Gun Control hmmmmm Gun Control. I wonder.

[BacktoBasics]

Here is an article about that kid from the new Harry Potter movie. He was fatally stabbed outside a bar. I was just wonder about this figure I read. It really makes you think about why our guns are so fucking important to us because you know that figure is massively eclipsed in any other area as densely populated in a like sized America town. Perhaps I'm wrong I just don't think so. I guess for example New York had a little over 900 murders in 2006. I wonder how many were teens and by guns.

LONDON (AFP) - Police in London have been given more time to question a 21-year-old man held on suspicion of fatally stabbing a teenager actor who played a role in the forthcoming Harry Potter film, Scotland Yard said on Monday.

Rob Knox, 18, was killed outside the Metro Bar in southeast London in the early hours of Saturday morning while reportedly trying to protect his brother from a man wielding a knife.

The teenager played the role of student Marcus Belby in "Harry Potter And The Half-Blood Prince", which is due to be released in November.

Police arrested a 21-year-old on suspicion of murder and have been given more time to question him, Scotland Yard said on Monday, without giving further details.

Knox's murder takes to 14 the number of teenagers violently killed in London this year, a figure which has caused alarm among police, politicians and campaigners.

The stabbing took place after a man entered the bar and was seen waving two knives around. A scuffle broke out and Knox and his brother Jamie were reportedly trying to protect each other.

Several others sustained knife wounds.

Tom Hopkins, 18, and Tarik Ozress, 17 - both of whom are friends of the Knox brothers - managed to pin the man down after wrestling with him for several minutes before police arrived.

Hopkins, who was stabbed in the head, said: "Rob was just trying to help out. He was like that. I grabbed the knife, I didn't know at the time that he had another knife. It was just chaos."

Knox was taken to hospital where he was pronounced dead.

Friends said there had been a row over a phone last week and believe it could have been a revenge attack.

"Rob was kind and thoughtful and would always help out others," the teen's parents Colin and Sally said in a statement. "The life and soul of the party, he was very outgoing, loved sports, and would always strike up a conversation with people.

"He was respectful to others and adored by all his family and friends."

Film producers Warner Bros said: "We are all shocked and saddened by this news and at this time our sympathies are with his family."

[thispego]

what the fuck does this have to do with gun control? in America?

Harry PotteR? wTF? are you drunk b2b?

[marini martini]

what the fuck does this have to do with gun control? in America?

Harry PotteR? wTF? are you drunk b2b?

:lmaoNo Shit, I was about to have my NRA speech all ready for this post!

[BigZak]

b2b is correct!

if i had to choose, i'd rather my kid get caught up in a knife fight than a gun fight anyday...

most of us mexicans carry a small blade anyway...:sombrero:

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

what the fuck does this have to do with gun control? in America?

Harry PotteR? wTF? are you drunk b2b?

If he had the right to concealed carry, he might have had a chance to protect himself.

[Bigzax]

yes, more guns are the answer! didn't you read the first post bro! the stats don't lie...

[thispego]

If he had the right to concealed carry, he might have had a chance to protect himself.

:lol do you think that's what he meant?

[marini martini]

.

[BacktoBasics]

I meant that they've only seen a total of 14 violent murders to date this year (teen murders). If they had gun accessibility like we do that number would be far greater. Eliminate the guns and you have far less fatalities. I understand that being able to carry a gun may some day protect you, I'm not disputing that but eliminating guns elimates many senseless murders and last time I checked they have guns for hunting purposes there so we can't argue that.

I found the figure of 14 to be extremely low compared to our teen crime per capita in the states and they were beginning to worry at that figure.

I also said that I may be wrong but according you gun lovers having a weapon to protect yourself eliminates crimes blah blah blah.

[BacktoBasics]

Yeah I'm only slightly buzzed, had to work today. Sup Pego

[Don Quixote]

It's okay ... you're more than free to give up your guns.

I'll keep mine, thankyou.

[balli]

:wrongf

[smeagol]

Guns are the solution.

That is pretty obvious . . .

[thispego]

i need to get a gun actually

[BacktoBasics]

:wrongfWe have a gun control forum :rolleyes

[Don Quixote]

I want a gun too. With the New Orleans PD the way it is, you can't count on them to protect you. Indeed, no man should rely on others to do what it is his intrinsic right and duty -- to protect himself and his family.

