De'Aaron Fox Rumors Suggest a Possible Trade to The Spurs

Originally Posted by CGD

Thats what gives me the most pause. Do we seriously want to be paying Fox contracts that go into the 70Ms?

we gotta bring someone eventually.

I'd LOVE to see Fox on the Spurs, I'm just not convinced that the boneheads on this team could maximized having him. I don't see him making the rest of the team better. Admittedly, I'm a teacher by trade and see things through that lens. Until these players grow up a bit more, Fox might be an asset that is not being fully utilized. From Fox's perspective, he's in his prime NOW, we might not even be on his radar if he's seeking a change of scenery.

IF Fox wants to come here, like it's his 1st choice, then this is a different conversation. IF he's willing to do some financial sacrificing to be here, then YES!
Fox/Castle would make for a solid backcourt, no doubt.

If Butler gets traded, I could see Fox going to Miami in a 3-team deal. SA is a tough sell if Miami is an option.

Originally Posted by ginobilized

I'd LOVE to see Fox on the Spurs, I'm just not convinced that the boneheads on this team could maximized having him.

I think you're making a mistake in thinking this roster is going to be similar in a couple of years. There is likely to be tons of churn in this roster. The Spurs are a rebuilding team, not a playoff team looking to contend right now, and I would expect there are really only four players on this team that are safe right now: Wemby (obviously), CP3 (can't screw him over after he signed here), Castle (way too much potential to move for anything other than a superstar), and Champagnie (his value is way above his contract).

Also he's not taking a paycut, that's completely unrealistic, especially at a time every team is flush with money from the new TV/streaming deal. Fox is a max player and will be paid a max contract.

Originally Posted by ginobilized

I'd LOVE to see Fox on the Spurs, I'm just not convinced that the boneheads on this team could maximized having him. I don't see him making the rest of the team better. Admittedly, I'm a teacher by trade and see things through that lens. Until these players grow up a bit more, Fox might be an asset that is not being fully utilized. From Fox's perspective, he's in his prime NOW, we might not even be on his radar if he's seeking a change of scenery.

IF Fox wants to come here, like it's his 1st choice, then this is a different conversation. IF he's willing to do some financial sacrificing to be here, then YES!
Fox/Castle would make for a solid backcourt, no doubt.

If Butler gets traded, I could see Fox going to Miami in a 3-team deal. SA is a tough sell if Miami is an option.

Ask Dame how that goes. Miami ain’t got for picks, which is why Dame is in Milwaukee.

If someone prefers another destination to playing with Wemby, then winning basketball games isn't their #1 priority and we don't need them.

Originally Posted by LeBowen

Future cap projections, having two max players won't be an issue because every contender gets over the cap. Third max deal is where things get interesting.
If we get Fox, we'd still have $100M before we hit luxury tax when his and Wemby's max deals kick in.

A 364MM cap and a half-billion second apron is mind blowing.

Originally Posted by LeBowen

If someone prefers another destination to playing with Wemby, then winning basketball games isn't their #1 priority and we don't need them.

Yea, but the issue is more what is SAC willing to do vs what does Fox want. Vecenie put a package of Reed/Whitmore/Adams/Green + a handful of FRP. That’s more palatable to SAC than Vessel + Zollins + Branham + several FRP. Fox being from HOU could be sold on going there vs SA.

Originally Posted by vy65

Yea, but the issue is more what is SAC willing to do vs what does Fox want. Vecenie put a package of Reed/Whitmore/Adams/Green + a handful of FRP. That’s more palatable to SAC than Vessel + Zollins + Branham + several FRP. Fox being from HOU could be sold on going there vs SA.

We talked about it yesterday, that package is absolutely not better.
Both Reed and Whitmore are out of Rockets' rotation, Adams and Green are washed. It was Jeff Green, not Jalen in that offer.
Two Rockets FRPs that would be in the 20s because they'd add an all-star without losing any rotation pieces and one Phoenix pick that would be solid. Basically dumping their unwanted assets for an all-star.

Hawks picks are definitely more valuable even with Hawks treadmilling and Kings really want that swap back.
No way we dump Collins on them, it would be Devin and Tre, most likely. Tre is also a solid player and would be useful for them.

If Kings are looking to keep competing after trading Fox, then Spurs offer is way better.
They could even try and get let's say Hunter with those Hawks picks.

