Your point is valid about the lack of interior defense.. but the other points are just as valid, you can't just dismiss them.
Sorry, but:
Spurs DID lose because Bonner is inconsistent, and lacks nba skills in a lot of areas.
Spurs DID lose because Violet Palmer fantasizes about Amare every night she pulls out the vibrator, and Bennet Salvatore just plain hates the spurs; I'm guessing he probably lost money on a bet he made against the spurs some years ago.
Spurs DID lose because they do not have Manu.
what about the sun's defense...? I thought it was pretty good.
and what you think about Porter, can he take them to the next level, or do you think the suns will still be the same old same old... not quite enough to make it all the way...?
I don't know much about porter as a coach except that he hasn't accomplished much yet.
Do you get paid for putting up these threads Timvp??? You are a bad ass recapper.
Hard to really say how the Suns defense is. It looked pretty solid at times.
What I really want to know is how does any team stop the Nash/Amare pick and roll? An athletic big maybe???
Yeah, but Manu didn't play, so we have yet to see how they defend us with Manu in.
I thought Bonner's basketball IQ was perfectly exemplified by his decision-making in the last possession. With the Spurs down 5 and, what, 4 seconds remaining, Bonner's got the ball open on the perimeter for 3, but a defender is closing. Instead of immediately taking the contested 3, he wastes 2 seconds to dribble in and clang a mid-range jumper. Granted, the game is 99% over there anyway, but the only way you win is if you take, and make, the immediate 3.
Bonner's a smart dude who is "basketball IQ challenged." This is not something that is going to change.
Tiago Splitter.
First you said that his teammates should have gotten Duncan the ball more often, then you said the team was too reliant on Duncan and Parker for offense. HUH?!
Great analysis as always Timvp!
I thought Bonner and Thomas both looked pretty weak out there, and if there's a glaring weakness in this team it's the big men. I still like Thomas as the primary backup against most teams, but he didn't show a lot last night.
I'll be interested to see if Tolliver and Mahinmi are given a chance to prove themselves once they're available.
I noticed when Parker took his three down the stretch that Mason looked to be open on the wing. I'm all for the stars taking the big shots, but Parker's three was forced a bit and Mason had been hitting all night. Having Parker and Duncan shoot those threes down the stretch may not have been the best plays.
ITA. In watching the game I didn't see anything that struck me as odd for what I've come to expect from the Spurs early in the season up until the last few minutes where anything resembling execution on either end of the floor went entirely out the window. Parker had a good look, but it was obvious the second he went into his motion that he was out of rhythm. Looked more like a heat check than a guy shooting for the game. As for Tim's, I can only assume 21 was having some flashbacks or something.
I tend to agree with most of the comments in this thread, but I'll add a couple of my own.
I think the effort on Opening Night was great and if the Spurs play that hard for the bulk of the season, with or without Manu, they're going to win a lot of games. It's going to be difficult to beat a relatively elite team like Phoenix even on the best of nights; trying to do it with Matt Bonner getting big minutes is not a big help. It's harder still when you're without a guy who is part of the foundation that the team's structure depends upon. More Manu might have meant less Mason, for instance, so I'm not sure that there's a 1-to-1 correlation in thinking that the Spurs definitely win with Manu; but I thought it was apparent in Game 1 just how much Manu does for the Spurs, particularly against the Suns.
I hear complaints about rebounding, but I thought the Spurs did a relatively good job of gang rebounding -- they hung in there against a team with a handful of guys who gobble up rebounds and were neck-and-neck with the Suns all night long in that category. There were, unfortunately, a couple of instances where their lack of size and athleticism showed in individual rebounding match -- and among the 3 worst plays of the game was Bonner's inability to rebound the ball after Barnes missed a 3rd quarter bunny in transition, which was abysmal.