Actually, I want two guns -- a small Derringer for my wife, and a double-barrelled shotgun for me. I'm actually a lousy shot, but you don't have to be a good shot with a shotgun. Just pump & spray! Thugs-b-ded. Or, better yet, the future rap stars invading my house will hear the pumping of the shotgun and get scurred -- the shotgun is an intimidating weapon.

What I really want, though, is a Taser. I get the thug on the ground, put the leads to his nipples, and make him say humiliating things, such as "I'm worthless", "I'm a no-good piece of trash," and "I belong in prison," etc. And a Taser won't kill him, it'll just hurt him real bad. And I won't have to clean up any blood or repair my house again after shooting it up with bullets -- I've already restored my house once!

[CuckingFunt]

I want a gun too. With the New Orleans PD the way it is, you can't count on them to protect you. Indeed, no man should rely on others to do what it is his intrinsic right and duty -- to protect himself and his family.

Actually, I want two guns -- a small Derringer for my wife, and a double-barrelled shotgun for me. I'm actually a lousy shot, but you don't have to be a good shot with a shotgun. Just pump & spray! Thugs-b-ded. Or, better yet, the future rap stars invading my house will hear the pumping of the shotgun and get scurred -- the shotgun is an intimidating weapon.

What I really want, though, is a Taser. I get the thug on the ground, put the leads to his nipples, and make him say humiliating things, such as "I'm worthless", "I'm a no-good piece of trash," and "I belong in prison," etc. And a Taser won't kill him, it'll just hurt him real bad. And I won't have to clean up any blood or repair my house again after shooting it up with bullets -- I've already restored my house once!

Good to hear, preacher man.

[balli]

We have a gun control forum :rolleyes

No, but we do have one for sensitive political issues.

[BradLohaus]

It's better to look at US murder rates state by state instead of as a whole. They range from 1 per 100,000 in New Hampshire to 12.4 per 100,000 in Louisiana. County by county stats would be even better, but I've never seen anything that specific.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=12&did=169

Some of the states with the lowest rates seem like they would have plenty of gun owners, like Iowa, Idaho, Montana, and the Dakotas.

[Don Quixote]

Good to hear, preacher man.

Okay, maybe I went a little far with the humiliation bit. But I certainly affirm the right and responsibility of every man to defend his house.

[mavs>spurs2]

In a way gun control would lower the amount of violent teen deaths, but I think it's more of a society problem than a gun problem. Same thing happened at a local park by my house not too far back, 3 ended up dead in a big brawl. No guns involved, just a knife. I think the fact that some people carry guns as personal protection deters alot of would be criminals, so it's a 2 way street. The criminals are already in the wrong so they're already going to have guns. Take guns away from the innocent citizens and they can't protect themselves.

[Don Quixote]

Like I said, if you folks want to give up your guns, then by all means, do it.

But if you're going to take mine away, you're going to have to pry them from my cold, lifeless fingers. Not that I'm a gun nut -- I can hardly shoot one. But the crook doesn't need to know that.

[MannyIsGod]

14 teens violently killed in London on May 25th seems rather high to me. I'm not sure San Antonio's rate is higher than that. So I think B2B's point may be way off.

If you're going to champion statistics to back up your case then you may want to make sure the comparison you're making is valid.

[BacktoBasics]

In a way gun control would lower the amount of violent teen deaths, but I think it's more of a society problem than a gun problem. Same thing happened at a local park by my house not too far back, 3 ended up dead in a big brawl. No guns involved, just a knife. I think the fact that some people carry guns as personal protection deters alot of would be criminals, so it's a 2 way street. The criminals are already in the wrong so they're already going to have guns. Take guns away from the innocent citizens and they can't protect themselves.
Obviously its not an absolute but taking the guns away does keep guns out of criminal hands. There aren't many gun crimes in Europe but its has to equate to a good half if not more of the crimes here in the states.

[BigZak]

14 teens violently killed in London on May 25th seems rather high to me. I'm not sure San Antonio's rate is higher than that. So I think B2B's point may be way off.

If you're going to champion statistics to back up your case then you may want to make sure the comparison you're making is valid.



show me your stats!!! b2b said he wonders and you say your not sure...and i'm busy sharpening my blade...

