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Unskilled workers UNITE!
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...ment-medd.html
Government Meddling Is Bad, Except When We Do It
The narrative Senate Republicans are going to try to spin, about the death of the automakers’ bailout, is that it was the fault of the U.A.W. After refusing to support the bill that Congressional Democrats and the Republican White House came up with, some Senate Republicans suggested that they might be willing to support a bill that rolled back U.A.W. wages to the levels earned by U.S. workers at Japanese- and German-owned plants. The union, which had already made concessions on work rules, said it would be willing to renegotiate wages in 2011, when its current contract expires, but not to roll back wages immediately. This was a deal-breaker for the Senate Republicans.
There are a couple of things to notice about this story. First, it has almost nothing to do with the core problems faced by G.M., Chrysler, and Ford. The wage gap between U.A.W. workers and workers at other car companies is no longer that big, and labor costs at this point account for only ten per cent of the cost of producing a vehicle. So rolling back wages was not going to suddenly make G.M. and Ford significantly healthier than they are today, and not getting those rollbacks did not materially change the economic value of the bridge loan. In other words, if you could support the loan with the givebacks, you should have been willing to support the loan without them.
More important, having the government dictate the wages of employees—which is literally what the G.O.P. was insisting on doing—is precisely the kind of government meddling in the marketplace that Republicans normally abhor. There is no reason to think that G.O.P. senators have a greater insight into labor dynamics, the appropriate wage for Ford workers,and how labor-management relations affect productivity than the Big Three’s executives do. Yet the senators were insisting that their judgment on these matters should trump all other considerations. I recognize the logic of saying that if we’re going to offer the automakers a loan, we should have conditions attached. But those conditions should be similar to the ones any lender would attach. They shouldn’t be an attempt to have the government dictate wage levels. What’s next? Price controls?
Unskilled workers UNITE!
The Big 3 have retirees to support, the transplants do not. The Big 3 have long established plants that are in the tax base of communities supporting schools and the like; the transplants have tax-waived status for their plants. The Big 3 have retired American workers that lived up to their obligations and expect their former employers to do the same. The deck is stacked against the American car companies.
At the same time I think Americans are realizing that we can't all sit around flipping paper for a living; we have to start making things again. We should try to save our domestic auto industry.
I am concerned that the Republicans are excited about the prospect of taking out a major American union and are willing to put the best interests of the country aside for political gains.
and where do you work exactly? I love how conservatives are quick with the anecdotes and short on the details.
I have a feeling that this scenario is either made up, embellished, or both, and i relish the chance to prove it.
Blow me. You dont know what youre talking about, that much is obvious.
What political gains is that? They'd be locking in the vote up in Michigan for the Democrats for a long time. For once, they are actually trying to put the best interests of the country ahead of political gains.I am concerned that the Republicans are excited about the prospect of taking out a major American union and are willing to put the best interests of the country aside for political gains.
Do you have a ing clue what's in store for this country? Do you realize what taxes are going to be like in our lifetime, in our children's lifetime, to cover the tab for all this ? And that's without even factoring in Medicare and social security.
Wake up.
Just think of all the money the government will have to pay in the long run when Ford/GM/Chrysler declare bankruptcy.
Give me a break. They are protecting their own turf and their own political contributors. The legislation isn't the place to dictate concessions unless it's done for everyone.
Considering we're only talking about 2% of what we've already given to Wall Street with basically no conditions whatsoever, that ship has already sailed.Do you have a ing clue what's in store for this country? Do you realize what taxes are going to be like in our lifetime, in our children's lifetime, to cover the tab for all this ? And that's without even factoring in Medicare and social security.
Wake up.
That's odd, considering they focused solely on the UAW and not on these companies as a whole.
I wish you would.Wake up.
Ever wondered what a UAW contract looks like? Here is all 22 pounds of it (in this case, Ford’s 2,215 page 2007 master contract...)
I’ll tell you this much, those 2,215 pages don’t include much regarding efficiency and compe iveness. What you’ll find are hundreds of rules, regulations, and letters of understanding that have hamstrung the auto companies for years.
Most of these rules are deliberately anti-efficiency. You can't move a guy off the (say) window-installation line, where he's not working because frames aren't being put out quickly enough, to the frame-welding line. Because it's the rule. So everything slows down for no good reason.
These rules are mostly put in as coercive tools against management. Want to speed up that frame-welding line by diverting some window-installation workers to lend a hand? Well, maybe: But it will cost you. How much is it worth to you?
