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  1. #51
    2nd Verse Same as the 1st Oh, Gee!!'s Avatar
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    depends on the subject.

  2. #52
    Believe. possessed's Avatar
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    I'm as liberal as they come and I ing love this decision. I respect Warren. I love how the comments of a couple pastors who seem to be nothing more than jealous of him are being construed into "Obama pissing off the base."

    Obama's entire message has been predicated on reconciliation and compromise and so if these people aren't on board and they don't subscribe to his fundamental message, how the can they be construed as part of the base?

    And also, Yoni, that you would attack Obama for doing what he said he would; that is enfranchising those with your point of view, is beyond sickening. You are ing disgusting excuse of an American and a human being. Piece of .
    Obama could fart in your mouth and you'd love it. Brainwashed, kool-aid drinking, eating, bad breath having, pussy ass liberal virgin internet warrior posting from the basement of your parents house.

  3. #53
    Live by what you Speak. DarkReign's Avatar
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    Obama could fart in your mouth and you'd love it. Brainwashed, kool-aid drinking, eating, bad breath having, pussy ass liberal virgin internet warrior posting from the basement of your parents house.
    The majority of your post may be true, but the "living in parents basement" portion certainly isnt.

    Nice try though. Do you make it a habit to generalize?

    Look bud, your team lost. It happens all the time. Get over it.

    Just be secure in the fact that no matter who won the election (McCain or Obama), the American people are sure to lose.

    The greatest illusion this country purports is that our government is run by the People. It most certainly is not and I havent lived long enough to say that it has ever been worse or more true a statement.

    We elect pros utes, who then service the people who got them elected. It is not their cons uency.

    So....yeah. I love my country, but hate my government. Not the "I really, really dislike you" kind of hate. No, its the real kind of hate.

  4. #54
    Live by what you Speak. DarkReign's Avatar
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    So....yeah. I love my country, but hate my government. Not the "I really, really dislike you" kind of hate. No, its the real kind of hate.
    I usually never quote myself, but this portion of my post gets me to thinking about WildCobra and Yonivore.

    How guys can be so interested in politics and governing, yet have little to no disdain for the entire faux operation?

    Its almost as if, as long as "their guy" is setting the course, all is right with the world. Bush knows no fault, the liberal agenda is ALL wrong, the conservative agenda is ALL right. This good, that bad, our country owns. Our government is the end all be all and no one should question it, certainly not in the terms of war or the methods used to gather information (torture, wiretaps, spying, etc). If they arent describing the Orwellian "Big Brother" nearly as well as Orwell did, I dont know who could. The weirdest portion of that statement is they actually support this government! WTF?! I thought you were a conservative? The root word is conserve, look it up. What are you conserving? Certainly not this country, not its people or its fundamental rights when your tail is so firmly tucked between your legs you trade perceived freedoms for perceived security. Theres a saying about that, you know...

    When in actuality, we should all be demanding better than this. Instead of finding ways in which we are so different to the point of outright resentment, we should find common ground long enough to change the rules to put the power back where it belongs.

    Then continue the usual left/right/liberal/conservative bull .

    I think I would have a much stronger allegiance in the political realm if only I had any confidence in the system of government we find ourselves under. Obama could be the next Jefferson or Washington or Eisenhower or Adams or whomever you think the greatest POTUS is of all time.

    Doesnt make a lick of difference when Congress is nothing more than a corporate brothel (if not the White House too). The people tasked with legislating law on behalf of the American people are s, check that, they are slaves (quite literally, at best indentured servants) to their monetary taskmasters.

    They dont legislate on behalf of Americans, they legislate on behalf of corporations, period. End of discussion.

    I dont give a what consonant falls at the end of their name, theyre s, thru and thru.

    Until that aspect of our government changes (RADICALLY), this entire back and forth between the mul ude of sides is just moral/political excercise for the various theories of government, its scope and its application.

    And it pains me to see so many Americans blinded enough, or too incerdibly jaded to not acknowledge that fact and that fact alone before pursuing any other agenda.

