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  1. #1901
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    October 28, 2008 - National General Election Ballot
    While the national ballot has remained unchanged since the last week of September, Barack Obama continues to gain electoral votes. Obama now leads in 30 states with a total of 375 electoral votes and John McCain leads in 21 states with a total of 163 electoral votes.

    Obama could lose Florida, Indiana, Nevada, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Virginia and still have 278 electoral votes.
    American Research Group

  2. #1902
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    The latest analysis from Fivethirtyeigth...


    "With no fewer than 45 polls released since our last update, covering essentially all of the major swing states, we have a pretty good idea of where this race stands -- a far better idea than you'll get by trying to discern the meaning of John Zogby's divining rod or paying any attention to what you see on the front page of Drudge Report. What we can say, when we put all this information together, is that there are two things that John McCain is NOT doing.

    Number one, John McCain is NOT closing Obama's margin as quickly as he needs to (if indeed he is closing it at all). This appears to be a 6- or 7- point race right now ... that's where we have it, that's where RCP has it, that where Pollster.com has it. In order to beat Barack Obama, John McCain will need to gain at least one point per day between now and the election. Our model does think that McCain has pared about a point off Obama's margin -- but it has taken him a week to do so. Now, McCain needs to gain six more points in six more days. And he needs to do so with no real ground game, no real advertsing budget, and no one particularly strong message. Not easy.

    Number two, John McCain is NOT gaining ground in the states that matter the most. The top tier of states in this election are Virginia, Colorado and Pennsylvania. There is lots of lots of polling in these states, particularly in Virgnia and Pennsylvania, and it's all coming up in roughly the same range, showing Obama leads in the high single digits (in VA and CO) or the low double digits (in PA). The second tier of states is probably Ohio, Florida and Nevada. McCain seems to be getting a bit stronger in Florida; Obama seems to be getting a bit stronger in Ohio and Nevada. McCain does seem to have halted Obama's progress in some of the third-tier states, particularly Missouri and North Carolina. On the other hand, some other third-tier states, like New Mexico and particularly New Hampshire (where Obama is getting some insane numbers lately), now appear to be off the table.

    My feeling is that John McCain still needs some sort of external contingency to win the presidency. Even if some of the more conservative turnout models are correct AND even if he were to win large majorities of the undecided vote, he is probably a little bit too far behind to catch up. Rather, McCain will need to find some way to eat into some fraction of Obama's decided vote, and because most of Obama's support is quite hard (e.g. enthusiastic), that will not be easy to do."
    Link

    Things are looking good for the Obama camp, but complacency is the last thing the DEMs need now...only a few days left in the election and in some states early voting has already started, so don't think that your vote won't make a difference...it will....let's show them that TX is not just a GOP stronghold anymore and if any party wants the support of the people of this great state, they are gonna have to work for us, the people, to earn that support...

  3. #1903
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Scroll up and read what I posted.

  4. #1904
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    Sorry, but I agree with this analysis...

    At this point I don't think you'll see much more tightening before November 4. You may see another point or 2 at the max, but considering this is a 5-6 point race thats simply not enough to make this a compe ive race. I'll really be interested to see the polls a few days from now after the Obamamercial from tonight because I thought it was extremely well produced and I think at the least its going to move the pendulum away from McCain but I think its more likely to bring movement back to Obama.

    Obama is on the top of a wave right now and I'm not sure there's anything McCain can' do to stop it much less swing it the other way.
    I think the Obamainfomercial will push Obama over the top in some close races....unfortunately for McCain they are all in formerly red states...

  5. #1905
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    WASHINGTON – Democrats are dominating early voting in six key states President Bush won four years ago, forcing Republican John McCain to play catch-up even before Election Day arrives.

    Democrats outnumber Republicans among early voters in Iowa, North Carolina, Florida, Colorado, New Mexico and Nevada, according to statistics from election and party officials in those states. Bush won all six in 2004, and McCain needs to win most of them to claim the White House this year.

    Georgia, another red state, doesn't track early voters by party, but it does by race. About 1.4 million Georgians have already cast ballots, and blacks are voting in disproportionate numbers. Black voters overwhelmingly support Democrat Barack Obama, who is bidding to become the nation's first black president.

