Russia!

[Ignignokt]

I guess USA is not the only country who can bomb inferior countries for bull reasons.

yeah i wish we were back in the decades when it was only idiotic latin commies who were the ones killing their own people for bull reasons.

[Cry Havoc]

I guess USA is not the only country who can bomb inferior countries for bull reasons.

It's amazing the rap the United States has. We are the least violent world power in history. We have dominated fewer cultures and peoples than any other supreme force in the world before us, and yet we are continually vilified.

I sincerely hope the people of the world realize that our president made the choice to go through with the Iraq war against the people, and that we are continually being screwed by a political system that gives us such viable candidates as John Kerry, Al "would you like fries with your consumerist lifestyle" Gore, and Hillary "bow to my ovaries" Clinton. This also involves one party which is so far up the ass of big business that I swear to god they must have blurred vision from seeing back dimples 24/7, and the other is so rife with bickering that I'm sincerely surprised we haven't had a "Senator Fight Club" in the middle of the Capitol building. How awful must your party's ability to rally people be that you lose to Dubya? TWICE? Then again, maybe that Fight Club idea would be good for them.

Hyperbole aside, I think anyone watching realizes it's clear that the people in this country are waking up and taking an active interest in politics again. Not sure if it's too late to have an effect, but at least we're trying.

Remember though, the first rule of Senator Fight Club is that you don't talk about Senator Fight Club.

The second rule of Senator Fight Club is that you talk to every single media pundit possible to tear your own fellow party member's opinion to shreds.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

It's amazing the rap the United States has. We are the least violent world power in history. We have dominated fewer cultures and peoples than any other supreme force in the world before us, and yet we are continually vilified.

I sincerely hope the people of the world realize that our president made the choice to go through with the Iraq war against the people, and that we are continually being screwed by a political system that gives us such viable candidates as John Kerry, Al "would you like fries with your consumerist lifestyle" Gore, and Hillary "bow to my ovaries" Clinton. This also involves one party which is so far up the ass of big business that I swear to god they must have blurred vision from seeing back dimples 24/7, and the other is so rife with bickering that I'm sincerely surprised we haven't had a "Senator Fight Club" in the middle of the Capitol building. How awful must your party's ability to rally people be that you lose to Dubya? TWICE? Then again, maybe that Fight Club idea would be good for them.

Hyperbole aside, I think anyone watching realizes it's clear that the people in this country are waking up and taking an active interest in politics again. Not sure if it's too late to have an effect, but at least we're trying.

Remember though, the first rule of Senator Fight Club is that you don't talk about Senator Fight Club.

The second rule of Senator Fight Club is that you talk to every single media pundit possible to tear your own fellow party member's opinion to shreds.

Good post.

And to add on, I think it also blows that at a time when our country needs a strong leader, we get handed two bad candidates from the parties in power (has been this way for four elections running).

It really is time for a viable third party to take the stage.

[RandomGuy]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26090865...ramenumber/14/

Yep. No way Russia is attacking Georgia with heavy ordinance. You guys are ALL ABOUT peace.

you. You're killing innocent people just like the Georgians.

Russia literally flattens Chechnya, when chechnya does the same thing Ossentia was doing, so it has very little moral authority when it comes to butting in to other nation's civil wars.

[rascal]

It's amazing the rap the United States has. We are the least violent world power in history. We have dominated fewer cultures and peoples than any other supreme force in the world before us, and yet we are continually vilified.

I sincerely hope the people of the world realize that our president made the choice to go through with the Iraq war against the people, and that we are continually being screwed by a political system that gives us such viable candidates as John Kerry, Al "would you like fries with your consumerist lifestyle" Gore, and Hillary "bow to my ovaries" Clinton. This also involves one party which is so far up the ass of big business that I swear to god they must have blurred vision from seeing back dimples 24/7, and the other is so rife with bickering that I'm sincerely surprised we haven't had a "Senator Fight Club" in the middle of the Capitol building. How awful must your party's ability to rally people be that you lose to Dubya? TWICE? Then again, maybe that Fight Club idea would be good for them.

