Game Thread: Spurs @ Celtics - Wed. 2/12/2025 -- 6:00pm CST (2:00am RIGA; 2:00pm Hawaii)

[scott]

Best places for Vassell (or at least places most likely to be willing to give up something useful for Vassell):
1. Milwaukee - terrible front office, desperate, want to keep Giannis, can potential sell them on having an "up-and-coming young star just having a down year" to pair with Dame in the backcourt and give more spacing for Giannis; can potentially ask for Portis if he picks up his player option +/- picks
2. Detroit - have lots of young guys who can't shoot (Ron Holland, Ausar Thompson), can pair with Cade in the backcourt and run a Cade-Vassell-Holland-Thompson-C lineup with equal parts shooting and rim pressure; would ask for Tobias Harris (expires in 2026) + picks

Best places to move Keldon Johnson:
...
...
Phoenix for Micic and Cody Martin and some second rounders? Don't know if I want to make Phoenix that much worse since Houston owns their picks.
Bulls? See if they're willing to do Vuc for a couple seconds. Otherwise Huerter is completely terrible but gets you off that salary a year earlier.

I'm glad you brought up Harris. His terrible contract in Philly has kind of put a stink on him, but he fits that rebounding-wing-who-can-defend-and-shoot archetype that we need. He's a little undersized, but still grades out 90+ percentile in Crafted Defensive Rebound Quality, 75+ percentile in Crafted DPM and 75+ percentile in Crafted Shooting Quality (and a career .366 3P shooter).

There aren't a lot of guys who are solid in all three criteria. Some of our forum favorites like Naz and Aldama grade significantly lower in Rebounding Quality and DPM.

[daslicer]

You're not wrong. But at least he sent the message, one way or another, whether gracious or not, that things were not ok when they were not ok.

Our guys act like they would love having a Swaggy P around.


Edit: They are young, but still. Somebody get mad. And dead-serious.

Kobe was fake and was for the cameras. He cried and ed when he didn't have a stacked team evident when he made that video insulting the Lakers for not trading Bynum for Kidd during the summer of 2007. There was the other time where he intentionally clowned Jeremy Lin and a bunch of Lakers during a staged practice in front of cameras to make himself look good during the '14-'15 season. At the time the Lakers were 6-16 and would be inspired to finish the season with a great record of 21-61 courtesy of Kobe letting them know he wouldn't tolerate their behavior.

I'm not bothered by the way this team acted before the Celtics game. If it was such an issue CP3 would have stepped in but he didn't. This is a young team, and they have their own ritual of warming up. The Warriors during their championship years use to act like this Spurs team did during their pre-game warmups and they won 4 les lol. My point is there is no clear way to act.

I think the Spurs were serious about winning this game even though you may not feel like that due to their pre-game warmup video. Spurs fought back in this game but the Celtics even though they were shorthanded are a great team. They have that Championship DNA much like the Duncan Spurs had during their le years that they could win games with 1 of the big 3 sitting out against average to below average teams. The Celtics are the same way, and the Spurs are unfortunately right now not an above average team that can compete with them.

Also, they don't act like this all the time I was courtside at the Hornet-Spurs game a few days ago and didn't see this team horse playing during pre-game warmup and shoot around.

If you want to talk about a guy who was serious about wining but wasn't fake well that guy is in your avatar. He also led by example and didn't berate his teammates or embarrass them like Kobe did for personal gain. This type of leadership worked because the rest of the team saw how serious he was about winning and fell in line.

[tbdog]

I'm still high on Vassell. But he is now is playing out of position. The offense philosophy is out of whack since the trade. Vassell isn't a stand in a corner type of player. You gotta run him off curls.

Also why are we not seeing a steady diet of Fox and Wemby pick n rolls?

[lefty]

I hate it when people use the example of Kobe as having a serious business-like at ude. Kobe was by far the most selfish self-centered player I have seen in my life. He was a player who was concerned with his stats first and then winning second. He is the same guy who sabotaged Shaq in the '04 Finals simply because he wanted to get Finals MVP.