    Voters can always cross party lines and no vote totals are announced until Election Day, but the early indications clearly favor Obama. It is unclear, however, whether they will translate into success on Nov. 4 because never before have so many Americans cast their votes before Election Day.
    Yahoooo News

  6. #1906
    W4A1 143 43CK? Nbadan's Avatar
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    Zogby, who I think leans right on his polls, can't spin the post Obamainfomerical bounce...

    Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby Poll: Obama 50.2%, McCain 43.3%
    Obama gains, McCain slips

    UTICA, New YorkDemocrat Barack Obama has inched forward again, once again expanding his lead above 50% and moving outside the margin of error as rival John McCain slipped more than a full point, the latest Reuters/C-SPAN/Zogby daily tracking telephone poll shows.

  7. #1907
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    KING: You don't believe Barack Obama is a socialist do you?

    MCCAIN: "No, but i do believe that he has been in the far left of American politics and stated time after time that he believes in spreading the wealth around. He has talked about courts that redistribute the wealth. He has a record of voting against tax cuts. And for tax increases."
    Oops

  8. #1908
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Lets take a quick look at Georgia because they provide a great look at demographics of early voting based on state data.

    So far the demographic breakdown of the early voting goes like so:

    35.2% Black

    That leaves basically 65% White and other races such as Hispanic or Asian with the vast majority of that being White.

    If Barack is carrying 90% of the black vote (this is a conservative estimate as its much more likely to be around 95%) and 40% of the white vote then this is how the percentages break down so far:

    57.5% Barack
    42.5% McCain

    I think this is a pretty conservative estimate of how much of the early vote Obama has in this state considering the very basic demographic breakdown and the conservative percentages I'm using both for the white vote and the black vote. Considering that as of yesteday's stats we'd already seen this round of early voting at the 40% mark of the entire turnout for the 2004 election so we're seeing a huge slice of the electorate at this point. I think its highly likely that at least half of Georgia's entire turnout for this election will have been cast in absentee or early ballot which means that McCain has to absolutely destroy on Election day to carry the state. I believe he's got a decent chance to pull that off, but these numbers are a strong indicator of the Obama GOTV machine and how its making the GOP's job a difficult one.

    Oh, and these numbers should scare the out of Republicans looking to win that Senate race.

  9. #1909
    "Have to check the film" PixelPusher's Avatar
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    Yeah, McCain can only parrot wingnut pablum for so long before he tires of it.
    It's even bleeding into his attack ads:


    it's that "...yet" part that puts a cork on the tip of the blade there.

  10. #1910
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    LOL LOL LOL



    Its safe to say the McCain senior staff hates Palin. Whottt probably thinks they're just Anti-American, right?

  11. #1911
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    Even though I was all for Gore, W was charismatic. Gore came off as being an arrogant bag. I think that turned alot of people off from him....

    Good god...you think W was charismatic? He's the most uncharismatic politician arguably in history, outside of maybe John Kerry...yeah Gore didn't really have much either, but at least he had experience and the Military background.

  12. #1912
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    Time for you to man up Whottt.

    Lets bet 6 months in the political forum. If McCain wins - he doesn't even need to win in a landslide - I will not come in here for 6 months after November fith. If Obama wins, then you stay out for sixth Months after November 5th.

    Don't be a - if you really believe what you say you do step up to the plate.



    Um...you must not be familiar with my political forum posting history, I go months without posting in here all the time...I'm sure I've had a couple of 6 month stints in the past 4 years(I think I've done it a lot actually).

    After the election is over I won't be posting in here anymore regularly than I have in previous years.


    You guys can get back to your liberal inbreeding and resume your non-stop piling on of Ray and Yoni, which ya'll like to label as intellectualism, after the election...win or lose, don't worry.

  13. #1913
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    Zogby, who I think leans right on his polls


  14. #1914
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Um...you must not be familiar with my political forum posting history, I go months without posting in here all the time...I'm sure I've had a couple of 6 month stints in the past 4 years(I think I've done it a lot actually).

    After the election is over I won't be posting in here anymore regularly than I have in previous years.