Hyperbole aside, I think anyone watching realizes it's clear that the people in this country are waking up and taking an active interest in politics again. Not sure if it's too late to have an effect, but at least we're trying.

Remember though, the first rule of Senator Fight Club is that you don't talk about Senator Fight Club.

The second rule of Senator Fight Club is that you talk to every single media pundit possible to tear your own fellow party member's opinion to shreds.

least violent world power? You forget about the destruction and almost elimination of all the native American Indian tribes. America was founded on violence. America has been involved in new wars every 30 years or so.

[Cry Havoc]

least violent world power? You forget about the destruction and almost elimination of all the native American Indian tribes. America was founded on violence. America has been involved in new wars every 30 years or so.

Yes. We destroyed the Indians. Horrible? Of course it was. So let's compare. We almost wiped out the Native Americans, many of whom were warring with each other, preventing them from fortifying a unified offensive against the US.

The first major powers, Egypt and Persia... well... their tombs still stand today, built on the backs of slaves because their rulers thought they were deities. Yep. Real peaceful bunch of individuals there.

The first major world power, Rome, conquered nearly the entire European continent and most of the outlying provinces. They decimated people who wouldn't bow to them.

The next great power, the Church, led the crusades. "Kill for us and go to Heaven. Pay money to forgive your sins." Mostly, they raked in cash and killed LOTS of people.

Which leads us to the "greatest" nation on Earth, England, which became a major power in the early 2n millennium and has persisted since then. Along the way, they have crushed neighboring states, enslaved the Scots, enacted some of the most brutal rule ever imposed, waged war with nearly all of Europe, invaded EVERY continent except Antarctica and extended their fist of influence, plunged into Africa with machine-guns, annihilated the Latin American cultures, attacked India, China, and still have more sphere of influence than any nation in the history of the planet.

Almost none of it was done through diplomacy, because they had the bigger guns. If you would have given the rulers of England (even up into the 19th century!) the kind of power that America wields today, we would all be flying their banners, and any nation that didn't would be a smoking hole in the ground.

Not to make light of the deaths of soldiers, but by the sheer numbers, America's modern wars are paltry sums compared to the horrors of the past. We've lost more soldiers in single battles than we have in the entire Iraq war before. There is an account of the history of the machine gun, where ~100 British troops killed tens of thousands of African natives in a single day.

This is, of course, practically nothing compared to the horrors of the Holocaust, which happened in Europe within many of our parents, grandparent's or great-grandparent's lifetimes. Even worse was the lesser known act by the modernizing Soviet Union which resulted in more estimated deaths than the entire World War that was taking place at the same time. It was a few DECADES ago that Europe was busy killing millions of it's own people. And now they presume to judge us for being uncivilized. That's absolute , and more hypocrisy than Bush can EVER be guilty of.

I don't mean to play numbers with human lives, but in the grand scheme of things, Europe + Russia has killed (think about this) enough people to fill the entire city of New York in the past 100 years. Consider that for a moment when the US is so reviled for all these "unnecessary civilian casualties".

Our people don't even WANT this war. The European people were busy glorifying war less than 100 years ago, sending their soldiers off with much the same at ude as we hail sports stars today.

THAT is hypocrisy, my friend. Our hands may not be spotless, but they look like Mr. Clean's ing noggin' next to Europe's distant AND recent past.

[RandomGuy]

THAT is hypocrisy, my friend. Our hands may not be spotless, but they look like Mr. Clean's ing noggin' next to Europe's distant AND recent past.

Glad you made that point.

Almost all modern nations have some rather nasty things in their past, especially when it comes to the wars that were fought to create those nations.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

It's amazing the rap the United States has. We are the least violent world power in history. We have dominated fewer cultures and peoples than any other supreme force in the world before us, and yet we are continually vilified.

hmm... let's see... since the beginning of the 1900's the US has been involved in World War I, World War II, Korean War, Vietnam War, Gulf War, invading Afghanistan, invading Iraq... yeah, you are definitely a bunch of pacifists.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this is good or bad, but it is what it is. American culture has been nurtured on war ever since its inception. I don't think there's been a good 30 years in between America being involved in a war in one way or another.