This sort of nonsense is killing American industry...not just the Auto Industry. I either read it in here or heard it on the radio but, someone was whining about how the Auto Industry is one of the few remaining industries actually making an American product. Know why? The ing unions extorted the rest of our industries right out of the country.
The bail out died because the UAW wouldn't concede on this, salaries, or benefits. And, the only way for the American Auto Industry to survive is for labor costs to be brought in line with their compe ors. It can either happen by the UAW making concessions or by the Big Three being released from labor contracts by going bankrupt and restructuring their entire enterprise.
I vote for the latter.
If they don't survive, oh well...let someone else build a better mousetrap. If the market demands American made cars, someone will make them. It doesn't have to be Ford, GM, or Chrysler. And, if it isn't...at least there'll be some unused factories and unemployed auto workers to buy and hire to start a new American car company. Everyone should be sufficiently humbled by then.
Give me a ing break. If Im gonna give someone a loan who's having trouble, Im sure as going to have some say as to what they need to do so I can get paid back. You dont like it, dont take my money!!!
Private companies going to the federal government asking for a federal bail out are in no position to be demanding cushy salaries.
Well said. How many democrats know that letting the Big 3 file for bankruptcy would be best but they depend way too much on unions to finance their campaigns?
Add bailing the U.S. Car companies out to my list of thing over which I disagree with the President if, as rumor has it, he is contemplating doing what (Republicans in) Congress wisely drove a stake through.
Bottom line is that if these companies had not been pursuing re ed long term business plans (in response to short term bovine america demand for 6000 SUX's) they would not be in this mess.
It will take decades for the common American to trust the big 3's product like they do Honda, Toyota, etc. And this is their own fault.
And if Republicans did not have a history of trying to suck the life out of unions for political gain, the prospect of tearing the unions down would be far less dubious. All this union bull , combined with american's desire for ty cars, and their executives going for short-to-mid term big bucks is why we are here.
I still tend to agree with the republicans on this one though. Seems like the unions would rather take the whole body down rather than give anything up.
The 6000 SUX. An American Tradition.
take it from me even I own a 2009 camry xle
Nobel prize economist: Chapter 11 is the only way
I'm told economics is considered a science of sorts. So, there you have it - the US auto manufacturers need to go chapter 11. Its science not consensus.
And, one of my favorite economists......The US car industry will not be shut down, but it does need to be restructured. That is what Chapter 11 of America’s bankruptcy code is supposed to do...
Bailouts and Bankruptcy
What happens when a company goes bankrupt? One thing that does not happen is their productive assets go poof and disappear into thin air. In other words, if GM goes bankrupt, the assembly lines, robots, buildings and other tools don't evaporate. What bankruptcy means is the le to those assets change. People who think they can manage those assets better purchase them.
nice save!
When have unions not been willing to take the whole body down rather than give anything up?
Hey, unlike you, i'm not an exaggeration of an political exaggeration.
But I could be wrong. Like I said, if republicans did not have their history of being s, I'd be even more on their side.
Nice, base your reasoning on how you feel about a political party.
Relax, I was just trying to support and rally the Unskilled Auto Workers union members. I support all of the great US unions that do such a wonderful job for their industry. Auto union, teachers union, airline union are all really good at gettin the job done and showing the rest of the world how to do things right. Yeah baby...USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!
Thursday, December 11, 2008:
Friday, December 12, 2008:
Up 64.59 points.
Can we now say the Democrats don't know about the economy or the free market?
Doesn't Bush/Paulsen coming out and saying they are going to use the TARP also put a positive effect on the market though?Thursday, December 11, 2008:
Friday, December 12, 2008:
Up 64.59 points.
Can we now say the Democrats don't know about the economy or the free market?
Good point. But, it's a steady climb all day, when did they announce they would use TARP?
Look at the amount of money thrown without strings attached to the financial sector. it appears now that quite a bit of that money has been used to pay dividends to stockholders and not used to free up credit. With the Republicans ing about the equivalent of 5% of that money unless they can get the hands around the necks of the union it is obvious that they are exploiting the situation to axe a perceived enemy.
I have never belonged to a union (entrepreneur is the best description) but with one out of ten jobs in America impacted by the auto industry I say throw the middle class a bone. The economic elite are doing just fine.
I think in the morning, around the 200 point drop.
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