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  1. #126
    Believe. duncan7721's Avatar
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    Besides Olajuwon, i forgot to say...

  2. #127
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    Olajuwon played for the U.S national team, so we're not counting him as an international player
    Is list just for the international player that plays in NBA? Why fan here not count all international player? Fans here believe only ones plays in NBA can be considers?

    This is stupid many of best international players and better than ones in names here have never play in NBA. I not even see Bodiroga Belov or Galis even talks about here.

    yes Sabonis and Petrovic were great players but why no one mentions these others. What about Marcuilonis and he also plays NBA like Drazen do and Sabas do? I can names many great players that not play in NBA. What about Papaloukas? What about McAdoo do he not count? What about Giannakis?

    Do fan here even know what Galis is able to do? Is he player only know in Greece? Stupid thing how American player never get credit. He is greatest FIBA player so far not Manu.
    Last edited by Kill_Bill_Pana; 04-24-2008 at 12:11 AM.

  3. #128
    Silence surpasses speech. duncan228's Avatar
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    Is list just for the international player that plays in NBA?
    That's the le of the thread. Is Manu the greatest international player ever in the NBA.

  4. #129
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    Anybody remember the big chinese dude with the Rockets?Yao has got to be in there somewhere. And in the manu vs dirk issue, if we were measuring on regular season success, dirk. But dirk is on the verge of being swept, and manu is on the verge of winning the series of the year. Manu.
    Yao is better center than Sabonis even before Sabonis have injury. Sabonis before injury I say probable better than Ilgauskas and Divac. But not Yao. Honest I think even Gasol and Dirk is better in FIBA and yes Yao than Sabonis. But Sabonis still very good. Just know almost all Lithuania players overrate because Lithuania have similar system as US.

    Hype and promote players like US do. Marcuilonis is easy best player of Lithuania and no person ever hear about him just about Sabonis and Jasekivicius and remembers how every person claim Jasekivicius is best "Europe player ever"

    You can no trust lies about how good Lithuania players are because many fans of Europe have crazy idea of basketball. Such players like Jasekivicius Macijauskas and Siskauskas are all great player for Europe but they are overrate. Spanoulis is player with 2 years only in Europe and he is already superior by far to these such player. But just hear how he "suck" and how they so good.

  5. #130
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    That's the le of the thread. Is Manu the greatest international player ever in the NBA.
    But thread make no sense. International player mean player who play international basketball. So topic is error. If say "best foreign player" then make sense but as is calls make no sense.

    Actual any NBA player that play for US team is also international player.

  6. #131
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Is list just for the international player that plays in NBA? Why fan here not count all international player? Fans here believe only ones plays in NBA can be considers?

    This is stupid many of best international players and better than ones in names here have never play in NBA. I not even see Bodiroga Belov or Galis even talks about here.

    yes Sabonis and Petrovic were great players but why no one mentions these others. What about Marcuilonis? I can names many great players that not play in NBA. What about Papaloukas? What about McAdoo do he not count? What about Giannakis?

    Do fan here even know what Galis is able to do? Is he player only know in Greece? Stupid thing how American player never get credit. He is greatest FIBA player so far not Manu.
    If you want start a thread saying: "Who's the best Fiba player? (period)"

    I'd still bealive is Manu.

  7. #132
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    If you want start a thread saying: "Who's the best Fiba player? (period)"

    I'd still bealive is Manu.
    Galis is best and Manu is second best so far. It is true. I love Manu so much as player how he play in Euroleague is amazing still some thing he can do then he lose in NBA because older.

    But no he is not as much good in FIBA as Galis were. But I guess Galis not count because he American player. But he is best of FIBA player ever. True thing must be state and it is true.

  8. #133
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Anybody remember the big chinese dude with the Rockets?Yao has got to be in there somewhere. And in the manu vs dirk issue, if we were measuring on regular season success, dirk. But dirk is on the verge of being swept, and manu is on the verge of winning the series of the year. Manu.
    Yao? are you serious? Yao haven't done anything meaningfull yet.

    And 'bout the Dirk vs Manu thing, it's easy, what'd you rather have?

    A regular season MVP or an euroleague (plus MVP) an olympic gold medal (plus MVP) and three NBA championships (plus 6th man award ).

  9. #134
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    Yao? are you serious? Yao haven't done anything meaningfull yet.

    And 'bout the Dirk vs Manu thing, it's easy, what'd you rather have?

    A regular season MVP or an euroleague (plus MVP) an olympic gold medal (plus MVP) and three NBA championships (plus 6th man award ).
    Hmm I think Manu win final MVP not MVP in Euroleague. Also this year is * year because two champions and two MVP. This is year best teams of Europe not compete in Euroleague.

