One tibit I was thinking of is the spurs have done two deals with Miami this year, they dumped Dedmon on us and the sign & trade they did with the Cavs. I get a sense teams like to work with certain teams that they have in the past.
I don't want Herro but I also really don't believe spurs would offer a pick, all the more as a facilitator, and no way then Miami bites (for now anyway)... And that's probably the case around the league, reason why this trade is stagnating. Miami is overestimating the interest a 120/4 Herro generates throughout the league.
While Herro and/or Nukic could improve the team, it wouldn't be enough to justify the cost IMO -- the direct cost of paying these guys and the opportunity cost of potentially better deals later on. The only acquisition that would put the Spurs closer to win now status is Lillard himself, and even with him not really.
Miami has enough salary pieces to take Lillard on. The financial structure of the deal is more or less in place.
What Miami needs is picks going to Portland. Of course it's a big stumbling block. Miami only has two late decade firsts.
Herro should be drawing more interest, at least that's the hope. They need SAS/POR/somebody to take him and throw what they think is worth toward the Blazers. Only neither team seems to value him that much; the idea has been floated that they should get draft capital in exchange, which can't happen here.
I honestly don't see any bargain/value the Spurs can get out of this, sadly. Herro is the only thing of Miami's they could value, unless somehow the Spurs want to acquire Jovic, Jacquez, Whitehead, Clowney, or another Brooklyn piece for better/juicy firsts and I don't think the Spurs want to do this or Brooklyn wants to do this.
Right now it seems like strongarming/begging Spurs or Nets into getting Herro unless another team pops up. I suppose the Spurs can use their expiring contracts, but this would mean taking on longer term salary by itself. Not what they want to do, I believe. And because of new cap rules, everyone needs to fill up their space by season's start, so expirings aren't worth much otherwise.
What he said
The other thing about Herro other than his defense... and his personality... and his contract... is that he puts up 16-17 shots a game. Who does he pull those shots from? We already need to adjust to Wembanyama and I don't want Herro taking any of his shots.
I wouldn't be upset with Kyle Lowry on an expiring contract. He's mostly washed and can't stay healthy, but he still had some moments in the playoffs. He definitely fills a need for a vet and a point guard, and he's got a ring. The Heat certainly don't need him with Lillard on board and Portland is set at the point with Scoot and Simons. If the Spurs could pocket some sort of asset to take those dollars -- lord knows they need a few more second round picks -- then why not?
Because that only solves part of the Lillard salary issue, and none of the Nurkic one, and they're insistent on offloading him in the deal. Miami doesn't have even a ton of SRPs to throw in. The only clean, uncontested one they have is 2029, although I guess 2030 would be available now that the 2023 NBA year is over.
Especially when the fruit of thy loom is Jusuf.
Okay I know you guys are dying to know how I would have handled this offseason for the Spurs if I were in charge. Let me just assure you it applies to this thread in the end as you will see.
First, my philosophy would be to build a defense first contender for Wemby his first year. That's this year, whether he's ready or not. If you build it, I believe he will rise.
So starting back at the draft day.
I would have snuck in and replaced Memphis and acquired Marcus Smart. We would have traded Tre Jones (bro of who was traded) and a 2024 first and we would have given Boston our 33 and 44 and 3 more seconds later on (boston did all those trades for the seconds, so we would have just provided them with more even so we would have a better offer than Memphis with #25). Seconds for days as they say.
Then we would get Marcus Smart with roughly 3/54 contract. Our starting lineup would be Smart/Vassell/Sochan/Wemby/Zollins. Now we have our defensive tone set going forward.
Then when free agency broke, I would have stepped up and snagged Bruce Brown from Indiana, maybe by guaranteeing that second year. He's a true winner and an everything man off the bench for us. He will establish our superior bench. His contract would be 2/40.
Then I would trade for Jarrett Allen. Whatever it cost, a couple firsts or whatever. It shouldn't be too expensive. He is 3/60 and will be our starting center. Our starting lineup is now Smart/Vassell/Sochan/Wemby/Allen and now it would be elite defensively.
Finally, now our team is looking so strong, we could realistically convince Lillard that we are contenders with him, so we do that trade for Keldon + stuff + 4 firsts and 4 seconds. Now our starting lineup is Lillard/Smart/Sochan/Wemby/Allen with Vassell/Brown/Zollins on the bench.
Start the championship countdown with that roster baby!!!!
The following post is written in the context that I actually like Herro and think he would fit in well with this team and be a key piece for us going forward. So, if you disagree with that premise, that's okay and you can just throw out all that I'm about to say.
If the Spurs wanted Herro, I think giving up the CHA pick and getting Herro back would be the way to go. This helps POR save face by getting another FRP added to the haul for Dame, when it reality this pick is MAYBE a coin flip to convey and I wouldn't bet on it. POR or MIA could attach a few 2nds coming back to us, and in reality we may not actually be giving up anything.
Is there better value you can get for the CHA pick? Maybe, though I'm not sure. It is by far the least valuable asset in our pick treasure chest, and a pick we probably don't actually want to make (if it conveys in 2024, it will likely be our 3rd - and worst - pick. If it conveys in 2025 it will likely be our 4th (!!!) pick). I'd definitely give it up in order to land Herro, but that is all based upon the first assumption. If the Spurs don't rate him, then its all pointless discussion. Spurs will never be in the business of taking large multi-year contracts for guys they don't want.
Miami can also remove protections on their 2025 owed to OKC, which gives them the ability to include another pick, I believe. Plus the FRP swaps in the alternate years.
They need to find a take for Herro at the rate of at least two FRPs, in my estimation. But Miami will need the additional draft capital.
Tbh if the Spurs wanted Herro, this deal probably would already be done.
This is probably correct. The Spurs involvement, if any, in either of the Dame or Harden deals will likely be taking on some random small player salaries that we aren't talking about that we can just waive and collect some SRPs (like the Dedmon deal).
If the Spurs could take on Herro and Jaquez while unloading McDermott's salary, I'd be at least interested. Herro's not my favorite but he's still an upgrade, and although he's probably overpaid, that contract won't be untradeable. Very good chance that a trade package in 2025 of Herro, KJ, 2 FRPs + parts gets you a very good player to pair with Wemby. Though it's hard to imagine Portland not demanding Jaquez.
herro and jacquez for mcdermott? yeah id be intereseted too!
Doesn't Miami have to wait 30 days before being able to trade Jaime Jaquez? If so, it will be difficult to imagine all of the teams with a path to help facilitate this trade staying patient for that long.
True, on the surface it sounds crazy-- duh, of course!-- but I'm just going on the idea that the only reason the Spurs would be involved as a 3rd team is because Portland isn't interested in Herro and doesn't want to take back long term salary, so he'd have to be shipped to another team.
yeah, I believe he can't be officially traded until July 31st.
This trade’s going to take a lot longer than that to happen, perhaps to the deadline, or even next summer.
Ideally I agree that that's the way that it should happen, but it sure feels like Portland is being strong-armed by the media and pundits to make a deal that is not in their best interest (somewhat similar to the attempts with Kawhi, although I know that the scenarios were quite different) just to see Lillard in a bigger market.
I agree that this is likely gonna stretch into August, if not longer. But things would get really ugly if Portland were to take this saga into the season.
Portland seems to not GAF what anyone,including Dame, wants. They trade him to the team that gives them the best offer.
I think Portland blinks first...
i had heard a few analysts proffer that the heat run to the finals was somewhat abetted by the absence of herro, because of his ball dominance.
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