Pain Killers?

[johnsmith]

Last week I found myself in the emergency room at the young age of 29. Nothing life threatening, but I'd thrown my back out. After the MRI's were complete, turns out I have a disc that isn't ruptured, but has some ed up scientific name to it in which the disc had bulged and the vertabrae basically sliced off some of said disc and now it's all ed up (sounds like a rupture to me, but whatever).


Anyway, it was the worst ing pain I've ever been in for my three decades of life. I couldn't sit, stand, lay down, or move without the pain being so agonizing that I would literally yell out loud and tears would come to my eyes (and not because I'm sensitive either). So anyway, I'll eventually have to have some ed up fusion surgery unless they can fix it some other way, and the fusion thing takes 4-6 weeks of recovery and doesn't work all that well all the time..........which was awesome to hear from the Doctor.

It feels so-so right now, I can do stuff, and be active, just won't be playing any basketball, golf, running, lifting weights, etc, etc anytime soon (so basically nothing fun) until after the surgery which is going to be whenever I can plan to take 4 - 6 weeks off of work, but I'm busy at work right now, so it will have to wait.


Now, to get to the point of the thread. I've done every drug known to man during my college years short of injecting something into my system (unless you count the steroids). The Doc gave me a prescription for about 800 different things last week, 1 of which was Vicodan. I've taken Vicodan in the past, but it was usually to go along with a couple of beers or a bong rip. This was the first time I'd taken it for actual pain. Anyway, I took that for a full week, two in the morning at first, then three in the morning later on. Then I'd take one or two as the day progressed and eventually took a little more at a time (I have an addictive personality and this is cool).

So now my back doesn't hurt near as much (which the Doc said would happen), so I stopped taking the Vicodan, after all, I'm a grown man and shouldn't be popping pills anymore. But here's the problem, ever since I've stopped, which has been 24 hours now, I feel like dog . My head hurts, I feel like I have the flu, and I've been busting dookies like nobody's business (well, except yours I guess). In fact, i'm typing this while pooping right now.

My point is this, they should really tell you that you're going to be all ed up once you stop using whatever drug they give you, it's like false advertising. "This is going to help tremendously, but man, when you're done, tell your wife to leave the house because you're going through a world of hurt".

I looked it up online and from what it appears, many people are totally ing dependant on this and I can see why because no one should have to deal with what I'm dealing with right now.



Also, anyone living in between SA and Austin know of a good back doctor. I was referred to one by the ER guy but I figure if anyone knows of a good one to please let me know.


Sincerely from the bathroom,
JohnSmith

[chode_regulator]

Now, to get to the point of the thread. I've done every drug known to man during my college years short of injecting something into my system (unless you count the steroids)...... In fact, i'm typing this while pooping right now.


Sincerely from the bathroom,
JohnSmith

no real advice to offer but goddamn those are three funny statements to make.

i was prescribed percosets when i had eye surgery and when i got the meds they gave me a huge folded piece of paper with side effects and what not. i also think youre supposed to wean yourself off that , notjsut stop taking it. to beh honest you should have researched that before you jsut started taking it, though im sure if you were in bad pain you didnt care you just wanted it to stop.
are muscle relaxers an alternative to start taking instead of vicodin? i would imagine that after a few days the symptoms go away.

[florige]

Did he give you the doctor disclaimer speech about if they possibly botch the surgery about how it could be worse? My uncle had almost the same surgery and he said they gave him the speech about possibly being in a wheelchair if they screw up. But his was close to his spine so I don't know.

[Man of Steel]

First things first.

One--do not take anything that some ER tells you--you need a very good orthopedic or neurosurgeon to run your tests and evalutae them. In San Antonio, the best are Dr. Hilton and Dr. Swann.

Second--most back ailments respond favorable to conservative treatment. It takles time-modification of lifestyle--exercise--going to "back school"--but this is much better than jumping onto an operating table.

I have had three back surgeries--fell free to PM me whenever you need to. Fusion is MAJOR back surgery--takes about 4-5 hours--you would be in the hospital for at least a week-10 days and rehab at Warm Springs for two weeks. You will be confined to a wheel chair--it takes years to recover. I had my fusion in 2004 and I am almost starting to feel "normal" but on some days I still feel pretty bad.

As for pain killers--when you are in pain--you need them. People do not become addicted to pain killers when they truly are in pain. They get in trouble when they keep taking pain killers after the pain subsides--they grow dependent and then its a real problem.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

no way you should be experiencing side effects from those painkillers after only 1 week.
It has to be a consequence of some other factor you are not considering. Or it may be all in your head.



2nd greatest speed metal album of its era.

[balli]

Have you tried smoking weed yet? Tetrahydrocannabinoids should work well to reverse the terrible effects bestowed upon your body and mind by opiates.

