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Israel isn't "the Jews" and no, I don't think Israel is winning.
I think Israel and the US are making things more dangerous for Jews everywhere, especially in Israel.
A clear cause for war doesn't authorize disproportionate/unlimited punishment of civilians.Did I not write intent in that sentence too?
I stand by my point about tremendous claims requiring tremendous proof.
At the end of the day this is much ado over nothing.Right off the bat the Russians and Chinese will never allow what the Israeli's are doing be defined as such. Then of course when you look at what US forces were doing in Vietnam, Basra, Fallujah, and elsewhere you're opening that door too so we won't either. Israel has a clear cause for war.
Let's see if you continue to do the outrage thing when the conflict moves off the news cycle.
I'd be cool with the US facing war crimes process for what we did in Iraq, even if Russia and China objected. I don't bow to their prerogatives.
And obviously, you're not familiar with my MO here. I raise a bunch of issues not currently at the top of the news cycle, on the reg.
Last edited by Winehole23; 12-27-2023 at 10:33 PM.
Israel isn't "the Jews" and no, I don't think Israel is winning.
I think Israel and the US are making things more dangerous for Jews everywhere, especially in Israel.
Hey, if you hold up bully for you. That is when they will need the help the most.
And despite your stand it will still never happen.
I also think the complete destruction of Hamas is a pipe dream. Israel won't be able to withstand the political cost in war deaths -- and hostages -- required to get it done, even if they could do it.
You underestimate the value Jews put on life. Unlike Christians, all the religious laws can be suspended to save it. Political slaughter will have to yield at some point. Too many Israelis will have died.
What will never happen? You've got this thing with indefinite reference/elliptical construction that makes you hard to understand.
The UN, ICC, or similar ins ution will never label this conflict as a genocide, ethnic cleansing or the like.
I don't know enough about the situation to make a claim one way or the other as to Hamas' long term viability. Most of their facilities, infrastructure, and their leadership will be destroyed.
I just hope that there is room for a better polity for the Palestinians in the future.
Netanyahu's cynical and disastrous strategy leading to this conflict and the domestic cost won't be lost in the lust for revenge or paid for purely in Palestinian lives. He's a goner.
His opposition is not exactly pro Palestinian.
Killing Gazans indiscriminately, driving them out of their homes and starving them does not reliably lead to the polity you describe. Quite the opposite, I think.
I didn't suggest that. Netanyahu, right now, isn't so popular at home. He screwed up. The Hamas massacre on Oct 7 will be blamed on him, not totally unjustly.
He was too focused on the West Bank, coddling his far right settler cons uency.
The Palestinians were never going to consent to Israeli governance anyway.
Hopefully, the Kuwaiti, UAE, Qatari, or similar Sunni cultural brethren can help there. Despite the conflict the Israelis and the Arab League continue to work together. Given the reality of Iranian foreign policy it makes sense to do so when that is the alternative.
oh sure, the US will protect its beachhead in Israel and veto any motion adverse to Israel, no doubt about it.
As will Russia, China, and Britain.
lol
None of those countries want another Arab Spring inside their own borders. That's not going to happen either. None of them will accept forced resettlement at the hands of Israel. Too risky.
The UN is a conversation piece, we agree on that. Israel just rescinded their automatic visas, and besides, has been killing their agents wantonly. We're up to like 140 UN deaths, In think -- a record for any conflict.
supposing that never happens (likely), do you think for yourself that no genocide or ethnic cleansing has happened?
Given the evidence at this point and my recent statements I would hope that is obvious. Much like CC I see it as urban warfare.
That is why I intentionally said the smaller countries. I agree it is unlikely Egypt, Jordan, or the like is a good match. At the end of the day, there is going to need to be a lot of need for leadership, expertise, and advice that is both something the Palestinians can accept and is in their best interest.
If not then they are ed genocide or not.
well, when the facts on the ground are studied and verified, we'll see who's still singing the same tune.
Not to create a case for systemic intent with what you have.
You accept genocide as an acceptable outcome.
At least that is honest.
Bull talks, actions walk.
What is it you say? You're doing it again. Jumping to conclusions without understanding what is being said.You accept genocide as an acceptable outcome.
At least that is honest.
Sorry to disappoint you but I do not approve of genocide. I am saying that whether or not it is labeled as a genocide the Palestinians will continue to live in the iron age being run by people who use them at their own expense. To me that means they are ed unless that leadership, expertise, and advice comes from somewhere.
Exactly. Do better than innuendo.
There are few more tremendous claims than genocide. Your proof if it comes will not be a 1000 cuts. It will be one tremendous one.
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