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yup wemby needs to kearn how to draw a goul and get to the line consistently. 8 to 10 freethrow attempts will help his scoring
looks tired...but loves chucking up 3s not drawing any fouls to keep teh defense honest...
yup wemby needs to kearn how to draw a goul and get to the line consistently. 8 to 10 freethrow attempts will help his scoring
Common Chinook W
Yes, all 20-year old blue chip prospects are supposed to regress in their second season, playing completely away from their strengths, because that’s how they want to play. It’s like a rite of passage.
Scott I think we both know Wemby’s not going to play poorly the rest of the season and that he’s bound to have a statistical improvement over last season once the season’s done.
Homeboy made a grand total of two 2pt FGs yesterday.
There is 1) Wemby executing poorly (as in not making shots, committing TOs, etc); there is 2) Wemby playing poorly (as in not following plays, being in the wrong place, making bad decisions, taking ill advised shots); and then there is 3) Wemby being used poorly (as in having a game plan that sets him up for failure, like trying to turn him into a perimeter ISO player or deep 3pt shooter).
#1 is a natural thing that all players go through. If this is all that were happening, there would be no cause for concern.
#2 is happening in some aspects (bad shot selection, poor decisions) but it’s not clear how much of that is a result of Wemby or a function of…
#3 this appears to be happening based on the comments we’ve heard from Wemby and the coaching staff.
If we’re gonna see Steph Wemby by design all season, then the only way for him to finish with statistical improvement on the offensive end* is for him to sudden turn into a 38%+ 3pt shooter. Maybe this will happen, a lot of his shots don’t look bad and just rim out… maybe, just maybe, he’s just on the receiving end of negative variance. More likely, however, is that he’s not a dead-eye 3pt shooter and he never will be. His 3pt shot is good enough to be a deadly weapon, but not good enough to become the centerpiece of his game.
But more important than just statistical improvement is the improvement of how he fits into team offense. Right now, he’s not. The regression is not just in some PPG stat, because honestly who cares. The regression is how he fits into the offensive flow.
There is an argument being made here that we are just injecting him with an overdose of 3pt shots as a way to jumpstart his development as a 3pt shooter via in-game experience. But this is nonsensical from a practical perspective. You don’t build a well-rounded game by transforming yourself into a one-dimensional player for 20 games (or however long the Steph Wemby era will last). If you want him to become an unstoppable, well rounded offensive weapon, then let’s get the practical experience of just playing that way. 5-6 3PA/gm seems around the sweet spot for Wemby in game settings. You don’t need him jacking up 10-15 ill advised 3PA/gm to develop his 3 point shot because there are these other situations called practice where he can do that.
One of the most logical explanations of why this is happening is because it’s what Wemby wants to do. While this is a logical explanation, it is a pretty ing stupid justification. What’s the point of having a coaching staff if we’re just going to let Wemby do whatever he wants because that’s what he wants. If Wemby wants to start playing with his eyes closed, are we going to let him?
*he’s already ungodly on the defensive end both from a statistical perspective and the way he impacts the game and it is showing in the overall team defensive results
scott I think you need to step back and look at the big picture. Stupid justification? When you have a generational player, you treat that with care and not recklessly. Simply look at generational players in the past decade or two ( I’m old) and see how many of them stayed with their first team. This isn’t the era where they stay loyal to one city. As an organization you have two choices to appease your star: you win or you follow what they want to do. The former is simply difficult to do unless you were a playoff team already and gifted with a top pick. Why around with the latter? The worst thing to have is a losing team with an unhappy star. On the other hand, the star has no one else to blame but himself because he chose to play this way and will mature as a player.
Dejounte, I see your point, but like most things in life there is a balance. Forcing Wemby to be Shaq (as an example) could possibly drive him out. But providing zero structure, letting Wemby just do whatever he wants, and then seeing him fail is also a recipe to see him walk out there door. Most human beings aren’t very good at accepting their own culpability in their failings, and if the Spurs just let him go Steph Wemby for a few years (which I don’t think they’ll do) and turn into a low efficiency chucker and the narrative in the media and among fans becomes that he failed to live up to the hype… he’s probably going to start asking who’s fault that is and he (like most people) are unlikely to end up looking in the mirror. And at that point, he’ll be looking for greener pastures.
