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Javtokas sucks. I don't care how many ty Youtube videos you post of him making layups.
sorry about that. and i dont want to come off as being a prick with my arguing. as ive said before, i just enjoy a good debate (a civil argument if you will).
i usually take "poor man" as a lesser player with similar production/skill set. something like "calderon is a poor mans nash". "homeless man" would be the same thing, but far worse than a "poor mans" version. something along the lines of "steve blake is a homeless mans nash" (although that ones not as good, i just can be arsed to think of another one).
generally, contract would also play a part in the equation. a "poor mans" version of a player would be as close to said player without spending near the money. a "homeless mans" version would be even less costly.
my point about thabo being a "homeless mans" manu with the potential to be a "poor mans" manu has as much to do with his skill set as it does with his production. hes an off-guard with decent defense who has the length to handle the 3 spot, and the handles to take some ball handling duties (although hes far from ideal in that regard). he rebounds well for his positions, can distribute a little, and can come up with a steal every now and then. doesnt that description sound a little bit like manus skill set?
put it this way: if i gave you 2 mil dollars to spend, and told you to bring me the player that best resembles manus skill set, who would you bring me?
Javtokas sucks. I don't care how many ty Youtube videos you post of him making layups.
You have no idea what I said there, do you? Here, this will help.
www.dictionary.com
I did not think you were being a prick, we were just having a discussion. I get what you meant now about the difference between the two. I just do not know who you can get for any amount of money with Manu's skill set. But, that is all besides the point. It looks like that scenario is out the window. Right now, my best hope is that we get Boone or Williams from NJ for our TE. I just do not know if that is what NJ would be looking for though.
I don't want starting a new thread about that, because I don't have a clue if Spurs are interested in Nocioni, but Bulls' beat writer is reporting that Chicago is looking to trade Nocioni in order to resign Gordon.
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune....,4479290.story
So to sum up :
- Bulls want to dump Nocioni.
- Spurs were interested in him last summer.
- Spurs can offer a package like Bonner+Vaughn+Udoka+Johnson (S&T) for Nocioni , that will allow Bulls to save money this year and in the following ones. Spurs can also trade the TE for Cedric Simmons.
Connect the dots ...
Sounds good. Nice job, Bruno.
I'm more of a www.m-w.com person meself.
That would be perfect!
As posted earlier though, I think the Bulls are looking for a veteran big, which is why those 2 players you mentioned from the Bulls might be going to the Kings for Brad Miller.
Man, I'd hate to lose Udoka. I'm not convinced Noce is much better, but he's much more expensive. And Udoka has a year in the system.
If the Bulls trade Noce, wouldn't it be a straight salary dump? If so, why not move him to GS who can absorp him with their TE?
Golden State's trade exception already expired.
Gotcha.
Noce still messes with the 2010 plan.
Crap, that's true.
If Javtokas continues to play well during the Olympics we might be able to move him for a 2nd round draft pick.
How? He is off the books next year
Wtf Nocioni has 5 more years.
Nocioni's contract is for longer and he's paid more than I'd want to trade...
HoopsHype says it is done after this next year.
http://hoopshype.com/salaries/chicago.htm
When hoopshype doesn't know the exact amounts of the salaries, they leave the space blank.
One of the most complete listings of current and past contract terms can be found here:
http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/index.html
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2928061Andres Nocioni agreed to a five-year deal to return to the Chicago Bulls, and there is a team option for a sixth year.
Curious. I think the site is inaccurate on this account. But if does have only 1 year left, then a trade for him makes more sense.
The problem, of course, is that even if we did trade for him do we have any money to resign him? No. The MLE is probably not enough given the Euro. But 8 million is way the too much if he continues to play like he did last season.
Makes sense..........
Nocioni's contract is decreasing.
His salary for the next year will be $8M but his salary for 2010-2011 will be $6.85M.
Trading for Nocioni will eat some 2010 cap space but you had to consider that you will have one more solid player in 2010 to build around. You also had to consider that Spurs will have a better team in 2008 and 2009.
Spurs aren't that rigid about the 2010 plan. They have offered a contract longer than 2 years too Najera this summer. Nocioni's contract is quite 2010 plan friendly. I don't know if Spurs have a shot to get him but not going after him because of the 2010 plan would be a mistake.
im a chapu-loving argie, but i think its kind of a risky bet for the spurs under those terms. he would definitely bring more emotion and energy to this team though, but i agree with tav1 that udoka has good odds to bring similar offense and maybe better defense for a 1/4 of the money.
there were times at the end of the season and in the PO's were udoka was chipping in on both ends beautifully, but they were just slightly overshadowed by out of sync shots (he'd either rush or hesitate) and cheap fouls. what was worse, at times he looked like he wanted to disappear.in that sense, chapu would assert his will a lot more, for better or for worse.
still too risky, i'd look to improve in other areas, namely bigs. the only bigs we have that KNOW how to play D are old and unathletic- Duncan is the only guy getting blocks, and he is too important to focus on that (foultrouble). the rest are unproven, and only mahinmi known for D, which is even said to be decreasing in the D league. i dont know who that blake pg-3pt shooter guy is, but thats also a good project for this team, which funnily enough now feels like it has few shooters, when only barry and horry left... i guess thats how good they were.
+1.
I was assuming a contract of incremental increases. If it works backwards, then it's not such a big deal, as you suggest.
Do you think Noce's 06-07 season or his 07-08 season was the abberation? I'd guess he's somewhere in between.
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