    Nothing is more important. Not the "War on Terror" (ugh...). Not the economic situation. Not our borders, our healthcare, our...anything.

    Nothing, IMO, supercedes this glaring issue of an unrepresentative government run amok. With the ability to tax! Draft and enforce law! On behalf of billionaires and the proxies!

    Its like this the world round. But here in the US, we can make a difference, if people werent so lazy and distracted with the ever-expanding ways to entertain ourselves. I am just as guilty, there is no question.

    But only because in the limited engagements I have on this topic doesnt seem to sink in for people. They either dont believe me (25%), dont understand (25%) or dont care enough to listen (50%).

    I honestly dont think that even if we were all standing in a soup-line, Depression-style, Americans still would fall into one of those categories. Nevermind the fact that your dumbass is standing ina soupline, when 5-10 years ago you had a job and a house with a 401k.

    Theyd chalk it up to the global economy....thats just code word for "its cheaper elsewhere" because governments like China and India and Mexico have nowhere near the standard of living or the promises of their forefathers to uphold.

    The powers that be dont want to bring the world up to our standard, they want to drag us down to the world. Theyre winning in blowout fashion in the third quarter, right now. Time is not on our side, yet we still believe this entire situation of ours is some big machine that no one controls and we're just victims of the world economy.

    I guess it is easier to be a victim, easier to just blame and accept station among the other drones and worker bees. I say it again....I feel sorry for people having children right now. Youve cursed them to this place. There is no heaven or , only our life. We are the first generation in this country to hand over the world in worse shape then when we got it. Your kids will never have your success level.

    Hows that for karma?

  5. #55
    Homer 2centsworth's Avatar
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    The question was about giving money, not what his motivations for becoming president are.
    I said the guy isn't charitable. You said he is because he gave up a wall street job. I countered by saying he gave up that job for the power he could never buy on his own.


    Sure, there are a ton of hypocrites outside of christian pastors who piss me off but I was placing a context on my comments in this thread. I don't agree with a lot of what Warren has to say or believe, but he puts his money where his mouth is and I believe he has good intentions.
    See.. you're focused on Warren's intentions, but up above you said you're not worried about Obama's intentions. Confusing.

  6. #56
    Veteran Wild Cobra's Avatar
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    I usually never quote myself, but this portion of my post gets me to thinking about WildCobra and Yonivore.

    How guys can be so interested in politics and governing, yet have little to no disdain for the entire faux operation?
    After all this time, you have me wrong. Don't you.

    I have no love for the republicans. There are few conservatives left in politics. Like you, I am a libertarian. Just more conservative than you. I generally end up voting for the lesser or two evils and I support the republicans against unsubstantiated allegations. They are generally false. There is little to admire about the republicans, except that they are not the democratick party. I’m sorry if my level of evidence is more than yours. Bring in some proper allegations, and you will find me in agreement most the time.

    Look at the whole thing dealing with governor Palin. Nearly every allegation was utterly false. The democrats are the slime of the earth when all they can do is slander others. At least most the republicans refrain from slander. There is so much slander all the time against republicans, I blow all of it off as just that until there is good evidence.

  7. #57
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    The powers that be dont want to bring the world up to our standard, they want to drag us down to the world. Theyre winning in blowout fashion in the third quarter, right now. Time is not on our side, yet we still believe this entire situation of ours is some big machine that no one controls and we're just victims of the world economy.
    Even if you don't accept the Illuminist theory about a banking cabal steering western history, it's more or less unarguable that it was the banks who drove this country into a ditch and the banks who stand to gain the most (and already have received the most, carte blanche) from the crisis they created.

    The direction of the USA is Brazil and Mexico. Given our pitiful education system, our manufacturing sector gutted in the name of globalism and our abandonment of sound money and thrift (echoing the theme of a venal, unrepresentative government), the trend is clear. A very bright future lies behind us.