I don’t think the Old School, yelling-at-Tony, Pop would be right for a modern Superstar. But neither is the “just do what you want” Pop who seems to have been completely shook by Nephew and LMA. And this brings me back to my original point. Rather than putting ALL of the onus of tough love on Pop and the coaching staff, it would have been really helpful to have a high performing veteran, who earns the respect of his teammates with his play on the court as much as he does off of it, to be that steadying mentor for Vic. Every Spurs GOAT had one.
I know this name might bring some visceral reaction, but even bring DDR back on this team could have been that kind of guy for Vic. Right now, there is no one on the team who can fill that role. And again, having that guy isn’t necessarily about winning today, but winning in the future. Ironically, Chinook is suddenly against this idea after spending all summer talking about Jimmy Butler and Khris Middleton. Jimmy Butler would have *potentially* been another kind of guy for this role (though there are valid questions about whether he’s the right locker room presence). Chris Paul would have been the right guy 6years ago like he was for SGA… it’s not Chris Paul’s fault he was born 39 years ago, but that’s just the reality of the situation.
What we're seing isn't "carring" for Wemby but for PATFO's own interest and timeline.
Why would another strategy necessessarilly be "reckless"?
One could argue that the present strategy is reckless, surrounding him with such low IQs and passing abilities, not having anyone taking attention off of him etc can be very damaging, physically bc he's gonna get beaten down every games and more importantly, mentally.
It's as sad to watch Wemby this season that it was exciting last season.
scott so your fear is that this style continues for years after this one. I think this coaching staff has shown to steer away from what doesn’t work after giving it some time. Remember the Sochan at PG experiment only lasted 20 games. Collins was told to stop shooting threes after a certain point last season. I don’t think there is any basis for the fears you are having over what ineffective style they’re playing now. They’ve shown time and time again that they drop whatever doesn’t work in-season, if not by the end of it. Now, if the Spurs suddenly start winning with this style because they’ve added talent back from this injury list then I don’t think it will stop. Why would they? It likely means Wemby’s 3’s are going in with improved spacing from Vassell and the rotation is more balanced. Who knows… maybe the reason the coaching staff agreed to Wemby’s demands to play this way is because it looked good in practice when the roster was at full strength?
My fingers are faster than my reading comprehension, scott, i acknowledge now that you said you don’t think they will continue this past this season - ignore the first sentence of my previous sentence but my point about them changing it up mid-season (and other points) still applies
LMAO wemby
No, my biggest fear is that Wemby is not developing at his full potential, because we’ve not provided the proper development resources - in this case a high performing veteran mentor who leads by example.
Everything else you’ve just stated are just symptoms, not the disease.
Will the Spurs eventually pivot away from this if it doesn’t work? Probably, but then it’s just like the Sochan experience… why waste 20 games on it when pretty much anyone could have predicted this outcome? , our man DAF86 stated it before Wemby played a single game: Wemby is a center. Is he a center with range? Yes, absolutely. Can we find a way to take advantage of that? Yes, and we should. Does that mean we should go down rabbit holes to see if Wemby is secretly Steph Curry and thus negating all of the other amazing things he can do? Probably not.
It all goes back to the development philosophy and framework that this team operates with. There doesn’t seem to be a plan, and there aren’t resources (our shooting coach can’t really teach anyone how to shoot… we don’t have veteran role models on the team, Pop has taken a laissez faire approach to player development, etc). We shouldn’t have to go on these 20-82 game sojourns to discover what we have. We should be able to figure that out in practice, in training game, and in a few games. We’ve had a full season of Wemby, and now we’ve decided that we should try and discover if he is actually Kevin Durant. Haven’t we seen enough to know he can’t take guys off the dribble as primary offensive move? Haven’t we seen enough to know he’s not a Logo 3 merchant?
