BENO NEXT?? What trade works

[JonNOKC]

I like the Ely trade by the Spurs....worst case scenario it gives extra motivation to Elson and other post players, best case Ely becomes Duncan's primary backup (the first time Spurs can bring legitimate low post scoring in from the bench) while occasionally playing next to Duncan...this trade is very low risk (only cost 2nd rounder and Ely is in last year of contract...one other point is this trade isn't about money as many have claimed (insider reports say the Spurs will pay the difference in Ely vs Williams contract) but this is a guy who Pop and others have coveted ( "coveted" may be alittle strong) for 3 years, and hope a championship environment and solid veterans will help Ely undergo a attitude adjustment!

That brings us to Beno...as much as we would like an athlectic 3 our backup PG has been even more of a problem this year...It won't be easy to work out a trade involving Beno (although easier than trying to get legit 3 that can halp this year) due to his low salary and poor play this year but there are still guys out there that think he has potential....while Vaughn has played well lately, having watched him for many years I am not convinced he is the answer.....so what trades may be out there involving Beno???

Here's a few possibilities (no particular order):

1. Beno & Oberto for Fred Jones (mentioned a couple weeks ago) - salary works, Oberto probably have limited play with Ely trade, and Fred Jones odd man out after TJ Ford trade.

2. Beno for (Boston PG/G) - not sure on this one, but Boston sucks and they have 4 PG/G combos all young and all have 2 years left on contract (same as Beno) the problem is Celtics probably fell all are better than Beno, so any trade here has to involve draft pick, rights to euro player, or asorbing large contact (Celtics have very few and Spurs not in position to do so). It may be worth talking and see if anything make sense...I would rank them in order of best suited for Spurs (1. West 2. Rondo 3. Telfair 4. Ray)

3. Beno/Oberto/Draft Pick or Euro rights for Chucky Atkins - Chuckster is definitely the most talent scoring PG out there and has reasonable salary plus expiring contract..the Grizzlies no they will not resign him thus would enertain reasonable offers..giving up Beno Memphis gets a young guy with some potential, Oberto (expiring contract), and draft pick or rights to Euro player.

Other than these guys most trades seem nearly impossible...alot of PGs available (Watson,Claxton,James,Jaric) make too much and have 4yr deals or longer...some of these guys may be had but would reguire Spurs give up Barry+Beno+pick/rights and dont see FO doing that for overpaid, long term contracts. Others just aren't realistic (see JKidd)

ANYONE HAVE OTHER POSSIBLILTIES??

[Duncanoypi]

Beno for Kevin Johnson...

[veronicamae]

how many more trade scenarios do we need to discuss?

[lefty]

Raps don't need another PG ; they are more than fine with Ford and Calderon

[AFBlue]

how many more trade scenarios do we need to discuss?

Actually I hadn't thought about the Fred Jones one...but he makes $4M over the next 3 or 4 years...so too much, too long...

[ChumpDumper]

Actually I hadn't thought about the Fred Jones one...but he makes $4M over the next 3 or 4 years...so too much, too long...He also sucks.

[Mr. Body]

Only the third seems possible. I wd under no account trade a draft pick or Euro right in any way for Atkins, however.

[JonNOKC]

Actually I hadn't thought about the Fred Jones one...but he makes $4M over the next 3 or 4 years...so too much, too long...

He acutally makes 3.1 mil for 2 years

[JonNOKC]

Raps don't need another PG ; they are more than fine with Ford and Calderon


I agree if anyone is offering anything better then this doesn't work, but as it is they have 3 PG on the team and Beno saves them money while Oberto gives them an expiring contract

[Bruno]

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58188

[Darkwaters]

I agree if anyone is offering anything better then this doesn't work, but as it is they have 3 PG on the team and Beno saves them money while Oberto gives them an expiring contract

Doesn't Oberto have a player option for next season?