The possession that won the game for the Suns was the Spurs' third-to-last one, I think. After a Phoenix miss, Mason had the ball above the arc on the wing. With a someone closing him out, he put the ball on the floor and kicked out to Parker, who was above the arc, too. Instead of trying to work the ball to Timmy and running some offense, Parker bricked an ill-advised 3 (IMO) and the die was cast. Obviously, Parker had been shooting the ball well in the 2nd half and had carried the offense late, but I think that you have to work the ball to Tim in those situations and let him see what he can create for himself or others. That struck me as a purely mental mistake.
I disagree with whomever is claiming that the officials cost the Spurs the game. There were some missed calls, to be sure, but the Spurs did get the benefit of a few of those missed calls. The Suns were probably able to be a bit more physical with Duncan than, say Bonner was allowed to be physical with Stoudemire. But, several of the ticky-tack calls against Bonner were expressly for having two hands on the offensive player in the post, which has clearly been a foul for several years now. Amare got called for one of those as well, in the first half, so it's not like those calls were one-sided, either.
In the end, the free throw numbers, excepting the Hack-a-Shaq, were even (and that's with the Spurs intentionally fouling late) at 19 and the Spurs had their chances to win that game. Had they, for instance, corralled a loose ball with about 6 minutes to go, the Spurs might have extended a one-point lead and given themselves some breathing room; instead, Finley and Mason (I think) each fail to grab the loose ball, the Suns collect it and get it to Barbosa who drains a jumper to give the lead back to the Suns. In such a close game, plays like that one are killers.
It was a disappointing loss, but one that gives me substantial hope going forward.
Kudos, as always, for a very-do ented recap
Never thought I'd see the day that the Suns transition defense would be equal to or better than the Spurs.
No kidding about Finley. No matter how much weight he's lost or how more well-conditioned he is, it's still that same ol' result. There is very little net benefit. I'm still mystified at Pop's fascination with this guy. I'd would've rather the team went in another direction here.
Keep an eye on Bowen this year for any noticeable decline.
Nice "Game Thoughts", timvp! Professional grade quality.
I noticed that Bruce Bowen has completely forgotten how to run the break in transition, both offensively and defensively. Ugly.
I also noticed that Bennett Salvatore is in mid-season form and has gained new confidence in his court vision, making several calls much farther away from the other two officials on the floor and also showcasing his eagle-eye, detecting the slightest move of any pivot foot. He's back!
I also learned from a post-game TV interview that San Antonio has had only 3 dominant big-men, starting on Harry Wurzbach and Rittiman road with Shaquille O'Neal. I could have sworn Artis Gilmore was around before Shaq but...maybe not.
Pop biggest task during the first couple of months is to settle a rotation.
Right now, there is 13 players who can be part of the future rotation. Spurs are damn late in the process of setting a hierarchy. It's almost impossible to judge how good will be this team in a couple of months when everybody should be healthy and when Pop will have figure who should play or not.
November will be a preseason for Spurs. What sucks is that it counts and Spurs will be behind other teams for the playoff race. Spurs fans will have to be patient.
Last night would've been a perfect opportunity for Tolliver and Ian to get some burn. I can't wait until we get the full compliment of players back so we can actually see what we're working with.
I don't think it was bad officiating for any side...but if you want two examples of questionable calls going the spurs way here they are:
1. non call on offensive foul on parker pushing off Nash near the free-throw line.
2. Charge called on Amare while going to the basket on a dunk while Thomas was still not set.
There you go........ it's the first game of the season and you are already making excuses for your team??.... I'd rather read form spurs fans that your team was incomplete and all those things....but officianting??? common.....you sound like what you guys like to call a suns fan.....
Last edited by nashty; 10-30-2008 at 12:44 PM.
I though Bonner looked pretty lost on defense all night. He was looking around like he didn't even know who to guard. Timmy and Pop got in his ass a couple of times during the game and he responded with more of the same. I don't think he passed the ball well or had very much confidence. I didn't think his first half was that impressive, he just hit a couple of three's but I didn't see the effort in rebounding. I knew it was over once he missed that open 3 after he had hit the others.
