Does tanking ruin a team?

[Extra Stout]

Wasting Wemby's rookie year and not developing the sh!tty players around him at every opportunity to learn to pass him the ball is just not smart. Since we suck anyway, the Spurs could spend an entire game working on entry passes to Wemby. We lose by 40, who cares? At least we're working on something that matters in the long run. Having these guys run around with zero structure or accountability, like they're playing in the Rec League at the YMCA is just dumb.

This is the sticking point for me. I get that wins and losses don’t matter that much. But Victor’s development does. And the decisions that are being made are stunting the development of the greatest prospect in a generation. And the solutions to that are blinking-red-lights obvious. If that’s not being done with an eye on the next draft, then what the ?

[z0sa]

The problem is that when they're losing they're thinking "Man am I just not good enough?" Tanking just tells the players that they're not good enough and can hurt their psyche. You're tanking for a player who's going to take SOMEBODIES job.

100% because this team is so young.

No vet presence (especially at PG) means a lot more than missing Wemby 3 times a quarter for dunks. Our guys are young and none of them are guaranteed an NBA salary 4-5 years from now. They, like most younguns won’t know what is good for them until they experience it.

“Tanking” would absolutely ruin the confidence of some of these younger players if it was an unspoken but obvious fact in the locker room. Anyone who says differently doesnt remember being 21 or is BSing.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Wemby seems to be getting more irritated with the losing not less.

[DAF86]

It didn't ruin the Spurs when the tanked for Timmy, tbh.

[TD 21]

This is the sticking point for me. I get that wins and losses don’t matter that much. But Victor’s development does. And the decisions that are being made are stunting the development of the greatest prospect in a generation. And the solutions to that are blinking-red-lights obvious. If that’s not being done with an eye on the next draft, then what the ?

I don't have an alternate theory to offer or any facts to refute what you said, but you must have an axe to grind.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

It didn't ruin the Spurs when the tanked for Timmy, tbh.

One year tank is different. And it's not really a tank when Robinson coming back from injury means the rebuild is complete.

[itzsoweezee]

Nothing wrong in with tanking. How you do it matters. What the Spurs are doing right now is probably not good for anyone on the current roster, wemby included. Seeing him celebrate the win the other night is probably a good representation of why

[rankingtear]

They are not tanking. Wemby offense is not good right now and it is too raw to build anything around it. Every draft guy is saying this before the draft a PG won't suddenly fix it only hide it.

[CGD]

They won 40 games last year, and are currently 2nd in the west. I’d call that progress, and the end of their tank.

This will be the year to prove it; last year they finished 10th in the West with DAL and POR shamelessly tanking at the end, and Utah coming down to earth some. Presti gets a lot of love because he always seems to win the offseasons, which is fine, but not the whole story.

But the broader point stands: we are arguably in year 1.5 of the tank, and folks should hold their ing until we see it at year 4. Spurs are on schedule as far as I'm concerned.

[weebo]

People want to call it a tank I call it year 0 of the rebuild. The Spurs aren't actively trying to lose games but they sure as are not trying to win any either. As far as I can tell, Pop/Spurs FO are happy when they win, meh when they lose. And as far as developing Wemby, he's 19 years old and just learning the NBA fundamentals, learning how his game fits in the NBA, the speed of the NBA, etc...no pressure...just play and learn. The rest of the guys are just auditioning for parts, either you make the cut, get traded or are out of the league. So, who cares if "no jump shot" Tre Jones is lobbing alley oops to Wemby. He won't be on the team in 3 years.

[exstatic]

This will be the year to prove it; last year they finished 10th in the West with DAL and POR shamelessly tanking at the end, and Utah coming down to earth some. Presti gets a lot of love because he always seems to win the offseasons, which is fine, but not the whole story.

But the broader point stands: we are arguably in year 1.5 of the tank, and folks should hold their ing until we see it at year 4. Spurs are on schedule as far as I'm concerned.

They lost Chet for the year, or they might hav made noise last year.

[SouthernFryd]

Tanking is wrong on so many levels.

One not talked about much...is morally. It sucks something out of people when they lie or fake things. It's wrong...whether or not it produces results. It affects people negatively. It's soul sucking. "Yeah, we tanked. We didn't play hard. We faked it." How's that make them feel. How's that make them play? Kinda like they're playing now maybe?

How many of the greats did that. Seems to be much more prevalent now than ever before. And not just in basketball.

