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  1. #151
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Explain your claim here.

    My claim here is that Trump indeed likes dictators like Maduro and had Maduro flattered Trump and given him a gold-looking crown or some he's still be in power.

  2. #152
    Believe.
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    Hey ...its back to - Russia - again...of course...its always been russia ordering trump and elon and the GOP and all the traitors that took the russian money....

    2019- Fiona Hill laid out these gems under oath and of course the treasonous GOP pretended they were deaf,dumb and blind...although that was not hard to do for the GOP-Govt of Putin;

    In her 2019 congressional testimony, former National Security Council official Fiona Hill stated that Russia was "signaling very strongly" an informal proposal for a "very strange swap arrangement between Venezuela and Ukraine". This suggestion was designed to get the U.S. to accept a 19th-century-style division of global spheres of influence.


    Key Details from Hill's Testimony


    • The Nature of the Proposal: Russia communicated the idea through informal channels, such as the Russian press and commentators, rather than formal diplomatic channels. The essence of the message was: Russia would end its support for the Maduro regime in Venezuela (in the U.S. "backyard") if the U.S. would stay out of Ukraine and Eastern Europe (Russia's "backyard").
    • The Monroe Doctrine Link: Hill testified that the Russian proposal was explicitly tied to the concept of the Monroe Doctrine, a U.S. policy regarding its dominance in the Western Hemisphere. The Russians were essentially signaling a reciprocal doctrine: "You have your Monroe doctrine. You want us out of your backyard. Well, you know, we have our own version of this. You're in our backyard in Ukraine".
    • Administration Response: Hill indicated that National Security Council leadership, including John Bolton, viewed this as a dangerous idea because it legitimized the concept of great power spheres of influence, undermining the sovereignty of smaller nations like Ukraine and Venezuela. Hill and her colleagues were instructed to reject this framing and tell the Russians to "knock this off".
    • No Formal Coordination on a "Deal": Hill did not testify that the U.S. and Russia formally coordinated and reached an agreement on such a swap. Instead, she described it as a Russian-floated idea that the U.S. national security team rejected.

    In summary, Fiona Hill warned that Russia was testing the U.S.'s willingness to revert to a world order based on competing spheres of influence, where major powers could dominate their neighbors without U.S. intervention.

  3. #153
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    trump went all in on his handlers plan tho'

  4. #154
    right about pizzagate Blake's Avatar
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    "......May 4, 2017

    Barack Obama’s administration took a principled stand on Venezuela, by imposing sanctions to rein in rogue behavior. Donald Trump, by contrast, had no qualms about taking a half-million-dollar donation for his inauguration festivities from a country whose government is driving its people to the brink of starvation.

    CAMBRIDGE – There is a certain irony in recent news that Venezuela donated a half-million dollars to Donald Trump’s presidential inauguration through Petróleos de Venezuela (PDVSA), the state-owned oil company. Venezuela, of course, is a serial defaulter, having done so more times than almost any other country over the last two centuries....."

    https://www.hks.harvard.edu/centers/...nezuelas-money
    This aged well

  5. #155
    right about pizzagate Blake's Avatar
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    What happens if Maduro is found not guilty?

  6. #156
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    it's literally true, this was negotiated beforehand -- the twist was taking Maduro as a criminal suspect

    Trump/Rubio/Hegseth followed the CIA's advice, the Chavista government is best for stability, so it stays

    i.e., hopefully, keeping US troops off the ground in Venezuela

  7. #157
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    If you think she's not scared less and trying to balance her continued survival odds between the cartels and the U. S. Military, you're naive. As Secretary of State Rubio said, things will be said at news conferences and to the camera that will not bear any relationship to the truth of what taking place, behind the scenes.
    sure, but we're not in the room with their government

  8. #158
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    What happens if Maduro is found not guilty?
    in principle we'd have to free Maduro

    my guess in that eventuality, Maduro would be reapprehended as a terrorist and follow the due-process free track of American justice

  9. #159
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    how much money are US taxpayers going to send to Venezuela to build out their facilities?

    is it not profitable for oil companies to do so?




  10. #160
    right about pizzagate Blake's Avatar
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    in principle we'd have to free Maduro

    my guess in that eventuality, Maduro would be reapprehended as a terrorist and follow the due-process free track of American justice
    Well yeah he'd be free but what would the repercussions be? Any? None?

    I guess none.
    Last edited by Blake; 01-09-2026 at 08:51 PM.

  11. #161
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    what a naughty boy


  12. #162
    Independent DMX7's Avatar
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    Did you have to wait for all the facts to come in before you came to that assertion?
    What facts?

  13. #163
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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  14. #164
    right about pizzagate Blake's Avatar
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    I don't know. You're the one needing more facts before you can figure out if these idiotic Trump moves are good or bad.

    You still waiting for facts about the Maduro kidnapping or have you figured it out yet?

