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Aj is not "fired" yet.
Neither is DAntoni.
But both are pretty much sure things.
I'd love to have AJ back. He's too good to be an assistant though. Maybe he could come back for a couple of years until he gets a head coaching position that's a good situation for him. I sure as don't want to see him in a trainwreck like New York or Miami.
Aj is not "fired" yet.
Neither is DAntoni.
But both are pretty much sure things.
AVERY SHOULD GO TO PHX and coach the Suns.
He will bring in Sam Vincent Im sure
Seems like I recall a report that AJ wanted to trade Dirk. Anyone doubt the Mavs would still be in the playoffs tonight if they'd had Kobe and Harris in the backcourt with Terry coming off the bench?
If AJ is actually fired I expect him to be sitting next to Kelvin Sampson on Saturday.
You misunderstand the purpose of my proposed pe ion.
That's a damn good idea. I never knew they did that before.
In this series in particular I think bringing in Avery could make the difference. Who better than to scout the Hornets than the coach who just spent 5 games trying to defend Chris Paul and the NO pick and roll?
5 games first hand experience in the past two weeks
vs.
watching prepared video clips of 5 games first hand experience
That could be a huge edge off the hardwood.
------------------------------------------------
On Avery getting fired:
Whether it's now or later it's going to happen. I think it's the right move but not because Avery is a bad coach. In truth, Avery is probably one of the best coaches in the league, but he is never going to be able to have complete control of the team with Mark Cuban sneaking in the locker room for every team meeting and watching over him. Avery needs complete control over a franchise and acquiesence from the owner ala Pop with Peter Holt. Everybody knows Pop runs everything about the Spurs from merchandise sales to janitor schedules to player personnel to picking a player to have in his dog house every year. Peter Holt just looks at the book ledger at the end of the year and has a clause that Julianna Holt gets to have the first interview of the season 5 minutes after the Spurs win the championship. That's why the Spurs are so successful - one man makes the decisions and he's a good one to make decisions. You can't have a bunch of dissention among the top ranks. Cuban is just a fan like anybody with a blog that doesn't know anything about winning basketball games besides the fact he's not.
Another problem with Cuban is I get the impression players run to him when they don't like what Avery is doing. (see Josh Howard) This makes up the dissention argument again. And like someone said, if there's anybody Cuban should fire it's himself. The Kidd trade is on him and he crippled the franchise because of it. In the NBA, going all-in in the middle of the season is almost never going to net you a championship. Championships, for the most part, come from teams that have been cultivated over the years (see: history). And not only that but only 1 of 32 can win. I'll grant Cuban that Avery only has two first round losses on his resume, but it's not like Avery can rip out his heart and give it to Dirk or make Jason Kidd 10 years younger and have Devin Harris' speed and quickness so that he can try to slow down the best PG in the league.
Last edited by jackseven; 04-30-2008 at 04:05 AM.
Who Has The Balls To Fire George Karl?
That Man Is Horrific
DANTONI and AVERY, both gone now and George Karl is still coaching. KARL has not gotten out of the first round since 2002. 4-24 record
NBA Coaches of the Year
2008 -- Byron Scott, New Orleans
2007 -- Sam Mitc , Toronto
2006 -- Avery Johnson, Dallas
2005 -- Mike D'Antoni, Phoenix
2004 -- Hubie Brown, Memphis
2003 -- Gregg Popovich, San Antonio
2002 -- Rick Carlisle, Detroit
2001 -- Larry Brown, Philadelphia
2000 -- Glenn Rivers, Orlando
1999 -- Mike Dunleavy, Portland
1998 -- Larry Bird, Indiana
1997 -- Pat Riley, Miami
1996 -- Phil Jackson, Chicago
1995 -- Del Harris, L.A. Lakers
1994 -- Lenny Wilkens, Atlanta
1993 -- Pat Riley, New York
1992 -- Don Nelson, Golden State
1991 -- Don Chaney, Houston
1990 -- Pat Riley, L.A. Lakers
1989 -- Cotton Fitzsimmons, Phoenix
1988 -- Doug Moe, Denver
1987 -- Mike Schuler, Portland
1986 -- Mike Fratello, Atlanta
1985 -- Don Nelson, Milwaukee
1984 -- Frank Layden, Utah
1983 -- Don Nelson, Milwaukee
1982 -- Gene Shue, Washington
1981 -- Jack McKinney, Indiana
1980 -- Bill Fitch, Boston
1979 -- Cotton Fitzsimmons, Kansas City
1978 -- Hubie Brown, Atlanta
1977 -- Tom Nissalke, Houston
1976 -- Bill Fitch, Cleveland
1975 -- Phil Johnson, Kansas City-Omaha
1974 -- Ray Scott, Detroit
1973 -- Tom Heinsohn, Boston
1972 -- Bill Sharman, L.A. Lakers
1971 -- Motta, Chicago
1970 -- Red Holzman, New York
1969 -- Gene Shue, Baltimore
1968 -- Richie Guerin, St. Louis
1967 -- Johnny Kerr, Chicago
1966 -- Dolph Schayes, Philadelphia
1965 -- Red Auerbach, Boston
1964 -- Alex Hannum, San Francisco
1963 -- Harry Gallatin, St. Louis
if it's for the sake of him not going anywhere to hurt us i may agree to have him... i just don;t see him adjusting to our current locker room dynamic.. he is too much of an attention ... and the big 4's lockeroom is about other things i don;t think AJ has... D-Rob is not here anymore to pace him...
