My World Series of Poker eperiemce:

[Jimcs50]

I just got back from Vegas last night.

I played in the $1500 buy-in event #39 which started Saturday at 12 pm. I went with two buddies who also entered. We got to Vegas Friday morning and we went directly to The Rio and signed up for a Satelite to try to win some tokens($500) so we could get into the tourney at a discount. I played 3 single table $275 buy-in tourneys. The winner gets three tokens and $120 cash. The first tourney, we got down to 3 of us and we chopped and gave the chip leader the $120 and me and the other guy got one token each. I lost the next satelite and chopped the 3rd one with one guy in the 3rd, with me getting 2 tokens and the cash and he getting the one token, because I had him 2-1 in chips. So now I had my 3 tokens to get into the big tourney for only about $700....so things were looking great.

There were 2750 players entered including almost every top pro. 270 players get paid which was about $2800 for the last place finisher.


I have to say that I played my best poker ever.

I started out losing 1/3 of my starting 3000 chips in my first hand :bang to the player on my right when I finially folded(after thinking for 2 minutes)after the river when I knew that I was beat. He told me that he would tell me what he had when we changed tables or if he or I got eliminated. (He got eliminated 2 hrs later and he told me what he had which was the exact hand that I had him on, so I knew that I was playing great at that point).


I slowly made my chips back throughout the first 3 hrs and by the time my table broke and I went to a new table at 4:30, I had my stack up to about 5000 chips, which was just slightly less than the average chip stack.

I made a great call for all my chips in the next 2 hrs to get my stack up to 11,000 chips. We then went into the main room(the one you see on tv) I doubled up again at the expense of the table chip leader with the greatest call of my life, considering what was at stake.

The hand:

150-300 blinds $25 anties


I am in the big blind with 8-6, the chip leader limps in the cutoff and the action is folded to me and I check.

Flop: 2 2 8 (two spades)

Great for me! I bet 1000 chips, chip leader calls. a 3 h comes on the turn. I bet 3000 chips, he calls. A 10 of clubs comes on the river.

I check, he goes all in. I start thinking out loud. I told him he could not have a 2 because had he had an ace(only card that plays with a 2 at this point) , he would have raised in the cutoff. Only a 10 beats me, and the only hand that I could see him having with his calls is a 10 of spades with an ace, king, queen, or jack of spades. Un-likely

I put him on a busted flush draw and that he was trying to steal on the river.

I call, he mucks. :elephant


I now have 24,000 chips, twice the average stack. :)


Our table breaks.


My new table has no big stacks, in fact, when I arrive, one player announces "Big stack coming in" Good news for me.

There are now only 650 players left.

I lose a pretty good hand before the dinner break at 7:00 and go down 21,000 chips.

I come back at 8:30 and I get no hands for an hour and 2 other players catch me in chips and 3 players bust out. The good news is, Evelyn Ng sits down in seat 2(I am in seat 5) She is smokin hot :eyebrows

Blinds are 600-1200 and anties are 100.

I am on the button and the action folds to me, I look down at KJ spades, which is great for me at this point with only the blinds to act after me and 2800 in the pot. I raise to 3600, small blind fold, but the BB who has my size stack raises it to 10,000. I had been stealing from him for the last hr when his stack was low, but he tripled up a few minutes prior and now was a force to be reckoned with. There is about 16000 in the pot, so I have to call because I was getting over 2-1 odds and there is a chance that he was making a play, because he was getting tired of me pushing him around prior to this, so I call.


Flop:

Jd 8s 5s :toast

Top pair, 2nd nut flush draw, could not have been much better for me.

BB goes all in. I think for a minute, and decide that even if he has aces, I am slight favorite, I call.

He turns over QJ :elephant


The table goes bananas, all telling me that I made a nice call. I am already envisioning myself at the Final table on ESPN with all of you guys watching me win my first bracelet. :)

the turn is a blank

He has only 2 outs, because the queen od spades gives me the flush....he is a 20-1 underdog with only 2 outs.


The river:

Qd


He had 200 more chips that I, I was out.


:bang:bang:bang:bang


Holy Mother of God, how can lfe be so cruel??? I played the best poker of my life, made every right decision, and to have it all end with a miracle river, just punched me right in the nads.


Had he not hit the 2 outter, I would have had 46.000 chips, which at the time was in 3rd place out of the last 340 players. I would have cruised into the money, and maybe, just maybe won the whole damn thing.


:depressed


The good news, I won enough money in cash games the rest of the weekend to come home with $1000 more than I left with.

Also, I was playing at a table on Sat night when someone at Imperial Palace hit the bad beat jackpot which was $110,000. those two players get 30% and 20% and every player at a cash game table in the 6 casinos that were in the consortium got the rest. I got $260. :elephant The hand was quad 9s beaten by a 9 high straight flush.


Anyhoo, I am still a bit down, but I am proud of myself for playing great and getting all my money in with the best hand.......so it goes.

[Jimcs50]

Wow, sorry this is so long, but if you like poker, it is worth a read, I think

[ATRAIN]

Sometimes you can play the right way and still lose, its why they call it gambling. Sucks though, but im sure it was an experience. For all us non richers that will never do it hahah sorry had to!!

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Great story Jim. Sorry that you didn't win it all, Poker Rocky style, but there's always next year. That would have been the balls if you had made it on ESPN rocking a Spurstalk shirt.

[2centsworth]

You were on your game. Great calls, to get sucked out with a 2 outer is brutal.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

kn481KcjvMo

Here's to you Jim! :toast

[remingtonbo2001]

Wow, I'm not even a huge poker fan and I found that story interesting.

Hey, at least you got the opportunity to be in that situation.

Consider yourself blessed. :)

[tlongII]

I'd hit it.

http://media.musictoday.com/store/bands/1633/product_medium/WRAM57.jpg

[SequSpur]

you suck....... :)

[peewee's lovechild]

"Don't you draw the Queen of Diamonds, boy . . . she'll beat you if she's able."

[Cry Havoc]

Wow, sorry this is so long, but if you like poker, it is worth a read, I think

Read it all. Sounds like you made some good plays. The good news is that if you keep making the calls you made in that tournament, eventually you'll find yourself among the elite poker players.

Don't agonize over it too much, man. You did EVERYTHING you could and had absolutely no control over that no-out hand the guy pulled on you. If you played a shit hand or made a bad call then you could be really pissed.

I'm thinking about doing it next year. It sounds like a lot of fun. Perhaps I'll see you on the table across from me. :hat

[to21]

"Don't you draw the Queen of Diamonds, boy . . . she'll beat you if she's able."A song for all the bad beats taken by The Eagles.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Man! So close.


Sounds like an awesome experience. :tu

[Jimcs50]

I'd hit it.

http://media.musictoday.com/store/bands/1633/product_medium/WRAM57.jpg


Leave it to tlong to look at the one good thing about my story.

:lol


BTW, that pic does not do her justice.

Here is a better one:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Ng

[Jimcs50]

"Don't you draw the Queen of Diamonds, boy . . . she'll beat you if she's able."


:lol

Wow, Desperado, by the Eagles....I did not even realize that. I used to love that song.......till just now.

:)

[Jimcs50]

Read it all. Sounds like you made some good plays. The good news is that if you keep making the calls you made in that tournament, eventually you'll find yourself among the elite poker players.

Don't agonize over it too much, man. You did EVERYTHING you could and had absolutely no control over that no-out hand the guy pulled on you. If you played a shit hand or made a bad call then you could be really pissed.

I'm thinking about doing it next year. It sounds like a lot of fun. Perhaps I'll see you on the table across from me. :hat


That would be cool, but if you go, let's go the same time...I usually go for the same 1500 tourney in June tourney 38 or 39 usually.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

http://www.everypoker.com/g/poker-superstars/evelyn-ng.jpg

[E20]

Did you see any famous poker players?

[peewee's lovechild]

http://www.everypoker.com/g/poker-superstars/evelyn-ng.jpg

I would gladly poke her.

[Jimcs50]

An aside, my 2 buddies got busted out in 2nd and 3rd session. The one (Brad) that got eliminated early got on a bad table with a bunch of wild internet players who played kamikaze poker. He was sitting to the right of Alex Jacob who was not playing like that, but the action was 25-50 blinds, then some fucker makes it 800-1000 every time, so Brad could not make any calls to see flops without getting a premium hand first, which he really never got and when he tried to get into a pot, the guy would push all in after the flop, so he was screwed pretty much....bad luck. He finally called an all-in preflop with AK suited against a mid pair, and did not catch...

[J.T.]

Sounds like Tim Donaghy was the dealer, got your hopes up and then had to make The Man happy.

[Brutalis]

Sweet story. I'm a noob poker player myself.

Who won it anyways? Been a fan of Daniel Negranue (spelling) myself.

And I wouldn't touch that chick at all. Yuuuckkky.

[Jimcs50]

Did you see any famous poker players?

Yes, I saw quite a few. Humberto"The Shark is coming" Brenes, and Greg Raymer in the hallway, and I got a picture of Joe Hashem. Barry Greenstein, Scotty Nguyen and Eric Lingren were sitting at tables all around me towards the end there. Johnny Chan got eliminated in first 5 minutes I hear.

[Jimcs50]

Who won it anyways? Been a fan of Daniel Negranue (spelling) myself.


David Woo

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Yes, I saw quite a few. Humberto"The Shark is coming" Brenes, and Greg Raymer in the hallway, and I got a picture of Joe Hashem. Barry Greenstein, Scotty Nguyen and Eric Lingren were sitting at tables all around me towards the end there. Johnny Chan got eliminated in first 5 minutes I hear.

He was never the same since Matt Damon bluffed him out of a pot.

[Jimcs50]

And I wouldn't touch that chick at all. Yuuuckkky.

Dude, those are bad pics, she is quite beautiful in person and on tv.

[E20]

I always would have liked to play against:
Scotty Ngyuen
Phil Hellmuth

That would be a fun/interesting experience, based on there personalities, Matusow would be the same as well.

[Jimcs50]

He was never the same since Matt Damon bluffed him out of a pot.


:lol


You got it, Johnny?

[Jimcs50]

I always would have liked to play against:
Scotty Ngyuen
Phil Hellmuth

That would be a fun/interesting experience, based on there personalities, Matusow would be the same as well.

Helmuth was busted out, but I could have gotten seated with Scotty, had I won that hand, because there would have been only about 9 tables left by the end of Saturday.

[Cry Havoc]

Helmuth was busted out, but I could have gotten seated with Scotty, had I won that hand, because there would have been only about 9 tables left by the end of Saturday.

Damn, that hurts. I got knocked out of a tourney cause some noob called me with 10-9 off, and I had pocket rockets. Of course his full house comes (something like 4-9-9-10) and then I make my set. :pctoss

[Jimcs50]

Damn, that hurts. I got knocked out of a tourney cause some noob called me with 10-9 off, and I had pocket rockets. Of course his full house comes (something like 4-9-9-10) and then I make my set. :pctoss


If you made your set your Aces full would have beaten his 9s full. You sure he did not make quads?

[E20]

Damn, that hurts. I got knocked out of a tourney cause some noob called me with 10-9 off, and I had pocket rockets. Of course his full house comes (something like 4-9-9-10) and then I make my set. :pctoss

9-10 suited or not is a playable hand. It depends on when the initia bet was made pre flop of after.

[SequSpur]

you guys are fricking gay.... come play a poker game with me someday..bring alot of money cuz you're ass ain't staying unless you keep rebuying...

[Cry Havoc]

If you made your set your Aces full would have beaten his 9s full. You sure he did not make quads?

I don't remember the hand exactly. Maybe I didn't hit the trips. =\

[Jimcs50]

you guys are fricking gay.... come play a poker game with me someday..bring alot of money cuz you're ass ain't staying unless you keep rebuying...


:lol

I will beat you even more than I do in golf..
:)

[Fabbs]

Awesome Jim and while I'm still a noob, I cannot believe how much the huge dogs end up winning on hands. Just seems like oftentimes skill has nothing to do with it, like the river Q card that got you out.

On the other "hand", if you made it that far and went out on a bad beat, you've obviously got skills.

I'm reading, it's helping.

[MannyIsGod]

Ng is soooooooooooooooooooooo damn hot dude. Beat part of the story was hearing you sat with her.

Sucks you got sucked out on there. I don't know if I call his reraise there PF. If I think I'm ahead I push instead since you're putting in over a third of your stack on the call. Then again, you do have position and I pretty much suck ass at tournament poker. I just think if you miss the flop you have a tough decision when you may very well have the best hand.

Awesome to see you did well though. All you can do is get it in ahead or make them make a tough call.

[MannyIsGod]

Sweet story. I'm a noob poker player myself.

Who won it anyways? Been a fan of Daniel Negranue (spelling) myself.

And I wouldn't touch that chick at all. Yuuuckkky.

Don't worry - I'm sure you'll never have to.

[MannyIsGod]

An aside, my 2 buddies got busted out in 2nd and 3rd session. The one (Brad) that got eliminated early got on a bad table with a bunch of wild internet players who played kamikaze poker. He was sitting to the right of Alex Jacob who was not playing like that, but the action was 25-50 blinds, then some fucker makes it 800-1000 every time, so Brad could not make any calls to see flops without getting a premium hand first, which he really never got and when he tried to get into a pot, the guy would push all in after the flop, so he was screwed pretty much....bad luck. He finally called an all-in preflop with AK suited against a mid pair, and did not catch...

No way dude. Thats why they play like that. Those tournament LAGs will play so fucking loose early on because no one will play back at them without the nuts. They either bust out early or they build a huge chipstack before the first break then they have a lot of power to play with. As the tables I play have gotten tougher I've had to learn a lot more LAG tendencies and its sooooooooooooooo god damn hard for me but its so damn fun too. Just play back at them if you think you're ahead. You'll win more often then not. Maybe. :lol

[Jimcs50]

I don't know if I call his reraise there PF. If I think I'm ahead I push instead since you're putting in over a third of your stack on the call. Then again, you do have position and I pretty much suck ass at tournament poker. I just think if you miss the flop you have a tough decision when you may very well have the best hand.

Awesome to see you did well though. All you can do is get it in ahead or make them make a tough call.

Manny, when he raised it to 10,000, the pot then had almost 17,000, so I was getting almost 3-1 on my call of 6400 more. I had great implied odds too, if I hit my hand. The only hands that have me crushed are Kings and Aces.....so it was really a no brainer as far as calling....and given that there was a great chance that since he was stacked up recently, he wanted to play back at me for picking on his blinds a few times when he was lower stacked.

I am glad you recognize a hot poker player too in Evelyn Ng. :)

[SequSpur]

Jim should've folded on the reraise. He had premature ejaculation..read to much into it and got wacked. Sounds like you did great, but you started thinking outside the game... the dude had you beat and you thought he was playing you and really he had you beat.. oh well, that's cool that you did that...

[MannyIsGod]

Manny, when he raised it to 10,000, the pot then had almost 17,000, so I was getting almost 3-1 on my call of 6400 more. I had great implied odds too, if I hit my hand. The only hands that have me crushed are Kings and Aces.....so it was really a no brainer as far as calling....and given that there was a great chance that since he was stacked up recently, he wanted to play back at me for picking on his blinds a few times when he was lower stacked.

I am glad you recognize a hot poker player too in Evelyn Ng. :)

I think calling for 6k is correct now that you put it that way. I'm thinking of calling for 10k and even though 6k out of 22000 is still a good chunk of your stack you have a really good spot with a player that you've been picking on and you're in position so I think its a good hand to win some chips with.

Really sucks you got beat there that way. Thats what sucks about tournament poker for me. Its one and done. At a cash table you just reload and stack the fucker and get your money back and then some, but in this situation you just kinda walk away with your tail tucked inbetween your legs.