Fox is also from Texas and his wife went to high school in San Antonio

I'm 100% onboard as long as we don't lose Vassell. I've called it for years, plural, now: Vassell will be the best 3rd option in the League when we are winning le(s).

Originally Posted by baseline bum

I think you're making a mistake in thinking this roster is going to be similar in a couple of years. There is likely to be tons of churn in this roster. The Spurs are a rebuilding team, not a playoff team looking to contend right now, and I would expect there are really only four players on this team that are safe right now: Wemby (obviously), CP3 (can't screw him over after he signed here), Castle (way too much potential to move for anything other than a superstar), and Champagnie (his value is way above his contract).

Also he's not taking a paycut, that's completely unrealistic, especially at a time every team is flush with money from the new TV/streaming deal. Fox is a max player and will be paid a max contract.

I do hope that I'm making a mistake here.

Making the move now just doesn't feel like a Spurs-type move. To my knowledge, it still needs to pass through the gauntlet named Gregg Popovich. I'd love to see it happen, though.

Has anyone coined the term Empty Vassell? Throwing it out there.

Originally Posted by RC_Drunkford

Fox is also from Texas and his wife went to high school in San Antonio

This could work both ways. She may wanna stay the fk from round here. Especially when you have dough.

Originally Posted by exstatic

Ask Dame how that goes. Miami ain’t got for picks, which is why Dame is in Milwaukee.

Can you give me his phone number? I'll give him a call when I have some free time.

The only one time all star im trading for is Markannen. There is so many question with a Fox trade. Fit with Castle and fit with Wemby and fit with Sochan. Markannen just slot into that 3 spot. Smells like a Dame and DJ trade to me.

Originally Posted by rankingtear

It is way too early to speculate , the noise is Klutch using SA for leverage to get Fox help at the deadline to earn an All-NBA nod for a supermax extension. I doubt Fox is moved at the deadline, they are more likely to be buyers.

Not sure what you mean here... I don't think being involved in trade rumors is going to result in a player earning more All NBA votes...?

Originally Posted by baseline bum

If in 26-27 Fox signs a five year max contract with max raises his final year would be $67 million. Sounds like a lot but the cap will be $249 million so it would be 27% of the cap. If he makes an all-NBA team in 25-26 and instead signs a supermax year 5 would be $78.6 million of a $249 million cap, so ~31.5% of the cap. So yes I'm not worried about even paying him nearly $80 million his final year much less $70 million. A 10% annual bump to the cap compounded takes all the sting out of max raises. We're talking linear growth (Fox's contract) vs multiplicative growth (the salary cap). E.g., as the number of years n gets larger the difference between (1+r)^n and 1+r*n gets larger. And to top it off the r in (1+r)^n is 10% (annual salary cap raise) while the r in 1+r*n is 8% (annual max salary raise), so it's really comparing 1.1^n vs 1+0.08*n.

This is one reason why trading for him now, as opposed to the summer, might make sense.

If you trade for him now, you can extend him in the summer for a regular max (whether or not he signs that or wants to roll the dice is another question).

If you trade for him in the summer, you have a 6 month waiting period to extend him (IIRC from the Lauri discussions), and he'll have a good sense of whether or not he's on track for All-NBA and a SuperMax.

For the reasons you laid out, neither should really be too big of a concern, but you'd love to save that 5% of the cap if you can.

Originally Posted by rankingtear

It is way too early to speculate , the noise is Klutch using SA for leverage to get Fox help at the deadline to earn an All-NBA nod for a supermax extension. I doubt Fox is moved at the deadline, they are more likely to be buyers.

the noise started even before the season started.He let his feelings be known his priority is to win.

Originally Posted by vy65

A 364MM cap and a half-billion second apron is mind blowing.

The $33MM MLE is wild

Originally Posted by KingKev

This could work both ways. She may wanna stay the fk from round here. Especially when you have dough.

Overlooked point. I too am from San Antonio, and there is a zero percent chance I'd voluntarily move back to hole Texas

I thought Fox getting traded would stop him from getting a supermax at all, like with Number Two. Is that still the case?

Originally Posted by Seventyniner

I thought Fox getting traded would stop him from getting a supermax at all, like with Number Two. Is that still the case?

He has to make an All-NBA team to be supermax eligible. I do think he'd make it if he's here next year.