[KB24]

Beno for KOBE

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

[big3bigD]

:donkey

Beno and Manu for Kidd and Carter.

Then Jackie Butler and Oberto for Ben Wallace and Deng :smokin . :rolleyes

[FromWayDowntown]

I can't imagine anyone in the league is too anxious to give up very much at all for Beno at this point.

I also think, whether its prudent or not, that the Spurs are happy with Jacque Vaughn becoming more comfortable leading the 2nd unit. From hearing Mike Budenholzer last night, it sure sounds like that change is permanent (which, in relative terms, seems like a good thing) and that the staff is willing to give Vaughn some time to settle in. Budenholzer suggested last night that as Vaughn gets more PT, his willingness to be a vocal leader on and off the floor increases. Like I say, I'm not entirely sold that Jacque Vaughn is an optimal choice to play significant playoff minutes at the point for this team, but it would seem that the Spurs have now made the decision to proceed with that plan.

I'd be shocked if the Spurs made a deal to acquire a PG before the deadline; I'd think that if they can find a way to move Beno and other assets, it will be to acquire a wing-type player.

[MajorMike]

Doesn't Oberto have a player option for next season?

Fab has 2.5 mil PO.
Beno makes 967,920 this year, 1,747,095 next, and 2,603,172 QO in '08-'09.

Ely (3,308,615) Bonner (2,000,000) and Vaughn (1,071,225) are all 1-year deals.

Barry (5,554,370) Horry (3,630,000) Sisco (3,000,000) and White (427,163) are all under contract next year.

Bruce has 4.125 mil TO

Finley has 3.103 mil PO

The ONLY Spur besides the big 3 that is under contract PAST next year is Butler (2.376 in '08 & 2.552in '09).

Dumping Fab when he has a 2.5 mil PO that we don't want makes sense.

Dumping Beno when his salary almost doubles next year (967,920 to 1,747,095) makes even more sense. He was almost a shoo-in to come back this year, because he was so damn cheap. He makes less than Vaughn (1,071,225). You can bring Vaughn back for less than Beno will make next year.

Barry is the 4th highest paid Spur this and next year (and its not even close). I can't imagine keeping him as good basketball or business sense.

Even if Butler does not work for us, he will still be young and great tradebait for teams wanting a C or backup C. 2.5 is a steal the way the C contracts have been recently. I have always believed that the Butler signing was more of an investment than an experiment.

Best business sense in this case mirrors basketball sense. Barry Beno and Fab make a combined 8.6 mil this and 9.8 mil next year. Dead weight all the way.

Trim the fat, and take anything at this point. You've got 18+ mil over 2 years to offer. Bring in any disgruntled, overpaid, decent starting or young backup 3 or 5 and see if he can't contribute more than Barry, who is your only real 'loss'.

[T Park]

Nobody wants that douchebag udrih, get real.

[TDMVPDPOY]

beno for ameichi

[timvp]

one other point is this trade isn't about money as many have claimed (insider reports say the Spurs will pay the difference in Ely vs Williams contract)

Spurs saved around $1.5M just by making the trade.

[Bruno]

Spurs saved around $1.5M just by making the trade.

They saved $1M with this trade.

[timvp]

(($4.3M - $3.3M) * 2) - $500K = $1.5M

How do you get $1M?

Edit: Nevermind, forgot you have to prorate the initial amounts.

[timvp]

Bruno, show your math. How do you get exactly $1M?

:drunk

[Mr. Body]

It's prorated, too. I'm not sure if you took into account that they don't have to pay the entire difference in salaries. This is actually in the Spurs' disservice, I think.

[timvp]

It's prorated, too. I'm not sure if you took into account that they don't have to pay the entire difference in salaries. This is actually in the Spurs' disservice, I think.
Yeah, check my edit.

[Mr. Body]

Ok.

