Taxes, the Economy, Healthcare, and Iraq

[KenMcCoy]

Hi, I've been lurking on ST for about two years now and am finally putting in my .02.

Taxes and it's effects on the economy

While I fall under Obama's definition of middle class and would receive the benefits of his proposed tax cuts for the middle class I have to agree with McCain on this one. Cutting business taxes is the only way to stimulate the economy and create new US based jobs.

I work as a tax advisor for a large international company based in central Texas and see the effects of (and make decisions on) business taxes as it relates to jobs and local economies everyday. The tax burden currently placed on US businesses is one of the highest in the world and directly affects a business' bottom line. We continually have meetings and discussions on how to minimize the company's taxes and unfortunately that normally means moving jobs outside of the country. Cutting business taxes not only creates the possibilities for more jobs at a large company, it creates numerous opportunities for small businesses that are direct vendors for the company and indirect vendors for the company's employees (i.e. - restaurants, dry cleaners, and other stores opening near the large business to cater to the employees). Examples of these economies can be seen in San Antonio; Toyota chose San Antonio because of the tax packages that were offered to it but the mere mention of a large company going to the south side revitalized business on that side of town which created more jobs.

Healthcare

More government intervention is not needed in order for everyone to be able to have access to affordable healthcare. Good old American capitalism is what is needed.

Currently, clinics make up for unpaid medical bills by overcharging the insurance companies (who normally pay out an amount much more than what the service costs) which in turn drives everyone's costs up. The solution is to make health care providers display the prices for their services up front and people in need of health care can choose who they go to and how much they are willing to pay. This compe ion would drive the costs of the services down to the point that the market is willing to bear. Much like choosing where you are going to get your oil changed you would be able to say "Why are you charging $500 to set a broken arm when the guy down the street only charges $300?"

Iraq

Right or wrong we went over there, and are still there but that does not mean you pull out before the job is done. History has shown that either a dictator type leader or another country that does not have good intentions will move in if we pull out before the Iraqis are ready to run the country themselves. An example of this happening is Afghanistan. The US basically left them to straighten themselves out after the Afghan/USSR war which left an opening for the Taliban to come in and take control.

[clambake]

[QUOTE=KenMcCoy;2754517]Hi, I've been lurking on ST for about two years now and am finally putting in my .02.

Taxes and it's effects on the economy

While I fall under Obama's definition of middle class and would receive the benefits of his proposed tax cuts for the middle class I have to agree with McCain on this one. Cutting business taxes is the only way to stimulate the economy and create new US based jobs.

we did that and check the #s.

I work as a tax advisor for a large international company based in central Texas

who's that?

Toyota chose San Antonio because of the tax packages that were offered to it but the mere mention of a large company going to the south side revitalized business on that side of town which created more jobs.

interesting choice for your example.....toyota......their benefits are a tad obvious, don't you think?

Healthcare

More government intervention is not needed in order for everyone to be able to have access to affordable healthcare. Good old American capitalism is what is needed.

you like the way it's working now?

Currently, clinics make up for unpaid medical bills by overcharging the insurance companies (who normally pay out an amount much more than what the service costs) which in turn drives everyone's costs up. The solution is to make health care providers display the prices for their services up front and people in need of health care can choose who they go to and how much they are willing to pay. This compe ion would drive the costs of the services down to the point that the market is willing to bear. Much like choosing where you are going to get your oil changed you would be able to say "Why are you charging $500 to set a broken arm when the guy down the street only charges $300?"

are you suggesting the creation of a federal hmo police squad with teeth?

Iraq

Right or wrong we went over there,

need you say more?

[KenMcCoy]

we did that and check the #s.

We didn't cut enough...there are countries that offer 0% corporate income taxes for 50 years for companies in order to stimulate job growth.

who's that?

A large international company based in central texas...the admins can check my email and verify but I'm not disclosing where i work.

interesting choice for your example.....toyota......their benefits are a tad obvious, don't you think?

