The OKC Observatio

[Atl Spur]

They have one this year too. And they’re not winning the championship. One team doing it in 75 years of nba history is not much of a thing to copy and expect it to work. Denvers other players have been ting the bed too. So idgaf that OKCs second best player is struggling. He’s struggles bc the playoffs is more physical and teams get to rough them up more. Chet is a role player at this point. He hasn’t proven he is anything more than that. Denver is just playing very physical basketball. That’s the way you deal with these smaller teams in the playoffs. It’s why we traded George Hill for Kawhi. We were too small as a team and we needed bigger stronger and more physical players. We got a taller SG in Danny, a legit 6’7 SF and we also got rid of small ass Blair and put in 7ft Tiago. Size typically wins championships.

Fox 6”3 lightning fast, Harper 6”6 ish 215. , castle 6”7 ish 220 ; heights & weights sound similar to golden state during their reign!

[couchman]

I’ve been puzzled by how they use Chet.
He’s their second most talented player but he’s just a spacer on most offensive possessions.
I guess that’s what happens when you’re injured a lot and the team succeeds and get accustomed to playing without you.

[RC_Drunkford]

I don’t think the Spurs are building a roster on a 3-guard line up. We just have a 3-guard rotation. What we need to add is a 3-forward rotation and a back up big. Our 3 best players should be better than OKCs 3 best players in the long run, so now it comes down to who has the stronger supporting cast.

[Atl Spur]

If Harper is good as advertised, we have a big time chess piece no matter the perceived redundancy proclaimed by media etc…

[LeBowen]

OKC's size issue isn't even about guards, but about frontcourt.
Gordon bullies Chet and Jokic bullies Hartenstein. Guards have nothing to do with it.

Nuggets duo is averaging 23.9rpg, Thunder's is at 19.8.
10 extra OREB in the series for the Nuggets.
Might seem insignificant over 6 games, but Jokic and even Gordon require an extra body on them and create space that way.

That's why I'm adamant about Spurs needing a PF similar to Gordon.

[KobesAchilles]

OKC's size issue isn't even about guards, but about frontcourt.
Gordon bullies Chet and Jokic bullies Hartenstein. Guards have nothing to do with it.

Nuggets duo is averaging 23.9rpg, Thunder's is at 19.8.
10 extra OREB in the series for the Nuggets.
Might seem insignificant over 6 games, but Jokic and even Gordon require an extra body on them and create space that way.

That's why I'm adamant about Spurs needing a PF similar to Gordon.

One could argue though that having more size would help with their rebounding problem. I mean I know that people think that bc guards are similar heights then it should translate but it doesn’t really work that way. They get bullied in the playoffs by bigger and stronger athletes. Jokic is bigger and stronger than Chet. Gordon plays like a bully and is stronger than every player on OKC. MPJ is 6’10 and all it takes his for him to score 10 whole points and this series would be over. I mean OKC can’t even make the Nuggets pay for playing Braun and Murray together as a backcourt they are so discombobulated with Denver playing physical. When you have a 3 guard rotation you end up playing finness ball. And Wemby already plays that way offensively. If Sochan could shoot the ing ball this really wouldn’t be an issue for us but he never will be able to shoot on a high enough volume to help us that we are kinda ed.

I mean Castle and Fox should be a good enough backcourt to ring alongside Wemby and Giannis. TBH Sochan has ed up the whole roster bc I’m not even sure what to do with that spot. We need a PF and SF and not a guard. If we draft Harper we still need a PF. If we trade for Giannis we still need a SF.

The best play (if you’re pro keep the pick) would be to sign Collins and sign LaRavia and sign Kornet. The Spurs don’t extend Sochan and let him play out his contract and trade Vassell. That would give the Spurs the starters of Fox, Harper, Champ, Collins, and Wemby. Our bench would be Castle, KJ, LaRavia, Sochan, and Kornet. And Barnes would be in the fold too. That’s real depth and should be a playoff team. But I’m not sure bc the Spurs still haven’t hired any real assistant coaches amd haven’t gone after a better shooting coach and better player development coaches so…

[LeBowen]

One could argue though that having more size would help with their rebounding problem. I mean I know that people think that bc guards are similar heights then it should translate but it doesn’t really work that way. They get bullied in the playoffs by bigger and stronger athletes. Jokic is bigger and stronger than Chet. Gordon plays like a bully and is stronger than every player on OKC.