[Kori Ellis]

I don't think they saved a million or million and a half. They barely saved any money. If there were 31 games left in the season at the time of the trade, then EWill was owed $1,625,609 and Ely was owed $1,247,561. If the Spurs paid the Bobcats the difference in those, then they paid them about $378K. But they would have paid dollar per dollar tax on that $378K if they paid it to EWill.

So basically, they saved $378K.

[Bruno]

Bruno, show your math. How do you get exactly $1M?

:drunk

In fact Spurs have given cash to cover the difference between Ely and Williams remaining salary : they will still spend $4.3M (Williams salary) during the year but now it's split between Williasm, Ely and cash to Charlotte.

Teams pay the luxury tax only at the end of the season : it's based on players under contract at the end the year and not on what teams have spend during the year.

They will save $1M because at the end of the year, Spurs payroll will be $1M lower and they will be $1M less in luxury tax (difference between Ely and Williams salary).

[timvp]

In fact Spurs have given cash to cover the difference between Ely and Williams remaining salary : they will still spend $4.3M (Williams salary) during the year but now it's split between Williasm, Ely and cash to Charlotte.

Teams pay the luxury tax only at the end of the season : it's based on players under contract at the end the year and not on what teams have spend during the year.

They will save $1M because at the end of the year, Spurs payroll will be $1M lower and they will be $1M less in luxury tax (difference between Ely and Williams salary).

Bruno is king. I read the part in the CBA and yeah, that's how it works.

Props to you and Peter Holt.

:king

[ShoogarBear]

So basically, they saved $378K.http://www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com/archives/mcduck.gif

[Kori Ellis]

Bruno, thanks for the info. I didn't know it was tax on the end of the year salaries as opposed to the actual paid salaries.

[Bruno]

You're welcome. :)

[midgetonadonkey]

how many more trade scenarios do we need to discuss?

8 more

[exstatic]

Hahammm. The $1M in salary that they save will translate into $2M in actual savings, since luxury tax is 1 + 1 dollars for every dollar over the tax, and their dollar figure will be $1M lower. They save $2M, $1M salary plus $1M tax payment, minus the prorated payment to Charlotte.

[intlspurshk]

^^^they saved the tax payment but not the salary due to the shortfall in salary will be covered by SPURS, Bruno is right.

[pad300]

Trading Beno...

Lets try a 3 way

LAC-MEM-SAS

SAS Out - Udrih,Oberto
SAS In - James Singleton, Chucky Atkins

MEM Out - Chucky Atkins
MEM In - Oberto, Doug Christie

LAC Out - James Singleton, Doug Christie
LAC In - Udrih

Doug Christie is included solely as fodder - Mem. will cut him and he will rejoin the Clippers.
Jerry West (MEM) gets Oberto, whom he likes and further enhances his chances in the Oden Lottery.
Clippers wanted a picks/prospects, shooters and expirings for Magette. Singleton is worth less - they get a prospect (whom they expressed an interest in before).

Clearly to get MEM and LAC to buy in, we will have to add a couple of Picks or Euro rights.

Suggestion - SAS first to LAC, LAC Second to SAS, 2007 2nd to Mem. (CHI's if we get it, otherwise SAS)

[ChumpDumper]

They can't trade Christie while he's on a ten day contract -- or even after that for 90 days.

[Behrooz24]

Jerry West (MEM) gets Oberto, whom he likes and further enhances his chances in the Oden Lottery.

:lol

[pad300]

They can't trade Christie while he's on a ten day contract -- or even after that for 90 days.

You can replace Christie's contract with that of either Daniel Ewing or Paul Davis from the Clippers. The CBA trade limits still work. However, it might be more difficult to talk LAC into it...

[ChumpDumper]

It would have to be Ewing if there's any chance of that working. LA doesn't need four point guards.

[AFBlue]

You can replace Christie's contract with that of either Daniel Ewing or Paul Davis from the Clippers. The CBA trade limits still work. However, it might be more difficult to talk LAC into it...

