Reply With Quote
Then look at TPA. WS/48. VORP. All the advanced metrics will show you that DJ is a top 10 PG.
PER is pretty obsolete as a measure of true impact, tbh.DJM is #7 behind Trae, Curry, Morant, Doncic, LaMelo, CP3
http://insider.espn.com/nba/hollinge.../_/position/pg
Then look at TPA. WS/48. VORP. All the advanced metrics will show you that DJ is a top 10 PG.
the last 4 are definitely not better than DJ this season, while Kyrie hasn’t played a game yet. Stop lying to yourself. Everybody knows DJ is a top 10 PG
Nope I’ve literally said the same thing about DJ. Like a lot. I’m actually known as a DJ hater bc I think we should trade him while his value is high. If DJ is your best player then you are a lottery team. There are so many things about DJs game that I don’t like. However, he has shown to put in the work and now has a serviceable 3 ball and has upped his attempts to a career high. Jak still can’t make a 6 footer.
If we still had Tim, Tony, and Manu then I would love Jak. I prefer Jak to almost every other starting center we’ve had since Dave retired in 03 (he’s second imo behind Tiago). But we have none of those players. We have a bunch of wagons that need to be pulled and zero horses to do so. Jak might be a decent wagon but he’s a wagon nonetheless. And at this moment DJ is a pony who could maybe transform into a horse. He needs to change his game a lot if we want to actually contend but that’s another discussion
We might make the playoffs this year. But it’s mainly due to injury. AD is out. Luka has been hurt. Nuggets lost like 5 players. Paul George and Kawhi are out. Klay is still out. Its a long list of injuries. But it’s not bc we are a good team.
We are a lottery team bc of him. He’s not good enough to actually have real standards from you. He can’t give you 20/10 a night. If he could we would be a contender. But he isn’t good so you lowered your standards for him and say it’s not his fault we aren’t in the playoffs.
Also Steph Curry is probably the MVP this year. I think, and I might have to check, he would be considered an All NBA player. Which is what I said you need to have if you want to have Jak as your starting Center. Also Poeltl might be a top 10 center, I have him ranked 9th but he isn’t a top 10 big man in the game so that doesn’t really matter. Poeltl is the definition of a loser btw. His team traded him and then immediately won a championship. Meanwhile Poeltl hasn’t played in one playoff game as our starter.
Also what is your argument bc on reading your reply a second time you agreed with me. Poeltl just needs better talent around him. That’s literally what I said. He needs all nba talent around him to succeed. And then for some reason you jumped on me even though you said the exact same ing thing.
Yes DJ is a top 10 point guard. Steph, Paul, Ball, Lillard, Young, Ja, and then Murray. He’s 7th pretty easily. You can’t say Kyrie when he hasn’t played a game. Dude is probably gonna be hurt anyways. I guess Harden too but I’d rather have Murray this year than James who looked like he just doesn’t give a anymore.
For real man. I am amazed at the hate that Jak gets from some people here. He's so ing underrated. People are gonna be shocked when his contract is up and he commands a lot more than he does now.How come these type of comment haven't died yet? Imagine still not realizing Jak is a top 10 center in the NBA.
Uh, there are 2 centers in the NBA that give you 20 and 10 a night right now. That shouldn't be the mark for what a top 10 center is.We are a lottery team bc of him. He’s not good enough to actually have real standards from you. He can’t give you 20/10 a night. If he could we would be a contender. But he isn’t good so you lowered your standards for him and say it’s not his fault we aren’t in the playoffs.
Also Steph Curry is probably the MVP this year. I think, and I might have to check, he would be considered an All NBA player. Which is what I said you need to have if you want to have Jak as your starting Center. Also Poeltl might be a top 10 center, I have him ranked 9th but he isn’t a top 10 big man in the game so that doesn’t really matter. Poeltl is the definition of a loser btw. His team traded him and then immediately won a championship. Meanwhile Poeltl hasn’t played in one playoff game as our starter.
Also what is your argument bc on reading your reply a second time you agreed with me. Poeltl just needs better talent around him. That’s literally what I said. He needs all nba talent around him to succeed. And then for some reason you jumped on me even though you said the exact same ing thing.
I don't think Poetl is the difference between a playoff team and non play off team and I certainly don't think he needs to be surrounded by all NBA talent. The Spurs can make the playoffs this year and are unlikely to have any all NBA talent.
Is Poeltl going to put a team on his back and carry them to the playoffs? No. But so what? There are 2 centers in the NBA who could do that. I don't even think someone like Bam could do that.