    Of all things Manu do Euroleague final MVP and le this year is not much compare to other things he do. World Champions 2nd place is much more than this and no fan bring this up. Euroleague le and final MVP that year is not much of great thing.

  10. #135
    Stalin for 3 yourtehclay's Avatar
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    Even though I hate Dirk, you really have to put him above Manu on the list. It's closer than one would imagine though.

  11. #136
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Galis is best and Manu is second best so far. It is true. I love Manu so much as player how he play in Euroleague is amazing still some thing he can do then he lose in NBA because older.

    But no he is not as much good in FIBA as Galis were. But I guess Galis not count because he American player. But he is best of FIBA player ever. True thing must be state and it is true.
    I'd take three NBA rings, an euroleague and an olympic gold medal over an european cup anyday of the week.

  12. #137
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Hmm I think Manu win final MVP not MVP in Euroleague. Also this year is * year because two champions and two MVP. This is year best teams of Europe not compete in Euroleague.

    Of all things Manu do Euroleague final MVP and le this year is not much compare to other things he do. World Champions 2nd place is much more than this and no fan bring this up. Euroleague le and final MVP that year is not much of great thing.
    Fine I'll give you the euroleague, it's still a pretty nice resume

  13. #138
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Even though I hate Dirk, you really have to put him above Manu on the list. It's closer than one would imagine though.
    Why? seriously, think about it. Who'd you rather be? i'd even prefer to have an Argie league championship than a NBA MVP.

  14. #139
    Ain't over 'till its over MaNuMaNiAc's Avatar
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    Why? seriously, think about it. Who'd you rather be? i'd even prefer to have an Argie league championship than a NBA MVP.
    now you're just being ridiculous

  15. #140
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    FIBA says this of Galis

    Since the birth of the European Championships in 1935 and the first European club compe ion in 1958, literally thousands of players have stepped up to play at the top level. Yet few have had the impact on the record books as that of former Greek superstar, Nick Galis.

    Playing in the 1980‘s and early 1990‘s, Galis literally broke scoring records in almost every compe ion he entered, playing for Aris Thessaloniki and Panathinaikos Athens. He also masterminded the greatest ever achievement of any Greek national team, namely a gold medal at the 1987 European Championship.



    Galis displaying his deadly shooting touch
    “I’d love to play with Galis in the same team,” said the legendary Drazen Petrovic before his death in 1993.

    “I would assist him the ball and he would put it in the basket.”

    Nick Galis, a 183 cm guard, was born in New Jersey (USA) on July 23rd 1957. Although he was not born on Greek soil, his Greek nationality was unquestionable. His parents, Giorgos and Stella, hailed from the island of Rhodos and when Galis first came to Greece he was known as Nickos Georgalis-Galis.

    Galis’ first sport was actually boxing, but his mother soon put the clamps on his burgeoning career. Her horror at seeing her son come home every day with a new facial injury led to Galis taking up basketball and in 1970 began to play at Union Hill High School.

    His prep career was successful enough to earn him a scholarship to the University of Seton Hall and he did not disappoint. In his junior year (1977-78) he averaged 17.3 points per game and as a senior he led the nation in scoring (Indiana State forward Larry Bird was second) at 27.5 points per game, with a career high 48 points against the University of Santa Clara.

    Galis was chosen at no. 68 by the Boston Celtics in the 1979 NBA draft, but elected instead to pursue a professional career in Greece.

    It was a decision which would literally change the future of Greek basketball.

    Panathinaikos and Olympiakos had showed some interest in the newcomer, but it was Aris Thessaloniki who were the most active club. Giorgos Tsiligaridis was sent by Aris to the USA to convince Galis to sign with his team and he managed to return with his signature on a contract.

    Galis came to Thessaloniki at the start of the 1979-1980 and it took the young guard all of one game to show his potential. In his debut he lit up rival Thessaloniki club Iraklis for 30 points and an epic career was underway.

    Galis’ career is perhaps best summed up by the record books. He played 13 seasons with Aris, winning eight Greek les, five Greek Cups, one Korac Cup (1985) and also making three EuroLeague Final Four appearances. Of the eight Greek les, six were consecutive during which Aris put together a remarkable 80 game winning streak.

    Along with the team success came the individual accolades. Galis led the Greek League in scoring in every single one of his 15 seasons. He is the league’s all-time leading scorer with a total of 12,849 points in 384 games and a remarkable average of 33.4 points per game.

    His career high output was 62 points which came against Nikeas-Aris in 1981. He also torched Panellinios for 57 points in the 1987 final of the Greek Cup and his career high in European compe ion was 57 against Venice during the 1981 Korac Cup.

