Elton Snake?

[baseline bum]

This is bull that people are calling Brand out. He was perfectly willing to take less (his Philly contract averages $14 million a year, while he opted out of a $16.4 million contract). There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Brand wanted to remain a Clipper. He loved playing for them. The Clippers pulled a move by saying they would renounce him to sign Davis, thus making it impossible for them to offer a 6th year on the contract. That's a huge slap in the face to Brand, who's the best player the team has had since McAdoo.

[BacktoBasics]

It's not like Cleveland AT ALL. Brand opted out on his own accord. The Clips put a clause in his contract to opt out and he took it.

Boozer's contract had a TEAM option. Cleveland wanted to lock him up long term and let him out with a gentlemens agreement that he would re-sign. And Boozer ed them in the ass.

Brand never made any promise to anyone. . regardless of what he said for PR purposes. He did the right thing IMO, he took the offer that was best for him and the situation that was the best.

Couldn't agree more.

It was his option to take and the Clips did what they thought was enough to retain him but in the end it wasn't. Brand had the freedom to choose where he wanted to play and no where ever did he go public saying that he was commited to LA other than stating that he'd like to work out a deal. In the end they couldn't.

Its ridiculous to be pissed at Brand.

Now what Boozer did was completely different.

[SenorSpur]

What do you guys think? For a guy who's always been portrayed as one of the NBA's classiest players this was the kind of move that could destroy that reputation.

The man opted out to supposedly allow the Clippers more flexibility in signing a top FA point guard. Brand specifically said he would like to see Baron Davis as a Clipper. The Clippers sign Baron, one would assume Brand would follow and allow the Clippers to field a team of Baron, Brand, Thornton, Kaman, Mobley.....but instead the mother er jumps ship to Philly leaving Baron behind.

This has to be one of the lowest and snakiest moves I've seen in a long time.

....Clippers got Boozerized. Is there a connection here, as both Boozer and Brand went to Duke. Hmmmmmmmm!

[Sportcamper]

All-Star players do not play for the Clippers….

Elton is too good to remain with LA's J.V. Squad...

[Supergirl]

Obviously the situations are not identical, and obviously we do not REALLY know what goes on behind closed doors. But the facts, as they have been reported, are still similar:

In both cases, Brand and Boozer had informal conversations with their team owners about how to make the finances work so they could build a contender. Davis reportedly came to L.A. ON THE PREMISE ALONE that Brand would be there with him. Without that promise, I doubt Davis comes - why would he? He leaves a crappy team for an even crappier one? Come on. Boozer indicated he would sign with Cleveland, but then reneged. In both cases, though the details are different, the players behaved in a way I think is unethical. Does it happen in the business world all the time? Sure. But I would cut ties with anyone *I* knew who did business that way.

[greensborohill]

Obviously the situations are not identical, and obviously we do not REALLY know what goes on behind closed doors. But the facts, as they have been reported, are still similar:

In both cases, Brand and Boozer had informal conversations with their team owners about how to make the finances work so they could build a contender. Davis reportedly came to L.A. ON THE PREMISE ALONE that Brand would be there with him. Without that promise, I doubt Davis comes - why would he? He leaves a crappy team for an even crappier one? Come on. Boozer indicated he would sign with Cleveland, but then reneged. In both cases, though the details are different, the players behaved in a way I think is unethical. Does it happen in the business world all the time? Sure. But I would cut ties with anyone *I* knew who did business that way.

Bull ,

you can call Boozer unethical if you want. . . . I don't really see taking a deal worth 30 mil more as unethical, Cleveland should have known that there was a chance that could happen. they screwed up BIG TIME on that. But Brand on the other hand, never gave anyone his word that he would stay with the Clippers. I'm sure he and Baron spoke about playing together, but Baron is his own ing man, and lookie lookie, Baron went to the Clips b/c the deal had an extra year guaranteed. . so don't make Baron out yo be a ing moral saint in this situation, he got his pot of gold at the end of the rainbow that he wanted. Brand opted out on his own accord, said that he would like to stay with the Clipp's, got a better deal and took it. That's what free agency is. . YOU ARE FREE TO GO WHEREVER THE YOU WANT!! GET IT??

You and I could only wish to be in his situation. So take your ethics and shove it.

[greensborohill]

Plus, Philly wasn't even an option on the table when Brand opted out. Philly made mad moves to get Brand in the mix. And I guarantee all of you would be laughing to the ing bank of the Spurs had pulled this and gotten Brand or Pierce, or someone of that nature. So don't shove your ing morals and ethics down everyones throat. Brand did what was best for him. It's not like Baron, Sterling, etc. are gonna be sleeping on a ing park bench tonight with the L.A. Times as a blanket.