[Cry Havoc]

hmm... let's see... since the beginning of the 1900's the US has been involved in World War I, World War II, Korean War, Vietnam War, Gulf War, invading Afghanistan, invading Iraq... yeah, you are definitely a bunch of pacifists.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this is good or bad, but it is what it is. American culture has been nurtured on war ever since its inception. I don't think there's been a good 30 years in between America being involved in a war in one way or another.

You're putting the World Wars on us? Are you serious? That's ridiculous. Go read a ing history book. That was started by Europe and almost exclusively a European war. We tried to stay out of it as much as possible. If the Japanese would have bombed Argentina you would have done the exact same thing, had you the naval and air authority to do so.

If the US doesn't involve itself in WWII, France is speaking German right now under facism/Nazism and London doesn't even exist as a city any longer. So yeah, how HORRIBLE of us to come to the defense of our allies and protect nations that support individual freedom.

And when did YOU get off so high and mighty? Ever heard of the Falklands War? Ring a bell? Hmm? No, probably not. Because your country is faultless.

[Brutalis]

Wait a sec. didn't we fire ICBMs at Iraq killing thousands of innocent civilians?

Their government and politics are responsible for the civilians.

Just like ours is responsible for those that died on 9/11. Even though it was an inside job, but that's beside the point.

My point is if Russia flew over and bombed the out of Dallas, it's our own fault that civilians die. Our country should have protected them, and done something before it happened. Done what? I don't know. But it is not Russia's fault if 25 thousand civilians turn into dust over it.

I'm sick and tired of these bull people whining about the poor Iraqi civilians. Their blood is not on our hands, it's on their leaders hands.

[Indazone]

US forces are stretched too thin in Afghanistan and Iraq. We do not want to get into a confrontation with Russia. We are going to make a lot of noise and at the end of the day, Georgia will get flattened.

But you know what, those stupid screwups in Georgia decided to launch a lighting strike to take over all that breakaway territory and then Russia decides to hold the line and attack Georgia.

Tell me, how is that any different than when the USA attacked Iraq for their invasion of Kuwait? This entire -for-tat stuff between Russia and the West is BS. It could have been prevented if the NEOCONS did not push so hard to democratize Georgia, put missles on Russia's doorsteps be it defensive or not, and push all those other Eastern Bloc countries for membership in Nato. That would be equivalent to Russia putting missles in Cuba, and getting Mexico, Honduras, Costa Rica, Panama as part of the Russian Alliance. Yeah, I think we'd be making a lot of noise too.

All this pushing for democracy, and the US way over there has caused a lot of consternation over the projection of US power. Yes I know we are a champion of freedom but c'mon. Do you want peace or do you want war over an ideal of the human condition? I think peace is inherently better than war.

You know a President with a little bit better grasp of diplomacy could have had Putins support. Russia was a friend or supposedly one. Russia advised against the invasion of Iraq and Putin went so far as to tell Bush that the US would get mired in Iraq and there would be a lot of needless deaths and we would spend too much money there. He said spend your time in Afghanistan rooting out the terrorists. Yeah, well guess what? Putin was right about that.

If Bush had listened to Putin built on the good relationships early in Bush's presidency when he said, "I looked into the man's eyes and saw his soul". "I saw a man who means what he says and is honest. I think we can do business with him". We could have had a great relationship with Russia. Why do we need Estonia, Georgia, Kosovo, Poland etc under the Nato flag? If in those early days, Bush had helped Putin and helped them economically and worked together on terrorism, and not insisted that all these countries be folded into the Western Power Bloc, we would not be having this stupid Georgia war today.

[I. Hustle]

@ politics

[Anti.Hero]

hmm... let's see... since the beginning of the 1900's the US has been involved in World War I, World War II, Korean War, Vietnam War, Gulf War, invading Afghanistan, invading Iraq... yeah, you are definitely a bunch of pacifists.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this is good or bad, but it is what it is. American culture has been nurtured on war ever since its inception. I don't think there's been a good 30 years in between America being involved in a war in one way or another.

LOL, if America were really the villains foreigners portray them to be...this entire hemisphere would be United States of America.

It's too bad Sparta fell. Sure they'd be communists, but wow what an ally they would make!