    Galis was also a loyal servant of the Greek national team. His first game came during the 1980 pre-Olympic tournament and he would go on to play 168 times for his country. He is second on the all-time scoring list to former Aris team-mate Panagiotis Yiannakis at 5,130 points (Yiannakis scored 5,282 points in 351 games for Greece).

    Galis’ crowning glory came literally during the 1987 European Championship which was held in Greece. He led his side to the gold medal and also earned tournament MVP honours in the process. He naturally led all players in scoring, including 40 points in the final, a 103-101 victory over the Soviet Union.

    That performance led former Soviet Union star Sergey Belov to comment:

    “I admire him. When he plays one against one there is no way to stop him. I never thought that could be a player who could on his own beat the Soviet Union.”

    The praise from the Soviet Union continued in the form of coach Alexander Gomelski, who called Galis the “player of the 21st century”.

    Galis also won a sliver medal at the 1989 European Championship in Zagreb and participated in a total of five European Championships. He was the top scorer at all of them except for the 1989 Championship. Galis participated in one World Championship in 1986, where he again led all players in scoring, and had a 53-point outburst against Panama.

    Galis’ ability to put the ball in the basket compounded opposing players and coaches alike.

    “I feel that if Galis wants to make a basket, he will do it no matter who his opponent is,” said Lithuanian star Arvydas Sabonis.

    For those coaches who he came up against, most strategies to stop him proved futile. Former Nashua Den Bosh coach Rood Harrewain advocated locking Galis in the dressing room before the game, while Wojeck Krajowski of Lech Poznan looked to a higher power:

    “Before the game we made our plans on how we will stop the four players of Aris,” he said following a European club compe ion game.

    “For Galis, we made our prayers…”

    In some ways, Galis’ scoring feats overshadow the fact that he was also a great playmaker. In 1990 he dished 23 assists in a European Cup game against Finish side Uusikaoupounk and in the 1992/93 season with Panathinaikos he was the Greek League’s best passer at 6.7 assists per game. During that season he also recorded a remarkable double-double, hitting a perfect 13/13 field goals and dishing 19 assists against former side Aris.

    After he stopped playing basketball, Galis founded a Basketball Camp for kids at the village of Pefkochori in Halkidiki. This camp every year has more than 3, 000 kids who learn basketball from the great Nick.

    Nick Galis - Scoring Machine

    Compe ion Games Points Average
    Greek League 384 12,849 33.4
    Greek Cup 55 1,935 35.2
    European Cups 146 4,807 32.9
    National Team 168 5,130 30.5
    Total 753 24,721 32.8

    les

    Greek Championship 8
    1983, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991
    Greek Cup 6
    1985, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1992, 1993

    European Championship for Men 2
    Gold 1987, Silver 1989

    European Championship for Clubs
    Final-Four 4 1988 4th, 1989 4th, 1990 3rd, 1994 3rd

    European Cups 1
    European Cup Winner 1985

    And remembers FIBA assist is - 2 NBA assist thinks about this when read these numbers.

  16. #141
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    now you're just being ridiculous
    So you prefer individual awards over real ones?

  17. #142
    Ain't over 'till its over MaNuMaNiAc's Avatar
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    So you prefer individual awards over real ones?
    An NBA regular season MVP award is very real. Besides, what the are you arguing anyways?? Doesn't individual greatness come with individual achievements as well? Just because the Argie league championship is a team accolade doesn't immediately give it importance. The level of talent and importance between the NBA and Argentina is so enormous its unsurmountable in terms of importance.

    To answer your question, yes I believe that an NBA regular season MVP has more weight in determining the greatness of a player than an Argie championship does and its not even close.

  18. #143
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    An NBA regular season MVP award is very real. Besides, what the are you arguing anyways?? Doesn't individual greatness come with individual achievements as well? Just because the Argie league championship is a team accolade doesn't immediately give it importance. The level of talent and importance between the NBA and Argentina is so enormous its unsurmountable in terms of importance.

    To answer your question, yes I believe that an NBA regular season MVP has more weight in determining the greatness of a player than an Argie championship does and its not even close.
    I didn't say that NBA MVP's are less important than Argie 'ships in terms of determining the greatness of a player. I just say that I'd rather have a champion of something (no matter how little) than an individual award. And i'm sure that Manu thinks similar.