We're getting into whataboutisms, but I don't think having a legit wing instead of one of the guards would've helped them that much.
Clippers had enough size, but Jokic is a guy that can't be beaten at his own game. Zubac defended him better than anyone since the Lakers were allowed to beat him up in the bubble and it didn't help.

I mean OKC can’t even make the Nuggets pay for playing Braun and Murray together as a backcourt they are so discombobulated with Denver playing physical. When you have a 3 guard rotation you end up playing finness ball. And Wemby already plays that way offensively. If Sochan could shoot the ing ball this really wouldn’t be an issue for us but he never will be able to shoot on a high enough volume to help us that we are kinda ed.

Braun has been the difference make in this series, imo. Everyone expected others to do what they're doing, but Braun has been great on SGA and is playing really physical.
He's actually at 7.3rpg, rebounding isn't just about size.

Denver also plays 3 guard lineups with Russ in place of MPJ/Gordon and OKC can't punish them even with size advantage during those stretches.

I mean Castle and Fox should be a good enough backcourt to ring alongside Wemby and Giannis. TBH Sochan has ed up the whole roster bc I’m not even sure what to do with that spot. We need a PF and SF and not a guard. If we draft Harper we still need a PF. If we trade for Giannis we still need a SF.

Jeremy obviously needs to go if he can't develop a respectable jumpshot, but it's not his fault.
Whoever had the final say during the season (I'm not sure it was Mitch) was to blame. Regardless of how everyone performed, hierarchy stayed the same whenever we had a full roster.
Champagnie isn't a high end starter, but he was just what we needed and what we'll need again this season.
After Devin and Jeremy went down he finally got reasonable minutes, had a 20 game stretch with 30mpg, averaged 14ppg, 5rpg and 38% from 3pt on almost 8 attempts while being a neutral or maybe even slightly positive defender.
Then those two recovered and he lost his minutes, regardless of his great play. Had a couple more games when he got the chance again, but to no avail and then he fell off, lost all of his confidence.

And that's honestly the most annoying thing for me, double standards based on pick number and contract.

The best play (if you’re pro keep the pick) would be to sign Collins and sign LaRavia and sign Kornet. The Spurs don’t extend Sochan and let him play out his contract and trade Vassell. That would give the Spurs the starters of Fox, Harper, Champ, Collins, and Wemby. Our bench would be Castle, KJ, LaRavia, Sochan, and Kornet. And Barnes would be in the fold too. That’s real depth and should be a playoff team. But I’m not sure bc the Spurs still haven’t hired any real assistant coaches amd haven’t gone after a better shooting coach and better player development coaches so…

I more or less agree with the exception that Barnes has to start because he's our only elite shooter and is always healthy.

Keldon, Jeremy for Collins. He probably won't get an extension from Utah and they could take a flyer on Jeremy. They forced Kessler to take 5 3pts per game, he'd surely help the tank. They could maybe flip Keldon.
I'm not sure Nets have interest in Devin, maybe if we move down to #19 or #26 from #14. I'm not a fan of Cam, but whatever.

Fox/Harper
Castle/Harper
Barnes/Champagnie
Collins/Cam Johnson
Wemby/Kornet

That's a perfectly functional team with 3 guard rotation, 4 good to great wing shooters who are all 6'8 with Collins being able to play as a small ball C.
Harper/Castle/Champ/Cam/Collins would be as close to positionless basketball as it gets and would run opposing benches off the floor.

I don't think more FRPs should be given up until we see what we have. We haven't seen enough of Fox/Wemby together.
Playoffs are a must, if the team is rolling at the deadline and someone's available, it would be easy enough to make a move.

As for Giannis option, we'd need a couple more trades for high end role players because anything less than making the finals would be a failure in every Giannis season.
After those moves we'd have nothing left meaning we wouldn't have any room for error. up an all-in summer and it's over. That's why I don't think it happens, especially with Mitch in charge. Would've hired a proven coach if they were interested in skipping steps.

