Pick #14 - Strategies

[The Truth #6]

I want to roll the dice on Fleming at 14. However, I'm preparing for that not to happen and hoping for Coward at least. Getting Denim for me would be disappointing.

[RC_Drunkford]

Fleming is not a playoff role player for this team. Can't face guard initiators nor protect the rim as the anchor. He is John Collins and PJ Washington a 4 in a helio offense. Useless in our system.

system? The last time this franchise had a system was 2018

We play fast. Fleming is great in transition. Fits perfectly and he's a hustle player with a 3-point shot, which we really need at the 4.

[RC_Drunkford]

It seems like Caruso was allowed to foul the crap out of him, though. Will they be letting other "guard" defenders do that to him next season? Did anyone try putting a guard on him during the regular season? I sort of watched the games, but didn't watch them closely. Just mostly had them playing in the background. Didn't they start of with Jaylin Williams guarding him? Who were the primary defenders on him for the series?

OKC did that once in the regular season and then went away from it. The main reason why this worked was because they were able to sag off Westbrook cause he can't shoot. The other problem was that Denver somehow forgot that one of the wings has to cut to the nail to just throw a high-low pass to Jokic so he can get a lay up. Add to that Gordon playing hobbled and MPJ playing with one arm and there you go.

[CGD]

Before Harper, I thought Demin would be the pick at 14 given the Giddy comp. Feels like that itch has been scratched now (I hope).

I’d be pleased with a wing, or a high upside project like Essengue.

[rankingtear]

system? The last time this franchise had a system was 2018

We play fast. Fleming is great in transition. Fits perfectly and he's a hustle player with a 3-point shot, which we really need at the 4.

All dears are great in transition.

[Dejounte]

Noa Essengue reminds me of Tayshaun Prince

people have to think where the physicality is going to come from if 1-5 is either our offensive engine guards who you can’t risk being too physical on defense because they’ll get in foul trouble or skinny Noa and Wemby? Our guy who we want to keep injury free? I don’t know why people want a skinny wing at the 4, tbh. It never made sense. Who would be our Dort or Caruso? This is also why I think Carter Bryant won’t work, and Ace never had a chance with us. Fleming is bulky and it might work.

[rankingtear]

Noa Essengue reminds me of Tayshaun Prince

people have to think where the physicality is going to come from if 1-5 is either our offensive engine guards who you can’t risk being too physical on defense because they’ll get in foul trouble or skinny Noa and Wemby? Our guy who we want to keep injury free? I don’t know why people want a skinny wing at the 4, tbh. It never made sense. Who would be our Dort or Caruso? This is also why I think Carter Bryant won’t work, and Ace never had a chance with us. Fleming is bulky and it might work.

Nobody wants a skinny wing at the 4, but it is important that the 4 man has to have enough on ball juice or volume shooting to punish centers in the perimeter.

[Dejounte]

The Spurs have been all about “setting the tone” defensively, which is why I think something’s got to give in a lineup with Fox, Harper, Castle, and Wemby. They will fill that fifth spot with someone who has a knack for defense, tbh. This was the reason Sochan was a starter up until the second half became a throwaway season + they needed a shooter for lineup synergy. With Castle being an improved shooter next year, and Harper probably a good one already, I think they’ll shoot for a defensive big.

[RC_Drunkford]

Nobody wants a skinny wing at the 4, but it is important that the 4 man has to have enough on ball juice or volume shooting to punish centers in the perimeter.

Fleming has shooting. Handles are definitely his weakness, but there's nothing that indicates he won't get better at dribbling.

[LeBowen]

[Dejounte]

Nobody wants a skinny wing at the 4, but it is important that the 4 man has to have enough on ball juice or volume shooting to punish centers in the perimeter.

skinny wings people have wanted at the 4: TMIII, Ace Bailey, Carter Bryant, Noa Essengue

[RC_Drunkford]

skinny wings people have wanted at the 4: TMIII, Ace Bailey, Carter Bryant, Noa Essengue

I don't think people want TMIII at the 4, rather the 3. Same with Carter Bryant.

[Dejounte]

I don't think people want TMIII at the 4, rather the 3. Same with Carter Bryant.

then I don’t know what kind of improvement people would expect from making a move like that. Yeah they’re better than Vassell, or Champagnie but I don’t think it will be a huge improvement. Just imagine games where Julian or Vassell shot lights out and if they did that more consistently. That’s the kind of improvement I think TM3 or a draftee (if they reached their potential) would make. Will it win more games? Sure. A lot more? Nah.

[rankingtear]

Fleming has shooting. Handles are definitely his weakness, but there's nothing that indicates he won't get better at dribbling.

You can say that for all the prospects with bad handles what makes him special.

[LeBowen]

You can say that for all the prospects with bad handles what makes him special.

His size/wingspan and the ability to consistently shoot 3s?
That's what we need.

Haven't we had enough of "everyone gets to bring the ball up" nonsense.
I don't want anymore of that.

[Seventyniner]

system? The last time this franchise had a system was 2018

We play fast. Fleming is great in transition. Fits perfectly and he's a hustle player with a 3-point shot, which we really need at the 4.

Playing fast is a great way for a bad team to tank. It gives the opponent more possessions in which to leverage their advantage. I don't think the Spurs' past pace is predictive of their future pace.

[LeBowen]

Playing fast is a great way for a bad team to tank. It gives the opponent more possessions in which to leverage their advantage. I don't think the Spurs' past pace is predictive of their future pace.

Or we could double down on it and force the league to adjust, we'll have the best player, after all.