[braeden0613]

I meant that they've only seen a total of 14 violent murders to date this year (teen murders). If they had gun accessibility like we do that number would be far greater. Eliminate the guns and you have far less fatalities. I understand that being able to carry a gun may some day protect you, I'm not disputing that but eliminating guns elimates many senseless murders and last time I checked they have guns for hunting purposes there so we can't argue that.

I found the figure of 14 to be extremely low compared to our teen crime per capita in the states and they were beginning to worry at that figure.

I also said that I may be wrong but according you gun lovers having a weapon to protect yourself eliminates crimes blah blah blah.
England's crime rate skyrocketed after they took away the right to own a gun for protection. England, especially London is a terrible example arguing for gun control (although i'm confused if you are actually doing that)

[balli]

Here's my take on guns-

I'd melt every last one of them into one big ball of metal if I could. As it is though, America is full of right wing, gun-nut, armor piercing, fully automatic, crazies. Given the unchangeable and violent nature of that climate I say if you can't beat em, join em. If there's going to be guns anyway I'd rather it not be me that get's got. That's why I rarely go anywhere without my Kimber on my chest. But again, if I could, I'd destroy every single gun on planet earth. There's somehting wrong in this country when I am able to legally carry several concealed weapons of death with me into university classrooms, but a little marijuana carried on the same campus would get me thrown into a jail cell.

[Don Quixote]

Come and try to get my guns.

[braeden0613]

Come and try to get my guns.
I know this is way off topic...but you seem to be very pro-gun, yet are voting for Obama? This is the same guy that said in 1996, he wants to "ban the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns".

[Don Quixote]

You misunderstand, my friend. I have decided to post Obama posters, drawn by his followers, as a way of sincerely apologizing for the ripping I have given him here at ST. If I didn't, I was sure Obama cultists were going to find me and kill me.

I have more Obama art (porn) here ... http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96568&highlight=hail+messiah

and here (scroll to the bottom)
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95735&highlight=hail+messiah

I hope Obama supporters know appreciate me promoting their guy.

[balli]

I hope Obama supporters know appreciate me promoting their guy.

It's cool, but in truth, he doesn't need you. God stands on his own.

[Don Quixote]

Cmon! It's about change! Obamessiah needs us! He needs me, and he needs you.

Join us.

[braeden0613]

You misunderstand, my friend. I have decided to post Obama posters, drawn by his followers, as a way of sincerely apologizing for the ripping I have given him here at ST. If I didn't, I was sure Obama cultists were going to find me and kill me.

I have more Obama art (porn) here ... http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96568&highlight=hail+messiah

and here (scroll to the bottom)
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95735&highlight=hail+messiah

I hope Obama supporters know appreciate me promoting their guy.
Ahh ok...i feel better now :king

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I meant that they've only seen a total of 14 violent murders to date this year (teen murders). If they had gun accessibility like we do that number would be far greater. Eliminate the guns and you have far less fatalities. I understand that being able to carry a gun may some day protect you, I'm not disputing that but eliminating guns elimates many senseless murders and last time I checked they have guns for hunting purposes there so we can't argue that.

I found the figure of 14 to be extremely low compared to our teen crime per capita in the states and they were beginning to worry at that figure.

I also said that I may be wrong but according you gun lovers having a weapon to protect yourself eliminates crimes blah blah blah.

A gun ban has worked wonders in Washington, D.C. :tu

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Obviously its not an absolute but taking the guns away does keep guns out of criminal hands. There aren't many gun crimes in Europe but its has to equate to a good half if not more of the crimes here in the states.

Guns can be involved in crimes without someone getting shot. Namely, robberies, rapes, etc.

The Constitution guarantees one's right to bear arms.

And further, if someone breaks into your home, unless you have a gun you are fucked. The police sure as hell aren't going to get there in time. Whatever's going to happen if someone breaks into your home while you're there is going to go down in a minute tops.

Yeah, that may give you the time to call the cops, but all they're going to be doing when they arrive is calling the coroner for your dead ass.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

There's somehting wrong in this country when I am able to legally carry several concealed weapons of death with me into university classrooms, but a little marijuana carried on the same campus would get me thrown into a jail cell.

Technically, you can't legally concealed carry on university campuses right now....

[balli]

I carried mine to class all the time last year. Welcome to the wild wild west otherwise known as Utah baby.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18355953/

As states and colleges across the country review their gun policies in light of the tragedy, many in Utah are proud to have the nation's only state law that expressly allows the carrying of concealed weapons at public colleges.