[E20]

Just squat the pain away.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

LOL at e20 still relying on lifting weights as his high.

[2Blonde]

IMO...DO NOT go to an orthopedist, make sure you go to a neurosurgeon. When you are talking about potential surgery that involves messing with your spinal cord or nerves, then a neurosurgeon is the way to go. Orthos are great for setting bones but the Neuros are the ones who going to do the best job of making sure you are in that group that is 80% successful.

[clambake]

sorry to hear that, john. you need to get several opinions before going under the knife. i know it will be expensive, but you need branch out beyond what your health insurance will provide. this could be a one shot thing to get it right.

remember, life without golf is .

[Wild Cobra]

Pain is there for a reason. Pain is your friend. If you numb it too much, you will your back up even worse.

I have a hard time believing it wont heal itself. However, you have to respect the pain and avoid causing it. I would suggest wearing a very firm back brace (medical corset) that will grab your hips and ribcage, taking all the weight off your spine.

I'm by far no expert. Definately run the idea across with an expert or two.

[clambake]

also, i've been watching the mavericks play basketball.

could i get some of those painkillers?

[duncan228]

Echoing what's been said, you really need to see a specialist. The ER was an appropriate place to start, you were hurt. But please don't rely on their tests alone. A spinal fusion is serious surgery, you want the right diagnosis and a doctor you can trust. It takes a long time to rehab, and it's a lot of work. Your doctor should feel like a partner to you, you need to be able to talk to them and feel comfortable asking questions. If you feel like you're being treated as a 'number', or you're rushed through the appointment, or your concerns are dismissed without a satisfactory response, find another doctor.

As for the pain meds, I agree that when they're used for pain addiction is rarely an issue. Tolerance can be, taken long enough your body will adjust and you will need stronger doses to get relief. Anytime you're on those kinds of meds for any length of time you do need to wean off of them to avoid 'withdrawal' symptoms.

It's better to stay ahead of severe pain than to try to 'catch up' to it. Once the pain is at a high level the meds don't work as well. Take them as directed, don't wait for the pain to scream at you.

I hope you can recover without surgery, but if that's the fix I hope it all goes well. Back pain impacts your entire body, everything you do, it's hard to live with.

[Bartleby]

Pain is there for a reason. Pain is your friend. If you numb it too much, you will your back up even worse.

I have a hard time believing it wont heal itself. However, you have to respect the pain and avoid causing it. I would suggest wearing a very firm back brace (medical corset) that will grab your hips and ribcage, taking all the weight off your spine.

I'm by far no expert. Definately run the idea across with an expert or two.

I agree with WC on this (may be the first and last time ever). I've thrown my back out pretty bad a couple of times, probably not as bad as you have but enough to where any movement is painful and just getting up out of bed or off the floor is extremely difficult. It took a few weeks in both instances for the pain to go away, but it finally did. Yours might, too, if you are willing to ride it out. Of course, it could always come back, but yoga might help for that.

One back specialist I heard on NPR said he almost always recommends conservative treatment (not surgery) and encourages his patients to do what they always do, rather than lay in bed and rest it. If they normally run every day, he tells them to try to stick to it. Sounds counterintuitive, but it made sense coming from him.

[chode_regulator]

no way you should be experiencing side effects from those painkillers after only 1 week.
It has to be a consequence of some other factor you are not considering. Or it may be all in your head.



2nd greatest speed metal album of its era.

yeah thats a good point. i didnt even think of. i cant remember the exact number of pills i got but it was over 20 percs for like 5 days. i didnt have any side effects when i stopped. are you on other meds? bc i got percs, some sort of steroid i think, and 800 mg ibuprofen and then another pill that was to help me from getting sick, i.e. nauseaus or hwoever you spell it, from the combination. maybe its from the combination of pills?


and to third the surgery thing. ive got two body parts that could have surgery, but both doctors are tellign me that surgery is always a last option and should be looked at taht way. you always run the risk of making it worse. but again im talking about a shoulder and foot and youre dealign with a back.

best of luck.

[Man of Steel]

You might consider going to a pain specialist (Dr. Dennis Karasek is great) and see if he recommends a spinal injection. Sometimes these can be effective--but not always.

I agree with another writer--if surgery is ever needed, you need both an orthopedic as well as a neurosurgeon. My neuro told me he focuses exclusively on the nerves to prevent damage and the ortho goes straight to the prob with the spinal cord.

Please---please--do not even think about surgery right now. Back pain is a real . But surgery rarely if ever reduces pain. I had t get surgery because my spinal cord was so damaged the doc told me that I could be cripple in less than five years without it.

This is an extreme case. Nine times out of ten, conservative treatment is adequate.

