https://www.spurstalk.com/san-antoni...estion-answer/
I'd be interested to see who others believe is the best player on the Spurs. I think it's White but it's pretty close. Aldridge and DeRozan have a valid case, I think, maybe.
Good write-up, though I think this needs to be flipped:
"Murray is best as a one-on-one defender. White is best a help-defender."
Also, for sure his teammates likely see him as the best player. They always drop nothing but compliments for him in interviews.
White may be neck and neck with Aldridge as the best player on the team, but he's by far the most important. This team is moribund without White directing things.
It's definitely White tbh.
DeMar and it's not that close. LMA is like Gasol on his last legs shooting 3s out there now it seems. White is a good role player but DeMar is still an all star guard.
Good write up, almost all teams employ multiple ballhandlers in the starting lineup gone are the days of volume scorers like LA, Derozan. Two to three playmaking guards/wings who do different things are the norm these days unless you have a jumbo creator high usage players like Lebron or Luka.
I think White becoming a pull up monster like Jamal Murray and Dejounte becoming unstoppable downhill like Westbrook is an offense that is hard to gameplan against. White already has shown flashes he can get there. Dejounte has still room to add muscle to his frame.
White needs a downhill guard beside him as much as he needs a rim rolling/DHO big man.
I think our best configuration moving forward is a 3 guard lineup because of the size of our guards. White and Dejounte being 6'4 ballhandlers is our strength right now.
I still think Demar is our best player followed by White. They won't be catering to LA strength any more.
1. Derozz
2. White
3. Keldon
4. Vassell
5. LMA
6. Poodle
7. Murray
8. Mills
9. Rudy
10. Walker
1- Demar ...
White is the best player on the team. Give him 20 shots per game and he will average 25 PPG. It‘s all about him being aggressive
Remember the i quit here i come Cancun ending Game 7 vs Denver?
Leading the Spurs to defeat after Nephew had them up 22 vs got State?
Spurfan thinking this is the best player.
DDR is the best player on the Spurs with LMA 2nd. White currently a distant third, but he has shown he can develop into more than that with his bubble play.
The Spurs problem isn't the quality of their players in a vacuum, or even their overall talent, it's that the coaching staff haven't been able to find the right balance. A couple of players stepping up ( White, Johnson, Vassell, even Murray ) could really change the course. Otherwise they're headed into the lottery again. There's no need to go into a full tanking mode though. They can see what they have until the trade deadline and depending on their position choose how to proceed. There are a lot of teams that will fight to get in the play-in , both in the east and west, so it's unlikely they'd need to have a terrible record in order to end up with a decent % once the lottery balls come into play. They could easily end up with a 30-42 record and be 13th or 14th in the west.
I'd still go with Aldridge, then DeRozan, then White, then Gay.
Aldridge is struggling right now, and if that's real decline, then he obviously drops down. But if it's rust (dude hasn't played in like nine months) and an attempt to fit the scheme, then he'll come around and show he's clearly the best player soon enough. I don't like trying to measure "bestness" as simply who is best on offense and defense. That's how to you three-and-D players shooting up value boards like Robert Covington. I think it's more about whether you can build around a guy on both or either end. I don't see White as that guy. I think he's a good third option on offense who'll also be one of a team's best defenders. But he'll need better players than him for it to really work.
I think the Spurs would be making a mistake by marginalizing Aldridge to pursue the bubble style of play. If he's shot and can only really score by shooting threes, then whatever. But if he's good, the team should be running their offense through him and have him step out once he's in rhythm versus having him be outside while the guards "attack". Good, quick hits into the post are still a good way to get points. It's the long iso possessions that have to be limited. The first option of the motion-weak offense (the main set of the "beautiful game") is a post-up. I think the Spurs have done a poor job of innovating on offense since basically the Aldridge era began. Pop ran some wrinkles that first year when Tim was there and fewer in Gasol's first year, but after that, he basically gave up.
I'm getting a bit off track. I like White, a lot. I think he can be the best player on the team this seaon, but if he is, it's likely a really bad thing. If the Spurs are serious about taking a swing at it this year, they should get Murray and Gay out of the SL and try to find a shooting four to put in there instead. I honestly think if they can find one in a DeRozan trade, that might work out really well. They need to establish a clear hierarchy of Aldridge inside, DeRozan/White driving and everybody shooting when they're open and in position. Put actual structure back into the offense so guys can find their roles. Run sets that take advantage of people's strengths (like why isn't DeRozan running the zipper series at all?). Focus on building young player's confidence. You know, coach a bit.