At least you left Vegas up. I haven't ruled out going before the end of the WSOP but I'm already making a trip to California in August (playing at the Bike and Commerce WOOT) and I may spend some time traveling this fall so I don't think its in the cards (pun intended).

[SequSpur]

If Jim was off the blind, shouldn't he have came in stronger? Maybe that dude folds... Instead, coming in slightly better than weak told the guy he was trying to get lucky...shit, that ain't even a slow play... oh well....

[MannyIsGod]

Jim was on the button. He wasn't in the blind.

[SequSpur]

exactly...told ya it was luck. :lmao

[MannyIsGod]

OH YEAH.

And I really like your play in the hand where you doubled up early. I'd check that river a lot to induce a bluff from busted draws. If he has a ten and owns you then so be it but when you check there you're going to induce a lot of bluffs and you have to call no matter what comes on the river. Thats a really really good job of doubling up.

[Heath Ledger]

At those blind levels, you should have folded the reraise, if it was a shorter stack insta call, however you don't want to get into coinflip situation still so early in the tourney especially if someone has you covered. yes it sucks to have to fold but live to see another day, you made a semi good read but the end result of course sucked cuz he sucked out on you. KJ suited and reraised is an instafold, any pair is ahead and u must worry about jj qq kk aa and ak all of which have you crushed. You made an amateur call and were asking for trouble in that situation still fairly early in the tourney. KJ suited is not a premium hand in that situation.

[MannyIsGod]

Meh - he made a read and went with it. The call isn't as bad as it first looks when you consider the dead money, he's in position, and any pot you play will be for a big portion of your stack. I agree KJ is a meh hand but the BB's RR range is huge considering he's been played at and he's probably playing back. You can see the evidence in that he showed down QJ. I think there are times where you go to a showdown and see a premium hand but depending on the flop you may have outs. I think 2:1 odds at this point in the tourney makes a call fine. At first I said I prefered a push over a call but I think with KJ a push is bad as a ton of hands that call the push will be way ahead and you'll fold out the hands you beat. Calling allows you to try to outplay your opponent on the flop.

[Jimcs50]

Meh - he made a read and went with it. The call isn't as bad as it first looks when you consider the dead money, he's in position, and any pot you play will be for a big portion of your stack. I agree KJ is a meh hand but the BB's RR range is huge considering he's been played at and he's probably playing back. You can see the evidence in that he showed down QJ. I think there are times where you go to a showdown and see a premium hand but depending on the flop you may have outs. I think 2:1 odds at this point in the tourney makes a call fine. At first I said I prefered a push over a call but I think with KJ a push is bad as a ton of hands that call the push will be way ahead and you'll fold out the hands you beat. Calling allows you to try to outplay your opponent on the flop.

actually, it was closer to 3-1 odds on my call...and the only hands that are worse odds to beat are AA or KK, and I think if he had one of those 2 hands, he would have taken pot odds out of the equation and just pushed all in preflop, and taken down the 7k in the pot.

[Jimcs50]

At those blind levels, you should have folded the reraise, if it was a shorter stack insta call, however you don't want to get into coinflip situation still so early in the tourney especially if someone has you covered. yes it sucks to have to fold but live to see another day, you made a semi good read but the end result of course sucked cuz he sucked out on you. KJ suited and reraised is an instafold, any pair is ahead and u must worry about jj qq kk aa and ak all of which have you crushed. You made an amateur call and were asking for trouble in that situation still fairly early in the tourney. KJ suited is not a premium hand in that situation.


Yes you do want to get into a coinflip when you are getting 3-1 odds, that is the no-brainer.

:rolleyes

[tlongII]

I could give a shit about your poker strategy. Why didn't you hit on Evelyn???

[SequSpur]

You risked your whole load and hard work on a so so hand that wasn't even that great. You should've folded when dude reraised. Cuz you didn't have shit. You got used just like the Spurs did in the Lakers series.

[Cry Havoc]

You risked your whole load and hard work on a so so hand that wasn't even that great. You should've folded when dude reraised. Cuz you didn't have shit. You got used just like the Spurs did in the Lakers series.

Don't mind Sequ, he only plays AA, KK, AK because those are the only "great" hands to start with. :lmao

You play poker and all gambling because it's the odds. That's the CONCEPT of poker. My god, it's such a simple concept.

I guess some people wait around until they've got a sure thing. If you've got cowboys in the hole, don't go up against QQ, they might pull a doozy on fourth street! Fold your hand away and save your money! :lmao

That's why you've got several WSOP bracelets to give you bragging rights to talk shit, right Sequ?

[2centsworth]

So Jim has the opportunity to become a monster stack and coast into the money as a 20 to 1 favorite and people are riding him because the other guy got majorly lucky?

OK, I take 20 to 1 all day versus your 3 to 1 AA versus 98 suited.

[Fabbs]

So Jim has the opportunity to become a monster stack and coast into the money as a 20 to 1 favorite and people are riding him because the other guy got majorly lucky?

OK, I take 20 to 1 all day versus your 3 to 1 AA versus 98 suited.
+1

And no props should be given to the 20-1 Bingo Dork who sucked out.
Many tourneys the winner is simply greasy. Jamie Gold, last years winner Yang made horrible plays and sucked out.

[Cry Havoc]

So Jim has the opportunity to become a monster stack and coast into the money as a 20 to 1 favorite and people are riding him because the other guy got majorly lucky?

OK, I take 20 to 1 all day versus your 3 to 1 AA versus 98 suited.

+1

[Jimcs50]

So Jim has the opportunity to become a monster stack and coast into the money as a 20 to 1 favorite and people are riding him because the other guy got majorly lucky?

OK, I take 20 to 1 all day versus your 3 to 1 AA versus 98 suited.


Thankyou buddy, I have been second guessing myself for even raising with the KJ in the first place, because had I limped, he would have checked and when the flop hit, he would have bet a small bet and then I move all in first, and no way could he call my bet and I would have taken in a nice pot.

But, with KJ spades, my stack size, position and his lack of defending his BB against me in the past, I felt that I made the right move.......oh well. If this is the worst thing that happens to me this year, I am a lucky guy.

No more whining..... :)

[Heath Ledger]

At least your read was right, my only thing is that too many hands are ahead of you as KJ is such a dominated hand. You could have folded and picked a better spot to play a big hand, big hands big pots, kj is not a big hand, its a speculative hand, good enough for trying to steal the blinds or raise from late position but when faced with a reraise its about garbage. And you say you were getting 3-1 thats great but you still have just kj, even though you hit your top pair, who's to say the guy didnt reraise with ak, kq suited(doubtful there probably a flat call)

kq, qq, kk, aa, any pair for that matter and you inevitbly busted

oh well thats poker i guess but i think you still had plenty of chips and should have looked for a better situation than to commit so heavily with a dominated hand. KJ is exactly the kind of hand that gets people in trouble when they hit their top pair. I have no problems with your post flop play however you could have been dominated which wasn't the case.

Good news is its over, you probably learned something and wiill use it in your arsenal next time, plust the world series experience is always a good notch on your belt.

[Jimcs50]

At least your read was right, my only thing is that too many hands are ahead of you as KJ is such a dominated hand. You could have folded and picked a better spot to play a big hand, big hands big pots, kj is not a big hand, its a speculative hand, good enough for trying to steal the blinds or raise from late position but when faced with a reraise its about garbage. And you say you were getting 3-1 thats great but you still have just kj, even though you hit your top pair, who's to say the guy didnt reraise with ak, kq suited(doubtful there probably a flat call)

kq, qq, kk, aa, any pair for that matter and you inevitbly busted

oh well thats poker i guess but i think you still had plenty of chips and should have looked for a better situation than to commit so heavily with a dominated hand. KJ is exactly the kind of hand that gets people in trouble when they hit their top pair. I have no problems with your post flop play however you could have been dominated which wasn't the case.

Good news is its over, you probably learned something and wiill use it in your arsenal next time, plust the world series experience is always a good notch on your belt.


You are right about the hand being a really bad hand to call a reraise with, and I usually dump it under most circumstances, but in small stack tourneys, you have to go with your gut sometimes and go with pot odds and that can cost you dearly sometimes, when you are wrong. As I said earlier, I should have limped and I would have won the hand most likely after my all in on the flop to his pot sized bet on the flop.

It is good to talk to poker players about this, because I can learn from you guys, and I want to keep getting better and better and to do that, you have to make mistakes.

[Cry Havoc]

At least your read was right, my only thing is that too many hands are ahead of you as KJ is such a dominated hand. You could have folded and picked a better spot to play a big hand, big hands big pots, kj is not a big hand, its a speculative hand, good enough for trying to steal the blinds or raise from late position but when faced with a reraise its about garbage. And you say you were getting 3-1 thats great but you still have just kj, even though you hit your top pair, who's to say the guy didnt reraise with ak, kq suited(doubtful there probably a flat call)

kq, qq, kk, aa, any pair for that matter and you inevitbly busted

oh well thats poker i guess but i think you still had plenty of chips and should have looked for a better situation than to commit so heavily with a dominated hand. KJ is exactly the kind of hand that gets people in trouble when they hit their top pair. I have no problems with your post flop play however you could have been dominated which wasn't the case.

Good news is its over, you probably learned something and wiill use it in your arsenal next time, plust the world series experience is always a good notch on your belt.

Perhaps.

But by the same token, if his opponent doesn't land that out, he's in the top 5 of the chip leaders and could make a run at winning the whole damn thing.

That's what it's all about, right? Even if he gets a couple of bad beats, if he plays well the rest of the way out (assuming he wins that pot), he's going to end up pretty high in the competition, most likely.

I'd still take that chance. KJ isn't a horrible hand. If you only wait for AA, AK, KK, etc., you're going to get hammered pre-flop all day long, and when you go in, people are going to fold right and left to you because you only play the best hands.

[Heath Ledger]

Another thing to think about is he said he had been stealing blinds on the guy for about an hour, the guy basicly did a 3bet raise on his standard 3xbb raise, usually when a bb picks a spot to stand up to the button bully he has something at the very least possibly an ace rag suited or a10, small pair etc, its very unlikely a bb will reraise with air, so because of this i still don't like the call, it is cruel that you made a "read" which is a guess and you were right but got crushed on the river, but that as you know is poker. The river can either break you or propel you into a household name.

Good news is you have plenty of years left to play more events, if i wasn't so busy with my business at the moment i would have played in one or two small buy in events (1500) the main event you might as well be playing a scratchoff lottery ticket.

[Jimcs50]

Another thing to think about is he said he had been stealing blinds on the guy for about an hour, the guy basicly did a 3bet raise on his standard 3xbb raise, usually when a bb picks a spot to stand up to the button bully he has something at the very least possibly an ace rag suited or a10, small pair etc, its very unlikely a bb will reraise with air, so because of this i still don't like the call, it is cruel that you made a "read" which is a guess and you were right but got crushed on the river, but that as you know is poker. The river can either break you or propel you into a household name.

Good news is you have plenty of years left to play more events, if i wasn't so busy with my business at the moment i would have played in one or two small buy in events (1500) the main event you might as well be playing a scratchoff lottery ticket.


My initial read was that the BB just got some chips to defend, with his recent triple up and he was just getting some revenge because he thought I was your typical button bully, which I am not, unless I have a whole lot of chips and I am going against a medium stack, not a tiny stack(a tiny stack with push all in with any ace) I just figured that KJs is a great hand against a random hand in the blinds(there are over 1300 hands worse than my hand and only a handful that are over 3-1 favs over my hand.

The main event is ridiculous. There are 4 opening days, and a day offbetw the 4 days and the start of day 2 and there are 2 of them. So, you might have to wait 4 days betw your first and 2nd day....that is horrible....who has that kind of time?

Maybe when I retire.

[MannyIsGod]

Perhaps.

But by the same token, if his opponent doesn't land that out, he's in the top 5 of the chip leaders and could make a run at winning the whole damn thing.

That's what it's all about, right? Even if he gets a couple of bad beats, if he plays well the rest of the way out (assuming he wins that pot), he's going to end up pretty high in the competition, most likely.

I'd still take that chance. KJ isn't a horrible hand. If you only wait for AA, AK, KK, etc., you're going to get hammered pre-flop all day long, and when you go in, people are going to fold right and left to you because you only play the best hands.

You had me until you said KJ isn't a horrible hand. It actually is. I'd much rather play suited connectors, suited one gappers, off suit connectors, off suit one gappers, and even some suited and off suit 2 gappers. KJ is so painful to play in re raised pots because of domination issues. You're not really ahead of much and while 3:1 is great against a hand like AQ its really not that good against much else of a normal 3 bet.

Since the guy may just be restealing you have to adjust his range somewhat, but KJ really never a hand I want in that situation.

I think Jim played it fine as I said before, but its a pretty marginal situation either way. Without a solid read there I'd toss the hand away.

[MannyIsGod]

My initial read was that the BB just got some chips to defend, with his recent triple up and he was just getting some revenge because he thought I was your typical button bully, which I am not, unless I have a whole lot of chips and I am going against a medium stack, not a tiny stack(a tiny stack with push all in with any ace) I just figured that KJs is a great hand against a random hand in the blinds(there are over 1300 hands worse than my hand and only a handful that are over 3-1 favs over my hand.

The main event is ridiculous. There are 4 opening days, and a day offbetw the 4 days and the start of day 2 and there are 2 of them. So, you might have to wait 4 days betw your first and 2nd day....that is horrible....who has that kind of time?

Maybe when I retire.

I don't think he'd defend with any 2 cards. Then again, you're probably closer to being right than I am because I think QJ is a horrible hand to defend with. Also, if you think you're that far ahead of his range then I still think you should push because if the flop comes and it doesn't give you a strong draw, K, or a J then you h ave a really tough decision.

But yeah, I can't remember the last time I cashed in a real MTT. I've played in some online micros to kill time but those are so easy the don't count.

[Fabbs]

For all you who say his KJ suited sucked, what about Bingo Dorks QJ unsuited?

If Jim made a bad call, then Bingo Dork must have made a horrific call.
And since head to head is only about who wins, i say Jims *bad* call >>>> Bingo Dorks horrible bet.

This was just pure b.s. grease, Jim and anyone should make that same exact call 7 days a week at the far superior call at 20-1.

[johnsmith]

This is why I complain about poker on ESPN, it's created a bunch of know it all douche bags.

[Cry Havoc]

I don't think he'd defend with any 2 cards. Then again, you're probably closer to being right than I am because I think QJ is a horrible hand to defend with. Also, if you think you're that far ahead of his range then I still think you should push because if the flop comes and it doesn't give you a strong draw, K, or a J then you h ave a really tough decision.

But yeah, I can't remember the last time I cashed in a real MTT. I've played in some online micros to kill time but those are so easy the don't count.

But the action had folded around. I'll play KJ against someone heads-up, especially if they're limping.

You can't just say that "KJ" is horrible in the general sense of the word. Ducks in the hole (the cards, not the ST Ducks) or a 7-8 suited is not typically a strong hand preflop at a table. However, heads-up, even a low pair can be a complete monster.

You play your opponent as much as the cards. If I have J-8 off on the big, and I see the little limp in (flop comes 2c, Jc, 9s) and check while staring at the 2 clubs on the board, continue to limp on 4th street (Kd), you bet your ass I'm going to pound him with chips and make him pay to see that last card. It's a horrible call on his part for a lot of chips unless he's got an over card. Putting all your chips down with Jacks and a Queen kicker is a similarly bad call. He got outed on the river. Period.

