2023 NBA Free Agency Thread - June 30 @ 5 pm CDT

[Jordan Jackson]

But they have.

Several times.

You saw it.

I saw Tim Duncan realized it and try to leave. ( btw Orlando really fumbled that at the 1 yard line woof).

Spurs are very lucky Duncan is such a solid dude bailing out ownership by taking pay cuts.

We’ll see how this Wemby era plays out. But they are going to have to make a significant financial commitment down the road to win.

[Mr. Body]

But did they make an pitch for SOMEONE and FAILED, or they NEVER EVEN TRIED? We know what Brian Wright said about taking time to see where they're at, but this bit of information might help set expectations on what's to follow. It'd be interesting to dig a bit on this if you can, timvp

Probably never know. My sense just by watching and listening to what they have said, they didn't want long-term contracts - and my feeling is that means even more than this next season. And the team is literally jammed with players. I don't think they wanted to bring players into the development schemes thay have in place already.

Given the lack of long-term money they were willing to give out, I doubt many players were interested. But most teams know exactly what they need and are in places where they have to overpay and overpromise. The Spurs don't.

I still don't see any players we really missed on other than a Plumlee, and it feels like they may have made a move for him and he simply declined. My guess for one reason is because the team will not promise him anything. Mason Plumlee has literally no future on this team. He's 33 and is close to done with his career and certainly how good he can get. The bigs on the Spurs -- we have no idea how good they can be yet.

[Ariel]

Another possibility is that they're not sure what they need right now (Bassey, Barlow, Wesley might make a big jump or may suck), and they think they can get a stop gap of the caliber that's available right now in free agency , later on via trade (20 2nds should be enough for 6 of those).

[JPB]

this is the "you participate in society" meme in sports fanhood form

congratulations

guys, if you're here on spurstalk, make sure you effusively praise everything the team does. unless you are willing to abandon your fanhood, please refrain from having any criticism over what is happening. thank you.

It's not because you're not critisizing what spurs are doing that you're an FO fanboi. No need to caricature, spurs know what they're doing, that's their job and they have a plan, like it or not. Is that a good plan? I believe it is and there's no move worth doing so far...

So why should I lament pages after pages because they didn't overpay Reaves who was always staying in LA anyway, or trade for a Lillard who does'nt fit the timeline and compromise their plans, just because his agent threw the spurs out there to "class up" his player while Dame also never wanted to come here (and I understand he doesn't have the final word), or sign Lopez who was always staying in Milwaukee... Or whoever just for the sake of saying they did anything...?

Critisizing for critisizing doesn't make one smarter... I know these guys know what they're doing. They have cap, a boatload of picks and a generational player. Being smart is not wasting any of that and making sure you only make the right moves to make the best of your hand and clean the table at the river... You disagree? Fine, but that doesn't make you smarter or cooler.

[ChumpDumper]

I saw Tim Duncan realized it and try to leave. ( btw Orlando really fumbled that at the 1 yard line woof).

Spurs are very lucky Duncan is such a solid dude bailing out ownership by taking pay cuts.

We’ll see how this Wemby era plays out. But they are going to have to make a significant financial commitment down the road to win.

And they will, just like they did before. If they stay at the floor this season, that's a part of the plan.

[scott]

Like I've said in other threads, the Spurs did so well in setting themselves up for this that there are many paths to team building they can take from here that are viable. The wait and see approach they are choosing is a perfect valid one, no matter how much it frustrates fans.

What I'll have my eye on is what Devin's extension comes in at. If it's 4/120, then it will be interesting because you (theoretically) could get Herro on the same deal and personally I think Hero is a better player. If the Spurs go ahead and extend Devin for 4/120, then it means one or more of the following is true:

• The Spurs rate Devin above Herro (which I don't agree with, but they are the professionals at this - I am not)
• Herro wasn't really attainable, or requiring giving up assets that are worth more than the gap between Herro and Devin
• The Spurs value loyalty more than the gap between Herro and Devin

All of the above are okay - but it's a piece of info that will be good to know. Like I said, I'd prefer Herro to Vassell at 4/120... but if Devin is at 4/100 then it's a harder call.

Like ChumpDumper and I have stated, it seems like the floor is the cap for this year, and that's okay too so long as it is a short term scenario. Eventually this FO is going to have to pony up and push the chips in. I give them the benefit of the doubt that they will... but hopefully the fan base and media will keep the pressure on them to do so (narrator: they won't).

[Bruno]

But did they make an pitch for SOMEONE and FAILED, or they NEVER EVEN TRIED? We know what Brian Wright said about taking time to see where they're at, but this bit of information might help set expectations on what's to follow.