[Obstructed_View]

I heard a report on the radio this morning that Brand called Baron Davis, notified him that he was opting out and asked Baron to come to LA to play with him. If that's the truth, then what he did was ed up, plain and simple. It's a lot of money, and it was his option. You can even say whatever you want to your employer just to get more money, but Baron might have liked to go somewhere other than the Clippers and if he signs with them, it's probably partially because he wants to stick to his commitment.

[endrity]

Anyone remember that Mike Krzyewski commercial of a couple of years ago, with American Express. How he said that he wanted his players to become better men in life.

Well, I guess those players failed to show up for Coach K's Ethics 101 class.

[greensborohill]

I heard a report on the radio this morning that Brand called Baron Davis, notified him that he was opting out and asked Baron to come to LA to play with him. If that's the truth, then what he did was ed up, plain and simple. It's a lot of money, and it was his option. You can even say whatever you want to your employer just to get more money, but Baron might have liked to go somewhere other than the Clippers and if he signs with them, it's probably partially because he wants to stick to his commitment.

Then have Baron back out of the verbal agreement.

Oops, sorry Baron I changed my mind, now your stuck with a ruch azz contract. . . my bad"

Cry me a river for Baron Davis b/c I care so damn much.

[JamStone]

This is bull that people are calling Brand out. He was perfectly willing to take less (his Philly contract averages $14 million a year, while he opted out of a $16.4 million contract). There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Brand wanted to remain a Clipper. He loved playing for them. The Clippers pulled a move by saying they would renounce him to sign Davis, thus making it impossible for them to offer a 6th year on the contract. That's a huge slap in the face to Brand, who's the best player the team has had since McAdoo.

I think that's only partly accurate.

To me, what seemed to happened based on a lot of the rumors that are being reported is that Brand was willing to opt out in order to take less so the Clippers could sign Baron Davis. That wasn't the problem. The reported problem is that after the Clippers secured Baron Davis, they took a hardline stance on Brand, gave him a "take it or leave it" contract with their first offer with no room to negotiate at all. Apparently, Brand was offended by that. After Philly made their offer, the Clippers' at ude changed and were willing to negotiate but it was too late, and the fact that Elton Brand's agent had something against the Clippers hurt the Clips even more because at that point, he wasn't returning their calls and Brand wasn't really getting the impression the Clippers were then willing to negotiate. It's a job on the Clippers part all the way around. It's not to say that Elton Brand handled the situation really well, but the Clippers put themselves in the position they found themselves. It's their own fault. Still, I don't see many similarities at all with the Boozer-Cleveland situation a few years back.

[nickdakoolkat]

As far as I'm concerned the clippers had it coming to them. They conived and snuck around NBA rules by convincing Baron to opt out and commit to them before they could legally do so. They promised him the potential hook up of Baron and Brand...but what they didn't realize is that NBA players have egos and when push comes to shove 98% of players will take the money with Bowen and Duncan being the 2 exceptions. As i warrior fan I knew the situation would not end up good for hte clipps reguardless because karma is a , so the le of this thread should be called Clippers Front Office Snakes Get What they deserve?

[jack sommerset]

Comparing Boozer to Brand is wrong. Cavs let Boozer out of his contract. They still had him signed. The Cavs said we will not pick up his option next year. They made a deal to pay the guy more NOW, well then. Boozer said thanks guys thats mighty nice of you, you guys are willing to pay me more and you don't even have to. Yes if you let me out of my contract I promise not to sign with another team and sign a long term deal with you for more money. Opps, he bolted. Thats cold blooded.

[Obstructed_View]

Then have Baron back out of the verbal agreement.

Oops, sorry Baron I changed my mind, now your stuck with a ruch azz contract. . . my bad"

Cry me a river for Baron Davis b/c I care so damn much.

Baron's word would then be as useless as Brand's is. "Oops, sorry Baron I changed my mind, now it's too late for you to shop yourself as a free agent and you're stuck with the smaller contract you took when you thought I'd be there and you're stuck on the Clippers while Maggette and I move on for as much money as we can squeeze out of everyone."

They conived and snuck around NBA rules by convincing Baron to opt out and commit to them before they could legally do so.

Wow, I hadn't heard that one. Link, please.

[JamStone]

As far as I'm concerned the clippers had it coming to them. They conived and snuck around NBA rules by convincing Baron to opt out and commit to them before they could legally do so. They promised him the potential hook up of Baron and Brand...but what they didn't realize is that NBA players have egos and when push comes to shove 98% of players will take the money with Bowen and Duncan being the 2 exceptions. As i warrior fan I knew the situation would not end up good for hte clipps reguardless because karma is a , so the le of this thread should be called Clippers Front Office Snakes Get What they deserve?