[braeden0613]

I carried mine to class all the time last year. Welcome to the wild wild west otherwise known as Utah baby.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18355953/
and let me guess, there has been no incidents since the ban was lifted?

[balli]

and let me guess, there has been no incidents since the ban was lifted?

And none before. It's a terrible law. I'm a completely radical psycho who really should last person on earth sanctioned to carry a gun anywhere, much less a university, but hey, if that's their decision.

[Don Quixote]

Guns can be involved in crimes without someone getting shot. Namely, robberies, rapes, etc.

The Constitution guarantees one's right to bear arms.

And further, if someone breaks into your home, unless you have a gun you are fucked. The police sure as hell aren't going to get there in time. Whatever's going to happen if someone breaks into your home while you're there is going to go down in a minute tops.

Yeah, that may give you the time to call the cops, but all they're going to be doing when they arrive is calling the coroner for your dead ass.

Dang straight. It's about self-defense, nothing more.

How can you call yourself a man and not even try to acquire the means to defend yourself or your family? How can a man look himself in the mirror in the morning knowing he has to rely upon the New Orleans PD (or whatever PD) to defend him if someone broke in?

I'll hand over my guns, alright, when I hand over my weenie and testicles.

[balli]

How can you call yourself a man and not even try to acquire the means to defend yourself or your family? How can a man look himself in the mirror in the morning knowing he has to rely upon the New Orleans PD (or whatever PD) to defend him if someone broke in?

The Big Lebowski: What makes a man, Mr. Lebowski?
The Dude: Dude.
The Big Lebowski: Huh?
The Dude: Uhh... I don't know sir.
The Big Lebowski: Is it being prepared to do the right thing, whatever the cost? Isn't that what makes a man?
The Dude: Hmmm... Sure, that and a pair of testicles

[Don Quixote]

Exactly!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

:lmao at the NRA members in here.

Over 11,000 gun-related deaths in the US in 2005, per capita the rate is about 15/100,000 which is 3 times the next country, Switzerland, at about 5/100,000. In Oz it's 1.5, and most of the developed world is under 2.

Legally available guns lead to more deaths, not just murders but domestic homicides and accidents. I'm very glad we have strict gun control in this country. However, I also understand that in the US it would be almost impossible to get back all the guns which presents a conundrum.

Oh, and the self-defense argument is a joke. How many people have you heard about who successfully defended themselves against crime using their gun? It doesn't happen.

[Don Quixote]

Maybe so, but if Helen Hill (indy filmmaker murdered in New Orleans, 2007) hadn't (a) let a stranger into her home, and (b) had some sort of weapon nearby, her husband wouldn't be a widower today. At least the scumbag would have thought twice if he'd known the Hills were packing heat.

I remember watching America's Most Wanted last summer, before they caught the guy, and her husband was crying -- more like sniveling -- on the show. I sympathize with him, really I do. They were obviously a couple that practiced non-violence and, I guess, expected others to live that way too. (That would be a nice thing, in my opinion.) So here he is crying on AMW, wondering why anyone would kill his wife for no reason?

I wanted to shake him and say, Michael! It was because you're a wuss! YOU lived in the Foubourg (a tough neighborhood in N.O.), YOU didn't put a fence around your yard, and YOUR wife let in a stranger. And YOU didn't have any means to defend her, you, or your son. I'm glad I calmed down, but seriously, does he expect people to just leave them alone? It's New Orleans, murder capital of the south!

I'm glad that they raise their son to be into peace and all, but it's naive to expect everyone to live that way. The fact is, there are messed-up people out there, and they have the potential to do you great harm. If you want to not have a gun, fine. But I'll exercise my 2d amendment rights, thankyou.

[Duff McCartney]

It takes more than combat gear to make a man
Takes more than a license for a gun
Confront your enemies, avoid them when you can
A gentleman will walk but never run

[marini martini]

:makemyday:makemyday:makemyday

While My Guitar Gently Weeps:cry

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

:lmao at the NRA members in here.

Over 11,000 gun-related deaths in the US in 2005, per capita the rate is about 15/100,000 which is 3 times the next country, Switzerland, at about 5/100,000. In Oz it's 1.5, and most of the developed world is under 2.