Was just making it simple...these effects can be seen where any large company is located (inside or outside the US).

you like the way it's working now?

Personally...it doesn't matter to me since i have a good healthcare plan and am in good general health. But this is the only way to lower the actual costs of healthcare. THe actual costs (including a decent profit percentage) are nowhere near the prices that the insurance companies are willing to pay out. Doctors that I know agree with this also. The cost of doing a simple blood test is less than $10 but the insurance providers pay over $100 for these services.

are you suggesting the creation of a federal hmo police squad with teeth?

No, just a system where the patients know how much a clinic charges for services before they decide to purchase that clinics services. If you had $1500 in a medical spending account and had the freedom to choose which provider to go to based on cost/quality of service you would go with the one that meets your needs the best since you know it is coming out of your spending account. Currently, most people don't care how much the doctor charges, they just care about their own copay amount. So if a doctor overcharges on their services it doesn't affect the patient because their insurance pays the difference (or most of it). This system drives the prices of the services up since doctors/clinics know that they can charge more than the actual value of a service and still get paid for it.

[2centsworth]

I'm with you on taxes, but against you on healthcare. The following article talks a little bit about why capitalism will not solve our healthcare crises.
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/18802

For a solution read this http://myfreefilehosting.com/f/b9750a1119_0.88MB (bottom of page download)

[Anti.Hero]

Common sense doesn't work in this country. The masses are licking their chops to attack "BIG EVIL BUSINESS" and are too stupid to comprehend most of your well done post.

It'll take a collapse before the masses wise up. Then again, it only took $4 gas for people to say " the birds".


They should just split the country in two and let people choose who they want their leaders to be. We'll see which side can sustain itself for 5 years.

[2centsworth]

Common sense doesn't work in this country. The masses are licking their chops to attack "BIG EVIL BUSINESS" and are too stupid to comprehend most of your well done post.

It'll take a collapse before the masses wise up. Then again, it only took $4 gas for people to say " the birds".


They should just split the country in two and let people choose who they want their leaders to be. We'll see which side can sustain itself for 5 years.

it's bad enough only having a two party system. No way I want a one party system.

[Anti.Hero]

it's bad enough only having a two party system. No way I want a one party system.

Yes but the dems are going far-left, the reps are turning into moderate dems/"neo-cons"

Just divide them in two and you will have a narrower spectrum for each party.

[KenMcCoy]

I'm with you on taxes, but against you on healthcare. The following article talks a little bit about why capitalism will not solve our healthcare crises.
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/18802

Interesting...many things that i agree with. But not so sure I trust an analysis that doesn't mention the costs of malpractice suits. Doctors are so scared of getting sued nowadays that if you go into the hospital for heartburn they check you for everything that begins with "H".

[clambake]

We didn't cut enough...there are countries that offer 0% corporate income taxes for 50 years for companies in order to stimulate job growth.

which is why a candidate has proposed large tax cuts and incentives to companies(big and small)to keep the US as their sole base of physical operations.

Personally...it doesn't matter to me since i have a good healthcare plan and am in good general health. But this is the only way to lower the actual costs of healthcare. THe actual costs (including a decent profit percentage) are nowhere near the prices that the insurance companies are willing to pay out. Doctors that I know agree with this also. The cost of doing a simple blood test is less than $10 but the insurance providers pay over $100 for these services.

i agree completely with your fleecing analogy, but this would require stomping on some very big toes.

No, just a system where the patients know how much a clinic charges for services before they decide to purchase that clinics services. If you had $1500 in a medical spending account and had the freedom to choose which provider to go to based on cost/quality of service you would go with the one that meets your needs the best since you know it is coming out of your spending account. Currently, most people don't care how much the doctor charges, they just care about their own copay amount. So if a doctor overcharges on their services it doesn't affect the patient because their insurance pays the difference (or most of it). This system drives the prices of the services up since doctors/clinics know that they can charge more than the actual value of a service and still get paid for it.

that would require a complete re-education of the american public. in other words.....that would piss off the red states.

