I'm somewhat concerned with Dejounte Murray (video)

[Dejounte]

illusion those are all good clips but if you're going to show the good from that game show the bad too because it's not like he played a great game...He was productive but he did struggle at the same time.

I'll compile ALL his possessions and add a ticker. Just say the word.

[rankingtear]

Even if he is, who was/is lining up for Bledsoe and Beverley? Smart and Bledsoe are clearly higher ceiling offensive players. The former is a good secondary play maker and decent shooter, while the latter is a good slasher and finisher.

If his offense takes another jump, it'll merely be in the vicinity of average. His shooting, though clearly improved, was small sample size and wide open. He's nowhere near being able to puncture defenses in p-n-r or space the floor.

He's a problem because he doesn't have value, which means stubbornly retaining him as opposed to giving up away. The money in a vacuum isn't a big deal, but he's a difficult piece to build around and because they jumped the gun on him, they might be less likely to extend White now (lack of durability doesn't help) or if they do, they'll have tied up significant money in a backcourt severely lacking in offensive dynamism.

Everybody would lineup for a 24 year old Bledsoe or Beverley. Smart has 1 season shooting above 40% FG find players not in their rookie contracts still employed by an NBA team with his FG% and Bledsoe turned into a below average 3pt shooter.

Why wouldn't he be able to puncture defense in the PNR? He already showed he can take guys to the rim 1 on 1 the last few games with his explosiveness back and the only big who rolls is Jakob. He reworked his jumper, it takes a lot of repe ion to be comfortable shooting a reworked shot.

Where is the evidence that he doesn't have value when 3 media outlets (ESPN,SI,Athletic) peg him as a top 100 player in the NBA, he had 2 all defensive votes last season even when our defense is a dumpster fire. Everyone in the NBA knows a down year after ACL surgery is common.

[J_Paco]

Everybody would lineup for a 24 year old Bledsoe or Beverley. Smart has 1 season shooting above 40% FG find players not in their rookie contracts still employed by an NBA team with his FG% and Bledsoe turned into a below average 3pt shooter.

Why wouldn't he be able to puncture defense in the PNR? He already showed he can take guys to the rim 1 on 1 the last few games with his explosiveness back and the only big who rolls is Jakob. He reworked his jumper, it takes a lot of repe ion to be comfortable shooting a reworked shot.

Where is the evidence that he doesn't have value when 3 media outlets (ESPN,SI,Athletic) peg him as a top 100 player in the NBA, he had 2 all defensive votes last season even when our defense is a dumpster fire. Everyone in the NBA knows a down year after ACL surgery is common.

Yet, he didn't have a down year. He improved in nearly every statistical category even with him coming back from a severe injury & a line up that doesn't fit his strengths/a misplaced role.

He has clearly become the new "whipping boy" of ST partly because of his contract & his inability to become an elite offensive prospect. They'll continue to until either he's gone, the team finds an actual high - end prospect (could be Keldon or Devin) or the Spurs adjust his role on offense.

Until then, the incessant ing, whining & crying about his pay & play will continue.

Note: I've already adjusted my expectations for DeJounte (a better scoring Aaron McKie or Nate McMillan), but also realized he has improved a ton since 3 or 4 years ago. He came out of college as an erratic shooting, inefficient combo guard without a true position.

Now, he's improved his PG skills & is far, far more efficient than in college (with a reworked jumper that the poster above me said) even with suffering a terrible knee injury (that robbed him of a year of development). Pop & the team need to rework his role now & have him play to his strengths of defense & transition offense.

[8FOR!3]

I'll compile ALL his possessions and add a ticker. Just say the word.

It'd be worth watching anyways

[XDT76]

Can we make clear that there is a player named Trey on the roster, and it isn't Tre Jones? It's not ing hard.

Maybe the idea is to make Trey Lyles our backup point guard?

[RVSTX]

100. Dejounte Murray, San Antonio Spurs
The Spurs are in the midst of pivoting to a new era, with DeMar DeRozan’s and LaMarcus Aldridge’s contracts set to expire after 2020–21. So who will lead San Antonio forward? Murray is likely the franchise headliner. He isn’t a prototypical point guard, but Murray’s athletic gifts are undeniable. He’s a superb on-ball defender, sporting a 6' 10" wingspan that makes life increasingly difficult for opposing guards. Murray’s ability to upsize onto larger guards provides significant value, as does his ability to wreak havoc in passing lanes. There’s a significant dose of uncertainty for San Antonio after two decades of sustained success. Murray’s defensive excellence should help stabilize the ship. His defensive value and transition prowess lands him the final spot on our Top 100, and he’ll need to improve his half-court offense to move much higher. Murray attempted fewer than two threes per game last season, and his reticence from beyond the arc isn’t an isolated statistic. He doesn’t quite explode to the rim in the half court, nor does he look to create his own shot. He’s often too content to probe and dish, limiting his scoring impact in a middling offense. Let’s hope Murray truly takes the reins of San Antonio’s offense after an underwhelming offensive campaign in 2019–20. —Michael Shapiro

[TD 21]

Everybody would lineup for a 24 year old Bledsoe or Beverley. Smart has 1 season shooting above 40% FG find players not in their rookie contracts still employed by an NBA team with his FG% and Bledsoe turned into a below average 3pt shooter.