This tbh

[SupremeGuy]

Young team gon' young team.

Maybe it's best they all work through this together and at least keep a good vibe.

I dunno. Comes down to Wemby. I'd rather him see good vibes at least. lol

We have too many mediocre players and they're all just in each other's way.

[RC_Drunkford]

Jordan McLaughlin and Bismack Biyombo gonna make their Spurs debuts in garbage time.

[Ice009]

Man who gaf, steph the only one with heart in this team

Castle benched you mitch

I didn't watch the game (glad I didn't), decided to read the game thread instead . I can't believe they're doing this to him.

A comment Steph made at the start of the season keep echoing through my head. He said it'll be fun to play with Victor for the next couple of years (at the time, I was thinking, what do you mean a couple of years. I thought it was a slip of the tongue). I think he's out of here if they keep doing this to him.

Poor Fox, requesting to be part of this

I feel super bad for De'Aaron.

CP3 has erased all of his goodwill. that guy.

We should have known he would. He always does this in every stop he's been at. The fans end up hating him. He's done it early in his SA stop. I don't think he's head coaching material either. He'll lose the team. He's no Chauncy Billups. As I said, he's really showed his selfishness putting himself ahead of the team. I don't care how hyper compe ive he is, he's selfish.

Was the return we got from Boston in that Derrick White trade fair value?

Looking back at it, probably. I bet Derrick is happy as to be out of there, though. At least we did right by him. I also read that Boston is Derrick's dad's favourite team. It's great of the Spurs always helping other teams. Send out Kawhi to win a Championship, send out D White to win a Championship.

vassell dont deserve to start.

None of these guys do except Steph, Victor, and Fox, yet only one of the two is starting.

CP3 with 28 minutes and 5 points, Castle 20 minutes with 18 points

Wow, I can't believe Castle is still now producing in less minutes. Looks like he's still playing his ass off which is the sign of a really good player.
How did Steph play overall? I'm shocked that he only got 20 minutes if he was playing that well. What is going on. Are they trying to tank, but that also doesn't make sense as they're still playing Victor and Fox. Is just sounds like inept coaching.

I hate it when people use the example of Kobe as having a serious business-like at ude. Kobe was by far the most selfish self-centered player I have seen in my life. He was a player who was concerned with his stats first and then winning second. He is the same guy who sabotaged Shaq in the '04 Finals simply because he wanted to get Finals MVP.

I think Kobe was deluded a bit thinking he can get his stats AND win. I don't think he was going for his stats over wins, or was he? To me if felt like he thought he can get his stats and that would lead to the win. I always thought he was a bit irrational/crazy. I also think he thought other players he deemed inferior shouldn't be taking shots over himself, so he took the shots instead. I don't think he was only out there for stats at the expense of wins? I don't know, maybe I am remembering it all wrong as I stopped watching Kobe around 2011, and probably my memory isn't clear enough on the period between Shaq and Pau.

[RC_Drunkford]

Looking back at it, probably. I be Derrick is happy as to be out of there, though. At least we did right by him. I also read that Boston is Derrick's dad's favourite team. It's great of the Spurs always helping other teams. Send out Kawhi to win a Championship, send out D White to win a Championship.

Derrick literally said being traded from the Spurs was the best thing that ever happened to him

"Det culture"

[The Truth #6]

CP came here to hoop. Playing time. He likes to teach as well. But he's here because he got playing time not trying to win. At this point the goals no longer overlap. But let's make a big trade to start winning and then not really go with it? Confusing as always what they're doing.

[Manu-of-steel]

Keep CP3 on the bench, that I think he can be effective there. Slowing the game. But we need Fox and Steph in the starting 5, a fast-paced team.