Seems a little intricate and like alot of hassle for piece-parts...

More simple is:

Beno + Oberto for Atkins + future pick

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Beno + Oberto for Atkins + future pick
I don't think they'll add a pick to that. Maybe just Atkins. But still good.

[pad300]

Seems a little intricate and like alot of hassle for piece-parts...

More simple is:

Beno + Oberto for Atkins + future pick

1) I still think our wing positions need more, and Singleton could be very useful - look at his rebound rate. This is very likely our last move this year, if it can satisfy both holes (PG, Wing), we should surely try.

2) Your not getting a future pick out of Memphis. They are in rebuild mode and will try to keep their picks for the next couple of years. You could probably do Beno and Oberto for Atkins straight up.

3) Think about 2007-08.
Your way
C - Butler, Elson,
PF - Duncan, Horry* (I think he retires),
SF - Bowen, Finley
SG - Manu, Barry
PG - Parker

Needs - 2 or 3 Bigs, 2nd & 3ed PG's, 2 Wing players.
Assets - Short term (1 year contracts, due to the "oh so important" 2008 plan), 1 first pick, 2 (MIL, SAS) maybe 3 (CHI) second picks, Scola (ready), Javoktas, Mahnimi & Sanikidze (likely not ready).
Thats a lot of holes to fill. Scola likely won't come for a 1year contract (Javtokas might...).

My way
C - Butler, Elson,
PF - Duncan, Horry* (I think he retires),
SF - Bowen, Singleton (playing for a contract), Finley
SG - Manu, Barry
PG - Parker

Needs - 2 or 3 Bigs, 2nd & 3ed PG's, 1 Wing.
Assets - Short term (1 year contracts, due to the "oh so important" 2008 plan), 2 (LAC, MIL) maybe 3(CHI) second picks, Scola (ready), Javoktas, Mahnimi & Sanikidze (likely not ready).
Still a lot of holes to fill. But Singleton fills a wing slot with a usable veteran, who is playing in a contract year. He also plays some PF, which gives us some semi-reliable backup there too.

[AFBlue]

1) I still think our wing positions need more, and Singleton could be very useful - look at his rebound rate. This is very likely our last move this year, if it can satisfy both holes (PG, Wing), we should surely try.

2) Your not getting a future pick out of Memphis. They are in rebuild mode and will try to keep their picks for the next couple of years. You could probably do Beno and Oberto for Atkins straight up.

3) Think about 2007-08.
Your way
C - Butler, Elson,
PF - Duncan, Horry* (I think he retires),
SF - Bowen, Finley
SG - Manu, Barry
PG - Parker

Needs - 2 or 3 Bigs, 2nd & 3ed PG's, 2 Wing players.
Assets - Short term (1 year contracts, due to the "oh so important" 2008 plan), 1 first pick, 2 (MIL, SAS) maybe 3 (CHI) second picks, Scola (ready), Javoktas, Mahnimi & Sanikidze (likely not ready).
Thats a lot of holes to fill. Scola likely won't come for a 1year contract (Javtokas might...).

My way
C - Butler, Elson,
PF - Duncan, Horry* (I think he retires),
SF - Bowen, Singleton (playing for a contract), Finley
SG - Manu, Barry
PG - Parker

Needs - 2 or 3 Bigs, 2nd & 3ed PG's, 1 Wing.
Assets - Short term (1 year contracts, due to the "oh so important" 2008 plan), 2 (LAC, MIL) maybe 3(CHI) second picks, Scola (ready), Javoktas, Mahnimi & Sanikidze (likely not ready).
Still a lot of holes to fill. But Singleton fills a wing slot with a usable veteran, who is playing in a contract year. He also plays some PF, which gives us some semi-reliable backup there too.

I see the Spurs having two seperate needs and I'm not saying Singleton wouldn't be good, but the likelihood that they address both of those needs in two seperate deals, let alone a more complicated three-team trade, is slim at best....

