George Hill greatest FO draft blunder of All Time.

[Extra Stout]

One must understand something about SequSpur. He only appears to hold these strong yet dumb opinions. He really is just trying to get a rise out of people for humor value. This is because he is a troll in real life, as becomes obvious when one meets him in person.

[TJastal]

, I think the rockets should send the spurs FO a very sincere thank you note for everything they've done the past couple years....

Spurs:

1. Let Donte Greene slip past #26, allowing rockets to take advantage. (Nah, don't pick up a talented swingman you dumb s, use your #1 pick to take an undersized shooting guard and try to convert him to backup point guard) Rockets: Ka-Ching!

2. Signed Matt Bonner and ushered Luis Scola to the rockets. Rockets: Ka-ching!

3. Turned their back on a still very capable veteran Brent Barry, whom the rockets promptly sign. Rockets: Ka-Ching!

Is there more I'm forgetting?

[rj215]

Wow the greatest FO draft blunder of all time with out a game played??

Why not let the kid get a few games under his belt that count before we go and throw him under the bus?

+1

[Bartleby]

Getting a legitimate starting small forward from either draft or free agency should have been numero uno priority and that didn't really get accomplished unless you count their second round pick of Gist, who looks to me like he's going to be more of 4 than a 3.... and being 2nd round pick its not like they were counting on it.

They let a golden opportunity slip by to obtain a legit starting 3 in the draft, when Donte Green fell into their laps at #26 who coincidentally has been tearing apart the summer league averaging 20+ a game. He was the best small forward on the board at that point, and many felt should have been a lottery pick. Maybe they figured they would plug that hole via free agency, but I feel when the opportunity is there to fill a #1 priority you take it, and they whiffed big-time on that one.

I disagree. Gist has shown the speed and the skill set to make it as a 3 in the NBA. I can also see him playing the 4 in small ball situations, but as he gets more range on his shot he will probably see more time at the 3.

Also, when you compare what Gist and Green have done in the summer leagues, Gist has actually outperformed green from a statistical standpoint. Green had two great, high scoring games, and two crappy ones. His shooting percentages are lower than Gist's, and Gist is a much better rebounder.

Question becomes, why would they deem a backup pg was their greatest need? They have traditionally let Manu run the offense when Parker sits, and they also have Jacque Vaughn, who is servicable and knows the system. Signing Barry was another possibility at that point as well.

The alternatives you suggest are short term stop-gap solutions at best, not the sort of plan I would want to see the Spurs use for the entire season, much less the playoffs.

Manu is too turnover prone to play PG. Besides, it takes him out of his game if you have him brining the ball up the floor.

Vaughn is great on defense but horrible when it comes to offense. I'm sure the Spurs FO were just as tired as we fans were of how the offense grinded to a halt when he came in for Tony.

Barry has the handle, passing abilities, and court vision to play PG, but his lack of speed is a serious liability on defense and he appears to have become injury prone (since he is, in fact, closer to 40 than Bruce)

As it turns out they had yet another combo guard who can play pg on their radar all along, Roger Mason, whom not surprisingly signed. So why in all honesty did they not take Green if they were planning to go after Mason? Bowen is almost 40 years old, and Udoke is good in limited minutes only. There is a great need for a talented athletic swingman on this team.

Mason is a shooting guard (much more so than Hill), and keep in mind that while he may have been on their radar during the draft, it was not entirely clear how free agency was going to play out.

Bowen is no spring chicken, but he hasn't slowed down much and has basically played injury free since he first signed with the Spurs.

I thought Udoka played pretty well for the most part, and I expect him to be even better this year as he will be more used to the Spurs system.

So, yes, while I agree there was a need for a talented athletic swingman, the need to draft an athletic PG who can score was greater and quality point guards are harder to come by through free agency than small forwards.

[TJastal]

"So, yes, while I agree there was a need for a talented athletic swingman, the need to draft an athletic PG who can score was greater and quality point guards are harder to come by through free agency than small forwards."