You cannot beat someone who gets that lucky, because you cannot afford to only play the best hands in tourneys. People start dumping to you left and right if you only raise when you've got a flush or better.

[Jimcs50]

But the action had folded around. I'll play KJ against someone heads-up, especially if they're limping.

You can't just say that "KJ" is horrible in the general sense of the word. Ducks in the hole (the cards, not the ST Ducks) or a 7-8 suited is not typically a strong hand preflop at a table. However, heads-up, even a low pair can be a complete monster.

You play your opponent as much as the cards. If I have J-8 off on the big, and I see the little limp in (flop comes 2c, Jc, 9s) and check while staring at the 2 clubs on the board, continue to limp on 4th street (Kd), you bet your ass I'm going to pound him with chips and make him pay to see that last card. It's a horrible call on his part for a lot of chips unless he's got an over card. Putting all your chips down with Jacks and a Queen kicker is a similarly bad call. He got outed on the river. Period.

You cannot beat someone who gets that lucky, because you cannot afford to only play the best hands in tourneys. People start dumping to you left and right if you only raise when you've got a flush or better.


Spot on there. You have to mix things up in a small stack tourney(only 30 BBs) If I waited for aces or kings or queens, I would not have played one hand all day, as I never got one of those hands. My best 2 hands as far as pots won were 4-6 and 6-8 in the BB, both times flopping my high card and winning against the big stack on flush draws when my reads were right.

KJs is a good hand against the blinds on the button when all the action folded to you....I just wish the small blind called my raise instead. :)

[MannyIsGod]

For all you who say his KJ suited sucked, what about Bingo Dorks QJ unsuited?

If Jim made a bad call, then Bingo Dork must have made a horrific call.
And since head to head is only about who wins, i say Jims *bad* call >>>> Bingo Dorks horrible bet.

This was just pure b.s. grease, Jim and anyone should make that same exact call 7 days a week at the far superior call at 20-1.

So you're saying Jim knew he was on OJ? Jim went with a read which is fine, but when people say 1) KJ is a good hand in this spot (its really not) and 2) its ok because the BB just got lucky they're viewing everything through results oriented glasses or they don't know much about relative hand values.

Yeah, the BB played this hand far worse than Jim and picked a really stupid hand to defend with imo, but that is irrelevant unless everone here is going to sit and read their opponents soul each time they sit down.

[MannyIsGod]

But the action had folded around. I'll play KJ against someone heads-up, especially if they're limping.


He's playing it against a reraise. Sure, if someone limps in front of you raising with KJ is the right play, but what happens when they 3bet you? Do you still think its a good play everytime? Doesn't their show of stength (the reraise) narrow your perception of their range (barring further knowledge/reads) or do you assume they have the same cards they did and disregard every 3bet you face?



You can't just say that "KJ" is horrible in the general sense of the word. Ducks in the hole (the cards, not the ST Ducks) or a 7-8 suited is not typically a strong hand preflop at a table. However, heads-up, even a low pair can be a complete monster.


78s will have much more equity than KJ suited against a 3bet range because 78s is rarely dominated. Against a hand like AK, 78s is FAR better than KJs.

22 is never a monster until you hit a set post flop. Sure, most of the time you're starting out ahead but what happens when the flop comes? Virtual any flop you face where you have someone playing at you will lead to a fold.

Had Jim had 22 here it would have been a fold on a reraise. Its a horrible hand to play short stacked. Unless you're in a situation where you have to push preflop and even then its marginaly better than something like 78s. Its NEVER a monster unless you have a set or quads.


You play your opponent as much as the cards. If I have J-8 off on the big, and I see the little limp in (flop comes 2c, Jc, 9s) and check while staring at the 2 clubs on the board, continue to limp on 4th street (Kd), you bet your ass I'm going to pound him with chips and make him pay to see that last card. It's a horrible call on his part for a lot of chips unless he's got an over card. Putting all your chips down with Jacks and a Queen kicker is a similarly bad call. He got outed on the river. Period.


I'm not sure why you're talking about a BvB battle with a totaly different hand. No one is talking about Jim's post flop play in the least. The only marginal play in the hand was preflop when calling the reraise. Once that flop comes of course he's not laying it down. Its the nearly best possible flop he could hope for.



You cannot beat someone who gets that lucky, because you cannot afford to only play the best hands in tourneys. People start dumping to you left and right if you only raise when you've got a flush or better.


You keep saying this but I never once advocated playing only premium hands. I simply said calling a reraise with KJ is bad because of domination issues (barring further reads or information). KJ is one of the worse hands to play in poker because of domination and the reverse implied odds it brings.

[MannyIsGod]

KJs is a good hand against the blinds on the button when all the action folded to you....I just wish the small blind called my raise instead. :)

K, here's the thing. KJ IS a good hand when its folded to you on the button facing only the blinds. But - and this is the important thing here - KJs is NOT a good hand when the BB 3bets you. Thats the important thing to remember.

Every action alters the hand and should alter your perception of the hand. When he re raises you that KJ should look a LOT worse than it looked when you raised.

The most important action of this entire hand was the big blinds reraise. If you think he does this with a really really wide range then you can proceed from there. But a typical 3bet range from someone who isn't crazy is going to include a lot of hands that crush you. AK, KK, QQ, AA, JJ are all hands you do not want to see and they're going to make up a large percentage of a 3 bet range. A looser 3bet range will include AJ KQ which also have you dominated.

Its all about putting your opponent on a reliable range of hands. If you can do that and you think that your KJ is ahead of a good portion of that range then a call is OK. But even then, be prepared to see KQ, AK, KK, AA, AJ, QQ, and JJ far more than you see QJ, JT, KT simliar hands.

[Cry Havoc]

So you're saying Jim knew he was on OJ? Jim went with a read which is fine, but when people say 1) KJ is a good hand in this spot (its really not) and 2) its ok because the BB just got lucky they're viewing everything through results oriented glasses or they don't know much about relative hand values.

Yeah, the BB played this hand far worse than Jim and picked a really stupid hand to defend with imo, but that is irrelevant unless everone here is going to sit and read their opponents soul each time they sit down.

Again, you play your man. If I was up against a guy who played a crazier style (i.e., will push in with 4-2 off to get people to fold and nail lucky hands), sure I'll play back at him. If I have a guy on tilt, sure I'll play back at him. If you're heads-up, you want to do everything you can to demolish the psyche of the other person. Put him in a position where he's either so mad he can't see straight, or he's so defeated he's going to fold to you when you have rags.

[Cry Havoc]

K, here's the thing. KJ IS a good hand when its folded to you on the button facing only the blinds. But - and this is the important thing here - KJs is NOT a good hand when the BB 3bets you. Thats the important thing to remember.

Every action alters the hand and should alter your perception of the hand. When he re raises you that KJ should look a LOT worse than it looked when you raised.

The most important action of this entire hand was the big blinds reraise. If you think he does this with a really really wide range then you can proceed from there. But a typical 3bet range from someone who isn't crazy is going to include a lot of hands that crush you. AK, KK, QQ, AA, JJ are all hands you do not want to see and they're going to make up a large percentage of a 3 bet range. A looser 3bet range will include AJ KQ which also have you dominated.

Its all about putting your opponent on a reliable range of hands. If you can do that and you think that your KJ is ahead of a good portion of that range then a call is OK. But even then, be prepared to see KQ, AK, KK, AA, AJ, QQ, and JJ far more than you see QJ, JT, KT simliar hands.

Agree with this.

Who smells a ST poker tournament? I sure do. =)

[MannyIsGod]

Again, you play your man. If I was up against a guy who played a crazier style (i.e., will push in with 4-2 off to get people to fold and nail lucky hands), sure I'll play back at him. If I have a guy on tilt, sure I'll play back at him. If you're heads-up, you want to do everything you can to demolish the psyche of the other person. Put him in a position where he's either so mad he can't see straight, or he's so defeated he's going to fold to you when you have rags.

Without a doubt playing your reads is far more profitable than any preflop strategy but the best LAGs in the world will you how awful hands like KQ/KJ are to usually do this with. I'm not speaking in Jim's sense, but in a general sense.

I have a question for you since you say the cards don't matter. What do you think Jim does if the flop comes 223 rainbow and the big blind bets out half the pot?

[MannyIsGod]

Agree with this.

Who smells a ST poker tournament? I sure do. =)

Tournament poker is meh. I'd much rather have a ST cash game. But we've had several tournaments in the past. I'm not sure I've ever won one.

[Heath Ledger]

Hey man he has the right to play how he wants to, however in a tournament longevity in the tourney is the goal. Its a game of survival. Coin flips are not ideal in with so much poker left to play, had he laid his hand down he would have had around 17 or 18k to work with to find a better spot. Instead he is out of the tourney. The raise preflop was fine typical a and b poker but the call not so much and if you posted this on a forum such as realpokertraining or twoplustwo which has lots of pros lurking you will keep hearing similar things that myself and manny are saying. Im not claiming to be a pro however i am consistantly profitable both online and in live mtt's.

Its also a matter of differences in game theory/opinions. Some people are just willing to gamble a bit more often, those types of players either accumulate huge stacks or go home early. Nothing wrong with that either.

I just put my opinion out there if that makes me a douchebag then wtf ever.

[Jimcs50]

My gut feeling was right from the start that the BB was now chipped up and he was just trying to play back at the button who raised him 3 times in an hour and 15 mins, and he thought that I had a marginal hand, and I would fold to his 7400 raise. Had I folded, I will bet money that he was going to show the QJ off to me and tell me that he would defend from now on, so be careful.

This is real good dialoge here about the hand, I am learning a lot....I wish I could have phoned a friend prior to my action preflop.

:)

[tlongII]

Poker sucks ass. The only reason I would play it would be to get a chance to tag Evelyn's ass.

[Jimcs50]

Hey man he has the right to play how he wants to, however in a tournament longevity in the tourney is the goal. Its a game of survival. Coin flips are not ideal in with so much poker left to play, had he laid his hand down he would have had around 17 or 18k to work with to find a better spot. Instead he is out of the tourney. The raise preflop was fine typical a and b poker but the call not so much and if you posted this on a forum such as realpokertraining or twoplustwo which has lots of pros lurking you will keep hearing similar things that myself and manny are saying. Im not claiming to be a pro however i am consistantly profitable both online and in live mtt's.

Its also a matter of differences in game theory/opinions. Some people are just willing to gamble a bit more often, those types of players either accumulate huge stacks or go home early. Nothing wrong with that either.

I just put my opinion out there if that makes me a douchebag then wtf ever.

I am not a gambler preflop at all. I want to see flops, and go from there. I am what you call tight aggressive. I play connectors, but only if I am getting 4-1 odds or better, unless I suspect bullshit from the raiser.

[Cry Havoc]

Without a doubt playing your reads is far more profitable than any preflop strategy but the best LAGs in the world will you how awful hands like KQ/KJ are to usually do this with. I'm not speaking in Jim's sense, but in a general sense.

I have a question for you since you say the cards don't matter. What do you think Jim does if the flop comes 223 rainbow and the big blind bets out half the pot?

I didn't say they don't matter. I say they're 50/50 with the person you're playing. I think Jim made a read here (the correct one, FWIW) and just got busted by the one card that beats him. That happens to almost everyone in every tournament.

[Jimcs50]

Poker sucks ass. The only reason I would play it would be to get a chance to tag Evelyn's ass.

I wish she would have come to me to console me after my horrific beat.

:)

[MannyIsGod]

I'm now curious though, what would you do if the flop missed you completely and the bb bets about half the pot?

[Heath Ledger]

lets see i think he had $21k pre-preflop, so he now has $11k left after calling off half his stack, there should be $20,600 in the pot half pot sized bet of 10k that basicly makes him go all in with air or fold and play shortstacked poker (which is easy by the way)

Im curious to see his answer as well. These are things you need to think about before you make those calls, Im calling off half my stack here, hmm what happens if i miss the flop and he bets out? Oh shit im comittted, oh well hes giving me 3-1 though....

[scott]

I haven't played poker in about 3 years, and frankly can't even remember if a pair beats a royal flush, but I bet I could still take all Manny's money.

[MannyIsGod]

All in blind bitch. All in blind.

[scott]

Shit, I shoulda straddled.

Anyway... cool story Jim. Tough beat, but now you've got a great story!

[Jimcs50]

I'm now curious though, what would you do if the flop missed you completely and the bb bets about half the pot?


I would have folded had a jack, nor 2 spades not hit the board, but if 2 spades flopped, I probably would have called, because I was getting 3-1 on my call and if he had a pair under kings, I would have 12 outs and I would have been in a virtual coinflip, and getting 3-1 odds in a coinflip is a no brainer.

There are times in a tourney that you have to make a decision for all your chips, and even if it is on a draw, if you are getting the proper odds, you have to gamble.

[Jimcs50]

Shit, I shoulda straddled.

Anyway... cool story Jim. Tough beat, but now you've got a great story!

Thanks Scott.

Speaking of straddling. I usually straddle, but the morning I was leaving, I sat down for an hour and a half with my two buddies in a 10 handed 1-2 NL game. I was distracted and tired and I forgot to straddle. I look down and see KK. I raise to 12 and get only 1 caller in the SB. The flop:

K Q something

I bet 10, he calls, the turn is another small card, I bet 20, he folds.

:bang

Had I straddled like usual, I would have probably had at least 5 players in the hand and someone would have hit something in that flop and I might have made a lot more than 22 bucks.....so lesson learned....pay attention!!!

[Jimcs50]

:depressed


I am even more depressed. I just watched a replay of the 2005 Final table, and nobody hit any 2 outters to suck out. Fuuuck me!

[Fabbs]

Where are the player by player (everyone) results for 2008 so far?

[Jimcs50]

Anyone watching the Main Event on Tuesdays?

I am glad that they play the Final table in Nov. so we do not already know who won before they even start televising it, like other years. Like last year when I already knew Jerry Yang would suck his way out to the title. Mike Matasow is playing well, hope he makes it to Final table. As an aside, Patrik Antonius' fiance', Maya Geller is hot, hope she stays in for a long time, as she is easy on the eyes. :)

[Heath Ledger]

I'll be watching it. I have been running bad for a month up until a few nights ago I chopped at Caesars followed by two final tables one of which with another small cash.

[Anti.Hero]

So apparently online poker for u.s. citizens is illegal? I did not know this.



Pretty pretty pretty pretty gay.

[MannyIsGod]

its quasi legal/illegal. No actual law on the books saying its illegal, but that doesn't stop the Justice dept.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

That beat hurts like hell Jim, but well done and thanks for the story. :)

And nice commentary by the boys - it is making me think about the way I play.

As for how I'm going this year - haven't played much, was up a little until I made a tired read on the river a few weeks ago and lost my stack to a dickhead, now I'm even again. Time to start thinking and playing again though, because this thread has me all fired up and interested again! :)

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

At those blind levels, you should have folded the reraise, if it was a shorter stack insta call, however you don't want to get into coinflip situation still so early in the tourney especially if someone has you covered. yes it sucks to have to fold but live to see another day, you made a semi good read but the end result of course sucked cuz he sucked out on you. KJ suited and reraised is an instafold, any pair is ahead and u must worry about jj qq kk aa and ak all of which have you crushed. You made an amateur call and were asking for trouble in that situation still fairly early in the tourney. KJ suited is not a premium hand in that situation.

I was thinking the same thing, but then he was reading the game well so I see why he did it. I would have folded and copped the 3 grand loss, but then again, like Manny I suck at tourneys* and wouldn't have gotten that far anyway! :lol

*except when playing at Kori's house... ;)

[Jimcs50]

I play a couple times a week in a raked cash game and I got lucky in one particular hand on Friday night....so it goes both ways.