Rick Carlisle is still out of a job isn't he? Surely he will get either NY, PHX or DAL?
AJ, Phil Jackson, and Jerry Sloan are the only coaches to have found a way to beat Tim Duncan in the postseason.
D'Antoni + Dallas would be a dream come true.
In Dallas, AJ had to contend with a jackass of an owner and knuckleheads in his rotation. Still, he wasn't that far off coaching a team to a NBA championship. How long did it take Pop to make it to the NBA Finals?
Spurs fans talk a lot of about AJ, but that seems to be due to the fact that they are too young to remember AJ as anything other than the HC of the Mavs. I generally don't listen to these fans.
I find nothing shocking about his firing and the timing of it. You go from Choking in the finals to choking in the first round to another first round exit in lackluster style you get fired.
He should serve time in the East for a while.
I seriously doubt that there are many people posting here who don't remember AJ before he coached the Mavs. I remember him very well, and I don't like him. Mostly I don't like his mouth, and the fact that he actually believes all the stuff he says. There are plenty of examples, but I'll never forget the night the retired David's jersey, and AJ talked mostly about AJ.
I think he rode Robinson's coattails as a player. He may have been the best of a series of budget-priced PG's, but that's where it stops. As a coach, who can say? He inhereted a team loaded with talent, and a lot of knowledge of the Spurs' system. I'm not sure how much he enhanced things, but you would think he invented the concept of defense.
I do know that the Mavs lost in the first round last year because they got out-coached. And that got in his head, because of that big ego of his. He may be ruined for life because of it. And he did some really idiotic things this year involving Jason Kidd.
I definitely have to agree that I would hate to have him pop up as a commentator. I just couldn't listen to a full game of him, between that voice and his self-serving comments. I would have to turn the volume off on the game.
Can't argue much with a personal preference.
AJ was there at the start of Spurs Basketball as we know it today. He was the coach on the floor. He had as much of a hand in creating it as Pop did.I think he rode Robinson's coattails as a player. He may have been the best of a series of budget-priced PG's, but that's where it stops. As a coach, who can say? He inhereted a team loaded with talent, and a lot of knowledge of the Spurs' system. I'm not sure how much he enhanced things, but you would think he invented the concept of defense.
And Pop didn't inherit a pretty good situation himself? Pop also needed a second top 10 bigman of all time to fall into his lap in order to make it to the NBA Finals. AJ made do with much less. It certainly didn't take him long to make the Mavs solid defensively.
Pop does have a sane owner to work with who generally stayed has stayed out of his way. AJ didn't have that luxury in Dallas.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playof...tsGame5-080430
NEW ORLEANS -- It ultimately played out as a five-point game featuring a scrappy Dallas comeback and real, live crunch time. That's all true.
Yet you never really had a doubt how Tuesday's tale of two coaches was going to climax.
For Byron Scott? His morning appointment was a Coach of the Year press conference and his night was capped with the sweet sight of Chris Paul's first playoff triple-double ushering his ex Jason Kidd into summer vacation. Which can only equate to all-day, buzzer-to-buzzer bliss.
For Avery Johnson?
The Lil' General had to leave his hometown wondering if this 99-94 defeat, wrapping up a 4-1 series rout for Scott's New Orleans Hornets, was an elimination game in the most literal sense.
"This is tough for me," Johnson conceded afterward, not specifically responding to a question about his job security but struggling to contain his disappointment after the Dallas Mavericks' second straight flameout in the first round.
"Obviously this is where I was born and raised."