  19. #144
    Ain't over 'till its over MaNuMaNiAc's Avatar
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    I didn't say that NBA MVP's are less important than Argie 'ships in terms of determining the greatness of a player. I just say that I'd rather have a champion of something (no matter how little) than an individual award. And i'm sure that Manu thinks similar.
    Manu might think similar when talking about an NBA mvp award and an NBA championship, but if you're trying to tell me that he would choose an Argie league le over an NBA regular season mvp award, I don't buy it. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that's not the case. Lets face it, Manu might be humble, but he's not completely devoid of pride. He appreciates meaningful individual awards as much as the next player. He's not freaking mother Teresa for Christ sake!

  20. #145
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    FIBA says this of Galis

    Since the birth of the European Championships in 1935 and the first European club compe ion in 1958, literally thousands of players have stepped up to play at the top level. Yet few have had the impact on the record books as that of former Greek superstar, Nick Galis.

    Playing in the 1980‘s and early 1990‘s, Galis literally broke scoring records in almost every compe ion he entered, playing for Aris Thessaloniki and Panathinaikos Athens. He also masterminded the greatest ever achievement of any Greek national team, namely a gold medal at the 1987 European Championship.



    Galis displaying his deadly shooting touch
    “I’d love to play with Galis in the same team,” said the legendary Drazen Petrovic before his death in 1993.

    “I would assist him the ball and he would put it in the basket.”

    Nick Galis, a 183 cm guard, was born in New Jersey (USA) on July 23rd 1957. Although he was not born on Greek soil, his Greek nationality was unquestionable. His parents, Giorgos and Stella, hailed from the island of Rhodos and when Galis first came to Greece he was known as Nickos Georgalis-Galis.

    Galis’ first sport was actually boxing, but his mother soon put the clamps on his burgeoning career. Her horror at seeing her son come home every day with a new facial injury led to Galis taking up basketball and in 1970 began to play at Union Hill High School.

    His prep career was successful enough to earn him a scholarship to the University of Seton Hall and he did not disappoint. In his junior year (1977-78) he averaged 17.3 points per game and as a senior he led the nation in scoring (Indiana State forward Larry Bird was second) at 27.5 points per game, with a career high 48 points against the University of Santa Clara.

    Galis was chosen at no. 68 by the Boston Celtics in the 1979 NBA draft, but elected instead to pursue a professional career in Greece.

    It was a decision which would literally change the future of Greek basketball.

    Panathinaikos and Olympiakos had showed some interest in the newcomer, but it was Aris Thessaloniki who were the most active club. Giorgos Tsiligaridis was sent by Aris to the USA to convince Galis to sign with his team and he managed to return with his signature on a contract.

    Galis came to Thessaloniki at the start of the 1979-1980 and it took the young guard all of one game to show his potential. In his debut he lit up rival Thessaloniki club Iraklis for 30 points and an epic career was underway.

    Galis’ career is perhaps best summed up by the record books. He played 13 seasons with Aris, winning eight Greek les, five Greek Cups, one Korac Cup (1985) and also making three EuroLeague Final Four appearances. Of the eight Greek les, six were consecutive during which Aris put together a remarkable 80 game winning streak.

    Along with the team success came the individual accolades. Galis led the Greek League in scoring in every single one of his 15 seasons. He is the league’s all-time leading scorer with a total of 12,849 points in 384 games and a remarkable average of 33.4 points per game.

    His career high output was 62 points which came against Nikeas-Aris in 1981. He also torched Panellinios for 57 points in the 1987 final of the Greek Cup and his career high in European compe ion was 57 against Venice during the 1981 Korac Cup.

    Galis was also a loyal servant of the Greek national team. His first game came during the 1980 pre-Olympic tournament and he would go on to play 168 times for his country. He is second on the all-time scoring list to former Aris team-mate Panagiotis Yiannakis at 5,130 points (Yiannakis scored 5,282 points in 351 games for Greece).

    Galis’ crowning glory came literally during the 1987 European Championship which was held in Greece. He led his side to the gold medal and also earned tournament MVP honours in the process. He naturally led all players in scoring, including 40 points in the final, a 103-101 victory over the Soviet Union.

    That performance led former Soviet Union star Sergey Belov to comment:

    “I admire him. When he plays one against one there is no way to stop him. I never thought that could be a player who could on his own beat the Soviet Union.”

    The praise from the Soviet Union continued in the form of coach Alexander Gomelski, who called Galis the “player of the 21st century”.

    Galis also won a sliver medal at the 1989 European Championship in Zagreb and participated in a total of five European Championships. He was the top scorer at all of them except for the 1989 Championship. Galis participated in one World Championship in 1986, where he again led all players in scoring, and had a 53-point outburst against Panama.

    Galis’ ability to put the ball in the basket compounded opposing players and coaches alike.

