Big Man Needed: The Alternative Draft and Offseason View

[Mr. Body]

Much of the board's generated posts around Marcus Bryant's Draft Profiles have been around wing and SG prospects, with a PG thrown in (Chalmers). This is not remiss, there is no doubting the team badly needs scoring, youth, and athleticism to refresh its perimeter players. Rush, Lee, Batum, CDR are all good prospects...

But are we barking up the wrong tree? Since the beginning of the Duncan era, for more than a decade now, the prevailing team philosophy for defense required two shot-blockers on the floor at all times, or as much as possible. When Robinson retired we shifted to Rasho Nesterovic and then added Nazr Mohammed. When we got rid of those guys, we at least had Francisco Elson. But then, when we traded Elson off, suddenly we only have one guy of any real shot-blocking threat left: Duncan himself. (I discount Horry, who is (was) more an opportunistic shot-blocker.) One of the reasons for a gradual decline in defensive prowess team-wide could be a lack of another guy guarding the rim.

Now, with the loss of Splitter, himself not known as a shot-blocker but at least having the length and timing to have the potential (1 block/game is enough), where do we turn? The roster is littered with big men who are fairly immobile and do not help in this department. The team may consider themselves backed in to a corner here and required to select a big man with their first pick. I'm not so sure they'll pick a wing.

What are the possibilities?

Robertas Javtokas -- don't think there is any contact there any more.

Francisco Elson -- he is a free agent and for all his addled charm, serves in this regard, has the length to perhaps bother Odom or Gasol.

Drafting -- Koufos, Lopez, Ibaka, Ajinca, Hibbert

Any ideas here?

[kobyz]

it's sucks that Splitter not come, he could be all that we need

[Pistons < Spurs]

The Pistons also need to get a decent big, and I've not been real encouraged by who looks to be available in this draft. There are some guys who appear to be fairly intriguing prospects down the road, but they're the far from sure things, and none of them are ready to contribute now.


I know some of you Spur fans follow the D league, and I was wondering if there's any talent there worth looking into?

[Mr. Body]

The Pistons also need to get a decent big, and I've not been real encouraged by who looks to be available in this draft. There are some guys who appear to be fairly intriguing prospects down the road, but they're the far from sure things, and none of them are ready to contribute now.


I know some of you Spur fans follow the D league, and I was wondering if there's any talent there worth looking into?

Do you guys need a PF or a C? There seem to be scads of them in the draft, but I agree it's hard to be sold on any. Cs are littering the board, but almost none of them are sure things. Talking about the second half of the first on (and Brooks Lopez is likely overrated), where most of them will be. I see perhaps two guys who can contribute at C fairly quickly (Hibbert, R. Lopez) simply because they can rebound and block shots as plug-ins. The rest are question marks.

For PF there are good prospects near the end of the round, guys like Hickson and DJ White, and Dorsey at least can bang around. But like you say, there's not a lot of proven quan y there.

I've heard Dumars has promised DJ. White. Anything about this?

The last two years have generated at least one very nice PF in the second round (Carl Landry, Paul Millsap). So who is the undersized workhorse people will overlook this year?

[SenorSpur]

Much of the board's generated posts around Marcus Bryant's Draft Profiles have been around wing and SG prospects, with a PG thrown in (Chalmers). This is not remiss, there is no doubting the team badly needs scoring, youth, and athleticism to refresh its perimeter players. Rush, Lee, Batum, CDR are all good prospects...

But are we barking up the wrong tree? Since the beginning of the Duncan era, for more than a decade now, the prevailing team philosophy for defense required two shot-blockers on the floor at all times, or as much as possible. When Robinson retired we shifted to Rasho Nesterovic and then added Nazr Mohammed. When we got rid of those guys, we at least had Francisco Elson. But then, when we traded Elson off, suddenly we only have one guy of any real shot-blocking threat left: Duncan himself. (I discount Horry, who is (was) more an opportunistic shot-blocker.) One of the reasons for a gradual decline in defensive prowess team-wide could be a lack of another guy guarding the rim.