Blinds are 1-2


I am in the cutoff, I get 10-J spades. Four players limp before me, I limp as well, the button makes in 12 straight. There are 3 callers and I call as well.( I am getting 4-1 on my call)

The Flop:

8 9 2 rainbow.

Open ender...niice.

Everyone checks to me, I check, the button bets 30, the guy under the gun calls, I over call.

The Turn:

7 Bingo...the nuts!!!


The 1st guy bets 30, I smooth call, as the board is pretty harmless (I assume), the original raiser thinks for a minute and moves all in for another 200. The first bettor folds, I call.

The button has 77 and he now has a set, I tell him I have the nuts and want insurance. He has 10 outs for a fullhouse.

The insurance costs me $200, the button tells me that he will just take the insurance and I agree.

The River:

2


Had the button smooth called, I would have lost the whole thing.

So, sometimes, you get greedy and you can lose your ass, I should hae moved all in before the button in order to insure my nut straight.

:)

[Fabbs]

Patrik Antonius' fiance', Mya is hot, hope she stays in for a long time, as she is easy on the eyes. :)
pics?

Playing. Last night in cash game drew A9 spades, he drew K 10 Spades.
Flop was 3 spades. He bet on flop and turn, i just followed him to the river where he i all in'd him.
Ahhh, that felt good.

[Jimcs50]

pics?

Playing. Last night in cash game drew A9 spades, he drew K 10 Spades.
Flop was 3 spades. He bet on flop and turn, i just followed him to the river where he i all in'd him.
Ahhh, that felt good.

Been there....sucks to be the one with the king. :)

[Jimcs50]

pics?






http://pokerblog.cc/i-love-maya-geller/

[Fabbs]

^^ i googled and thought maybe you meant this Mya:
Photo #1 link only:
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l121/cakeandice-cream/Mya2.jpg
#2
http://www.myamya.com/images/photo01.jpg
I like her better then pokerMaya, but maybe the pics of poker Maya dont do justice.

And I'm sure you probably have flopped A high straight and had Mr Flopped Two Pair hit his runner/runner boat on the turn/river. :lol I know i have. 1st freakin hand of a tournament! All in and All out. :bang

[Fabbs]

Jim,
In the World Series of Suck Outs is the guy who 5%'d you out, do you know his name? I've been watching some of the shows and wonder if he is still there. If already posted, sorry but i aint scrollin.

Have you seen Evelyn again in person?

Manny i still want to take your course because i think poker is mostly cheats and suck outs.

[to21]

Jim,
In the World Series of Suck Outs is the guy who 5%'d you out, do you know his name? I've been watching some of the shows and wonder if he is still there. If already posted, sorry but i aint scrollin.

Have you seen Evelyn again in person?

Manny i still want to take your course because i think poker is mostly cheats and suck outs.
Manny offers a course?

He must make a lot of money off of poker to teach someone how to play huh?

[Fabbs]

Manny offers a course?

He must make a lot of money off of poker to teach someone how to play huh?
Manny offers a course in online poker.
I offer a course in how to get Evelyn.

[lefty]

I wish I knew how to play poker

[DannyT]

anybody know where to get some sharp looking poker/roulette tables here in town?

[MannyIsGod]

anybody know where to get some sharp looking poker/roulette tables here in town?

I used to know a dude who made custom tables that were soooooooooooooo slick but I'm not sure where I put his contact info. I'll try to find it.

[mexicanjunior]

For career dress up day at work this week, I wore my Pokerstars jersey and cap. I'm such a poser, lol...

http://www.randomdestination.com/members/mj/pics/MJ-Work.jpg

[DannyT]

I used to know a dude who made custom tables that were soooooooooooooo slick but I'm not sure where I put his contact info. I'll try to find it.

yeah dude let me know...I have found a couple guys with decent prices but they dont have any pictures so Im still looking into it....let me know what you find man


thanks

[DarkReign]

Some local kid from the same city I grew up in is in the final 64 this year.

http://detnews.com/article/20090714/SPORTS07/907140408/Shelby-Township-s-Joe-Cada-in-final-64-of-World-Series-of-Poker

[Jimcs50]

Glad someone dug up this old thread.

I played in the June 20th 1500 buyin WSOP tourney again.

This was my 3rd straight year I was ready for another deep run this year and was primed to get into the money.

This year was even better because we started with 4500 chips instead of 3000.

I was in seat 3, the table had a mixture of older players and young internet types, so it was well balanced.

Started at 12:00 pm on Saturday.

At 12:15, I am in middle position when the player under the gun min raises to 100(blinds are 25-50) This move always makes me suspicious.

the next player folds, I look down at my cards and low and behold, pocket kings. :)

Well, I raise to 400.......it folds around to the original min raiser, he just calls( I was expecting a reraise) The Flop: 3c 8h Q h, this flop looks great for me, except the two hearts. The guy checks, I bet 900, a large bet, but I wanted to discourage a flush draw from calling, and would be happy to just take down the pot right now.

He moves all in for all of his 4500 chips. :wow

WTF???

Did he slow play aces? Is he on a flush draw with AK? Did he flop a set?

All these questions go into my thought process.

I do not want to call and be the first donkey walking out of this tourney after 15 mins. I looked forward to this for a whole year.

I go into the tank for a full min, the I actually call clock on myself. When it gets down to 20 secs, I do the pussified move and fold.

The guy, a middle aged man in a Harley teeshirt shows JJ. :wow

I should have doubled up against this moron, but now I have pissed away almost a 1/3 of my starting stack with the winning hand....I am on major TILT..

Any other tourney, I call, any cash game, I call, but since it was this tourney, I over think the situation, thinking that any player would not risk his whole stack this early in this big tourney on a draw or on an under pair.

I am now short stack at table and can not really try to outplay anyone now, so I have to try to get a big hand now, it never comes, and I last about 3 more hours before losing my last 1200 when I flop a set of 5s, and the big stack catches a wheel on the turn to knock me out.

:depressed

What a donkey I am.

[Jimcs50]

BTW, my buddy who went with me this year, made it to day 2 and was 60 places out of the money. He survived and cashed $2850, finishing 245 out of 2600....nice. Last year was his first year and he only lasted 2 hours. I expected to do better than him.:(

[jackseven]

Glad someone dug up this old thread.

I played in the June 20th 1500 buyin WSOP tourney again.

This was my 3rd straight year I was ready for another deep run this year and was primed to get into the money.

This year was even better because we started with 4500 chips instead of 3000.

I was in seat 3, the table had a mixture of older players and young internet types, so it was well balanced.

Started at 12:00 pm on Saturday.

At 12:15, I am in middle position when the player under the gun min raises to 100(blinds are 25-50) This move always makes me suspicious.

the next player folds, I look down at my cards and low and behold, pocket kings. :)

Well, I raise to 400.......it folds around to the original min raiser, he just calls( I was expecting a reraise) The Flop: 3c 8h Q h, this flop looks great for me, except the two hearts. The guy checks, I bet 900, a large bet, but I wanted to discourage a flush draw from calling, and would be happy to just take down the pot right now.

He moves all in for all of his 4500 chips. :wow

WTF???

Did he slow play aces? Is he on a flush draw with AK? Did he flop a set?

All these questions go into my thought process.

I do not want to call and be the first donkey walking out of this tourney after 15 mins. I looked forward to this for a whole year.

I go into the tank for a full min, the I actually call clock on myself. When it gets down to 20 secs, I do the pussified move and fold.

The guy, a middle aged man in a Harley teeshirt shows JJ. :wow

I should have doubled up against this moron, but now I have pissed away almost a 1/3 of my starting stack with the winning hand....I am on major TILT..

Any other tourney, I call, any cash game, I call, but since it was this tourney, I over think the situation, thinking that any player would not risk his whole stack this early in this big tourney on a draw or on an under pair.

I am now short stack at table and can not really try to outplay anyone now, so I have to try to get a big hand now, it never comes, and I last about 3 more hours before losing my last 1200 when I flop a set of 5s, and the big stack catches a wheel on the turn to knock me out.

:depressed

What a donkey I am.

Got to call that, but sounds like you're playing good poker overall. What is the atmosphere at WSOP like?

[Fabbs]

He moves all in for all of his 4500 chips. :wow

WTF???

The guy, a middle aged man in a Harley teeshirt shows JJ. :wow
Jim,
Not saying your lay down was not correct (meaning that a lot of good players would have done just as you did).
I am saying that i have concluded that moves such as Harley Tee Guy did exist at ALL levels. It is no longer just the lower levels that regularly play "No Fold Em Hold Em". :depressed

[mrose31]

Glad someone dug up this old thread.

I played in the June 20th 1500 buyin WSOP tourney again.

This was my 3rd straight year I was ready for another deep run this year and was primed to get into the money.

This year was even better because we started with 4500 chips instead of 3000.

I was in seat 3, the table had a mixture of older players and young internet types, so it was well balanced.

Started at 12:00 pm on Saturday.

At 12:15, I am in middle position when the player under the gun min raises to 100(blinds are 25-50) This move always makes me suspicious.

the next player folds, I look down at my cards and low and behold, pocket kings. :)

Well, I raise to 400.......it folds around to the original min raiser, he just calls( I was expecting a reraise) The Flop: 3c 8h Q h, this flop looks great for me, except the two hearts. The guy checks, I bet 900, a large bet, but I wanted to discourage a flush draw from calling, and would be happy to just take down the pot right now.

He moves all in for all of his 4500 chips. :wow

WTF???

Did he slow play aces? Is he on a flush draw with AK? Did he flop a set?

All these questions go into my thought process.

I do not want to call and be the first donkey walking out of this tourney after 15 mins. I looked forward to this for a whole year.

I go into the tank for a full min, the I actually call clock on myself. When it gets down to 20 secs, I do the pussified move and fold.

The guy, a middle aged man in a Harley teeshirt shows JJ. :wow

I should have doubled up against this moron, but now I have pissed away almost a 1/3 of my starting stack with the winning hand....I am on major TILT..

Any other tourney, I call, any cash game, I call, but since it was this tourney, I over think the situation, thinking that any player would not risk his whole stack this early in this big tourney on a draw or on an under pair.

I am now short stack at table and can not really try to outplay anyone now, so I have to try to get a big hand now, it never comes, and I last about 3 more hours before losing my last 1200 when I flop a set of 5s, and the big stack catches a wheel on the turn to knock me out.

:depressed

What a donkey I am.

Just pretend a Jack was going to hit on the turn, or river.

[G-Nob]

Your thought process was good, but you gotta go all in after the flop. I know he wasn't pot committed at that point but you allowed him to smell weakness by just betting the pot.

He checked after the flop and he wouldn't have slow-played rockets. Particularly, if there were 2 hearts on the board. Your aggression would've told him that you had top pair or a straight/flush draw and the pressure would've been on him to make the call. With an all in, his thoughts would've been like yours, "Do I want to criple myself this early in the tourney?"

[G-Nob]

OMG pocket kings... You ride that shit cowboy... YOU RIDE THAT HAND!


In tournament play, you slow-play kings. Unless you want to go home early.

[G-Nob]

I didn't comment on the betting style. Just on the folding of pocket kings. Ride it to the end.

Yes of course. I was at wsop this year too and I can't tell you how many players went all in on pocket kings pre-flop. Toughest hand to lay down, too.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Your thought process was good, but you gotta go all in after the flop. I know he wasn't pot committed at that point but you allowed him to smell weakness by just betting the pot.

He checked after the flop and he wouldn't have slow-played rockets. Particularly, if there were 2 hearts on the board. Your aggression would've told him that you had top pair or a straight/flush draw and the pressure would've been on him to make the call. With an all in, his thoughts would've been like yours, "Do I want to criple myself this early in the tourney?"


All in is a horrible move, the only thing he's going to call you with has you beat.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Yes of course. I was at wsop this year too and I can't tell you how many players went all in on pocket kings pre-flop. Toughest hand to lay down, too.

Nothing wrong with getting all in preflop with kings.

[G-Nob]

All in is a horrible move, the only thing he's going to call you with has you beat.

wha?

[G-Nob]

Nothing wrong with getting all in preflop with kings.

Of course not. If you're at a cash game at Billy's house.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

Of course not. If you're at a cash game at Billy's house.

No, even if you're in a tourney. If you're folding KK preflop your losing money.

[G-Nob]

No, even if you're in a tourney. If you're folding KK preflop your losing money.

On what? Up against AK? You're willing to get all your chips in on the hope one of the other 9 guys don't catch an ace?

If its cheap, yes, you ride it. Otherwise, live to fight another day.

[GINNNNNNNNNNNNOBILI]

On what? Up against AK? You're willing to get all your chips in on the hope one of the other 9 guys don't catch an ace?

If its cheap, yes, you ride it. Otherwise, live to fight another day.

Well, Their are situations where you fold it, but thats only maybe 1% of the time. 9 people aren't calling all in preflop

[brettn]

on what? Up against ak? You're willing to get all your chips in on the hope one of the other 9 guys don't catch an ace?

If its cheap, yes, you ride it. Otherwise, live to fight another day.

heeeeehawwwwww

[Jimcs50]

OMG pocket kings... You ride that shit cowboy... YOU RIDE THAT HAND!

Had he reraised me all in preflop, then I would have gone all in. There are many hands that he would do this with. AA, AK, KK QQ, even JJ, and the only one that has me beat is AA, and I am not folding preflop with KK.

But the way he played hand it smelled like he slow played aces. Yes, if he did slow play aces, he would have checked to me on flop, because I was showing strength preflop and 90% of players follow up with bet on flop when they have position and opponent checks in front of them.

Only 2% of donkeys would have played JJ that way. :lol


Had this ben a young internet type player making this play, I would have called, but the fact that he looked like a tricky, been around the block player, it made me to decide that I was beat.

[Jimcs50]

Got to call that, but sounds like you're playing good poker overall. What is the atmosphere at WSOP like?


Atmosphere was fantastic. 5000 poker players mixed in with every pro you can think of all in one casino. Half naked hotties in bikinis passing out coupons for the topless Saphire Pool at hotel just adds to the circus like atmosphere too.

:toast

[samikeyp]

Win or lose...Jimmy Franchise is still the man. :toast

[Jimcs50]

Win or lose...Jimmy Franchise is still the man. :toast

Hey Mikey, how have you been doing? Hot enough for you?

[Heath Ledger]

just pretend a jack was going to hit on the turn, or river.

+1

[SequSpur]

Dude, you got owned. You should've went all in from the beginning after the first bet. You would've taken a small load, but you would've survived another day.

kk.... with that flop, should've been an instant all in. He was chasing the whole time.

Slow pay kings? uh no... too many hands can take that down.. if you have a pair and get trips on the flop then maybe...

I never understood this 90% rule that players do this and do that preflop, in position, etc.

I had kings last week in a tourney and I was probably in the middle of the pack. I called the 2400 blind, raised 15k before the flop, out of position. One person called, he had me 2 to 1 in chips, so I went all in...

I had kings, he had queens... I won, became chip leader and won the whole thing minutes later....

Kings, minutes into the tourney, you have to take em down...

keep reading them books...lol

We need to play some golf Jimbo.

[Heath Ledger]

I see no problem with your fold. This early in the tourney I would have more than likely folded unless this guy had shown he was a loose semi-loose player. It sucks to have to lay down Kings, down the stretch you probably wouldnt because thats when people are making a lot more moves. I cant believe this guy shoved though, you re-raised him preflop and there was an over pair on the board to his jacks. This guys reeks of donkeyfish unless he was really trying to sell you on the fact that he had pocket aces or pocket queens. If he did have aces preflop he would probably have smooth called your re-raise so he played it like many would have played aces aside from the min raise, that is usually tipping off a monster from under the gun, with jacks under the gun i would just throw in the standard raise and call your reraise and see the flop.