Mason played excellent. Aggressive on offense and tried to make his rotations on D. Not afraid to shoot and it looks like he will be able to run and finish with Parker on the break, something no one else can do while Manu is out.
All in all its what I thought we'd look like. I don't think this team has what it takes this year, you never know though. We know what Finely, Bowen and Bonner will give, they're not going to get any better. Udoka still has room for improvement and we haven't seen the new guys that much, but in Pop's system they won't matter that much anyway.
PS
Stop complaining about Refs. We know Palmer sucks, but she wasn’t the reason we lost.
Response to sig. Because to others, Bill Hicks is... "another human being on this planet" where potential harm might come. Love for fellow man is important, too and with greater positive results and impact than the importance of self-indulgence.
I will try not to hijack this thread, but I don't really get your point. His point is he has free will to do with himself as he pleases as long as he doesn't hurt anyone else and other people should not be able to tell him what to do with his personal temple. It has nothing to do with self-indulgence.
I'll PM you when I have a few minutes and try to help you understand the point. Mr. Hicks died at age 32 of liver cancer and he may well have caused some harm to his friends and family, including Jim and Mary Hicks.
i think defense was the spurs' greatest weakness. barnes kept getting open looks at the three point line and hill hit a few wide open jumpers. i blame most of this on finley because he was the one who was guarding them when they got their open looks. i think the time has come for bowen to stop defending the quick point guards in the NBA. as evident last year against NO, bowen can't keep up with smaller and quicker guards. it would be much more productive to assign him to shut down a wing player and let parker deal with the PG. since popovich insists on starting finley, putting finley on the lesser wing threat seems much better.
another reoccurring issue the spurs must deal with is finding someone who can defend very mobile PF's. west, stoudemire and odom ran wild against the spurs' defenders last postseason and it seems like they will continue to do so again this year unless something happens. stoudemire may not have scored explosively this time but he did make some key plays down the stretch that cost the spurs the game.
Great recap timvp
The player I was most disappointed last night was Thomas. He usually plays smart but yesterday he was terrible. A step slow on D and missing some rotations. On offensive he had a bad shot selection.
Too bad Ian got injured again. He’d have a lot of chances in the preseason and could become a rotation player. Now he’s a big question mark. I hope he gets healthy and be able to help especially on interior D.
TD and TP were fantastic
Mason did a very good job and I hope we can see more of the 1st half Bonner, if not he’ll be in trouble.
Grant Hill DID foul Tony on that play. As he was slipping and falling he slapped down @ the ball and hacked TP across the arm. Up until that point it was a no call. The officiating is inconsistent all across the board. I try my best to convince myself it all evens out because we can go on forever about the calls. For instance Chris Paul pushes off more than any one i know yet....
Last edited by Fingaroll44; 10-30-2008 at 03:28 PM.
Hey, I never said it was all the refs fault, in fact I pointed out several things the spurs did wrong. It was defenitely a factor in the game however, no matter how you look at it.
The Parker charge into Grant Hill was missed. That's one bad one against the Suns. I pointed that one out before.
The charge Thomas took was questionable, but then again it was Stoudemire, and he was barreling to the basket in usual Amare Stoudemire fashion, and clipped him in the side. The charge they called on Parker was more questionable IMO, that one late in the 4th quarter when he drove baseline and slowed up to loft a cross court pass and just slightly bumped into a suns defender who promptly flopped on his back and was granted the call. Now, if it was Nash he bumped I could possibly believe that the smallest guy on the court (Parker) could run him over. But it wasn't Nash, so its hard to believe, and even JVG pointed out it should have been a no-call. So those two virtually cancel each other out and were still left with the ton of ticky tack calls they fed Stoudemire all game long with and the phantom 4th quarter traveling violation on Mason.
Like I said before, I don't like having to point out the facts, but the facts do exist, and the fact is the spurs got shafted alot in that game.
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