Now, with the loss of Splitter, himself not known as a shot-blocker but at least having the length and timing to have the potential (1 block/game is enough), where do we turn? The roster is littered with big men who are fairly immobile and do not help in this department. The team may consider themselves backed in to a corner here and required to select a big man with their first pick. I'm not so sure they'll pick a wing.

What are the possibilities?

Robertas Javtokas -- don't think there is any contact there any more.

Francisco Elson -- he is a free agent and for all his addled charm, serves in this regard, has the length to perhaps bother Odom or Gasol.

Drafting -- Koufos, Lopez, Ibaka, Ajinca, Hibbert

Any ideas here?

Two words:
Desgana Diop

[Mr. Body]

Two words:
Desgana Diop

Thumbs up to that. MLE to Diop (probably necessary for the whole thing); get your wing in the draft.

[Pistons < Spurs]

Do you guys need a PF or a C? There seem to be scads of them in the draft, but I agree it's hard to be sold on any. Cs are littering the board, but almost none of them are sure things. Talking about the second half of the first on (and Brooks Lopez is likely overrated), where most of them will be. I see perhaps two guys who can contribute at C fairly quickly (Hibbert, R. Lopez) simply because they can rebound and block shots as plug-ins. The rest are question marks.

For PF there are good prospects near the end of the round, guys like Hickson and DJ White, and Dorsey at least can bang around. But like you say, there's not a lot of proven quan y there.

I've heard Dumars has promised DJ. White. Anything about this?

The last two years have generated at least one very nice PF in the second round (Carl Landry, Paul Millsap). So who is the undersized workhorse people will overlook this year?

C is a bigger need.

Dice is great, I love the guy. But he's no C. And he may be retiring. That leaves us w/ just Chiekh Samb who's long, thin and extremely raw. He's probably still in the D league this year.

A lot depends on what Dumars does in the off season regarding Sheed.

The assumption is that he's getting traded. Teams will want him for his expiring contract.

What may be more fantasy than reality is the hope of getting someone like Brand or Okafor in a trade. Sheed has the LB connection w/ the Bobcats aswell as the whole North Carolina thing.

Max may in my view also be shipped. He's a dynamic player at times, but consistency hurts him. Being undersized as he is, I don't think he's a legitimate starter. And he's also in the way of Amir Johnson who the organization has high hopes for. There's no minutes for him being stuck as the 3rd PF.

We've heard the draftexpress claim that we have a promise to DJ White...but there's been no other news regarding that. I know we were very high last year on DeVon Hardin before he pulled out of the draft.

Hardin might be the most ready and best fit for us at PF. And Jason Thompson might be the best available C. But I'm not thrilled with either of them.

[kobyz]

we have to get another big to help Duncan against: Gasol/Bynum, O'Neal/Stoudemire, Chandler/West, Spiltter was perfect for this - it's 100% that is not come?

[Mulletino]

Bring Ron Artest or Rasheed Wallace

[SenorSpur]

Thumbs up to that. MLE to Diop (probably necessary for the whole thing); get your wing in the draft.

...and a big to you, Mr. Body, for addressing this question to the masses. The decline in the vaunted Spurs defense is not only evident to many of us who watch the games religiously, but also can be measured by a drop in the one key statistic that Pop has generally focused on to measure his defensive effectiveness - Opp FG%.

The Spurs ranked 5th in the league in opposition FG% this season:

BOS - .419
HOU - .433
DET - .437
DAL - .443
SAS - .444

While this may not be too terribly bad, the Spurs have typcially hovered around the 43% - 41% range during the heyday of the Twin Towers.

The Splitter situation makes this weakness in the paint even more of an issue. I still favor them getting another wing in FA. However, if the Spurs could come out of this offseason with both Diop and a surprise rookie swingman (i.e. Rush or Batum) that would be a good pair.

Now I'm going to get greedy and wonder if they could split their MLE between Diop and Pietrus? IF Diop is out of their price range, I wouldn't have an issue with them bringing back Elson. Of course at that price, I would expect Pietrus to soon follow him too.