[Raven]

i don't consider jwill and dort as guards

[exstatic]

i don't consider jwill and dort as guards

That’s nice. They’re both shorter than Steph Castle. Dort’s LISTED height is 6’4”, which would be in shoes.

[Atl Spur]

i don't consider jwill and dort as guards

What are they?

[mystargtr34]

J Dub is absolutely a forward to me. He’s huge. Dort is a guard/forward.

[LeBowen]

Jalen Williams
6' 4.50'' barefoot
8' 9.50'' reach
7' 2.25'' wingspan
209 lbs

Castle
6' 5.50''
8' 6.00''
6' 9.00''
210

Harper
6’ 4.50"
8’ 6.00"
6’ 10.50"
213

[RC_Drunkford]

I absolutely want us to trade for a starting PF. Kinda like the idea to somehow snatch PJ Washington and Gafford from Dallas with 14 and matching salaries going to the Mavs. We‘d be Playoff team immediately.

Sochan is close to losing his rotation spot completely tbh. No matter how you construct the line ups, if the Spurs add a PF he‘s basically unplayable unless our back up big shoots 3s

[rjv]

side note. chet is meh against jokic. wemby can go toe to toe with the joker. if wemby is a Thunder, OKC is already getting ready for Ant Man.

[Obstructed_View]

Once again, if we draft Sengun instead of Primo, we're not getting Wemby.

Doesn't make drafting Primo a good decision.

[poopbox]

Has anyone noticed the 9+ guards they have on their roster? It’s funny how the media/talking heads want the spurs to think passing on a star potential guard isn’t a good fit! If no knock your socks off trade is available you take Harper with no hesitation. Okc keeps drafting guards and trying to create the very dynamic we have the opportunity to place on the floor next year.

They have an actual coaching staff who knows how to coach players. We have Brent Brown

Those 9+ guards are also on the verge of losing a playoff series to a team playing 6 or 7 players all of who are gassed from playing 40 minutes a game

You know who doesn't play a bunch of guards at the same time? The pacers and they easily punched their ticket to a conference finals after dismantling a number 1 seed

[spurraider21]

I absolutely want us to trade for a starting PF. Kinda like the idea to somehow snatch PJ Washington and Gafford from Dallas with 14 and matching salaries going to the Mavs. We‘d be Playoff team immediately.

Sochan is close to losing his rotation spot completely tbh. No matter how you construct the line ups, if the Spurs add a PF he‘s basically unplayable unless our back up big shoots 3s

mavs arent giving up both those guys for a single end of lottery pick. they basically gave 2 firsts for PJ and he's been good for them

[rjv]

Pacers start three players who are all 6'6" and under (Nesmith measured 1/4" taller than Castle without shoes at his combine). Nesmith played guard/forward at Vanderbilt. Nembhard and Halliburton were guards in college.

[KDKSpurs24]

They have one this year too. And they’re not winning the championship. One team doing it in 75 years of nba history is not much of a thing to copy and expect it to work. Denvers other players have been ting the bed too. So idgaf that OKCs second best player is struggling. He’s struggles bc the playoffs is more physical and teams get to rough them up more. Chet is a role player at this point. He hasn’t proven he is anything more than that. Denver is just playing very physical basketball. That’s the way you deal with these smaller teams in the playoffs. It’s why we traded George Hill for Kawhi. We were too small as a team and we needed bigger stronger and more physical players. We got a taller SG in Danny, a legit 6’7 SF and we also got rid of small ass Blair and put in 7ft Tiago. Size typically wins championships.

Boston’s struggles is not about size! First of all they weren’t even allowing a ton of points to the Magic or the Knicks in these playoffs. Defense has barely been an issue for them most of the time. It’s their offensive style of play. I hate the way they play. They pass up potentially good 2s to seek out 3s and it’s formed super bad habits for them. They have shots themselves out of those games due to this style. We wouldn’t have to ever worry about Fox, Castle and Harper forcing up too many 3s. They would definitely prefer to get to the rim. I do say we need a big defensive/rebounding PF, though.