They tried this already. The personnel's overall low IQ can't make this work. Most of the team are enjoying the freedom they finally have. I don't know why you would reinforce such a thing when it's clear every player on the team is happier to play more loose. Running plays for Aldridge who can't score over small guys inside and can't even outrebound them either (as he's constantly being outhustled) is counter productive. Move on from Aldridge. I would say him being ineffective started mid-season of last year. Just like the Warriors have been figured out, the league has figured out how to beat slow, pace-killing bigs like Aldridge.
Old-school thinking has to move forward now.
Rankingtear said it best.
It's not like we're trying to beat the best at what they do best.
We've added a twist of running a hydra line-up, with multiple playmakers with diversified skillsets in at least three positions. The opposing defense will never know what's coming.
It's a unique style that not many in the league are doing. We may not be there all the way yet; some players are still developing and we will need another player or two.
Hydra offense, the way I define it, is when you have 3+ players on the court who handles/ dribbles (and attacks the basket, does an ISO to score, or kicks it out) the ball on occasion for more than 3-5 seconds.
I could be wrong, but these are the teams I believe who employ the hydra offense I speak of above:
(Thinking of starters only)
GSW, but only when they had Durant. Klay only takes one or two dribbles on offense. Their playmakers were: Curry, Durant, Draymond
Current BKN: Dinwiddie, Irving, Durant
Clippers: Leonard, George, Beverley. Playmaking/ offensive output from their point is weak.
Wizards: Beal, Deni, Westbrook
Bucks: Giannis, Middleton, Jrue
Last edited by Dejounte; 12-23-2020 at 10:40 AM.
Easily the best player
Didn't we go 1 - 9 or something like that on the last RRT we had without him
Most of that hasn't "been tried". Inherently starting Murray all last year was actively not trying to put guys in places to succeed. Offensively challenged players "finally feeling free" to suck it up isn't "trying it" either. Most good offenses actually have a lot of structure. Look at what GS and MIA do for examples. It's not old-school thinking that you build a system that works with your best players. Throwing up your hands and going, "I have to get rid of LMA and DMDR because they don't fit" isn't doing anything, especially when you don't follow that up by getting rid of them.
I also don't think it makes sense to blame IQ for this. DeRozan ran a decent offense in Toronto. Aldridge has been part of good offenses as well. Guys like White, Mills and Gay should fit fine. I think a lot, lot of folks don't know the first thing about how the "beautiful game" offense worked. They think it was all this passing and movement without considering that all of that was predicated on an offense that has a bunch of built-in options and contingencies. Guys were able to make all those passes because they could trust that the receiver would know where to be. It's not like that's in this offense and guys aren't using it. It's not there at all.
I would agree that Leonard, Aldridge, Gay, DeRozan and now Murray could be resistant to having to "think" and pass in situations where they think they can score. That could be an ego problem. But it's then up to the coach to tweak the system and sooth the personalities to make it work. He shouldn't abandon structure and put together bad lineups and basically throw his hands up on development. Pop's one of the most powerful people in the NBA. He doesn't have to take from his rookie guards.
I think people need to let go of the bubble. There are certainly some good things to take from it. But it's not a good model for team over a whole season. From playing small to relying on guys like Johnson and White shooting unsustainably well from three to the slew of teams who didn't really care about winning games. You don't abandon your best player(s) because you had a good seven-game stretch.
Pffft, it's well known that the Beautiful Game ran just on luck and good players magically fitting together! Lucky passes, and the ones that weren't lucky, were magically performed by the high IQ of the players physically moving the ball to where it had to go. This is common knowledge, Chino, you're slippin'.....
This team is almost the same as last year and we‘re talking about running the right sets. These players should know how to play together by now but they don’t and that is a coaching problem
Outstanding write up. Thanks for your insight.
Obviously the concept of "best player" is subjective at it's core, but those hyping DDR are the ones who believe "best player" means "best scorer". This is affirmed by the league dubbing the le "all-star" on the top league scorers and letting them play a 300 point scrimmage.
I personally agree with you that DW is the best player because he does everything well and he holds the team together. All you really have to do to prove your case is point to the preseason and the argument ends.
On the back and forth of Murray being in the SL I don't think its a problem if he starts as long as he's moved to the 2 guard and White is the pg. They fit pretty good together if Murray accepts his proper role.
"It's not old-school thinking that you build a system that works with your best players. Throwing up your hands and going, "I have to get rid of LMA and DMDR because they don't fit" isn't doing anything, especially when you don't follow that up by getting rid of them."
I think the problem with this line of thinking is you're assuming LMA and DMDR will be the team's best players past this season. We're clearly in transition from that. They may be the team's best players, but it's obvious the team is preparing for a transition.
Chinook
If by the end of this season there's a legit discussion on the topic of who's the best between White, Vassell, and KJ, then the Spurs will truly have something.
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