There is constant references of Duncan and Bowen being exceptions. Where does this stem from? Duncan took a paycut on his extension. He still got a max deal from the Spurs. How did he take less? Duncan isn't the first to take less on an extension. Garnett restructured his mega-deal and took a huge paycut with his extension starting next year. Why are Duncan and Bowen the exceptions? As for Bowen, what team was willing to offer him so much more money? Taking maybe $2-3 million less over the course of a few years doesn't exactly scream world class philanthropist. Duncan and Bowen aren't exceptions. Duncan still got a max deal from the Spurs. And Bowen wasn't giving up much money at all by returning to the Spurs.

[Obstructed_View]

I think that's only partly accurate.

To me, what seemed to happened based on a lot of the rumors that are being reported is that Brand was willing to opt out in order to take less so the Clippers could sign Baron Davis. That wasn't the problem. The reported problem is that after the Clippers secured Baron Davis, they took a hardline stance on Brand, gave him a "take it or leave it" contract with their first offer with no room to negotiate at all. Apparently, Brand was offended by that. After Philly made their offer, the Clippers' at ude changed and were willing to negotiate but it was too late, and the fact that Elton Brand's agent had something against the Clippers hurt the Clips even more because at that point, he wasn't returning their calls and Brand wasn't really getting the impression the Clippers were then willing to negotiate. It's a job on the Clippers part all the way around. It's not to say that Elton Brand handled the situation really well, but the Clippers put themselves in the position they found themselves. It's their own fault. Still, I don't see many similarities at all with the Boozer-Cleveland situation a few years back.

If that's the case, I said before that Davis should consider that a breach of the agreement and back out of his commitment to LA on principle. That would cost him a lot of money, though, since there's no way to do a S&T.

[DaDakota]

This for all you idiots who forgot how the Boozer thing went down. . .

Boozer did the right thing...he made $31 million more.......with a career that could go up in one knee injury......he did the right thing.....

I would have done it, and if people are honest amongst themselves they would have done it too.

DD

[ElNono]

money talks

[The Franchise]

Boozer did the right thing...he made $31 million more.......with a career that could go up in one knee injury......he did the right thing.....

I would have done it, and if people are honest amongst themselves they would have done it too.

DD

Nah!!! 31 million can't compared to the feeling of looking your teammates in the eye, and going into battle knowing you have their respect. BULL !!!!

[MarHill]

There is constant references of Duncan and Bowen being exceptions. Where does this stem from? Duncan took a paycut on his extension. He still got a max deal from the Spurs. How did he take less? Duncan isn't the first to take less on an extension. Garnett restructured his mega-deal and took a huge paycut with his extension starting next year. Why are Duncan and Bowen the exceptions? As for Bowen, what team was willing to offer him so much more money? Taking maybe $2-3 million less over the course of a few years doesn't exactly scream world class philanthropist. Duncan and Bowen aren't exceptions. Duncan still got a max deal from the Spurs. And Bowen wasn't giving up much money at all by returning to the Spurs.

JamStone,

I agreed with you about Duncan and Bowen. But, Duncan left 12 million on the table with this extension and that's what people are reacting too. Also, the perception looks like he left money on the table and he helped the Spurs out..as well.

However, I agree with your earlier post that we don't know what goes behind close doors in a negotation. Elton Brand deserves to get as much as he can. I don't have problem with that.

But, if he gave his word to Davis that he would stay...if he came to Clippers then I would I have a problem with that. Also, that he told Clippers he would stay even after he opted-out. That's a problem.

You have stand behind your word or at least be honest with it. (For example with Corey Maggette if he would have said...I'm looking to get paid since I've opted-out from Clippers. Then I would respect that. He has every right to get as much as money as he can....he's free agent. That's cool with me. But don't say I want to win and I will take less money to play for championship contender. Then sign with for the first team that pays him the most money. If you speak something...you will always be tested by those words.)

Yes, I still believe that I will trust a man's word until he proves me otherwise. This is a old, moral truth that is still revelant in today's post-modern, truth-is-relative world.

[JamStone]

JamStone,

I agreed with you about Duncan and Bowen. But, Duncan left 12 million on the table with this extension and that's what people are reacting too. Also, the perception looks like he left money on the table and he helped the Spurs out..as well.