Why wouldn't he be able to puncture defense in the PNR? He already showed he can take guys to the rim 1 on 1 the last few games with his explosiveness back and the only big who rolls is Jakob. He reworked his jumper, it takes a lot of repe ion to be comfortable shooting a reworked shot.

Where is the evidence that he doesn't have value when 3 media outlets (ESPN,SI,Athletic) peg him as a top 100 player in the NBA, he had 2 all defensive votes last season even when our defense is a dumpster fire. Everyone in the NBA knows a down year after ACL surgery is common.

They were/are better players. Smart is a league average/volume 3-point shooter in consecutive seasons.

Because he lacks the shooting to prevent them from going over and the speed to beat them to the other side and get in the paint despite it.

Those are not evidence he does. National media, for the most part, don't have intimate knowledge of non glamour teams. That's why so many still think he's the key young building block for the Spurs.

[rankingtear]

They were/are better players. Smart is a league average/volume 3-point shooter in consecutive seasons.

Because he lacks the shooting to prevent them from going over and the speed to beat them to the other side and get in the paint despite it.

Those are not evidence he does. National media, for the most part, don't have intimate knowledge of non glamour teams. That's why so many still think he's the key young building block for the Spurs.

Smart was below league average last year. 35% to 36%. Smart shot 30% from three his fourth year.

I don't think he lacks speed to get to the rim, he had it in spades the last few games.

Disregard the intel these panel of experts have and the tools they have access to like Synergy etc. Your'e suggesting a fan who mostly watches spurs game can rank a player relative to 450 other players more objectively than a panel of reporters who covers all teams?

[spurraider21]

did that guy really include a clip of murray leading a 5-2 fastbreak possession as proof of his ability to drive and kick?

[Dejounte]

did that guy really include a clip of murray leading a 5-2 fastbreak possession as proof of his ability to drive and kick?

With a defender on him. Congratulations, you picked one clip out of 9. Y'all are really pushing me to go through his entire possessions just to prove you wrong.

[TD 21]

Smart was below league average last year. 35% to 36%. Smart shot 30% from three his fourth year.

I don't think he lacks speed to get to the rim, he had it in spades the last few games.

Disregard the intel these panel of experts have and the tools they have access to like Synergy etc. Your'e suggesting a fan who mostly watches spurs game can rank a player relative to 450 other players more objectively than a panel of reporters who covers all teams?

League average is 35-36% annually. He was 36.4% and 34.7% the past two seasons.

He lacks speed, strength and handle, in terms of getting to and finishing at the rim.

"Experts"? They're consensus rankings from their NBA personalities. If you've read/listened to many of them, you'd know they're not the types to use Syngergy. Many rely on word of mouth with non glamour teams. Talking heads/writers are not akin to front office executives.

You don't know who I mostly watch and as a Spurs fan, your narrative would fit had I been overrating him.

[rankingtear]

League average is 35-36% annually. He was 36.4% and 34.7% the past two seasons.

He lacks speed, strength and handle, in terms of getting to and finishing at the rim.

"Experts"? They're consensus rankings from their NBA personalities. If you've read/listened to many of them, you'd know they're not the types to use Syngergy. Many rely on word of mouth with non glamour teams. Talking heads/writers are not akin to front office executives.

You don't know who I mostly watch and as a Spurs fan, your narrative would fit had I been overrating him.

I don't get why you think he lacks speed. Strength is improved and handle is still loose but his crossover gets by most defenders. Finishing would improve this year added strength/explosiveness and mentality regarding the ACL tear.

SI top 100 references Synergy playtypes.
https://www.si.com/nba/2020/12/14/to...21-daily-cover

[TD 21]

I don't get why you think he lacks speed. Strength is improved and handle is still loose but his crossover gets by most defenders. Finishing would improve this year added strength/explosiveness and mentality regarding the ACL tear.

SI top 100 references Synergy playtypes.
https://www.si.com/nba/2020/12/14/to...21-daily-cover

You've fast become one of the few people worth reading here and I respect your opinion, but you're not swaying me.

Sure, he's improved, but the bar was so low to begin with that it's still not nearly enough and the only path I see to his not being a difficult player to build with is by him embracing becoming a volume 3-point shooter.