[Atl Spur]

They have an actual coaching staff who knows how to coach players. We have Brent Brown

Those 9+ guards are also on the verge of losing a playoff series to a team playing 6 or 7 players all of who are gassed from playing 40 minutes a game

You know who doesn't play a bunch of guards at the same time? The pacers and they easily punched their ticket to a conference finals after dismantling a number 1 seed

Did they win a chip that I missed? Because Boston and Golden state has. Furthermore you may want to go check indiana starting lineup height/weight ( position le doesn’t matter ) and get back to the conversation

[Atl Spur]

Boston’s struggles is not about size! First of all they weren’t even allowing a ton of points to the Magic or the Knicks in these playoffs. Defense has barely been an issue for them most of the time. It’s their offensive style of play. I hate the way they play. They pass up potentially good 2s to seek out 3s and it’s formed super bad habits for them. They have shots themselves out of those games due to this style. We wouldn’t have to ever worry about Fox, Castle and Harper forcing up too many 3s. They would definitely prefer to get to the rim. I do say we need a big defensive/rebounding PF, though.

Someone watches & understands what’s going on I see nice post

[Atl Spur]

Pacers start three players who are all 6'6" and under (Nesmith measured 1/4" taller than Castle without shoes at his combine). Nesmith played guard/forward at Vanderbilt. Nembhard and Halliburton were guards in college.

He didn’t know you would fact check him….. thanks

[LeBowen]

Boston’s struggles is not about size! First of all they weren’t even allowing a ton of points to the Magic or the Knicks in these playoffs. Defense has barely been an issue for them most of the time. It’s their offensive style of play. I hate the way they play. They pass up potentially good 2s to seek out 3s and it’s formed super bad habits for them. They have shots themselves out of those games due to this style. We wouldn’t have to ever worry about Fox, Castle and Harper forcing up too many 3s. They would definitely prefer to get to the rim. I do say we need a big defensive/rebounding PF, though.

It's dumb to say it's all one player's fault, but Porzingis has been their biggest issue.
22mpg, 8ppg on 32/12/70 in these playoffs.

He was the final cherry on top that made their team game breaking with his spacing and rim protection, but right now there's something wrong with him.
Mazzulla finally decided to sit him in this last game and they played way better, even without Tatum.

[Atl Spur]

Jalen Williams
6' 4.50'' barefoot
8' 9.50'' reach
7' 2.25'' wingspan
209 lbs

Castle
6' 5.50''
8' 6.00''
6' 9.00''
210

Harper
6’ 4.50"
8’ 6.00"
6’ 10.50"
213

Looks about right.

[scott]

It's just down to their second best player ting the bed.
16ppg on 33/21/82, gameplan has nothing to do with his disappearence.
If anything, OKC's biggest issue has been that other than SGA noone can create , they have no bag as kids these days would say.
I still stand by what I said even before the playoffs began, Williams isn't worth the extension he'll ask for and he should be traded because after he signs that deal his trade value will drop.
The only systematic issue they have is Chet being reduced to a role player. Idk how much of it is on him, but he's an afterthought during most possessions.

Williams, Chet and a couple of picks for Giannis seems like as much of a no brainer as a trade can be.
SGA is their franchise player and they're on his timeline, not the Williams/Chet timeline.
And SGA is just 8 months younger than Fox who's preparing for retirement according to some spurstalk members.

The West is wide open and no contender other than OKC has a clear path to makin major improvements, then pairing SGA with Giannis would be their best shot to win multiple championships.

One other thing I'll add for consideration... a team chasing their first le might have a different approach to a team like the Spurs (one of the two winningest teams in league history, and Top 5 in number of les). OKC should be willing to go absolutely all out to bring that first chip to OKC. If that means trading Williams/Chet and your pick war chest for Giannis... you do it. The Spurs on the other hand can be more picky. If we were still chasing our first le, I'd be much more willing to send Castle and #2 for Giannis... but because we already have 5, I'm much more interested in playing the long game and setting ourselves up for a dynasty.