Trade Parker For Calderon

[ClingingMars]

[Phenomanul]

So simply adding Jermaine O'Neal is the reason why they are sucking?

I think what he meant to say was that the players that were traded from the Pacers have failed to live up to their potential...

The Raptors gave up both offense and defense by losing Rasho Nesterovic and TJ Ford. It was exacerbated by the fact that Jermaine O'Neal has failed to live up to his end of the deal. The Raptors lost a considerable amount of talent on the deal instead of a staying even...

Calderon isn't the reason why the Raptors are underachieving this year.


That said, TP >>>>>>> Calderon. As far as what the Spurs need from their PG (scoring, defense).

[portnoy1]

I just dont want anybody misunderstand what im sayin. Once again tony parker has more rings because of who he's playin with. Pop is one of the top 5 coaches in the league. Tim duncan is well tim duncan, which means he is not chris bosh. Manu ginobili does most of his damage in the 4qt which isnt factored into an EFFECIENCY rating. where is parker then? and the surrounding players on the team know their roles because pop is a great coach. Parker has a better coach, better system, better big 2 by his side ( duncan , ginobili ) and smarter role players. thats all im sayin folks.
Last year TP 18.8 pts / 6.0 ast / 49% fg / 25% 3pt fg / 2.3 turnovers in 33 min a game.
Jose Calderon 11.2 pts / 8.3 ast / 51% fg / 42 % 3pt fg / 1.5 Turnovers in 30 min a game. A good portion coming off the bench.

even his numbers this year are slightly better than parkers. You cant argue with numbers

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Nash actually draws charges. Calderon is like Nash without the flopping.

I'm not gonna lie I don't watch Raptorball too much

But does Calderon run around and ball hawk like Nash as well?

[DAF86]

I just dont want anybody misunderstand what im sayin. Once again tony parker has more rings because of who he's playin with. Pop is one of the top 5 coaches in the league. Tim duncan is well tim duncan, which means he is not chris bosh. Manu ginobili does most of his damage in the 4qt which isnt factored into an EFFECIENCY rating. where is parker then? and the surrounding players on the team know their roles because pop is a great coach. Parker has a better coach, better system, better big 2 by his side ( duncan , ginobili ) and smarter role players. thats all im sayin folks.
Last year TP 18.8 pts / 6.0 ast / 49% fg / 25% 3pt fg / 2.3 turnovers in 33 min a game.
Jose Calderon 11.2 pts / 8.3 ast / 51% fg / 42 % 3pt fg / 1.5 Turnovers in 30 min a game. A good portion coming off the bench.

even his numbers this year are slightly better than parkers. You cant argue with numbers

So we'd win games by just shooting 3's?

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Last year TP 18.8 pts / 6.0 ast / 49% fg / 25% 3pt fg / 2.3 turnovers in 33 min a game.
Jose Calderon 11.2 pts / 8.3 ast / 51% fg / 42 % 3pt fg / 1.5 Turnovers in 30 min a game. A good portion coming off the bench.

even his numbers this year are slightly better than parkers. You cant argue with numbers

I'm not even a Spurs fan and I can use that argument against numbers here, it's that simple.

[ClingingMars]

Six feet . . . .

he's inching farther away!

[roycrikside]

The team is basically the same other than that swap. What say you?

I agree with most people, I wouldn't trade Tony for any point guard in the league besides Paul and maybe Williams, but there's no reason to put down Calderon, LJ, who's a damn fine player in his own right.

The Raptors' struggles this season have more to do with the games Calderon has missed than the ones he hasn't, and the Jermaine O'Neal experiment didn't work either. I think they played above their heads a bit last year and are crashing to Earth this year. You can't be a very good team without at least one swingman who can score consistently.

[Spurminator]

This thread is embarrassing. Not just as a Spurs fan, not just as a basketball fan, but as a human. That we as a society have managed to produce a person who would purposely propose and argue such an idea is a blot on all of humankind. Truly we have a long way to go.

[portnoy1]

EXAMPLE - guys go under screens against parker all the time. half the time he can make the jumpers exept if he is playin against the lakers. They have proved that to many years now. you cant go under any screen with calderon even if its at the 3pt line because he can hit. that opens up EASIER lanes to the basket and better shots for Tim, and more time for shooters to line up.

[ClingingMars]

This thread is embarrassing. Not just as a Spurs fan, not just as a basketball fan, but as a human. That we as a society have managed to produce a person who would purposely propose and argue such an idea is a blot on all of humankind. Truly we have a long way to go.

[timvp]

I think what he meant to say was that the players that were traded from the Pacers have failed to live up to their potential...

The Raptors gave up both offense and defense by losing Rasho Nesterovic and TJ Ford. It was exacerbated by the fact that Jermaine O'Neal has failed to live up to his end of the deal. The Raptors lost a considerable amount of talent on the deal instead of a staying even...

Calderon isn't the reason why the Raptors are underachieving this year.


That said, TP >>>>>>> Calderon. As far as what the Spurs need from their PG (scoring, defense).

