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Spurs have the remainder of the MLE (~1.9 million), the LLE (~1.9 million), and a trade exception (~1.7 million). These can't be combined. Go back to the drawing board.
We don't. We have ~$4.5M divided to two ~$2M deals.
Spurs have the remainder of the MLE (~1.9 million), the LLE (~1.9 million), and a trade exception (~1.7 million). These can't be combined. Go back to the drawing board.
We only have roughly half of the MLE.
Just because we have that much under the lux tax, it doesn't mean we can spend that much on 1 player.
don;t we have already a thread about the salaries for the 2008-2009 started by timvp?
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10083
[merge]http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10083[/merge]
It's fun to start threads instead of posting in someone else's!
Whatever is left, it needs to be thrown at someone younger and not at Finley. Someone who can create their own shot or a shooter.
Thank you.
Pe ion: read and understand the CBA and player salaries before you post threads like this.
Also, as LJ already broke down in entirety in another thread what salaries we have and what was left to work with, this thread is redundant and unnecessary.
It was rough to find his thread, I had to scroll 3/4 of the way down page 1.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...=100836&page=3
I'm not typically one to whine about threads by newbies or at least the uninformed to be charitable but, I have to agree with a lot of the folks here. Lately there has been a lot of stupid threads showing up.
While I don't make the time to the read the CBA, if you read enough of the threads by people who know what they are talking about, such as Bruno, timvp, Marcus and others, you can get a feel for generally what we can and cannot do.
There are always going to be threads about crazy trades and people who misunderstand how the cap works but come on folks, think a little before you post and don't clutter up the front page. There is quite a bit of knowledge on the board if you choose to use it.
sounds like it to me like your.......whining
ibtl
A little update :
Guaranteed salaries :
Tim Duncan -- $20,598,704
Tony Parker -- $11,550,000
Manu Ginobili -- $9,905,248
Kurt Thomas -- $4,200,000
Bruce Bowen -- $4,000,000
Fabricio Oberto -- $3,600,000
Roger Mason -- $3,500,000
Matt Bonner -- $2,978,000
Michael Finley -- $2,500,000
Jacque Vaughn - $1,262,275
Ime Udoka - $1,080,000
Ian Mahinmi - $841,000
TOTAL -- $66,115,227 for 12 players.
If Spurs fill the rest of the roster will Hill, Hairston and player(s) with min contracts (Watkins, Tolliver...), they will have a payroll around $68M-$68.5M (about $3M below the luxury tax).
I thought Tolliver was actually signed for 2 years, partial guaranteed (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...68&postcount=4), (and according ESPN, for the minimum, http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/player...?playerId=3276
)Salary 2008: $427,163
yes he is.
I didn't put him on the list because his contract isn't fully guaranteed.
And Tolliver isn't a rookie cba wise. His salary for this year is $ 711,517 and he counts for $797,581 against the cap.
Nice work. That means the Spurs could use their LLE and still stay below the threshold if they wish. The Spurs like to be right at that lux tax number, so one more additional signing wouldn't surprise me. Or they could use that trade exception.
Watkins also got a similar deal, however I'm pretty sure Tolliver got a larger chunk guaranteed.
I just read on realgm forum that shamsport has given the guarantee salaries for training camp invite :
http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...oure-fired.jsp
San Antonio kitted out their inactive list with some class. Salim Stoudamire ($200,000), Desmon Farmer (none), Darryl Watkins ($20,000), Devin Green (nada) and Anthony Tolliver ($200,000) all signed early to various levels of guaranteed money, and the Spurs then added to those with further camp signings in Brian Morrison and their second round draft pick Malik Hairston. (Note: Morrison was waived almost immediately for Charles Gaines.) Those seven players are fighting against each other for two spots, as the Spurs have 13 guaranteed contracts other than they, with only Jacque Vaughn being expendable. Sham's prediction: If only for the level of guaranteed money, Stoudamire and Tolliver are the front runners for the two spots, but Desmon Farmer has NBA talent and a modi of experience. The Spurs don't need both Green and Hairston, and arguably don't need either. Watkins gives the Spurs some size and shotblocking, but they don't particularly need either right now. What they could use is another shooter, which looks doubly good for Stoudamire. Counting against Salim is his small stature, something which Farmer isn't burdened with. But the level of guaranteed money infers that the Spurs aren't too bothered about that. Gaines hasn't a chance.