Legally available guns lead to more deaths, not just murders but domestic homicides and accidents. I'm very glad we have strict gun control in this country. However, I also understand that in the US it would be almost impossible to get back all the guns which presents a conundrum.

Oh, and the self-defense argument is a joke. How many people have you heard about who successfully defended themselves against crime using their gun? It doesn't happen.

I don't feel like digging them up, but there's been multiple cases of people defending themselves against crimes using their guns here in Texas and in other states where concealed carry licenses apply.

Also, here in Texas you can apply for and receive a concealed carry permit (CHL). Since the program was put in place, the incident rate of those with these permits being involved in any crimes is statistically lower than the state average (and this includes domestic homicides, accidents, etc.) of the general population (they extrapolated it out based on per 100,000 citizens numbers).

There were some very vocal folks in this state who were against concealed carry being legalized, some went so far as to say that blood would be running in the streets if it became law, and these folks have since admitted that it has been a deterrent against crime, based on stats.

You can also look at a country like Switzerland, where every male of military age is required, as part of the national militia, to maintain an assault rifle and a pistol at their home.

They have basically no gun crime (the number of stabbings exceed the number of shootings), and their instances of private property burglaries are way lower than here in America (I guess something about the fact of a gun being in every home doesn't sit well with said evildoers).

American citizens are constitutionally guaranteed the right to arms. If it ever changed, you'd just end up with a lot of bad guys with illegal weapons knowing they could now prey on defenseless citizens.

No thanks.

[balli]

ruffnready hates america

we know this

but what we don't know, is if ruffnready is aware that swimming pools are more dangerous than guns

The World Water Crisis?


http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/world/2000/world_water_crisis/default.stm

[balli]

I don't feel like digging them up, but there's been multiple cases of people defending themselves against crimes using their guns here in Texas and in other states where concealed carry licenses apply.

Also, here in Texas you can apply for and receive a concealed carry permit (CHL). Since the program was put in place, the incident rate of those with these permits being involved in any crimes is statistically lower than the state average (and this includes domestic homicides, accidents, etc.) of the general population (they extrapolated it out based on per 100,000 citizens numbers).

There were some very vocal folks in this state who were against concealed carry being legalized, some went so far as to say that blood would be running in the streets if it became law, and these folks have since admitted that it has been a deterrent against crime, based on stats.

You can also look at a country like Switzerland, where every male of military age is required, as part of the national militia, to maintain an assault rifle and a pistol at their home.

They have basically no gun crime (the number of stabbings exceed the number of shootings), and their instances of private property burglaries are way lower than here in America (I guess something about the fact of a gun being in every home doesn't sit well with said evildoers).

American citizens are constitutionally guaranteed the right to arms. If it ever changed, you'd just end up with a lot of bad guys with illegal weapons knowing they could now prey on defenseless citizens.

No thanks.


The problem with that argument is this. Ideally if there were no legal weapons, there would be many less illegal weapons and furthermore, gun prices on the black market would skyrocket. However, considering how many weapons have already been issued legally, as Oz pointed out, it is easy to see the problem involved with suddenly banning new sales.

Quite frankly it's an issued that neeeded to be solved in the past, because at present the United States is absolutely full up of guns and banning new ones would all of a sudden create a closed society of gun owners who would then have free reign for malpurpose if that were their intent. Quite frankly it speaks to ill nature of the American people that we have allowed weapons of death to become such a problem that they are now in some cases felt necesarry to defend oneself against other guns.

[BigZak]

i think everyone should have the right to have a gun in their own home and in their own home only...

[boutons_]

"maintain an assault rifle and a pistol at their home.

They have basically no gun crime"

You can't prove causality. That's NRA bullshit.

Switzerland, most of Europe, Japan have very low rates of violent/gun crime compared to USA, and it's not because they'e all a bunch dickless DQs and aggies packing heat.

The gun industry in the USA is NOT about self-defense.

It's about pathological infatuation with killing and guns, dicklessness (male insecurity), and dealers making tons of money selling guns and ammo to whomever the gun dealers can find, legal and illegal. In America, everything is always about $$.

2nd Amendment? GMAFB

It's wide-open to interpretation anyway. The "comma" placement?

Militia? How many of you gun-freaks are in a citizen's militia?

[MannyIsGod]

Has it gotten to the point where just seeing Ruff's posts about a controversial American issue just pisses anyone else off regardless of what he says?

