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  1. #26
    That's my mans! Red Hawk #21's Avatar
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    WTF?!! This is becoming a ing nightmare, first Smith and now Childress

  2. #27
    Esse quam videri ploto's Avatar
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    I guess Rasho didn't love Toronto so much that he'd opt out of $8 million to sign a long term deal for less money. I can't wait for the ploto spin on Rasho picking up the player option and the subsequent trade. This is going to be good. Somehow it's going to be Peter Holt and Bruce Bowen's fault.
    If you had kept up you would have known that I posted in April that Rasho was going to pick up his option because it was the only way he could play for Slovenia. With the Olympic qualifying tournament as early as it was, there was no way he could opt out and sign a deal in time to train and play with his national team, and he was not going to back out on his national team.

    Our bet was contingent upon the conditon of Rasho staying with the Raptors past this summer. I also said that he would do that IF the Raptors wanted to keep him for a few years. He and his family have loved Toronto and he would have been happy to stay there for a few more years, but he did not have that power alone. The Raptors wanted the value of his expiring contract more. So he was surely not going to opt out when the Raptors were not going to offer his a new longer-term deal.

    I specifically stated that Rasho still had to be on the team at the end of June for our bet. Now technically, he still was because of the timing required to get the deal through the NBA with Ford's BYC but for all intents and purposes he was no longer a Raptor at the end of June 2008. I set that parameter because I knew that he would be traded in June if he was not going to stay a Raptor for the long term anyway.

    As it stands, Rasho will finish out his contract and return to Europe to end his career there. He would have stayed for Toronto, but I do not see it for any place else. That is why I laughed so hard at your claim that he played so well because he was trying to get a new deal in the NBA. Rasho had no interest in that. It was stay in Toronto or go home.

    And for the record, I never said he would sign a new deal for less money-- I said he would sign a deal for less money up front (as in less than $8M this season) in exchange for more years on the team.

  3. #28
    Veteran Indazone's Avatar
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    I hope the dude does it. It'll be a slap in the face of Stern who would then have to wise up and get rid of the current cap structure and the matching MLE and LLE rules.

  4. #29
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    ROFL at ploohto's new sig.

  5. #30
    Esse quam videri ploto's Avatar
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    If you're thinking that restricted free agent swingman Josh Childress is using an offer from the Greek powerhouse Olympiakos -- reported to be three years, $20 million -- merely as a bargaining chip to strong-arm the Atlanta Hawks into putting forth an offer, think again.

    Childress and his advisory team, including agents Lon Babby and Jim Tanner, are in Greece now, meeting with officials from Olympiakos. It's doubtful that the entire group would have gone all the way to Greece simply to dupe the Hawks. This certainly looks like more than a bargaining tool. Reached by e-mail, Tanner said, "(Josh) is definitely considering it. We're here now."

    Think back to last year, and the drama around restricted free agents like Sasha Pavlovic, Anderson Varejao and Charlie Bell. All had the overseas threat in their back pockets, though none of them made good on it. (It might be worth revisiting, and don't say we did not warn you about this.)

    Now, Childress is exploring this European adventure, though most personnel types stateside seem to think this is a free-agent ploy. But perhaps NBA-types have become too convinced of their league's superiority.

    Already, we've seen several lower-tier players spurn the NBA to play in Europe, including guard Juan Carlos Navarro and forward Bostjan Nachbar. Former Temple star Lynn Greer, in fact, passed up NBA offers to play for the same Olympiakos team that Childress is meeting with -- Greer got a two-year, $7 million deal. Remember big man Maciej Lampe? He had been getting some NBA nibbles but turned them down to play in Russia for three years, $10 million. His deal not only includes a car, but a driver, too.

    The difference is that Childress is a significant NBA player. He was the sixth overall pick in the 2004 draft and has four years in the league. He has averaged 11.1 points and 5.6 rebounds, serving as one of the better sixth men in the league. But it's doubtful that, with NBA salary rules, Childress would get an offer starting at much more than the mid-level exception. And with the rules of restricted free agency allowing the Hawks to match any NBA offer Childress receives, he won't even get that. He'll likely have to play out his final year and become an unrestricted free agent next summer. Basically, Atlanta is bidding against itself for Childress' services.