They have the best list annually, but the fact that these lists almost always have Murray ahead of White (generally misses cut), tells you all you need to know about their knowledge of the Spurs.

[Slippy]

We seen enough of DJ to know what you going to get. Best suited coming of the bench. Glorified role player.

[tonight...you]

We seen enough of DJ to know what you going to get. Best suited coming of the bench. Glorified role player.

Is that better than a regular role player?

[TDMVPDPOY]

guy is a fkn scrub

his being overtaken by the younger players on the team

[TimDunkem]

Is that better than a regular role player?

Nah because he has the contract to go with it.

[tonight...you]

Nah because he has the contract to go with it.

Understood.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Any team have a young, black, and athletic big that could be had for the combo of Lonnie and Murray?

[gospursgojas]

Stopped reading here:

The problem is we have some guys who just aren’t natural scorers playing together, Dejounte Murray being the main one. Lonnie Walker looks to be really improving. But in an ideal world you need to have Murray next to 4 shooters at all times and DeRozan presents a problem there. I’d consider moving on from Murray before DeRozan, just my opinion. I really like Murray and I hope he figures it out, he just isn’t showing much. The purpose of this isn’t to trash Murray though, I think most if not all Spurs fans like and are rooting for the guy. And I don’t think we have to rush anything, he deserves a chance he’s only been healthy for one season following that major injury, but at some point we’ve got to think about moving on if he doesn’t show more right?

[talkspurs]

I wonder what people think DJ should be. from what I read on here they wan him shooting 5-7 3s a game which put him making roughly 1 and a half to 2 and a hlaf a game. lets call it 2 for easy math. you figure he is going to make 3-4 2 pts a game well figure 7 points. figure another 4 fts a game thats 17 pts. while I have never heard a ast number they only say better passing well go 6 ast. He avg 4 last year so lets give him 2 more a game which would be 6. His To would go up but get better from the 2-1 it currently is. He would still get his 6 reb and 2 steals.

So with the stats it would put him at 17 pts 2 3s 6 reb 6 ast 2 steals. While that is not allstar level it is not far outside of it either.
He is making about 16 mil a year if he hits his incentives. The rookie max extension is almost 40 mil a year. He is makeing less then half of what a max player would make.

[J_Paco]

I wonder what people think DJ should be. from what I read on here they wan him shooting 5-7 3s a game which put him making roughly 1 and a half to 2 and a hlaf a game. lets call it 2 for easy math. you figure he is going to make 3-4 2 pts a game well figure 7 points. figure another 4 fts a game thats 17 pts. while I have never heard a ast number they only say better passing well go 6 ast. He avg 4 last year so lets give him 2 more a game which would be 6. His To would go up but get better from the 2-1 it currently is. He would still get his 6 reb and 2 steals.

So with the stats it would put him at 17 pts 2 3s 6 reb 6 ast 2 steals. While that is not allstar level it is not far outside of it either.
He is making about 16 mil a year if he hits his incentives. The rookie max extension is almost 40 mil a year. He is makeing less then half of what a max player would make.

They love ing, moaning about someone in a Spurs jersey (ala Tony Parker, Matt Bonner, DeJuan Blair, Gary Neal, Bryn Forbes, etc) so Murray has taken that role as he's one of the better young players on the squad.

I like that analysis by SI & your standpoint on DeJounte, but their isn't any swaying the congregation about him. I do think he does need to become a volume three-point shooter, play off-ball more with Derrick playmaking/initiating & be more consistent on both side.

Yet, a lot of the problems are based on his alleged "overpriced" contract, lack of elite offensive upside - he's the 29th pick for Pete's sake, everyone can't become TP on offense - and playing role/position that doesn't truly suit his skillset or strengths.

[Slippy]

Is that better than a regular role player?

He can be a valuabe role player. Disruptive on defense and another dynamic energy guy on offense just not at PG.. he aint a natural and hast growen into one . Glorified among a few spurs fans tho who fail to see his limits.

[tonight...you]

He can be a valuabe role player. Disruptive on defense and another dynamic energy guy on offense just not at PG.. he aint a natural and hast growen into one . Glorified among a few spurs fans tho who fail to see his limits.

Copy.

[J_Paco]

He can be a valuabe role player. Disruptive on defense and another dynamic energy guy on offense just not at PG.. he aint a natural and hast growen into one . Glorified among a few spurs fans tho who fail to see his limits.

Or they (fans like myself) choice not to incessantly harp on his limits, realize he does possess some positive attributes & needs Pop to adjust his role for him to reach his maximum potential.

I'm personally not super high on any of our current prospects until someone really breaks away from the pack. DeJounte & Derrick are the best of the group, yet they both had uneven seasons last year and I'm hopeful that a change in roles/the lineup will help them take a bigger jump.