PER was mentioned earlier, so I thought I’d post this.
Current PER of Nikola Jokic: 32.7
Current PER of Jock Landale: 33.9
For your entertainment. It’s the most trivial of trivia, of course.
There’s no real conclusion to be drawn. Except, it could be taken to reflect that Jock has been a solid + player in the time he’s gotten so far.
I would put him over dame. He is better in every stat except ft% and scoring. using yahoo season avg they have him at 8th. Curry james ball harden VanVleet young mitc . Some of those I would say are not PG but they have the classification on yahoo.
I don’t hold these expectations for Poeltl at all. My overall point was you absolutely can blame Poeltl for us not being on the playoffs atm simply bc he ISNT good enough to carry us. You can blame anybody for this too not just Poeltl. Everyone is to blame for not being good enough. Also the Center position is very weak and saying he’s a top 10 center doesn’t really mean anything. There’s probably 2 centers that are game changers and the rest are all B players at best.
We might make the playoffs but that’s more likely due to injury than anything else. Clips lost Paul and Kawhi. Luka is hurt for the Mavs. Ja can get hurt with his style of play. Denver has 5 missing players. To me it’s a 3 way race between Portland, Minny, and us for that 8th seed. But that also requires luck with our own injuries. We can’t afford to lose anybody except Bryn
I would say that Poeltl could be the most important Spurs player just based on the loses when he’s out (albeit Landale could’ve helped a lot). Plus Poeltl scoring aggressive really makes the Spurs a different beast. I’m not good with advanced metrics but when Poeltl plays great, the Spurs more likely win and vice versa. Now DJM (the head of snake) was out last night and the Spurs had a record high win. I’m not saying DJM is dispensable, but you can discern from there.
I think the problem with Poeltl being out isn’t that he was out. It’s who was replacing him. Ewwbanks is an F player and Young isn’t a Center at all. If Poeltl misses time now and Jock replaces him instead then I think we don’t look that bad. When DJ misses games, we still have guys who can run the point adequately in White and Tre.
I’m not arguing against him being over Dame. Dame is having a let down season but Dame has always been overrated a bit. The dude has underperformed in Portland the last few years and everyone says it’s everyone else. Portland is a mess right now though since they’re missing CJ (another injury that helps the Spurs make the playoffs) but they haven’t been world beaters for a few years. Dame, imo, has been more all about Dame and not about the team.
Somebody has gotten into these players heads that the only way to help your team is to shoot a lot and score. That’s not true at all though. Play smart defense and setting up an offense for other people besides yourself goes a long way with point guards. You look at a guy like Gary Payton. You think Gary couldn’t have averaged 25 points a game. Of course he could, but he put up 18 a game, played hard defense and ran an offense for other people. That’s the style I feel like more guys should play like. Not this I’m going to jack up 35 footers without passing the ball once.
This is the part where you out yourself as a hater.
Just flat out ridiculous to blame Poeltl for Toronto winning a ship and the Spurs not making the playoffs, when he was an afterthought in a trade that gave the Raptors the FMVP player they needed to get over the hump after a series of playoff blunders, whilst taking said FMVP player away from a Spurs team built entirely around him and pushing them to a rebuild. Such a ridiculous "oversight" and history rewriting, just to label Jakob a "loser" somehow...
I'd say you can't be serious, but you totally are. Lol.
Sorry for not making myself clear. I’m not blaming Poeltl. He was a loser scrub that played 12 minutes a game. Toronto smartly packaged him for an actual winner. Kawhi is a winner. 2 chips, multiple all nba, 2 finals mvps. 2 dpoy awards and multiple all star selections. That’s the resume of a winner in the nba.
The reason why Poeltl is a loser is bc that’s all he’s done in his career. No all star, no all nba defense, never averaged double digit in anything. Can’t shoot a 6 footer. Never been a starter on a good team, and never had impact on a winning culture. He has zero basketball resume. I am a Poeltl hater bc I feel like he is a metaphor of the current San Antonio Spurs. No real expectations, no winning culture, and lowered expectations that bring about unwarranted praise.
The Spurs are a C TEAM and Poeltl is a C player. You see Poeltl and you think he’s pretty good. Sure he has zero offensive game, he can’t hit a free throw and he clogs the paint with his defender cheating off of him. BUT he sets amazing screens that free up shooters. He moves well on defense. He does a lot of grunt work. Hes a good player! But when that is considered a very good player (by a lot of posters here) that just shows (to me) how far our standards have fallen. But yes I do hate Poeltl as a starter
Plenty of imperfections.
