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RealGM poster tracked Bulls defense on Magic in 1991 Finals. As always Jordan gets exposed big time when he gets analyzed thoroughly
Link: https://forums.realgm.com/boards/vie....php?t=1261129
Lakers were not the favoritesLakers were the favorites in that series. Lebron's fans tend to forget that, and some were still just a gleam in their daddy's eye when it happened.
Magic career FG% is 52%. In that series he was guarded by Scottie and MJ and shot 43%
Scottie did a better job on him than Jordan did in that series. No denying it. But that's a whole 5 games. Very small sample size.
Blazers were the favorites in WCF but they choked - those early 90s Blzers teams were notorious chokers
with Terry Teagle and
Worthy injured his foot before the NBA Finals started and he and Byron Scott didn'T even play game 5; Magic managed to have 20 assists that night despite having to play with Terry Teagle, Tony Smith and 2nd year Divac
And you watch the games, Magic'S bad shooting wasn't because of Jordan
RealGM poster tracked Bulls defense on Magic in 1991 Finals. As always Jordan gets exposed big time when he gets analyzed thoroughly
Link: https://forums.realgm.com/boards/vie....php?t=1261129
You are right about the blazers being notorious chokers. They still are
But the Lakers were preseason favorites over the Bulls. Then when they made the Finals they were still favored. Every talking head and his momma said the Bulls werent ready for the more experienced Lakers.
https://www.basketball-reference.com...ason_odds.html
Lakers were not the favorites
Blazers were the favorites in WCF but they choked - those early 90s Blzers teams were notorious chokers
with Terry Teagle and
Worthy injured his foot before the NBA Finals started and he and Byron Scott didn'T even play game 5; Magic managed to have 20 assists that night despite having to play with Terry Teagle, Tony Smith and 2nd year Divac
And you watch the games, Magic'S bad shooting wasn't because of Jordan
Eh it'S their opinion tbh
I have already conceded that Pippen did a better job on Magic in that series. But just for the of it, I am going to re-watch some of that series. It's been 30 years.
I present you Tim McMillen, congressman
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_McMillen
Jordan had plenty of weaknesses as a player and anybody saying that he has none is beyond stupid. He couldn't shoot the 3. His field goal percentage was like 28% from 3 career wise and don't give me those bull years where they moved the 3 point line closer. It's ridiculous that grown men count those years, probably tee off from the women's marker and then brag to their friends that they birdied the hole
He wasn't a good rebounder. Yeah he was alright for a guard but he wasn't great at rebounding. That would be a weakness. He wasn't a good post defender. An if anybody says he is then why didn't he guard bigger players? Why did he let Cartwright, Grant, and Pippen guard them? Because he couldn't. Again, that's a weakness. His passing was ty. He had those Kobe like passes where he is tripled teamed and about to be blocked so he passes to the wide open guy and people are like omg what a pass! Well he had 3 people on him and could've made that pass a lot sooner
I'm not taking anything anyway from Jordan. the guy was great. He dominated his era. He's in the discussion of GOAT (I personally don't have him as the GOAT but a lot of people from 1990-on do). But another weakness of his is that he has no ability to give other people who did well against him any credit. Imagine saying that Gary Payton didn't guard him well but that he had personal problems going on
Sidenote: I love 80s bball but let's not pretend that they actually knew how to defend people. Teams averaged 115 a game back then and I have to hear over and over again how physical they were. Look they didn't call flagrants, i know that, but they called just as many soft ticky tacky fouls as they do today. It's actually harder to play defense today than it was back then.
ExactlyJordan had plenty of weaknesses as a player and anybody saying that he has none is beyond stupid. He couldn't shoot the 3. His field goal percentage was like 28% from 3 career wise and don't give me those bull years where they moved the 3 point line closer. It's ridiculous that grown men count those years, probably tee off from the women's marker and then brag to their friends that they birdied the hole
He wasn't a good rebounder. Yeah he was alright for a guard but he wasn't great at rebounding. That would be a weakness. He wasn't a good post defender. An if anybody says he is then why didn't he guard bigger players? Why did he let Cartwright, Grant, and Pippen guard them? Because he couldn't. Again, that's a weakness. His passing was ty. He had those Kobe like passes where he is tripled teamed and about to be blocked so he passes to the wide open guy and people are like omg what a pass! Well he had 3 people on him and could've made that pass a lot sooner
I'm not taking anything anyway from Jordan. the guy was great. He dominated his era. He's in the discussion of GOAT (I personally don't have him as the GOAT but a lot of people from 1990-on do). But another weakness of his is that he has no ability to give other people who did well against him any credit. Imagine saying that Gary Payton didn't guard him well but that he had personal problems going on
Sidenote: I love 80s bball but let's not pretend that they actually knew how to defend people. Teams averaged 115 a game back then and I have to hear over and over again how physical they were. Look they didn't call flagrants, i know that, but they called just as many soft ticky tacky fouls as they do today. It's actually harder to play defense today than it was back then.
If you watch Jordan's offensive rebounds, they happen because those ing milkmen who are supposed to guard him were just watching the ball instead of blocking him out
And yeah his assists were just "oh , I can't score" bail out passes
As for the sidenote there are plenty of videos and full old games on YT, you can see they called soft ass fouls and handchecking and you can see the so called tough guys flopping
Who's your GOAT by the way
Last edited by lefty; 05-12-2020 at 01:34 PM.