Duncan left $12 million on the table after his previous contract and extension paid him over $140 million. Let's keep it in perspective. And it's not like he takes a paycut to like $10 million a year. He'll go from something like $22 million to $18 million. KG takes a $8 million paycut starting next season. And, Duncan's not the first, last, or only NBA player to take somewhat of a paycut later on in his career after making a load of money. Like I said earlier, KG actually took a much bigger paycut with his last negotiations for an extension and he often got blasted by Spurs fans for being the reason the Wolves couldn't get talent around him. Brand left money on the table.

Baron Davis left money on the table. And, there are plenty of examples in previous summers of players taking discounts to play for a team they wanted to play for.

I'm not saying Duncan didn't help the Spurs at all with his last negotiations for an extension. I'm saying he isn't this "saint" of a person who is a one of kind player choosing winning over money. He's made a load of money. He took a small paycut on an extension after making about as much as a player can make in his first 12 years in the league. Most players' careers are done by 12 years. Him taking a paycut now was really nothing to write about. Yet, there are Spurs fans talking about how Duncan is like the only player who would choose winning over money. That's my problem. He never had to choose winning over money. He's always gotten paid like a motha in pimp. That's my point.

I know you're not really disagreeing with me. Just wanted to add more clarification.

I'm cool with the rest of what you wrote in your post. Only addition is that athletes say all the time. I have no problem with what Maggette said. Do we take stuff that Chad Johnson or T.O. or Manny Ramirez or Charles Barkley or Damon Jones say too seriously or with a grain of salt? It was just talk. Maggette aint the first or last either.

[MarHill]

Duncan left $12 million on the table after his previous contract and extension paid him over $140 million. Let's keep it in perspective. And it's not like he takes a paycut to like $10 million a year. He'll go from something like $22 million to $18 million. KG takes a $8 million paycut starting next season. And, Duncan's not the first, last, or only NBA player to take somewhat of a paycut later on in his career after making a load of money. Like I said earlier, KG actually took a much bigger paycut with his last negotiations for an extension and he often got blasted by Spurs fans for being the reason the Wolves couldn't get talent around him. Brand left money on the table.

Baron Davis left money on the table. And, there are plenty of examples in previous summers of players taking discounts to play for a team they wanted to play for.

I'm not saying Duncan didn't help the Spurs at all with his last negotiations for an extension. I'm saying he isn't this "saint" of a person who is a one of kind player choosing winning over money. He's made a load of money. He took a small paycut on an extension after making about as much as a player can make in his first 12 years in the league. Most players' careers are done by 12 years. Him taking a paycut now was really nothing to write about. Yet, there are Spurs fans talking about how Duncan is like the only player who would choose winning over money. That's my problem. He never had to choose winning over money. He's always gotten paid like a motha in pimp. That's my point.

I know you're not really disagreeing with me. Just wanted to add more clarification.

I'm cool with the rest of what you wrote in your post. Only addition is that athletes say all the time. I have no problem with what Maggette said. Do we take stuff that Chad Johnson or T.O. or Manny Ramirez or Charles Barkley or Damon Jones say too seriously or with a grain of salt? It was just talk. Maggette aint the first or last either.

Yes...I agree with you. I'm a huge Duncan fan...but I know he's no saint. It's much easier to take a pay cut....when you have made millions!!! LOL!!

I know that athletes saying things publicly all the time...to make themselves look good. I'm not that naive. However, my main thing...if they said something privately...then honor your word.

Also, I would prefer they come out and say I want to get paid. I'm a free agent and I'm looking for a big payday. Don't pretend....I will respect you more.

[angelbelow]

i had great respect for brand, hes a hard worker and a classy guy. i no longer think those things.

[DaDakota]

i had great respect for brand, hes a hard worker and a classy guy. i no longer think those things.

I am sure he cares what you think, no wait.....I am sure he doesn't.

DD

[Condemned 2 HelLA]

This is bull that people are calling Brand out. He was perfectly willing to take less (his Philly contract averages $14 million a year, while he opted out of a $16.4 million contract). There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Brand wanted to remain a Clipper. He loved playing for them. The Clippers pulled a move by saying they would renounce him to sign Davis, thus making it impossible for them to offer a 6th year on the contract. That's a huge slap in the face to Brand, who's the best player the team has had since McAdoo.

There was word late today on 570 that they were going to renounce the contracts of guys like Dan au and Quentin Ross among others so that they could clear enough room to give Brand about $81 million. Ultimately the Clipper deal was better than what the Sixers wanted to give him, but Elton and his agent really had to jerk the Clippers chain in order for them to offer him not one, but TWO deals. At that point, he felt disrespected enough by the team to pretty much just say 'screw you guys, I'm going home', and that was that.
There was also a rumor that the Clips wouldn't put a no-trade clause in the deal either, which apparently made his decision that much easier.