  8. #58
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    I have no love for the republicans. There are few conservatives left in politics. Like you, I am a libertarian. Just more conservative than you. I generally end up voting for the lesser or two evils and I support the republicans against unsubstantiated allegations. They are generally false. There is little to admire about the republicans, except that they are not the democratick party.
    Faced with a fecal dualism, WC gets in the ring and starts flinging . He doesn't have to, but he chooses to.

    I’m sorry if my level of evidence is more than yours. Bring in some proper allegations, and you will find me in agreement most the time.
    Keep polishing those turds. Pretty soon, you'll see your own reflection.

    Look at the whole thing dealing with governor Palin. Nearly every allegation was utterly false. The democrats are the slime of the earth when all they can do is slander others. At least most the republicans refrain from slander. There is so much slander all the time against republicans, I blow all of it off as just that until there is good evidence.
    Still buttsore about Palin and upholding the honor of the GOP, even though you say their only virtue is they're not the Dems. But you're not a republican.

    I guess you're just a toady.

  9. #59
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    I said the guy isn't charitable. You said he is because he gave up a wall street job. I countered by saying he gave up that job for the power he could never buy on his own.
    Because you're assuming that his intentions for his life long service has been power yet I fail to see the power associated with working for ACORN as a community organizer for virtually nothing. His rise to the presidency is something that was not planned for and is actually an extremely unlikely event.

    See.. you're focused on Warren's intentions, but up above you said you're not worried about Obama's intentions. Confusing.
    Not at all. I'm focused on Warren not fitting the mold of big name clergy who live off the fat of the lamb which does not strike me as what should happen. For all I know, he could care nothing about the people his money is helping and be doing all of this for PR and Power - as you claim Obama is doing.

  10. #60
    Live by what you Speak. DarkReign's Avatar
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    After all this time, you have me wrong. Don't you.

    I have no love for the republicans. There are few conservatives left in politics. Like you, I am a libertarian. Just more conservative than you. I generally end up voting for the lesser or two evils and I support the republicans against unsubstantiated allegations. They are generally false. There is little to admire about the republicans, except that they are not the democratick party. I’m sorry if my level of evidence is more than yours. Bring in some proper allegations, and you will find me in agreement most the time.

    Look at the whole thing dealing with governor Palin. Nearly every allegation was utterly false. The democrats are the slime of the earth when all they can do is slander others. At least most the republicans refrain from slander. There is so much slander all the time against republicans, I blow all of it off as just that until there is good evidence.
    Ok, I can understand that you identify more with Republicans than Dems. The rest of that is drivel to me in the sense that Palin, Obama, McCain, Democrat and Republican are all beholden to the same people.

    So the argument about who I may or may not lean with is of little importance, IMO. The car is a broken down piece of with an alignment problem that pulls either to the left or right, depending on the season.

    Doesnt make the car any less a piece of .

    Time for a new car.

  11. #61
    Homer 2centsworth's Avatar
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    Because you're assuming that his intentions for his life long service has been power yet I fail to see the power associated with working for ACORN as a community organizer for virtually nothing. His rise to the presidency is something that was not planned for and is actually an extremely unlikely event.
    Congress was an almost certainty with an outside chance of the presidency. To say that's not appealing is not being totally honest. Plus, money can be made in more than just one place. Many wealthy people delay short-term gratification for long-term benefits.


    Not at all. I'm focused on Warren not fitting the mold of big name clergy
    who live off the fat of the lamb which does not strike me as what should happen.
    you mean the stereotype. I guess stereotyping clergy is ok.

    For all I know, he could care nothing about the people his money is helping and be doing all of this for PR and Power - as you claim Obama is doing.
    I haven't claimed anything except that one puts his money where his mouth is.

  12. #62
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Congress was an almost certainty with an outside chance of the presidency. To say that's not appealing is not being totally honest. Plus, money can be made in more than just one place. Many wealthy people delay short-term gratification for long-term benefits.


    you mean the stereotype. I guess stereotyping clergy is ok.

    I haven't claimed anything except that one puts his money where his mouth is.
    Its not a stereotype. Lets look at the big name clergy like Hagee and Olstien. How many of them practice this form of charitable giving? If its standard practice then I'm simply wrong.