[Heath Ledger]

Dude, you got owned. You should've went all in from the beginning after the first bet. You would've taken a small load, but you would've survived another day.

kk.... with that flop, should've been an instant all in. He was chasing the whole time.

Slow pay kings? uh no... too many hands can take that down.. if you have a pair and get trips on the flop then maybe...

I never understood this 90% rule that players do this and do that preflop, in position, etc.

I had kings last week in a tourney and I was probably in the middle of the pack. I called the 2400 blind, raised 15k before the flop, out of position. One person called, he had me 2 to 1 in chips, so I went all in...

I had kings, he had queens... I won, became chip leader and won the whole thing minutes later....

Kings, minutes into the tourney, you have to take em down...

keep reading them books...lol

We need to play some golf Jimbo.

All in preflop with kings after a min raise from under the gun, is horrible advice. That is a surefire way to overplay your hand, with no reads on the player or history at the table, there is no reason to not err on the side of caution this early in the tourney. You will get outplayed every once in a while but you are not going to bust out and can live to see another day. Im an agressive player but all in preflop after an under the gun raise is a recipe for disaster.

[MannyIsGod]

In tournament play, you slow-play kings. Unless you want to go home early.

:lol

[Heath Ledger]

Oxy-Moron

[MannyIsGod]

I see no problem with your fold. This early in the tourney I would have more than likely folded unless this guy had shown he was a loose semi-loose player. It sucks to have to lay down Kings, down the stretch you probably wouldnt because thats when people are making a lot more moves. I cant believe this guy shoved though, you re-raised him preflop and there was an over pair on the board to his jacks. This guys reeks of donkeyfish unless he was really trying to sell you on the fact that he had pocket aces or pocket queens. If he did have aces preflop he would probably have smooth called your re-raise so he played it like many would have played aces aside from the min raise, that is usually tipping off a monster from under the gun, with jacks under the gun i would just throw in the standard raise and call your reraise and see the flop.

I see a big problem with the fold early in a tourney after committing that much of your stack. Big problem.

[MannyIsGod]

Dude, you got owned. You should've went all in from the beginning after the first bet. You would've taken a small load, but you would've survived another day.

kk.... with that flop, should've been an instant all in. He was chasing the whole time.

Slow pay kings? uh no... too many hands can take that down.. if you have a pair and get trips on the flop then maybe...

I never understood this 90% rule that players do this and do that preflop, in position, etc.

I had kings last week in a tourney and I was probably in the middle of the pack. I called the 2400 blind, raised 15k before the flop, out of position. One person called, he had me 2 to 1 in chips, so I went all in...

I had kings, he had queens... I won, became chip leader and won the whole thing minutes later....

Kings, minutes into the tourney, you have to take em down...

keep reading them books...lol

We need to play some golf Jimbo.

Instant all in only gets called by hands that beat you. Worst way to play it that I can think of with the exception of folding outright.

[MannyIsGod]

Hey Jim, I might be at A&M this upcoming spring. I'll be happy to take your money at your weekly game :)

[Heath Ledger]

He has $1300 invested $3200 remaining, and you want him to call when the hand played out in a way to suggest someone quite possibly has pocket aces or perhaps trip queens? Its a pretty big hit to say the least but with this structure in these tourneys i think the blinds are like 60 minutes or something, its definitely not panic time.

His fold was one that many good thinking players would make unless they had a reason not too, chip commitment threshold was not met here, especially giving the structure of the tournament which allows you to have some patience.

Usually when you make that call with the way the hand played out you are really far behind. Again with just the description he gave I see no problem with his fold, if its a small buy in 20 min blind tourney one could argue a call may be in order. But the blinds were at 25-50 it was a good fold on paper without any read that this guy was a donkey or making a move. It takes time to ascertain a players ability to make these moves and this was the first orbit or 2nd if it started at 25-25 which is rare.

Lets repeat, the guy showed a sign of strength even though his min raise utg was cheesy then shoved on that flop after a big bet by Jim. Situationally I say it was the right play, what the guy had is irrelevant usually when you make that kind of call early in a tourney you are walking to the rail.

[G-Nob]

If he was a good player, he wouldn't have slow played Aces. Check after the flop with 30or more outs and he's gonna slow play? No way. Not unless he was an internet player.

[Heath Ledger]

He didnt' slow play, he made a fishy min raise preflop utg which in many cases a bad player will do with aces. Its usually a tell of a big hand or big pocket pair to min raise under the gun. On the flop it was a low risk situation because he checked to a raiser who 9 times out of ten is going to continuation bet. He let him do his continuation bet and shoved over the top of him putting him at a decision for all of his chips. He was either selling trip queens or pocket aces. In this case it worked, it may have been his plan. Maybe the guy had Jim pegged as a rock after only 3 or 4 hands of play (doubtful) but he knew nobody wants to bust this early in a tournament, I play a couple hundred hours a month in various tourneys and cash games and any solid player has a hard time making that kind of call holding only a pair early in a tourney, not just early but 25-50 early.

It sucks that you just bled off a third of your stack but again you are not crippled, you have plenty of chips and time to catch some hands you just are a bit more limited with what kind of moves you can make without comitting yourself.

Everyone says it was a bad fold because he folded a better hand but situationally you were not at the table Jim is a solid player and made a play that many solid players would make. I guarantee you Phil Helmuth would have laid that hand down as well as many other top pros this early in a tourney.

[Jimcs50]

He has $1300 invested $3200 remaining, and you want him to call when the hand played out in a way to suggest someone quite possibly has pocket aces or perhaps trip queens? Its a pretty big hit to say the least but with this structure in these tourneys i think the blinds are like 60 minutes or something, its definitely not panic time.

His fold was one that many good thinking players would make unless they had a reason not too, chip commitment threshold was not met here, especially giving the structure of the tournament which allows you to have some patience.

Usually when you make that call with the way the hand played out you are really far behind. Again with just the description he gave I see no problem with his fold, if its a small buy in 20 min blind tourney one could argue a call may be in order. But the blinds were at 25-50 it was a good fold on paper without any read that this guy was a donkey or making a move. It takes time to ascertain a players ability to make these moves and this was the first orbit or 2nd if it started at 25-25 which is rare.

Lets repeat, the guy showed a sign of strength even though his min raise utg was cheesy then shoved on that flop after a big bet by Jim. Situationally I say it was the right play, what the guy had is irrelevant usually when you make that kind of call early in a tourney you are walking to the rail.


All this makes sense, which is why I folded, I wish he never showed me his hand though. :lol

[G-Nob]

Not saying he should've called the all in, just saying he should've gone all in after the flop. Pretending he did actually have the rockets, that is a scary-ass flop for him, considering he knew Jim was strong, (possibly AK, KK, mid pair, etc) but you then put the thought in his mind, "does he have the AK of hearts?" All I'm saying is, with so many outs there is no way he checks after the flop with AA. The only way he knew he could scare Jim off of the hand was to go over the top all in.

[mexicanjunior]

Had he reraised me all in preflop, then I would have gone all in. There are many hands that he would do this with. AA, AK, KK QQ, even JJ, and the only one that has me beat is AA, and I am not folding preflop with KK.

But the way he played hand it smelled like he slow played aces. Yes, if he did slow play aces, he would have checked to me on flop, because I was showing strength preflop and 90% of players follow up with bet on flop when they have position and opponent checks in front of them.

Only 2% of donkeys would have played JJ that way. :lol


Had this ben a young internet type player making this play, I would have called, but the fact that he looked like a tricky, been around the block player, it made me to decide that I was beat.

Tough fold but in that situation, and the amount you paid to buy in, I probably would have done the same thing. All depends on the vibe from the raiser though...

[samikeyp]

Hey Mikey, how have you been doing? Hot enough for you?

Not up here in Lower Canada...er...I mean Michigan. :lol

When I was in town for my radio spot though...I was greeted with 100's the whole time! :toast

[Jimcs50]

Hey Jim, I might be at A&M this upcoming spring. I'll be happy to take your money at your weekly game :)


Manny, there is a game every night, so you would have a choice of nights to play. All are rake games, but still good games. I would love to be able to give you the opportunity to take my chips.:)

[Jimcs50]

Not up here in Lower Canada...er...I mean Michigan. :lol

When I was in town for my radio spot though...I was greeted with 100's the whole time! :toast


Michigan, eh? Upper peninsula area?? I am jealous...the golf up there is fantastic.

[samikeyp]

Michigan, eh? Upper peninsula area?? I am jealous...the golf up there is fantastic.

No, Lansing.

I am surprised though, about how nice the golf courses are throughout the state. Then again, they are not open year round like in Texas! :lol

[G-Nob]

In other wsop news, is anyone watching what Ivey is doing right now? Top 26 so far. That mofo has had an unbelievable wsop.

[Jimcs50]

In other wsop news, is anyone watching what Ivey is doing right now? Top 26 so far. That mofo has had an unbelievable wsop.

Wow, Dennis Phillips is still in it....

[brettn]

Wow, Dennis Phillips is still in it....

nah, busto'd yesterday. ivey, esfandiari and jeff shulman are the last "big" names in alive with about 25 left. Ivey's lost about half of his starting stack today though, pretty rough start.

[SequSpur]

Andrew Lichtenberger Eliminated in 18th Place ($500,557)
Andrew "LuckyChewy" Lichtenberger wasn't lucky enough to ride his deep run in the Main Event into a berth in the November Nine. He opened his last pot preflop for 400,000 and was called by Darvin Moon in position. The flop was all small cards, . Lichtenberger had to act first and bet 680,000 chips. Moon raised that bet to 1.5 million, then called when Lichtenberger moved all in! Lichtenberger: Moon: Lichtenberger was drawing at the last two jacks in the deck. Neither the turn nor the river was one of them. He's out in 18th place. Moon is now up to almost 25 million chips.

[SequSpur]

Instant all in only gets called by hands that beat you. Worst way to play it that I can think of with the exception of folding outright.

The fact is that if he would've went all in, he would've won. You bookreaders need to read that part of the story.

As soon as the flop came, he had the highest hand, the guy didn't have aces or he would've blew him away off the rip.

[Fabbs]

Lichtenberger: Moon: Lichtenberger was drawing at the last two jacks in the deck. Neither the turn nor the river was one of them. He's out in 18th place. Moon is now up to almost 25 million chips.
Everything made sense up to here. Could you translate the rest?
What did Moon have?

[SequSpur]

sound familiar? Dude had Kings and went all in and won the pot with a flop of small cards.....

I guess you all forgot that chapter.... :lmao

[SequSpur]

Everything made sense up to here. Could you translate the rest?
What did Moon have?

Kings vs. Jacks

[SequSpur]

I see no problem with your fold. This early in the tourney I would have more than likely folded unless this guy had shown he was a loose semi-loose player. It sucks to have to lay down Kings, down the stretch you probably wouldnt because thats when people are making a lot more moves. I cant believe this guy shoved though, you re-raised him preflop and there was an over pair on the board to his jacks. This guys reeks of donkeyfish unless he was really trying to sell you on the fact that he had pocket aces or pocket queens. If he did have aces preflop he would probably have smooth called your re-raise so he played it like many would have played aces aside from the min raise, that is usually tipping off a monster from under the gun, with jacks under the gun i would just throw in the standard raise and call your reraise and see the flop.

I see no problem with the fold either, except you are folding Kings! lol


There is only one pair that can beat that... one!!! No one slow plays aces dude, not after the flop, because Jim could've had trips...

[brettn]

I see no problem with the fold either, except you are folding Kings! lol


There is only one pair that can beat that... one!!! No one slow plays aces dude, not after the flop, because Jim could've had trips...

Dude could've easily been slow playing a set of Qs or 8s in the original hand. Sure, it's a tough spot. But saying that "only one pair beats you" after the flop is pretty shortsighted. You can make a case for either folding or calling the shove there, like I said, Jim was in a tough spot.

[SequSpur]

yeah...what ifs... dude had kings.... the only reason he didn't call was because it was early in the tourney and he spent alot of money to get in...

I would've called it without thinking, in fact, I would've raised the blind big time, then I would've went all in on the flop. Without even thinking about it. Dude would've ran to the bathroom.

[SequSpur]

Poker is all about Luck. You have to gamble. You have to put down the rulebook. You have to change it up, you have to slow play, you have to play your 2 7 offsuit like you got the rockets.... all that shit.....

[Heath Ledger]

Noob come play poker with me anytime

[MannyIsGod]

No, Lansing.

I am surprised though, about how nice the golf courses are throughout the state. Then again, they are not open year round like in Texas! :lol

Dude they have incredible courses everywhere up there. I kept commenting about that to Jess.

[MannyIsGod]

Oh, and if you're folding on that flop you're so damn weak tight. I'm afraid of 2 whole hands there and I can think of several drawing hands. Bad fold.

[Heath Ledger]

Disagree. Your one of those donk internet players. :)

[Jimcs50]

Kings vs. Jacks

Big difference, if there were a queen on flop, Andrew Lichtenberger would not have gone all in with his jacks, would he? If I had that flop( all little cards), then I would have called because, Harley teeshirt guy could have had JJ or 10s and made move thinking he had a great chance to have best hand. But since there was a Q on board, I did not and nobody would have put him on JJ.

[Jimcs50]

Oh, and if you're folding on that flop you're so damn weak tight. I'm afraid of 2 whole hands there and I can think of several drawing hands. Bad fold.


As I said, any other tourney, any cash game, I call there. But after waiting a freaking year to redeem myself and make up for my 2 outter bad beat from last year, I wanted to play smart and not go out in 15 mins. But, in hindsight, I guess I should play my game and not worry about looking like a donkey walking out 1st in 2700 man tourney.....right?

[Fabbs]

Anyone ever suspect casinos and or players and or player/dealer combos of cheating?

Got a good one for ya. I folded 2/3u last night. Would have flopped a set and rivered a boat 33322. Small problem.

Winner and guy next to me had pocket 3s for quads.

Not the 1st time some shady crap has come down at this place.
Talk to the floor? Spare me. I have yet to see a floor anywhere truly do anything having to do with exposing cheating.

[MannyIsGod]

As I said, any other tourney, any cash game, I call there. But after waiting a freaking year to redeem myself and make up for my 2 outter bad beat from last year, I wanted to play smart and not go out in 15 mins. But, in hindsight, I guess I should play my game and not worry about looking like a donkey walking out 1st in 2700 man tourney.....right?

Even your post is weak tight. It doesn't matter how big the tourney is - you don't change your play. You lose to AA and QQ. Other sets really aren't likely given the action. AKs is behind you, AQ is way behin you. JJ is obviously way behind although I'd consider it unlikely. KQ is unlikey but possible.

I'm easily calling and if I just got sucked out on or was up against AA then I live with it but I'm not going to see monsters in every hand. If you're not getting it all in the flop here with KK when are you doing it?

[Jimcs50]

Anyone ever suspect casinos and or players and or player/dealer combos of cheating?

Got a good one for ya. I folded 2/3u last night. Would have flopped a set and rivered a boat 33322. Small problem.

Winner and guy next to me had pocket 3s for quads.

Not the 1st time some shady crap has come down at this place.
Talk to the floor? Spare me. I have yet to see a floor anywhere truly do anything having to do with exposing cheating.

how does he have quads if you have a 3 in your hand?

[Jimcs50]

Maybe the board was 223xx and you had 23 and he had 33, so he had bigger boat.

That has happened to me a few times....you do not need to cheat for that cooler to occur.

[Jimcs50]

I'm easily calling and if I just got sucked out on or was up against AA then I live with it but I'm not going to see monsters in every hand. If you're not getting it all in the flop here with KK when are you doing it?