I just think the Spurs can reasonably fill one of the two voids they have on their current roster, be it backup PG or wing. I posted what I thought to be the most "reasonable" or "likely" deal.

[AFBlue]

Beno to GS for Matt Barnes also works...

[pad300]

I see the Spurs having two seperate needs and I'm not saying Singleton wouldn't be good, but the likelihood that they address both of those needs in two seperate deals, let alone a more complicated three-team trade, is slim at best....

I just think the Spurs can reasonably fill one of the two voids they have on their current roster, be it backup PG or wing. I posted what I thought to be the most "reasonable" or "likely" deal.

I'd suggest that a 3 way is easier than 2 two-ways, given our limited trade assets. You may be right about only being able to fill one of two holes. At that point, I would suggest addressing the wing position first. At PG, we have Parker for 35+ minutes per night, followed by Vaughn, who has been doing well lately, and as a third option, there is the Barry - Manu double Hybrid guard backcourt (which worked against Detroit). But we really have no good answer to strong SF's (eg. Bonzi, Artest, Howard last year, Battier, Howard, ? Diaw? this year), and our rebounding remains a weakness, which is magnified when we play small ball. The wing spot appears to be the position of greater need...

[AFBlue]

I'd suggest that a 3 way is easier than 2 two-ways, given our limited trade assets. You may be right about only being able to fill one of two holes. At that point, I would suggest addressing the wing position first. At PG, we have Parker for 35+ minutes per night, followed by Vaughn, who has been doing well lately, and as a third option, there is the Barry - Manu double Hybrid guard backcourt (which worked against Detroit). But we really have no good answer to strong SF's (eg. Bonzi, Artest, Howard last year, Battier, Howard, ? Diaw? this year), and our rebounding remains a weakness, which is magnified when we play small ball. The wing spot appears to be the position of greater need...

Ask any GM and they'll tell you that a three-way trade is always harder than a two way because it becomes more difficult to match up the outgoing and incoming salaries. I didn't bother to check your earlier deal, but I wouldn't doubt if there was a financial snag in there somewhere.

The other thing is that even if the Spurs go with a guy like Singleton, Barnes, Outlaw, or one of these other long 3/small ball 4 types, how much time do you expect Pop to give them over a veteran like Finley? Outside of Maggette, Posey, or Mo Pete, I really don't see that athletic wing the Spurs are looking for to contribute immediately even if they get him.

I'm just trying to be realistic. Pop likes veterans and none of the SF/PF types (outside of Maggette) that the Spurs could get would be veterans...

The PG they could get, however...

[timvp]

Hahammm. The $1M in salary that they save will translate into $2M in actual savings, since luxury tax is 1 + 1 dollars for every dollar over the tax, and their dollar figure will be $1M lower. They save $2M, $1M salary plus $1M tax payment, minus the prorated payment to Charlotte.

Nah, Bruno is right. There is no salary savings because the Spurs gave Charlotte the prorated difference in salary. The Spurs just save money by having $1M less in tax payment.

[AFBlue]

Nah, Bruno is right. There is no salary savings because the Spurs gave Charlotte the prorated difference in salary. The Spurs just save money by having $1M less in tax payment.

:lol

I can't believe it took like 5 people and a page of threads to figure that out...

Presumably everyone has a hs diploma...Congrats! :clap

Just playing... ;)

[pad300]

Ask any GM and they'll tell you that a three-way trade is always harder than a two way because it becomes more difficult to match up the outgoing and incoming salaries. I didn't bother to check your earlier deal, but I wouldn't doubt if there was a financial snag in there somewhere.

The other thing is that even if the Spurs go with a guy like Singleton, Barnes, Outlaw, or one of these other long 3/small ball 4 types, how much time do you expect Pop to give them over a veteran like Finley? Outside of Maggette, Posey, or Mo Pete, I really don't see that athletic wing the Spurs are looking for to contribute immediately even if they get him.