Bartelby

I wanna address your entire reply piece by piece, but I'll lay off cuz its all a moot point now, what's done is done. I'll simply say that for the remaining few seasons of Duncan's prime, yes I think stopgaps at backup point guard would work just fine (Manu, Mason, Vaughn).. caveat being this also allows the spurs to go big. A project point guard like Hill that has played shooting guard mostly his entire life is really is rolling the dice.... I mean, even the pick itself makes no sense. Spurs needed that #1 to be plug n play.. if your going that route you go with pure point guard, Mario Chalmers would have clearly been the much better choice.

Hill is going to need more time to get acclimated to a position he's not used to playing, as evidenced by his struggles already in summer league. He's probably going to make alot more mistakes along the way, and with the level of compe ion in the west at an all time high he is likely to end up on the bench, or at best getting very limited "garbage" minutes, and Pop using those aformentioned "stop-gaps" anyway.

Udoka is a good career backup who can hustle, play defense, and make a few wide open shots once in awhile, but nowhere near what Donte Greene is going to be offensively. Bowen is closing in on 40 years old, and both are also shorter, around 6'5. Greene is everything they are not - young, tall, quick, athletic, and can score alot of points inside and out. He would have been starting by the 3rd week of the season. I think as far as priorities go for the spurs, obtaining a starting quality swingman should have trumped backup pg anyday. Also its alot easier IMO to find a backup point in FA than a starting quality 3.

[TJastal]

Oh, and about Gist, he is not going have the handles, speed, and shooting range of Greene, I can almost guarantee you that. But hey, I'll cross my fingers.

From everything I've heard and read about him, he will make it as a scrapper undersized 4, a Malik Rose type of player, but not the type of guy who is going to play starter minutes, score 18ppg and help spread the floor for Duncan

[Ocotillo]

Oh, and about Gist, he is not going have the handles, speed, and shooting range of Greene, I can almost guarantee you that. But hey, I'll cross my fingers.

From everything I've heard and read about him, he will make it as a scrapper undersized 4, a Malik Rose type of player, but not the type of guy who is going to play starter minutes, score 18ppg and help spread the floor for Duncan

The odds are huge against someone drafted at 57 to give you starter minutes. We all know Manu turned out to be that exception but if Gist turns into a role player than can give us some solid time on the floor as a 4 in small ball and be a defensive player at the 3, we should be pretty darn content to get an NBA role player at that position in the draft.

Manu is the exception. I would venture to say most second rounders end up overseas or in the D-league. If you can get a rotation player out of your second round pick(s), you are doing a pretty good job.

[TJastal]

The odds are huge against someone drafted at 57 to give you starter minutes. We all know Manu turned out to be that exception but if Gist turns into a role player than can give us some solid time on the floor as a 4 in small ball and be a defensive player at the 3, we should be pretty darn content to get an NBA role player at that position in the draft.

Manu is the exception. I would venture to say most second rounders end up overseas or in the D-league. If you can get a rotation player out of your second round pick(s), you are doing a pretty good job.

I think Gist has some potential to be a 7th or 8th man off the bench down the line, and like you said that is great for a #57 pick. I applaud that pick.

Its the #26 pick that has me scratching my head. Do you think Donte Green at #26 would have had the potential to step in as a starting 3 fairly quickly? Damn straight. Wasn't this the spurs' biggest need this off season, a starting quality swingman? Who can score.. alot? I thought so. Apparently however "backup point guard" is more important than a starting quality small forward in the cloudy thinking of the spurs FO.

[Bartleby]

I'm not so sure Donte is an NBA starter. Maybe in a couple of years, but I doubt he starts for the Rockets anytime soon. I am almost certain he wouldn't start for the Spurs this year. He has shown he can put points on the board, but it has taken him a lot of shots to do that and other parts of his game (the ones the Spurs would need him for) seem lacking.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Oh, and about Gist, he is not going have the handles, speed, and shooting range of Greene, I can almost guarantee you that. But hey, I'll cross my fingers.

From everything I've heard and read about him, he will make it as a scrapper undersized 4, a Malik Rose type of player, but not the type of guy who is going to play starter minutes, score 18ppg and help spread the floor for Duncan

That's nice. I guess it's too obvious to mention that we don't need an 18 PPG scorer, just someone to spread the floor for the big three and give Bowen some time to rest.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I think Gist has some potential to be a 7th or 8th man off the bench down the line, and like you said that is great for a #57 pick. I applaud that pick.

