NBA: Rank Lebron As A Player Now

[Spurtacular]

Sure. Not Bosh, Wade, Allen talented, but pretty good. That said, none of those guys have done anything of note since.

A double-double guy and a top ten level player when he needed it. No getting past GS without them.

[ElNono]

A double-double guy and a top ten level player when he needed it. No getting past GS without them.

You’re putting the cart before the horse. Double-double guys are dime a dozen in this league. And ‘top 10 guy’ only when LeBron picked up all the attention. That’s why LeBron is a franchise guy, the rest tried and failed.

[Spurtacular]

You’re putting the cart before the horse. Double-double guys are dime a dozen in this league. And ‘top 10 guy’ only when LeBron picked up all the attention. That’s why LeBron is a franchise guy, the rest tried and failed.

They were top draft choices, dude. Those type of players weren't very likely to fall in Cleveland's lap if Lebron had stayed.

[ElNono]

They were top draft choices, dude. Those type of players weren't very likely to fall in Cleveland's lap if Lebron had stayed.

I’m not saying they didn’t turn out to be good, what I’m saying is that the guy that elevated everything there was LeBron.
Kyrie thought he was hot after that ring and his teams have done better without him.

[Spurtacular]

I’m not saying they didn’t turn out to be good, what I’m saying is that the guy that elevated everything there was LeBron.
Kyrie thought he was hot after that ring and his teams have done better without him.

Kyrie may have needed Lebron to peak right, but his talent was undeniable. Sure, he went to Boston and fizzled out; maybe he could've won another ring if he had stayed with Lebron. But Lebron wasn't winning that ring without Kyrie. That said, I don't care how much Kyrie gets called out on his play going forward; it's largely true.

[ElNono]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.

[lefty]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.

Agreed
MJ was a great 2nd banana to MVPippen and Rodman tbh

[Spurtacular]

Never said they’re not talented. TD and Manu had Parker, Shaq and Pau had Kobe, Curry and KD had Klay... you always need a solid second/third banana around.

And my point is I doubt Lebron gets those types of players if he had stayed in Cleveland and not went to Miami.

If I'm gonna throw you a bone, maybe Lebron gets one quality FA to join him and catches lightning in a bottle one of those Miami years, and he rings.

[TDfan2007]

You're a Spur fan at heart, so I'll let your Jim love slide. But Kawhi has been in the right place at the right timePERIOD.

He was drafted to the Spurs, who were already good. Jim was the man on those teams. They still had Manu. Still had TP. Still had Pop on the sidelines and good role players. All he had to do is mature as a player and fit into Pop's system. Then they fell out. Somebody had to go so he was...

...Deported to a ready made contender, who went 18-4 (81.8%) while he load managed in route to a ring*. Even without him this year, the Raps are winning at a 67.7% clip - good for 6th in the East (so far).

Fast forward to this year. He (secretly) met with Paul George - while he was simultaneously "negotiating in good faith" with Jeannie Buss. All in an effort to join another stacked team. Go get Moe Harkless. Go trade for Paul George. Etc, and I'll sign.

When has he ever had to shoulder the load of dragging a lotto team to the playoffs? Answer: none.

Career averages of 18.1ppg, 6.4rpg, and 2.5apg is hardly worthy of being thought of amongst the all-time greats. He "won" because he was on great teams. That's it and that's all.

* yes his 2019 ring deserves a big fat * next to it. We all know if KD and Klay played he'd be shining shoes.

what a takedown. I agree with everything you've said, but when the guy plays, he's an assassin and easily a top 3 player because you can take nothing away from him. His passing is even improving.

It's a tough call between him and LeBron at this point, with Anthony Davis and Harden having a case for that number 4 spot. Giannis is clearly number one right now

[ElNono]

And my point is I doubt Lebron gets those types of players if he had stayed in Cleveland and not went to Miami.

If I'm gonna throw you a bone, maybe Lebron gets one quality FA to join him and catches lightning in a bottle one of those Miami years, and he rings.

I mean, it’s hard to tell and we can play the what if game all day long. He did get some players to join him like Kevin love, friendkilla, RJ, Mozgov, Perkins, Shawn Marion, Shumpert. They had Mo Williams too, IIRC. There’s a lot of talent there that was recruited by LeGM, tbh

[ambchang]

You're a Spur fan at heart, so I'll let your Jim love slide. But Kawhi has been in the right place at the right timePERIOD.

He was drafted to the Spurs, who were already good. Jim was the man on those teams. They still had Manu. Still had TP. Still had Pop on the sidelines and good role players. All he had to do is mature as a player and fit into Pop's system. Then they fell out. Somebody had to go so he was...