But, this is not war. This is not life or death. This is a game. You learn a lot about people when playing games. If you're paying attention, you have learned a lot about Pop.

[The Truth #6]

It felt like the morale on the team was way better last year. Possibly because there was less pressure in a way before Victor showed up. And now I get a sense there may be a time clock ticking for all the players, and I don't see that necessarily good for team spirit in a sense. Players potentially could be looking just to get their stats and look for the next team they might end up on. I can't say that conclusively, but I have to wonder if that's potentially becoming a question. I mean, it's a business. For example, Sochan's next contract doesn't exactly look more promising dollar wise after getting thrown into the fire as a point guard.

[Dex]

They are not tanking. Wemby offense is not good right now and it is too raw to build anything around it. Every draft guy is saying this before the draft a PG won't suddenly fix it only hide it.

Spus are 4-22.

You can call it whatever you want, but at this point we better be tanking because we sure as aren't winning anything this season. The only thing to play for is another good draft pick.

[eric365]

Tanking is ok and even wemby should understand it
But tanking the way spurs do it is an issue

Get a good pass first point guard with very bad defense to compensate
And rest key players on more games
That should keep a 15 wins max record

[cd98]

Tanking didn't ruin the Spurs when they got Tim Duncan. It changed the franchise. Same with the Cavs tanking for Lebron. Spurs aren't ruined for tanking to get Wemby. Losing is generally what follows a number one pick. The good news is we should be in the lottery again with a chance to add more talent to the roster. If you improve too quickly, you can end up a middle of the road team with a superstar that's good enough to keep you average but without other assets to improve to become elite.

[Spurs9]

Team would have been way more entertaining to watch with Westbrook tbh.

[z0sa]

Tanking didn't ruin the Spurs when they got Tim Duncan. It changed the franchise. Same with the Cavs tanking for Lebron. Spurs aren't ruined for tanking to get Wemby. Losing is generally what follows a number one pick. The good news is we should be in the lottery again with a chance to add more talent to the roster. If you improve too quickly, you can end up a middle of the road team with a superstar that's good enough to keep you average but without other assets to improve to become elite.

Cavs improved to 35 wins with LeBron. David Robinson was injured for the TD tank. He came back and we were instantly contenders.

Spurs are looking like they are starting the tank this season, when it is already year 2 at the earliest.

[R. DeMurre]

I think it's a fair question to ask. It's clear that many fans are frustrated by tanking, and it makes sense that a certain percentage of players might have the same reaction. The only real concern I have right now is that a good deal might be available at the trade deadline and be rejected for fear of it adding too many wins. One interesting thing to me is that Sochan, back at his more natural position, has registered in the last four games assist/turnover numbers of 8/0, 4/0, 2/1, and 5/3... that's 19 assists to 4 TOs, which is a pretty great sign. If Sochan at PG was an experiment to make him better while waiting for a real PG to show up via free agency, trade, or the draft, it appears that the experiment might be showing signs of having some success.

[scott]

Cavs improved to 35 wins with LeBron. David Robinson was injured for the TD tank. He came back and we were instantly contenders.

Spurs are looking like they are starting the tank this season, when it is already year 2 at the earliest.

This is one of the overlooked part of the argument that we are merely in Year 1 of a 3/4 year tank. That’s a fair concept, but what other supposedly generational player took several more years of tanking after him for the team to become compe ive? I’ll grant you, Timmy is a unique case that should not be pointed at since he was added to a contender already.

All the other generational talents immediately improved their teams. The Spurs have gotten significantly worse, which was hard to even think possible.

Though I understand the argument that we are merely 1 year into a 3/4 year tank… are we just supposed to ignore the 3 lottery picks that preceded Wemby? Yes, they were late lotto picks… but they were still lotto picks. Do we get to write them off because we simply sucked instead of were deliberately tanking?

If this is a 3-4 year tank, it will mean that we missed the playoffs for 6-7 straight years to rebuild. Maybe folks are okay with that, but in what world does a GM and HC who require a 7 year rebuild deserve to be rewarded (one of them with the highest paying contract in the league).

Once again, this former Sniffer says that this is starting to smell like horse .