[BacktoBasics]

Guns can be involved in crimes without someone getting shot. Namely, robberies, rapes, etc.

The Constitution guarantees one's right to bear arms.

And further, if someone breaks into your home, unless you have a gun you are fucked. The police sure as hell aren't going to get there in time. Whatever's going to happen if someone breaks into your home while you're there is going to go down in a minute tops.

Yeah, that may give you the time to call the cops, but all they're going to be doing when they arrive is calling the coroner for your dead ass.The Constitution also protects me from forking over 20% of my income but we all know how that goes. The Constitution also protects my right to illegal search and seizure but all know how labor day weekend went in Bexar County. Sadly the Constitution hardly means more than someones expired insurance binder.

Furthermore I don't have to back up shit. I started off by saying that I could be wrong. I also said it SEEMED low but wasn't sure. I then compared it to the total of a densely populated area like New York and the number still seemed low. I wasn't looking for a debate I was looking for opinions on something that stuck out as I read it.

To be quite honest I still don't know where I stand on gun control. I know Europes numbers skyrocketed but they've also plummeted....but then again so have ours.

So thanks for your opinions and for those of you that wanted me to back up something I never supported in the first place GO FUCK YOURSELVES.

[BradLohaus]

Over 11,000 gun-related deaths in the US in 2005, per capita the rate is about 15/100,000 which is 3 times the next country, Switzerland, at about 5/100,000.

I don't know where you got those numbers. There are over 300 million people in the US. If the 15/100,000 number is correct, then there were about 45,000 gun related deaths in the US that year. If the 11,000 number is correct, then the per capita rate that year was less than 4/100,000.

The overall murder rate in the US in 2005 was 5.6/100,000. If the rate of gun realted deaths that year was 15/100,000 then that's quite a few suicides by gunshot and gun accidents.


Oh, and the self-defense argument is a joke. How many people have you heard about who successfully defended themselves against crime using their gun? It doesn't happen.

It does happen, just not very often. Actually, the main reason for the 2nd amendment is to keep the population armed so that the government can't descend into tyranny. But history is over and only saints work in the government so that won't ever be a problem again.

[BacktoBasics]

BradLohaus

"Aggressive wars, income taxes, national IDs, domestic spying, torture regimes, secret prisons, Federal Reserve manipulation -- we don't have to take it any more." - Ron Paul


Its tough to read that sig because everytime I do I think to myself how fucking typical of America to just flat out overlook something or someone with a vision for the greater good of everyone instead of him or herself.

[Heath Ledger]

Once you give up guns, you can expect many other freedoms and liberties to be slowly taken away. For instance in the UK samurai swords have now been banned, next thing you know they will be banning steak knives.

[Geezerballer]

:lmao at the NRA members in here.

Over 11,000 gun-related deaths in the US in 2005, per capita the rate is about 15/100,000 which is 3 times the next country, Switzerland, at about 5/100,000. In Oz it's 1.5, and most of the developed world is under 2.

Legally available guns lead to more deaths, not just murders but domestic homicides and accidents. I'm very glad we have strict gun control in this country.


It’s difficult to have a serious discussion about why the U.S. has a higher murder rate than other industrial countries because nobody is willing to discuss the elephant in the room. It’s easier to demagogue the fact that there are more legal firearms here than it is to consider that we also have a much more ethnically diverse population than Sweden or Japan for example.

While some pro-gun advocates will point out the many regions where gun ownership is high (rural America) while the murder rate is low, they stop far short of noting that the population in these low crime areas is predominantly white. In fact the murder rate by whites in America is comparable to the murder rates of the other nations so often brought up by the gun control groups.

Statistics from U.S. Justice Dept. show that while blacks are just 13% of the population but they commit more than half the muggings and murders in the country. Hispanics commit violent crimes at about three times the white rate.

The proportion of blacks and Hispanics in an area is the single best indicator of how dangerous it is. The racial mix is a much better predictor of crime rates than poverty, unemployment and dropout rates combined.

This may be an uncomfortable element to consider but if you expect to find effective solutions to a problem, you can’t turn away from facts.

[BradLohaus]

BradLohaus

"Aggressive wars, income taxes, national IDs, domestic spying, torture regimes, secret prisons, Federal Reserve manipulation -- we don't have to take it any more." - Ron Paul


Its tough to read that sig because everytime I do I think to myself how fucking typical of America to just flat out overlook something or someone with a vision for the greater good of everyone instead of him or herself.