    I'm simply claiming Obama's time is equal to giving money. I think thats fairly accurate giving that he could be using that time to make a great deal of money and that makes it extremely valuable.

  13. #63
    Homer 2centsworth's Avatar
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    Its not a stereotype. Lets look at the big name clergy like Hagee and Olstien. How many of them practice this form of charitable giving? If its standard practice then I'm simply wrong.
    so they must donate 90% to meet your standard and Obama need only donate 1%.

    I'm simply claiming Obama's time is equal to giving money.
    And a preachers time? Do you even know what most preachers do?

    I think thats fairly accurate giving that he could be using that time to make a great deal of money and that makes it extremely valuable.
    he spent his time wisely manny. He is the POTUS. Even being Senator was time spent wisely. And btw, projecting peoples incomes in the future isn't as easy as you might think. Yes he would have made a good living, but would he be a big time player like he is now?

    here's an example. A friend of mine worked in the kitchen of a restaurant to learn the trade. Yes he could of made more money doing other things at the time, but now he owns 8 highly successful restaurants and lives large.

  14. #64
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    Warren is what Europeans would call a Christian Democrat. Socially conservative, economically leftist. I wish the Democrats would take these morons into their party.

  15. #65
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    so they must donate 90% to meet your standard and Obama need only donate 1%.

    And a preachers time? Do you even know what most preachers do?



    he spent his time wisely manny. He is the POTUS. Even being Senator was time spent wisely. And btw, projecting peoples incomes in the future isn't as easy as you might think. Yes he would have made a good living, but would he be a big time player like he is now?

    here's an example. A friend of mine worked in the kitchen of a restaurant to learn the trade. Yes he could of made more money doing other things at the time, but now he owns 8 highly successful restaurants and lives large.
    I actually think Obama's fairly lazy. I don't think he would have cut it as a lawyer in a big firm. Probably wouldn't have made partner.

    Dude never held a real job for more than a couple years. He didn't do a clerkship, despite being president of the Harvard Law Review.

  16. #66
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    so they must donate 90% to meet your standard and Obama need only donate 1%.

    And a preachers time? Do you even know what most preachers do?



    he spent his time wisely manny. He is the POTUS. Even being Senator was time spent wisely. And btw, projecting peoples incomes in the future isn't as easy as you might think. Yes he would have made a good living, but would he be a big time player like he is now?

    here's an example. A friend of mine worked in the kitchen of a restaurant to learn the trade. Yes he could of made more money doing other things at the time, but now he owns 8 highly successful restaurants and lives large.

    I've spent the last 5 years in a relationship with the daughter of a Methodist minister. I have no idea what preachers do, Pete. I don't understand why you're surprised that I hold them to higher standards. Don't you?

    But in any event, I never established that 90% as some kind of standard to which everyone to strive for. I think Obama does plenty outside of giving actual money. You seem to think because he's president that the time he has spent in public service means nothing and he was the only one that gained from it.

    You never addressed the issue of big name preachers and how they act in regards to money. You simply side stepped it after saying I was stereotyping. Was I wrong, Pete? Do most of these figureheads not live lavishly?

    The whole point behind this was to praise Warren. You supposedly saw an opening to point out that Obama doesn't meet the same standard. I never said he had to, for one. But I do maintain he does plenty for the American people and for you to say otherwise is simply dishonest. The time he spends in office is equitable to charitable donations, IMO. If you want to disagree, feel free. The fact that Obama has been successfull doesn't change this. I already pointed out I didn't analyze Warren's intentions so I'm not sure why you feel the need to do so to Obama.

    I mean by your defenition doing anything simply to be "saved" is selfish and self serving, correct?

  17. #67
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    I actually think Obama's fairly lazy. I don't think he would have cut it as a lawyer in a big firm. Probably wouldn't have made partner.