America is no where close to the empires of old. I guess nukes have something to do with that...

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

hmm... let's see... since the beginning of the 1900's the US has been involved in World War I, World War II, Korean War, Vietnam War, Gulf War, invading Afghanistan, invading Iraq... yeah, you are definitely a bunch of pacifists.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying this is good or bad, but it is what it is. American culture has been nurtured on war ever since its inception. I don't think there's been a good 30 years in between America being involved in a war in one way or another.

We had to be dragged into WWI, WWII, Korea, and had the mandate of the entire U.N. for the Gulf War.

Afghanistan was in response to 9/11.

You missed his point completely, but that doesn't surprise me.

[Cry Havoc]

LOL, if America were really the villains foreigners portray them to be...this entire hemisphere would be United States of America.

It's too bad Sparta fell. Sure they'd be communists, but wow what an ally they would make!

America is no where close to the empires of old. I guess nukes have something to do with that...

Hemisphere? Try globe. Aside from Russia, the United States wields more power than the rest of the world combined in military. That's not even a GOOD thing, but it simply means we are the FIRST nation in the history of the world to have the power to completely overrun the world with their military... and not actually attempt to conquer the world.

The US is the most restrained power in the history of the world. We, at one point, had the largest disparity between economic, military, and political power at the same time that has ever existed. Even though we're "in decline" now, we are still far more dominant than any other country, and it takes an entire continent to actively compete with us (the EU).

So yes. Continue to demonize the US. Because you can, you are free to. If we were any other power at any other point in history, you would all have portraits of George W. ing Bush hanging in your room. The US and the UK saved the world from Hitler. What the has your country done lately?

[Tully365]

"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant: It's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

Nice quote from the original funder of Osama Bin Laden and the Mujahadeen.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Nice quote from the original funder of Osama Bin Laden and the Mujahadeen.

Actually there was nothing wrong with that decision, it was made during the Cold War when we were trying to contain the USSR.

The problem was us turning our backs on Afghanistan after it was over.

[Nbadan]

Actually there was nothing wrong with that decision, it was made during the Cold War when we were trying to contain the USSR.

The problem was us turning our backs on Afghanistan after it was over.

No wrong except we trained the Mujahadeen in American military techniques and strategery explosives, and weapons that they've used against us in Afghanistan and Iraq to kill our troops...

[MaNuMaNiAc]

You're putting the World Wars on us? Are you serious? That's ridiculous. Go read a ing history book. That was started by Europe and almost exclusively a European war. We tried to stay out of it as much as possible. If the Japanese would have bombed Argentina you would have done the exact same thing, had you the naval and air authority to do so.

If the US doesn't involve itself in WWII, France is speaking German right now under facism/Nazism and London doesn't even exist as a city any longer. So yeah, how HORRIBLE of us to come to the defense of our allies and protect nations that support individual freedom.

And when did YOU get off so high and mighty? Ever heard of the Falklands War? Ring a bell? Hmm? No, probably not. Because your country is faultless.

First of all I'm not putting anything on anyone, you're the one jumping to conclusions. I'm not blaming the US for WW I and II. I'm contradicting your assessment that the US is non violent. How can you say that, when you've been involved in more armed conflict in the past hundred years than any other modern world power?

Who the said anything about the US being involved in WW II being a horrible thing?? I'm not saying the US is ing evil, so chill out. I'm saying the US is NOT the non violent super power you're painting yourself out to be.

nd when did YOU get off so high and mighty? Ever heard of the Falklands War? Ring a bell? Hmm? No, probably not. Because your country is faultless.

First of all, since I wasn't criticizing you or America, I hardly think I was being high and mighty. Second, the Falklands, which I hardly think you can consider a war seeing as the English used us for target practice, doesn't really point to us being violent. Short sighted and inept, sure! but violent?? really? I mean, name another "war" Argentina's been a part of in the past 100 years?

[MaNuMaNiAc]

EDIT: Never mind, I'm really not interested in getting into a long ass discussion here. Let's just agree to disagree.

[whottt]

No wrong except we trained the Mujahadeen in American military techniques and strategery explosives, and weapons that they've used against us in Afghanistan and Iraq to kill our troops...