Wilt. Everybody loves to on him that he didn’t win enough or he played against inferior compe ors but nobody s on Shaq for winning against Mutumbo, Smits, Van Horn, and Eric Dampier. Dude had rules changed so he couldn’t dominate and he still did. He averaged 50 points a game and 24 rebounds that same season. He played all 48 minutes a game for every game one season. Do you know how ridiculously difficult that is? Literally no other player can do that in the history of the game. Also he averaged something like 9 blocks a game for some years. Which is like Double Hakeems career high.
Wilt was dominant tbh
Conversely, they changed the rules for Jordan
hm i seem to also recall the lakers having some rather significant injuries in that series too, but jordan lovers sure love to forget that. typical pick-and-choose mentality, just like mike himself loves to do. figures.
You are right about the blazers being notorious chokers. They still are
But the Lakers were preseason favorites over the Bulls. Then when they made the Finals they were still favored. Every talking head and his momma said the Bulls werent ready for the more experienced Lakers.
https://www.basketball-reference.com...ason_odds.html
truthbombs everywhere in this post, but especially the boldJordan had plenty of weaknesses as a player and anybody saying that he has none is beyond stupid. He couldn't shoot the 3. His field goal percentage was like 28% from 3 career wise and don't give me those bull years where they moved the 3 point line closer. It's ridiculous that grown men count those years, probably tee off from the women's marker and then brag to their friends that they birdied the hole
He wasn't a good rebounder. Yeah he was alright for a guard but he wasn't great at rebounding. That would be a weakness. He wasn't a good post defender. An if anybody says he is then why didn't he guard bigger players? Why did he let Cartwright, Grant, and Pippen guard them? Because he couldn't. Again, that's a weakness. His passing was ty. He had those Kobe like passes where he is tripled teamed and about to be blocked so he passes to the wide open guy and people are like omg what a pass! Well he had 3 people on him and could've made that pass a lot sooner
I'm not taking anything anyway from Jordan. the guy was great. He dominated his era. He's in the discussion of GOAT (I personally don't have him as the GOAT but a lot of people from 1990-on do). But another weakness of his is that he has no ability to give other people who did well against him any credit. Imagine saying that Gary Payton didn't guard him well but that he had personal problems going on
Sidenote: I love 80s bball but let's not pretend that they actually knew how to defend people. Teams averaged 115 a game back then and I have to hear over and over again how physical they were. Look they didn't call flagrants, i know that, but they called just as many soft ticky tacky fouls as they do today. It's actually harder to play defense today than it was back then.
Will have to look at this.
I think Jordan was a good defender unlike Kobe who was given I dunno how many all-team defense awards despite being total shiesta. For that reason, I don't put any stock in popular narratives.
Jordan was not as good as Pippen at guarding wing players. No denying that. Anyone here claiming that?
Side note: The Glove is the nickname the Dream Teamers gave to John Stockton when he was shutting down MJ in practices when nobody else could.
Gary Payton stole the nickname in the next NBA season.
Was it really? I had no idea. Poor Stockton, not only did he never get a nickname, but when he did he got it jacked
All-time steals leader. He didn't need a nickname. He was the real deal.Was it really? I had no idea. Poor Stockton, not only did he never get a nickname, but when he did he got it jacked
Steal leader got his nickname stolen
If you have ESPN Plus watch Game 2 of the 91 Finals against the Lakers. The passing clinic Jordan put on was ing insane. Got everyone the ball, and then took it over offensively. He was a very good passer.. Not Magic, or Bird, but they can't score like Mike.. Jordan is likely the best guard defender of all time. Everyone from coaches, to former players, credit this to him. Post Defense? Was he supposed to grow 6 inches and guard Hakeem on the block or something? GTFO.. Conversely Hakeem might be the best defensive Big ever. You want him running around chasing PG's up and down the court? And if he can't is that a weakness? Yeah Lebron can guard all 5 positions. And he's been guarding them like for the last 4 years.. Bird not an elite 1 on 1 defender. Neither was Magic.. Jordan was a dominate 1 on 1 defender.. And wait for it... The best offensive player of all time.
Last edited by dbreiden83080; 05-13-2020 at 09:13 PM.
Starks was a good defender, and a good 3 PT shooter especially for the 90's when the 3 had little emphasis. In today's game with Teams shooting 400 3 PT shots a game.. Starks is likely an All Star.. Starks was gritty and Tough.. Pop would have loved him on the Spurs le teams.
Yup. Lebron guarding all 5 positions is a myth. When Duncan was lighting the Heat up for like 25 points in a half in the 2013 Finals I didn't see Spo send the self proclaimed king to guard him and put out the fire. Because he knew he was incapable.
Isiah is the only real from his generation. He's the only man from that time who isn't a bitter and drowning in delusional bias.
Starks was not a good defender, he got lit up by other shooting guards; Dumars droppoed 40 on his ass a couple of times, Reggie "Klay Thompson' Miller looked like Thanos whenever ther faced Indiana
Heck even T
As a shooter he was very streaky, he wasn't a pure consistent shooter
Starks was gritty and had heart, I like him a lot actually, but he - like other shooting guards of that era - were grossly overrated to make Jordan look like he overcame amazing hurdles
Magic and Bird could have scored like Mike if they wanted to, they weren't chuckers like Jordan, that's the difference
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