The video that RC posted in the Wemby thread I think is a great watch. It’s not that Wemby is in a slump, it’s just really poor utilization of him coupled with an incoherent roster construction. Going into Game 10, 62% of his shots are 3PA this year (hitting 22% of them), meanwhile he was shooting 77% in the restricted area (per the video RC posted). I think most people can see the problem with that!
scott ah the funny thing about the Sochan experiment is that the outcome is debatable. There’s a side here that believes it helped mold him into the player he’s starting to show this season and the other side thinks it did nothing. IMO, he’s exhibiting some ball handling skills this season that wouldn’t be there if it weren’t for those 20 games last season. He was able to discover his limitations and is (smartly) picking up the ball in situations he wouldn’t have.
So whether one believes that extreme experiment worked out for Sochan or not will be believers in the current Wemby experiment. Hopefully we have more definitive evidence that it shapes him into the dominant player he’ll become (we hope).
I don't know why people don't wanna acknowledge how the real world works, even though they are clearly smart enough to understand it.
Winning the Wemby lotto meant that the Franchise value sky rocketed almost overnight. So, PATFO is not gonna treat Wemby like they did a young Tony. If Wemby wants to try following the KD/Curry mold then they will give him that chance. Cuz he's the Franchise right now. It's that simple.
It very well could end up being a waste of time. But it's something that Wemby wants, so it's something that he will get.
It could be worse. Our Franchise ticket could be wasting time by getting suspend for showing off his Walther PPK collection on insta live.
No one knows if the "strategy" is a requested by Wemby or imposed by PATFO
But let's just act as if you knew smh
If we're trying to be positive, OKC also went from 22 to 40 to 57 wins in consecutive seasons.
Most of us in here expected 30 to 35 wins this year and above .500 record the next season. It's not impossible to skip that step.
But if we go into the next season with the likes of Collins and Keldon on the roster, then the front office and coaching staff has to go.
Wemby, Devin, Jeremy, Castle are the core, Champagnie will also be on the roster and most likely two rookies.
I want 3 legit players on top of that. Not fading veterans or reclamation projects. We'll need actual NBA players.
Of course, no one knows if Wemby requested the strategy.
That is if you are completely ignoring Wemby's own words about not wanting to be boxed in as a inside player only.
Exactly this. Wemby’s a billion dollar investment. No need to around with what he wants tbh.
Wemby also wants (or so he claims) to be "coached hard". You'd think that coaching would include saying "hey man... I know you want to be Steph Curry... but you aren't. Let's play into your strengths and natural advantages" instead of "oh, you want to be a princess today? I guess it's tea time!"
Or maybe Wemby is just a pussy ass who can't handle any criticism at all and needs to be babied. I don't think this is the case, and I sure hope it's not, because they we have other problems.
I think Wemby‘s bad shooting numbers from 3 are easy to explain: he shoots most of them from way behind the 3-point line. He‘s clearly automatic from 3 in practice/shootaround (there are plenty of videos). Yesterday against the Jazz he shot most of them standing at the line and he hit them. He just needs to get higher quality looks.
Teams were guarding him with smalls to begin the season last year too and he was struggling like then. We were all ing about him trying to cross guards up instead of taking them in the post. Then he started destroying SGs and SFs in the post by the new year and teams were forced to guard him with PF and C. His conditioning must just be total crap now to not be punishing these guys on the block like did last year by about mid December when teams were guarding him that way.
Has anyone been coached hard in San Antonio since nephew took a massive dump on the entire franchise?
LMA complained about touches and got his way.
We witnessed two straight seasons of Forbes losing us easy games and he never got benched.
I honestly don't know the answer to the coaching question right now, can't decide which side to take, tbh.
While we do have an awful roster outside of 4 or 5 players, there are a lot of coaches around the league who make those borderline NBA players work well in a system.
Does our coaching staff have that capability? You think Spoelstra wouldn't make our roster look better?
What kind of message they send to players trying to become rotation members? Mamu and even Bassey do well whenever they get minutes, but there was never any discussion of sitting Keldon or especially Collins because they're a massive negative on both ends of the floor. Where's the accountability?
We're already one of the worst teams in the league, how much worse can it get if worst performers start catching DNPs?
It's probably hard to push accountability onto the players when you've got the highest paid FO and HC in the league who ALSO happen to be the only FO and HC who've managed to survive being in the lottery for 5 straight years, headed towards 6.
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