Originally Posted by LeBowen

We talked about it yesterday, that package is absolutely not better.
Both Reed and Whitmore are out of Rockets' rotation, Adams and Green are washed. It was Jeff Green, not Jalen in that offer.
Two Rockets FRPs that would be in the 20s because they'd add an all-star without losing any rotation pieces and one Phoenix pick that would be solid. Basically dumping their unwanted assets for an all-star.

Hawks picks are definitely more valuable even with Hawks treadmilling and Kings really want that swap back.
No way we dump Collins on them, it would be Devin and Tre, most likely. Tre is also a solid player and would be useful for them.

If Kings are looking to keep competing after trading Fox, then Spurs offer is way better.
They could even try and get let's say Hunter with those Hawks picks.

Let's compare.

Vassell is a vastly superior player to Whitmore, but Cam is in the second year of a 4/16 deal whereas Vassell is in the first year of a 5/135. Kings are currently hard capped at the first apron, and may value getting more cap flexibility with the "promising young player". However, Advantage Spurs.

Reed is a vastly superior prospect to Tre Jones. Tre is an expiring, and even if he were useful to SAC this season, he wouldn't be there next year. He's just an expiring salary filler. Advantage Rockets.

Adams and Green are just expiring salary filler. No need to think about them as anything else. No advantage to either team here.

Picks:

Spurs best picks to offer are best of ATL/SA 25, 26, 27. After that, I'd say best of DAL/MIN/SA 2030 and then Best of SA/SAC 31 and MIN 31.

Rockets have PHX 27 Unprotected which is pretty juicy, best of HOU/BKN 27, and Best of DAL/PHX 29. If they put those three on the table, accounting for natural variance I'd say those are just about as good as SA's. Where we have the advantage is we can offer the better pick in 25 and 26 if a quicker pick were a priority to SAC.

If it comes down to Vassell + filler versus Cam/Reed + filler, and the picks are a wash, it will depend on whether or not SAC wants Devin's long term salary. It also depends on whether SAC views this as a rebuild or a retool. If they are rebuilding completely, they won't want Devin's salary and age versus Reed/Cam. If they are retooling, it more than likely favors the Spurs.

The two teams competing offers are closers than most Spurs fans would want to admit, IMO.

Originally Posted by RC_Drunkford

Fox is also from Texas and his wife went to high school in San Antonio

Wow, didn't know that. Sounds like a great fit then both on the court and off the court.

Originally Posted by scott

Overlooked point. I too am from San Antonio, and there is a zero percent chance I'd voluntarily move back to hole Texas

Come on, we only had 27 days of 100+ this year. Though missed having one in mid October by 1 degree.

LOL Christmas Eve and the trees still have half their leaves. I remember when they used to lose all their leaves in November instead of January.

Originally Posted by scott

Let's compare.

Vassell is a vastly superior player to Whitmore, but Cam is in the second year of a 4/16 deal whereas Vassell is in the first year of a 5/135. Kings are currently hard capped at the first apron, and may value getting more cap flexibility with the "promising young player". However, Advantage Spurs.

Reed is a vastly superior prospect to Tre Jones. Tre is an expiring, and even if he were useful to SAC this season, he wouldn't be there next year. He's just an expiring salary filler. Advantage Rockets.

Adams and Green are just expiring salary filler. No need to think about them as anything else. No advantage to either team here.

Picks:

Spurs best picks to offer are best of ATL/SA 25, 26, 27. After that, I'd say best of DAL/MIN/SA 2030 and then Best of SA/SAC 31 and MIN 31.

Rockets have PHX 27 Unprotected which is pretty juicy, best of HOU/BKN 27, and Best of DAL/PHX 29. If they put those three on the table, accounting for natural variance I'd say those are just about as good as SA's. Where we have the advantage is we can offer the better pick in 25 and 26 if a quicker pick were a priority to SAC.

If it comes down to Vassell + filler versus Cam/Reed + filler, and the picks are a wash, it will depend on whether or not SAC wants Devin's long term salary. It also depends on whether SAC views this as a rebuild or a retool. If they are rebuilding completely, they won't want Devin's salary and age versus Reed/Cam. If they are retooling, it more than likely favors the Spurs.

The two teams competing offers are closers than most Spurs fans would want to admit, IMO.

Excellent post. The only thing to add is that a retool vs a rebuild seems more like given that they have Sabonis/DD/Murray (who’s having a rough year)/Monk. There could be a mass firesale, but that doesn’t seem likely to me