Lowe: Someone in league texted me and said there's a little bit of buzz about 2 for 11 + Aldridge

[DPG21920]

I like White more than what I think Halliburton and Hayes will become.

I don't have much worry about paying him, it's not like they'll be in tax trouble after this year, and it's not like they'll lose out on free agents with so little going for them. But also, paying him now just means you can trade him later. Jrue couldn't get his team to the playoffs and somehow was worth a billion unprotected first round picks.

Having White around would be better for developing Wiseman, who will need all the help he can get.

Agree.

[Chinook]

I get it, but sentimentality shouldn't interfere with practicality. The reality is, he's 26, this doesn't look like a quick fix and Haliburton and to a lesser extent Hayes are both similar and have the added benefits of being 6 and 7 years younger respectively, while also not needing to be significantly paid for 4 years.

Basically. I like him more than Murray for sure, and I don't have a problem saying he's the best of the Spurs "young" players right now. The issue is that his ceiling isn't so high that he's untouchable. If White is one of the Spurs' three best players, they aren't going anywhere. Like don't trade him for nothing or even let him walk, but trading for future value and letting the rest of the young guys settle into roles for a season isn't a bad idea. I'd MUCH rather them trade Murray and then do that, since they'd save some critical money. But ultimately, which of those two they pick likely won't have any affect on the Spurs' trajectory going forward.

[objective]

Spurs aren't going anywhere with or without White or with or without Halliburton or Hayes anyways, they're probably 2 top lotto picks in good future drafts away from being contenders.

But if White is allowed to play and isn't hamstrung by whack coaching, then he'll put up very nice numbers like he did in the bubble, and he'll be worth more in trade.

With the flattened lotto odds and how tough the West will be, I wouldn't sweat White costing them lotto odds.

[Dejounte]

Spurs aren't going anywhere with or without White or with or without Halliburton or Hayes anyways, they're probably 2 top lotto picks in good future drafts away from being contenders.

But if White is allowed to play and isn't hamstrung by whack coaching, then he'll put up very nice numbers like he did in the bubble, and he'll be worth more in trade.

With the flattened lotto odds and how tough the West will be, I wouldn't sweat White costing them lotto odds.

Nah. If they get Wiseman, that's a new BIG 3 with

Wiseman = Timmy D
Keldon = Manu
White = Parker

[exstatic]

Let's be honest, that's a Spurs fan perception. No one in the sports media sees it that way and there's a chance many in the league don't see it that way, either.

RoCo is just a larger version of LDN. He’s a great defender, but really just shoots 3s, with no other offense.

[TD 21]

I like White more than what I think Halliburton and Hayes will become.

I don't have much worry about paying him, it's not like they'll be in tax trouble after this year, and it's not like they'll lose out on free agents with so little going for them. But also, paying him now just means you can trade him later. Jrue couldn't get his team to the playoffs and somehow was worth a billion unprotected first round picks.

Having White around would be better for developing Wiseman, who will need all the help he can get.

It's more so about their being viable replacements readily available than who'd end up better.

They're probably on the verge of locking up 3 mid 20s role players to relatively big extensions. It won't hurt them for the time being, but it's just not a prudent way to go about re-building.

Haliburton and Hayes are as good or better passers.

I get it too- it seems like something that might need to happen (including White) to get deals done Im just saying I’m not in love with it because you are swapping youth for youth somewhat.

I want ideally to add onto youth but I get it.

Not really. White is 26. Wiggins has been in the league 6 years to his 3 yet is still only 25, while Wiseman and Hayes are 19 and Haliburton is 20.

Basically. I like him more than Murray for sure, and I don't have a problem saying he's the best of the Spurs "young" players right now. The issue is that his ceiling isn't so high that he's untouchable. If White is one of the Spurs' three best players, they aren't going anywhere. Like don't trade him for nothing or even let him walk, but trading for future value and letting the rest of the young guys settle into roles for a season isn't a bad idea. I'd MUCH rather them trade Murray and then do that, since they'd save some critical money. But ultimately, which of those two they pick likely won't have any affect on the Spurs' trajectory going forward.

Wait, did you just agree with me?

Of course it'd be preferable to do this with Murray in White's stead, but then it'd no longer be realistic from a financial or value perspective for the Warriors.

[objective]

White will become the new Jrue on trade value. Jrue hadn't made an all-star game in 7 years, and his one appearance was for the joke eastern conference.

Bubble Stats per 36
White age 26
22.7 points
6 assists
5.2 rebounds

Jrue age 30
16.7 points
5.5 assists
4.6 rebounds

Both with reputations for good defense, and if the Spurs can excise Forbes from their rotation, then White's rep will grow. Dejounte was on an all defense team playing next to Anderson and Green, and his stat impact dived when he was next to Forbes and DeRozan. White can hit that all-defense.

And by age 28 or 29 the odds are his salary will still be less than Jrue's at that age (between 25 and 26 million)

[Sugus]

White will become the new Jrue on trade value. Jrue hadn't made an all-star game in 7 years, and his one appearance was for the joke eastern conference.