It would defy weeks of ominous signals if N'awlins didn't also wind up as the backdrop for Johnson's last game on the Mavericks' bench. ESPN.com reported after Dallas' victory over New Orleans in the regular-season finale April 16 (Daily Dime) that Avery's job would be thrust into serious peril if the Mavs did not at least find a way out of the first round. Sources close to the situation have since disclosed that Mavericks owner Mark Cuban actually considered dismissing Johnson before the playoffs, specifically after Cuban and Johnson engaged in an emotional argument after a March 18 home loss to the Lakers.
Cuban uncharacteristically refused to speak with reporters after the defeat -- Dallas' ninth playoff loss in a row on the road since taking a 2-0 lead in the 2006 NBA Finals -- undoubtedly knowing what sort of questions were coming. But Johnson was fielding queries about his future as early as the morning shootaround, letting out an unmistakable pause when asked if he fears that his job is in jeopardy.
Johnson then said: "I would hope not. I love what I'm doing and I love the team. Right now I'm just focusing on coming out and trying to get this team to play as best as we can. And then whatever happens tomorrow, then we'll have to manage that part of it."
If anything gives Johnson hope of hanging on after falling to 3-12 in the playoffs since the Mavericks' unraveling in the Finals against Miami, it's that there's no clear-cut candidate to replace him. Rick Carlisle and Jeff Van Gundy will undeniably be names of interest, but the partnership of Dirk Nowitzki and Kidd would seemingly demand an offensive specialist to maximize their potential as a tandem. The Mavericks, according to sources, would have definite interest in Mike D'Antoni or Flip Saunders if either is made available, but can they bank on either one?
There's also a chance, sources say, that Johnson might even be amenable to a mutual parting, given the likelihood that he would almost certainly become a candidate for openings in New York and Chicago. Sources say that the Bulls, anticipating Johnson's exit, have already had internal discussions about the possibility of hiring him. What we know for sure is that the last 48 hours of the Mavericks' season were among the most chaotic of Johnson's tenure ... and none of it connected to how Kidd fits in his offense. Sources say Johnson's well-chronicled cancellation of Monday's practice was an angry response to discovering that Josh Howard did not cancel a birthday party previously scheduled in his honor at a Dallas night club Sunday night after the Mavs' heavy Game 4 defeat.
In-house frustration with Howard was already at its limit, courtesy of the former All-Star's miserable shooting in this series (which continued in Game 5 with a 2-for-10 finish after a 4-for-4 start) and multiple interviews Howard granted -- one of them hours before Game 3 -- detailing his offseason marijuana use. So you can understand why an exasperated Johnson, also apparently convinced that Howard was not the only Mav out on the town after such a damaging loss, kicked the whole team out of the gym. The team then responded with a players-only meeting and a players-only practice, which their coach applauded at the morning shootaround.
"We had some of our leaders step up, which I've always wanted," Johnson said.
But Johnson also hinted at the depth of his discontent, prefacing his compliment by saying: "We came in [Monday] with the intention to practice. And then something changed."
So ...
Clearly not the smoothest preparations for a team in a 3-1 hole. Especially when various elements of the Hornets' series-long dominance didn't change at all, ranging from Jannero Pargo's scorching shooting off the bench (16 points on 7-for-9 accuracy) to David West's indiscriminant ability to punish defenders big (Erick Dampier) and small (Brandon Bass) and most of all Paul's brilliance (24 points, 15 assists, 11 rebounds and zero turnovers) in a performance Johnson likened to "a young Nate Archibald."
The Hornets' dynamo had 11 of his 15 assists by halftime, which was fitting on a night he became just the fifth player in NBA history -- joining Oscar Robertson, Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas and Kevin Johnson -- to average better than 11 assists in his first playoff series. He also emerged from a second-quarter, double-technical tangle with Dallas' Jerry Stackhouse with a 3-point dagger to spark a 17-3 run that broke open a four-point game.
New Orleans never trailed and its lead reached 15 points by halftime, but Johnson can take a sliver of solace from the second-half fightback. When even Mavs loyalists had to be expecting a surrender, Dallas sliced the deficit to 63-57 and had a chance to get even closer when Nowitzki sullied his own triple-double bid (22 points, 13 rebounds and six assists) by missing two near-automatic looks by his standards. The Mavs then rallied again in the fourth quarter -- which began with Jason Terry defiantly marching into a Hornets huddle before the period began to proclaim that the visitors were not ready for their season to end -- by somehow slicing a 17-point lead to three in the final minute.
Enter Paul for the dagger rebound. The Mavs would have had a shot to force overtime had they been able to track down Paul's errant jumper, but the MVP candidate was credited with his 10th board when Tyson Chandler batted the ball out of the key and into Paul's arms.