Its the #26 pick that has me scratching my head. Do you think Donte Green at #26 would have had the potential to step in as a starting 3 fairly quickly? Damn straight. Wasn't this the spurs' biggest need this off season, a starting quality swingman? Who can score.. alot? I thought so. Apparently however "backup point guard" is more important than a starting quality small forward in the cloudy thinking of the spurs FO.

So I guess you missed Greene's two subpar shooting performances in SL and choose to selectively pick which of his games you want to gush over...

Green wouldn't be starting in short order, put down the crack pipe.

And can we put the drama over the swing man position on hold? Free agency isn't near over with yet, some of you need to back away from the damn ledge.

We weren't getting a starting quality SF in the draft at 26, we aren't getting it in a weak FA class with only the MLE to spare, either.

Donte's definitely got potential, but it's a bit early to be annointing the guy as an All-Star, don't you think? Marco Belinelli, anyone?

[exstatic]

I think Gist has some potential to be a 7th or 8th man off the bench down the line, and like you said that is great for a #57 pick. I applaud that pick.

Its the #26 pick that has me scratching my head. Do you think Donte Green at #26 would have had the potential to step in as a starting 3 fairly quickly? Damn straight. Wasn't this the spurs' biggest need this off season, a starting quality swingman? Who can score.. alot? I thought so. Apparently however "backup point guard" is more important than a starting quality small forward in the cloudy thinking of the spurs FO.

The Spurs rate each position player by player for their draft board. Say they have needs at position A, B, and C. The draft board looks like the following, on a ten scale:

A 8.5
B 7
C 7.5

You draft position A, and don't even look back. Drafting college players based on college reputation got the Spurs Alfrederick Hughes. Don't believe the hype.

[jayc23]

One must understand something about SequSpur. He only appears to hold these strong yet dumb opinions. He really is just trying to get a rise out of people for humor value. This is because he is a troll in real life, as becomes obvious when one meets him in person.

more like a dwarf... hes self acclaimed 5'2... obviously the midget has never played a minute of high caliber basketball and just likes judging people

[jayc23]

+1

seriously if one more person responds to my post trying to disprove the le... you really are stupider than Seguspur.. read the post itself .. not just the le "dont judge a book by its cover"... the irony is your trying to defend George from a dig from one of his closest friends... when I'm just trying to get people to wait and watch George develop into a solid NBA player

[SPURSGOAT]

seriously if one more person responds to my post trying to disprove the le... you really are stupider than Seguspur.. read the post itself .. not just the le "dont judge a book by its cover"... the irony is your trying to defend George from a dig from one of his closest friends... when I'm just trying to get people to wait and watch George develop into a solid NBA player

Hill can start by not having disappointing showings like he did on Saturday. He went from looking like a first round pick in Friday's game then back to being like he was playing in Vegas SL on Saturday...

I still believe in the FO and am behind them 100% on the draft picks and signing of Mason. I still think that Hill will grow into a very solid NBA PG, but it is going to take some time and he will go through some growing pains of course...

[spurman20]

"So, yes, while I agree there was a need for a talented athletic swingman, the need to draft an athletic PG who can score was greater and quality point guards are harder to come by through free agency than small forwards."

Bartelby

I wanna address your entire reply piece by piece, but I'll lay off cuz its all a moot point now, what's done is done. I'll simply say that for the remaining few seasons of Duncan's prime, yes I think stopgaps at backup point guard would work just fine (Manu, Mason, Vaughn).. caveat being this also allows the spurs to go big. A project point guard like Hill that has played shooting guard mostly his entire life is really is rolling the dice.... I mean, even the pick itself makes no sense. Spurs needed that #1 to be plug n play.. if your going that route you go with pure point guard, Mario Chalmers would have clearly been the much better choice.

Hill is going to need more time to get acclimated to a position he's not used to playing, as evidenced by his struggles already in summer league. He's probably going to make alot more mistakes along the way, and with the level of compe ion in the west at an all time high he is likely to end up on the bench, or at best getting very limited "garbage" minutes, and Pop using those aformentioned "stop-gaps" anyway.