    Dude never held a real job for more than a couple years. He didn't do a clerkship, despite being president of the Harvard Law Review.
    Have you ever worked with a serious non profit before? If long hours for ty pay is being lazy, then yeah I guess you're right. If a real job is only one where you work in an office and clock out at 5, then yeah maybe you're right.

    I'm sure you think highly of your profession, but your post is fairly stupid.

  18. #68
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    BTW, Lazy doesn't work for minorities trying to get into these positions. It may work for people like Bush who are born with silver spoons, but I find it laughable that you would think the black kid from a single parent household with a Muslim name got where he did by being lazy.

  19. #69
    Orange Whip? Orange Whip? Viva Las Espuelas's Avatar
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    Obamacans, MARCH!!!

  20. #70
    Homer 2centsworth's Avatar
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    I've spent the last 5 years in a relationship with the daughter of a Methodist minister. I have no idea what preachers do, Pete. I don't understand why you're surprised that I hold them to higher standards. Don't you?
    of course I do, but not to the point of ridiculousness. I'll give you a quick example of what preachers do. I know a lot of preachers and most of their time is spend trying to feed, clothe and help the less fortunate. From Robert Emmitt at CBC to Sean Azzaro at River City to Craig Grubbs and Hope Ministries at the Lincoln Courts.

    But in any event, I never established that 90% as some kind of standard to which everyone to strive for. I think Obama does plenty outside of giving actual money. You seem to think because he's president that the time he has spent in public service means nothing and he was the only one that gained from it.
    I like the dude, but he's not some type of God. We all should give of our time and of our Money. He doesn't get any special breaks in my book.

    You never addressed the issue of big name preachers and how they act in regards to money. You simply side stepped it after saying I was stereotyping. Was I wrong, Pete? Do most of these figureheads not live lavishly?
    Where are you learning this? You're watching too much TV. Yes, there are Preachers who are wolves in sheeps clothing, but like everything there are bad apples in every walk of life.

    The whole point behind this was to praise Warren. You supposedly saw an opening to point out that Obama doesn't meet the same standard. I never said he had to, for one. But I do maintain he does plenty for the American people and for you to say otherwise is simply dishonest. The time he spends in office is equitable to charitable donations, IMO.
    so why do other representatives find a way to be more charitable? You're way to lenient on him IMO.

    If you want to disagree, feel free. The fact that Obama has been successfull doesn't change this. I already pointed out I didn't analyze Warren's intentions so I'm not sure why you feel the need to do so to Obama.
    I'm not trying to analyze intentions, so that's why I'm focusing on the bottom line. Obama doesn't put his money where his mouth is.

    I mean by your defenition doing anything simply to be "saved" is selfish and self serving, correct?
    huh?

  21. #71
    e^(i*pi) + 1 = 0 MannyIsGod's Avatar
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    Pete, You know I'm not talking about all preachers right? I'm referring to those with a good deal of celebrity.

    Maybe Obama should be held to a higher standard and I guess thats for each individual to judge for himself. After seeing the type of work he's done in the past firsthand, I realize how ty it can be and how the only people who do it are the ones who really feel the effort is worth it because of who they are trying to benefit. Once again, I never established Warren's outstanding mark as a standard for everyone to be held to. He could be giving much less and still be an extremely charitable individual. That being said, I will never come to terms with agreeing with a minister who lives in a mansion while there are starving people in this world. I simply do not agree with that one bit.

  22. #72
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    I’m sorry if my level of evidence is more than yours.
    It is clear that American children eat more light bulbs than fish.

  23. #73
    Orange Whip? Orange Whip? Viva Las Espuelas's Avatar
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    I will never come to terms with agreeing with a minister who lives in a mansion while there are starving people in this world. I simply do not agree with that one bit.
    so is this sentiment held for ministers only?

  24. #74
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    So board Republicans are pissed off that Democrats aren't really that pissed off about Obama's choosing a guy from Saddleback Church and not Brokeback Church.

  25. #75
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    so is this sentiment held for ministers only?
    Not for me, but hey, at least most people who live in mansions, know and are resigned to the fact that they're s . Hypocrisy bites.

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