...Deported to a ready made contender, who went 18-4 (81.8%) while he load managed in route to a ring*. Even without him this year, the Raps are winning at a 67.7% clip - good for 6th in the East (so far).

Fast forward to this year. He (secretly) met with Paul George - while he was simultaneously "negotiating in good faith" with Jeannie Buss. All in an effort to join another stacked team. Go get Moe Harkless. Go trade for Paul George. Etc, and I'll sign.

When has he ever had to shoulder the load of dragging a lotto team to the playoffs? Answer: none.

Career averages of 18.1ppg, 6.4rpg, and 2.5apg is hardly worthy of being thought of amongst the all-time greats. He "won" because he was on great teams. That's it and that's all.

* yes his 2019 ring deserves a big fat * next to it. We all know if KD and Klay played he'd be shining shoes.

So the 99 spurs deserve an asterisk because they played less games and thus didn’t let the injury game play out, but the raptors deserve an asterisk because the other team was injured?

But there’s no asterisk for the 12 heat (shorter season), 88 lakers (Isiah Thomas injury), 00 lakers (duncan injury), 10 lakers (Celtics frontline).

Pick a lane buddy.

[LkrFan]

So the 99 spurs deserve an asterisk because they played less games and thus didn’t let the injury game play out, but the raptors deserve an asterisk because the other team was injured?

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? Drinking Saki early huh? They deserve an *PERIOD.

But there’s no asterisk for the 12 heat (shorter season), 88 lakers (Isiah Thomas injury), 00 lakers (duncan injury), 10 lakers (Celtics frontline).

12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke

Pick a lane buddy.

Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999

[LkrFan]

^ forgot about that 0.4 dude, who backed up NVE. They were stacked, young, and way more athletic before they traded EJ and Elden Campbell for Glenn Rice.

[Ghazi]

DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

ass take

[lefty]

DK at #1

LeBron, Duncan, Kareem are all better than him, and Kawhi probably will be too once it's all said and done.

Agreed

[lefty]

GOATS don't lose to rivals 14x in a row, son. People like to excuse that the man was young and lacked surrounding talent; but the final game of the two sweeps, McHale, Walton, and others were out injured as I came back from 15 in the fourth to finish Jordan off on his home floor. , Fred ing Roberts was the starting 4 in that game. He was like the Lakers' version of Jeff Lamp (12th man).

Then when I was injured and the Pistons got their chance, what did Jordan do when he had the Pistons 2-1 in the 89 ECF and Game 4 on his home court? He choked. He did nothing in the toughest era; we all were there, son. Then boys like you going through puberty in the 90's got a hard-on for the man.

[ambchang]

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? Drinking Saki early huh? They deserve an *PERIOD.



12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke



Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999

Thanks for confirming your self contradiction.

[daslicer]

Yes and yes.

50/82=61% of the season. Every other true champ had to grind all the way thru all 82. 1999 deserves an *PERIOD

You really think the Raps beat a healthy Dub team? Drinking Saki early huh? They deserve an *PERIOD.



12 Heat - no *

88 Lakers - nope; they just beat them in 87. Matter of fact, you missed the Pistons 89 *. Magic and B Scott didn't play.

00 Lakers - nope; then went on to annihilate the Spurs in 2001, proving 2000 wasn't a fluke



Just be lucky Phil Jackson didn't coach the 1998 Lakers:

Eddie Jones
Eldon Campbell
Nick Van Exel
Rick Fox
Robert Horry
Shaq (only 315lbs)
Kobe
Corie Blount

I guarantee you guys don't win in 1999

Trading Eddie Jones and Elden Campbell for Glen Rice was a big mistake by Jerry West. Those guys caused problems for the Spurs matchup wise.

[LkrFan]

Trading Eddie Jones and Elden Campbell for Glen Rice was a big mistake by Jerry West. Those guys caused problems for the Spurs matchup wise.

Agreed. Next to not seeing Eddie and Kobe for a decade, I also regret not keeping NVE. He was soooooo fun to watch:


As a 6th man extraordinaire, he could've been Sweet Lou on steroids.

[Rummpd]

I don't know if undisputed, but Jordan has a more than strong case as the GOAT. Not only narratives, raw numbers and accolades are on his side, but also advanced metrics support his case as the GOAT.

Jabbar is the true GOAT

[spurraider21]

11 rings in 13 seasons

a league where there were 8 total teams

[Clipper Nation]

a league where there were 8 total teams

Good point, the league didn't water itself down with expansion for Russell like they did for DK.

[FrostKing]

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Russell

[lefty]

Good point, the league didn't water itself down with expansion for Russell like they did for DK.

[Larry Joe Bird]

This dude knows.