    You guys can get back to your liberal inbreeding and resume your non-stop piling on of Ray and Yoni, which ya'll like to label as intellectualism, after the election...win or lose, don't worry.
    Then make the bet. Stop dancing and just make the bet.

  15. #1915
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    Except I'm not using exit polls but the information directly from the state of Georgia. Although polling done by SUSA (Not exit polling either) and some other firms says pretty much the exact same thing. I know its a huge surprise to you, but the data gathered by these pollsters is being verified by the data gathered by the state itself.
    Yeah but you're asking me to make a bet on demographic voting...and that is done by exit polling.

    Its amazing you give Obama an added 10 million votes than John Kerry from minorities and still have him losing. You were still unable to provide a demographic breakdown but I suspect thats because you have no idea who the is going to supply your magic votes so I'll just let it go. I have a feeling this is about as close as I'm going to get to the answer.
    And I've also stated how he's going to lose voters....I've stated a variety of reasons he's going to lose them and I feel they are all very valid.


    #1. It's a fact that a good PCT of Hillary supporters are not supporting him...I think the general number has been consistently that 58% of them support him and the rest don't. 28%(also a pretty consistent number) or so are expected to go to McCain....that's 6 million votes right there, and a good deal of the remaining Hillary supporters are not expected to vote.


    You think there is not going to be any price paid there...you think there is going to be no substantial loss there.


    Look at it blanket numbers from 2004:

    Bush took 61 million votes
    Kerry took 58 million vots.


    You substract 6 milliion Hillary supporters from Obama's 10 million total and add them to McCain and that's a 4 million gain for Obama and a 6 million gain for McCain.

    That equals 67 million votes for McCain and 62 million for Obama.


    Except for the fact that I don't think hispanics are going to turn out for Obama like you think they are...


    They didn't in the primaries, they turned out for Hillary...and these hispanics of which we speak are largely independents a great deal of which supported Bush the Republican in the last election..they are not Yellow Dog Democrats, and the key issue with hispanic voters is one Mccain just happens to be on the right side of for them.

    It's not a slam dunk he's going to rule the hispanic vote like you think it is...I know since you are hispanic you think you have some insight here...

    But let me just ask you this...

    Who did hispanic voters support in the primary?

    Who did you support in the primary?



    As for the rest of my break down...

    An estimated 1 in 5 voters who voted Democrat in the last election are expected to not support Obama for racial reasons, they might go to McCain, they might not vote...but that's roughly 12 million votes.

    You have to hope those losses come out of the Hillary pool..I don't think they are given the Clintons history of support for African Americans.


    Then you have the Jews...6-8 million of those in the United States, and a group that has been trending more and more Republican for 2 election now...

    You seem to think Obama's cozying up to Iran and Islamic middle name won't be a factor with them...I think it will be a huge factor. I expect that trend to the Republicans to increase in this election.






    Anyway, on the topic of getting an extra 10 million votes from minorites and losing, you have to understand that Kerry only got 60 million votes in 04. Less actually but for expidency I'll go with 60 million. Out of that, less than 11% was from AA of which Kerry got 90% of the vote, and 8% was Hispanics where Kerry got 55% of the vote. Grand Total of 17 Million votes. So you're saying his vote total from minorities is going to increase by more than 60% and he's still going to lose because of a mass exodous of white voters that we have absolutely no evidence for.
    But we do have evidence for it...

    It's been consistently reported that 28% of Clinton Democrats are expected to vote for McCain...

    It's also been consistently reported that only 58% of them are expected to vote for Obama.


    Beyond all that...it's been consistently reported that 1 in 5 Democrats are expected to not vote for Obama due to racial reasons.



    That's 18 million votes lost assuming they are all coming from a different pool of voters....even if they aren't...it's still bound to be a number relevant to Obama chances of beating McCain.


    That is downright ing stupid, Whottt. You should have at least stuck to the stupid low voterturnout idea than coming out saying that Obama's support from minorities will grow at that rate and he will still lose. Thats ing idiocy. I'd bet everything I own agaisnt Obama gaining 10 million votes from minorities and doing anything but dominating.

    Next time don't pull a number out of your ass when you're butt hurt about being shown for the fool you are because you're merely reinforcing the concept.

    I didn't pull any numbers out of my ass...I am going by the same information you are...