True. Paul really is politics to improve his country and not his own postition in the world. Not many of those around anymore.

[balli]

The proportion of blacks and Hispanics in an area is the single best indicator of how dangerous it is. The racial mix is a much better predictor of crime rates than poverty, unemployment and dropout rates combined.

As if poverty, unemployment and dropout rates didn't unproportionally affect the minorities living in said area.

Disgustingly and dangerously simple minded/racist post BTW

[CuckingFunt]

As if poverty, unemployment and dropout rates didn't unproportionally affect minorities.

Disgustingly and dangerously simple minded post BTW

Agreed.

[Nbadan]

As if poverty, unemployment and dropout rates didn't unproportionally affect the minorities living in said area.

Disgustingly and dangerously simple minded/racist post BTW

It' s the same old ideological trap of trying to find causation from correlation....

[BradLohaus]

This may be an uncomfortable element to consider but if you expect to find effective solutions to a problem, you can’t turn away from facts.

I'd like to see a study that compares the murder rate, the illegitimacy rate, and the per capita income in every region in the US.

[Geezerballer]

It' s the same old ideological trap of trying to find causation from correlation....

You mean like "the reason we have a higher murder rate in the U.S. is because we have more guns?"

[BacktoBasics]

True. Paul really is politics to improve his country and not his own postition in the world. Not many of those around anymore.Fucking sad no one can see it.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Quite frankly it speaks to ill nature of the American people that we have allowed weapons of death to become such a problem that they are now in some cases felt necesarry to defend oneself against other guns.

I don't necessarily worry about defending myself against other guns. A bad guy can do just as much damage with a knife, baseball bat, crobar, whatever floats his boat, if I have nothing to defend myself and my family with.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

"maintain an assault rifle and a pistol at their home.

They have basically no gun crime"

You can't prove causality. That's NRA bullshit.

Switzerland, most of Europe, Japan have very low rates of violent/gun crime compared to USA, and it's not because they'e all a bunch dickless DQs and aggies packing heat.



You're a fucking idiot. Switzerland isn't NRA propaganda, it's a fact, and one that the Swiss are damn proud of. Funny, theirs is actually one born out of what happened on their continent with the Germans, so it's a much more recent addition to their country's culture than ours.


The gun industry in the USA is NOT about self-defense.

It's about pathological infatuation with killing and guns, dicklessness (male insecurity), and dealers making tons of money selling guns and ammo to whomever the gun dealers can find, legal and illegal. In America, everything is always about $$.

You're a fucking idiot. I own a firearm, and it's not about killing. I pray to God that I never have to use it to take another human being's life, though if you come into my house with ill intent you can damn sure bet on it being your ass instead of mine or my family's.

The only insecurity here is knowing if someone were to break down my door at 2 AM that 9-1-1 emergency isn't going to get here in time.



2nd Amendment? GMAFB


As much as you bitch on the political forum about the government taking away our rights as citizens to privacy, it's slightly (and by slightly I mean the size of the Grand Canyon) hypocritical of you to shit on the second amendment just because it doesn't suit your pussification and socialization of America agenda.



It's wide-open to interpretation anyway. The "comma" placement?


It's not wide open to interpration, if it were it wouldn't still be a fundamental tenant of our rights as Americans, because lord knows the Democrats have tried to ban firearms time and time again.



Militia? How many of you gun-freaks are in a citizen's militia?

It's cute, anyone who embraces our constitutionally guaranteed freedoms is now a 'gun-freak'. Exaggerate much?

There's no need to be in a citizen's militia at this point, though if shit keeps up that may change. And I guess you missed the citizens of Louisiana joining together to deal with thieves who were looting homes after Katrina...

You miss the whole point about the militia - the Founding Fathers considered the right to bear arms and form a militia critical to the security of the nation. Hell, it was the SECOND amendment they put down on paper.

I don't know who did your home schooling, but whoever it was did a shitty job.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Fucking sad no one can see it.

It's funny that you went off on me earlier in this thread, yet we agree on Paul...

He was the best man for the job this fall, but he didn't cater to special interests in D.C. so he got taken apart by the media and those in his party with a special interest agenda.

Sad.