The best advice I can give you is to call Dr. Karasek first thing Monday morning and get into his office asap.

[Destro]

Vicodin will cause constipation so makes sense that you are making dookies after you stopped taking them. You were clogged up

[johnsmith]

You might consider going to a pain specialist (Dr. Dennis Karasek is great) and see if he recommends a spinal injection. Sometimes these can be effective--but not always.

I agree with another writer--if surgery is ever needed, you need both an orthopedic as well as a neurosurgeon. My neuro told me he focuses exclusively on the nerves to prevent damage and the ortho goes straight to the prob with the spinal cord.

Please---please--do not even think about surgery right now. Back pain is a real . But surgery rarely if ever reduces pain. I had t get surgery because my spinal cord was so damaged the doc told me that I could be cripple in less than five years without it.

This is an extreme case. Nine times out of ten, conservative treatment is adequate.

The best advice I can give you is to call Dr. Karasek first thing Monday morning and get into his office asap.

Dude, I thought you were the man of steel?

[SequSpur]

u need physical therapy./

[johnsmith]

Thanks everyone for the advice.

I'm going to make an appointment this week and figure out what the is wrong with me.

The really neat thing about all of this is that now my back isn't in agonizing pain, but it's constantly noticable. It's really neat how I get to now think about every movement I make, including but not limited to, waking up in the morning, walking, sitting, standing...............this is going to put a serious kink in my plan to become a professional football player before I turn 30. I'm 29 now, but I had a feeling that I was just getting into my prime.


On a lighter note, I may win my fantasy football league this weekend which will cover the copay for the emergency room and the first time office visit at the new Doc

[johnsmith]

Also, I'm never taking Vicodan again...........ever............unless it's for fun.

[mrsmaalox]

Head straight for the experts at the South Texas Spinal Clinic

http://www.spinaldoc.com/Webpages.asp?WPID=1

Good website with tons of good information

[johnsmith]

Head straight for the experts at the South Texas Spinal Clinic

http://www.spinaldoc.com/Webpages.asp?WPID=1

Good website with tons of good information

I already have an appointment set up with Pipken.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

They really should explain these things...

"Studies have shown hydrocodone as stronger than codeine but only one-tenth as potent as morphine at binding to receptors, whereas roughly half as potent as morphine in analgesic properties.[4] However other studies have shown hydrocodone to be anywhere from equally as potent to oxycodone (1.5× the potency of morphine) to only 66.6~% the potency of oxycodone (equipotent to morphine).[5] Hydrocodone can become habit-forming, which leads to physical and psychological addiction, but the potential for addiction varies from individual to individual depending on unique biological differences. Sales and production of this drug have increased significantly in recent years, as have diversion and illicit use. In the U.S., pure hydrocodone and forms containing more than 15 mg per dosage unit are considered Schedule II drugs. Those containing less than or equal to 15 mg per dosage unit in combination with acetaminophen or another non-controlled drug are called hydrocodone compounds and are considered Schedule III drugs. Hydrocodone is typically found in combination with other drugs such as paracetamol, aspirin, ibuprofen and homatropine methylbromide. The purpose of the non-controlled drugs in combination is often twofold: 1) To provide increased analgesia via drug synergy. 2) To limit the intake of hydrocodone by causing unpleasant and often unsafe side-effects at higher-than-prescribed doses (See Below). In the UK, it is listed as a Class A drug under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971. Hydrocodone is not available in pure form in the United States due to a separate regulation, and is always sold with an NSAID, acetaminophen, antihistamine, expectorant, or homatropine. The cough preparation Codiclear DH is the purest US hydrocodone item, containing guaifenesin and small amounts of ethanol as active ingredients. In Germany and elsewhere, hydrocodone is available as single-active-ingredient tablets as Dicodid (by analogy to the original manufacturer's other products Dilaudid and Dinarkon and others) available in 5- and 10-mg strengths."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrocodone

Go read about common painkillers (codeine, morphine, tramadol, oxycodone, hydrocodone - Vicodan is hydrodone and acetaminophen (aspirin)) , it's fascinating stuff, and you may want to know it one day.

When I had an impacted, infected wisdomm tooth and went through 6 days of migraine level pain (trigeminal neuralgia), I really needed something like Vicodan, not bloody tramadol!

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

no way you should be experiencing side effects from those painkillers after only 1 week.
It has to be a consequence of some other factor you are not considering. Or it may be all in your head.

Wrong.

Opoids and opiod analogues quickly become physically addictive, and the symptoms js is describing are signs of mild withdrawl.

Vicodin will cause constipation so makes sense that you are making dookies after you stopped taking them. You were clogged up

All opoids, including something as mild as codeine, cause constipation. Enjoy the free flow!