There are something like 100 good players that were free agents. If Spurs were truly looking to add one or two vets through free agency, they could have done it. That's why I say it was a choice.

[Ariel]

There are something like 100 good players that were free agents. If Spurs were truly looking to add one or two vets through free agency, they could have done it. That's why I say it was a choice.

Yeah, I get that, but that only applies if you want to fill a spot at any cost, which was always unlikely to be the case. But maybe they targeted 2 of those 100 and failed, or couldn't reach an agreement, or whatever. The Spurs aren't the type to go after ANY player at position X, they have their targets and may prefer to stand pat if their target of choice can't be had. Those 2 are not 1 and the same.

[EricB]

Refusing Tyler Herro would be beyond insulting.

kid is 23 and a damn good player.

[PrimeMinister]

seeing a lot of the jingling keys type of spurs fans bringing up timmy's near walk year to orlando...but when wemby's contract year comes do you think his decision will be determined by the 3 years he could have spent with damian lillard to start his career, or the potential trajectory of the franchise at that point in time?

gonna go with the FO on this one.

[Bruno]

Yeah, I get that, but that only applies if you want to fill a spot at any cost, which was always unlikely to be the case. But maybe they targeted 2 of those 100 and failed, or couldn't reach an agreement, or whatever. The Spurs aren't the type to go after ANY player at position X, they have their targets and may prefer to stand pat if their target of choice can't be had. Those 2 are not 1 and the same.

Maybe you're right, I can't be 100% sure.

Now let's say they wanted to add a center, there were: Plumlee, Landale, Thomas Bryant, Eubanks, Zeller, Metu, Mo Bamba, Robin Lopez...

My assumption, is, that if they had contacted most of these players, they would have end up with one.

[Dejounte]

It's not because you're not critisizing what spurs are doing that you're an FO fanboi. No need to caricature, spurs know what they're doing, that's their job and they have a plan, like it or not. Is that a good plan? I believe it is and there's no move worth doing so far...

So why should I lament pages after pages because they didn't overpay Reaves who was always staying in LA anyway, or trade for a Lillard who does'nt fit the timeline and compromise their plans, just because his agent threw the spurs out there to "class up" his player while Dame also never wanted to come here (and I understand he doesn't have the final word), or sign Lopez who was always staying in Milwaukee... Or whoever just for the sake of saying they did anything...?

Critisizing for critisizing doesn't make one smarter... I know these guys know what they're doing. They have cap, a boatload of picks and a generational player. Being smart is not wasting any of that and making sure you only make the right moves to make the best of your hand and clean the table at the river... You disagree? Fine, but that doesn't make you smarter or cooler.

Worse yet, they’re now resorting to name calling tactics like calling people sniffers. People graduated high school but they never left it. Sad, really.

[spurraider21]

seeing a lot of the jingling keys type of spurs fans bringing up timmy's near walk year to orlando...but when wemby's contract year comes do you think his decision will be determined by the 3 years he could have spent with damian lillard to start his career, or the potential trajectory of the franchise at that point in time?

gonna go with the FO on this one.

not just the orlando year. but then his complete commitment to the team while taking below-market pay for the rest of his career. im not expecting wemby to go full kawhi on us, but cant just take for granted he'll be another timmy

the last time timmy made the all-nba first team he was making less than 10 mil per year.

[Ariel]

Maybe you're right, I can't be 100% sure.

Now let's say they wanted to add a center, there were: Plumlee, Landale, Thomas Bryant, Eubanks, Zeller, Metu, Mo Bamba, Robin Lopez...

My assumption, is, that if they had contacted most of these players, they would have end up with one.

The conclusion that we can both agree is that they weren't DESPERATE to find one, that's for sure (I'd have taken Plumlee or Landale for sure if possible). I guess we'll find out eventually about the rest.

[scott]

And they will, just like they did before. If they stay at the floor this season, that's a part of the plan.

This is the thing I'd like to dig in on. Is there a place that shows historical Spurs payrolls relative to the cap? We know they'd done enough to hang 5 banner from the rafters, which is rad. But how much of that relied on stars taking hometown deals versus the FO stepping up and writing checks?

In the future, they are going to have to open that checkbook. Right now I give them the benefit of the doubt that they will... but what evidence do we really have that they will? The capital partners they have brought on would point to spending in the future... but I just hope that they FO doesn't get cheap in the future because they've got their Wemby meal ticket.

