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  1. #551
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    To my knowledge he is only seen as a prophet in Islam.
    But it is widely regarded that he did exist. Is that the case with Santa or bigfoot?

  2. #552
    United Autodidact Society Shastafarian's Avatar
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    But it is widely regarded that he did exist. Is that the case with Santa or bigfoot?
    No. I wasn't questioning whether he existed. Just stating that I think only Islam sees him as a prophet.

  3. #553
    I Got Hops Extra Stout's Avatar
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    If your faith system makes exclusive claims of itself, you forfeit the "besides objective evidence" part...unless you want to wander into the sibling of intellectual laziness; intellectual dishonesty.
    I don't accept that at all. In starting down the path towards faith, we already have left Cartesian ideas of certainty behind. If one considers that God might exist, one then must consider whether God is revealed to mankind in any way. If one considers that God is revealed, then he must consider whether God is revealed uniquely to him, or also to others. If one considers that God is revealed also to others, then he must consider whether God is revealed in a similar fashion to others or not. If one considers that God is revealed is a similar fashion to others, then he must consider whether there is a faith system out there that might be correct. If he considers that a particular one might be correct, he should then evaluate its tenets. If he accepts them, then he should have faith. If he does not believe them, then he should back up a few steps.

    The right spirit of humility to have in all this is to recognize that these steps are all inductive. The validation of this faith journey is first and foremost through noetic experience and not rational intellect. I do not believe it is necessary to bowdlerize my faith in order to treat others with respect if they make different choices.

  4. #554
    I Got Hops Extra Stout's Avatar
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    To my knowledge he is only seen as a prophet in Islam.
    I believe some Hindus regard him as a sage, at least.

  5. #555
    "Have to check the film" PixelPusher's Avatar
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    But it is widely regarded that he did exist. Is that the case with Santa or bigfoot?
    The myth of Santa Claus (and the parallel myths in other European countries) has it's roots in a real life Bishop Saint Nicholas of Myra. Of course, he didn't live in the North Pole or ride in a sleigh powered by flying reindeer.

  6. #556
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    How exactly does that help your case that only an advanced mind could conceive of a higher power?
    ? It's pretty obvious isn't it?


    Anyway what I said was spirtual beliefs are the product of advanced intelligence...since man is the most advanced intelligence we know of, and it also the only creature on the planet possesing spiritual beliefs that we know of, and has done so for the entirety of his existence based on all the evidence...it's the easiest point in the world to make.



    You'd have to be a total idiot to not concede the point.

  7. #557
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    Put it this way...even if all spiritual beliefs are complete bull fairytales...they are still the product of advanced intelligence.


    [/thread]

  8. #558
    33-49 Xylus's Avatar
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    Put it this way...even if all spiritual beliefs are complete bull fairytales...they are still the product of advanced intelligence.


    [/thread]
    So is Paris Hilton's popularity.

    Who gives a ?

    Man has created millions of horrible ideas.

  9. #559
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Put it this way...even if all spiritual beliefs are complete bull fairytales...they are still the product of advanced intelligence.


    [/thread]
    Yeah if you use advanced intelligence in the most basic of ways. You don't mean people of high IQ, you mean higher brain function of humans compared to animals.

    Wow, thats such a resounding statement Whottt. Thanks for such groundbreaking thought.

  10. #560
    33-49 Xylus's Avatar
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    You'd have to be a total idiot to not concede the point.
    I understand that human beings are the only animal on Earth capable of having spiritual beliefs, but I'm not sure what the point behind this assertion is. How does it advance or hinder this discussion?

  11. #561
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    So is Paris Hilton's popularity.

    Who gives a ?
    You do you ignorant stick...that's why you are asking the questions...DUH.

    Man has created millions of horrible ideas.
    First and foremost your parents thinking it would be a good idea to reproduce.

    off...

  12. #562
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    I understand that human beings are the only animal on Earth capable of having spiritual beliefs, but I'm not sure what the point behind this assertion is. How does it advance or hinder this discussion?
    It proves my point pretty emphatically...since such beliefs are only found in the most intelligent of all creatures, it is therefore pretty obviously a product of advanced intelligence.


    Do you need it explained further? Idiot?

    If so let me put it another way...

    The worst idea ever thought of by man is still better than the best one ever thought of by a rock...