    So, why not Europe? Three years, $20 million is more money than Childress can get here. And there are perks. Housing is provided. A car is provided. Utilities are paid for. There are no taxes (there is an IRS bill for income earned overseas, but much less than an NBA player would pay here). Players who have been to Europe generally love it.

    "The money is great, and you can't measure the amount of fun you have," says former Sacramento Kings forward Corsley Edwards, who has bounced all over the globe (Turkey, Spain, China, Italy) playing pro ball. "In the NBA, everything is straight business. Unless you are LeBron James or Michael Jordan, you're just a player, just a warm body. But you go play overseas, and you are Michael Jordan to them. Everyone loves you. It's like a college atmosphere."

    Former North Carolina forward Jawad Williams -- who played in the NBDL and briefly with the Clippers -- has been carving himself a career overseas, too, playing first in Japan and then for Galil-Elyon in Israel. "The big difference is that, in Europe, you're really going to be part of a team," Williams says. "In the NBA, you know the ball is going to the star player, they're going to create mismatches and just keep going back to the same play over and over. That's not really a team game."

    As a business decision, Edwards and Williams agree, playing abroad is shrewd. Both admit that it's tough to give up on the NBA dream, but, as Edwards says, "Why should I bust my butt trying to get a veteran's minimum contract in the NBA, giving 52 percent of that to taxes, buying a car, buying a house, trying to keep up with the Joneses? I can get more money in Europe and not have to worry about any of that. All I pay for is food."

    Indeed, it makes sense for a guy looking at the veteran's minimum to go off and do better in Europe or China or Israel. And it makes sense for, say, Nachbar or Navarro, born in Europe, to return closer to home. But it's a much bigger leap for a player in the middle of a bright career -- like Childress -- to bolt for Greece. To most of us, at least. Guys like Edwards and Williams, who have actually played in overseas leagues, know better.

    "Playing for Olympiakos? For that money?" Williams said. "You can't knock that. Greece is a beautiful place. To get $20 million guaranteed to play there, when you can't get that much in the NBA, he has to be thinking about it seriously."

    Edwards was more direct: "He has his four years in the NBA. He played in the playoffs and all. He experienced the NBA. Now, take the money. Go see the major cities, the major artifacts, the Sistine Chapel, the Colosseum, the Seven Wonders of the World. Live in Greece. He'll love it. If he goes back to the NBA this year on a one-year deal, he might get hurt. This way, no matter what, he has $20 million. And he is going to love it. If I was him, it'd be a no-brainer. I'd be signing the contract by now."
    http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn...c.php?t=436885

  6. #31
    Believe. jason1301's Avatar
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    I think when all is said and done some people are going to owe Kill Bill an apology.
    He may not be happy with the news, actually he may be seriously depressed by now.

    He is a fan of Panathinaikos which is synonymous to Olympiakos hater -- of course olympiakos's fan are Panathinaikos's haters as well lol

  7. #32
    Veteran Indazone's Avatar
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    Most likely KillBill is hating it now. Pana has some serious compe ion now.

  8. #33
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    If you had kept up you would have known that I posted in April that Rasho was going to pick up his option because it was the only way he could play for Slovenia. With the Olympic qualifying tournament as early as it was, there was no way he could opt out and sign a deal in time to train and play with his national team, and he was not going to back out on his national team.
    Link? I don't remember you saying that ... then again, I don't really keep up with RaptorTalk. Did you forget to consider that when you made the bet?

    So he was surely not going to opt out when the Raptors were not going to offer his a new longer-term deal.
    Exactly. Which is why I made the bet. You are the only one who thought so enthusiastically that Rasho would turn down $8M that you wanted to make a bet.

    I specifically stated that Rasho still had to be on the team at the end of June for our bet. Now technically, he still was
    Exactly. Don't worry, I'll let you out of the bet. If I collected on all my winning bets, that wouldn't be fair. No need to love Jackie Butler

    As it stands, Rasho will finish out his contract and return to Europe to end his career there. He would have stayed for Toronto, but I do not see it for any place else. That is why I laughed so hard at your claim that he played so well because he was trying to get a new deal in the NBA. Rasho had no interest in that. It was stay in Toronto or go home.
    Do you not think Europe has scouts? Rasho's play at the end of last season upped his value around the world ... just not the NBA.