According to sham, Juan Dixon is not a definite to make the Wizards roster, either. He's probable but not definite. The Spurs could have signed him this summer, so I assume they don't like him. But you never know.
If (big If) Hill is active on opening day, I don't think the Spurs are limited to only Vaughn and Stoudamire as third point options.
They could waive or trade Vaughn to create space for someone like Stoudamire or Dixon (if he's waived by Washington). They could potentially trade Bonner and Vaughn to Milwaukee for Damon Jones, who will be waived later this month if they don't find a trade partner. And Farmer has a fighting chance. The Jones option has the advantage of bringing in a vet player who can space the floor while unloading Bonner for an expiring contract. It would also create a roster space if the Spurs wanted to keep Hairston or Farmer for Austin. Or, if they wanted to use their trade exception for someone like Daequen Cook.
If I were a betting person, I'd wager on an opening day roster of Parker-Vaughn-Hill, but I wouldn't be floored to see any of the above names on the roster if Hill performs well.
A lot riding on Hill, then.
If I were in the FO, I'd lobby for the Jones option and try to use the trade exception on either Cook or Shawne Williams. But while I think the odds are good that Milwaukee would bite, it's impossible to know these things. If the Spurs couldn't get Williams or Cook, I'd use the open roster spot on someone for Austin.
Shamsports has tons of great infos about salaries :
http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...ries/spurs.jsp
http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...otes/spurs.htm
Spurs' 08-09 salaries :
Tim Duncan -- $20,598,704
Tony Parker -- $11,550,000
Manu Ginobili -- $9,905,248
Kurt Thomas -- $4,200,000
Bruce Bowen -- $4,000,000
Fabricio Oberto -- $3,600,000
Roger Mason -- $3,500,000
Matt Bonner -- $2,978,000
Michael Finley -- $2,500,000
Jacque Vaughn - $1,262,275
Ime Udoka - $1,080,000
George Hill - $1,006,200
Ian Mahinmi - $841,000
Desmon Farmer - $797,581
Anthony Tolliver - $711,517 ($797,581 against the tax)
Salim Stoudamire* - $200,000
Daryl Watkins* - $20,000
Malik Hairston* - $2,601
Brian Morrison* - $0
Charles Gaines* - $0
Devin Green* - $0
TOTAL -- $68,853,126 for 15 players. ($68,939,590 against the tax)
Some comments :
- I'm assuming Hairston, Morrison and Gaines deal were full unguaranteed. Hairston get one day of salary because of the waivers rule.
- Spurs are $2.2M bellow the luxury tax. They can go as far as $3.2M if they waive Farmer and Tolliver.
- Tolliver get $200K guaranteed, that is to say 47 days of salaries. Spurs have zero financial interest to waive him before December 13th.
- Tolliver has one year of NBA service because he was cut by Cavs one day after the start of the season. If Cavs had cut him a couple of days sooner, his salary would be $270K lower.
- Farmer has two years of NBA service. He plays in 06-07 for Seattle. The 04-05 years count also for him as a year of service because it was under the old CBA and rules weren't the same. This extra year of service raises his salary by $80K. He also isn't D-League eligible.
- At the end of the season the cost to keep Farmer and Tolliver during SL will be $25K for each. If Spurs want to keep them for the training camp, it will be significantly more expensive : $200K for Tolliver and $325K for Farmer.
- If the economical crisis hit the NBA, Spurs could face some luxury tax trouble next year. Even by taking the cheap road the team salary will be around $70M. Spurs have been wise to give a flat or decreasing structure to some of theirs players 'contracts.