[Marcus Bryant]

I think you go with a 4th scorer over a shotblocking big with your MLE. Diop would be nice as a reserve big, but if you can get a 22 year old scoring SG, you do it at this point. Too much rides on Manu to produce at a high level. This regular season he had to shoulder a huge amount of the load during a stretch in the regular season and that was part of the reason his ass was worn out by the WCF, IMO.

Diop's averaging 15 minutes a night as a 26 year old big. He gives you very little scoring. Plus the game is moving away from his style.

Javtokas is not a bad idea. If he'd come over for 2 years at the LLE, I think you have to consider it.

[tav1]

I agree that a second shot blocker would be a great help, but I think a 4th scorer on the wing is more pressing. Beside, we have Mahinmi and Thomas (in all liklihood) so I think we should see a little improvement. I'd rather give Mahinmi a chance to prove himself than sign someone like Elson. Floor time will only help him.

[spursfan98]

...and a big to you, Mr. Body, for addressing this question to the masses. The decline in the vaunted Spurs defense is not only evident to many of us who watch the games religiously, but also can be measured by a drop in the one key statistic that Pop has generally focused on to measure his defensive effectiveness - Opp FG%.

The Spurs ranked 5th in the league in opposition FG% this season:

BOS - .419
HOU - .433
DET - .437
DAL - .443
SAS - .444

While this may not be too terribly bad, the Spurs have typcially hovered around the 43% - 41% range during the heyday of the Twin Towers.

The Splitter situation makes this weakness in the paint even more of an issue. I still favor them getting another wing in FA. However, if the Spurs could come out of this offseason with both Diop and a surprise rookie swingman (i.e. Rush or Batum) that would be a good pair.

Now I'm going to get greedy and wonder if they could split their MLE between Diop and Pietrus? IF Diop is out of their price range, I wouldn't have an issue with them bringing back Elson. Of course at that price, I would expect Pietrus to soon follow him too.

Pietrus and Diop should be at the top of the list. Pietrus is more important but if we cant get both id be happy with either of them. It depends on who we draft but getting elson back is a bad idea. he wasnt very good and hes not young and thats what we need

[spursfan98]

Also we should try to trade oberto and bonner together. i know its not a great package but if we add splitters rights and maybe a 2nd round future pick we could get someone who actually can hold on to the ball and block shots

[mrspurs]

ive said it all along......we need another big to help timmy....teams pretty much had their will with us in the paint...ive seen mahinmi play alot....he isnt the answer at all...maybe after another season....we need help now....or all our shooters will make no difference against all the youth that scored on us in the paint.....find a big .........go spurs go

[td4mvp21]

Diop would be ideal. I think the Spurs should really attempt to sign him. He is a great shot blocker, good post defender, and more mobile than your average center. I say keep KT, I like what he brings to the table.

However, what about for small ball? Unfortunately, the Spurs will be forced to play it at multiple points in the season. We need a very mobile big or a long SF to do that. I'm sick of playing Finley or Udoka (6'5'' players) at power forward.

[SenorSpur]

I think you go with a 4th scorer over a shotblocking big with your MLE. Diop would be nice as a reserve big, but if you can get a 22 year old scoring SG, you do it at this point. Too much rides on Manu to produce at a high level. This regular season he had to shoulder a huge amount of the load during a stretch in the regular season and that was part of the reason his ass was worn out by the WCF, IMO.

I agree completely. I just wonder that, because Pop has such a man-crush on Manu, if he'd even trust another wing player enough to give him minutes and opportunities - especially a rookie. Still, I agree with you. Manu was dogged and ragged and the Spurs had no Plan B option who could provide some of those same skills. Breakdown a defense, get to the rack, drive and kick, hit the outside j.

Diop's averaging 15 minutes a night as a 26 year old big. He gives you very little scoring. Plus the game is moving away from his style.