When I turn a king.

:)

[Heath Ledger]

Bells would have gone off in my head immediately as well, guy min raises under the gun, usually someone doing so has at the least AK or a big pair, Jim repops it, the guy smooth calls, I would smooth call if I had aces or queens, with aces as to not tip off the strength of my hand, with queens to see a flop and re-evaluate. It's the first orbit of the tourney, this is when donks overplay their hands and get knocked out early, or when solid players put all of their chips in with very solid hands. If I'm correct it was 2-4 hands into the tourney, so for Jim to figure out if this guy was one of the early donks or a solid player putting his chips in with a monster is a complete coin flip. its best to err on the side of caution. He is not crippled with $3200 chips remaining and hour long blind levels.

Tourneys are a game of patience, you do not want to call an all in early in a tourney with this blind strucutre holding only a pair. Period. You say not going all in on the flop is weak however in my opinion its overplaying the hand, especially with the min raise utg and smooth call. Its a really shitty spot to be in early in a tourney but its only one hand and one you should be able to get away from in these tourneys without a whole lot of remorse, if you get outplayed shit happens. Usually early in a tourney someone making this play has a set or pocket aces. This wasn't the case unfortunately for Jim but theres quite the argument to fold in this situation a few hands into the tourney. Its not like you havent been bluffed off a hand before Manny, shit everyone has been. KK is a great starting hand but at the end of the day its a pair. Even if the guy has AK suited and you call you are just about flipping there and this early in the tourney flipping is not what you want to do.

That being said if you saw this guy out firing and buying pots in previous hands, instacall may come into play or instashove. My opinions are solely based on the info Jim has given us and a couple of hands in its very hard to have any kind of read on a player. And Jim has lost not quite a third of his stack in one hand, so what, Ive come back from much shorter stacks and won or cashed in tourneys. If its the $65 tourey at the Sahara, Im probably gonna get all my chips in and rebuy if I bust but this was a whole other can of worms.

[Heath Ledger]

Even your post is weak tight. It doesn't matter how big the tourney is - you don't change your play.


I dont think i've seen such a false statement in my life. Blind structures and starting chip stacks totally play a part in certain decisions in tourneys.

Im guessing your poker prowess is mostly online with all of the gunslingers.

[Jimcs50]

Bells would have gone off in my head immediately as well, guy min raises under the gun, usually someone doing so has at the least AK or a big pair, Jim repops it, the guy smooth calls, I would smooth call if I had aces or queens, with aces as to not tip off the strength of my hand, with queens to see a flop and re-evaluate. It's the first orbit of the tourney, this is when donks overplay their hands and get knocked out early, or when solid players put all of their chips in with very solid hands. If I'm correct it was 2-4 hands into the tourney, so for Jim to figure out if this guy was one of the early donks or a solid player putting his chips in with a monster is a complete coin flip. its best to err on the side of caution. He is not crippled with $3200 chips remaining and hour long blind levels.

Tourneys are a game of patience, you do not want to call an all in early in a tourney with this blind strucutre holding only a pair. Period. You say not going all in on the flop is weak however in my opinion its overplaying the hand, especially with the min raise utg and smooth call. Its a really shitty spot to be in early in a tourney but its only one hand and one you should be able to get away from in these tourneys without a whole lot of remorse, if you get outplayed shit happens. Usually early in a tourney someone making this play has a set or pocket aces. This wasn't the case unfortunately for Jim but theres quite the argument to fold in this situation a few hands into the tourney. Its not like you havent been bluffed off a hand before Manny, shit everyone has been. KK is a great starting hand but at the end of the day its a pair. Even if the guy has AK suited and you call you are just about flipping there and this early in the tourney flipping is not what you want to do.

That being said if you saw this guy out firing and buying pots in previous hands, instacall may come into play or instashove. My opinions are solely based on the info Jim has given us and a couple of hands in its very hard to have any kind of read on a player. And Jim has lost not quite a third of his stack in one hand, so what, Ive come back from much shorter stacks and won or cashed in tourneys. If its the $65 tourey at the Sahara, Im probably gonna get all my chips in and rebuy if I bust but this was a whole other can of worms.


You and I are totally on same page and probably are very similar poker players. I think there are about 65% of the players that would have called there, and 35% of us fold there under the circumstances. You're right, Phil Helmuth folds there 15 mins into the Main Event, not because he is affraid to lose 10K buyin so quickly, but because he looks forward to that tourney all year, and if he is to go broke, he wants it to be in a better spot, and after he has enough information from the player to make an educated guess about where he stands. As I said, if this were an young gun internet type that wants to accumulate chips at an accelerated pace, then I would probably call. I had no info on this guy at all, seeing as though this was our 5th hand of the tourney.

In hindsight, I call. :)

[Heath Ledger]

Im not claiming to know it all, however I play poker just about every day whether cash games or tourneys(as i live here in Vegas) and with some pretty good success I must say. I may be wrong but Im pretty sure most of Mannys play is in online cash games, and even the tourneys online are a lot more agressive than in live tourneys. So while his advice MAY BE on par for online agressive play it is quite the opposite for live play.

[Cry Havoc]

Im not claiming to know it all, however I play poker just about every day whether cash games or tourneys(as i live here in Vegas) and with some pretty good success I must say. I may be wrong but Im pretty sure most of Mannys play is in online cash games, and even the tourneys online are a lot more agressive than in live tourneys. So while his advice MAY BE on par for online agressive play it is quite the opposite for live play.

That wholly depends on the player, too. If he's raising pre-flop, with the flop that actually came up on the board, you have no reason to assume he hit on anything except maybe the two hearts. The chances of picking up the 3rd Q there are very low.

I don't necessarily see this as a "right" or "wrong" decision. It's a spot call, a poker call, and basically his kings were pretty lethal unless the other player had pocket rockets or a pair of ladies in his hand.

Both decisions have their merit. I can't really see much criticism for calling OR folding in that place. That's when you strap your belt down and go with your gut.

I will say that if Jim wasn't prepared for his opponent to go all in when making his bet of 900, he shouldn't have pushed so hard. There ARE a lot over crazy-aggressive players out there so early. Some might have gone all in with rags (looking to buy an early pot when others are playing conservative) and still taken Jim down.

But it's in no way an obvious decision.

[Fabbs]

Jimcs50
Maybe the board was 223xx and you had 23 and he had 33, so he had bigger boat.

That has happened to me a few times....you do not need to cheat for that cooler to occur.



how does he have quads if you have a 3 in your hand?
Exactly. He had quad 3s yet i had 2/3.
Their ain't five 3s in a deck.

Mike Caro has a group that monitors cheating. I haven't contacted them yet, but even before this happened last night I've been wanting to. Not that this group could do anything about correcting the cheating. *The Gaming Commision*. Please. Those retards are most likely in on a lot of it.

I have no doubt (in my own mind) that cheating happens on a regular basis.

[brettn]

That wholly depends on the player, too. If he's raising pre-flop, with the flop that actually came up on the board, you have no reason to assume he hit on anything except maybe the two hearts. The chances of picking up the 3rd Q there are very low.

I don't necessarily see this as a "right" or "wrong" decision. It's a spot call, a poker call, and basically his kings were pretty lethal unless the other player had pocket rockets or a pair of ladies in his hand.

Both decisions have their merit. I can't really see much criticism for calling OR folding in that place. That's when you strap your belt down and go with your gut.

I will say that if Jim wasn't prepared for his opponent to go all in when making his bet of 900, he shouldn't have pushed so hard. There ARE a lot over crazy-aggressive players out there so early. Some might have gone all in with rags (looking to buy an early pot when others are playing conservative) and still taken Jim down.

But it's in no way an obvious decision.

Completely agree with this. You can argue all day whether a call or fold or is the right play here, but due to the lack of information available it becomes more of a gut play than anything. Factor in that this is a $1500 WSOP event and the decision becomes ever harder. It's easy for anyone to say that being in that sort of atmosphere wouldn't affect their play, but I'm sure it's a whole lot different when you're actually at the table and faced with this type of decision.

In other news, Mr. Phil Ivey made the November 9 yesterday, alongside fellow Pro and co-owner of Cardplayer, Jeff Shulman. Should be a really great final table come November.

[Jimcs50]

QUOTE=Cry Havoc;3563014]
I will say that if Jim wasn't prepared for his opponent to go all in when making his bet of 900, he shouldn't have pushed so hard. [/QUOTE]

This was a bet that I could get away from, I did not pot commit myself, I had wagered 1300 out of 4500, and needed to call 3200 more to win 9000, which was less than 3-1 on my call, and only hand that I was getting right price for where I was a dog on flop was A 3 hearts, where he had 14 outs twice.

I bet 900 to discourage any flush draws from calling, but it was small enough that I could fold if the situation arose.

Had I bet 2000 on flop, and he moved all in, then I would have been pot committed, as I would have had to put in 2100 to win 9000, so I would have been getting over 4-1 odds.

[SequSpur]

Noob come play poker with me anytime

Are you referring to me analysis paralysis? I am gaming tomorrow night.. where the fuck are you?


Jim, dude, you folded Kings...it's okay...

[SequSpur]

Bells would have gone off in my head immediately as well, guy min raises under the gun, usually someone doing so has at the least AK or a big pair, Jim repops it, the guy smooth calls, I would smooth call if I had aces or queens, with aces as to not tip off the strength of my hand, with queens to see a flop and re-evaluate. It's the first orbit of the tourney, this is when donks overplay their hands and get knocked out early, or when solid players put all of their chips in with very solid hands. If I'm correct it was 2-4 hands into the tourney, so for Jim to figure out if this guy was one of the early donks or a solid player putting his chips in with a monster is a complete coin flip. its best to err on the side of caution. He is not crippled with $3200 chips remaining and hour long blind levels.

Tourneys are a game of patience, you do not want to call an all in early in a tourney with this blind strucutre holding only a pair. Period. You say not going all in on the flop is weak however in my opinion its overplaying the hand, especially with the min raise utg and smooth call. Its a really shitty spot to be in early in a tourney but its only one hand and one you should be able to get away from in these tourneys without a whole lot of remorse, if you get outplayed shit happens. Usually early in a tourney someone making this play has a set or pocket aces. This wasn't the case unfortunately for Jim but theres quite the argument to fold in this situation a few hands into the tourney. Its not like you havent been bluffed off a hand before Manny, shit everyone has been. KK is a great starting hand but at the end of the day its a pair. Even if the guy has AK suited and you call you are just about flipping there and this early in the tourney flipping is not what you want to do.

That being said if you saw this guy out firing and buying pots in previous hands, instacall may come into play or instashove. My opinions are solely based on the info Jim has given us and a couple of hands in its very hard to have any kind of read on a player. And Jim has lost not quite a third of his stack in one hand, so what, Ive come back from much shorter stacks and won or cashed in tourneys. If its the $65 tourey at the Sahara, Im probably gonna get all my chips in and rebuy if I bust but this was a whole other can of worms.


Why can't you just admit that the all in call was the right thing to do? He would've fucking doubled up. You analyze to much. Shit dude...

You probably wouldn't make it past the first day in that tourney. I love your types... analyze the game, while off shoots like me, destroy your ass.

[Cry Havoc]

I will say that if Jim wasn't prepared for his opponent to go all in when making his bet of 900, he shouldn't have pushed so hard.

This was a bet that I could get away from, I did not pot commit myself, I had wagered 1300 out of 4500, and needed to call 3200 more to win 9000, which was less than 3-1 on my call, and only hand that I was getting right price for where I was a dog on flop was A 3 hearts, where he had 14 outs twice.

I bet 900 to discourage any flush draws from calling, but it was small enough that I could fold if the situation arose.

Had I bet 2000 on flop, and he moved all in, then I would have been pot committed, as I would have had to put in 2100 to win 9000, so I would have been getting over 4-1 odds.

And yet you went on tilt after that hand.... :lol

I mean no offense, I just think that part is kinda funny. Sorry to be laughing at your beat.

[Jimcs50]

In other news, Mr. Phil Ivey made the November 9 yesterday, alongside fellow Pro and co-owner of Cardplayer, Jeff Shulman. Should be a really great final table come November.

Oh wow, I did not realize that Jordan Smith was last guy eliminated before November 9. I know him. He is best friends with a good friend of mine, Jimmy Caldwell, who I play poker with a lot.Jordan already won a bracelet this year in the $2000 buy in NL holdem event on June 18th. He had already won a WPT tourney a couple of years ago too. He is an awesome player.

He had AA cracked by chip leader Darvin Moon to get eliminated after being 3rd chip leader with 10 players left. Darvin had 88 and floped a set, and Jordan got it all in on flop. Had Jordan's aces held up, he would have been 2nd chip leader only a million behind 1st.

He called my friend Jimmy right afterwards and was pretty bummed. Not only did he miss the November 9, but all those guys make a ton of endorsement money from FTP in the next couple of months.

:depressed

[Jimcs50]

And yet you went on tilt after that hand.... :lol

I mean no offense, I just think that part is kinda funny. Sorry to be laughing at your beat.

:lol

Yeah, I might as well have called if I would go on Tilt after that. But in my defense, I did not think he had JJ, so if he showed AQ or AK hearts, I could have felt a little better because I could have convinced myself that he would have won on turn or river anyway. But with JJ, I know I was as good as doubled up had I called. :)

[Heath Ledger]

Why can't you just admit that the all in call was the right thing to do? He would've fucking doubled up. You analyze to much. Shit dude...

You probably wouldn't make it past the first day in that tourney. I love your types... analyze the game, while off shoots like me, destroy your ass.


Lolz dipshit I've got about 17k in tourney cashes (live play)this year alone with 5 cashes in my last 11 tourneys

Last year I had 29k in tourney cashes between live play and Internet play so get your ass over here and back up your words cash games or tourneys it makes no difference when you play 30 to 60 hours a week you learn a thing or two

[Heath Ledger]

115546853Billing

[SequSpur]

Lolz dipshit I've got about 17k in tourney cashes (live play)this year alone with 5 cashes in my last 11 tourneys

Last year I had 29k in tourney cashes between live play and Internet play so get your ass over here and back up your words cash games or tourneys it makes no difference when you play 30 to 60 hits a week you learn a thing or two

WGAF.

How much did you lose? What are you a kid or something? How many WWJD bracelets did you win?

lmao

[Heath Ledger]

Great rebuttal. What are you a kid or something?


http://i787.photobucket.com/albums/yy160/blademaster1975/47316fe3.jpg

[Jimcs50]

Great rebuttal. What are you a kid or something?


http://i787.photobucket.com/albums/yy160/blademaster1975/47316fe3.jpg


Is that the amount of money he'd be saving if he switched to Geico?

[MannyIsGod]

I dont think i've seen such a false statement in my life. Blind structures and starting chip stacks totally play a part in certain decisions in tourneys.

Im guessing your poker prowess is mostly online with all of the gunslingers.

How big a tourney has nothing to do with the blind structure or how many orbits you have before you start getting chipped away. I don't make decisions based on whether I'm playing online, at Kori's table, or at a tourney at the WSOP. I make them based on the situation.

You've basically with anything less than a set on that you're not getting it all in on the flop. I think thats weak tight as hell. I gave you a huge range of hands you are ahead of and you can think of 2 that you're behind. 2 whole hands. I understand you're scared by the minraise, but the minraise isn't that scary.

[MannyIsGod]

If its the $65 tourey at the Sahara, Im probably gonna get all my chips in and rebuy if I bust but this was a whole other can of worms.

Kinda funny you called out my statement because I honestly feel this statement is one of the worst possible from a poker player. Don't play emotionally. Play rationally.