    I don't know if he'll return to Europe. It'd be nice if he could find a team that would utilize him correctly in the NBA. But yeah, with the way the Euros are throwing around money and his past success in Euroleague, he'll probably bank with a Russian, Greek or Spanish team.

    And for the record, I never said he would sign a new deal for less money-- I said he would sign a deal for less money up front (as in less than $8M this season) in exchange for more years on the team.
    Yeah, obviously. But that was a ludicrous assumption given the Raptors need to give Bustnani more playing time and it is why I made (and won) the bet.

  9. #34
    俺はまんこが大好きなんだよ baseline bum's Avatar
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    If I was Childress, I'd walk. No sense in being bound to a team that lowballs you just because Stern has the Player's Union by the balls.

  10. #35
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    Most likely KillBill is hating it now. Pana has some serious compe ion now.
    Panathinaikos is face this compe ion in Greek League and Greek Cup now once Childress is announce.

    Olympiacos have

    Coach: Giannakis (consider be best coach in world by many)

    PG
    1. Theo Papaloukas (many believe best point guard ever come from Europe)
    2. Milos Teodosic (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)
    3. Igor Milosevic (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)

    SG
    1. Lynn Greer (is former NBA player)
    2. Yotam Halperin (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Arvydas Macijuaskas (is former NBA player)

    SF
    1. Josh Childress (is former NBA player)
    2. Panagiotis Vassilopulos (is consider franchise player of Olympiacos team and is one of key players in Greece national team)
    3. Michalis Pelekanos (also one of key players of Greece national team)

    PF
    1. Yiannis Bouroussis (is one of stars of Greece national team and consider one of best big men in world not in NBA)
    2. Giorgos Printezis (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Zoran Erceg (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)

    C
    1. Nikola Vujcic (is consider one of best big men in world not in NBA)
    2. Sofoklis Schortsanitis (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Ian Vouyoukas (replacement for NBA player Tsakalidis because he is consider better than Big Jake)

    They have best team on paper in Europe at current time. Is chance PAO can win none of 3 compe ions next year. But PAO still have best player in Greece in Spanoulis. He is still better than players like Papaloukas and Childress. Even though Olympiacos bring in players in level of Papaloukas and Childress and Vujcic consider best C in Europe by many this is still not any player in Spanoulis level.

    Usual team with best player win championships.

  11. #36
    Veteran endrity's Avatar
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    Kill Bill,

    for all I know CSKA is still the best team in Europe, and I think also the one with the deepest pockets. I think they believe their team is still good enough that they don't have to overspend to bring NBA players in. But if it's necessary, they'll do it.

  12. #37
    Can't Start Threads Kill_Bill_Pana's Avatar
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    Kill Bill,

    for all I know CSKA is still the best team in Europe, and I think also the one with the deepest pockets. I think they believe their team is still good enough that they don't have to overspend to bring NBA players in. But if it's necessary, they'll do it.
    CSKA have right now I think but am not sure about this roster like this

    PG JR Holden/Zoran Planinic/Alexy Shved
    SG Trajan Langdon/Nikos Zisis/Viktor Keiru
    SF Ramunas Siskauskas/Viktor Khryapa/Andrey Vorontsevich
    PF Matjaz Smodis/Terence Morris/Artem Zabelin
    C Erazem Lorbek/Aleksey Savraksenko/Sasha Kaun

    Even though I am PAO fan I think I can admit Olympiacos roster look better than CSKA roster. But is still early in year. If Childress is announce then PAO will want make big signing. Will probably go after big NBA player. Same maybe for CSKA.

  13. #38
    Veteran endrity's Avatar
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    Exactly, CSKA has TONS of money as well, if they feel threatened they will spend too. I think they are just waiting to see what happens right now.

  14. #39
    Veteran Indazone's Avatar
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    Panathinaikos is face this compe ion in Greek League and Greek Cup now once Childress is announce.

