2025 NBA Draft

[rascal]

CMB and Fleming would be a nice haul from the draft if outside the top 4.

Move Sochan out of the starting lineup and play CMB at SF.

[exstatic]

CMB and Fleming would be a nice haul from the draft if outside the top 4.

Move Sochan out of the starting lineup and play CMB at SF.

News update: Sochan hasn’t started in months. Film at eleven.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

CMB at SF

[spurraider21]

CMB at SF

may as well slide sochan down to SG while we're at it

[John B]

News update: Sochan hasn’t started in months. Film at eleven.

Also from the backup Center position please, unless against small ball, emphasis on “small.”

[scott]

McNeeley's sucked enough where I am not remotely comfortable taking him with a top 10 pick. His value is so highly leveraged to his shooting where I'm very uncomfortable taking that risk. Now that we have an entire season sample on him, the single biggest worry about him is actually his functional athleticism. He is a legitimate 6'8" guy who somehow shoots < 50% at the rim and can't generate defensive events to save his life. His FT rate and rebounding imply that he's got good physicality, but I do not necessarily see that in the few times when I'm watching him.

NBA 1st round draft picks in the past 15 years: <55% at the rim, <2 STL%, <2 BLK%, 6'6"+
This filter is actually pretty generous to McNeeley, as he's currently sitting at 49% at the rim, 1 STL%, 0.9 BLK% - it takes into account UConn typically depressing stock rates for their players.

Looking at just freshmen:
Jalen Hood-Schifino
Wendell Moore
Christian Braun
Tony Snell

And Christian Braun was not considered a draft prospect his freshman or sop re year. I get small players who have trouble finishing at the rim - it's sort of a concern for me, but it's at least understandable given their size. But a big 6'8" guy who has that much trouble is a huge red flag. At the next level, I'm concerned that McNeeley might have the aggressiveness to drive on a closeout, but not the functional athleticism to necessarily convert, which decreases his actual gravity as a shooter. And if he can't maximize his gravity, he's pretty useless because he doesn't do much else at a high level. Would not draft with a top 10 pick, might consider with serious reservations with Atlanta's pick in the mid-teens.

Dude, always loves your posts. Thank you for your contributions.

What tool do you use for these filters?

[scott]

To me they're on completely different tiers as prospects, and stylistically very different. Fleming is a big wing, while CMB is a mobile big.

Drafting Fleming and getting a shooting 3 and D wing like NAW is the easiest path to being a good playoff team. Fox, Castle, NAW, Fleming, Wemby. Easily attainable lineup that barely requires any luck to build. Shooting at multiple positions, no real defensive weak spots, two attacking guards who can get to the rim. It'll work well against a vast majority of teams. Fleming's shown me enough as a shooter that I buy him at least as a medium volume spot up guy.

Where CMB gives you an advantage is with small fast teams that can rotate quickly and prominently feature a unicorn big. With unicorn bigs, especially skinny ones, the optimal defender for them is a physical long defender that can win with strength. See the success that PJ Tucker has had against Durant. CMB is a very similar build, but bigger, longer, more athletic, and with better defensive instincts. This makes him a really good theoretical counter to skilled big guys with a skinny build - Durant, Chet Holmgren, and...Victor Wembanyama. Additionally, with fast teams that can close out fast, decision making is at a premium as you need to be able to make plays against a rapidly rotating defense. Additionally, the primary weakness of these smaller teams is that they sacrifice bulk and strength. If you have a skilled mobile big that can attack, you can exploit that lack of size to get to the rim. These are things that I don't have as much confidence in Fleming to do. That's why from the beginning of the year I've said that CMB is an anti-OKC weapon. It's way tougher from a roster construction standpoint, but the payoff deep in the playoffs especially against elite teams is greater.

Can NAW really hold up as a full-time SF? Seems undersized and more suited as a guard to me, defensively. I haven't watched him a ton, but seems like if you started him next to Castle you'd be putting one of them at an immediate disadvantage of having to guard the opposing SF, many of whom can use their size to get an advantage? Maybe Steph can use his strength to hold up and he takes the SF while NAW is your primary perimeter defender?

[scott]

CMB and Fleming would be a nice haul from the draft if outside the top 4.

Move Sochan out of the starting lineup and play CMB at SF.

Don't see CMB as a SF... but I like the idea of taking both Fleming and CMB. Address the PF weakness by doubling up there.

[SpursBills]

Dude, always loves your posts. Thank you for your contributions.

What tool do you use for these filters?

https://www.barttorvik.com/#

Have fun!

[SpursBills]

Can NAW really hold up as a full-time SF? Seems undersized and more suited as a guard to me, defensively. I haven't watched him a ton, but seems like if you started him next to Castle you'd be putting one of them at an immediate disadvantage of having to guard the opposing SF, many of whom can use their size to get an advantage? Maybe Steph can use his strength to hold up and he takes the SF while NAW is your primary perimeter defender?