    What you need to be worried about is that from the getgo I accepted your theory that minorities are going to turnout...and factored it in.


    You simply label my theory stupid and refuse to factor it in to your projections.


    I'm not the one in denial and refusing to acknowledge relevant factors...you are.
    Last edited by whottt; 10-30-2008 at 06:46 AM.

  16. #1916
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    MSNBC keeps talking about a Mason-Dixon poll coming out today that shows PA down to a 4 point race at 47-43 which would be a huge departure from everything else coming out of the state. We'll see but I'm betting that the poll has some skewed demographics before I'm accepting that a race that is universally shown at 9-12 points all of a sudden down to four points with a huge increase in undecideds.

  17. #1917
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    First of all, I'm asking you to bet on results. WTF does it matter where I get the information I'm basing my prediction on Whottt? THe only thing that matters is the end result because thats all we're betting on. You keep doing this stupid song and dance where you post something completely out of left field in response to something I post. I haven't looked at a single bit of exit polling considering there has been zero exit polling conducted in 2008 so I'm not evne sure why you're bringing this up. The demographic breakdown doesn't come from polling but the actuall demographics of the early voting participants as reported by the state of Georgia.

    In the end you just keep dancing around the subject because you're too scared to make the bet. You say that six months out of the political forum is no big deal to you yet you refuse to make the bet because you're simply full of .

    If you want to sit there and garner praise for your one out of a billion predictions that comes through why don't you actually put something on the line?

    Anyway, you are completely pulling numbers out of your ass. You haven't cited a single source for these numbers that you're using. You just decide to throw a number to see if it sticks without actually providing a context for said number or a source. You say that Hilary supporters are abandoning Obama when the vast majority of polls show that Obama is gathering more support from his base than McCain is. There are more Republicans defecting for Obama than there are Democrats defecting for McCain and this is a strong consistency in the vast majority of polling.

    Then you bring up Hispanics and you cite that you don't think they're going to turnout in large numbers yet early voting numbers out of predominatly hispanic areas are that of greatly increased turnout comapred to 2004. If you look at the border counties of Texas and New Mexico what you see are early voting numbers that are much higher than in 2004.

    http://www.sos.state.tx.us/elections...ng/index.shtml

    Check them for yourself (or you can actually read my posts in this very thread) if you don't believe me. You can compare them yourself and see how large the increase is and early voting still has 3 full days to go.

    And I haven't even begun to touch on the support that the hispanic community is showing Obama. Bush did well with this community in the 2 elections he won but this isn't 2004 and there is no evidence that McCain is in line to recieve the same kind of support. There's no doubt that Hilary got more of this demographic than Obama but they're not supporting McCain because McCain isn't Hilary.

    Just show me some information to back up what your saying and stop pussy footing around my bet challenges to you. If you really believed your predictions and if you really didn't think six months out of here was a big deal you'd have absolutely no qualms about making a bet but the truth is that you know the foundation of your predictions should start with "Once Upon A Time".

    Just start by providing links to how your claims of the "continuously reported" figures on Hilary supporters.

  18. #1918
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    I'll leave the political forum for 6 months after the election no matter who wins

  19. #1919
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    I'll leave the political forum for 6 months after the election no matter who wins
    Pussy - you'll do anything to avoid actually having anything to lose from your predictions. You sure do have a lot of conviction behind them.

  20. #1920
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    You're funny Manny.

  21. #1921
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    You're funny Manny.
    That's about the only reality based thing you've posted in the past 4 months.

  22. #1922
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    Any word on the overnight ratings for Obama's sales pitch?


    I am very interested in those...

  23. #1923
    I can live with it JoeChalupa's Avatar
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    The polls are getting tighter and this race, as I've said many times, is FAR from over. Far from over my friends.

  24. #1924
    Damn The Man Mr. Peabody's Avatar
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    The polls are getting tighter and this race, as I've said many times, is FAR from over. Far from over my friends.
    Watching a few too many McCain townhalls....?

  25. #1925
    I can live with it JoeChalupa's Avatar
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    Watching a few too many McCain townhalls....?
    No, not at all. McCain has always been a strong closer and the polls are showing that. Just keeping it real.

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