    “I feel that if Galis wants to make a basket, he will do it no matter who his opponent is,” said Lithuanian star Arvydas Sabonis.

    For those coaches who he came up against, most strategies to stop him proved futile. Former Nashua Den Bosh coach Rood Harrewain advocated locking Galis in the dressing room before the game, while Wojeck Krajowski of Lech Poznan looked to a higher power:

    “Before the game we made our plans on how we will stop the four players of Aris,” he said following a European club compe ion game.

    “For Galis, we made our prayers…”

    In some ways, Galis’ scoring feats overshadow the fact that he was also a great playmaker. In 1990 he dished 23 assists in a European Cup game against Finish side Uusikaoupounk and in the 1992/93 season with Panathinaikos he was the Greek League’s best passer at 6.7 assists per game. During that season he also recorded a remarkable double-double, hitting a perfect 13/13 field goals and dishing 19 assists against former side Aris.

    After he stopped playing basketball, Galis founded a Basketball Camp for kids at the village of Pefkochori in Halkidiki. This camp every year has more than 3, 000 kids who learn basketball from the great Nick.

    Nick Galis - Scoring Machine

    Compe ion Games Points Average
    Greek League 384 12,849 33.4
    Greek Cup 55 1,935 35.2
    European Cups 146 4,807 32.9
    National Team 168 5,130 30.5
    Total 753 24,721 32.8

    les

    Greek Championship 8
    1983, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991
    Greek Cup 6
    1985, 1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1992, 1993

    European Championship for Men 2
    Gold 1987, Silver 1989

    European Championship for Clubs
    Final-Four 4 1988 4th, 1989 4th, 1990 3rd, 1994 3rd

    European Cups 1
    European Cup Winner 1985

    And remembers FIBA assist is - 2 NBA assist thinks about this when read these numbers.
    I know who Galis is i've seen him play, he's great and i'd have love to see him in the NBA but you have to ackowladge that Manu resume is better than Nick's. If you want to count the Greek 'ships then you also have to put the Italian 'ships of Manu. And like I said in europe Manu 's the same amount of 'ships that Galis has in lots of less years.

  21. #146
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Manu might think similar when talking about an NBA mvp award and an NBA championship, but if you're trying to tell me that he would choose an Argie league le over an NBA regular season mvp award, I don't buy it. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that's not the case. Lets face it, Manu might be humble, but he's not completely devoid of pride. He appreciates meaningful individual awards as much as the next player. He's not freaking mother Teresa for Christ sake!
    Well, we'll have to ask him.
    Now that he's won everything he ever dream of I'm sure he'd prefer a NBA MVP over an Argie 'ship but if he wouldn't have won anything ever I'm sure he'd rather be a champion of something before getting an individual award.

  22. #147
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    i'd even prefer to have an Argie league championship than a NBA MVP.
    Wowch.

  23. #148
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    Wowch indeed

  24. #149
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    I know who Galis is i've seen him play, he's great and i'd have love to see him in the NBA but you have to ackowladge that Manu resume is better than Nick's. If you want to count the Greek 'ships then you also have to put the Italian 'ships of Manu. And like I said in europe Manu 's the same amount of 'ships that Galis has in lots of less years.
    You say best FIBA player you not say anything about best player of best FIBA teams. If Galis have some of Manu teammates he will have won many championships.

    You realize he is one who make basketball in Greece? before him there is nothing in Greek basketball. he is beating Soviet Union twice in biggest FIBA compe ions and he is do it with country that have no basketball developing. It is his games there that create sport in Greece. He have 40 point game against Soviet team in 1987 and 45 point game against them in 1989. He outscore Sabonis before injury 45-19 in this game.

    This is SAME Soviet team that is so good it cause US to go to pro players for 1992 Olympics to be able to win them. You must think serious about what you are saying.

  25. #150
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    You say best FIBA player you not say anything about best player of best FIBA teams. If Galis have some of Manu teammates he will have won many championships.

    You realize he is one who make basketball in Greece? before him there is nothing in Greek basketball. he is beating Soviet Union twice in biggest FIBA compe ions and he is do it with country that have no basketball developing. It is his games there that create sport in Greece. He have 40 point game against Soviet team in 1987 and 45 point game against them in 1989. He outscore Sabonis before injury 45-19 in this game.

    This is SAME Soviet team that is so good it cause US to go to pro players for 1992 Olympics to be able to win them. You must think serious about what you are saying.
    Galis is among the best players I've ever seen but you need to consider the level of compe ion he faced and what he accomplished. Only 1 euro 'ship seems to little to consider somebody as the greatest FIBA player ever. Anyway this thread was 'bout the best international player in the NBA

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