Bubble Stats per 36
White age 26
22.7 points
6 assists
5.2 rebounds

Jrue age 30
16.7 points
5.5 assists
4.6 rebounds

Both with reputations for good defense, and if the Spurs can excise Forbes from their rotation, then White's rep will grow. Dejounte was on an all defense team playing next to Anderson and Green, and his stat impact dived when he was next to Forbes and DeRozan. White can hit that all-defense.

And by age 28 or 29 the odds are his salary will still be less than Jrue's at that age (between 25 and 26 million)

You'd do well to not get your hopes up that White will have trade value even close to Jrue's. It's not about the stats, or the ASG appearences (though Jrue's is a clear separator between him and White), it's about how both players are perceived around the league. Jrue is a known quan y - it's known that he's a great and switchable defender, great offensive player, good lockerroom presence and leader. White is, frankly, an above-average role player; we Spurs fans know his true value, which is why he's best served playing for us, but at the same time it means that teams won't be willing to shed nearly as much as MWKE did for Jrue. You need to be an elite roleplayer for years on end to have that kind of league-wide perception and value.

[objective]

You'd do well to not get your hopes up that White will have trade value even close to Jrue's. It's not about the stats, or the ASG appearences (though Jrue's is a clear separator between him and White), it's about how both players are perceived around the league. Jrue is a known quan y - it's known that he's a great and switchable defender, great offensive player, good lockerroom presence and leader. White is, frankly, an above-average role player; we Spurs fans know his true value, which is why he's best served playing for us, but at the same time it means that teams won't be willing to shed nearly as much as MWKE did for Jrue. You need to be an elite roleplayer for years on end to have that kind of league-wide perception and value.

It's fair to not get my hopes up with Pop's coaching, that is true.

Jrue under Pop would have been getting 24 minutes a game off the bench.

If White is freed, he will succeed.

[Collins21]

As Spurs fans we've gone from wanting to trade LMA for the #2 pick to now Spurs fans are suggesting taking Whiteside and a future pick. It's obvious most Spurs fans are idiots.

[DPG21920]

As Spurs fans we've gone from wanting to trade LMA for the #2 pick to now Spurs fans are suggesting taking Whiteside and a future pick. It's obvious most Spurs fans are idiots.

You can at least @ me bruh lol

[Sugus]

It's fair to not get my hopes up with Pop's coaching, that is true.

Jrue under Pop would have been getting 24 minutes a game off the bench.

If White is freed, he will succeed.

I disagree. White doesn't have the physical tools to "succeed" (by which you mean, I guess, be the kind of player that gets selected to an ASG, like Jrue was). He's really smart, plays gritty, and knows how to distribute - but he doesn't have a scoring mentality, is far too passive (the bubble play can perfectly well be an anomaly instead of the new normal, and even then, I wouldn't say he was playing at an All-Star level, just shooting more), and isn't athletic enough to score at the rim at will, often getting blocked or having to do complicated acrobatics just to score there. He's also too old at this point to ever shake the "role-player" tag, even if he goes to other teams - what players do you know that were relatively unknown around the league, then went on to have career resurgences and become stars after 26? It's not many, and most of them had 1-year peaks where they made an ASG, only to flame out after age catches up with them.

I like White, he's maybe my third favorite Spur right now, and I wouldn't want to trade him if we could avoid him. But he is what he is, and a coaching change doesn't really alter that. In any case, Pop's teachings and mentality have likely been far too engrained in him already to be changed. I see it in Dejounte as well, that hesitance... I hope Lonnie and Keldon don't suck that in, because it's a career killer.

[Collins21]

You can at least @ me bruh lol

Why the would I @ you, I didn't say SpursTalk I said Twitter.

[DPG21920]

Why the would I @ you, I didn't say SpursTalk I said Twitter.

Because I was the one on Twitter engaged with Jabari Young on LMA to Portland involving whiteside...

[Mugen]

White will become the new Jrue on trade value. Jrue hadn't made an all-star game in 7 years, and his one appearance was for the joke eastern conference.

Bubble Stats per 36
White age 26
22.7 points
6 assists
5.2 rebounds

Jrue age 30
16.7 points
5.5 assists
4.6 rebounds

Both with reputations for good defense, and if the Spurs can excise Forbes from their rotation, then White's rep will grow. Dejounte was on an all defense team playing next to Anderson and Green, and his stat impact dived when he was next to Forbes and DeRozan. White can hit that all-defense.

And by age 28 or 29 the odds are his salary will still be less than Jrue's at that age (between 25 and 26 million)

You and I seem to be the only ones that aren't underrating DWhite tbh. I absolutely think he could be the 3rd best player on a championship team tbh and I think his upcoming extension is going to be a steal.

I wouldn't move him unless you're getting an absolute can't miss prospect at #2. I like Wiseman enough but he's not that. And I am not nearly high enough on the 2nd tier draft candidates where I'd be willing to move Derrick to see who falls to #6.