I'm just trying to be realistic. Pop likes veterans and none of the SF/PF types (outside of Maggette) that the Spurs could get would be veterans...

The PG they could get, however...

Yes, ONE 3-way is harder than ONE 2-way. However, I suggest that ONE 3-way is easier than TWO 2-way deals. The salaries in my proposed deal should work out; they pass through real-gm's trade checker.

Pop does have something of an obsession with veterans, but what PG is going to come in with less than half the season to learn the playbook on the fly and force Vaughn out of the 2nd PG slot while doing so... Vaughn is a veteran as well. I'd give the SF/PF a better shot, just because of the larger talent gap there is to fill at that spot.

Also, don't be too sure about getting the PG. There are a number of teams looking for a good cheap vet. PG at the moment - Cleveland, Miami, Spurs, Minnesota... There aren't that many available.

[AFBlue]

Yes, ONE 3-way is harder than ONE 2-way. However, I suggest that ONE 3-way is easier than TWO 2-way deals. The salaries in my proposed deal should work out; they pass through real-gm's trade checker.

Pop does have something of an obsession with veterans, but what PG is going to come in with less than half the season to learn the playbook on the fly and force Vaughn out of the 2nd PG slot while doing so... Vaughn is a veteran as well. I'd give the SF/PF a better shot, just because of the larger talent gap there is to fill at that spot.

Also, don't be too sure about getting the PG. There are a number of teams looking for a good cheap vet. PG at the moment - Cleveland, Miami, Spurs, Minnesota... There aren't that many available.

See you're point on more than one two-way deal, and I understand the hesitation to bring a PG in w/ less than half the season to go, but that's where our agreement ends....

The answer to your question (bolded) is Chucky Atkins. Atkins is a veteran, and can be an effective playmaker (score when needed, and defer when needed).

Vaughn may be a veteran as well, but Pop gave Beno every opportunity to win/keep the backup PG spot. The reason why....Vaughn, while smart and energetic, is simply not a consistent offensive threat, which leads me to my next point....

The talent gap between Atkins and Vaughn is bigger than the talent gap between Finley (the current 3/4 option) and any one of the players you mentioned (Singleton for instance). In fact, you could make the argument that Atkins is an improvement over Vaughn, but Finley might actually still be a better option than Singleton/Barnes/etc.

One last point....

Pop had a 6'9 220lb hybrid forward, who was a veteran nonetheless (we already established Pop's affinity for veterans), and he barely got off the bench. What makes you think Pop will go with a 2nd or 3rd year player over Finley for key minutes down the stretch?

[silk]

good point phat tony...i thought eric williams would have been more useful for us ..atkins would be great but it's a little sad beno can't put it together.. he could be a force..

[mountainballer]

The other thing is that even if the Spurs go with a guy like Singleton, Barnes, Outlaw, or one of these other long 3/small ball 4 types, how much time do you expect Pop to give them over a veteran like Finley? Outside of Maggette, Posey, or Mo Pete, I really don't see that athletic wing the Spurs are looking for to contribute immediately even if they get him.

I'm just trying to be realistic. Pop likes veterans and none of the SF/PF types (outside of Maggette) that the Spurs could get would be veterans...

The PG they could get, however...

I'm not sold on the verteran argument. yes, it's right that Pop prefers veterans, but does this really exclude any "non-veteran" option? last year they almost traded Barry for sophomore Smith. I don't think that they would have made this move thinking that Smith wouldn't get Barry's minutes (15+). Spurs are a contender and can't act like a rebuilding team, that makes deadline trades for a potential improvement next season.
so, if they didn't try to trade a veteran like Barry for another veteran (or at least a player with some seasons under his belt), why shouldn't they try again this year?
I agree, that new players, who are average talents, but above average athletes, will have it hard to find time on a veteran (and disciplined system playing) team like the Spurs immediatly.
the major factor will be this: a player like for example Barnes wouldn't be aquired to upgrade the overall talent, he would be aquired to fill a hole in the rebounding and athletics department. so he would get time, when the matchup turns to much the Spurs disadvantage. so I could see this player get 25 minutes in a game and just 5 the other day.