I don’t think so, he’s smaller than I’d like, but he’s probably the only one who’s readily available without sacrificing a ton. I’d probably try and get him as a stopgap and then transition him to a bench role as you upgrade your team. Ideally you get young KD, but short of that I’d be looking at guys like Jaden McDaniels, old KD, MPJ, etc. Nobody that’s currently readily available without either paying out the nose for a trade or paying the player a ton of money.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

may as well slide sochan down to SG while we're at it

Well we already tried him at PG. What could go wrong.

[Dejounte]

McNeeley's sucked enough where I am not remotely comfortable taking him with a top 10 pick. His value is so highly leveraged to his shooting where I'm very uncomfortable taking that risk. Now that we have an entire season sample on him, the single biggest worry about him is actually his functional athleticism. He is a legitimate 6'8" guy who somehow shoots < 50% at the rim and can't generate defensive events to save his life. His FT rate and rebounding imply that he's got good physicality, but I do not necessarily see that in the few times when I'm watching him.

NBA 1st round draft picks in the past 15 years: <55% at the rim, <2 STL%, <2 BLK%, 6'6"+
This filter is actually pretty generous to McNeeley, as he's currently sitting at 49% at the rim, 1 STL%, 0.9 BLK% - it takes into account UConn typically depressing stock rates for their players.

Looking at just freshmen:
Jalen Hood-Schifino
Wendell Moore
Christian Braun
Tony Snell

And Christian Braun was not considered a draft prospect his freshman or sop re year. I get small players who have trouble finishing at the rim - it's sort of a concern for me, but it's at least understandable given their size. But a big 6'8" guy who has that much trouble is a huge red flag. At the next level, I'm concerned that McNeeley might have the aggressiveness to drive on a closeout, but not the functional athleticism to necessarily convert, which decreases his actual gravity as a shooter. And if he can't maximize his gravity, he's pretty useless because he doesn't do much else at a high level. Would not draft with a top 10 pick, might consider with serious reservations with Atlanta's pick in the mid-teens.

Ha so me putting McNeely in the bust category tier was on point

[SpursBills]

Ha so me putting McNeely in the bust category tier was on point

I personally think so. Took a while for the numbers to catch up to eye test, but we got there in the end

Maybe I’m still not ready to use the word ‘bust’ quite yet - definitely overrated by mainstream though

[BackHome]

That is the problem when you don’t get draft picks in the lottery you end up looking at a decent role player or a Fat under sized slow Center in Queen or a Shorter version of Sochan in CMB

[exstatic]

Well,I guess if ATL won’t help us out, we’ll help ourselves. Swapped 8/9 positions with CHI tonight.

[onechance87]

Well,I guess if ATL won’t help us out, we’ll help ourselves. Swapped 8/9 positions with CHI tonight.

we are coming flagg

[rascal]

Why is Fleming so low in several mock drafts? He looks to be a great fit for the Spurs.

[onechance87]

Why is Fleming so low in several mock drafts? He looks to be a great fit for the Spurs.

think cause he plays against alot of small program teams.

[spurraider21]

Why is Fleming so low in several mock drafts? He looks to be a great fit for the Spurs.

he'll probably be a riser especially after all the athletic testing and measurements

[onechance87]

Jermemiah fears,Asa newell and collin murray boyles all had good games moving there stock up.
Lets see what fleming and mcneely do tommrow after looking bad last couple of games.

[rascal]

think cause he plays against alot of small program teams.

He's going to be a steal for some team. Hope the spurs don't sleep on him. I like him more than several players inside the current mocked top ten.

[SpursBills]

He's going to be a steal for some team. Hope the spurs don't sleep on him. I like him more than several players inside the current mocked top ten.

Spurs are coming out of this draft with McNeeley and Danny Wolf and you're going to like it

[heyheymymy]

Fleming is at a pretty small school but like others say he won't hide at the combine. If he is who we think he is he will blow up after combine and workouts regardless of NCAA or March Madness prominence

[mudyez]

Spurs are coming out of this draft with McNeeley and Danny Wolf and you're going to like it

There is still the dream of jumping up but if not I'd be ok with those two.

[objective]

My impressions from hearing various podcasts etc is that people think Fleming also has very little on ball juice and is just a 3 & D athlete who might not have the feet or mobility to hang with ball handling wings at the NBA level, could be best at guarding bigger players.

Those guys are valuable on NBA rosters, but there's only so much plus value there. Look at Tari Eason: creates events and hustles, fast breaks, and while he defends people don't think of him as a #1 lockdown guy (Dunc'd On very recently covered him and was pointed on him not being a #1) ....

And another guy drafted at age 21 ... And he's a good bench piece drafted 17th. His next contract doesn't look too ominous.

That's kind of the thing with Fleming. He could go 17, be impressive in summer league, be a good bench players and fill in starter.