[daslicer]

I think Kobe was deluded a bit thinking he can get his stats AND win. I don't think he was going for his stats over wins, or was he? To me if felt like he thought he can get his stats and that would lead to the win. I always thought he was a bit irrational/crazy. I also think he thought other players he deemed inferior shouldn't be taking shots over himself, so he took the shots instead. I don't think he was only out there for stats at the expense of wins? I don't know, maybe I am remembering it all wrong as I stopped watching Kobe around 2011, and probably my memory isn't clear enough on the period between Shaq and Pau.

Kobe was about stats first and winning second. He had the mindset that for him to be happy he had to get his numbers and be the number 1 guy and only then could he focus on winning. This was the biggest reason he hated playing with Shaq despite winning 3 les with him which was Shaq got the credit as the number 1 guy and that drove him crazy to the point where he forced him out. They were other issues those two had with each other, but it ultimately came down to Kobe wanting to be the number 1 guy and Shaq being in his way to prevent that from happening.

Kobe thought stupidly when he traded Shaq that if he started averaging 30 or more points a game that he would instantly be labeled as the best player in the league. That obviously didn't happen because the media would point out to Kobe when he wanted to be labeled as the best player in the league that the Lakers had to win and just scoring a lot of points wasn't going to get him that respect. This is when Kobe started to have meltdowns about not having enough help to get wins despite him creating his own situation. He only cared about winning when the media started to disrespect him and not consider him the best player in the league.

[Ice009]

Kobe was about stats first and winning second. He had the mindset that for him to be happy he had to get his numbers and be the number 1 guy and only then could he focus on winning. This was the biggest reason he hated playing with Shaq despite winning 3 les with him which was Shaq got the credit as the number 1 guy and that drove him crazy to the point where he forced him out. They were other issues those two had with each other, but it ultimately came down to Kobe wanting to be the number 1 guy and Shaq being in his way to prevent that from happening.

Kobe thought stupidly when he traded Shaq that if he started averaging 30 or more points a game that he would instantly be labeled as the best player in the league. That obviously didn't happen because the media would point out to Kobe when he wanted to be labeled as the best player in the league that the Lakers had to win and just scoring a lot of points wasn't going to get him that respect. This is when Kobe started to have meltdowns about not having enough help to get wins despite him creating his own situation. He only cared about winning when the media started to disrespect him and not consider him the best player in the league.

Yeah, wow, I can't say for sure that was his mindset, but you very well may be correct. It takes me back, and the way you've described how it played out, that seems to fit with what his thought process may have been during that time. Maybe that is exactly what he was thinking, that if he averaged 30+ ppg, he's be labeled as the best player in the NBA, but luckily the media called him out for his record. I didn't pay much attention to the Lakers when Shaq was traded, but what you said may very well be what his mindset was then. I only started paying attention to them again when the traded for Pau Gasol.

[daslicer]

Yeah, wow, I can't say for sure that was his mindset, but you very well may be correct. It takes me back, and the way you've described how it played out, that seems to fit with what his thought process may have been during that time. Maybe that is exactly what he was thinking, that if he averaged 30+ ppg, he's be labeled as the best player in the NBA, but luckily the media called him out for his record. I didn't pay much attention to the Lakers when Shaq was traded, but what you said may very well be what his mindset was then. I only started paying attention to them again when the traded for Pau Gasol.

Back then 30 points was what the top perimeter players such as Kobe, AI, Tmac wanted to average because that was what Michael Jordan averaged who they grew up watching. The mentality back then by all 3 of those guys was if they could average 30 then they would be on the same level as Jordan. Obviously, it didn't work out that way for either of those 3 guys.

[ffadicted]

This is exemplary of a key part of the problem. Teams that don't take care of business during games should not be in this kind of mood:

They should look ready to commit murder since they are a losing team.

Not downtrodden. Not low-attidude. Not hopeless. But damned sure not silly either. It's annoying and stupid.


They should be moving as if they have a mission to execute. Kome would flame this entire roster, and he'd be right.