I think these are fair questions/doubts to have. This FO has proven to do a GREAT job at selling and ac ulating assets to build... but we haven't seen them do any buying yet. I can buy into the case that it isn't time yet... but time will eventually come.

[PrimeMinister]

not just the orlando year. but then his complete commitment to the team while taking below-market pay for the rest of his career. im not expecting wemby to go full kawhi on us, but cant just take for granted he'll be another timmy

you can't take anything about this situation for granted. that's why ensuring you can sustain success into the years that he actually has the choice to leave is very important.

[scott]

seeing a lot of the jingling keys type of spurs fans bringing up timmy's near walk year to orlando...but when wemby's contract year comes do you think his decision will be determined by the 3 years he could have spent with damian lillard to start his career, or the potential trajectory of the franchise at that point in time?

gonna go with the FO on this one.

Good point here. Come year 6 in Wemby's career, when he will truly be approaching the crossroads, his feelings towards this franchise will be based on what has happened the previous 2-3 years. Hopefully the Spurs will have kicked into gear by then. If in Year 6 we are still talking about our cap space and all the assets we have saved up, we'll have really screwed the pooch.

[exstatic]

I saw Tim Duncan realized it and try to leave. ( btw Orlando really fumbled that at the 1 yard line woof).

Spurs are very lucky Duncan is such a solid dude bailing out ownership by taking pay cuts.

We’ll see how this Wemby era plays out. But they are going to have to make a significant financial commitment down the road to win.

Tim Duncan didn’t take a pay cut until 2010, after he’d been in the league 13 years. The Spurs cheerfully paid him every dollar the could for those 13 years.

[ChumpDumper]

This is the thing I'd like to dig in on. Is there a place that shows historical Spurs payrolls relative to the cap? We know they'd done enough to hang 5 banner from the rafters, which is rad. But how much of that relied on stars taking hometown deals versus the FO stepping up and writing checks?

For most of the compe ive Duncan years, I remember the Spurs hanging around the tax threshold but rarely going over. I do think there were years that the cap/tax issues did affect personnel decisions (Scola thread!), but most of the time they were spending as much as small-time owners in a small market could be expected to spend.

[Mugen]

spurs do absolutely nothing in the offseason

sniffers:

[jesterbobman]

I was curious and wasn't sure of my memories of us being a marginal tax team were accurate, so googled. This is best place I could find for comparisons of teams over time on total salaries (there'll be better ones, but good enough).

https://hoopshype.com/salaries/

The Spurs have never been the biggest spenders, but there have been years (2016/17 they were 4th in the league) where they paid big money, and were consistently around 10th (sometimes higher, sometimes lower) based on when extensions kicked in (e.g, Parker got money after 2005).

I don't think there's any doubt that they were on the cheap side for a le contending team.

[scott]

To Summarize my thoughts on this whole scenario, which again starts with the basic premise that our FO has done such a GREAT job in getting us to this point that we have lots of viable options to argue over:

1. Going after Dame is a great move *IF* you believe that Wemby will be a Duncan-level rookie (All NBA 1st Team, 5th in MVP voting AS A ROOKIE)
2. Going after someone like Herro or Reaves is a great move *IF* you believe they are better than the players you already have (I think Herro would be our best player immediately after Wemby. I put Reaves equal to Vassell personally, though my personal opinions don't really matter)
3. Standing pat and seeing what we have is a great move *IF* you think you have some real potential on the roster in Devin/KJ/Sochan/Bran *AND* you are committed to pushing in the chips at some point down the road.

Right now I think there is some justifiable skepticism that this FO is committed to pushing in the chips down the road. This is Sam Presti Syndrome. You collect assets forever and never actually make a move to go all-in. Maybe OKC is finally turning that corner now, though I'm not sure. I'm willing to give this FO the benefit of the doubt... but I have a little bit of skepticism in the back of mind.

We're on track #3. That is perfectly fine. Go Spurs Go.

[RC_Drunkford]

do people realize the Spurs only want to make the salary floor to get the luxury tax payout? Otherwise they wouldn't even care, like last season. Holt's hustling the NBA

[intlspurshk]

So the Spurs behavior in FA market shows that the path to get the second star player is through draft unless some existing star is available through trade like DL in the coming years (highly unlikely). It is still a strategy and probably makes sense when the NBA will still be ruled by Nuggets and the Joker for the next few years.

[objective]

Holt kids are working that inherited wealth like geniuses.

Keep payroll low while Wemby is cheap and pocket all the money

Sell out to a Vegas or Seattle group and get them billions before you have to pay Wemby a 5 year 350 million dollar deal