    Get it now stick?


    Edit: Except for atheism...because the Rock can do that one itself

  13. #563
    Esse quam videri ploto's Avatar
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    To me- faith does not explain everything; it simply gives me peace when things are inexplainable. I am not one of those people who normally prays that God will make things be a certain way. Instead, I pray for the ability to accept life with grace and humility no matter how things turn out.

  14. #564
    "Have to check the film" PixelPusher's Avatar
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    I don't accept that at all. In starting down the path towards faith, we already have left Cartesian ideas of certainty behind. If one considers that God might exist, one then must consider whether God is revealed to mankind in any way. If one considers that God is revealed, then he must consider whether God is revealed uniquely to him, or also to others. If one considers that God is revealed also to others, then he must consider whether God is revealed in a similar fashion to others or not. If one considers that God is revealed is a similar fashion to others, then he must consider whether there is a faith system out there that might be correct. If he considers that a particular one might be correct, he should then evaluate its tenets. If he accepts them, then he should have faith. If he does not believe them, then he should back up a few steps.

    The right spirit of humility to have in all this is to recognize that these steps are all inductive. The validation of this faith journey is first and foremost through noetic experience and not rational intellect. I do not believe it is necessary to bowdlerize my faith in order to treat others with respect if they make different choices.
    The steps you describe are what I had to do years after growing up in a faith preformed for me, like a great many others who's religious preference is largely a result of culture and geography, not of some journey started from a blank slated origin.

  15. #565
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    Yeah if you use advanced intelligence in the most basic of ways. You don't mean people of high IQ, you mean higher brain function of humans compared to animals.

    Wow, thats such a resounding statement Whottt. Thanks for such groundbreaking thought.
    Put away your computer, your keyboard, your mouse and your monitor...


    After all, they're fairytales first and foremost.

  16. #566
    United Autodidact Society Shastafarian's Avatar
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    It seems logic has escaped young whottt.

  17. #567
    33-49 Xylus's Avatar
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    Actually, Atheism is a belief that no God exists, so it's not possible for a rock to "believe" in Atheism since it has no brain. Dumbass.

    I swear, for all the took DPG got in this thread for his opinion, you really take the cake for the worst argument.

  18. #568
    United Autodidact Society Shastafarian's Avatar
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    and has done so for the entirety of his existence based on all the evidence
    Just curious there Aristotle but what evidence are you referring to? Aww shucks he has me on ignore. Anyone else care to answer this question?

  19. #569
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Wow that's a tremendous non sequitor even for you. But, with these posts I'm reaching dangerously into arguing with a re ed child about the demonic feather wielding Easter bunny territory so I'm going to stop.

  20. #570
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    Actually, Atheism is a belief that no God exists, so it's not possible for a rock to "believe" in Atheism since it has no brain. Dumbass.
    A person with zero brain activity has a brain...what do they believe?


    I swear, for all the took DPG got in this thread for his opinion, you really take the cake for the worst argument.
    At least I'm not the quoting non-atheists to back up my atheistic view point...against their express wishes.

  21. #571
    God Talks To Me. angel_luv's Avatar
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    For your consideration:
    Mark 10:13-16-People were bringing little children to Jesus to have him touch them, but the disciples rebuked them.
    When Jesus saw this, He was indignant. He said to them, "Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. I tell you the truth, anyone who will not receive the kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it." And He took the children in His arms, put His hands on them and blessed them.

  22. #572
    33-49 Xylus's Avatar
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    A person with zero brain activity has a brain...what do they believe?
    A person with zero brain activity is as smart as the rock...since they'd be ing dead.

  23. #573
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    Wow that's a tremendous non sequitor even for you. But, with these posts I'm reaching dangerously into arguing with a re ed child about the demonic feather wielding Easter bunny territory so I'm going to stop.

    Take a different path then...feel free to point me to any successful atheistic civilization...

  24. #574
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    A person with zero brain activity is as smart as the rock...since they'd be ing dead.

    A horse has a brain, what do they believe?


    It's only going to get worse...

  25. #575
    United Autodidact Society Shastafarian's Avatar
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    Take a different path then...feel free to point me to any successful atheistic civilization...
    I just can't fathom how dumb you truly are...it's astounding

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