[MannyIsGod]

I will say this - my more aggressive style will bust me out more often early in tournaments. But it will also have me with larger stacks when I head into the money and stacks are power. I'd much rather have more early bust outs because I'm confident when I do make the money I'm going to go deeper with a more aggressive style. Playing hours of tournament poker to cash out just after the bubble is worthless, IMO>

[pkbpkb81]

I will say this - my more aggressive style will bust me out more often early in tournaments. But it will also have me with larger stacks when I head into the money and stacks are power. I'd much rather have more early bust outs because I'm confident when I do make the money I'm going to go deeper with a more aggressive style. Playing hours of tournament poker to cash out just after the bubble is worthless, IMO>

i like playing with people like you becuse i play a little tight and am able to pick of big pots from that type of player, also i have seen a lot of aggressive types get a large stack only to piss it away becuse they go too over the top
you have to have a good mix imo

[Cry Havoc]

i like playing with people like you becuse i play a little tight and am able to pick of big pots from that type of player, also i have seen a lot of aggressive types get a large stack only to piss it away becuse they go too over the top
you have to have a good mix imo

That's why good, experienced aggressive players shift gears on you without warning and you think they're betting on a pair of 10s and they're sitting on an Ace-high flush. So you push in against them a few hands and they muck, and then take 3/4ths of your stack the next hand.

[Heath Ledger]

A decent night again at imperial palace walked away up 772 god I love tourists not bad for a 3.5 hour session.

[Jimcs50]

A decent night again at imperial palace walked away up 772 god I love tourists not bad for a 3.5 hour session.

I dropped a lot of cash as a tourist that weekend with aces. Had AA cracked 5 out of 5 hands for a total of $2400.00. :depressed

Only twice did I get all my money in being ahead, but in all three cases, nobody folds there.

1-2 NL cash game at Harrahs: Got is all in preflop twice against KK and JJ, and both times, the fuckers spiked their sets on turn. Net loss= $650

2-5 NL cash game at Rio: Had AA, made it 20 straight preflop, 3 callers.
Flop: A K Q two spades, bet $50, got raised to $125, pushed all in, got snap called, of course, he has 10 J. Board does not pair. Loss: $400

2-5 NL cash game at Rio: Had AA, I reraise a $15 raise, and 2 callers to $75.00, get 1 caller.
Flop: A 7 7 :toast. Check check, turn is face card, I bet $100, get raised to $250, I push my last $500 in, get snap called. He had 77 for quads. No ace on river. :depressed Net loss $675.


Now sickest loss ever for me:

2-5 NL cash game at Venetian: Had AA, raise in front of me to $15, I make it $60 to go, get 2 callers.

Flop :J 8 2 I bet $85, get one caller. Turn: K. I bet $125, he calls again. I'm thinking now that maybe he has KJ, and just sucked out on my aces, since my aces have been getting hammered all weekend. So now in my head before river is dealt, I call for a 2 on river to conterfeit the fucker. River: 2 :toast

I feel like I am vindicated, like I am now back on my game and I am getting this fuckers chips. He checks, I bet $200, he pushes all in, I call my last $200, and what does he have???

The donkey had 7 2. :wow

He called $60 preflop with 72, he called 2 streets with bottom pair for $210.

I called for the card that beat me, which makes it even sicker.

Net loss: $650


The worst part is after I see what he had, I am sitting there with my last $200 still in front of me. I have this incredulous look on my face, and I say
that that was the worst beat that I ever had in my poker playing life. Then he starts yelling : ship it, ship it, ship it!!"

What a total dick.:ihit

[Cry Havoc]

I dropped a lot of cash as a tourist that weekend with aces. Had AA cracked 5 out of 5 hands for a total of $2400.00. :depressed

Only twice did I get all my money in being ahead, but in all three cases, nobody folds there.

1-2 NL cash game at Harrahs: Got is all in preflop twice against KK and JJ, and both times, the fuckers spiked their sets on turn. Net loss= $650

2-5 NL cash game at Rio: Had AA, made it 20 straight preflop, 3 callers.
Flop: A K Q two spades, bet $50, got raised to $125, pushed all in, got snap called, of course, he has 10 J. Board does not pair. Loss: $400

2-5 NL cash game at Rio: Had AA, I reraise a $15 raise, and 2 callers to $75.00, get 1 caller.
Flop: A 7 7 :toast. Check check, turn is face card, I bet $100, get raised to $250, I push my last $500 in, get snap called. He had 77 for quads. No ace on river. :depressed Net loss $675.


Now sickest loss ever for me:

2-5 NL cash game at Venetian: Had AA, raise in front of me to $15, I make it $60 to go, get 2 callers.

Flop :J 8 2 I bet $85, get one caller. Turn: K. I bet $125, he calls again. I'm thinking now that maybe he has KJ, and just sucked out on my aces, since my aces have been getting hammered all weekend. So now in my head before river is dealt, I call for a 2 on river to conterfeit the fucker. River: 2 :toast

I feel like I am vindicated, like I am now back on my game and I am getting this fuckers chips. He checks, I bet $200, he pushes all in, I call my last $200, and what does he have???

The donkey had 7 2. :wow

He called $60 preflop with 72, he called 2 streets with bottom pair for $210.

I called for the card that beat me, which makes it even sicker.

Net loss: $650


The worst part is after I see what he had, I am sitting there with my last $200 still in front of me. I have this incredulous look on my face, and I say
that that was the worst beat that I ever had in my poker playing life. Then he starts yelling : ship it, ship it, ship it!!"

What a total dick.:ihit

Ouch. I have nothing else to say to that.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Lolz dipshit I've got about 17k in tourney cashes (live play)this year alone with 5 cashes in my last 11 tourneys

Last year I had 29k in tourney cashes between live play and Internet play so get your ass over here and back up your words cash games or tourneys it makes no difference when you play 30 to 60 hours a week you learn a thing or two

Hey dude whats the max you ever loss on one evening out? or winning on one evening out?

max i won = 3.5k
max loss = 200

my mom and her friends went interstate a few weeks ago, they won +20k bought herself a LV bag instead of receiving free cash from them...the next night she flew home, some of them stayed till the next day loss 50k...she usually gets free money every time they win each hand or even plane tickets to overseas...free flights, hotel bookings, who wouldnt wanna go and see something new interstate...

one time i was in the high roller room :D some stupid intern indian student won 200k playin baccarat only to lose it all the next night...some ppl just dont know when to stop

stop going to the casinos since yr2002....

[Jimcs50]

Hey dude whats the max you ever loss on one evening out? or winning on one evening out?

max i won = 3.5k
max loss = 200

....

Most I've won: $6400 ($ 200 buy in tourney, 1st place)

Max loss: $1200 cash game

[Heath Ledger]

Biggest cash game winnings is $2200 in a $1 $2 game 27 hour session.
Biggest tourney win $7800 had a few for $5k plus several for $3k+ and many many between $1500-$2500.

Biggest single evening loss was about $900.

Lately running bad in cash games, last 3 sessions leaking off a few hundred at a time but last night i pretty much offset the last few sessions and got a little back on top.

Tourneys have been running uber good, i should probably be playing a lot more of them.

[Heath Ledger]

Tonight at the Flamingo I won another $790 in $1 $2NL sat down at 10:20 got up at 3:20. Huge hand when I called a raise to $15 with 57 hearts I was on button and one other caller in front of me. I flopped a straight 9 high with two diamonds. Preflop raiser bets out $30 guy in front of me goes all in for $80 I raise it to $150. Preflop raiser smooth calls. Turn is queen of diamonds, ive already comitted myself to this hand and shove $200 in there, preflop raiser calls me. River is a black queen. I put the guy all in for the rest of his chips around $70 or so. He calls. He has pocket aces, exactly what I had him on, other guy has pocket jacks i scoop a very nice pot and cash out.

This guy with aces was the "table buddy" that you tend to talk to durig your session. i tried to tip him off to fold but he just couldnt do it hes been up since early am on Saturday playing poker. A guy I've played with a few times this week and earlier this year last time he was in town.

[Jimcs50]

Tonight at the Flamingo I won another $790 in $1 $2NL sat down at 10:20 got up at 3:20. Huge hand when I called a raise to $15 with 57 hearts I was on button and one other caller in front of me. I flopped a straight 9 high with two diamonds. Preflop raiser bets out $30 guy in front of me goes all in for $80 I raise it to $150. Preflop raiser smooth calls. Turn is queen of diamonds, ive already comitted myself to this hand and shove $200 in there, preflop raiser calls me. River is a black queen. I put the guy all in for the rest of his chips around $70 or so. He calls. He has pocket aces, exactly what I had him on, other guy has pocket jacks i scoop a very nice pot and cash out.

This guy with aces was the "table buddy" that you tend to talk to durig your session. i tried to tip him off to fold but he just couldnt do it hes been up since early am on Saturday playing poker. A guy I've played with a few times this week and earlier this year last time he was in town.


Played a cash game Sunday night and missed a golden opportunity Heath. Tell me what you would have done in this spot.

1-2 NL game

I have $400 in front of me and look down and see 55, I call the BB. The guy to my left, raises to $12, folds around to Phillip in SB, he raises to $52(he only has $80 more in front of him). I show my cards to my buddy to my right, and since I had original raiser to my left, who has about $300 in front of him and could go over the top of Phillip's reraise, I fold. Well, Troy smooth calls. Flop Q 7 5 :bang Phillip shoves his last $80 in and Troy snap calls with KK. Phillip shows A 10 and obviously was just trying to steal. Turn is an Ace and no king comes on river to save Troy from bad beat. I would have made a nice chunk of change there. :depressed

I think I made the right fold, because Phillip did not have enough money in front of him for me to call his $52 reraise, and Troy could have and probably should have reraised with kings. But still you hate letting those chances slip away.

[pkbpkb81]

you made the right call with a small pocket pair, the first preson the guy with pocket kings would have come over the top and you would have been a under dog going to the flop

[Jimcs50]

you made the right call with a small pocket pair, the first preson the guy with pocket kings would have come over the top and you would have been a under dog going to the flop

Yeah, just wish Phillip called the $12, then I call and I bust Troy's ass. :)

[MannyIsGod]

The fold is correct - but do you always smooth call the BB with low pocket pairs? I pretty much never smooth call BBs with small pocket pairs.

[Jimcs50]

The fold is correct - but do you always smooth call the BB with low pocket pairs? I pretty much never smooth call BBs with small pocket pairs.

I was UTG, so I smooth call usually in that early position,( other times, I raise it to say $7 or $8 to build a pot) then call a marginal raise like the $12 and then try to hope I catch a set on flop. There was a lot of raising going on so I pretty much knew that I would be calling a raise in that hand.

I mix up my play as much as possible, sometimes limping with huge hands or any PPs, and raising with other hands like suited connectors or even total rag hands. People really can not put me on hands preflop.

[TDMVPDPOY]

if i was the last person b4 the dealer button, and everyone is in b4 the flop with buy-ins...fkn all in b4 the flop...there be a few that be scared to go all-in on the first game b4 flop...collect ur wins and stay low for a few hands...thats how i play...

[Heath Ledger]

I fold in that situation more times than not I like to see cheAp flops with small pocket pAirs but open with them if first in from mid to late position

if someone from late position raises I sometimes reraise with them in the blinds obviously multiple way pots are the best for small pairs your hoping you flop a set whole someone else flops two pair and someone else flops top pair topkicker and doesn't know how to fold that

I also tend to raise occSionally with suited connectors or with Air from late position in a passive gAme beCause your c-bet will take down smAll pots most of the time because most opponents hands miss most flops


Excuse any typos damn iPhone auto correct is a pAin in the ass

[Heath Ledger]

Just finished 21 hour session cashe out up $375. I bought in for $200 cashed out at $575 after swinging up and down all night like a monkey I hopped off on a small upswing. Not bad for my last 3 sessions im just shy of $2k in profits but this session I really had to hang in there, some very solid players a lot of loosey goosey play. Somehow I survived it without getting stacked and ended it by stacking a very loose guy home on leave from Iraq who was simply there to gamble it up. He had a huge target on him but I was lucky enough to take him down.

[Jimcs50]

Lost $300 last night in one hour. Called $13 raise from SB with QJ, after button called as well.

Flopped QJ8, I bet $24 into $47 pot, original raiser, raised me $50, button calls the $74, I put original raiser on kings or aces, and maybe button on AQ or a draw, so push all in (another $150) and original raiser goes into tank for 2 mins, then calls and button goes all in. Original raiser only has $24 left so calls....Now I feel like I a beat, figure button has 9-10......low and behold, the original raiser has the one hand that kills me(QQ) and the button does have 9-10..... the board does not pair so the button scoops the whole pot. That is a cold deck my friend, we are destined to go broke there.

[Heath Ledger]

Yeah that is pretty brutal. Sounds like the kind of shit I've been going through over the past few weeks up until this week. It feels good to be running good after a 3 week shit sandwich of no extended runs of good cards.

Jim where you been playing online?

[Jimcs50]

I have pretty much blown off playing online. I played at FTP. I dont have the time to play in the 1200-2000 player tournies, which I think are the only ones that are profitable. If you can win one or go really deep in those, then you cash out the 2-4 K and you are guaranteed of making money. Otherwise, I can win a few hundred in sit n goes and I end up just losing it back.

[Heath Ledger]

So where have you been playing?

[Jimcs50]

So where have you been playing?


There are about 6 or 7 rake games here in town. There is at least one game every night and some nights, 2 or 3 going on.

[Jimcs50]

So where have you been playing?


I wish I were in Vegas though, with all those tourists that just love to give away money. The players here in town are all pretty good with a few exceptions, so winning on regular basis is not easy.

[Heath Ledger]

I took a day off yesterday after 3 good sessions in a row. Im out to pound on some more tourists this morning.

[Jimcs50]

I took a day off yesterday after 3 good sessions in a row. Im out to pound on some more tourists this morning.

Next time I come to Vegas, I will PM you and get your number. We can hook up and maybe pound some tourists together. :)

[Heath Ledger]

next time i come to vegas, i will pm you and get your number. We can hook up and maybe pound some tourists together. :)

+1

[G-Nob]

Do you guys have any thoughts on sitting with guys who carry on conversation in a different language? I sat at a cash table with these guys who sounded like they may have been from eastern europe and I had a serious problem with no english at the table while we were playing cards. (They both also spoke english) They wouldn't stop so I got up. Only because I think this was an unfair advantage. I'm all for shootin the shid but not during a card game where valuable info could be given or taken in conversation. Your thoughts?

[Heath Ledger]

Any good dealer would have put the kabash on their chat. You are not out of line to speak up, after a few warnings the dealer will call the floor over and they will get their final warning. A lot of time the forreign players dont know this rule but there are some who take advantage. They are not supposed to chat in another language if there is a hand in progress period. Especially if one of them is in the hand.

[Jimcs50]

Yes, they do not allow that is any casino I've played in.

[G-Nob]

Yes, they do not allow that is any casino I've played in.

Just an fyi, this happened at o'shea's at the cash tables they have at the very front of the casino. For small money players like me, they have tourneys all day that are 35 buy-ins if I remember right.

[Jimcs50]

Had Quad Queens last night!!!

Flopped a set, with two clubs, bet 1/2 pot, got one caller, thought he was flushing, so wanted to fade a club on turn. Turn was a blank, I bet 1/3 the pot, he calls. The river was a club, but the Qc :toast. As I am reaching for my chips, Max asks me if I hit that river, he says that he will only call $40 bet maximum, so I bet $80. :lol he calls(knew he would) and shows a the flush, I show my 4 queens and also collect a $50 bonus. (house pays that for any quads) Sweet!!!