[KenMcCoy]

Common sense doesn't work in this country. The masses are licking their chops to attack "BIG EVIL BUSINESS" and are too stupid to comprehend most of your well done post.

It'll take a collapse before the masses wise up. Then again, it only took $4 gas for people to say " the birds".

Thanks!!! This is the one flaw with democracy...once the masses realize that they can get something for free (i.e. - welfare, universal health care, whatever) they start voting for whatever benefits THEM and not the health and stability of the country.

They should just split the country in two and let people choose who they want their leaders to be. We'll see which side can sustain itself for 5 years.

I like it. How did N. Korea and S. Korea do??

[clambake]

Just divide them in two and you will have a narrower spectrum for each party.

one side would be burdened by tree huggers.

the other would be devoured by the "bubba" plight.

[Nbadan]

I work as a tax advisor for a large international company based in central Texas and see the effects of (and make decisions on) business taxes as it relates to jobs and local economies everyday. The tax burden currently placed on US businesses is one of the highest in the world and directly affects a business' bottom line. We continually have meetings and discussions on how to minimize the company's taxes and unfortunately that normally means moving jobs outside of the country. Cutting business taxes not only creates the possibilities for more jobs at a large company, it creates numerous opportunities for small businesses that are direct vendors for the company and indirect vendors for the company's employees (i.e. - restaurants, dry cleaners, and other stores opening near the large business to cater to the employees). Examples of these economies can be seen in San Antonio; Toyota chose San Antonio because of the tax packages that were offered to it but the mere mention of a large company going to the south side revitalized business on that side of town which created more jobs.

Blah....unless your primary consumers are in other countries then you pay a sort of tax anyway to get your good back here to the U.S. to market...what we need is to raise import taxes on businesses that choose to locate to place like Mexico that have much lower wage demands...I mean, lets face facts, you can make all the cheap in Mexico and China that you want, but unless you have a market to sell it in those goods aren't gonna make for you....meanwhile, Manufacturing in the U.S. is at all time lows - those are jobs that pay wages and carry benefits that support families - instead we are stuck with a steady stream of Bushco service economy jobs that offer no job security, no benefits and no protection for families...

[Nbadan]

I work as a tax advisor for a large international company based in central Texas and see the effects of (and make decisions on) business taxes as it relates to jobs and local economies everyday.

Let's face facts, if American businesses cared more for Americans and American jobs than they did for their own bottom lines they wouldn't pay tax advisors like you millions of dollars to skirt U.S. tax laws...

[Nbadan]

Examples of these economies can be seen in San Antonio; Toyota chose San Antonio because of the tax packages that were offered to it but the mere mention of a large company going to the south side revitalized business on that side of town which created more jobs.

The only reason Toyota located to SA was because Texas is a non-Union state and San Antonio had excess power capacity thanks to our 'socialized' but very successful power company...same for microsoft and all the other businesses in Westover Hills...

[Nbadan]

Currently, clinics make up for unpaid medical bills by overcharging the insurance companies (who normally pay out an amount much more than what the service costs) which in turn drives everyone's costs up. The solution is to make health care providers display the prices for their services up front and people in need of health care can choose who they go to and how much they are willing to pay. This compe ion would drive the costs of the services down to the point that the market is willing to bear. Much like choosing where you are going to get your oil changed you would be able to say "Why are you charging $500 to set a broken arm when the guy down the street only charges $300?"

The problem isn't people who can pay, or clinics ripping insurance companies, the problem is people who can't pay......people who can't pay tend to let health care problems perpetuate until they get much, much worse.....then taxpayers get stuck paying for expensive emergency care instead of much less expensive preventative care...