My points is that giving Calderon the full-time keys hasn't made the Raptors a better team. The Raptors thought they could elevate Calderon, bring over a few Euro point guards and be just as good at the position. It hasn't worked out.

Let's say Jermaine O'Neal and Rasho Nesterovic cancel each other out. Then the only real different is Calderon replacing the role he shared with Ford in the past.

I like Calderon as a player and he's probably a top five shooter in the league but my opinion is the Raptors underestimated his shortcomings defensively. Ford helped the Raptors hide Calderon some on the defensive end. Now that he can't hide as much, the Raptors defense overall has become much worse and that has been part of the reason why their overall team isn't as good.

[mathbzh]

I just dont want anybody misunderstand what im sayin. Once again tony parker has more rings because of who he's playin with. Pop is one of the top 5 coaches in the league. Tim duncan is well tim duncan, which means he is not chris bosh. Manu ginobili does most of his damage in the 4qt which isnt factored into an EFFECIENCY rating. where is parker then? and the surrounding players on the team know their roles because pop is a great coach. Parker has a better coach, better system, better big 2 by his side ( duncan , ginobili ) and smarter role players. thats all im sayin folks.
Last year TP 18.8 pts / 6.0 ast / 49% fg / 25% 3pt fg / 2.3 turnovers in 33 min a game.
Jose Calderon 11.2 pts / 8.3 ast / 51% fg / 42 % 3pt fg / 1.5 Turnovers in 30 min a game. A good portion coming off the bench.

even his numbers this year are slightly better than parkers. You cant argue with numbers

Parker average PER for the last 4 seasons: 21.05
Calderon best season so far: 20.77

How do you say that? You can't argue with numbers?

[portnoy1]

now that makes sense

[portnoy1]

being frank though, im thinkin about the future. If parker doesnt pass the ball soon, duncan and ginobili will be retired and the reigns will be in TPs hands. He will have to be the guy, which means more than scoring, he will have to set the table. Chris paul, deron williams and steve nash set the table for the teams they are on. Parker will have to pass to help his teammates succeed. If not he'll just be a scoring guard who gets his and thats it.

[velik_m]

Let's say Jermaine O'Neal and Rasho Nesterovic cancel each other out.

That's an insult to Rasho :P

[portnoy1]

oh an that whole calderon lets guys get by him defensively thing. Im forced to agree that guys do get by him and go all the way to goal for layups. My question is Do you notice any difference in the spurs? this season more than ever guys are getting layups and DUNKS. is that parkers fault? I would say no. better help from teammates is all.

[InK]

Isnt it possible to stop people with less then 5 (10, 100?, 300?) posts from making new threads? I was browsing through the first two pages today and its annoying to see so many new guys without selfcontrol/ selfrespect posting this garbage.

[portnoy1]

whats the big idea? it was just a thought and I wanted to see what people thought about that topic.

[timvp]

I agree with most people, I wouldn't trade Tony for any point guard in the league besides Paul and maybe Williams, but there's no reason to put down Calderon, LJ, who's a damn fine player in his own right.

The Raptors' struggles this season have more to do with the games Calderon has missed than the ones he hasn't, and the Jermaine O'Neal experiment didn't work either. I think they played above their heads a bit last year and are crashing to Earth this year. You can't be a very good team without at least one swingman who can score consistently.

Again, I like Calderon but I think the Raptors overestimated what they had. It appears they thought the grass was greener on the other side but it hasn't worked out that way.

I disagree that they played above their heads last season. In fact, Mitc was almost fired at the end of the year because they supposedly underperformed. Two seasons ago, the Raptors won 47 games ... and that was with a worse version of Bosh, a worse version of Bargnani and even worse perimeter players. In fact, they didn't have a swingman who averaged more than 9 points per game.

Fast forward two years and Bosh is better, Bargnani is better, the bigs are better and the swingmen are better. The only difference is that the keys to the point guard position have been fully given to Calderon. The result? 47 wins down to a pace of 33 wins.

It's not all Calderon's fault; it's more of the fault of the Raptors thinking they had a star in Calderon rather than a very good role player.

[Brazil]

whats the big idea? it was just a thought and I wanted to see what people thought about that topic.

let's see

I told you !! the ST Juglar economic cycles version: 10 days trade Manu 10 days Trade Parker but this one is a winner.

[portnoy1]

I dont understand, we are here talking about sports, And having what I felt was a good discussion no matter everyones opinion. in the end thats all it is, an opinion. Isnt like the coach pop is reading and taking to heart anything we say here.

[Hemotivo]

tp>>>>>>>>>>>calderon

[Kori Ellis]

I dont understand, we are here talking about sports, And having what I felt was a good discussion no matter everyones opinion. in the end thats all it is, an opinion. Isnt like the coach pop is reading and taking to heart anything we say here.

You felt this was a good discussion?

A good discussion is when there are good arguments on both sides. Not when you come up with something ridiculous and then there's 3 pages of people laughing at you/bashing you.

[portnoy1]

a new thread is a new thread, you didnt have to read it. but you did cause its a discussion about sports. Just relax and enjoy the site Ink, its all good bro.