- Mahinmi first year was at 80% of the rookie scale because of the luxury tax. The rest of his rookie contract is at 100% of the rookie scale. Spurs have still 4 days to pick a $900K option for the 09-10 year.
- Hill contract has been made with the 2010 plan in head. He is paid 120% of the rookie scale the first couple of years but only 80% for 2010-2011. By doing that Spurs will have a little more cap space available in 2010.
Thanks Bruno.
A few observations from my end on this year and a couple years down the line:
-The fact that Farmer is ineligible for the D-League is an interesting one. I'd still say Tolliver is a given to head to Austin once their season starts (assuming everyone else on the front line is healthy), but I don't know if he'll have a fellow Spur up there with him. The only way that would happen is if Hill or Mahinmi have failed to integrate themselves for one reason or another; even still, a Tolliver/Mahinmi Austin combo is improbable unless the roster changes somehow. I still expect Farmer to spend much of the year on the inactive list, but he could see some decent playing time if any of the 2/3 players get hurt.
-This year's team is basically the same one we'll see next year, save for one or two pieces at the end of the bench. The only way this changes is if there is a trade or they bring in a significant piece via the MLE.
-The job the Spurs have done at freeing up cap space for 2010 is impressive. They only have 4 players on contract right now (Duncan, Parker, and possibly Hill and Mahinmi), and I suspect that the only two names that will be added to that list are Ginobili (who I still think will get an extension this year or next year) and Udoka (who I expect to be resigned to a 3 year contract this offseason, with the possibility of stepping into the starting SF role if Bowen retires in two years). Barring any trades or an MLE signing next year, here is the roster going into the 2010 summer:
Parker / Hill / ?
(Ginobili) / ? / ?
(Udoka) / ? / ?
Duncan / Mahinmi / ?
? / ? / ?
(Note: Relatively minimum contracts via free agency or 2nd round draft picks next year are also possible.)
$3MM for Bonner . . . great!
Thanks for the information Bruno
So no D-League for Farmer.
When does the Beno TE expire?
EDIT: The search feature is my friend.
$1.847M that expires on Oct. 29th. It's probably not going to be used.
spurs always sign their picks with less then the 120 like most teams
damn letting the Beno TE go out without shipping a player makes me feel uneasy...
Good thoughts, both of you.Thanks Bruno.
A few observations from my end on this year and a couple years down the line:
-The fact that Farmer is ineligible for the D-League is an interesting one. I'd still say Tolliver is a given to head to Austin once their season starts (assuming everyone else on the front line is healthy), but I don't know if he'll have a fellow Spur up there with him. The only way that would happen is if Hill or Mahinmi have failed to integrate themselves for one reason or another; even still, a Tolliver/Mahinmi Austin combo is improbable unless the roster changes somehow. I still expect Farmer to spend much of the year on the inactive list, but he could see some decent playing time if any of the 2/3 players get hurt.
-This year's team is basically the same one we'll see next year, save for one or two pieces at the end of the bench. The only way this changes is if there is a trade or they bring in a significant piece via the MLE.
-The job the Spurs have done at freeing up cap space for 2010 is impressive. They only have 4 players on contract right now (Duncan, Parker, and possibly Hill and Mahinmi), and I suspect that the only two names that will be added to that list are Ginobili (who I still think will get an extension this year or next year) and Udoka (who I expect to be resigned to a 3 year contract this offseason, with the possibility of stepping into the starting SF role if Bowen retires in two years). Barring any trades or an MLE signing next year, here is the roster going into the 2010 summer:
Parker / Hill / ?
(Ginobili) / ? / ?
(Udoka) / ? / ?
Duncan / Mahinmi / ?
? / ? / ?
(Note: Relatively minimum contracts via free agency or 2nd round draft picks next year are also possible.)
Gist and Javtokas are low dollar possible additions next summer. I expect nothing but trades and draft and stash players through the draft. I also think there is an outside possibility the Spurs add Hairston to their roster next season---far outside, depending on whether or not he joins the Toros. At any rate, your point still stands.
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