    Olympiacos have

    Coach: Giannakis (consider be best coach in world by many)

    PG
    1. Theo Papaloukas (many believe best point guard ever come from Europe)
    2. Milos Teodosic (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)
    3. Igor Milosevic (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)

    SG
    1. Lynn Greer (is former NBA player)
    2. Yotam Halperin (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Arvydas Macijuaskas (is former NBA player)

    SF
    1. Josh Childress (is former NBA player)
    2. Panagiotis Vassilopulos (is consider franchise player of Olympiacos team and is one of key players in Greece national team)
    3. Michalis Pelekanos (also one of key players of Greece national team)

    PF
    1. Yiannis Bouroussis (is one of stars of Greece national team and consider one of best big men in world not in NBA)
    2. Giorgos Printezis (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Zoran Erceg (will be draft by NBA in future base on what scouts say)

    C
    1. Nikola Vujcic (is consider one of best big men in world not in NBA)
    2. Sofoklis Schortsanitis (is NBA draft pick)
    3. Ian Vouyoukas (replacement for NBA player Tsakalidis because he is consider better than Big Jake)

    They have best team on paper in Europe at current time. Is chance PAO can win none of 3 compe ions next year. But PAO still have best player in Greece in Spanoulis. He is still better than players like Papaloukas and Childress. Even though Olympiacos bring in players in level of Papaloukas and Childress and Vujcic consider best C in Europe by many this is still not any player in Spanoulis level.

    Usual team with best player win championships.
    yeah tell that to Kobe and Lebron

  15. #40
    Veteran Indazone's Avatar
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    I'd say after reading this article that Childress is going to sign over there.

    ( Childress flew to Greece late Sunday and is scheduled to meet with Olympiakos officials on Monday. Childress, 25, is so flustered with the Hawks' refusal to make a sign-and-trade deal to another team, one source familiar with his thinking believes there's "better than a 50-50 chance" he'll sign with Olympiakos. The team also will cover the Greek taxes for Childress, making it even more lucrative.

    "Unless he just gets there and doesn't like it at all, I think he's going to go," one league source said. )

    Folks, this isn't a guy from Europe going back home. Nor is it about a washed up veteran going overseas to play a few more years. This is about money, pride and opportunities. Josh Childress is a blue-blooded American, and apparently unhappy with the Atlanta Hawks' unwillingness to neither pay nor trade him. Childress was the No. 6 pick in the 2004 draft, and is a career averages of 11.1 points, 5.6 rebounds and 1 steal, so he's a player. He also has a real chance at packing up and jetting to Greece.

    Last month, I wrote a piece on the four types of NBA-caliber players who could be packing to leave in the future. They were :

    1. The local or national hero (in Europe)

    2. The young Latin American player

    3. The late-blooming American

    4. The American high school prodigy


    Even if Childress were not to go, examples of all four cases have already happened. However, if you were to tell me a month ago that a young American NBA player with a bright future would pack his bags for Europe the next month, I would've looked at you as if you were crazy. Thus, there was no No. 5 : The disgruntled young American NBA player.

    http://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articl..._leaves/293341

  16. #41
    Veteran endrity's Avatar
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    yeah tell that to Kobe and Lebron
    No. I'll tell it to Duncan, the true player of the decade in the NBA.

  17. #42
    Esse quam videri ploto's Avatar
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    Exactly, CSKA has TONS of money as well, if they feel threatened they will spend too. I think they are just waiting to see what happens right now.
    They are going to play the Raptors this pre-season. Do not know who else they will play when in North America.

  18. #43
    Veteran endrity's Avatar
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    They are going to play the Raptors this pre-season. Do not know who else they will play when in North America.
    Go to nba.com, they have all of the preseason NBA Europe tour schedule. I think Memphis is also going over there.

  19. #44
    Esse quam videri ploto's Avatar
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    Go to nba.com, they have all of the preseason NBA Europe tour schedule. I think Memphis is also going over there.
    The Raptors are not going over there. CSKA is coming "here."

  20. #45
    Veteran Indazone's Avatar
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    I think Olympiakos can beat Pana now. With Childress they are going to be tough.

  21. #46
    DEEP in the Q
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  22. #47
    Banned
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    red hawk #21 is sad

  23. #48
    Feels bad man Mr.Bottomtooth's Avatar
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    Damn Euro- s.

  24. #49
    Banned
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  25. #50
    I like boobs a lot! Slo spurs fan's Avatar
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    How old are you really?

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