This season was on pace (pun intended) with two best records in the league and another conference finalist.
Imagine Wemby on that Pacers team instead of Turner, game breaking.

He's going to be the best player in the league and others will have to adjust to the Spurs.
He seems way more comfortable on the perimeter and we don't really want him to post up, especially if we get another great guard.
Having the best rim protector in the league alongside multiple ballhandlers, one of which is the fastest player in the league will make Spurs impossible to deal with.
The more ballhandlers we have, the more difficult it will be to stop the transition.

[rankingtear]

skinny wings people have wanted at the 4: TMIII, Ace Bailey, Carter Bryant, Noa Essengue

That is only scott, the guy does not know TMIII is 205 lbs.

[Extra Stout]

The Spurs have been all about “setting the tone” defensively, which is why I think something’s got to give in a lineup with Fox, Harper, Castle, and Wemby. They will fill that fifth spot with someone who has a knack for defense, tbh. This was the reason Sochan was a starter up until the second half became a throwaway season + they needed a shooter for lineup synergy. With Castle being an improved shooter next year, and Harper probably a good one already, I think they’ll shoot for a defensive big.

Back when the Spurs were good, they always could go with double bigs (Duncan/Robinson, Duncan/Nesterovic, Duncan/Mohammed, Duncan/Oberto, Duncan/Splitter), or had a true stretch 4 who was stout defensively (Horry), and had one or more good-to-elite POA defenders (Elliott, Bowen, Green, Leonard).

Now they have no credible bigs other than Wemby, and no actual plus defenders besides Wemby and Sochan, the latter of whose role is limited by his utter lack of shooting.

Castle you hope develops into a good defender, but his rookie year he was not.

The Spurs finished 14th in offensive efficiency last year, but 25th in defensive efficiency. Regardless of what happens with improved offense due to better shooting/spacing/multiple guards who can attack, if they don’t build a credible defense, Wemby will languish in mediocrity.

This has to be taken into account in draft strategy and overall team construction.

[LeBowen]

The Spurs finished 14th in offensive efficiency last year, but 25th in defensive efficiency.

I know he can't be on the floor at all times, but Wemby has 110 DRTG for the season, Spurs as a team have 116.3.
Backup big who would do a respectable job when Wemby sits wouldn't solve most of our problems, but if we had one we'd surely be an average defensive roster, even with all the size issue on the wings.

[sfernald]

Back when the Spurs were good, they always could go with double bigs (Duncan/Robinson, Duncan/Nesterovic, Duncan/Mohammed, Duncan/Oberto, Duncan/Splitter), or had a true stretch 4 who was stout defensively (Horry), and had one or more good-to-elite POA defenders (Elliott, Bowen, Green, Leonard).

Now they have no credible bigs other than Wemby, and no actual plus defenders besides Wemby and Sochan, the latter of whose role is limited by his utter lack of shooting.

Castle you hope develops into a good defender, but his rookie year he was not.

The Spurs finished 14th in offensive efficiency last year, but 25th in defensive efficiency. Regardless of what happens with improved offense due to better shooting/spacing/multiple guards who can attack, if they don’t build a credible defense, Wemby will languish in mediocrity.

This has to be taken into account in draft strategy and overall team construction.

It seems like the biggest thing we are missing is a credible big other than Wemby as you said. Maybe we should just draft the closest thing to Wemby lite in the draft at #14 so we get 48 minutes of consistent defense first and foremost. So who would that be? Anyone know with any certainty of the huge number of possible centers drafted?

[mo7888]

It seems like the biggest thing we are missing is a credible big other than Wemby as you said. Maybe we should just draft the closest thing to Wemby lite in the draft at #14 so we get 48 minutes of consistent defense first and foremost. So who would that be? Anyone know with any certainty of the huge number of possible centers drafted?

There is no 'Wemby Lite' in this draft...

[RC_Drunkford]

You can say that for all the prospects with bad handles what makes him special.

- bigger wingspan than Giannis
- good 3-point shooter
- has improved his game every year
- athletic with an NBA body
- high motor
- makes hustle plays
- good rebounder
- can play smallball 5 and protect the rim
- averaged 3 stocks per game
- runs hard in transition
- averaged over 1.5 PPP as a cutter
- sets good screens
- good roller
- 2nd in shuttle run at the combine
- quicker lane agility than Dylan Harper

should I go on?

[RC_Drunkford]

Playing fast is a great way for a bad team to tank. It gives the opponent more possessions in which to leverage their advantage. I don't think the Spurs' past pace is predictive of their future pace.

tell that to the Pacers who are in the ECF

then I don’t know what kind of improvement people would expect from making a move like that. Yeah they’re better than Vassell, or Champagnie but I don’t think it will be a huge improvement. Just imagine games where Julian or Vassell shot lights out and if they did that more consistently. That’s the kind of improvement I think TM3 or a draftee (if they reached their potential) would make. Will it win more games? Sure. A lot more? Nah.

TM3 is better defensively though (at least that's what people say). If Vassell can ever return to being a good defender and offball player who shoots lights out, then I agree that this move won't do much. That's why I'd rather have a PF like PJ Washington or John Collins.

[Spursfanfromafar]

I think the Spurs can smartly package the 14th pick and Keldon to deal with Brooklyn and get Cam Johnson and a late FRP. And use the late FRP plus Barnes & Branham to get Porzingis. The lineup could then be -

Fox, Castle, CamJohnson, Sochan, Wemby
Harper, Vassell, Champagnie, Mamu, Porzingis
Wesley, Duke Jr, Ingram/Minix, Larry Nance Jr (FA), Biyombo/ Alex Condon (SRP)