tayshaun a 3, will guard Manu, a 2, and vice versa, and Bowen, a 3, will guard one of the Pistons guards, I'm not sure which.

Plus Horry will probably play like 20+ mins, and that'll throw the matchups even more out of whack.

One lineup I'd like to see is a frontline of Tim, Rob, and Nazr. We haven't really done it all year, but if we put that kind of length out there, we could probably rebound really well. Sure, we'd lose a little in perimeter defense, but all we want to do is funnel toward the bigs anyway, and Rob can shoot 3s almost as well as Bowen could, and from more spots.

[Dre_7]

I personally still think MIA is going to the Finals out of the east.

[ColoradoSpursFan]

Luck is going to be a big part - getting good calls from refs and hitting the fucking free throws!!

I have seen countless games where the Spurs would have won close games if they did not suck at the charity stripe.

I know other teams have bad shooters - Big Ben - Shaq - and so on.

Detroit is a much better all around free throw team. that alone can help win close games.

Of course the two teams are close in attributes but they both are relatively inconsistent.

No NBA team is a lock - Spurs and Detroit included.

[SenorSpur]

Uh last year in finals Tim practically out rebounded both Wallaces. Lets not get ahead of ourselves.

Duncan is far better than Rasheed period, Rasheed has his moments.
Manu better than Hamilton - Hamilton great shooter but no way he drives the lane like Manu and wake me when he has earned the credentials of Manu.
Billups slight edge over Parker but not as much as some say period
Bowen is better than Prince by a fair margin and can defend anyone under 6 8
Wallace gets edge over Nazr agreed but Wallace has also been at times inconsistent and recently Nazr closing gap.



While Ben does indeed have the edge over Nazr, you have to admit Nazr's offensive prowess is the difference between this matchup having a slim edge as opposed to a wide gap.

[jcrod]

I think this line up works better against the pistons:
Manu-1
Finley-2
Bowen-3
TD-4
Nazr-5
- Tony just has nobody to cover against the starting 5 of detroit...Tony should only play spotted minutes


:lol :lol
What kind of shit is this.

[Pistons < Spurs]

I personally still think MIA is going to the Finals out of the east.
:wow

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Uh last year in finals Tim practically out rebounded both Wallaces. Lets not get ahead of ourselves.

Duncan is far better than Rasheed period, Rasheed has his moments.
Manu better than Hamilton - Hamilton great shooter but no way he drives the lane like Manu and wake me when he has earned the credentials of Manu.
Billups slight edge over Parker but not as much as some say period
Bowen is better than Prince by a fair margin and can defend anyone under 6 8
Wallace gets edge over Nazr agreed but Wallace has also been at times inconsistent and recently Nazr closing gap.

Lot closer than people give credit for. A motivated and nearly healthy Spurs starting five can give the Pistons all they can handle.

Dont forget the coach - FlipFlop not on same plane with Pop end of story.


I agree with most of this. The starting 5s are almost a wash. And IMO, the benches are a wash as well. The only clear edge in this match-up is the coaching...

[Rummpd]

No way benches the same - Spurs have former all stars and all time heroics (Horry) coming off bench come on, be serious!

This is Spurs major edge period you never know who will break out one night - Finley,Barry, Van Exel, Horry.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Horry will end up playing more minutes than Nazr against Detroit. To me, he's a starter.

Nazr, Barry, and Finley will be the rotation vS. McDyess, Hunter and either Evans or Delfino...

To me, they'll cancel each other out...

[SequSpur]

Detroit is not making the finals anyway.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Put your money where your mouth is...

Spurs sweep didn't go over well for you last year even though I never asked for the T-shirt..

EDIT: And here's the thread. I believe a PM was sent to confirm...

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18168&page=3&pp=26&highlight=spurs+sweep

:hat

[veronicamae]

Put your money where your mouth is...

Spurs sweep didn't go over well for you last year even though I never asked for the T-shirt..

EDIT: And here's the thread. I believe a PM was sent to confirm...

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18168&page=3&pp=26&highlight=spurs+sweep

:hat

So you mean if you don't sweep, you don't deserve the championship?

:lol

I think they created the Best of 7 for a reason...

[Leetonidas]

Individual breakdowns don't mean shit. This is a team game.

Look at the '04 finals. Everyone said...
Payton > Billups
Kobe > Rip
George = Prince
Malone > Sheed
Shaq > Ben

How'd that work out?

Whichever team gets on a roll at the time will win. Simple as that. These teams are too even.

Who in their fucking mind said that?

[JamStone]

Rummpd,

Just as you rate Nazr Mohammed closer to Ben Wallace than most people might say, and Bruce Bowen "better than Prince by a fair margin," it could be fair to say that the Pistons bench is "closing the gap" or is better than you give them credit for.

The Spurs bench is definitely better than the Pistons bench. But, as you view Nazr closing the gap to Ben Wallace, the Pistons bench is similarly better than you might think.

Antonio McDyess is starting to play 20-24 minutes and putting up numbers around 15 ppg, 7 rpg more consistently. Lindsey Hunter is nearly fully healthy and has been impressive defensively over the last two weeks. Carlos Delfino is starting to get a few more minutes, and he is talented enough and athletic enough to be a contributor on the court.

While the Spurs have former all stars, the operative word is "former." By most accounts of Spurs fans, Van Exel has been quite a disappointment. Brent Barry has had a couple of good shooting games in the last couple weeks. So, that makes about 4 or 5 good games so far in about 70? And, Michael Finley has shown a propensity to play very poorly against the Pistons. Of course, Robert Horry will be a threat and an impact player. But, the Spurs bench is a bunch of mid 30 year old former stars who play at half the speed of their prime. They may be smarter. They may be better basketball players. But, their edge is not as huge as you make it out to be.

The Detroit bench is mostly uproven except for Antonio McDyess and Lindsey Hunter. Mo Evans and Carlos Delfino may or may not play well. Dale Davis won't play much. Tony Delk is more insurance than anything. But, the Pistons had far less last year against the Spurs when the Finals went to the full 7 games. The Pistons didn't even have a back-up small forward or shooting guard last season in the playoffs. They played four perimeter guys in a rotation: Billups, Hamilton, Prince, and Lindsey Hunter. So, Evans, Delfino, and Delk this year seems like gravy.

Spurs have an edge in the bench. But, if you, Rummpd, insist that Bruce Bowen is "FAR BETTER" than Tayshaun Prince and that Nazr Mohammed is "CLOSING THE GAP" with Ben Wallace, you will have to concede the bench disparity is not that much.

... especially when you're talking about basically an 8-man rotation in the playoffs.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

So you mean if you don't sweep, you don't deserve the championship?

:lol

I think they created the Best of 7 for a reason...

No, I meant I <3 gibbons...