[Nbadan]

Right or wrong we went over there, and are still there but that does not mean you pull out before the job is done. History has shown that either a dictator type leader or another country that does not have good intentions will move in if we pull out before the Iraqis are ready to run the country themselves. An example of this happening is Afghanistan. The US basically left them to straighten themselves out after the Afghan/USSR war which left an opening for the Taliban to come in and take control.

If history has shown anything it is that the Middle East is a cluster- of corrupt governments and foreign self-interest.....that almost always drives 'occupying forces' into complete and utter bankruptcy...

[KenMcCoy]

Blah....unless your primary consumers are in other countries then you pay a sort of tax anyway to get your good back here to the U.S. to market...

The goal is to minimize taxes not eliminate them. Of course there are some taxes that go to the US, but moving jobs overseas reduces those taxes substantially.

what we need is to raise import taxes on businesses that choose to locate to place like Mexico that have much lower wage demands...

So you want to pay $10 for something at walmart that normally costs $2? Talk about the poor getting poorer...

The amount of the tax needed would have to be astronomical for it to force companies to move their manufacturing back to the US.

Manufacturing in the U.S. is at all time lows - those are jobs that pay wages and carry benefits that support families - instead we are stuck with a steady stream of Bushco service economy jobs that offer no job security, no benefits and no protection for families...

Exactly my point...people need to realize that we are in a GLOBAL economy now. The country's that offer the best tax packages in order to lure in businesses are the ones that succeed in this day and age. The US didn't see it coming and kept on taxing business.

[KenMcCoy]

Let's face facts, if American businesses cared more for Americans and American jobs than they did for their own bottom lines they wouldn't pay tax advisors like you millions of dollars to skirt U.S. tax laws...

They do care about americans...americans demand low priced products and refuse to pay for higher priced items that are manufactured domestically.

[KenMcCoy]

The only reason Toyota located to SA was because Texas is a non-Union state and San Antonio had excess power capacity thanks to our 'socialized' but very successful power company...same for microsoft and all the other businesses in Westover Hills...

They all received lucrative multi year sales and property tax incentives, which in TX is the norm.

[KenMcCoy]

Let's face facts, if American businesses cared more for Americans and American jobs than they did for their own bottom lines they wouldn't pay tax advisors like you millions of dollars to skirt U.S. tax laws...

Liberals...not only do they expect the government to take care of them but now they also expect businesses to do the same!!! The world isn't one big UNICEF.

[Nbadan]

So you want to pay $10 for something at walmart that normally costs $2? Talk about the poor getting poorer...

The amount of the tax needed would have to be astronomical for it to force companies to move their manufacturing back to the US.

I would rather not have 8-10-11 children working in 3rd country sweatshops just so I can buy a disposable razor for a few cents less than it would cost to produce in the U.S. as I'm sure many people would - plus, those jobs (and dollars) stay in the U.S. generating more business and more jobs instead of in some multinational companies Canary Island fund...

[Nbadan]

Exactly my point...people need to realize that we are in a GLOBAL economy now. The country's that offer the best tax packages in order to lure in businesses are the ones that succeed in this day and age. The US didn't see it coming and kept on taxing business.

We're not in a global economy, the multinational companies that bribe our politicians to us all over are in a 'global economy'.....the U.S. runs multi-billion dollar deficits year in and year out which translates to money that would otherwise stay here and generate more jobs fleeing to third world holes..

[Nbadan]

They do care about americans...americans demand low priced products and refuse to pay for higher priced items that are manufactured domestically.

they don't give a about you, me or any other flag-waving American...the quicker you and other globalists realize that, the quicker we can start turning our economy around...

[Nbadan]

They all received lucrative multi year sales and property tax incentives, which in TX is the norm.

See post #22...

[Nbadan]

Liberals...not only do they expect the government to take care of them but now they also expect businesses to do the same!!! The world isn't one big UNICEF

....and globalists think that they are saving the world by employing Asian women and children in sub-human sweetshops for less than a dollar a day and abetting greedy politicians to put the will of multinational companies over the will of the people of this country...