Based on the arrival of the Fakers this season and them having Bynum come back next sesason, their frontline will be even taller and more imposing. Let's also not forget Oden coming back from injury in Portland. The Spurs have to match that type of size with another big of their own. Diop would give the team the necessary size, defense, and rebounding to combat such a frontline. I don't ever want to see Duncan outmanned again going up against 2 or 3 oppsoing 7-ft players. Guys like Oberto and KT are physical but they cannot match that type of size.

[Spur-Addict]

I agree completely. I just wonder that, because Pop has such a man-crush on Manu, if he'd even trust another wing player enough to give him minutes and opportunities - especially a rookie. Still, I agree with you. Manu was dogged and ragged and the Spurs had no Plan B option who could provide some of those same skills. Breakdown a defense, get to the rack, drive and kick, hit the outside j.



Based on the arrival of the Fakers this season and them having Bynum come back next sesason, their frontline will be even taller and more imposing. Let's also not forget Oden coming back from injury in Portland. The Spurs have to match that type of size with another big of their own. Diop would give the team the necessary size, defense, and rebounding to combat such a frontline. I don't ever want to see Duncan outmanned again going up against 2 or 3 oppsoing 7-ft players. Guys like Oberto and KT are physical but they cannot match that type of size.

EXACTLY, we do need scoring as well. They just better address both, PERIOD. Although we couldn't score at times, rebounding killed us. Gotta protect the paint and glass. We'll find someone who can score, there are always people like that in the league.

[SenorSpur]

EXACTLY, we do need scoring as well. They just better address both, PERIOD. Although we couldn't score at times, rebounding killed us. Gotta protect the paint and glass. We'll find someone who can score, there are always people like that in the league.

Because these are both priorities, there should be no reason the FO doesn't accomplish BOTH.

[MoSpur]

What about Ian?

[SlovenianGuy]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned Kwame Brown and Andrea Bargnani.

Kwame Brown is athletic and could be the other half of the twin towers if he decided to play with some effort. He has more upside than all of the Spurs' centers in the last few year and shouldn't be too expensive, but signing him is a huge gamble.

Andrea Bargnani is actually pretty decent defender when it comes to guarding his own man, but his help defense is non existent. If he could make open shots he might be just the right player to play together with Tim. On the other hand it's clear (at least for me) that Andrea and Bosh can not play with each other. The problem is that the Raptors might not be ready to trade him before they give him another chance to prove he can contribute.

[Spur-Addict]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned Kwame Brown and Andrea Bargnani.
Kwame Brown is athletic and could be the other half of the twin towers if he decided to play with some effort. He has more upside than all of the Spurs' centers in the last few year and shouldn't be too expensive, but signing him is a huge gamble.

Andrea Bargnani is actually pretty decent defender when it comes to guarding his own man, but his help defense is non existent. If he could make open shots he might be just the right player to play together with Tim. On the other hand it's clear (at least for me) that Andrea and Bosh can not play with each other. The problem is that the Raptors might not be ready to trade him before they give him another chance to prove he can contribute.

Don't be suprised, you shouldn't be. Kwame is like the Big kid from the boys and girls club, he can only dominate the little people (PHX in playoffs). I'd prefer Fran back before Kwame. Barg is soft, and he couldn't produce in the east playoffs against orlando. ORLANDO!..... ...and they really needed him.

[Bruno]

Sign Patrick O'Bryant and Kurt Thomas. Spurs should spend the MLE and their first round draft pick on perimeter players.

[AA2120]

josh duncan from xavier in the 2nd round...

[ChumpDumper]

The Pistons also need to get a decent big, and I've not been real encouraged by who looks to be available in this draft. There are some guys who appear to be fairly intriguing prospects down the road, but they're the far from sure things, and none of them are ready to contribute now.


I know some of you Spur fans follow the D league, and I was wondering if there's any talent there worth looking into?

There was only one true center left that played at a noteworthy level after Lance Allred was called up by Cleveland. Chris Alexander actually has better size and defense than Allred, but his offense is pretty rudimentary. Pretty much IR/spot-minute material, but if you don't have already have a seven footer over 260, he'd be worth a look.