It's time to cut this kind of out. One can be outwardly, ostensibly determined and businesslike during work-hours and still be family.

It's even worse given that it's two literal scrubs doing it too, one that doesn't play, and one that hurts the team when he does. SMH

[Ice009]

It's even worse given that it's two literal scrubs doing it too, one that doesn't play, and one that hurts the team when he does. SMH

Yeah, that's not good. One guy that is in the rotation that shouldn't be, and the other and end of bench player.

[scott]

CP came here to hoop. Playing time. He likes to teach as well. But he's here because he got playing time not trying to win. At this point the goals no longer overlap. But let's make a big trade to start winning and then not really go with it? Confusing as always what they're doing.

Worth noting, that after last night CP3 is now officially tied with Jason Kidd for 2nd all time in career steals. I think part of the "coming here to hoop" for Chris was to get the playing team required to get these records (2nd in assists and now about to be 2nd in steals).

Now that he's got the steals essentially locked up, sit him down over the ASB and tell him it's time for him to move to the bench, and if he can't do that then we will buy him out and he can find another team.

[gilmor2002]

Kobe was fake and was for the cameras. He cried and ed when he didn't have a stacked team evident when he made that video insulting the Lakers for not trading Bynum for Kidd during the summer of 2007. There was the other time where he intentionally clowned Jeremy Lin and a bunch of Lakers during a staged practice in front of cameras to make himself look good during the '14-'15 season. At the time the Lakers were 6-16 and would be inspired to finish the season with a great record of 21-61 courtesy of Kobe letting them know he wouldn't tolerate their behavior.

I'm not bothered by the way this team acted before the Celtics game. If it was such an issue CP3 would have stepped in but he didn't. This is a young team, and they have their own ritual of warming up. The Warriors during their championship years use to act like this Spurs team did during their pre-game warmups and they won 4 les lol. My point is there is no clear way to act.

I think the Spurs were serious about winning this game even though you may not feel like that due to their pre-game warmup video. Spurs fought back in this game but the Celtics even though they were shorthanded are a great team. They have that Championship DNA much like the Duncan Spurs had during their le years that they could win games with 1 of the big 3 sitting out against average to below average teams. The Celtics are the same way, and the Spurs are unfortunately right now not an above average team that can compete with them.

Also, they don't act like this all the time I was courtside at the Hornet-Spurs game a few days ago and didn't see this team horse playing during pre-game warmup and shoot around.

If you want to talk about a guy who was serious about wining but wasn't fake well that guy is in your avatar. He also led by example and didn't berate his teammates or embarrass them like Kobe did for personal gain. This type of leadership worked because the rest of the team saw how serious he was about winning and fell in line.

Celtics has JT which was head and shoulders above anyone Spurs has.. even without JB they can easily dismantle Spurs with role players like Derrick White and Porzingis.

[daslicer]

Celtics has JT which was head and shoulders above anyone Spurs has.. even without JB they can easily dismantle Spurs with role players like Derrick White and Porzingis.

I agree the Celtics are like a perfect operating machine and they have so many weapons to deal with. Right now, I can't think of a team that can beat them in a 7-game series in either conference. I think the Nuggets would be the worst matchup for them simply because of Jokic.

[RC_Drunkford]

I agree the Celtics are like a perfect operating machine and they have so many weapons to deal with. Right now, I can't think of a team that can beat them in a 7-game series in either conference. I think the Nuggets would be the worst matchup for them simply because of Jokic.

that's what the Spurs used to be...

[daslicer]

that's what the Spurs used to be...

I agree.

[Extra Stout]

I don’t see why the Spurs need to bench CP3. He is at worst their fourth-best player. Just start a three-guard lineup of CP3, Fox, and Castle. So what if they’re undersized? It’s not as though Vassell plays any defense anyway. Then arrange the rotations so that at least 2 out of those 3 are on the floor for as much of the game as possible. Vassell can have Keldon’s minutes, since KJ doesn’t belong in the rotation at all.