Obviously...we didn't train them for that reason now did we?


That's the stupidest ing logic ever.


Oh ...we gave the Russians a bunch of planes and tanks in WWII...I guess we are responsible for the rise of the Soviet Union too....so I guess we're to blame for both ends.


It our fault Dan...it's all our fault, we're the biggest most corrupt evil peace of country and people to ever exist on planet Earth.


IT IS ALL OUR FAULT

EVERYTHING IN THE WORLD IS OUR FAULT!!


Just cnp those last two sentences dude...that is the sum total of your political insight. That's all you say, that's all you do...day after day after day after day.

[rascal]

Hemisphere? Try globe. Aside from Russia, the United States wields more power than the rest of the world combined in military. That's not even a GOOD thing, but it simply means we are the FIRST nation in the history of the world to have the power to completely overrun the world with their military... and not actually attempt to conquer the world.

The US is the most restrained power in the history of the world. We, at one point, had the largest disparity between economic, military, and political power at the same time that has ever existed. Even though we're "in decline" now, we are still far more dominant than any other country, and it takes an entire continent to actively compete with us (the EU).

So yes. Continue to demonize the US. Because you can, you are free to. If we were any other power at any other point in history, you would all have portraits of George W. ing Bush hanging in your room. The US and the UK saved the world from Hitler. What the has your country done lately?

Wrong
The US could not win a war against the rest of the world. Your arrogance needs to stop. There would be too many military numbers against the US.

[rascal]

First of all I'm not putting anything on anyone, you're the one jumping to conclusions. I'm not blaming the US for WW I and II. I'm contradicting your assessment that the US is non violent. How can you say that, when you've been involved in more armed conflict in the past hundred years than any other modern world power?

Who the said anything about the US being involved in WW II being a horrible thing?? I'm not saying the US is ing evil, so chill out. I'm saying the US is NOT the non violent super power you're painting yourself out to be.



First of all, since I wasn't criticizing you or America, I hardly think I was being high and mighty. Second, the Falklands, which I hardly think you can consider a war seeing as the English used us for target practice, doesn't really point to us being violent. Short sighted and inept, sure! but violent?? really? I mean, name another "war" Argentina's been a part of in the past 100 years?

Agree with you. He totally spun the meaning of the original argument, which is that the US is nonviolent, into other things.

[Cry Havoc]

Agree with you. He totally spun the meaning of the original argument, which is that the US is nonviolent, into other things.

Wrong. Patently wrong.

My initial statement was, "The US is the least violent world power that has ever existed. That we are the first with the power to take over all or much of the globe (easily the entire Western Hemisphere), and not actually do so."

His comment basically amounted to "Nuh uh you guys like war! You're SO violent."

My response is that we have been in several armed conflicts in which we were defending our allies. If a friend gets hit by a bully and you jump in to defend him, does that make you a violent person? And if so, what is the point of bringing that up? He's contradicting me for no reason other than to play the advocate without anything meaningful to say, especially considering I never said we were a non-violent power in the first place.

[Cry Havoc]

First of all I'm not putting anything on anyone, you're the one jumping to conclusions. I'm not blaming the US for WW I and II. I'm contradicting your assessment that the US is non violent. How can you say that, when you've been involved in more armed conflict in the past hundred years than any other modern world power?

Who the said anything about the US being involved in WW II being a horrible thing?? I'm not saying the US is ing evil, so chill out. I'm saying the US is NOT the non violent super power you're painting yourself out to be.

Perhaps you should actually read what I say before spouting such negatively charged retorts. I never stated that we were non-violent.

First of all, since I wasn't criticizing you or America, I hardly think I was being high and mighty. Second, the Falklands, which I hardly think you can consider a war seeing as the English used us for target practice, doesn't really point to us being violent. Short sighted and inept, sure! but violent?? really? I mean, name another "war" Argentina's been a part of in the past 100 years?

Argentina invaded South Georgia without provocation. But yeah, you were definitely innocent there.

You guys don't have the manpower to facilitate a real war, and any move you would make would instantly be countered by a more powerful country. Of course you aren't going to fight a war you know you'd be crushed in.