Relevant and accurate stats?
You're just a parrot if agreeing with that wrong stuff and saying they're relevant. Is inaccurate information "relevant"
Did Jordan have 5 rings and 5 MVPs at age 33?
Was Jordan "faaar" ahead of Kobe at age 30?
I have answered all your questions and you have dodged mine. You should read the link in the Spurs forum about the GM votes. Especially the parts about the best players, finishers... I remember you telling me that Bynum was the best finisher. I said what about Lebron or Amare or TP. Go see what people who watch them closest think...
They are relevant. Saying what MJ finished his career with is not inaccurate or irrelevant. It shows you what Kobe would have to do just with regards to winning hardware to even be able to start.
Jordan skill wise was far ahead of Kobe at age 30. Not ring wise, not awards wise. BASKETBALL WISE.
Since the original question from the Laker fan was about who did what better, those comparisons can be made now. Everyone knew what Jordan was by the time he was 30, and Kobe just doesn't compare in the mind of anyone that isn't a rabid Laker fan. They just aren't the same. If Kobe wins four to six more regular season and finals MVP trophies before he retires then we'll all revisit the comparison. Steve Nash would earn his way into the discussion if he did that, though.
Bird wasn't known for shooting 3's in regular season games? He's only known for shooting 3's in the All Star game?
'94 Rockets. What year did Jordan retire?As mentioned, the '94 Rockets were one of the first teams to actually use the three point shot as a consistent weapon and to hit it at a high percentage. What you see today is in no way representative of what happened before that.
Jordan was as skilled a 3 point shooter as Kobe? Can he walk on water too?You should have your Laker fandom stripped of you for saying something so ignorant.
What relevance do wrong "facts" have?
You keep saying Kobe can never catch up with Jordan's accomplishments (6 rings, Finals MVPs, etc), why are you conveniently forgetting this when comparing at age 30?
That's the original blog post but this conversation is not about the original blog post which said Kobe is as good as Jordan right now and I don't agree.
Even though Jordan was already a highlight reel, he wasn't a winner yet. Jordan is GOAT because he was a winner. Kobe's not there yet but he's starting his run right at the same time Jordan did his, age 30.Everyone knew what Jordan was by the time he was 30, and Kobe just doesn't compare in the mind of anyone that isn't a rabid Laker fan.
That's my whole point, let's wait and see before we close the book on Kobe's career.If Kobe wins four to six more regular season and finals MVP trophies before he retires then we'll all revisit the comparison. Steve Nash would earn his way into the discussion if he did that, though.
Where did I say he can never do it? I said I do not believe he can and that it is unlikely. How are the facts wrong? We all know what Jordan won. So saying Kobe has to meet this level is not wrong and he still has time. No one is saying that Kobe right now is done because he does not have in his career that is ongoing what Jordan has for his career that is over.
People are saying that even if Kobe at the end of his career has the same amount of les and awards (which is unlikely) that he still won't be considered the GOAT because he is not a better player.
EXACTLY, thank you for agreeing with me. At least you can admit he CAN do it (although unlikely), as I said we don't have an argument.
At age 33, how many MVPs, Finals MVPs, DPOY awards, NBA first team selections, etc, did Jordan have?How are the facts wrong?
Read back a few posts, it was already posted that Kobe "CANNOT", that was the original post I replied to, see for yourself.We all know what Jordan won. So saying Kobe has to meet this level is not wrong and he still has time. No one is saying that Kobe right now is done because he does not have in his career that is ongoing what Jordan has for his career that is over.
People are fine in saying that, I don't disagree. I said what IF Kobe has MORE? Read one of my first posts after Jamstone, I said Kobe would need at least 7 rings, and what IF he had 8?People are saying that even if Kobe at the end of his career has the same amount of les and awards (which is unlikely) that he still won't be considered the GOAT because he is not a better player.
That is where you are wrong. Winning is part of it. The winning is the effect, not the cause. Jordan was the best because he was the best basketball player. Naturally he won because of that. Kobe is not near Jordan with regards to skill. Not now, not at any age. He may make a quantum leap in his game, but I doubt it.
That is opinion and you're en led to it.
I read what you said. I have made the argument that Jordan is not better than Kobe because of the rings. So if Kobe wins 8 rings, that does not make him better in my book. Jordan was the better player. If neither Kobe or Jordan win any rings, who do you take?
That is 1 fan's opinion but at least it's arguable IF Kobe gets 8 rings.
30 year old Kobe and 30 year old Jordan?If neither Kobe or Jordan win any rings, who do you take?
On the Bulls, I take Jordan. On the Lakers, I take Kobe, they fit their respective teams better.
Who was the better basketball player at age 30, do not talk about systems or teams or anything.
At age 30, I would say they're dead even and if forced to pick 1, I would take Kobe.
At the same age, would you take Bynum or Robinson (meaning Bynum's age 21 to 22 years old)
Ouch. I'd have to go with Robinson. I may change my mind in a few months.
lmao lmao lmao lmao
I used to think Allanon was a rational, level headed Laker fan until I read this thread. It's clear he's not.
Which part was irrational? You think it's impossible for Kobe to ever catch Jordan even though they've accomplished the same by the age of 30?
Laker fans...and only laker fans would say that. It's all a matter that he's on your favorite team. If he played for the Hornets, I doubt you'd say that.At age 30, I would say they're dead even and if forced to pick 1, I would take Kobe.
lmao why? because he's been lifting weights and had a decent stretch of a season last year before he got injured.Ouch. I'd have to go with Robinson. I may change my mind in a few months.
What had Jordan done by the day he turned 30?
He went to college for 3 years. And since you've been all about being fair to both players in this thead, it doesn't quite work like that.
Why are you penalizing Kobe for getting more NBA experience? The question was at age 30, who would you pick (forget everything else). I
The fact of the matter is the day they turned 30, both players were/are virtually the same with Kobe having more experience and MORE accomplishments. Jordan didn't start killing until this exact same year Kobe is in.
That's why I chose Kobe, by a slight margin, this isn't reasonable?
I presume that you include "the day he turned 30" for some reason, but by the end of the season in which he turned 30, Jordan had won an NCAA le, been the Naismith and Wooden player of the year in college, had won two regular season MVPs, led the league in scoring seven years in a row, had won three NBA les and three Finals MVPs, became the second person in NBA history to score 3000 points in a season (also became the first person in NBA history to get 200 steals and 100 blocks in that same season, yet wasn't awarded the MVP), set the record for most points in a playoff game...
If you'd like to cut off "by the day he turned 30" he had done all those things with the exception of the last le and one of the finals MVP awards.
The only things Kobe Bryant has done by the age of 30 that Jordan never did is score 81 points against Toronto, tank a playoff game to spite his team and get outplayed and lose in the finals.
By your weak attempts to compare, someone could make a case that Tony Parker is as close to Jordan as Kobe is.
/thread
edit: they need a smiley face emoticon that s on another smiley face emoticon.
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