[Heath Ledger]

My last session I had quads twice. Quad Aces and Quad jacks. Got 97 for the quad aces, $60 for the quad jacks. Plus the pots of course. I flopped the quad Jacks. It sucks though when you get a monster like that and you struggle to get a little value out of it.

[G-Nob]

Had Quad Queens last night!!!

Flopped a set, with two clubs, bet 1/2 pot, got one caller, thought he was flushing, so wanted to fade a club on turn. Turn was a blank, I bet 1/3 the pot, he calls. The river was a club, but the Qc :toast. As I am reaching for my chips, Max asks me if I hit that river, he says that he will only call $40 bet maximum, so I bet $80. :lol he calls(knew he would) and shows a the flush, I show my 4 queens and also collect a $50 bonus. (house pays that for any quads) Sweet!!!

That paid off for you but it coulda burned you too. I'm wondering what the maximum you could've thrown into the pot for him to throw the draw away.

[Fabbs]

Jim, Heath,

When "Show One Show All" is ignored. Yeah i know you can ask the dealer to turn them up, but usually the dealers are in such a hurry and/or they are sloppy as to listening to me when i say "Please show those". Its like i have to yell the moment the one guy shows the other guy. Anything short of immediate yelling and -poof- the cards are mucked.

Do you guys just live with it or do you yell out Show One Show All? and/or do what it takes to get the dealer to flip em over
I've also had a few dealers get snippy with me on this. I told them to ride the rhino. Most dealers are fine with it tho, as they should be.

[Heath Ledger]

My experience is that dealers are quick to muck hands, but they will sometimes dig them out if the know where they are or the person who was shown usually speaks up as to what he was shown and or the guy showing. More times than not they are telling the truth but you never know.

I ask sometimes when I want to know, also when Im in a big hand and someone mucks on the river, i often ask to see the cards, this pisses some people off but any edge you can get into the brains of your opponents helps.

[Jimcs50]

That paid off for you but it coulda burned you too. I'm wondering what the maximum you could've thrown into the pot for him to throw the draw away.

Sometimes, I just want value and I bet enough to keep them in the pot, hoping that their draw misses, if club came on turn, then I would still have 10 outs to fill up and win anyway. In this case, I knew where I was and just tried to string him along. If there is already a big pot preflop, then I will just try to take the pot down on the flop. But in this case, I only bet $11 preflop with the queens and only had one caller, so I tried to get more money on flop and turn, which I did.

[CavsSuperFan]

I don’t know much about poker, or gambling or women & stuff…But I always find it kind of creepy while I am watching ESPN Poker with Mother and a player turns over the right card & then fans start cheering like he scored a touchdown or made a slam dunk…Its like, get a life people!….

[Heath Ledger]

Im on a 6 session winning streak. A profit in all of my last 6 sessions. Im up around $2500. Since the world series has ended the games believe it or not have been so much softer. Ive had people go all in on me several times when Im holding the nuts, or calling my allins with top pair no kicker. Life is great at the moment. :)

[Heath Ledger]

Sitting at final table of 80 player tourney 4th in chips only 12 bb's remaining 8 players left

[Heath Ledger]

Chopped for $440

[TDMVPDPOY]

Jim, Heath,

When "Show One Show All" is ignored. Yeah i know you can ask the dealer to turn them up, but usually the dealers are in such a hurry and/or they are sloppy as to listening to me when i say "Please show those". Its like i have to yell the moment the one guy shows the other guy. Anything short of immediate yelling and -poof- the cards are mucked.

Do you guys just live with it or do you yell out Show One Show All? and/or do what it takes to get the dealer to flip em over
I've also had a few dealers get snippy with me on this. I told them to ride the rhino. Most dealers are fine with it tho, as they should be.

show one show all...baccarat :D:D

[G-Nob]

Chopped for $440

Nice work!

[Jimcs50]

Played in 19 man and woman tourney on Sunday, $50 buy in with rebuys in first hour. Started with 2000 in chips and 25-50 blinds. Addon at break for another $50 if you want.

I won!!! Heads up against this guy named Troy who is a good player. Heads up went back and forth for 30 mins. Blinds were 4000-2000. I was in BB with 7-8 spades. Troy goes all in for 16000, I had 32,000 left, if I lose, I still have 20,000 to play with. I call. He has Q 10, so I need to hit.

I get 8 on river to win.:)

Was this the correct call? No, but in heads up, sometimes, you just have to go with your gut. I had chips to lose, and still be in it, so I called and it paid off.


First place- $640 not bad for a $100 entry

[Jimcs50]

One of the games I play gives you $1000 if you get a straight flush.

My friend had Q 10 spades and floped A K J spades....a Royal!!!

He won the hand and got the 1 k bonus....nice.

[Heath Ledger]

I have yet to hit a Royal in live play, I'm long over due statistically.

[MannyIsGod]

I've lost a to a royal with a straight flush live before.

[Jimcs50]

I have yet to hit a Royal in live play, I'm long over due statistically.

I had one about 9 months ago. Had KQ clubs, flopped 10 J clubs, caught ace clubs on turn, another J came on river giving my opponent a full boat....got paid off for a hundy on river bet. Guy did not want to call with his 888JJ hand, especially after the dealer was taking pictures of the board with his camera phone, cuz somehown, he knew that I had the Royal. I almost killed him. LOL


BTW, I looked up the odds for getting a Royal with two cards in your hand and statistally speaking, it says that if I played 5 days a week, 8 hours aday, it will take me another 21 years to get another one. The odds are like 2.2 million to one.

[Jimcs50]

I've lost a to a royal with a straight flush live before.



That blows.

I lost to a higher straight flush before as well, I flopped the Nut flush, and turned the straight flush(one card played) and my opponent had the high end of the straight flush with one card as well. I would have been happier with just the nut flush.:(

The irony here is that this was same opponent, Scott, that had the full house to my Royal Flush, so I guess we are even.:)

[Cry Havoc]

I had one about 9 months ago. Had KQ clubs, flopped 10 J clubs, caught ace clubs on turn, another J came on river giving my opponent a full boat....got paid off for a hundy on river bet. Guy did not want to call with his 888JJ hand, especially after the dealer was taking pictures of the board with his camera phone, cuz somehown, he knew that I had the Royal. I almost killed him. LOL


BTW, I looked up the odds for getting a Royal with two cards in your hand and statistally speaking, it says that if I played 5 days a week, 8 hours aday, it will take me another 21 years to get another one. The odds are like 2.2 million to one.

Heh.

I was playing in a couple online tourneys about four months ago.... I hit two royal flushes within 8 hours of each other. I got called both times, the first time the guy had a flush, and the second I went in aggressive trying to make him think I was buying it, and caught him with two pair. I played all night and the first one happened around 12:30... the second came at 8:03 AM. I looked at the time because I wanted to remember that moment for the rest of my life. :tu

Never happened before or since. Blew me away both times.

[Jimcs50]

Heh.

I was playing in a couple online tourneys about four months ago.... I hit two royal flushes within 8 hours of each other. I got called both times, the first time the guy had a flush, and the second I went in aggressive trying to make him think I was buying it, and caught him with two pair. I played all night and the first one happened around 12:30... the second came at 8:03 AM. I looked at the time because I wanted to remember that moment for the rest of my life. :tu

Never happened before or since. Blew me away both times.

Now you will have to wait 42 years for your next one.:lol

I had a king high straight flush online, also with clubs.

[Jimcs50]

Played in a $125 buyin tourney with rebuys yesterday here in town. 30 players, three full tables. I bought in and never had to rebuy or add on at break, so was only in for the $125.

Started with 15K in chips and 100-200 blinds, had great start got chip stack up to 37K in first 1 1/2 hour, then had QQ under the gun. The player two to my left was an aggressive preflop raiser who was not really getting any cards, so I limped in hoping he would raise. Blinds were 400-800. As hoped, he made it 2200, so I was going to re-raise, but player on button raises to 15K. Now, did he do this because he knew the the same thing I knew about the aggressive player or does he have me beat with a monster??? I go all in to isolate and get the first guy to fold, which he does, the raiser puts in his last 5k and shows AA. :bang The flops has a Q. :toast, but he hits runner runner hearts to make a flush. :depressed. Now I have 17K going into break.

In first three hands after the break, I double up twice and win 12K in the 3rd hand to get my stack to 80K.

I hit final table with over 250K and get 3rd place when I move all in against chip leader on button with J 9 d for 170K, he calls half his stack with A 10 and fllops an ace but I flop two diamonds, but miss, getting a pair of useless jacks on river.

I win $600 for 3rd, 2nd place got $1000. In hindsight, I could have waited for a better spot to move all in, but blinds were 40-20 K and I had 4 BBs left, so had to try to either steal blinds or double up pretty quickly.

[Heath Ledger]

Nice hit.
Shorthanded is such a crapshoot anyways. Nothing wrong with your play there.

I havent played much in the past week only for 1 hour in cash games, left up $100, i've been busy packing and shit. This move is going to be stressful.

[Fabbs]

Jim, Heath,

Live 100u 2/3 blinds
Me just left of BB.
Ah/3d
No one raises.
Flop 2h 4c 5s for a straight.
BB checks, i check. Why? Because Fat Stack around the corner has been raising almost constantly, and because no flush draw there at all except runner runner.
Fatso bets 10, next guy joins, 3rd guy joins, BB folds.
Me: I only call. Again, why? I want to build the pot and because Fat Stack has shown himself to be an overly aggessive river chaser whose idiocy has been rewarded several times with 1-2 outer suck outs.
Turn: 9c
I check, knowing Fats will bet. He does, 10. I put him on flush draw. Next guy calls the 10, 3rd guy folds, I go 20. Why only 20? Two clubs and I'm telling you Fatso can and will chase. I started with 100, have 225 at the start of this hand and am bound and determined to go home up, and i want this to be my last hand. So, i reason, let him chase his flush, if he gets it i bail, kind of pissed that he hits but i would still go out of the hand with only about 40 in it (he might have gone out if i bet real big after the turn but again, i dont want to risk it, i saw him bet huge before on idiotic calls after the turn with he having only 1 out on the river). 3rd guy i put on a 6, so he is hanging around for the gutshot river 3 which would give him the higher straight. I figure he willnot chase enough to chase his gutshot, right?

Well, Fatso calls my 20 and so does Gutshut.
River 3d. No flush for Fatso.
Fatso folds as i had him correctly chasing his flush.
Gutshot hits his farking higher straight as he has 6/8 offsuit, no clubs.
Gutshot bets 40 and i fold, telling him i know you hit your greasy 6 and sure enough he shows it.

I knew all along i risked Gutshot hitting his 3 on the river to give him the higher straight 6 to 5, but i mean FARK!!! would you guys play this any differently. Pot of about 100 would have been mine had he not sucked out.

I wanted him to chase his stupid one-two out river and the suck out hits it.

"Better to win a small pot then lose a big one"? or would you play it just like i did and call Suckout a greasy spoon?

Here is the weirdest part. On semi big hands like this, after the turn but before the River when I am 80% or better, on All Ins i am losing these 80% of the time. Is Tony Soprano and his punks running the camera and radioing down to the table because i find this extremely fishy to happen on an 80% basis, just on big pots.

[TDMVPDPOY]

why u mofos bother sittin 4-5 hrs just to win 600 or 2-3rd placing?

fuck that shit go put the principal on black and walk towards the exit if it dont land....

http://i31.tinypic.com/2qs44qr.gif

[Jimcs50]

why u mofos bother sittin 4-5 hrs just to win 600 or 2-3rd placing?

fuck that shit go put the principal on black and walk towards the exit if it dont land....

http://i31.tinypic.com/2qs44qr.gif



how is that fun?

Besides, there is no casino gambling in Texas, we have to make do.

[Cry Havoc]

Jim, Heath,

Live 100u 2/3 blinds
Me just left of BB.
Ah/3d
No one raises.
Flop 2h 4c 5s for a straight.
BB checks, i check. Why? Because Fat Stack around the corner has been raising almost constantly, and because no flush draw there at all except runner runner.
Fatso bets 10, next guy joins, 3rd guy joins, BB folds.
Me: I only call. Again, why? I want to build the pot and because Fat Stack has shown himself to be an overly aggessive river chaser whose idiocy has been rewarded several times with 1-2 outer suck outs.
Turn: 9c
I check, knowing Fats will bet. He does, 10. I put him on flush draw. Next guy calls the 10, 3rd guy folds, I go 20. Why only 20? Two clubs and I'm telling you Fatso can and will chase. I started with 100, have 225 at the start of this hand and am bound and determined to go home up, and i want this to be my last hand. So, i reason, let him chase his flush, if he gets it i bail, kind of pissed that he hits but i would still go out of the hand with only about 40 in it (he might have gone out if i bet real big after the turn but again, i dont want to risk it, i saw him bet huge before on idiotic calls after the turn with he having only 1 out on the river). 3rd guy i put on a 6, so he is hanging around for the gutshot river 3 which would give him the higher straight. I figure he willnot chase enough to chase his gutshot, right?

Well, Fatso calls my 20 and so does Gutshut.
River 3d. No flush for Fatso.
Fatso folds as i had him correctly chasing his flush.
Gutshot hits his farking higher straight as he has 6/8 offsuit, no clubs.
Gutshot bets 40 and i fold, telling him i know you hit your greasy 6 and sure enough he shows it.

I knew all along i risked Gutshot hitting his 3 on the river to give him the higher straight 6 to 5, but i mean FARK!!! would you guys play this any differently. Pot of about 100 would have been mine had he not sucked out.

I wanted him to chase his stupid one-two out river and the suck out hits it.

"Better to win a small pot then lose a big one"? or would you play it just like i did and call Suckout a greasy spoon?

Here is the weirdest part. On semi big hands like this, after the turn but before the River when I am 80% or better, on All Ins i am losing these 80% of the time. Is Tony Soprano and his punks running the camera and radioing down to the table because i find this extremely fishy to happen on an 80% basis, just on big pots.

You played alright, but if you have someone looking to make a hand that can beat you, it's better to just get them out as early as possible. You weren't putting a lot of money in the pot, so it's not like you were pulling down a lot of cash from the guy with the 6, he was just hanging around for his card -- and got it. People will hang around all day if you let them and nab pots from you left and right. No poker player worth his salt is going to call a pot raise with a gutshot straight draw, especially not if he's got two people on the board raising against him.

If you make that hand mano a mano with Loosey McChips to your left early on, you win and might take down quite a bit off him early when he's still thinking he'll land the flush.

[Fabbs]

You played alright, but if you have someone looking to make a hand that can beat you, it's better to just get them out as early as possible. You weren't putting a lot of money in the pot, so it's not like you were pulling down a lot of cash from the guy with the 6, he was just hanging around for his card -- and got it. People will hang around all day if you let them and nab pots from you left and right. No poker player worth his salt is going to call a pot raise with a gutshot straight draw, especially not if he's got two people on the board raising against him.

If you make that hand mano a mano with Loosey McChips to your left early on, you win and might take down quite a bit off him early when he's still thinking he'll land the flush.
CY,
True, but if i raise big after the flop Loosey also might bail and i win 6 chips.
But i do think i should have made my post turn raise (of their 10) 40 instead of 20.
I think you are correct that Gunshot 6 bails after the turn if i make him pay 40. What you have to keep in mind tho, after the turn there were two clubs and i didnt want to get bbq'd by Loosey had he hit his club on the River.

It was just an annoying hand, Gunshot sucked out and again this has happened far too often. Trust me i have bet big earlier, like all in KK vs AK with the flop having neither and Jerk Off Joe hitting runner runner JQ for the straight. Its bullcrap, and its happening to me far far more then the math says it will. Annoying.