Udoka is a good career backup who can hustle, play defense, and make a few wide open shots once in awhile, but nowhere near what Donte Greene is going to be offensively. Bowen is closing in on 40 years old, and both are also shorter, around 6'5. Greene is everything they are not - young, tall, quick, athletic, and can score alot of points inside and out. He would have been starting by the 3rd week of the season. I think as far as priorities go for the spurs, obtaining a starting quality swingman should have trumped backup pg anyday. Also its alot easier IMO to find a backup point in FA than a starting quality 3.

Greene is very over hyped. He will never be a defender, He requires alot of shoots to get his points, he is a weak finisher and turnover prone and has a low BBall IQ.

He is the next Billy Owens and John Wallace, Hakeim Warrick.

[jayc23]

Hill can start by not having disappointing showings like he did on Saturday. He went from looking like a first round pick in Friday's game then back to being like he was playing in Vegas SL on Saturday...

I still believe in the FO and am behind them 100% on the draft picks and signing of Mason. I still think that Hill will grow into a very solid NBA PG, but it is going to take some time and he will go through some growing pains of course...

agreed.

[The Franchise]

Greene is very over hyped. He will never be a defender, He requires alot of shoots to get his points, he is a weak finisher and turnover prone and has a low BBall IQ.

He is the next Billy Owens and John Wallace, Hakeim Warrick.

Don't attack Donte Green because you like Hill. I think they both need some time to refine their games, but if it came down to a GM choosing between Hill or Greene, George Hill would be home fixing a bologna sandwich right now.

[SenorSpur]

Hill can start by not having disappointing showings like he did on Saturday. He went from looking like a first round pick in Friday's game then back to being like he was playing in Vegas SL on Saturday...

I still believe in the FO and am behind them 100% on the draft picks and signing of Mason. I still think that Hill will grow into a very solid NBA PG, but it is going to take some time and he will go through some growing pains of course...

Fortunately for Hill, he's got a stud like TP ahead of him, who went through the exact same growing pains and struggles. Both Parker and Vaughn will be an excellent tutors for this kid.

[knee-knee-3]

Don't attack Donte Green because you like Hill. I think they both need some time to refine their games, but if it came down to a GM choosing between Hill or Greene, George Hill would be home fixing a bologna sandwich right now.

Green doesn't board, doesn't defend, doesn't dish, doesn't bring anything consistent offensively - and he's superior to Hill? Hill can do at least three of these things right now, and it's freakin' July!

[The Franchise]

Green doesn't board, doesn't defend, doesn't dish, doesn't bring anything consistent offensively - and he's superior to Hill? Hill can do at least three of these things right now, and it's freakin' July!

Doesn't bring anything consistent offensively? You need to watch some Rockets Summer League games. He does play matador defense, but he can learn those fundamentals in training camp. There is nothing wrong with this kids ability to score (except for one stinker game he had) He is actually a good passer, and gets his teammates involved just ask Marty Liunnen. He is an ok rebounder, but you do expect more from someone with his height. Did I mention he's only 19? Overall he needs work,but yes he is better than Hill and will make more of an impact for his team.

[Mr. Body]

Don't attack Donte Green because you like Hill. I think they both need some time to refine their games, but if it came down to a GM choosing between Hill or Greene, George Hill would be home fixing a bologna sandwich right now.

Who knows what Greene is capable of, but the Spurs vitally need scoring off the bench, which he will be able to do far better than Hill at any point in their careers. He also appears to have much higher long-term potential. There's a clear ceiling for Hill. One of those two players could be an NBA starter and it's not the one in a Spurs' uniform.

[jayc23]

the only thing greens got is size and a jump shot... when was the last time that alone won an NBA le

[jayc23]

Who knows what Greene is capable of, but the Spurs vitally need scoring off the bench, which he will be able to do far better than Hill at any point in their careers. He also appears to have much higher long-term potential. There's a clear ceiling for Hill. One of those two players could be an NBA starter and it's not the one in a Spurs' uniform.

coming from Mr. Body.

[Mr. Body]

coming from Mr. Body.

um, yes, I did write that post.

???