Some other great points made… I’d be more at peace with the tank if there were discernible development taking place. Instead, we have Wemby missing out on key developmental opportunities because his teammates suck. We have Devin turning into a poor-shot selection black hole because the team around him suck ass and he can’t get fed properly, and we have Sochan being forced into being something he is not and is not his highest and best use. The result is we lose by 40 and gain nothing. If we’re going to lose by 40 and have a 4-22 record, at least get something out of it.

[exstatic]

This is one of the overlooked part of the argument that we are merely in Year 1 of a 3/4 year tank. That’s a fair concept, but what other supposedly generational player took several more years of tanking after him for the team to become compe ive? I’ll grant you, Timmy is a unique case that should not be pointed at since he was added to a contender already.

All the other generational talents immediately improved their teams. The Spurs have gotten significantly worse, which was hard to even think possible.

Though I understand the argument that we are merely 1 year into a 3/4 year tank… are we just supposed to ignore the 3 lottery picks that preceded Wemby? Yes, they were late lotto picks… but they were still lotto picks. Do we get to write them off because we simply sucked instead of were deliberately tanking?

If this is a 3-4 year tank, it will mean that we missed the playoffs for 6-7 straight years to rebuild. Maybe folks are okay with that, but in what world does a GM and HC who require a 7 year rebuild deserve to be rewarded (one of them with the highest paying contract in the league).

Once again, this former Sniffer says that this is starting to smell like horse .

Some other great points made… I’d be more at peace with the tank if there were discernible development taking place. Instead, we have Wemby missing out on key developmental opportunities because his teammates suck. We have Devin turning into a poor-shot selection black hole because the team around him suck ass and he can’t get fed properly, and we have Sochan being forced into being something he is not and is not his highest and best use. The result is we lose by 40 and gain nothing. If we’re going to lose by 40 and have a 4-22 record, at least get something out of it.

We’re actually in year two. I’m also guessing that Cleveland wasn’t tanking when they won 35 games, and that caused problems down the line when they tried to put a team around him.

[JuneJive]

Where was this question before we got Wemby?

Now it's bad, yeah, right.

[scott]

I think it's a fair question to ask. It's clear that many fans are frustrated by tanking, and it makes sense that a certain percentage of players might have the same reaction. The only real concern I have right now is that a good deal might be available at the trade deadline and be rejected for fear of it adding too many wins. One interesting thing to me is that Sochan, back at his more natural position, has registered in the last four games assist/turnover numbers of 8/0, 4/0, 2/1, and 5/3... that's 19 assists to 4 TOs, which is a pretty great sign. If Sochan at PG was an experiment to make him better while waiting for a real PG to show up via free agency, trade, or the draft, it appears that the experiment might be showing signs of having some success.

Really fantastic point. I could definitely see an opportunity arising that seems perfect (the right player, the right price, the right timeline) and the FO passing because “we aren’t ready to win” - and then a similar opportunity fails to present itself. I’m thinking of a move similar to the one that took Halliburton to Indy. A young player on the rise (and still on his rookie deal) but with clear star potential was gettable. These types of opportunities do not come around often.

It’s easy to find the logic to pass on an established (potentially disgruntled) star making a ton of money (some like Dame), but I hope if a Halliburton-like situation presents itself that this team doesn’t pass for the sake of some other “master plan” that right now appears to be questionable in terms of what the results will be. We could get Top 5 picks for the next 3 years and roll snake eyes with busts 3-years in a row. You just don’t know, but someone like the Halliburton comes with a much higher degree of confidence.

[scott]

We’re actually in year two. I’m also guessing that Cleveland wasn’t tanking when they won 35 games, and that caused problems down the line when they tried to put a team around him.

Yes, when you are one year into something, you are in year two.

Of course Cleveland wasn’t taking when they won 35 games, they didn’t need to anymore - they just added a generational talent, and immediately went on a trajectory of improvement, winning 35 games, then becoming a .500+ team, on their way to becoming a 60 win team. That’s my point. What other generational talents required several years of tanking after they were drafted?

[MultiTroll]

Once again, this former Sniffer says that this is starting to smell like horse .

Some other great points made… I’d be more at peace with the tank if there were discernible development taking place. Instead, we have Wemby missing out on key developmental opportunities because his teammates suck. We have Devin turning into a poor-shot selection black hole because the team around him suck ass and he can’t get fed properly, and we have Sochan being forced into being something he is not and is not his highest and best use. The result is we lose by 40 and gain nothing. If we’re going to lose by 40 and have a 4-22 record, at least get something out of it.