Yet it's been evident to anyone spending any time around this team that the Dallas rally was an aberration. Johnson's successes in Big D are sizable and historic, as the only coach in franchise annals to win a Game 7 in San Antonio, take them to the Finals and post a 67-win season while also picking up a COY trophy of his own in 2006. But belief, unity, joy and focus have been scarce commodities for the Mavs ever since they beat these Hornets at home in their regular-season finale to avoid a first-round meeting with Kobe Bryant's Lakers.
This is the one loss in the series in which they didn't go down meekly. That's not all Johnson's fault -- you certainly can't blame him for Howard's sudden and steep decline -- but his relationship with the owner and his ability to reach these players in his famously demanding, hands-on manner has clearly deteriorated. It also didn't help that Johnson didn't start Terry until Game 3, even when the Mavs needed to be as small and quick as possible to keep up with the Hornets, and so rarely put Kidd in post-up situations against Paul to help his point guard when Dallas couldn't run. Factor in all the longstanding doubts about Kidd operating in Johnson's grinding halfcourt sets and the limited flexibility post-trade that the Mavs have to tweak the roster further and you can see why a coaching change is regarded throughout the league as an inevitability.
"We've had a great run with this group," Stackhouse said. "But when you lose in the first round two years in a row, you expect some changes. We're all hired to be fired at some point, from the greatest [Michael Jordan] to Harold Miner. They all see the end.
"We'll wait and see what the boss [wants to] do. No matter what happens or what changes are made, it's been a great situation for me the last four years. It's been a great situation for Avery for the last four years, [for Jason Terry] coming out of Atlanta. For the last four years, it's been a great situation for everybody that's involved. So if this is the end or whatever, you can't do nothing but say we had our chance. Had our opportunity."
Wouldn't this be the first time Mark Cuban has fired a coach?? If I recall, he didn't fire Nellie, he stepped down himself.
As for D'Antoni and Avery:@ Spurs fans who they they'd come on board to be assistant coaches with the Spurs. There are so many open coaching opportunities this offseason, more so than at any point that I can remember, and those two guys with playoff experience are still about 90% better than the coaching options out there. Any team is going to jump at the chance to hire them for head coach.
(possible*) Open coaching positions:
--Mavs
--Suns
--Raptors
--Nuggets
--Bulls
--Heat
--Knicks
Avery and Cuban sucks!!!!!!!!!What a losers!!!
Ahhh dammit. I hate a logical reply like that. Forces me to think too much. Just kidding... I have to agree with a lot of what you say, just not to the same degree as you. AJ was part of the beginnings of the system, and there is no doubt that he shaped some of what happened on the floor at that time. And it's possible that he had some longer-lasting influence... I can't say for certain. But I don't see him as being any kind of an architect.
Can we agree that AJ is extremely egocentric? It may have driven him to over-achieve as a player. But I think it reduces his value as a coach, and it makes him almost intolerable when he is in front of a microphone.
One other thing... I think AJ understood the mechanics of the Spurs' system, but not the spirit. One example is the way he whines and es about officiating, rather than focusing on preparation and execution. (The other example I'm thinking of would just be a cause for bickering, so I'll stop there.) But that's one more reason I see AJ as a recipient, rather than an architect of the Spurs current system. I just don't think he completely gets it.
For the record, I appreciate your comment about not being able to argue with a personal preference. Mark of wisdom.
Crackhouse.
Mitc is about to get fired from the Craptors too.
While I agree that Avery is egocentric and whines too much - but who's perfect? I'm not a big fan of Avery, but Pop could probably keep him in line. And if Avery refuses to toe the line, Pop wouldn't have any problem in firing him. Maybe Avery was constantly looking for excuses because of the owner - Cuban. Working with Holt would probably be a lot easier.
But I imagine that Avery wants to be a HC, and I'm sure there will be a team willing to offer him that position. So the whole discussion is probably academic.
aj 23-24 in playoffs enough said
Sources close to the situation have since disclosed that Mavericks owner Mark Cuban actually considered dismissing Johnson before the playoffs, specifically after Cuban and Johnson engaged in an emotional argument after a March 18 home loss to the Lakers.
bulls are already thinking of hiring him
good
I feel bad for the guy because of the whole Jason Kidd thing. However, I could not stand him when he would coach against us.
I wish him the best if this rumor is true.
I said this year it would be dirk or aj gone
I don't recall if AJ was still here or not when Kerr joined the team and am too lazy to look it up. What is the relationship between those two or does anyone know?
Also, the irony of Avery "I will not be mishandled" Johnson coaching Steve Nash would be something.
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