and even if it is for sure more problematic for a new player, to get into the Spurs system than into any team's system, it is not impossible, if a certain role is just sought. see Nazr. he is for sure not the smartest player in the league, but he got 20 minutes immediatly and almost 25 in the PO.

for a new PG, I agree that it would be the most difficult part.
I guess this will be a lot about the whole scenario. Spurs have some flexibility about this, because either Barry or Manu could help a bit at PG. so it would be more logical, to look for a combo guard, than for the typical floor general. but you never know.
look at Steve Blake. (btw. I had him on my list for breakout player 2007, when he went to the Bucks. thought he would fit great there, but was wrong.) he contributed immediatly with the better team than his old one, and after one month he is delivering 10+ APG and 10+ PPG.
(I remember, that during the summer I mentioned Blake as a possible trade for Beno and I got laughed at.)

back to the combo guard. what would you guys think of a swap Beno for Charlie Bell, if Buck would agree on this? (maybe Spurs add a 2nd rounder)
Bucks aren't going anywhere and they have holes in the playmaking department.
Bell is far from a playmaker, but with his athletic abilities and good defense, he could be very usefull against those teams with big guards.
I guess if he was aquired, Barry could take the back-up PG role and Bell more of a back-up SG part.
just a thought. good? bad? unrealistic?

[AFBlue]

I'm not sold on the verteran argument. yes, it's right that Pop prefers veterans, but does this really exclude any "non-veteran" option? last year they almost traded Barry for sophomore Smith. I don't think that they would have made this move thinking that Smith wouldn't get Barry's minutes (15+)

I disagree that Smith would've taken Barry's minutes. Remember Barry was in the doghouse as well and had been taken out of the rotation largely all-together, so Smith wouldn't have had that many minutes to pick up anyways. That, and I think Pop would've made a comment similar to the one he made with Ely (big wow, one IR guy for another). I CLEARLY think JR Smith was a play for the future w/o sacraficing any current production. I assume Finley would've gotten more of the minutes.


and even if it is for sure more problematic for a new player, to get into the Spurs system than into any team's system, it is not impossible, if a certain role is just sought. see Nazr. he is for sure not the smartest player in the league, but he got 20 minutes immediatly and almost 25 in the PO.

Nazr was a veteran and the Spurs' only other option was Rasho. None of the SF discussed are veterans. The only one considered to be close to that would be Barnes, and I agree with your earlier statements that he MIGHT see 20 minutes in one game if the matchup presents itself, during the regular season. I can't see Pop going to this unproven kid in crunch time.


back to the combo guard. what would you guys think of a swap Beno for Charlie Bell, if Buck would agree on this? (maybe Spurs add a 2nd rounder)
Bucks aren't going anywhere and they have holes in the playmaking department.

I like the idea of Charlie Bell and Keyon Dooling. Both are scrappy combo guards with a knack for scoring and decent defense.

Bell for Beno works, but the Bucks might want a pick as well...

Dooling for Ely works, but they also might want a pick...

[mountainballer]

I like the idea of Charlie Bell and Keyon Dooling. Both are scrappy combo guards with a knack for scoring and decent defense.

Bell for Beno works, but the Bucks might want a pick as well...

Dooling for Ely works, but they also might want a pick...

uff...finally we can agree on something :lol

I guess the Spurs would like the Bell scenario more. he is much cheaper (744K expiring, Dooling 3.3 M + another season) and overall the player, who might make more of an impact right now.
Bucks will ask for more than just Beno. maybe they want their pick back, since it will be better than they would ever have thought. (would you give it back if it get's us Bell?)