  15. #165
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    sure, but we're not in the room with their government
    I think we are. More importantly, given the precision and efficiency of Maduro's arrest and extraction, they think we are.

  16. #166
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    I think we are. More importantly, given the precision and efficiency of Maduro's arrest and extraction, they think we are.
    so what happens next if Venezuela does not satisfy Trump?

    are more regime change and nation-building on the menu?

  17. #167
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Trump's bull vanishing like teardrops in the rain


    https://www.justice.gov/opa/media/1422326/dl

  18. #168
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    65% Republican support is not a particularly high own-side approval rating and is likely the ceiling

    One in three Americans approves of the U.S. military strike on Venezuela that toppled the country's president and 72% worry the U.S. will become too involved in the South American ​country, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll that concluded on Monday.


    The two-day poll showed 65% of Republicans back the #military operation ordered by Republican President Donald Trump, compared to 11% of Democrats and 23% of independents.
    htps://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/only-33-americans-approve-us-192028711.html

  19. #169
    Veteran velik_m's Avatar
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    Trump suggests US taxpayers could reimburse oil firms for Venezuela investment

    Donald Trump has suggested US taxpayers could reimburse energy companies for repairing Venezuelan infrastructure for extracting and shipping oil.

    Trump acknowledged that “a lot of money” would need to be spent to increase oil production in Venezuela after US forces ousted its leader, Nicolás Maduro, but suggested his government could pay oil companies to do the work.

    “A tremendous amount of money will have to be spent and the oil companies will spend it, and then they’ll get reimbursed by us or through revenue,” the president said.
    An oil pumpjack on Lake Maracaibo in Cabimas, Venezuela.

    The US energy secretary, Chris Wright, reportedly plans to meet representatives of Chevron, ConocoPhillips and ExxonMobil at the Goldman Sachs Energy, Clean Tech & Utilities Conference in Miami later this week.

    Representatives of Trump’s administration are planning to meet executives to discuss increasing Venezuelan production, Reuters reported.

    ...
    https://www.theguardian.com/business...ela-investment

  20. #170
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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  21. #171
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    I think we are. More importantly, given the precision and efficiency of Maduro's arrest and extraction, they think we are.
    It has to be really hard work to delude yourself this hard for this long.

  22. #172
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    It has to be really hard work to delude yourself this hard for this long.
    nothing could be easier than wish-casting and calling it reality, Quixote comes to mind

    what is astonishing is that reality appears throughout the adventure and repeatedly kicks Don Quixote's ass without Quixote being any the wiser
    Last edited by Winehole23; 01-06-2026 at 03:57 PM.

  23. #173
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    in literature as in politics, delusion is a strong force
    Last edited by Winehole23; 01-07-2026 at 11:52 AM.

  24. #174
    I don't really care... Yonivore's Avatar
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    so what happens next if Venezuela does not satisfy Trump?
    Not sure what you mean by "satisfy."

    are more regime change and nation-building on the menu?
    First of all, this wasn't a regime change; Maduro was an illegitimate dictator who failed to recognize the 2024 election results. Having outstanding warrants from the U.S. the Trump administration executed a military-assisted service of an arrest warrant. President Trump has said he is committed to staying with Venezuela until they make an orderly transition BACK to the legitimate form of government Maduro usurped.

    Why is all of this so hard for you to understand?

    Maduro was not the leader of Venezuela.
    Maduro was an indicted criminal with outstanding warrants.
    Maduro's arrest was not unprecedented; the United States had arrested, and brought back for justice, a number of criminals located in foreign lands.

  25. #175
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Not sure what you mean by "satisfy."
    Sure you do, Trump threatened Delcy Rodriguez directly, said worse would happen to her than Maduro if she got out of line

    The military assisted law enforcement operation has occurred in the context of a US naval blockade of Venezuela and ongoing small craft bombings, it's not a toothless threat

    None of the probable escalations will endear this decision to the American people


    First of all, this wasn't a regime change; Maduro was an illegitimate dictator who failed to recognize the 2024 election results. Having outstanding warrants from the U.S. the Trump administration executed a military-assisted service of an arrest warrant. President Trump has said he is committed to staying with Venezuela until they make an orderly transition BACK to the legitimate form of government Maduro usurped.
    Bullpucky

    Not only did we decapitate a foreign government, we did it in favor of a hardline leftist regime, no date suggested for national elections


    Maduro was not the leader of Venezuela.
    Maduro was an indicted criminal with outstanding warrants.
    Maduro's arrest was not unprecedented; the United States had arrested, and brought back for justice, a number of criminals located in foreign lands.
    I get the pretext, even grant that there's a similarly ludicrous precedent in Panama in 1989. It's not hard to understand, I just think this was a bad decision whatever the pretext.
    Last edited by Winehole23; 01-07-2026 at 11:54 AM.

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