However generally speaking the high PER players are good. FWIW, generally.
Ya nothing to completely base a players value on.
Bruce Bowen was sub 10 PER.
I'm not lying to myself, I literally just said I can't tell for sure if Murray is indeed a top 10 PG or not. I would love to think we have a top 10 PG in the league.
No son, YOU have to explain what the is your argument, because a guy needing more talent around him doesn't mean that guy is a loser.We are a lottery team bc of him. He’s not good enough to actually have real standards from you. He can’t give you 20/10 a night. If he could we would be a contender. But he isn’t good so you lowered your standards for him and say it’s not his fault we aren’t in the playoffs.
Also Steph Curry is probably the MVP this year. I think, and I might have to check, he would be considered an All NBA player. Which is what I said you need to have if you want to have Jak as your starting Center. Also Poeltl might be a top 10 center, I have him ranked 9th but he isn’t a top 10 big man in the game so that doesn’t really matter. Poeltl is the definition of a loser btw. His team traded him and then immediately won a championship. Meanwhile Poeltl hasn’t played in one playoff game as our starter.
Also what is your argument bc on reading your reply a second time you agreed with me. Poeltl just needs better talent around him. That’s literally what I said. He needs all nba talent around him to succeed. And then for some reason you jumped on me even though you said the exact same ing thing.
I seriously fail to see where are you even trying to get with this. You seem to be talking about Poeltl as if he was some kind of franchise player that needs to take us to the promise land. He's a center making 9 millions per year, he's doing more for the team than he's being paid for.
"We are a lottery team because of him" you say, yet you also say that Poeltl is a top 10 center in the NBA. How the can a top 10 player be the reason a team sucks?
Seriously son, rethink what you are saying because you are making no goddamn sense.
So, let me get this straight. Poeltl is a loser because he got to start with a bunch of sop res, but a guy like, let's say Kendrick Perkins, is a winner because he got to play with several hall of famers and MVPs throughtout his career, despite the latter being immensely less talented than the former? What a sad, sad logic.
poeltl has been underwhelming. haven't looked at any numbers and don't care to but he's a 2nd stringer at best tbh.
he's only a starter for a contender / almost contender if he was playing with duncan.
I agree. If he was on a Duncan type team he'd be serviceable, but if he's your second best player, you're not going anywhere IMO.
​​[QUOTE=DAF86;10659284]He's a center making 9 millions per year, he's doing more for the team than he's being paid for.
[/QUOTE]
This is the problem I see with a lot of the posters here. Just because Poodle is getting paid less doesn’t mean he should only play so much. And anything more is already beyond his salary? F%ck that argument
Thats kinda how it works doesn’t it? Kawhi wouldn’t have won basically anywhere else. But he went to the best franchise in sports and won a championship. You think the Pistons would’ve developed him the same way we did? The Twolves? Where you land plays a huge part of you’re a winner or loser. Mac Jones is gonna be in the playoffs as a rookie while Trevor Lawrence isn’t going to even sniff the playoffs for a while (if ever at all). So to act like you’re surprised that where you land determines your career is weird.
And is Perkins less talented? In what way? Everything people praise about Jaks game is exactly what Perk did for the Thunder. If anything, you are showing bias against Perk bc you are a Spurs fan and not a Thunder/Celtic fan. To this day, Celtic fans claim they would’ve won the 2010 championship if Perk didn’t get hurt. Perk =Jak so why do you say he is immensely less talented?
You said that Jak deserves NO blame for us not being in the playoffs. You said he is a top 10 center and we have bigger things to worry about. You also said he needs more talent around him for his team to succeed.
Im saying Jak DESERVES to blamed for us not being a playoff team. He isn’t good enough to make us one. That in itself deserves blame. Everyone on the team deserves blame for us sucking, just in varying degrees. I also said the exact same thing that if you are going to be successful with Jak as your starter then you need better talent around him. I think Jak is a problem on the team bc he kinda makes us complacent as fans. He’s good enough to where you can see the positives in his game, but there will always be a low ceiling to our teams if he is our starter. He is just that bad on offense. It’s not even the ppg but just that his defender clogs the lane all the time. Jak has yo physically move his man out of the way every time somebody drives bc of this fact. But he can’t do that every play bc that’s exhausting. If he had literally a 8 foot Oberto jump shot he would be so much better on offense. Instead he refuses to work on his shot
I discerned that Detroit has 60% of their roster out plus are tanking.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