[Collins21]

Because I was the one on Twitter engaged with Jabari Young on LMA to Portland involving whiteside...

That didn't register to me but after going back and looking at it you're right i guess that was you. 2. You weren't the only one clamoring for that deal. 3. Burn the whole thing down if they do that deal.

[DPG21920]

That didn't register to me but after going back and looking at it you're right i guess that was you. 2. You weren't the only one clamoring for that deal. 3. Burn the whole thing down if they do that deal.

I mean I think it’s a very good deal. Get a good youngish prospect at position of need (Collins) + a 1st round pick and no big contract that goes beyond this next season?

Sure, getting #2 is great, but that comes with eating Wiggins crappy deal.

[TD 21]

The counting stats are irrelevant. NBA front offices aren't casual fans. They're not going to be swayed based off of something so cir stantial and largely irrelevant.

White doesn't have Holiday's pedigree and that's not changing whether he's putting up big counting stats on a bad team or not because on a good one he'd be a role player.

Besides, Holiday isn't worth what he went for in a vacuum. Like S bag, unique cir stances were required.

You and I seem to be the only ones that aren't underrating DWhite tbh. I absolutely think he could be the 3rd best player on a championship team tbh and I think his upcoming extension is going to be a steal.

I wouldn't move him unless you're getting an absolute can't miss prospect at #2. I like Wiseman enough but he's not that. And I am not nearly high enough on the 2nd tier draft candidates where I'd be willing to move Derrick to see who falls to #6.

I think he could be too, but that's not something this organization will have to worry about through the duration of prime and beyond.

That's the thing, all of the Spurs assets aren't getting them a can't miss prospect and even if they suck badly enough next season to warrant it, with the new lottery odds, that route might take a while too.

[Collins21]

I mean I think it’s a very good deal. Get a good youngish prospect at position of need (Collins) + a 1st round pick and no big contract that goes beyond this next season?

Sure, getting #2 is great, but that comes with eating Wiggins crappy deal.

Nah man i hate Whiteside I'd pay Wiggins for 10 years if that meant never seeing Whiteside in a Spurs uniform.

[objective]

I mean I think it’s a very good deal. Get a good youngish prospect at position of need (Collins) + a 1st round pick and no big contract that goes beyond this next season?

Sure, getting #2 is great, but that comes with eating Wiggins crappy deal.

Just reading the thread on twitter, don't think it's legal

Portland is giving up 2021 protected to get Covington. I couldn't find info on the protection, but if it rolls over year after year (as opposed to converting to two seconds if not conveyed like some traded picks do) ... then the Blazers might not be able to offer a future first until the Houston trade is completed

2023 at earliest, maybe even later

[objective]

The counting stats are irrelevant. NBA front offices aren't casual fans. They're not going to be swayed based off of something so cir stantial and largely irrelevant.

White doesn't have Holiday's pedigree and that's not changing whether he's putting up big counting stats on a bad team or not because on a good one he'd be a role player.

Besides, Holiday isn't worth what he went for in a vacuum. Like S bag, unique cir stances were required.

The front offices have plenty of their own stupid. No one wanted to offer anything good for Kawhi, which was a dumb way to turn down a rented le. Lakers weren't ever even offering Ingram if I remember Shelbourne's reports right, not that Ingram was any good.

White is well on his way to becoming the stock answer the pundits give on 'most underrated' or 'best non-all-star'.

I have no doubt. I guess we'll see.

[DPG21920]

Nah man i hate Whiteside I'd pay Wiggins for 10 years if that meant never seeing Whiteside in a Spurs uniform.

Well your irrational (or maybe rational) hate aside, it’s a good deal. Put it this way, if it were not Whiteside but some other random 18M expiring contract + Collins + a 1st would you like it?

[DPG21920]

Just reading the thread on twitter, don't think it's legal

Portland is giving up 2021 protected to get Covington. I couldn't find info on the protection, but if it rolls over year after year (as opposed to converting to two seconds if not conveyed like some traded picks do) ... then the Blazers might not be able to offer a future first until the Houston trade is completed

2023 at earliest, maybe even later

Yeah that part was unclear, but the framework is there.

[Collins21]

Well your irrational (or maybe rational) hate aside, it’s a good deal. Put it this way, if it were not Whiteside but some other random 18M expiring contract + Collins + a 1st would you like it?

Yeah

[TD 21]

The front offices have plenty of their own stupid. No one wanted to offer anything good for Kawhi, which was a dumb way to turn down a rented le. Lakers weren't ever even offering Ingram if I remember Shelbourne's reports right, not that Ingram was any good.

White is well on his way to becoming the stock answer the pundits give on 'most underrated' or 'best non-all-star'.

I have no doubt. I guess we'll see.

Sure, but not that kind.

Nah, the Spurs are so far off the radar that the only time they're mentioned is when one of the agenda driven media wants to take their latest shot. If he played for one of their pets, like the Raptors, maybe.